Thanks for the replies. We are catching a 4:10 flt. Back to ATL. Decided against the tour, and will just cab over to BOS.
This will be my first time in Term.A. My last trips to BOS we were still NWA , great city and had a bunch of great layovers there.
Thanks again

Capn wrote:

Thanks for the replies. We are catching a 4:10 flt. Back to ATL. Decided against the tour, and will just cab over to BOS.
This will be my first time in Term.A. My last trips to BOS we were still NWA , great city and had a bunch of great layovers there.
Thanks again

Since you will have some time, there are some things in East Boston that you can do:

- Have some food and drink at the Reel House (https://www.reelhouseboston.com/) - nice waterfront dining spot with outdoor options. There is also a water taxi from there to Charlestown, in the Navy Yard - and you could see Old Ironsides and some of the other sights there.
- If it's open, I highly suggest grabbing lunch at Rino's (http://rinosplace.com/) if you like Italian food.
- Rent a small sailboat and go out on Boston Harbor at Piers Park (https://piersparksailing.org/). In general, hanging out at Pier's Park is pretty relaxing and enjoyable and there are often food trucks and other things in the area.

tlecam,
Thanks for rest. tips, the Reel House sounds like the winner, ran it by the Chief Pilot ( WIFE ) an she liked the idea.
Have a great day.

Official DL announcement on BOS/JFK adds -

https://news.delta.com/delta-virgin-atl ... nd-uk-2020

BOS
Departs BOS at 9:00 p.m. and arrives LGW at 8:45 a.m. (next day) (daily)
Departs LGW at 10:30 a.m. and arrives BOS at 1:20 p.m. (daily)

Delta’s new Manchester service is scheduled as follows:

BOS
Departs BOS at 10:00 p.m. and arrives MAN at 9:30 a.m. (next day) (daily)
Departs MAN at 11:30 a.m. and arrives BOS at 2:00 p.m. (daily)

Starting this winter, all of Delta’s JFK and Boston-Heathrow flights will operate on its newly retrofitted Boeing 767-400 aircraft, featuring a modern interior and all four branded seat products – including a more private Delta One experience, Delta Premium Select, Delta Comfort+ and Main Cabin – to give customers greater choice when they travel. Delta's refreshed 764-400 aircraft also features the new wireless IFE system developed by Delta Flight Products with seat-back entertainment screens in every cabin and thoughtful touches like full-spectrum LED ambient lighting and memory foam cushions for added comfort. The aircraft is equipped with 33 Delta One seats in a 1-2-1 configuration, 20 Delta Premium Select seats in a 2-2-2 configuration, 28 seats in Delta Comfort+ and 156 seats in Main Cabin.

I believe GLA maybe the only GBR destination (major) remaining from BOS through DL if you also include seasonal adds: LHR, LGW, EDI (seasonal) and MAN

I noticed that WN dropped some nonstop routes out of BOS in after January 5th, 2020 in today's schedule extension, including BOS-ATL, BOS-AUS, BOS-DAL, BOS-HOU, BOS-MCI, and BOS-MKE.

I am unsure if any of these cuts by WN are permanent route discontinuations, temporary route discontinuations due to the 737 MAX grounding, or seasonal route suspensions.

Update to WN cuts out of BOS starting in January 2020:
BOS-ATL, BOS-MCI, and BOS-MKE permanently discontinued after January 5th
BOS-HOU reduced to Sunday-only, starting on January 5th
BOS-AUS and BOS-DAL reduced to seasonal nonstop service after January 5th

iyerhari wrote:

Official DL announcement on BOS/JFK adds -

https://news.delta.com/delta-virgin-atl ... nd-uk-2020

BOS
Departs BOS at 9:00 p.m. and arrives LGW at 8:45 a.m. (next day) (daily)
Departs LGW at 10:30 a.m. and arrives BOS at 1:20 p.m. (daily)

Delta’s new Manchester service is scheduled as follows:

BOS
Departs BOS at 10:00 p.m. and arrives MAN at 9:30 a.m. (next day) (daily)
Departs MAN at 11:30 a.m. and arrives BOS at 2:00 p.m. (daily)

Starting this winter, all of Delta’s JFK and Boston-Heathrow flights will operate on its newly retrofitted Boeing 767-400 aircraft, featuring a modern interior and all four branded seat products – including a more private Delta One experience, Delta Premium Select, Delta Comfort+ and Main Cabin – to give customers greater choice when they travel. Delta's refreshed 764-400 aircraft also features the new wireless IFE system developed by Delta Flight Products with seat-back entertainment screens in every cabin and thoughtful touches like full-spectrum LED ambient lighting and memory foam cushions for added comfort. The aircraft is equipped with 33 Delta One seats in a 1-2-1 configuration, 20 Delta Premium Select seats in a 2-2-2 configuration, 28 seats in Delta Comfort+ and 156 seats in Main Cabin.

I believe GLA maybe the only GBR destination (major) remaining from BOS through DL if you also include seasonal adds: LHR, LGW, EDI (seasonal) and MAN

Not surprised with the later evening times. Won't be a problem with gates, and good arrival times in the UK.

jplatts wrote:

Update to WN cuts out of BOS starting in January 2020:
BOS-ATL, BOS-MCI, and BOS-MKE permanently discontinued after January 5th
BOS-HOU reduced to Sunday-only, starting on January 5th
BOS-AUS and BOS-DAL reduced to seasonal nonstop service after January 5th

At least some of these were in the OAG thread a few weeks ago. Appears that WN is not going to fight DL and B6 on these routes.

I believe that DL and B6 both fly BOS-ATL and BOS-AUS.

B6 flies BOS-HOU (and United obviously covers BOS-IAH)

DL flies BOS-MCI, BOS-MKE

Neither fly BOS-DAL, but AA and B6 fly to DFW.


I do think that is a reasonable proxy for how some of the route battles will go; DL and B6 will coexist but squeeze the other competitors on routes that are weaker in Boston.

I am very interested to see waht happens with Chicago and DC. Fares will be a bloodbath.

tlecam wrote:

B6 flies BOS-HOU (and United obviously covers BOS-IAH)

B6 has already announced that it is planning to move BOS-HOU over to IAH starting on October 27th.

Question to folks who know about LHR - I was checking that VS flies from LHR to BOM, DEL, TLV etc. How easy is to connect on a DL flight from BOS-LHR on VS to BOM/DEL?

LHR is a complex airport so asking if it's worth taking VS from BOS-BOM/DEL - i have always taken BA also because my affiliation is with OW.

jplatts wrote:

Update to WN cuts out of BOS starting in January 2020:
BOS-ATL, BOS-MCI, and BOS-MKE permanently discontinued after January 5th
BOS-HOU reduced to Sunday-only, starting on January 5th
BOS-AUS and BOS-DAL reduced to seasonal nonstop service after January 5th

What a great day for B6 and greater day for DL. B6 may want to look very closely at MKE and MCI.

iyerhari wrote:

Question to folks who know about LHR - I was checking that VS flies from LHR to BOM, DEL, TLV etc. How easy is to connect on a DL flight from BOS-LHR on VS to BOM/DEL?

LHR is a complex airport so asking if it's worth taking VS from BOS-BOM/DEL - i have always taken BA also because my affiliation is with OW.

DL/VS are both terminal 3. should be pretty easy to connect as long as you like to hike from one gate to another, those gates can take 15 minutes to get back to the terminal and another 15 minutes to get to the other pier. ironically depending on BA's schedule and aircraft location, VS/DL might actually be better..

tlecam wrote:

jplatts wrote:

Update to WN cuts out of BOS starting in January 2020:
BOS-ATL, BOS-MCI, and BOS-MKE permanently discontinued after January 5th
BOS-HOU reduced to Sunday-only, starting on January 5th
BOS-AUS and BOS-DAL reduced to seasonal nonstop service after January 5th

At least some of these were in the OAG thread a few weeks ago. Appears that WN is not going to fight DL and B6 on these routes.

I believe that DL and B6 both fly BOS-ATL and BOS-AUS.

B6 flies BOS-HOU (and United obviously covers BOS-IAH)

DL flies BOS-MCI, BOS-MKE

Neither fly BOS-DAL, but AA and B6 fly to DFW.


I do think that is a reasonable proxy for how some of the route battles will go; DL and B6 will coexist but squeeze the other competitors on routes that are weaker in Boston.

I am very interested to see waht happens with Chicago and DC. Fares will be a bloodbath.

Couple of other adds: DL flies to CMH. DL flies to BNA.

DL and B6 fly to AUS - I believe that may the next victim for WN.

would WN even need the 5 gates that WN is supposed to have after they move to Terminal B?

VS4ever wrote:

iyerhari wrote:

Question to folks who know about LHR - I was checking that VS flies from LHR to BOM, DEL, TLV etc. How easy is to connect on a DL flight from BOS-LHR on VS to BOM/DEL?

LHR is a complex airport so asking if it's worth taking VS from BOS-BOM/DEL - i have always taken BA also because my affiliation is with OW.

DL/VS are both terminal 3. should be pretty easy to connect as long as you like to hike from one gate to another, those gates can take 15 minutes to get back to the terminal and another 15 minutes to get to the other pier. ironically depending on BA's schedule and aircraft location, VS/DL might actually be better..

Thank you. The reason I ask is LHR is a complex airport - there are concourses and there are specific rules that exist so that folks do not have to go through security which is extremely elaborate.

This has been discussed in the past that DL LHR is primarily O&D which i do not think is the case. With the DL/VS JV. there is significant opportunity on onward connections to India and some of the Asian locations. Not in the same level as BA but BOM/DEL are huge markets.

adamh8297 wrote:

jplatts wrote:

Update to WN cuts out of BOS starting in January 2020:
BOS-ATL, BOS-MCI, and BOS-MKE permanently discontinued after January 5th
BOS-HOU reduced to Sunday-only, starting on January 5th
BOS-AUS and BOS-DAL reduced to seasonal nonstop service after January 5th

What a great day for B6 and greater day for DL. B6 may want to look very closely at MKE and MCI.

So they are only going to have BWI and MDW permanently, is that right? If so, no way are they going to need 5 gates.. i wonder if with F9 coming in whether there's an agreement for them to move across from E to cover the space?

Curious..

VS4ever wrote:

adamh8297 wrote:

jplatts wrote:

Update to WN cuts out of BOS starting in January 2020:
BOS-ATL, BOS-MCI, and BOS-MKE permanently discontinued after January 5th
BOS-HOU reduced to Sunday-only, starting on January 5th
BOS-AUS and BOS-DAL reduced to seasonal nonstop service after January 5th

What a great day for B6 and greater day for DL. B6 may want to look very closely at MKE and MCI.

So they are only going to have BWI and MDW permanently, is that right? If so, no way are they going to need 5 gates.. i wonder if with F9 coming in whether there's an agreement for them to move across from E to cover the space?

Curious..

They still have

STL which is 4 daily I believe
CMH
DEN
BNA

VS4ever wrote:

So they are only going to have BWI and MDW permanently, is that right? If so, no way are they going to need 5 gates.. i wonder if with F9 coming in whether there's an agreement for them to move across from E to cover the space?

In addition to BOS-BWI and BOS-MDW, WN will also still have nonstop service to CMH, DEN, BNA, and STL out of BOS after the January 5, 2020 cuts.

VS4ever wrote:

adamh8297 wrote:

jplatts wrote:

Update to WN cuts out of BOS starting in January 2020:
BOS-ATL, BOS-MCI, and BOS-MKE permanently discontinued after January 5th
BOS-HOU reduced to Sunday-only, starting on January 5th
BOS-AUS and BOS-DAL reduced to seasonal nonstop service after January 5th

What a great day for B6 and greater day for DL. B6 may want to look very closely at MKE and MCI.

So they are only going to have BWI and MDW permanently, is that right? If so, no way are they going to need 5 gates.. i wonder if with F9 coming in whether there's an agreement for them to move across from E to cover the space?

Curious..

WN will still have STL BNA CMH and DEN for a total of about 23 daily flights in January. Its in their best interest to squander gates to keep competition out.

jplatts wrote:

VS4ever wrote:

So they are only going to have BWI and MDW permanently, is that right? If so, no way are they going to need 5 gates.. i wonder if with F9 coming in whether there's an agreement for them to move across from E to cover the space?

In addition to BOS-BWI and BOS-MDW, WN will also still have nonstop service to CMH, DEN, BNA, and STL out of BOS after the January 5, 2020 cuts.

ok, i knew i was missing something, thanks for the correction, I still wonder even with that, if they need all 5 gates. Massport gave them that, predictated on a 51-56 Departures per day, that's going to be more like 30 or less.

Just booked BOS-AMS-FCO roundtrip for about $1260 in J for next April.
I am looking forward to a London business class airfare war also.

RL757PVD wrote:

VS4ever wrote:

adamh8297 wrote:

What a great day for B6 and greater day for DL. B6 may want to look very closely at MKE and MCI.

So they are only going to have BWI and MDW permanently, is that right? If so, no way are they going to need 5 gates.. i wonder if with F9 coming in whether there's an agreement for them to move across from E to cover the space?

Curious..

WN will still have STL BNA CMH and DEN for a total of about 23 daily flights in January. Its in their best interest to squander gates to keep competition out.

The time is now for Southwest to launch Denver to Providence flights. Provide a nice compliment to their Denver to Boston and Denver to Hartford flights and that will cover all of the meaningful New England regions for them.

iyerhari wrote:

VS4ever wrote:

iyerhari wrote:

Question to folks who know about LHR - I was checking that VS flies from LHR to BOM, DEL, TLV etc. How easy is to connect on a DL flight from BOS-LHR on VS to BOM/DEL?

LHR is a complex airport so asking if it's worth taking VS from BOS-BOM/DEL - i have always taken BA also because my affiliation is with OW.

DL/VS are both terminal 3. should be pretty easy to connect as long as you like to hike from one gate to another, those gates can take 15 minutes to get back to the terminal and another 15 minutes to get to the other pier. ironically depending on BA's schedule and aircraft location, VS/DL might actually be better..

Thank you. The reason I ask is LHR is a complex airport - there are concourses and there are specific rules that exist so that folks do not have to go through security which is extremely elaborate.

This has been discussed in the past that DL LHR is primarily O&D which i do not think is the case. With the DL/VS JV. there is significant opportunity on onward connections to India and some of the Asian locations. Not in the same level as BA but BOM/DEL are huge markets.

I don't find it that complex. Same terminal connections are as easy as anywhere. When I fly thru LHR I tend to self connect. You can get really cheap fares that way. Last time I was there I flew BOS-LHR with VS and LHR-MUC with LH. Even though I had to change terminals with luggage and do the check-in again for the LH flight, the whole process was pretty straight forward and easy. However I do have a EU passport so clearing immigration is a breeze.

B752OS wrote:

RL757PVD wrote:

VS4ever wrote:

So they are only going to have BWI and MDW permanently, is that right? If so, no way are they going to need 5 gates.. i wonder if with F9 coming in whether there's an agreement for them to move across from E to cover the space?

Curious..

WN will still have STL BNA CMH and DEN for a total of about 23 daily flights in January. Its in their best interest to squander gates to keep competition out.

The time is now for Southwest to launch Denver to Providence flights. Provide a nice compliment to their Denver to Boston and Denver to Hartford flights and that will cover all of the meaningful New England regions for them.

They probably would have been better off with both DEN and HOU out of PVD. I can see their motivation for keeping a robust STL in keeping B6 at bay

Is Delta's MAN-BOS going to be year round or seasonal? There seems to be some trolls on wikipedia who seem to think this route is just seasonal, but Delta has made NO indication it is seasonal.

massachoicetts wrote:

Is Delta's MAN-BOS going to be year round or seasonal? There seems to be some trolls on wikipedia who seem to think this route is just seasonal, but Delta has made NO indication it is seasonal.

Quote from DL’s press release:

https://news.delta.com/delta-virgin-atl ... nd-uk-2020

“Delta is also set to return to Manchester with new peak-summer service from Boston effective May 21, 2020.”

Sounds like summer seasonal to me.

What are the odds that Delta will reestablish a pilot base at Logan? The 757 and 767-300 are treated as the same for pilot staffing purposes (pretty sure its called the 756 internally) and by my count there will be at least 12 departures daily next summer on 763 and Int'l J-class configured 757s (3X LAX, 1 SFO, 1 SLC, 1 CDG, 1 AMS, 1 DUB, 1 EDI, 1 MAN, 1 LIS). That doesn't start to count the ATL and JFK 757 flights although I think most of those are currently for the purpose of getting planes and crews into BOS for the Int'l feed.

Having a BOS base is just a selfish want for me...but it would be great. Provides a lot more schedule reliability given that the crew is local and you can count on them being there (in theory, I know....) but also makes the longevity of the BOS "hub" more secure as it just puts more assets on the ground at Logan and just that much more complex to uproot.

Speaking of bases for DL: The fight attendant base at Logan has really exploded in size. I used to feel as if I knew at least 1/2 the BOS based F/As and I certainly knew their route patterns (as I often had the same folks on Monday and Tuesday mornings to either LGA, MSP, LAX and ATL). So many new folks now.

N717TW wrote:

What are the odds that Delta will reestablish a pilot base at Logan? The 757 and 767-300 are treated as the same for pilot staffing purposes (pretty sure its called the 756 internally) and by my count there will be at least 12 departures daily next summer on 763 and Int'l J-class configured 757s (3X LAX, 1 SFO, 1 SLC, 1 CDG, 1 AMS, 1 DUB, 1 EDI, 1 MAN, 1 LIS). That doesn't start to count the ATL and JFK 757 flights although I think most of those are currently for the purpose of getting planes and crews into BOS for the Int'l feed.

Having a BOS base is just a selfish want for me...but it would be great. Provides a lot more schedule reliability given that the crew is local and you can count on them being there (in theory, I know....) but also makes the longevity of the BOS "hub" more secure as it just puts more assets on the ground at Logan and just that much more complex to uproot.

Speaking of bases for DL: The fight attendant base at Logan has really exploded in size. I used to feel as if I knew at least 1/2 the BOS based F/As and I certainly knew their route patterns (as I often had the same folks on Monday and Tuesday mornings to either LGA, MSP, LAX and ATL). So many new folks now.

Given that Republic just opened a crew base in BOS I would imagine a DL pilot base is in the work. A 757/767 or an A320 base would make the most sense.

N717TW wrote:

What are the odds that Delta will reestablish a pilot base at Logan? The 757 and 767-300 are treated as the same for pilot staffing purposes (pretty sure its called the 756 internally) and by my count there will be at least 12 departures daily next summer on 763 and Int'l J-class configured 757s (3X LAX, 1 SFO, 1 SLC, 1 CDG, 1 AMS, 1 DUB, 1 EDI, 1 MAN, 1 LIS). That doesn't start to count the ATL and JFK 757 flights although I think most of those are currently for the purpose of getting planes and crews into BOS for the Int'l feed.

Having a BOS base is just a selfish want for me...but it would be great. Provides a lot more schedule reliability given that the crew is local and you can count on them being there (in theory, I know....) but also makes the longevity of the BOS "hub" more secure as it just puts more assets on the ground at Logan and just that much more complex to uproot.

Speaking of bases for DL: The fight attendant base at Logan has really exploded in size. I used to feel as if I knew at least 1/2 the BOS based F/As and I certainly knew their route patterns (as I often had the same folks on Monday and Tuesday mornings to either LGA, MSP, LAX and ATL). So many new folks now.

Your flight mix is a little off. It will be:

3X 75S LAX, 1X 764 LHR, 1X 75S LGW, 1X 76W SLC, 1X 76W CDG, 1X 76W AMS, 1X 76W DUB, 1X 75S EDI, 1X 75S
MAN

If you also want to count the non international configured 757’s that will add an additional 2X SFO and 1X LIS for a total of 14 flights next summer out of BOS. There are also flights to ATL & DTW this summer which are 757’s and will most likely be back next year so the real total is likely closer to 17X per day.

On a side note - I wonder if DL would consider adding either SNN or KEF from BOS on non-J 757’s?

clrd4t8koff wrote:

N717TW wrote:

What are the odds that Delta will reestablish a pilot base at Logan? The 757 and 767-300 are treated as the same for pilot staffing purposes (pretty sure its called the 756 internally) and by my count there will be at least 12 departures daily next summer on 763 and Int'l J-class configured 757s (3X LAX, 1 SFO, 1 SLC, 1 CDG, 1 AMS, 1 DUB, 1 EDI, 1 MAN, 1 LIS). That doesn't start to count the ATL and JFK 757 flights although I think most of those are currently for the purpose of getting planes and crews into BOS for the Int'l feed.

Having a BOS base is just a selfish want for me...but it would be great. Provides a lot more schedule reliability given that the crew is local and you can count on them being there (in theory, I know....) but also makes the longevity of the BOS "hub" more secure as it just puts more assets on the ground at Logan and just that much more complex to uproot.

Speaking of bases for DL: The fight attendant base at Logan has really exploded in size. I used to feel as if I knew at least 1/2 the BOS based F/As and I certainly knew their route patterns (as I often had the same folks on Monday and Tuesday mornings to either LGA, MSP, LAX and ATL). So many new folks now.

Your flight mix is a little off. It will be:

3X 75S LAX, 1X 764 LHR, 1X 75S LGW, 1X 76W SLC, 1X 76W CDG, 1X 76W AMS, 1X 76W DUB, 1X 75S EDI, 1X 75S
MAN

If you also want to count the non international configured 757’s that will add an additional 2X SFO and 1X LIS for a total of 14 flights next summer out of BOS. There are also flights to ATL & DTW this summer which are 757’s and will most likely be back next year so the real total is likely closer to 17X per day.

On a side note - I wonder if DL would consider adding either SNN or KEF from BOS on non-J 757’s?

Thanks. I didn't count the LHR 767-400 because the 764 is a different pilot group than the 767-300...the 767-300 and 757-200 are the same pilot crew group for pay, staffing, training, scheduling and line holding purposes.

I finally got around to downloading and editing my photos from the HiFly A380 arrival and departure into BOS this week.

However I decided to make a thread featuring content from all of the spotters who came out in force to the special A380. If I missed anyone let me know and I will add them.

So here is the Hi Fly A380 with the boston skyline in the background! Photos by myself and other Boston based spotters! https://twitter.com/theOrangetechie/status/1162552604578197505?s=20

tlecam wrote:

I am very interested to see waht happens with Chicago and DC. Fares will be a bloodbath.

It's going to be tough for anyone to cut frequencies on BOS-DCA or BOS-ORD without alienating their customer base. (Except NK -- why do they fly BOS-ORD?)

That said, AA and UA have room to downgauge ORD flights. UA used to use E175s on some ORD frequencies; I'm sure they could again.

I do wonder if some of the DC downsizing has actually happened at IAD, with B6 having dropped it entirely, and UA now down to four flights a day.

dtremit wrote:

tlecam wrote:

I am very interested to see waht happens with Chicago and DC. Fares will be a bloodbath.

It's going to be tough for anyone to cut frequencies on BOS-DCA or BOS-ORD without alienating their customer base. (Except NK -- why do they fly BOS-ORD?)

That said, AA and UA have room to downgauge ORD flights. UA used to use E175s on some ORD frequencies; I'm sure they could again.

I do wonder if some of the DC downsizing has actually happened at IAD, with B6 having dropped it entirely, and UA now down to four flights a day.

UA appears to have Mesa operating to of today's IAD-BOS flights, one on the CRJ700, and one on an E175

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-17aug19/

While the headlines have all been about LGW and MAN on DL, apparently they snuck an equipment change on BOS-LHR from end of March on VS and now both flights are 333’s vs 789’s, uptick of about 8 seats a flight or so, but interestingly the 333’s are more premium economy heavy, upper class is the same.

A few notes from the weekly OAG thread.
DL BOS-DUB DEC 0>0.3[0]
*DL BOS-LGW MAY 0>0.4[0]
*DL BOS-MAN MAY 0>0.4[0
It seems as if Delta is running a 767 between December 19 and December 23 on the route.
I wonder if this could be the slow development of the route into running year-round eventually.

Reminder the RED ARROWS will be flying through boston harbor tomorrow and then landing at BOS

NickolayAv wrote:

A few notes from the weekly OAG thread.
DL BOS-DUB DEC 0>0.3[0]
*DL BOS-LGW MAY 0>0.4[0]
*DL BOS-MAN MAY 0>0.4[0
It seems as if Delta is running a 767 between December 19 and December 23 on the route.
I wonder if this could be the slow development of the route into running year-round eventually.

The OAG thread also had increase YOY on the following from WN along with the cuts (MKE, ATL, decrease CMH etc)
BNA to 3
DEN to 1.9
MDW to 4
BWI to 8

Southwest ground agent I spoke with leaving my flight Sunday night said the airline's last day of operation at Terminal A would be the night of the 28th (a Wednesday). First day of operation from Terminal B would be Thursday the 29th.

It's amazing how much space there actually is in that area, and just how barren it has looked with Southwest in there.

B6BOSfan wrote:

Southwest ground agent I spoke with leaving my flight Sunday night said the airline's last day of operation at Terminal A would be the night of the 28th (a Wednesday). First day of operation from Terminal B would be Thursday the 29th.

It's amazing how much space there actually is in that area, and just how barren it has looked with Southwest in there.

Kinda surprised they did have the newer monitor style flight boards verses the older style. Thanks for the photos.

Taken last Sunday, the 11th... Seems the old American ticket counters have gotten the Southwest treatment (near the escalators to baggage claim).

Dieuwer wrote:

So we have tons of domestic capacity additions leading to trashy fares, while TATL premium fares are still sky high. What gives?? Why are airlines not adding TATL premium capacity instead of trashing it out domestically?

Case in point:
Next Monday BOS-LAX, cheapest B6 Mint = $619. Cheapest J BOS-LHR = $6609 (DL).

Now why would B6 want to fly transatlantic......hmmmm

Bluewho wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

So we have tons of domestic capacity additions leading to trashy fares, while TATL premium fares are still sky high. What gives?? Why are airlines not adding TATL premium capacity instead of trashing it out domestically?

Case in point:
Next Monday BOS-LAX, cheapest B6 Mint = $619. Cheapest J BOS-LHR = $6609 (DL).

Now why would B6 want to fly transatlantic......hmmmm

Sure. "Someday...".
Remember how quickly JetBlue added TCON Mint after announcing it? While Europe has been bandied about for YEARS and we are still waiting.

Dieuwer wrote:

Bluewho wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

So we have tons of domestic capacity additions leading to trashy fares, while TATL premium fares are still sky high. What gives?? Why are airlines not adding TATL premium capacity instead of trashing it out domestically?

Case in point:
Next Monday BOS-LAX, cheapest B6 Mint = $619. Cheapest J BOS-LHR = $6609 (DL).

Now why would B6 want to fly transatlantic......hmmmm

Sure. "Someday...".
Remember how quickly JetBlue added TCON Mint after announcing it? While Europe has been bandied about for YEARS and we are still waiting.

The decision making needed for TCON vs TATL is a hell of a lot different. I am not saying that B6 haven't taken forever to do it, They have, but the decision to add Mint to TCON, is an awful lot easier to implement than a TATL decision. As I said, i think we all agree B6 have taken for ever for a variety of reasons, but to say that TATL could be implemented at the same speed without the infrastructure that already exists to complete transcons is simply a fallacy.

VS4ever wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

Bluewho wrote:

Now why would B6 want to fly transatlantic......hmmmm

Sure. "Someday...".
Remember how quickly JetBlue added TCON Mint after announcing it? While Europe has been bandied about for YEARS and we are still waiting.

The decision making needed for TCON vs TATL is a hell of a lot different. I am not saying that B6 haven't taken forever to do it, They have, but the decision to add Mint to TCON, is an awful lot easier to implement than a TATL decision. As I said, i think we all agree B6 have taken for ever for a variety of reasons, but to say that TATL could be implemented at the same speed without the infrastructure that already exists to complete transcons is simply a fallacy.

Perhaps. But Delta announces new TATL service and 9 months later it happens.

Dieuwer wrote:

VS4ever wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

Sure. "Someday...".
Remember how quickly JetBlue added TCON Mint after announcing it? While Europe has been bandied about for YEARS and we are still waiting.

The decision making needed for TCON vs TATL is a hell of a lot different. I am not saying that B6 haven't taken forever to do it, They have, but the decision to add Mint to TCON, is an awful lot easier to implement than a TATL decision. As I said, i think we all agree B6 have taken for ever for a variety of reasons, but to say that TATL could be implemented at the same speed without the infrastructure that already exists to complete transcons is simply a fallacy.

Perhaps. But Delta announces new TATL service and 9 months later it happens.

You have to consider availability of aircraft. We are probably 18 months away from their launch date. They have a major delivery delay in A321NEO this year and next year. Even if they had made the LR decision in Q1 2018, they likely would've had to wait until Q4 of 2020 before they can start flying to Europe.

But they have a very aggressive TATL plan once it starts. They are going to take delivery of 26 A321LR/XLR with probably more than half of that going to BOS (probably 15 flights?). These will have a premium layout and still very low cost of operation compared to anything else in the market. I also wouldn't be surprised to see A220s fly to places like SNN, BFL or GLA down the road. By 2025, those TCON premium fares will be everywhere in TATL market also. The days of BA and DL charging ridiculous J or one-way Y fares to LHR will be over. It will make life very hard for existing operators. I would be shocked to see DY sticking around for example. if B6 doesn't go under or get taken over in the next few years, I think it will end up with a huge TATL hub out of BOS (probably close to AA @ PHL in # of departures)

tphuang wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

VS4ever wrote:

The decision making needed for TCON vs TATL is a hell of a lot different. I am not saying that B6 haven't taken forever to do it, They have, but the decision to add Mint to TCON, is an awful lot easier to implement than a TATL decision. As I said, i think we all agree B6 have taken for ever for a variety of reasons, but to say that TATL could be implemented at the same speed without the infrastructure that already exists to complete transcons is simply a fallacy.

Perhaps. But Delta announces new TATL service and 9 months later it happens.

You have to consider availability of aircraft. We are probably 18 months away from their launch date. They have a major delivery delay in A321NEO this year and next year. Even if they had made the LR decision in Q1 2018, they likely would've had to wait until Q4 of 2020 before they can start flying to Europe.

But they have a very aggressive TATL plan once it starts. They are going to take delivery of 26 A321LR/XLR with probably more than half of that going to BOS (probably 15 flights?). These will have a premium layout and still very low cost of operation compared to anything else in the market. I also wouldn't be surprised to see A220s fly to places like SNN, BFL or GLA down the road. By 2025, those TCON premium fares will be everywhere in TATL market also. The days of BA and DL charging ridiculous J or one-way Y fares to LHR will be over. It will make life very hard for existing operators. I would be shocked to see DY sticking around for example. if B6 doesn't go under or get taken over in the next few years, I think it will end up with a huge TATL hub out of BOS (probably close to AA @ PHL in # of departures)

So you would say B6 TATL service will happen by Q4 2020 with 90+% confidence? Or will they weasel out and make excuses why it won't happen until ...2030?

Delta can add transatlantic quickly because they are already doing it. Jetblue has to go slowly because all the infrastructure isn't in place yet.

Very simple things (and much more complex things) all have to be resolved. From as big as who's going to ground handle the flights, to as simple as who's going to transport the crew to/from the hotel.

Opening a new small outstation on a new continent is worlds apart from adding one, because usually you can have parent outstations. A bigger, more established station with more staff who can oversee a smaller station. When DL opens a new European station, they take staff from LHR, CDG, AMS to oversee the opening, and most likely promote managers from those others to stay at the new one.

JetBlue doesn't have that benefit. Everything is coming from the US.

And I realize how many LCCs add destinations non-stop, but usually they have no staff, and the crew is on their own. This translates very nicely into terrible service. Not necessarily in ways that a passenger might notice, but overall. And from experience in just BOS, I can tell you that the list of airlines that ran BOS with no staff and the list of Carriers that left BOS under poor circumstances is pretty much the same

Dieuwer wrote:

tphuang wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

Perhaps. But Delta announces new TATL service and 9 months later it happens.

You have to consider availability of aircraft. We are probably 18 months away from their launch date. They have a major delivery delay in A321NEO this year and next year. Even if they had made the LR decision in Q1 2018, they likely would've had to wait until Q4 of 2020 before they can start flying to Europe.

But they have a very aggressive TATL plan once it starts. They are going to take delivery of 26 A321LR/XLR with probably more than half of that going to BOS (probably 15 flights?). These will have a premium layout and still very low cost of operation compared to anything else in the market. I also wouldn't be surprised to see A220s fly to places like SNN, BFL or GLA down the road. By 2025, those TCON premium fares will be everywhere in TATL market also. The days of BA and DL charging ridiculous J or one-way Y fares to LHR will be over. It will make life very hard for existing operators. I would be shocked to see DY sticking around for example. if B6 doesn't go under or get taken over in the next few years, I think it will end up with a huge TATL hub out of BOS (probably close to AA @ PHL in # of departures)

So you would say B6 TATL service will happen by Q4 2020 with 90+% confidence? Or will they weasel out and make excuses why it won't happen until ...2030?

No, i'm saying that due to the A321NEO delays, it was never possible for them to launch it before Q4 2020. Seems like Q1 2021 is the most likely time. I guess Q2 is possible also.

This discussion is completely silly but I'll join

VS4ever wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

Bluewho wrote:

Now why would B6 want to fly transatlantic......hmmmm

Sure. "Someday...".
Remember how quickly JetBlue added TCON Mint after announcing it? While Europe has been bandied about for YEARS and we are still waiting.

The decision making needed for TCON vs TATL is a hell of a lot different. I am not saying that B6 haven't taken forever to do it, They have, but the decision to add Mint to TCON, is an awful lot easier to implement than a TATL decision. As I said, i think we all agree B6 have taken for ever for a variety of reasons, but to say that TATL could be implemented at the same speed without the infrastructure that already exists to complete transcons is simply a fallacy.

And it still took them 15 years to add Mint

Dieuwer wrote:

Perhaps. But Delta announces new TATL service and 9 months later it happens.

DL is an established global carrier about 20x larger than B6.

Who is going to eat their hat if JetBlue TATL service DOES NOT happen by Q2 2021?

Dieuwer wrote:

VS4ever wrote:

Dieuwer wrote:

Sure. "Someday...".
Remember how quickly JetBlue added TCON Mint after announcing it? While Europe has been bandied about for YEARS and we are still waiting.

The decision making needed for TCON vs TATL is a hell of a lot different. I am not saying that B6 haven't taken forever to do it, They have, but the decision to add Mint to TCON, is an awful lot easier to implement than a TATL decision. As I said, i think we all agree B6 have taken for ever for a variety of reasons, but to say that TATL could be implemented at the same speed without the infrastructure that already exists to complete transcons is simply a fallacy.

Perhaps. But Delta announces new TATL service and 9 months later it happens.

That’s not even a fair comparison. You know that right?

It’s like a kid out of college saying I am going to buy a new home compared with is parents who are buying a 2nd vacation home.

You were just complaining about ticket prices so you should want this to happen.


I honestly don’t understand why there is a need on airliners to make everything an apples to apples comparison to Delta. JetBlue isn’t Delta they aren’t even close so no they can’t snap their finger and make transatlantic happen. Shocking I know.