clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 08, 2019 7:57 pm

Just landed at BOS and there’s two JJ 76W’s here. One at the gate (E-8 looks like) and one parked over at north cargo.

There’s also a SV 77W here parked next to the EK 77W in North Cargo.

Anyone know why there’s two JJ on the ground at the same time and a SV 77W?
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:22 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
Just landed at BOS and there’s two JJ 76W’s here. One at the gate (E-8 looks like) and one parked over at north cargo.

There’s also a SV 77W here parked next to the EK 77W in North Cargo.

Anyone know why there’s two JJ on the ground at the same time and a SV 77W?


Flight from 4/6 was cancelled, assume tech given its still there and today’s flight is there due to depart at 5.30pm.

The SV, is probably members the Saudi Royal family on a visit.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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tlecam
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:23 pm

My folks just got back from a trip to the Dalmatian coast - connected through MUC; 346 on the way out, 359 on the way back. They prefer the 346, although they didn't elaborate and I didn't ask.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
RobertS975
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 08, 2019 8:41 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
Just landed at BOS and there’s two JJ 76W’s here. One at the gate (E-8 looks like) and one parked over at north cargo.

There’s also a SV 77W here parked next to the EK 77W in North Cargo.

Anyone know why there’s two JJ on the ground at the same time and a SV 77W?



One of the JJ planes was the regular Monday arriving GRU-BOS flight. The other JJ 763 is yesterday's (Sunday) flight which apparently went mechanical. The Sunday BOS-GRU was canceled.

The SV flight is probably Saudi royal family transport. They come to Boston for medical issues as well as colleges.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 08, 2019 10:30 pm

tlecam wrote:
My folks just got back from a trip to the Dalmatian coast - connected through MUC; 346 on the way out, 359 on the way back. They prefer the 346, although they didn't elaborate and I didn't ask.

Same thing happened to me. I also liked the A346 better. Here's my opinion in reply #334 :)
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1411815&start=300#p21129313
And for a group of 2 people, no Y seats are better than the 2 window seats on the A340/A330's.
 
EK77WNH
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:11 am

What’s the likelihood that TK goes double-daily to BOS now that the new airport is open?
(Formerly ChrisNH)
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 09, 2019 11:35 am

EK77WNH wrote:
What’s the likelihood that TK goes double-daily to BOS now that the new airport is open?

Interesting thought. The biggest problem they had was lack of connections due to the capacity restrictions at the old airport and they still managed a decent LF. At the new airport they should be able to provide a lot more and better connections. If they upgauge to an A350 or 77W then we'll know the old airport was at least partly, a limiting factor.
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 09, 2019 12:18 pm

EK77WNH wrote:
What’s the likelihood that TK goes double-daily to BOS now that the new airport is open?


Looks like upgauging (e.g. EK 77W to A380) is the name of the game instead of double-daily.
 
ramzi
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 09, 2019 1:22 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
EK77WNH wrote:
What’s the likelihood that TK goes double-daily to BOS now that the new airport is open?


Looks like upgauging (e.g. EK 77W to A380) is the name of the game instead of double-daily.


Agreed. I don't think BOS-IST needs frequency. I suspect they will upguage, and maybe a while later add a frequency.




Edit: typo.
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RL757PVD
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Apr 09, 2019 2:00 pm

2x daily BOS IST? Or a TK A380?

I know they just legalized it here but didn’t think that many dispensaries actually opened yet.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
hinckley
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 9:45 am

hinckley wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
Flew CX 811 last night in F ( using AA miles of course). Only myself and one other person in F. J appeared full and was high on the US originating end. I couldn't tell you about the Y load.


I flew 811 in F last week (also AA miles). F was completely full, as was J. This flight has got to be hugely profitable for CX. You've got to wonder whether a second (A359? 4x/week?) CX rotation is in BOS's future. You've also got to wonder why so many airlines were asleep at the wheel for so long, not seeing/understanding BOS-Asia demand.

On a separate note, I was hugely disappointed in the CX F experience. I've flown 811 several times now in J and see little advantage in the tired F cabin.


Came home on CX812 last night after an extended trip thru SE Asia. Again, both the F and J cabins were 100% full.

I started my day on a CX A351 flight from BKK to HKG (first A350 flight) and I have to say that CX's new J cabin is a very nice experience. A lot of small upgrades that add up to a really nicely improved cabin.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:24 am

Dieuwer wrote:
EK77WNH wrote:
What’s the likelihood that TK goes double-daily to BOS now that the new airport is open?


Looks like upgauging (e.g. EK 77W to A380) is the name of the game instead of double-daily.


The difference being that DXB is pretty congested and EK is short of planes/crew so adding a second frequency is not that easy.
The new IST is likely to provide a lot more connections than it was possible at the old airport. We will have to see what they do at other U.S. airports. The odds of 2x daily would improve if they can get additional capacity to India.
 
OneX123
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:54 am

I read earlier that Delta plans to start flying BOS to ORD soon? Does anyone know the daily frequency and intended start of that flight? It's unbelievable the amount of daily flights between these two cities
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:27 pm

hinckley wrote:
Came home on CX812 last night after an extended trip thru SE Asia. Again, both the F and J cabins were 100% full.

I started my day on a CX A351 flight from BKK to HKG (first A350 flight) and I have to say that CX's new J cabin is a very nice experience. A lot of small upgrades that add up to a really nicely improved cabin.


Full with paid pax of mileage/non-revs?
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:41 pm

OneX123 wrote:
I read earlier that Delta plans to start flying BOS to ORD soon? Does anyone know the daily frequency and intended start of that flight? It's unbelievable the amount of daily flights between these two cities


This should give you some of the info. 5x daily starting Sept 8th, however if the WN works get delayed and they don’t move out, I could see that being delayed.

https://news.delta.com/delta-adds-more- ... hington-dc
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
hinckley
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 12:48 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
hinckley wrote:
Came home on CX812 last night after an extended trip thru SE Asia. Again, both the F and J cabins were 100% full.

I started my day on a CX A351 flight from BKK to HKG (first A350 flight) and I have to say that CX's new J cabin is a very nice experience. A lot of small upgrades that add up to a really nicely improved cabin.


Full with paid pax of mileage/non-revs?


Ha! Fair point. I mentioned in an earlier post that in my experience, CX only allocates one seat per cabin per flight, at least for AA awards (or so says AA). But I suppose one seat per cabin per flight can add up if each oneworld member gets the same allocation.
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 1:15 pm

VS4ever wrote:
This should give you some of the info. 5x daily starting Sept 8th, however if the WN works get delayed and they don’t move out, I could see that being delayed.

https://news.delta.com/delta-adds-more- ... hington-dc

Wow - thank you. I did another spot check and something came up.

https://dl.fltmaps.com/en

Navigate and select BOS. It comes up with a route map. Click on the detailed destination list and it shows new destinations that I did not know has happened or anticipated to happen.

1. SDF
2. MSN
3. SRQ

The one that jumps to me is SDF and MSN. Anyone know if this is confirmed or the route planner just missed it?
 
BOSMEMFlyer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:02 pm

Also see it has YYZ on there
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:14 pm

iyerhari wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
This should give you some of the info. 5x daily starting Sept 8th, however if the WN works get delayed and they don’t move out, I could see that being delayed.

https://news.delta.com/delta-adds-more- ... hington-dc

Wow - thank you. I did another spot check and something came up.

https://dl.fltmaps.com/en

Navigate and select BOS. It comes up with a route map. Click on the detailed destination list and it shows new destinations that I did not know has happened or anticipated to happen.

1. SDF
2. MSN
3. SRQ

The one that jumps to me is SDF and MSN. Anyone know if this is confirmed or the route planner just missed it?


SDF and MSN are one-off flights, SRQ was announced last September: https://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/ne ... o-see.html
Delta Diamond Medallion and AAdvantage Gold for 2019
 
ConnectAir
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:15 pm

They also seem to have BOS-YHZ listed as a route.
WN, LX, AZ, BA, LH, KL, DL, OK, S5, US, UA, VY, IB, AF, LY, F9, CO, YX x2, PD

A319, A320, A321, A332, A333, A343, B712, B733, B737, B738, B753, B744, B764, B772, B789, DH8D, E145, E190,
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:24 pm

BOSMEMFlyer wrote:
Also see it has YYZ on there

YYZ and YHZ is operated by WS as a DL codeshare. The table correctly says that.

I did not know DL operated a SDF and MSN one-time flights.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 2:31 pm

iyerhari wrote:
BOSMEMFlyer wrote:
Also see it has YYZ on there

YYZ and YHZ is operated by WS as a DL codeshare. The table correctly says that.

I did not know DL operated a SDF and MSN one-time flights.


They are for the Kentucky Derby and the EPIC conference
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S0Y
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:49 pm

hinckley wrote:

Ha! Fair point. I mentioned in an earlier post that in my experience, CX only allocates one seat per cabin per flight, at least for AA awards (or so says AA). But I suppose one seat per cabin per flight can add up if each oneworld member gets the same allocation.


Each airline does not get separate allocations.
In general airlines make a certain number of seats available for awards on a given flight. The airlines own members get the most access, followed by alliance partners, followed by third party partners. However all are pulling from the same pool of seats. In the case of CX, AA is drawing from the OW allocation. AS by contrast appear to have access to a smaller portion of the pool than OW partners.

Sometimes there are anomalies where there might be a special arrangement where a partner gets more access than the others, but this is rare and they almost never get more access than the airlines own members.
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:35 pm

Some interesting soundbites coming out of this jetBlue "all hands meeting." One that caught my eye - "Boston at some point is going to be bigger than JFK."

https://twitter.com/WandrMe/status/1116075986888679425
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:38 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
Some interesting soundbites coming out of this jetBlue "all hands meeting." One that caught my eye - "Boston at some point is going to be bigger than JFK."

https://twitter.com/WandrMe/status/1116075986888679425


Also JetBlue will be launching the A220 in boston https://twitter.com/theOrangetechie/sta ... 8912888832
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:59 pm

jworks158 wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:
Some interesting soundbites coming out of this jetBlue "all hands meeting." One that caught my eye - "Boston at some point is going to be bigger than JFK."

https://twitter.com/WandrMe/status/1116075986888679425


Also JetBlue will be launching the A220 in boston https://twitter.com/theOrangetechie/sta ... 8912888832


Neither of these surprise me too much, Boston was always planned to be bigger than JFK because there's limited scope for expansion at JFK, some would argue there is at BOS too, but there's more than JFK. and actually these are somewhat linked because...

BOS has a lot of E190 flying, which will be replaced by the bigger A220 and thus allow further growth even without additional frequencies. the 220's are a 1-1 swap for the 190's ultimately, so either utilization will be higher, or they will just add capacity by seat count differences.

This also raises an eyebrow:
We might be New York's hometown airline but we're the heart of Boston. Delta wants to become the largest carrier there but we're going to fight them. We've got a new team planning strategy there. This is our city!"

Delta can't become the largest carrier, the gap is just too big surely already.. but interesting a new team planning strategy, Europe of course is one prong, but be interested to see what else they have up their collective sleeves
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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AviationAddict
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:00 pm

VS4ever wrote:
jworks158 wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:
Some interesting soundbites coming out of this jetBlue "all hands meeting." One that caught my eye - "Boston at some point is going to be bigger than JFK."

https://twitter.com/WandrMe/status/1116075986888679425


Also JetBlue will be launching the A220 in boston https://twitter.com/theOrangetechie/sta ... 8912888832


Neither of these surprise me too much, Boston was always planned to be bigger than JFK because there's limited scope for expansion at JFK, some would argue there is at BOS too, but there's more than JFK. and actually these are somewhat linked because...

BOS has a lot of E190 flying, which will be replaced by the bigger A220 and thus allow further growth even without additional frequencies. the 220's are a 1-1 swap for the 190's ultimately, so either utilization will be higher, or they will just add capacity by seat count differences.

This also raises an eyebrow:
We might be New York's hometown airline but we're the heart of Boston. Delta wants to become the largest carrier there but we're going to fight them. We've got a new team planning strategy there. This is our city!"

Delta can't become the largest carrier, the gap is just too big surely already.. but interesting a new team planning strategy, Europe of course is one prong, but be interested to see what else they have up their collective sleeves


I wonder if they would ever consider moving their HQ to Boston. Not that it would have any real impact on operations but it would send a strong message. I also feel like the positive message it would send to BOS could be stronger than the negative message it would send to NYC.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:32 pm

AviationAddict wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
jworks158 wrote:

Also JetBlue will be launching the A220 in boston https://twitter.com/theOrangetechie/sta ... 8912888832


Neither of these surprise me too much, Boston was always planned to be bigger than JFK because there's limited scope for expansion at JFK, some would argue there is at BOS too, but there's more than JFK. and actually these are somewhat linked because...

BOS has a lot of E190 flying, which will be replaced by the bigger A220 and thus allow further growth even without additional frequencies. the 220's are a 1-1 swap for the 190's ultimately, so either utilization will be higher, or they will just add capacity by seat count differences.

This also raises an eyebrow:
We might be New York's hometown airline but we're the heart of Boston. Delta wants to become the largest carrier there but we're going to fight them. We've got a new team planning strategy there. This is our city!"

Delta can't become the largest carrier, the gap is just too big surely already.. but interesting a new team planning strategy, Europe of course is one prong, but be interested to see what else they have up their collective sleeves


I wonder if they would ever consider moving their HQ to Boston. Not that it would have any real impact on operations but it would send a strong message. I also feel like the positive message it would send to BOS could be stronger than the negative message it would send to NYC.


I think if it went anywhere it would be MCO, a hell of a lot cheaper real estate down there. I should know, my company has a rather large office down there. While BOS would send a message, it would also i suspect (for a while at least) alienate NYC when they trade on being NY's hometown airline as mentioned above. The problem is NY can be exceedingly expensive and it can be quite easy to say you have an HQ there for say the executives and important staff to be there, but you could move everything else out to cheaper areas, downsize corporate and save a ton of money etc.

It's been discussed a number of times in the various B6 thread and B6 have clearly stated they need to get their costs down, but right now, they haven't made plans to ship out. Will they? who knows..
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
B752OS
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:52 pm

With the plans for JFK by PANYNJ, JetBlue is going to have even more space in the coming years. Their facilities there are already a lost nicer than BOS. I don't see how JFK does not eventually become their largest station.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:58 pm

B752OS wrote:
With the plans for JFK by PANYNJ, JetBlue is going to have even more space in the coming years. Their facilities there are already a lost nicer than BOS. I don't see how JFK does not eventually become their largest station.


I wholeheartedly agree with your point about the JFK facilities. T5 there is awesome and a dream to connect through (as long as your flights work of course!). Terminal C, albeit the check in area is nice and the newer renovated pieces close to it, the rest of it feels like a dump and this is from someone who loves to fly B6 as often as he can and especially against Terminal B and A. C needs a whole lot of loving and not just on the outside...
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:31 am

B752OS wrote:
With the plans for JFK by PANYNJ, JetBlue is going to have even more space in the coming years. Their facilities there are already a lost nicer than BOS. I don't see how JFK does not eventually become their largest station.

The problem at JFK is not the terminal. It's the airport itself. It's slot restricted, and when bad weather rolls in it's an absolute disaster. BOS isn't much better for weather but we fare better because we're smaller and less congested, and BOS is nowhere near being slot restricted. I think at the very least we can expect BOS and JFK to be equal.
 
B757rocket
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:47 am

Mods. Delete. TY
Last edited by B757rocket on Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:13 am, edited 3 times in total.
 
EADSYABSOB73857
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:56 am

Hey everyone, want to introduce myself as I’m new to the forum... I’ve been lurking on this site for quite some time but recently decided to jump in. I’m an aviation industry analyst working on Wall Street and I’m from Boston, so I keep close track of Logan’s growth. I want to thank you all for your incredible insight that you’ve provided over time, and VS4ever a huge thanks for your detailed analyses!
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:57 am

Welcome, EADS!
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:06 am

EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
Hey everyone, want to introduce myself as I’m new to the forum... I’ve been lurking on this site for quite some time but recently decided to jump in. I’m an aviation industry analyst working on Wall Street and I’m from Boston, so I keep close track of Logan’s growth. I want to thank you all for your incredible insight that you’ve provided over time, and VS4ever a huge thanks for your detailed analyses!


Welcome and thank you, i wish i could do more right now, but real life is getting in the way, however i am delighted my work is appreciated :) more to come as i am able
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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gatibosgru
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:22 am

Any plans from CM or JJ to eat up some of the lost AV traffic with either increase capacity or send bigger birds?
@DadCelo
 
tphuang
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:03 am

VS4ever wrote:
AviationAddict wrote:
VS4ever wrote:

Neither of these surprise me too much, Boston was always planned to be bigger than JFK because there's limited scope for expansion at JFK, some would argue there is at BOS too, but there's more than JFK. and actually these are somewhat linked because...

BOS has a lot of E190 flying, which will be replaced by the bigger A220 and thus allow further growth even without additional frequencies. the 220's are a 1-1 swap for the 190's ultimately, so either utilization will be higher, or they will just add capacity by seat count differences.

This also raises an eyebrow:
We might be New York's hometown airline but we're the heart of Boston. Delta wants to become the largest carrier there but we're going to fight them. We've got a new team planning strategy there. This is our city!"

Delta can't become the largest carrier, the gap is just too big surely already.. but interesting a new team planning strategy, Europe of course is one prong, but be interested to see what else they have up their collective sleeves


I wonder if they would ever consider moving their HQ to Boston. Not that it would have any real impact on operations but it would send a strong message. I also feel like the positive message it would send to BOS could be stronger than the negative message it would send to NYC.


I think if it went anywhere it would be MCO, a hell of a lot cheaper real estate down there. I should know, my company has a rather large office down there. While BOS would send a message, it would also i suspect (for a while at least) alienate NYC when they trade on being NY's hometown airline as mentioned above. The problem is NY can be exceedingly expensive and it can be quite easy to say you have an HQ there for say the executives and important staff to be there, but you could move everything else out to cheaper areas, downsize corporate and save a ton of money etc.

It's been discussed a number of times in the various B6 thread and B6 have clearly stated they need to get their costs down, but right now, they haven't made plans to ship out. Will they? who knows..


I agree here with you. If they move anywhere it will be to Orlando especially with the planned open of the south terminal. LIC SC will keep shrinking over time as the non-exec/sales/important staff get moved to OSC.

On the topic of size of BOS vs JFK, it's quite interesting actually. I also do think BOS will end up larger. Currently, BOS already exceeds JFK in # of flights, although still behind combined NYC operation of JFK/LGA/EWR/HPN. In terms of RPM and revenue passenger, it's still quite a way behind due to JFK operating a lot of A321s and very few E90s and being used more on long flight due to perimeter rule.

Based on PANYJ stats, they had 14.16 million revenue passengers at JFK in 2018. Now, I don't where BOS stats are located, but BTS showed the domestic revenue passenger at BOS to be 10.43 million and the international operation for B6 is still relatively small there. To me, that means B6 is expecting to grow its revenue passenger count at BOS by at least 30% in the future (if we assume JFK is 25% larger now in passenger count and it will grow another 5% through upgauging) and quite possibly a lot more if Joanna was referring to RPM.

So I would be shocked if they don't blow past 200 daily flights along with plenty of upgauging to A220s. This is kind of a slow year for them because delays to A321NEOs as well as waiting for the new gates. Next year will have to be the year of domestic expansion, since 2021 will all be about Europe. I think there will be some new route announcement for probably Q1 2020 when a lot of those delayed A321NEO airframes get put into service. Just my hunch.

Thanks again for great thread, guys.
 
EADSYABSOB73857
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:06 am

VS4ever wrote:
EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
Hey everyone, want to introduce myself as I’m new to the forum... I’ve been lurking on this site for quite some time but recently decided to jump in. I’m an aviation industry analyst working on Wall Street and I’m from Boston, so I keep close track of Logan’s growth. I want to thank you all for your incredible insight that you’ve provided over time, and VS4ever a huge thanks for your detailed analyses!


Welcome and thank you, i wish i could do more right now, but real life is getting in the way, however i am delighted my work is appreciated :) more to come as i am able


Appreciate the ‘Welcome’ Dieuwer and VS4ever!

Now I’ll start hitting with the questions:

We know both DL’s and B6’s stated ambitions for Logan... if we do the math (As VS4ever, you did this a few weeks back for B6), for B6 they should easily be able to hit above their stated 200 daily flights (in terms of Terminal C capacity)... Maybe 230???

As for DL- by September 2019, they will hit approx. 142 flights per day (solely on DL, not including partners)... DL has to have further expansion in the works (as Ed Bastion stated about BOS in a recent speech); with DL’s stated goal of 150 flights per day, as of September 2019 this technically leaves them with very little room (5%) for expansion. So, I would imagine that growth in Terminal A for Delta will exceed 150 flights/day, given that 1) DL has not added important domestic markets like: BWI (the last top 10 market from BOS lacking DL service), CLT, MIA, DAL, HOU, DEN, PHX, SAN; 2) international market expansion (I have no clue and won’t begin to speculate on routes they’ll add, as DL tends to be conservative with their international market additions (adding on top of existing served airport markets that require additional service, or unserved markets that standout due to a lack of service); and 3) an expansion of service on existing routes (of newly served routes, LAS should be a candidate for either larger aircraft or increased service)...

So, for both B6 and DL... we know about the band-aid solutions (handful of additional gates being added in C; reconfig of A and DL getting 20 gates)... but both airlines will run out of space relatively quickly, especially DL. Aside from increasing turns, what are the more mid-term/long-term solutions???
 
jplatts
Posts: 2525
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:50 am

EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
As for DL- by September 2019, they will hit approx. 142 flights per day (solely on DL, not including partners)... DL has to have further expansion in the works (as Ed Bastion stated about BOS in a recent speech); with DL’s stated goal of 150 flights per day, as of September 2019 this technically leaves them with very little room (5%) for expansion. So, I would imagine that growth in Terminal A for Delta will exceed 150 flights/day, given that 1) DL has not added important domestic markets like: BWI (the last top 10 market from BOS lacking DL service), CLT, MIA, DAL, HOU, DEN, PHX, SAN; 2) international market expansion (I have no clue and won’t begin to speculate on routes they’ll add, as DL tends to be conservative with their international market additions (adding on top of existing served airport markets that require additional service, or unserved markets that standout due to a lack of service); and 3) an expansion of service on existing routes (of newly served routes, LAS should be a candidate for either larger aircraft or increased service)...


If DL adds nonstop service to Dallas and Houston from BOS, DL would likely add nonstop service to DFW and IAH instead of DAL and HOU.

I agree that DL adding BOS-BWI, BOS-CLT, BOS-MIA, BOS-DEN, BOS-PHX, and BOS-SAN nonstop service might happen.
 
B752OS
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:21 am

VS4ever wrote:
B752OS wrote:
With the plans for JFK by PANYNJ, JetBlue is going to have even more space in the coming years. Their facilities there are already a lost nicer than BOS. I don't see how JFK does not eventually become their largest station.


I wholeheartedly agree with your point about the JFK facilities. T5 there is awesome and a dream to connect through (as long as your flights work of course!). Terminal C, albeit the check in area is nice and the newer renovated pieces close to it, the rest of it feels like a dump and this is from someone who loves to fly B6 as often as he can and especially against Terminal B and A. C needs a whole lot of loving and not just on the outside...


It's interesting that America, United and Delta all now have nicer facilities at Logan than JetBlue does, despite JetBlue being the largest carrier.
 
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VS4ever
Posts: 2071
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:25 am

EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
Hey everyone, want to introduce myself as I’m new to the forum... I’ve been lurking on this site for quite some time but recently decided to jump in. I’m an aviation industry analyst working on Wall Street and I’m from Boston, so I keep close track of Logan’s growth. I want to thank you all for your incredible insight that you’ve provided over time, and VS4ever a huge thanks for your detailed analyses!


Welcome and thank you, i wish i could do more right now, but real life is getting in the way, however i am delighted my work is appreciated :) more to come as i am able


Appreciate the ‘Welcome’ Dieuwer and VS4ever!

Now I’ll start hitting with the questions:

We know both DL’s and B6’s stated ambitions for Logan... if we do the math (As VS4ever, you did this a few weeks back for B6), for B6 they should easily be able to hit above their stated 200 daily flights (in terms of Terminal C capacity)... Maybe 230???

As for DL- by September 2019, they will hit approx. 142 flights per day (solely on DL, not including partners)... DL has to have further expansion in the works (as Ed Bastion stated about BOS in a recent speech); with DL’s stated goal of 150 flights per day, as of September 2019 this technically leaves them with very little room (5%) for expansion. So, I would imagine that growth in Terminal A for Delta will exceed 150 flights/day, given that 1) DL has not added important domestic markets like: BWI (the last top 10 market from BOS lacking DL service), CLT, MIA, DAL, HOU, DEN, PHX, SAN; 2) international market expansion (I have no clue and won’t begin to speculate on routes they’ll add, as DL tends to be conservative with their international market additions (adding on top of existing served airport markets that require additional service, or unserved markets that standout due to a lack of service); and 3) an expansion of service on existing routes (of newly served routes, LAS should be a candidate for either larger aircraft or increased service)...

So, for both B6 and DL... we know about the band-aid solutions (handful of additional gates being added in C; reconfig of A and DL getting 20 gates)... but both airlines will run out of space relatively quickly, especially DL. Aside from increasing turns, what are the more mid-term/long-term solutions???


There are really only a few ways you can increase capacity at a space restricted airport (note i am not saying slot controlled).
1. New Gates - kind of hard due to infrastructure especially at BOS - B6 is going to access to 2 new gates (C20A and C43) along with E1 as preference to get to the 30, But unless you change the footprint of the airport, not much more you can do...For DL its worse, first of all they have 10 less gates to work with, A1 is pretty much assigned to WS and the satellite gates somewhat get blocked with bigger aircraft for the international runs, see the answers to my questions above about the A gates and what they can take. But there are no such plans to expand A and the only way you could is basically to remove the South Cargo or relocate it down to the J pad area and remove the Eagle Terminal.
2. Turns/frequency - dangerous game unless you are WN who are masters at it. Where folks do 8, they do 11, just look at DAL for goodness sake, talk about some serious tin pushing. But back to BOS, B6 already have OTP issues (some posters on here would have you believe that it's an insanely large problem), well let's face it, they are most definitely not good, however it does not seem to stop people flying them in ever increasing numbers, so they do have somewhat of a legitimate grip,. So they must be doing something right? B6 have the space to do it, but again, is that a smart move, could the A220's be turned faster to make it work... DL on the other hand have a different issue, The WB's at A13 to A17 take up major space and time, sure they get A18-A22 back, but they are already stacked out at A2 to A11 pretty much, especially at peak times. So is this really an option for them...
3. Bigger Aircraft - THIS.. B6 moving up on 320's to 321's and coming soon the E190's to 220's will definitely increase the seat and potential passenger count, that along with the refit of the 320's from 150 to 162 will also help. For DL, a lot of their flying is regional, so there's a delicate balance there with mainline. With the 757's showing up more frequently, that increases their scope along with the 764's, they have a much higher seat count than anything B6 has, so once DL ramps up to the 150, what's next, how do they change their flying to grow.. that to me is a big unanswered question

As an aside, just to prove how insane the padding is of schedules, I give you DL5927 from PHL to BOS yesterday. Block time, to leave at 8.25am and arrive 10.02am, due to the fact that there were only about 30 ish people aboard our 9E E170, we took off at 8.15am and arrived at the gate at 9.15am... in a first for me in all my years of traveling, I actually arrived home before the time i was originally due to land.. That one will certainly help the OTP for DL, which reminds me, i need to finish those stats for 2018..
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
tjerome
Posts: 281
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 7:11 am

VS4ever wrote:
...there were only about 30 ish people aboard our 9E E170...


9E only operates CRJ family aircraft.

But I agreed with the rest of your post re: facilities and gate constraints. Terminal C is lacking, not enough curb space. Took 20 minutes on Monday morning around 5:15am to get from the entrance of Terminal B back to the main road to head towards Terminal C. It felt like I was on I-93 but at the airport.

It will be like this until a long term solution is implemented, and that would be leveling the airport, expanding the area, and starting off fresh. Just like what LGA is doing, that's the only long term solution.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:40 am

gatibosgru wrote:
Any plans from CM or JJ to eat up some of the lost AV traffic with either increase capacity or send bigger birds?


CM would be better suited to make up the difference during to PTY's connecting power.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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Dieuwer
Posts: 1272
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:56 am

Noticed a PreCheck line at Terminal E for the first time (on the far right side). Since when is that line operational? Must have completely missed it before...
 
airbazar
Posts: 9505
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:27 am

EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
So, for both B6 and DL... we know about the band-aid solutions (handful of additional gates being added in C; reconfig of A and DL getting 20 gates)... but both airlines will run out of space relatively quickly, especially DL. Aside from increasing turns, what are the more mid-term/long-term solutions???

I don't think we have to worry about that for a very long time. As we know the airline industry is very cyclical and there will be a downturn in the near future that will put a hold on expansion and possibly lead to more airlines disappearing and/or consolidating.
B752OS wrote:
It's interesting that America, United and Delta all now have nicer facilities at Logan than JetBlue does, despite JetBlue being the largest carrier.

But on the flip side terminal C has something none of the other terminals have: It's connected to the international terminal which soon will have even more amenities.
The newer gate area at terminal C (old terminal D), is pretty nice. Gates C40-C42 will probably end up looking the same so IMO it's only a matter of time until the 2 piers get refurbished to look the same.
At the end of the day none of the terminals at BOS are that great. UA's is probably the best but all of them are undersized and somewhat lacking amenities. I haven't seen the new AA expansion.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:35 am

airbazar wrote:

I haven't seen the new AA expansion.


Iyerhari is a frequent AA flyer and reports that it’s very good on that side. I get to see it with my own eyes on Monday when I fly to CLT, although as it’s a 5am departure I suspect much will be closed when i pass through.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
iyerhari
Posts: 922
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:25 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:50 pm

VS4ever wrote:
airbazar wrote:

I haven't seen the new AA expansion.


Iyerhari is a frequent AA flyer and reports that it’s very good on that side. I get to see it with my own eyes on Monday when I fly to CLT, although as it’s a 5am departure I suspect much will be closed when i pass through.

The newly remodeled Terminal B is done really nice. They created a nice central dome outside the security plus several other modeling changes. AA has completely moved to the LUS zone now. The restaurant options are also far better compared to what we used to have during the LUS days. I believe the AA side is being connected to gates B1-3 AC side. IMO, the one advantage that AA has is they do not anticipate any further expansion and once Massport connects B-E, it will be a better experience for connections. There will be however very few connection options anyways for international as AA flies to only to hubs plus a handful of AAE stations.

Each terminal at Logan has their own set of challenges and some good points.
 
johhn14
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 10:57 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:23 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
Noticed a PreCheck line at Terminal E for the first time (on the far right side). Since when is that line operational? Must have completely missed it before...

Precheck has been in E for a while - years. It was on the left last I was there though (Jan).
 
DTWorld
Posts: 176
Joined: Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:34 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:34 pm

It looks like HL8084 will be the frame of choice for KE's inaugural to BOS.

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/flights/ke91

Congrats once again, BOS and KE. Although my Alexa claims that the weather will be cloudy, I'm looking forward to seeing some pictures!
 
jworks158
Posts: 292
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:02 pm

A review came out of the inaugural HA flight last week, they showed a picture of E security in the morning overflowing. I wonder if TSA at E is having a little trouble adjusting to the two additional A330 morning departures? https://thepointsguy.com/reviews/hawaii ... s-bos-hnl/
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie

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