airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 3:50 pm

FGITD wrote:
Perhaps AA took it with them, or Southwest simply didn't want it anymore. Can't really fault them for not wanting to have a minor memorial to a tragedy that didn't involve them at one of their gates, but still...seems a shame to not have it marked anymore.

Didn't even know such a thing existed and to be honest it doesn't bother me since there is a real 9/11 memorial that is open to the public. I doubt 99.9% of Logan passengers even knew about it. In fact I wouldn't be shocked if only a few passengers even know about the real memorial. When you think about it, for people under the age of 25 or so, 9/11 is just a paragraph in a school book.

P.S. I did a google search and found this article. Is the flag above C19 still there?
https://www.wbur.org/morningedition/201 ... n-memorial

VS4ever wrote:
Some things should transcend different airline using a gate, this one is definitely one of those things. WN should see right and put the flag back up, 9/11 or not, “never forget” has been a motto about that fateful day for a reason.

True but you know that motto is not realistic. How often do we remember Pearl Harbor?

On a different topic, I drove past terminal A yesterday and all the Delta tails were quite a sight. It does look like a real Delta hub now :)
 
georgiabill
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 4:02 pm

Any info on how AT is doing out of BOS? Any flight reports?

With TK switching to 789 on the IST-BOS-IST route next year how have they been doing this summer season from BOS?

Any chance of LP trying LIM-BOS-LIM in the future?
 
wnflyguy
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 4:11 pm

Anyone have Pictures of WN new gates at BOS?
Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
aaflyer777
Posts: 250
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 5:13 pm

Flew BOS-BWI on WN yesterday, a few observations about terminal B:

WN gate area is very crowded, I'd hate to see what that looks like when all five of their gates are in use

NK has 35A, not sure if this is temporary due to B38 being out of service or if its permanent. NK definitely needs 2 gates so question is who gets B38/B35A when construction is done?

B29 is in the process of being removed, UA only used it for their RJ flights to CLE so makes sense to get rid of it. B29 area is now being used by Boutique

UA has B23-B28, 30, 31, and 36
WN has B31A, 32, 33, 34, 35
NK has B35A, 37
AA has the rest excluding the 3 AC gates
 
jworks158
Posts: 325
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:15 pm

rnav2dlrey wrote:
FGITD wrote:
Noticed something today while driving across the field.

Seems since southwest moved into B, the flag over B32 (the gate AA11 left from) is no longer there.

Perhaps AA took it with them, or Southwest simply didn't want it anymore. Can't really fault them for not wanting to have a minor memorial to a tragedy that didn't involve them at one of their gates, but still...seems a shame to not have it marked anymore.


good catch. i’ll give WN until this wednesday (the anniversary) to put the flag back up before i start my one-man twitter crusade for them to put it back.


Let me know if you need support with this, I feel the same way.
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
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N717TW
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 8:43 pm

rnav2dlrey wrote:
FGITD wrote:
Noticed something today while driving across the field.

Seems since southwest moved into B, the flag over B32 (the gate AA11 left from) is no longer there.

Perhaps AA took it with them, or Southwest simply didn't want it anymore. Can't really fault them for not wanting to have a minor memorial to a tragedy that didn't involve them at one of their gates, but still...seems a shame to not have it marked anymore.


good catch. i’ll give WN until this wednesday (the anniversary) to put the flag back up before i start my one-man twitter crusade for them to put it back.


I agree this should still be up there, but one quick point and one question:

Point: Massport redid the original AA concourse/pier to add two more gates. So B32 isn't actually the same gate....technicality but I point that out

Question: Does JetBlue still have the flag on C18? (I think that's the gate where UA175 left from). For some reason I think the flag moved over with UA is now on one of their new gates.
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 10:50 pm

N717TW wrote:
rnav2dlrey wrote:
FGITD wrote:
Noticed something today while driving across the field.

Seems since southwest moved into B, the flag over B32 (the gate AA11 left from) is no longer there.

Perhaps AA took it with them, or Southwest simply didn't want it anymore. Can't really fault them for not wanting to have a minor memorial to a tragedy that didn't involve them at one of their gates, but still...seems a shame to not have it marked anymore.


good catch. i’ll give WN until this wednesday (the anniversary) to put the flag back up before i start my one-man twitter crusade for them to put it back.


I agree this should still be up there, but one quick point and one question:

Point: Massport redid the original AA concourse/pier to add two more gates. So B32 isn't actually the same gate....technicality but I point that out

Question: Does JetBlue still have the flag on C18? (I think that's the gate where UA175 left from). For some reason I think the flag moved over with UA is now on one of their new gates.


I do believe they do.
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
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AviationAddict
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:06 pm

VS4ever wrote:
rnav2dlrey wrote:
FGITD wrote:
Noticed something today while driving across the field.

Seems since southwest moved into B, the flag over B32 (the gate AA11 left from) is no longer there.

Perhaps AA took it with them, or Southwest simply didn't want it anymore. Can't really fault them for not wanting to have a minor memorial to a tragedy that didn't involve them at one of their gates, but still...seems a shame to not have it marked anymore.


good catch. i’ll give WN until this wednesday (the anniversary) to put the flag back up before i start my one-man twitter crusade for them to put it back.


Some things should transcend different airline using a gate, this one is definitely one of those things. WN should see right and put the flag back up, 9/11 or not, “never forget” has been a motto about that fateful day for a reason.


The flags have traditionally moved with the airlines. The one that used to be at terminal C with UA is now at terminal B.
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:14 pm

From the OAG thread
it seems WS has dropped 1 daily to YYZ
WS BOS-YYZ OCT 3>2[3] NOV 3>1.9[3] DEC 3>2[3] JAN 3>2.0[3] FEB 3>2[3] MAR 3>2[3] APR 3>2[3]
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
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UkiAir
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:16 pm

Its at C19, and no, I don't believe its there all the time. But its definitely there on 9/11, and a lot of employees, especially from United stop by every year to pay respect.
 
FGITD
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Sep 08, 2019 11:29 pm

Come to think of it, I do remember a colleague once pointing out there are more flags on jetbridges than flights that departed that morning. I never paid particular attention.

I'll have to take a closer look, but it's actually very possible that JetBlue kept a flag up, United brought one to B, and AA had one.

Also a good point regarding gate renumbering. Heck, just look at E. 8A/B is now 11/12, 4 is 6, etc etc.
 
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N717TW
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 09, 2019 2:39 am

jworks158 wrote:
N717TW wrote:
rnav2dlrey wrote:

good catch. i’ll give WN until this wednesday (the anniversary) to put the flag back up before i start my one-man twitter crusade for them to put it back.


I agree this should still be up there, but one quick point and one question:

Point: Massport redid the original AA concourse/pier to add two more gates. So B32 isn't actually the same gate....technicality but I point that out

Question: Does JetBlue still have the flag on C18? (I think that's the gate where UA175 left from). For some reason I think the flag moved over with UA is now on one of their new gates.


I do believe they do.


In that case, Southwest should put the flag back up and they should should be publicly shamed if they don't.
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:01 am

AA has a flag flying above B7 I believe. It’s the gate at the end of their original B pier. Perhaps they took it and placed it there as WN was about to start ops?
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:06 am

georgiabill wrote:
Any info on how AT is doing out of BOS? Any flight reports?

With TK switching to 789 on the IST-BOS-IST route next year how have they been doing this summer season from BOS?

Any chance of LP trying LIM-BOS-LIM in the future?


Not sure about AT, but would curious myself how they’re doing.

For anyone flying J on TK’s new 789 it’s a huge upgrade in the product. Back in Y it’ll be a downgrade. TK is definitely going after the premium market in BOS and this will help. Probably tough to compete with QR’s Qsuites.
 
jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:40 pm

N717TW wrote:
jworks158 wrote:
N717TW wrote:

I agree this should still be up there, but one quick point and one question:

Point: Massport redid the original AA concourse/pier to add two more gates. So B32 isn't actually the same gate....technicality but I point that out

Question: Does JetBlue still have the flag on C18? (I think that's the gate where UA175 left from). For some reason I think the flag moved over with UA is now on one of their new gates.


I do believe they do.


In that case, Southwest should put the flag back up and they should should be publicly shamed if they don't.


I have heard from two individuals on the Facebook Aviation Photography Boston group, that "all of the old AA jet bridges were removed, so they haven't installed a new flag pole yet." another individual said "A new flag pole is going to be put up at B32. I haven't heard a date yet"
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
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jworks158
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 09, 2019 8:56 pm

Scandinavian posted this reply to someone about the CPH-BOS route today
https://twitter.com/SAS/status/1170291913070657538?s=20

"@ChocOhYeah There is a break in season for BOS-CPH beetween 22 NOV-29 Mar"

from this it seems like the route will be back next year.
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Sep 09, 2019 9:04 pm

jworks158 wrote:
Scandinavian posted this reply to someone about the CPH-BOS route today
https://twitter.com/SAS/status/1170291913070657538?s=20

"@ChocOhYeah There is a break in season for BOS-CPH beetween 22 NOV-29 Mar"

from this it seems like the route will be back next year.


Let me take a copy of this, so I can post it in 3 weeks time when airlineroute finally catches up with it.

In reality, I am not surprised, they must have decent business traffic keeping it going in the summary, because it's not setting the world on fire with its loads. But glad it will be back (fingers crossed) in 2020.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Sep 10, 2019 12:48 am

I recently flew Norwegian LGW-BOS for the first time in PE and I was pretty impressed actually. Paid $600 one-way. Plane looked brand new and vacuum cleaned. Seat was good and service friendly. Cardboard boxed lunch/dinner was good. Selection of wines decent. The major drawback for me however was the silly late departure from LGW: 5 PM. Don't like that. I prefer a late morning departure so I still have time to do stuff on arrival in BOS.
Also, hanging at LGW for several hours is kinda boring, although I brought my laptop to do work (while sitting in a restaurant with a stream of beer headed my way).
I would fly them AMS-BOS if it becomes available as that would be just a return from a family visit and I wouldn't care too much arriving at whatever time in BOS.
 
FGITD
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Sep 10, 2019 1:51 am

Norwegian starting AMS would certainly be interesting. Though I think DL and KL would do everything in their power to stomp them out. I've heard some interesting rumors about AF KL and DL lately. Big plans for the future, I think.

But for now everyone is starting to scale down, go a little dormant for autumn.
 
jsteeves3
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:01 pm

FGITD wrote:
Norwegian starting AMS would certainly be interesting. Though I think DL and KL would do everything in their power to stomp them out. I've heard some interesting rumors about AF KL and DL lately. Big plans for the future, I think.

But for now everyone is starting to scale down, go a little dormant for autumn.


What rumors? :o
 
ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:15 pm

Do most people believe that AMS is adequately served by the DL/KLM mix already in place or can the market take more? In other words, could KL go daily in 2020?
Next Trip >> BOS-NRT-BOS on JAL 787-9
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:17 pm

jsteeves3 wrote:
FGITD wrote:
Norwegian starting AMS would certainly be interesting. Though I think DL and KL would do everything in their power to stomp them out. I've heard some interesting rumors about AF KL and DL lately. Big plans for the future, I think.

But for now everyone is starting to scale down, go a little dormant for autumn.


What rumors? :o


I could see them handing over 1 of the AMS flights to KLM in order to free up a peak time widebody gate at terminal A, which could be used to start another widebody route. BOS-MUC seems to be under-served and is begging for competition.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:53 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
Do most people believe that AMS is adequately served by the DL/KLM mix already in place or can the market take more? In other words, could KL go daily in 2020?


The market could probably take more, Terminal E until the expansion is done, not so much. all I know is that, I am flying to AMS next week on DL, paid about $1,400 Y+ back in April each for a ticket, for sh**s and giggles last week (before 14 days were up) i took a look at D1 pricing and got quoted 11K a ticket, Sadly way out of range of my mid-level management job. AMS has always done reasonably well for DL, adding KL was a smart move and i can certainly see them going daily if there is the space in E to do it. Frankly I would love to see DY and/or B6 give AMS a go, to try and bring the prices down a bit, but doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Sep 10, 2019 7:57 pm

VS4ever wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
Do most people believe that AMS is adequately served by the DL/KLM mix already in place or can the market take more? In other words, could KL go daily in 2020?


The market could probably take more, Terminal E until the expansion is done, not so much. all I know is that, I am flying to AMS next week on DL, paid about $1,400 Y+ back in April each for a ticket, for sh**s and giggles last week (before 14 days were up) i took a look at D1 pricing and got quoted 11K a ticket, Sadly way out of range of my mid-level management job. AMS has always done reasonably well for DL, adding KL was a smart move and i can certainly see them going daily if there is the space in E to do it. Frankly I would love to see DY and/or B6 give AMS a go, to try and bring the prices down a bit, but doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.


When AB was still around, I used to fly BOS-DUS. That was a reasonable alternative to AMS, depending on where you need to be in The Netherlands.
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:21 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
Do most people believe that AMS is adequately served by the DL/KLM mix already in place or can the market take more? In other words, could KL go daily in 2020?


The market could probably take more, Terminal E until the expansion is done, not so much. all I know is that, I am flying to AMS next week on DL, paid about $1,400 Y+ back in April each for a ticket, for sh**s and giggles last week (before 14 days were up) i took a look at D1 pricing and got quoted 11K a ticket, Sadly way out of range of my mid-level management job. AMS has always done reasonably well for DL, adding KL was a smart move and i can certainly see them going daily if there is the space in E to do it. Frankly I would love to see DY and/or B6 give AMS a go, to try and bring the prices down a bit, but doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.


When AB was still around, I used to fly BOS-DUS. That was a reasonable alternative to AMS, depending on where you need to be in The Netherlands.


Alas, I don't need to be in the Netherlands, I need to be in the UK, but bouncing via AMS is preferable for my circumstances vs LHR or LGW, but those D1 tickets are huuuuggeely expensive.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:46 am

DI cutting BOS-LGW to 5 weekly for dead of winter Jan 10 - Feb 12. Mon/Wed is cut.

Trying to squeeze out any losses I guess.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-10sep19/
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
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VS4ever
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:09 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
DI cutting BOS-LGW to 5 weekly for dead of winter Jan 10 - Feb 12. Mon/Wed is cut.

Trying to squeeze out any losses I guess.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-10sep19/


As a certain grocery store in the UK say “Every little helps” and it’s only a month.
That feeling when you sit at the end of a runway, brakes are released and the raw power takes over. Now that is a thing of beauty and it never gets old.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:23 pm

VS4ever wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
Do most people believe that AMS is adequately served by the DL/KLM mix already in place or can the market take more? In other words, could KL go daily in 2020?


The market could probably take more, Terminal E until the expansion is done, not so much. all I know is that, I am flying to AMS next week on DL, paid about $1,400 Y+ back in April each for a ticket, for sh**s and giggles last week (before 14 days were up) i took a look at D1 pricing and got quoted 11K a ticket, Sadly way out of range of my mid-level management job. AMS has always done reasonably well for DL, adding KL was a smart move and i can certainly see them going daily if there is the space in E to do it. Frankly I would love to see DY and/or B6 give AMS a go, to try and bring the prices down a bit, but doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.


AMS works well for DL/KL because it's a huge hub. I don't think the O&D is that large from BOS but I could be wrong, so for that I don't think DY would start it with a 787 especially under the current financial situation. For B6 with an A321 and BOS connections it would work but judging by other threads it seems that if B6 wants to serve the Netherlands they would have to chose another airport. Rotterdam is only 45 miles from central Amsterdam and it could be an option.
 
tphuang
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 12:43 pm

airbazar wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
Do most people believe that AMS is adequately served by the DL/KLM mix already in place or can the market take more? In other words, could KL go daily in 2020?


The market could probably take more, Terminal E until the expansion is done, not so much. all I know is that, I am flying to AMS next week on DL, paid about $1,400 Y+ back in April each for a ticket, for sh**s and giggles last week (before 14 days were up) i took a look at D1 pricing and got quoted 11K a ticket, Sadly way out of range of my mid-level management job. AMS has always done reasonably well for DL, adding KL was a smart move and i can certainly see them going daily if there is the space in E to do it. Frankly I would love to see DY and/or B6 give AMS a go, to try and bring the prices down a bit, but doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.


AMS works well for DL/KL because it's a huge hub. I don't think the O&D is that large from BOS but I could be wrong, so for that I don't think DY would start it with a 787 especially under the current financial situation. For B6 with an A321 and BOS connections it would work but judging by other threads it seems that if B6 wants to serve the Netherlands they would have to chose another airport. Rotterdam is only 45 miles from central Amsterdam and it could be an option.

They put AMS on the map of places A321LR could reach. I think that's a pretty clear sign they intend to serve it.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:10 pm

airbazar wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
Do most people believe that AMS is adequately served by the DL/KLM mix already in place or can the market take more? In other words, could KL go daily in 2020?


The market could probably take more, Terminal E until the expansion is done, not so much. all I know is that, I am flying to AMS next week on DL, paid about $1,400 Y+ back in April each for a ticket, for sh**s and giggles last week (before 14 days were up) i took a look at D1 pricing and got quoted 11K a ticket, Sadly way out of range of my mid-level management job. AMS has always done reasonably well for DL, adding KL was a smart move and i can certainly see them going daily if there is the space in E to do it. Frankly I would love to see DY and/or B6 give AMS a go, to try and bring the prices down a bit, but doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.


AMS works well for DL/KL because it's a huge hub. I don't think the O&D is that large from BOS but I could be wrong, so for that I don't think DY would start it with a 787 especially under the current financial situation. For B6 with an A321 and BOS connections it would work but judging by other threads it seems that if B6 wants to serve the Netherlands they would have to chose another airport. Rotterdam is only 45 miles from central Amsterdam and it could be an option.


BOS-AMS was 152 PDEW in 2018 per the Swiss study in this thread. Number 6 behind LON/CDG/DUB/KEF and FCO. Top four are over 250 PDEW and then it drops off with FCO so its second tier in Europe O+D. Its probably a bit higher in 2018 due to the KL addition but not everyone takes the non-stop. When there's an increase in AMS capacity its usually aimed at increasing market share to Europe and other logical connecting destinations (Africa, ME, South Asia).

I think B6 could easily fill an LR with US feed alone.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
Dieuwer
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:40 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
VS4ever wrote:

The market could probably take more, Terminal E until the expansion is done, not so much. all I know is that, I am flying to AMS next week on DL, paid about $1,400 Y+ back in April each for a ticket, for sh**s and giggles last week (before 14 days were up) i took a look at D1 pricing and got quoted 11K a ticket, Sadly way out of range of my mid-level management job. AMS has always done reasonably well for DL, adding KL was a smart move and i can certainly see them going daily if there is the space in E to do it. Frankly I would love to see DY and/or B6 give AMS a go, to try and bring the prices down a bit, but doesn't look like it's going to happen any time soon.


AMS works well for DL/KL because it's a huge hub. I don't think the O&D is that large from BOS but I could be wrong, so for that I don't think DY would start it with a 787 especially under the current financial situation. For B6 with an A321 and BOS connections it would work but judging by other threads it seems that if B6 wants to serve the Netherlands they would have to chose another airport. Rotterdam is only 45 miles from central Amsterdam and it could be an option.


BOS-AMS was 152 PDEW in 2018 per the Swiss study in this thread. Number 6 behind LON/CDG/DUB/KEF and FCO. Top four are over 250 PDEW and then it drops off with FCO so its second tier in Europe O+D. Its probably a bit higher in 2018 due to the KL addition but not everyone takes the non-stop. When there's an increase in AMS capacity its usually aimed at increasing market share to Europe and other logical connecting destinations (Africa, ME, South Asia).

I think B6 could easily fill an LR with US feed alone.


I assume KEF is an aberration. Courtesy of the unsustainable ultra-low airfares WOW was charging. In fact, an article in Skift mentions that the Icelandic economy is now facing a slump. I guess people like to visit when you charge close to nothing. But the moment you charge $1 too many, the low cost crowd no longer is interested.

https://skift.com/2019/09/11/the-rise-a ... m-miracle/
 
airbazar
Posts: 9614
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:44 pm

tphuang wrote:
They put AMS on the map of places A321LR could reach. I think that's a pretty clear sign they intend to serve it.

Right, of course they want it. But AMS doesn't want B6 and since AMS has no slots, and AMS slots cannot be commercialized like at LHR it will be harder getting into AMS than it will be getting into LHR. At least that's the story going around.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:45 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
airbazar wrote:

AMS works well for DL/KL because it's a huge hub. I don't think the O&D is that large from BOS but I could be wrong, so for that I don't think DY would start it with a 787 especially under the current financial situation. For B6 with an A321 and BOS connections it would work but judging by other threads it seems that if B6 wants to serve the Netherlands they would have to chose another airport. Rotterdam is only 45 miles from central Amsterdam and it could be an option.


BOS-AMS was 152 PDEW in 2018 per the Swiss study in this thread. Number 6 behind LON/CDG/DUB/KEF and FCO. Top four are over 250 PDEW and then it drops off with FCO so its second tier in Europe O+D. Its probably a bit higher in 2018 due to the KL addition but not everyone takes the non-stop. When there's an increase in AMS capacity its usually aimed at increasing market share to Europe and other logical connecting destinations (Africa, ME, South Asia).

I think B6 could easily fill an LR with US feed alone.


I assume KEF is an aberration. Courtesy of the unsustainable ultra-low airfares WOW was charging. In fact, an article in Skift mentions that the Icelandic economy is now facing a slump. I guess people like to visit when you charge close to nothing. But the moment you charge $1 too many, the low cost crowd no longer is interested.

https://skift.com/2019/09/11/the-rise-a ... m-miracle/


Agreed (there were people flying cheapest fare to BOS just to get on WW) but there's another possible factor and that involves FI: The iceland stopover.

A person may fly BOS-KEF-AMS then do AMS-KEF with two days in Iceland and then KEF-BOS.

Does that count for 1 pax AMS and 1 pax KEF or does MIDT count it as 2 for AMS?
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
iyerhari
Posts: 947
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:24 pm

airbazar wrote:
tphuang wrote:
They put AMS on the map of places A321LR could reach. I think that's a pretty clear sign they intend to serve it.

Right, of course they want it. But AMS doesn't want B6 and since AMS has no slots, and AMS slots cannot be commercialized like at LHR it will be harder getting into AMS than it will be getting into LHR. At least that's the story going around.

I did not know AMS was slot controlled - knew that LHR is slot controlled. Curious question - are most of the large European airports slot controlled? I am referring to types like CDG, FRA etc.?
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:26 pm

iyerhari wrote:
airbazar wrote:
tphuang wrote:
They put AMS on the map of places A321LR could reach. I think that's a pretty clear sign they intend to serve it.

Right, of course they want it. But AMS doesn't want B6 and since AMS has no slots, and AMS slots cannot be commercialized like at LHR it will be harder getting into AMS than it will be getting into LHR. At least that's the story going around.

I did not know AMS was slot controlled - knew that LHR is slot controlled. Curious question - are most of the large European airports slot controlled? I am referring to types like CDG, FRA etc.?

Technically I don't think airports have slots however they do have a limit on hourly or annual movements.
AMS is supposedly the hardest airport in Europe to get into because it has a hard cap on movements (not actual slots). At LHR at least if you put up enough money you will find a seller :) Such a system doesn't exist at AMS.
https://www.schiphol.nl/en/cargo/page/s ... explained/
https://simpleflying.com/jetblue-is-try ... n-flights/
 
snaiks
Posts: 206
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:00 am

Hey guys do u know why/when is LH downgrading their 748 to 744? I wanted to fly their 748 but looks like it will be a 744

Thanks in advance
 
RobertS975
Posts: 918
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 2:17 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:47 am

adamh8297 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
VS4ever wrote:


BOS-AMS was 152 PDEW in 2018 per the Swiss study in this thread. Number 6 behind LON/CDG/DUB/KEF and FCO. Top four are over 250 PDEW and then it drops off with FCO so its second tier in Europe O+D. Its probably a bit higher in 2018 due to the KL addition but not everyone takes the non-stop. When there's an increase in AMS capacity its usually aimed at increasing market share to Europe and other logical connecting destinations (Africa, ME, South Asia).

I think B6 could easily fill an LR with US feed alone.


B6 would get killed BOS-AMS for the following reason.... much of the DL/KL traffic stopping at AMS goes on from there to visit other cities in Europe from AMS, then returns to the US with a connection in AMS. Still hard to split unaffiliated carriers on European flights without having to pay astronomical one way fares.
 
ChrisNH38
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:53 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:56 am

It appears as though CX is standing firm at BOS in the face of cuts elsewhere. Of note, both JFK and IAD are seeing draw-downs while BOS stands pat through the winter.
Next Trip >> BOS-NRT-BOS on JAL 787-9
 
ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:05 am

snaiks wrote:
Hey guys do u know why/when is LH downgrading their 748 to 744? I wanted to fly their 748 but looks like it will be a 744

Thanks in advance


The -400 comes back in late October, heralding the ‘end’ of summer for airlines. The second Daily goes away, too. Same with BA and their A380.
Next Trip >> BOS-NRT-BOS on JAL 787-9
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 1:10 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
It appears as though CX is standing firm at BOS in the face of cuts elsewhere. Of note, both JFK and IAD are seeing draw-downs while BOS stands pat through the winter.


As of now.... you give me the option of connecting through ICN vs HKG - I'm taking HKG with the current mood in Hong Kong. My vacation could have been ruined if I went to SE Asia later in 2019.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
clrd4t8koff
Posts: 1455
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 2:14 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
It appears as though CX is standing firm at BOS in the face of cuts elsewhere. Of note, both JFK and IAD are seeing draw-downs while BOS stands pat through the winter.


JFK isn't really impacted that much. While they're cutting the daily JFK-YVR-HKG flight they're adding an additional 4x weekly A350 non-stop on top of the 3x daily they already have. They also have a daily to EWR.

IAD on the other hand is getting drawn-down. After dropping from the A350-1000 to the A350-900 they're also now dropping from daily to 4x weekly.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:00 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
It appears as though CX is standing firm at BOS in the face of cuts elsewhere. Of note, both JFK and IAD are seeing draw-downs while BOS stands pat through the winter.


As of now.... you give me the option of connecting through ICN vs HKG - I'm taking HKG with the current mood in Hong Kong. My vacation could have been ruined if I went to SE Asia later in 2019.


I meant I'm taking ICN not HKG!!!! Bad typo that I can no longer edit.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN

2019: CX BOS-HKG, WE HKG-HKT, CA HKT-PEK-EWR, B6 EWR-BOS
 
jworks158
Posts: 325
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:32 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
snaiks wrote:
Hey guys do u know why/when is LH downgrading their 748 to 744? I wanted to fly their 748 but looks like it will be a 744

Thanks in advance


The -400 comes back in late October, heralding the ‘end’ of summer for airlines. The second Daily goes away, too. Same with BA and their A380.


Also keep in mind that the 744 has more seats then the 748.
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie
 
dtremit
Posts: 67
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:11 pm

RobertS975 wrote:
B6 would get killed BOS-AMS for the following reason.... much of the DL/KL traffic stopping at AMS goes on from there to visit other cities in Europe from AMS, then returns to the US with a connection in AMS. Still hard to split unaffiliated carriers on European flights without having to pay astronomical one way fares.


B6 can connect passengers in BOS, just as they do for carriers like EK today. They certainly don't have the same network reach as DL/KL, but they're also not trying to fill nearly as many seats (presumably ~160 a day versus ~750 a day for DL/KL).
 
FGITD
Posts: 446
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:44 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:34 pm

Valid points about JetBlue, but also worth noting that JetBlue may be able to attract good numbers of connecting passengers in Boston, but KL/DL can get them on both ends. And it's not as if DL's connecting options out of Boston are some minor operation, and of course AMS is....well, AMS.
 
ChrisNH38
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:53 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 13, 2019 2:24 am

I’m not here to validate this thesis, but FORBES is asking whether AA let Boston ‘Get away from them.’

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tedreed/20 ... ton-logan/
Next Trip >> BOS-NRT-BOS on JAL 787-9
 
VS11
Posts: 1447
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2001 6:34 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:14 am

ChrisNH38 wrote:
I’m not here to validate this thesis, but FORBES is asking whether AA let Boston ‘Get away from them.’

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tedreed/20 ... ton-logan/


Surprisingly good article. And the answer to the rhetorical title is: No, AA did not (miss a chance at Boston Logan). People like to whine about AA and Parker but reality is that nationally people are moving south - particularly Dallas and Charlotte and that’s where the beef is and will continue to be.

More Americans Are Moving West and South
https://www.voanews.com/usa/all-about-a ... -and-south
 
ChrisNH38
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Sep 06, 2019 10:53 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:32 am

The telling thing is that the sum of the AA+US parts shrank in Boston once they got together. Like, 2+1=0.75.
Next Trip >> BOS-NRT-BOS on JAL 787-9
 
airbazar
Posts: 9614
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:54 am

VS11 wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
I’m not here to validate this thesis, but FORBES is asking whether AA let Boston ‘Get away from them.’

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tedreed/20 ... ton-logan/


Surprisingly good article. And the answer to the rhetorical title is: No, AA did not (miss a chance at Boston Logan). People like to whine about AA and Parker but reality is that nationally people are moving south - particularly Dallas and Charlotte and that’s where the beef is and will continue to be.

More Americans Are Moving West and South
https://www.voanews.com/usa/all-about-a ... -and-south


But has has been said here on a.net so many times, population size means nothing.
If you look at air traffic growth over the years by total boardings, I don't really see a pattern that shows airports in the South and West are growing at a faster pace.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_t ... ted_States
 
iyerhari
Posts: 947
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:25 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Sep 13, 2019 1:33 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
The telling thing is that the sum of the AA+US parts shrank in Boston once they got together. Like, 2+1=0.75.

Isn't this the story of AA at JFK too? If you look at the passenger stats probably until 2000, AA was a market leader till such a time they gradually started ceding the market to B6 and then DL? I suppose AA wanted to focus on hubs where they have clear domination vs. fighting in a fragmented market like Logan i suppose.

VS11 wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
I’m not here to validate this thesis, but FORBES is asking whether AA let Boston ‘Get away from them.’

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tedreed/20 ... ton-logan/


Surprisingly good article. And the answer to the rhetorical title is: No, AA did not (miss a chance at Boston Logan). People like to whine about AA and Parker but reality is that nationally people are moving south - particularly Dallas and Charlotte and that’s where the beef is and will continue to be.

More Americans Are Moving West and South
https://www.voanews.com/usa/all-about-a ... -and-south


By that standards, all international carriers should be flocking to CLT, etc. and BOS should be having retrenchments.

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