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Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:05 pm

I suppose the Lufthansa Group decided to not be left behind and enter the fray with their own additional TATL flight, after the addition by AA/BA (BOS-LHR) and DL (BOS-CDG, BOS-FCO, and BOS-LGW).
 
georgiabill
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:13 pm

Pleasantly surprised by the OS announcement. I was thinking if another european airline started BOS I would have guessed LO. VIE will open alot of connections to eastern europe.I hope this does well for OS and the LH group.
 
iyerhari
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Nov 13, 2019 2:31 pm

Surprising and unexpected but nevertheless a great add. Finally a *A route launch. I was looking at OS routes in US and they fly mainly to *A hubs with a notable exception being JFK. JFK, EWR, IAD and ORD. Seasonal service to LAX. This makes BOS even more exceptional.
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Nov 13, 2019 3:36 pm

Brussels Airlines (SN) only needs to enter the BOS market, I think they would do very well, in the past Sabena flew between BRU-BOS for several years with Boeing 747, DC10, A330, MD11, A340
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 7:20 am

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... ce-in-s20/
If not posted already confirmed that the 777 for LHR for AA is rotating up from MIA
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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tlecam
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:44 pm

Apropos of the OS add, here's a interesting article from Ned Russell about BOS TATL growth.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 3:08 pm

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
Brussels Airlines (SN) only needs to enter the BOS market, I think they would do very well, in the past Sabena flew between BRU-BOS for several years with Boeing 747, DC10, A330, MD11, A340


Quite frankly I'm surprised it wasn't SN that added BOS as opposed to OS. I think the LH Group went with OS because MIA wasn't profitable and they now have a spare resource (767) that they needed something to do with, so BOS was the logical add. It's a shorter route and has a very strong economy.

I don't think currently SN has spare capacity to launch another TATL like BOS, but someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 3:20 pm

tlecam wrote:
Apropos of the OS add, here's a interesting article from Ned Russell about BOS TATL growth.


Except unfortunately you didn’t add the link :D
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 5:00 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
Quite frankly I'm surprised it wasn't SN that added BOS as opposed to OS. I think the LH Group went with OS because MIA wasn't profitable and they now have a spare resource (767) that they needed something to do with, so BOS was the logical add. It's a shorter route and has a very strong economy.

I don't think currently SN has spare capacity to launch another TATL like BOS, but someone please correct me if I'm wrong.


I'm not sure LH knows what they want from SN. SN's long haul bread and butter is Africa and it appears that they are re-trenching there. They couldn't make YYZ work so I doubt very much that they would be successful in BOS. I'm not even sure that OS will be successful here. It just seems like such a odd addition.
 
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tlecam
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 5:19 pm

VS4ever wrote:
tlecam wrote:
Apropos of the OS add, here's a interesting article from Ned Russell about BOS TATL growth.


Except unfortunately you didn’t add the link :D


Doh! https://thepointsguy.com/news/europe-ga ... satlantic/
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 7:22 pm

airbazar wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:
Quite frankly I'm surprised it wasn't SN that added BOS as opposed to OS. I think the LH Group went with OS because MIA wasn't profitable and they now have a spare resource (767) that they needed something to do with, so BOS was the logical add. It's a shorter route and has a very strong economy.

I don't think currently SN has spare capacity to launch another TATL like BOS, but someone please correct me if I'm wrong.


I'm not sure LH knows what they want from SN. SN's long haul bread and butter is Africa and it appears that they are re-trenching there. They couldn't make YYZ work so I doubt very much that they would be successful in BOS. I'm not even sure that OS will be successful here. It just seems like such a odd addition.


My understanding is that SN swapped YYZ for YUL because AC is starting YYZ-BRU on their own metal, which is also why OS swapped YYZ for YUL. This wasn't about not being able to make YYZ work, rather it was about AC wanting a larger presence in YYZ and operating the routes on their planes.

I think OS at BOS will certainly be more successful for them than MIA was simply due to how much shorter the route is. Also - It was posted in the 'Austrian starting BOS thread' that VIE is one of the top 5 yielding destinations from BOS:

adamh8297 wrote:
In the Swiss report about Geneva long haul, VIE was a top 5 yielding destination from BOS.

However it was it was only 30-40 PDEW.


I also think BOS has much more business demand in general than MIA which tends to be more vacationers and highly seasonal.
 
airway1
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 9:11 pm

Korean changing from a 787 to 777 early then expected. Seems they are busy!


https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-13nov19/
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 10:20 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
My understanding is that SN swapped YYZ for YUL because AC is starting YYZ-BRU on their own metal, which is also why OS swapped YYZ for YUL. This wasn't about not being able to make YYZ work, rather it was about AC wanting a larger presence in YYZ and operating the routes on their planes.

YYZ was seasonal only.
SN(LH) and AC have a TATL JV. In theory it shouldn't matter which one flies the route unless one can make more money than the other. Clearly SN wasn't making enough money for the JV and it was replaced by AC.
clrd4t8koff wrote:
I think OS at BOS will certainly be more successful for them than MIA was simply due to how much shorter the route is. Also - It was posted in the 'Austrian starting BOS thread' that VIE is one of the top 5 yielding destinations from BOS:

And yet some people are complaining that there's too much capacity and the fares are unsustainable :)
The high yields might be due to the lack of competition. the LH group controls the Austrian market. Because I have family in Austria I fly there almost every year, my wife at least once a year, and we have friends who live in New England who are Austrian and travel there yearly. For whatever reason it is very expensive to fly into an Austrian airport. The standard practice it to fly into MUC and rent a car or get picked up. Alternatively we fly into whatever European city is the cheapest, and self-connect onto a different flight. Hopefully this flight will make it more affordable to fly direct into Austria, simply by adding seats to the market.
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 14, 2019 11:53 pm

If you didn't know already Big Jet TV is live streaming all weekend from Logan, they flew in yesterday. While it appears most will be member only content they did do a free stream today.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfWChhtwYlc
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 1:04 am

airway1 wrote:
Korean changing from a 787 to 777 early then expected. Seems they are busy!


https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-13nov19/


The article states they’re switching to the 77W next March. This was the same date reported when this was initially announced. Where are you seeing they’re switching earlier than expected??
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 1:46 am

I think we saw ‘November’ thinking it was THIS November. The announcement basically is that the 77W continues on after S20 ends. They hadn’t said so till now.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 2:01 am

SAS switching to A321neo next year. Absolutely the right plane.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 2:43 am

ChrisNH38 wrote:
SAS switching to A321neo next year. Absolutely the right plane.

Definitely correct the 330 is way too big for the route however, your Source?
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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gatibosgru
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 2:55 am

The NEO is the best option for SAS. Do they have the LR or XLR on order or just the standard NEO?
@DadCelo
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 3:17 am

https://www.di.se/live/nu-ar-det-klart- ... an-lyfter/

In Swedish, but you can gather the gist of it.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 3:24 am

gatibosgru wrote:
The NEO is the best option for SAS. Do they have the LR or XLR on order or just the standard NEO?

According to the article they get getting LR’s
157 seats, 123 Econ, 22 business and I think 12 Econ plus

Due to start in September
Also note route will then revert to 6x weekly and return to being a year round route. Also part of the article.

Also when the E extension is complete this will now be a candidate for one of the new double gates that are being built.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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mikegigs
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 12:24 pm

VS4ever wrote:
Also when the E extension is complete this will now be a candidate for one of the new double gates that are being built.


I think Massport is doing a good job of keeping the future in mind with the design of these double gates. As more A321LR's come on I see these gates filling up fast. Already we have SAS, EI, eventually B6, and TP (757's cant fit, right?) . Who knows what other possibilities will be opened up as more airlines get A321LR's.
Airports: BOS, JAX, JFK, EWR, LGA, CVG, ATL, CLT, DCA, IAD, STT, PVD, ALB, MCO
Aircraft: 733, 735, 73G, 738, 752, 717, A319, A320, MD-88, E190, E175, E145, CRJ-200, CRJ-700, Q400
Airlines: B6, CO, DL, US, NW, WN, DH
...a good start but a long way to go!
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 12:41 pm

mikegigs wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
Also when the E extension is complete this will now be a candidate for one of the new double gates that are being built.


I think Massport is doing a good job of keeping the future in mind with the design of these double gates. As more A321LR's come on I see these gates filling up fast. Already we have SAS, EI, eventually B6, and TP (757's cant fit, right?) . Who knows what other possibilities will be opened up as more airlines get A321LR's.


AA quite possibly, too.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 12:46 pm

Would love to see SK add summer seasonal BOS-ARN when the A321LR fleet grows.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 1:03 pm

mikegigs wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
Also when the E extension is complete this will now be a candidate for one of the new double gates that are being built.


I think Massport is doing a good job of keeping the future in mind with the design of these double gates. As more A321LR's come on I see these gates filling up fast. Already we have SAS, EI, eventually B6, and TP (757's cant fit, right?) . Who knows what other possibilities will be opened up as more airlines get A321LR's.

You forgot one of the 2 largest carriers at BOS :) They have 100 of them on order. Not only can they convert some of those to LR or XLR but also they don't really need the LR for places like Portugal, Ireland, and the UK.
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 3:36 pm

VS4ever wrote:
gatibosgru wrote:
The NEO is the best option for SAS. Do they have the LR or XLR on order or just the standard NEO?

According to the article they get getting LR’s
157 seats, 123 Econ, 22 business and I think 12 Econ plus

Due to start in September
Also note route will then revert to 6x weekly and return to being a year round route. Also part of the article.

Also when the E extension is complete this will now be a candidate for one of the new double gates that are being built.


Question about SAS and BOS. While I'm hopeful that a switch the A321 will be better for them, I thought that when they initially started BOS with the PrivatAir 737 they still struggled with loads and there were only 86 total seats (20 J and 66 Y). Even with the A321 they'll have almost double that capacity. Have their loads been improving?
 
johhn14
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 5:40 pm

You are right that they started with the 737. I don't know what loads were like, but absolutely right.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 5:56 pm

johhn14 wrote:
You are right that they started with the 737. I don't know what loads were like, but absolutely right.

Speaking of PrivatAir 737, LH started MUC-BOS with a PrivatAir 737. Next Summer they will be operating an A380.
Nothing exemplifies the BOS growth more than that :)
 
FGITD
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 6:40 pm

airbazar wrote:
LH started MUC-BOS with a PrivatAir 737. Next Summer they will be operating an A380.
Nothing exemplifies the BOS growth more than that :)


It's a very interesting dynamic at E now. The bigger carriers are getting bigger. And even the "smaller" carriers are getting bigger.

BA was always top dog. But now LH group is going to be running a bigger operation. AFKL is going to be very interesting based on the capacity they plan. VS has grown, and Norwegian is nothing to laugh at anymore. (Well...it is. But for other reasons)

Meanwhile the seasonal or less frequent carriers are sizing up as well.

New terminal expansion is going to be interesting. A lot of territory more or less already "spoken for"
 
TheChickenman
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 7:10 pm

Hey all,

In the original American pier of terminal B, there was a nice retro neon sign hanging above the waiting area at the end of the pier. Now that American has moved out of the pier, does anyone know what's going to happen to it? Is it already gone? It'd be a shame to lose it.
 
rove312
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 15, 2019 10:10 pm

I've seen that it was moving to the AA museum around DFW.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Nov 16, 2019 9:58 pm

May 2019 - Load Factors from the T-100's (non-Europe to start, alphabetical order)

DOH - QR 85.4% - 18,747
DXB - EK 92.7% - 17,712 (this was during the runway works in DXB, which is why QR carried more passengers)
GRU - JJ 91.1% - 7,440
HAV - B6 65.6% - 787
HKG - CX 93.8% - 15,997 (before all the troubles began)
ICN - KE 86.2% - 10,200 (there's a reason why this is being expanded!)
IST - TK 91.4% - 16,380
MEX - B6 66.1% - 6,159
NRT - JL 86.5% - 10,457
PTY - CM 90.2% - 11,172
SAL - AV 84.5% - 4,307
TLV - LY 79.9% - 5,326

Europe

AMS - Combined 83.7% - 33,508 (up over prior year, DL dropped by about 1,000, but market increased due to KL)
DL - 84.2% - 27,132
KL - 82% - 6,376

BCN - (Level) - 86.6% - 7,611

CDG - Combined 88.3% - 40,009 (34,475 total last year)

AF - 88.9% - 17,042 (14,791)
DL - 86.3% - 11,928 (11,373)
DY - 89.5% - 11,039 (8,311) (no shortage of people wanting to fly them)

CPH - SK - 9,399 68.1% (4,951) - still proof that the move to the 321 is a good one in terms of capacity right sizing

DUB - Combined 90% - 45,599 (36,364 last year)

DL - 81.5% -9,268 (2,117) - earlier season start this year
EI - 92.4% - 36,331 (34,247)

EDI - DL - 82.7% - 2,359

FCO - Combined 84.3% 22,582 (13,686 last year)

AZ - 82.4% - 13,306 (13,686 last year)
DY - 87.2% - 9,276

FRA - LH - 88.1% 28,527 (23,947 last year)

KEF - FI - 81.4% - 20,496 (29,212 last year) - RIP Wow

LGW - DY - 89.8% - 19,146 (19,561 last year)

LHR - Combined - 78.2% - 92,197 (76,019 last year)

BA - 79% - 55,189 (54,036)
DL - 83.9% - 12,547 (9,258)
VS - 74.1% - 24,461 (12,725) - that 2nd daily seems to have done pretty well, double the pax count roughly and only a 3% loss in overall loads

LIS - Combined 88.1% - 17,962 (14,325 last year - DL's entry doesn't seem to have hurt TP in terms of numbers, at least in this month.

DL - 71.4% -2,320
TP - 91.3% - 15,642 (14,325)

MAD - 80.4% - 22,026 - (14,095 last year) - sadly MAD for DY is not coming back next year, at 82% their lowest load factor of their routes.

IB 79.5% - 14,680 (14,095)
DY 82.1% - 7,346

MAN - VS - 47.3% 814 (795 last year) - RIP TCX

MUC - LH - 85.8% - 15,803 (15,056)

PDL - S4 - 91.6% - 9,668 (8,557) - increase due to flights going from 36 to 55 in the month

SNN - EI - 87.4% - 9,593 (8,868)

TER - S4 - 94.6% - 1,759 (1,402)

ZRH - LX - 87.7% - 12,222 (12,367)
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Nov 16, 2019 10:50 pm

VS4ever wrote:
May 2019 - Load Factors from the T-100's (non-Europe to start, alphabetical order)

MEX - B6 66.1% - 6,159


Perhaps B6 should consider using A220 if they want to reenter the BOS-MEX route?
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 12:32 am

On the back of the BOS numbers above for May, I pulled the airlines that serve BOS internationally from elsewhere, so you can see who is doing what. I will do a couple in a number of posts to make the posts shorter.

Data is set up as follows: Top line will be the consolidated airline totals for the month, routes underneath,
Data format is Flights, Seats, Passengers, Loads.


Air France

For AF, the total is for all routes, however I have removed ORY, PPT and the caribbean routes from MIA. There were also 2 single (probably divert flights for PHL and PIT).
JFK, LAX, SFO and ATL are more than daily, pretty impressive to pull 89% on 4x daily for JFK.

Of the daily routes, BOS ranks 3rd behind ORD and IAD and just ahead of MIA (although MIA pushed more people through due to a larger gauge of aircraft (Avg of 378 seats vs 304), ignoring the outliers (DFW, MSP and SEA), IAH was the worst performer with 82.5%

AF 1236 433644 374454 86.4%
ATL-CDG 122 53276 41905 78.7%
BOS-CDG 63 19160 17042 88.9%
DFW-CDG 27 5920 4716 79.7%
DTW-CDG 61 16868 14092 83.5%
IAD-CDG 66 32442 28890 89.1%
IAH-CDG 61 17256 14233 82.5%
JFK-CDG 246 95978 85284 88.9%
LAX-CDG 135 53136 46387 87.3%
MIA-CDG 62 23444 20712 88.3%
MSP-CDG 54 14910 12288 82.4%
ORD-CDG 60 13644 12445 91.2%
SEA-CDG 44 9552 8289 86.8%
SFO-CDG 105 44064 39201 89.0%

Alitalia - total is for all routes, however I removed the outlier of MXP from JFK, given they now have competition from DY, the BOS performance was pretty good vs their network with only LAX beating out by about 3%, basement dweller was IAD, but they are less than daily, for daily, MIA brings up the rear. Overall network % of 80%,

AZ 483 131301 104785 79.8%
BOS-FCO 62 16149 13306 82.4%
IAD-FCO 44 10956 7232 66.0%
JFK-FCO 184 53522 43808 81.9%
LAX-FCO 63 18168 15536 85.5%
MIA-FCO 62 15438 12211 79.1%
ORD-FCO 6 1494 1051 70.3%

British Airways

Some interesting data here, 79% for BOS is a little low on the load side, but as we've seen elsewhere, the yields that BA are getting more than outweigh the slightly lower passenger totals due to the high J aircraft they are using.

In other news, CHS doesn't look good at 65%, hopefully the summer months will improve that. MSY pulled 87%, a sign that the route is rather successful. The LCY route is curious, the inbound (reported as JFK-SNN below) only managed 52%, but the outbound (reported as JFK-LCY) managed 80%, I am not sure why the big difference for a niche market route. JFK-LHR is just an impressive operation, 492 flights back and forth, 8 daily, 114,000 pax and an 86% loads, coupled with the front seat premiums BA will get on that route makes the numbers somewhat eye-watering.


BA 2998 840255 717369 85.4%
ATL-LHR 62 13998 12048 86.1%
AUS-LHR 61 20309 17721 87.3%
BNA-LHR 62 13392 11589 86.5%
BOS-LHR 248 69888 55189 79.0%
BWI-LHR 62 13276 12012 90.5%
CHS-LHR 18 3852 2514 65.3%
DEN-LHR 61 20433 18530 90.7%
DFW-LHR 62 13984 12310 88.0%
EWR-LHR 124 29216 24763 84.8%
FLL-LGW 24 7522 5530 73.5%
IAD-LHR 123 36174 31845 88.0%
IAH-LHR 121 29937 23232 77.6%
JFK-LCY 25 800 642 80.3%
JFK-LGW 60 19740 16834 85.3%
JFK-LHR 492 132882 114438 86.1%
JFK-SNN 25 800 417 52.1%
LAS-LGW 42 11550 9709 84.1%
LAS-LHR 62 20894 19057 91.2%
LAX-LHR 184 52040 45806 88.0%
MCO-LGW 114 35302 31842 90.2%
MIA-LHR 183 61547 50762 82.5%
MSY-LHR 45 9634 8395 87.1%
ORD-LHR 124 46252 41038 88.7%
PHL-LHR 86 22485 18744 83.4%
PHX-LHR 63 21231 17958 84.6%
PIT-LHR 36 7704 6087 79.0%
SAN-LHR 61 17727 13944 78.7%
SEA-LHR 122 29532 26273 89.0%
SFO-LHR 122 45190 40494 89.6%
SJC-LHR 61 13176 10788 81.9%
TPA-LGW 61 19154 16426 85.8%
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
FGITD
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 1:14 am

Very interesting collection of data, thank you for putting that together! What's amazing is just how high the yields are these days. You know things must be going ok if below 80% is noteworthy and cause for concern.

The only correction I must insist upon is the AF DTW flight. Having read these forums extensively, I believe that flight should be at least 100% both in and out, every single day of every month.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 1:37 am

FGITD wrote:
Very interesting collection of data, thank you for putting that together! What's amazing is just how high the yields are these days. You know things must be going ok if below 80% is noteworthy and cause for concern.

The only correction I must insist upon is the AF DTW flight. Having read these forums extensively, I believe that flight should be at least 100% both in and out, every single day of every month.


More to come, but i agree, DTW is the connection universe and should be full all the time.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 2:50 am

Part 2

Copa

BOS doing ok compared to the rest, you would expect places like MIA and LAX to do well and it shows, we are in the middle of the pack, it's hard to compare as there are so many different variations on flight numbers, closest numbers are ORD and SFO and we do comparably well to both.

CM 1765 271462 241502 89.0%
BOS-PTY 80 12380 11172 90.2%
DEN-PTY 30 4800 3755 78.2%
FLL-PTY 38 5672 4839 85.3%
IAD-PTY 124 19636 17807 90.7%
JFK-PTY 186 28644 26640 93.0%
LAS-PTY 43 6796 6131 90.2%
LAX-PTY 169 26026 24488 94.1%
MCO-PTY 308 48614 42128 86.7%
MIA-PTY 370 58198 53089 91.2%
MSY-PTY 35 4472 3554 79.5%
ORD-PTY 108 16956 15402 90.8%
SFO-PTY 106 16324 14649 89.7%
SJU-PTY 124 16408 12972 79.1%
TPA-PTY 44 6536 4876 74.6%

Cathay Pacific

This is obviously before all the troubles began, i have removed a divert from the list, but the CX total is the one reported. In terms of loads BOS is top of the tree, not by much, but we are. Impressive is the triple daily from JFK, however you can see why they terminated the YVR daily, 56% loads are not going to cut it, sadly. Network total of 84.3% is really dragged down by SEA, SFO and YVR.

CX 871 260821 219776 84.3%
BOS-HKG 62 17050 15997 93.8%
EWR-HKG 60 16800 15688 93.4%
IAD-HKG 34 9520 8430 88.6%
JFK-HKG 187 51425 48145 93.6%
JFK-YVR 62 17050 9636 56.5%
LAX-HKG 186 54684 47753 87.3%
ORD-HKG 60 16500 15414 93.4%
SEA-HKG 35 9800 7072 72.2%
SFO-HKG 184 67712 51377 75.9%


Norwegian

A lot to unpack, so i will split the comments, the Grand Total is everything, but i have removed the Scandinavian flights along with AMS, 85% network loads and a whopping 468K pax (helps when your 789's hold 344). So for LGW, BOS is in the middle of the pack overall, but the best of the true daily flights with just under 90%, I just love that they fly from LGW, I know the world is about LHR, but if you can price right, LGW has a huge catchment area, It's also interesting to note that with the exception of JFK (double daily +), BOS had the highest total pax of any other LGW route.

Grand Total 1669 548041 468057 85.4%

DI 596 197903 167694 84.7%
AUS-LGW 26 8944 7743 86.6%
BOS-LGW 62 21328 19146 89.8%
DEN-LGW 26 8502 7703 90.6%
JFK-LGW 168 54960 43753 79.6%
LAX-LGW 62 21328 18917 88.7%
MCO-LGW 55 16641 13897 83.5%
MIA-LGW 62 20236 15640 77.3%
ORD-LGW 36 11908 11178 93.9%
SEA-LGW 36 12384 10472 84.6%
SFO-LGW 44 15136 13736 90.8%
TPA-LGW 18 6192 5226 84.4%

For DY, I have kept the CDG, FCO and MAD comparatives, if you want to see the rest, let me know and i will pm the info, CDG, despite the AF/DL presence is doing rather well and is moving to 5 weekly from next April, something tells me, if they could, they might go daily on the route, Other routes fly more pax, but BOS got the best return, yields as we know are an entirely different story. FCO with it's AZ competition is also doing pretty well at 87%, only beaten by EWR, as for MAD, well it appears to be that 82% is too low, hence in a small way why it's not coming back next year..


DY 1073 350138 300363 85.8%
BOS-CDG 36 12331 11039 89.5%
BOS-FCO 36 10635 9276 87.2%
BOS-MAD 26 8944 7346 82.1%
DEN-CDG 28 9632 8331 86.5%
EWR-FCO 61 20984 18538 88.3%
FLL-CDG 26 8944 7325 81.9%
JFK-CDG 62 21328 18673 87.6%
JFK-MAD 62 21222 18734 88.3%
LAX-CDG 72 24715 21461 86.8%
LAX-FCO 36 10688 9419 88.1%
LAX-MAD 36 12331 10317 83.7%
MCO-CDG 18 6192 5330 86.1%
OAK-CDG 34 11696 9451 80.8%
OAK-FCO 26 7672 6221 81.1%


Part 3 coming soon, DL, EI and EK.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 2:05 pm

https://www.boston.com/travel/travel/20 ... e-december

VR will be doing something new with the Cape Verde flights:

Looks like SID-BOS-RAI on Tuesdays (with 3:10am arrival Wednesday morning in Praia) and RAI-BOS-SID (3:00am departure from Praia).

This is supposedly an effort to serve both the VFR and Africa connections which are growing on SID. They can probably get away with the poor arrival and departure times in RAI.

I have a hunch that the Saturday BOS-SID flight continues onto LOS (and vice versa) since VR's site mentions connections are available to Boston under the destinations page for Lagos and it is bookable.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 5:01 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
https://www.boston.com/travel/travel/2019/11/16/cabo-verde-adding-boston-route-december

VR will be doing something new with the Cape Verde flights:

Looks like SID-BOS-RAI on Tuesdays (with 3:10am arrival Wednesday morning in Praia) and RAI-BOS-SID (3:00am departure from Praia).

This is supposedly an effort to serve both the VFR and Africa connections which are growing on SID. They can probably get away with the poor arrival and departure times in RAI.

I have a hunch that the Saturday BOS-SID flight continues onto LOS (and vice versa) since VR's site mentions connections are available to Boston under the destinations page for Lagos and it is bookable.


The Tuesday flight makes sense, the Saturday flight is odd with only an hour's turnaround in BOS, I wonder if that's a mis-print, just seems too fast

EDIT: checked VR's site and no, it's an hour turnaround... I assume it's feasible to turn a 752 in an hour for an 8 hour flight?
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
georgiabill
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 5:15 pm

Is there any chance DY trys a seasonal BOS-ATH-BOS flight 3x or 4X May thru September?
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 6:43 pm

georgiabill wrote:
Is there any chance DY trys a seasonal BOS-ATH-BOS flight 3x or 4X May thru September?


This is a route I think DL would do well on seasonally. I could see either DY or DL launching it.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 9:08 pm

Part 3

Aer Lingus - 87% network load factor is up there, BOS-DUB actually has the best loads and the most pax for May, especially with it being double daily, BOS-SNN also did better than it's JFK counterpart, 87% is pretty impressive in my book for that route. Interesting to note that BDL at 85% is holding it's own,

EI 956 256820 222701 86.7%
BDL-DUB 62 10974 9386 85.5%
BOS-DUB 124 39308 36331 92.4%
BOS-SNN 62 10974 9593 87.4%
EWR-DUB 62 19646 16388 83.4%
IAD-DUB 62 16414 14623 89.1%
JFK-DUB 122 37702 34033 90.3%
JFK-SNN 54 9558 7725 80.8%
LAX-DUB 62 16562 13863 83.7%
MCO-DUB 34 9080 8242 90.8%
MIA-DUB 28 7624 5095 66.8%
ORD-DUB 124 39082 33958 86.9%
PHL-DUB 62 10974 9045 82.4%
SEA-DUB 36 9612 8257 85.9%
SFO-DUB 62 19310 16162 83.7%

Emirates - the total shows how the use of the A380 pushes up the numbers, compare 283K on 792 flights to EI's 222K on 956... This was when the capacity drop at DXB happened, we have a direct comparator with ORD and BOS beat them out, EWR-ATH 5th freedom at 89% is doing very well along with the JFK-MXP version. Really interesting to LAX down at 65% and IAD at 74%

EK 792 339910 282997 83.3%
BOS-DXB 54 19116 17712 92.7%
DFW-DXB 62 21948 18758 85.5%
EWR-ATH 62 21948 19618 89.4%
EWR-DXB 2 708 653 92.2%
FLL-DXB 26 6916 6111 88.4%
IAD-DXB 62 31992 23726 74.2%
IAH-DXB 62 25188 19249 76.4%
JFK-DXB 124 62310 54666 87.7%
JFK-MXP 62 31992 28232 88.2%
LAX-DXB 62 31992 20824 65.1%
MCO-DXB 36 12744 10336 81.1%
ORD-DXB 54 19116 17293 90.5%
SEA-DXB 62 21948 19734 89.9%
SFO-DXB 62 31992 26085 81.5%

Icelandair - The demise of WW really hasn't kicked FI into a higher gear, which tells you something about the WW passengers, BOS is their largest gateway with over 20K pax in May, despite most routes being in the 80% range, there are a couple of notable exceptions albeit on small data sets (MCI, PHL and TPA), SFO at 75% is a long route to gain only that level of load.

FI 800 164244 134307 81.8%
ANC-KEF 12 2196 1573 71.6%
BOS-KEF 102 25168 20496 81.4%
DEN-KEF 61 11184 9712 86.8%
EWR-KEF 62 12374 10156 82.1%
IAD-KEF 96 20568 17113 83.2%
JFK-KEF 88 20254 15760 77.8%
MCI-KEF 9 1650 944 57.2%
MCO-KEF 46 8427 6956 82.5%
MSP-KEF 62 12700 10828 85.3%
ORD-KEF 90 16498 13964 84.6%
PDX-KEF 29 5126 4095 79.9%
PHL-KEF 8 1466 861 58.7%
SEA-KEF 95 17405 15021 86.3%
SFO-KEF 36 8496 6403 75.4%
TPA-KEF 4 732 425 58.1%

Part 4: IB, JJ, JL, KE and KL coming soon.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 10:53 pm

Icelandair pulled the plug on MCI at the end of September. Seasonal service no longer.
Not surprising given the horrendous loads.
 
Dab747
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:02 pm

There is a post this evening about Singapore Airlines looking for another ULH route to North America. Along with Chicago, Boston is mentioned. I wonder if SQ could make a SiN-HKG-BOS route work if CX does in fact pull out of Boston in 2020. In the past they flew SQ 1 SIN-HKG-SFO. Any thoughts? Would SIN - BOS make more sense?
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:06 pm

Dab747 wrote:
There is a post this evening about Singapore Airlines looking for another ULH route to North America. Along with Chicago, Boston is mentioned. I wonder if SQ could make a SiN-HKG-BOS route work if CX does in fact pull out of Boston in 2020. In the past they flew SQ 1 SIN-HKG-SFO. Any thoughts? Would SIN - BOS make more sense?


What makes you think CX will pull out in 2020??
 
Dab747
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:07 pm

Unless I’m mistaken, wasn’t there a post earlier in the thread that alluded to CX leaving Boston. I will look back to see.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:46 pm

Part 4 of the May T-100 numbers for international route airlines from BOS.

Iberia - BOS came up 2nd to last in the numbers this month, but actually increased pax numbers year over year by about 600. JFK and MIA lead the way closely followed by ORD. SFO has come catching up to do even SJU is improving.

IB 518 161521 135031 83.6%

BOS-MAD 62 18468 14680 79.5%
JFK-MAD 124 43638 37456 85.8%
LAX-MAD 44 12384 9979 80.6%
MIA-MAD 123 36452 31057 85.2%
ORD-MAD 63 20043 16841 84.0%
SFO-MAD 28 8064 5675 70.4%
SJU-MAD 28 8072 6722 83.3%

Level - not much to compare right now, as there are just the two routes, but I wanted to separate them, as they are different operation effectively, JFK comes on stream in the July numbers and Las Vegas from October, let's not forget that ORY-BOS starts next year too.

BOS-BCN 28 8792 7611 86.6%
SFO-BCN 16 5024 4464 88.9%

Latam Brasil - There are other routes, but they are small and i wanted the GRU comparative, 91% loads are excellent for May, albeit for a less than daily route, I think we can see why this one is actually sticking around unlike the others that were terminated.

JJ 379 110221 97239 88.2%
BOS-GRU 38 8171 7440 91.1%
JFK-GRU 62 21098 19287 91.4%
MCO-GRU 62 13654 12203 89.4%
MIA-GRU 123 46472 40983 88.2%


JAL - I have just included the NRT routes, if you need HND, NGO or KIX, let me know., relatively easy comparison as most are single daily, 86% for BOS matched ORD and beat out LAX, given this profile, it's unlikely JL would go more than daily, but could add capacity, by shifting things around, of course there is the rumored HND flight, but has not been confirmed yet.

JL 1120 245075 197433 80.6%
BOS-NRT 62 12090 10457 86.5%
DFW-NRT 62 12090 10440 86.4%
GUM-NRT 65 12935 11407 88.2%
HNL-NRT 249 52496 40453 77.1%
JFK-NRT 62 15128 11868 78.5%
KOA-NRT 62 12338 7643 61.9%
LAX-NRT 62 15128 12498 82.6%
ORD-NRT 62 15112 13068 86.5%
SAN-NRT 62 11532 10041 87.1%
SEA-NRT 62 11532 9419 81.7%

Korean - As a new route, it's important that BOS is successful quickly and it appears so here, which explains the capacity and frequency increases for next year, 86% not to be sniffed at, certainly right in the mix with the other routes out there.

KE 1003 322471 274104 85.0%
ATL-ICN 62 22816 20629 90.4%
BOS-ICN 44 11836 10200 86.2%
DFW-ICN 44 12244 10754 87.8%
GUM-ICN 124 34838 29494 84.7%
HNL-ICN 62 22816 19289 84.5%
IAD-ICN 62 17174 15476 90.1%
JFK-ICN 124 50468 44464 88.1%
LAS-ICN 46 13330 11284 84.7%
LAX-ICN 124 50468 42015 83.3%
ORD-ICN 62 17230 15298 88.8%
SEA-ICN 62 17286 13675 79.1%
SFO-ICN 125 34877 27931 80.1%

KLM - not a new route, but the new entrant and 82%, albeit on less than daily is a good start, given the double daily already handled by DL, better than MSP and slightly behind ATL and IAH, the standout here is LAX on double daily with 92%.

KL 726 230488 201759 87.5%
ATL-AMS 62 23888 19808 82.9%
BOS-AMS 27 7772 6376 82.0%
IAD-AMS 59 18880 17127 90.7%
IAH-AMS 62 18280 15556 85.1%
JFK-AMS 174 53226 47171 88.6%
LAX-AMS 124 36736 33861 92.2%
MSP-AMS 36 10232 8072 78.9%
ORD-AMS 61 18384 16328 88.8%
SFO-AMS 98 36328 31296 86.1%
SLC-AMS 23 6762 6164 91.2%

Part 5: DL (because I missed it before and deserves it's own part.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:08 am

Part 5

Delta

Amsterdam - Given that KL just started, DL held it's own on loads for this month to AMS, but what a huge operation, roughly 17 daily based on the numbers below. Having spent some time at AMS, Pier D/E has a lot of DL metal, it almost looks like it's their airport not KL's. BOS keeps up with SEA, SLC wins the award for single daily, while JFK takes it for multiple.

ATL-AMS 186 54234 48161 88.8%
BOS-AMS 125 32242 27132 84.2%
DTW-AMS 248 72551 57934 79.9%
JFK-AMS 124 31973 29000 90.7%
LAX-AMS 35 10227 8342 81.6%
MCO-AMS 62 13825 12106 87.6%
MSP-AMS 186 54285 46212 85.1%
PDX-AMS 62 18130 14423 79.6%
SEA-AMS 124 31975 27290 85.3%
SLC-AMS 61 13613 12519 92.0%
TPA-AMS 17 3791 2684 70.8%

Charles De Gaulle - BOS sits in the middle of the pack overall, so this is pretty comfortable for DL, and of course they are going double daily next summer, I think we can see part of the rationale right here. IND/CVG and RDU not quite so hot, but nothing too scary here.

ATL-CDG 124 35887 30948 86.2%
BOS-CDG 62 13819 11928 86.3%
CVG-CDG 62 12894 10022 77.7%
DTW-CDG 124 27023 22199 82.1%
IND-CDG 48 10699 8286 77.4%
JFK-CDG 63 18362 16936 92.2%
LAX-CDG 27 7849 6372 81.2%
MSP-CDG 62 17860 15178 85.0%
RDU-CDG 61 13580 10541 77.6%
SEA-CDG 61 12655 10953 86.6%
SLC-CDG 62 13825 12158 87.9%

Dublin - BOS is lagging the other two, but ATL has no competition and the market from JFK is just huge with Double daily EI, along with BOS.

ATL-DUB 62 15059 13812 91.7%
BOS-DUB 62 11378 9268 81.5%
JFK-DUB 62 15050 13738 91.3%

Edinburgh - hard to judge too much until the June numbers come out and we get a side by side full month comparison.

BOS-EDI 17 2853 2359 82.7%
JFK-EDI 62 10310 9579 92.9%

Lisbon - hard to judge too much until June numbers for a full month comparison.

BOS-LIS 17 3249 2320 71.4%
JFK-LIS 61 10089 9127 90.5%

Heathrow - 2nd to MSP in terms of loads in May, the BOS flight has come a long way since years past of very low loads. PDX looks a little scary at 58%, hopefully it's like BOS used to be and busy up front.

ATL-LHR 124 32878 26972 82.0%
BOS-LHR 64 14946 12547 83.9%
DTW-LHR 115 26277 20085 76.4%
JFK-LHR 125 29381 23395 79.6%
MSP-LHR 61 13584 11810 86.9%
PDX-LHR 44 9798 5678 58.0%
SLC-LHR 59 13146 10817 82.3%

Part 6: LH, LX and LY
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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gatibosgru
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Nov 18, 2019 1:47 am

Nice to see the flight from/to GRU having very health LF!
@DadCelo
 
zuoyi
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Nov 18, 2019 2:02 am

VS4ever wrote:
Part 5

Delta

Amsterdam - Given that KL just started, DL held it's own on loads for this month to AMS, but what a huge operation, roughly 17 daily based on the numbers below. Having spent some time at AMS, Pier D/E has a lot of DL metal, it almost looks like it's their airport not KL's. BOS keeps up with SEA, SLC wins the award for single daily, while JFK takes it for multiple.

ATL-AMS 186 54234 48161 88.8%
BOS-AMS 125 32242 27132 84.2%
DTW-AMS 248 72551 57934 79.9%
JFK-AMS 124 31973 29000 90.7%
LAX-AMS 35 10227 8342 81.6%
MCO-AMS 62 13825 12106 87.6%
MSP-AMS 186 54285 46212 85.1%
PDX-AMS 62 18130 14423 79.6%
SEA-AMS 124 31975 27290 85.3%
SLC-AMS 61 13613 12519 92.0%
TPA-AMS 17 3791 2684 70.8%

Charles De Gaulle - BOS sits in the middle of the pack overall, so this is pretty comfortable for DL, and of course they are going double daily next summer, I think we can see part of the rationale right here. IND/CVG and RDU not quite so hot, but nothing too scary here.

ATL-CDG 124 35887 30948 86.2%
BOS-CDG 62 13819 11928 86.3%
CVG-CDG 62 12894 10022 77.7%
DTW-CDG 124 27023 22199 82.1%
IND-CDG 48 10699 8286 77.4%
JFK-CDG 63 18362 16936 92.2%
LAX-CDG 27 7849 6372 81.2%
MSP-CDG 62 17860 15178 85.0%
RDU-CDG 61 13580 10541 77.6%
SEA-CDG 61 12655 10953 86.6%
SLC-CDG 62 13825 12158 87.9%

Dublin - BOS is lagging the other two, but ATL has no competition and the market from JFK is just huge with Double daily EI, along with BOS.

ATL-DUB 62 15059 13812 91.7%
BOS-DUB 62 11378 9268 81.5%
JFK-DUB 62 15050 13738 91.3%

Edinburgh - hard to judge too much until the June numbers come out and we get a side by side full month comparison.

BOS-EDI 17 2853 2359 82.7%
JFK-EDI 62 10310 9579 92.9%

Lisbon - hard to judge too much until June numbers for a full month comparison.

BOS-LIS 17 3249 2320 71.4%
JFK-LIS 61 10089 9127 90.5%

Heathrow - 2nd to MSP in terms of loads in May, the BOS flight has come a long way since years past of very low loads. PDX looks a little scary at 58%, hopefully it's like BOS used to be and busy up front.

ATL-LHR 124 32878 26972 82.0%
BOS-LHR 64 14946 12547 83.9%
DTW-LHR 115 26277 20085 76.4%
JFK-LHR 125 29381 23395 79.6%
MSP-LHR 61 13584 11810 86.9%
PDX-LHR 44 9798 5678 58.0%
SLC-LHR 59 13146 10817 82.3%

Part 6: LH, LX and LY


Very nice data! Would you please tell me where you found all the route-specific data?

I tried to look on DOT's website, but couldn't find the route data like this. All I found was something like this https://www.transtats.bts.gov/Oneway.as ... lay_Flag=0

Thanks in advance!

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