ChasChandler
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Jul 22, 2019 9:31 pm

Here's great link I pulled from the Cleveland thread. It's from the FAA and shows 2018 YTD passenger counts for all of the airports and also 2018 YTD cargo tonnage from airports. They also compare 2018 to 2017. CMH comes in the 50th busiest airport in the country while LCK is 26th for cargo.

http://www.faa.gov/airports/planning_ca ... passenger/
 
Fargo
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:06 pm

I’ll ask again as it seemed to get overlooked the last few times I’ve asked.

What is happening with the CVG master plan? Nothing has come out on it in quite a while, the website is very out of date and it says the last of the plan was suppose to be done in “Q2 2019”.

Is there a snag?
 
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AirportRival
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Jul 23, 2019 2:56 am

Fargo wrote:
I’ll ask again as it seemed to get overlooked the last few times I’ve asked.

What is happening with the CVG master plan? Nothing has come out on it in quite a while, the website is very out of date and it says the last of the plan was suppose to be done in “Q2 2019”.

Is there a snag?


I'd say you haven't received a response because it's not likely that anyone on here has any insider info to share. I know I haven't heard anything but I just recently started working at the airport again.
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Cvgspotter15
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Jul 23, 2019 7:06 pm

AA is starting daily seasonal service to PHX from CVG on an A319 running December 18- April 6! Super excited about this one!!
 
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Cvgspotter15
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Jul 23, 2019 7:13 pm

Cvgspotter15 wrote:
AA is starting daily seasonal service to PHX from CVG on an A319 running December 18- April 6! Super excited about this one!!


Link: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cincin ... 1805046001
 
jplatts
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Wed Jul 24, 2019 3:11 am

Cvgspotter15 wrote:
Cvgspotter15 wrote:
AA is starting daily seasonal service to PHX from CVG on an A319 running December 18- April 6! Super excited about this one!!


Link: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cincin ... 1805046001


The load factors on WN CVG-PHX seasonal nonstop service in March and April 2019 was 89.83% (Source: DOT T-100 Domestic Segment).

There is probably enough demand for WN to extend CVG-PHX to year-round once 737 MAX is back in service since there are some WN FF's in the Greater Phoenix market who prefer to fly on WN over other airlines with WN having nonstop service out of PHX to destinations that AA, DL, UA, or F9 don't serve nonstop from PHX.
 
flyguy89
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Wed Jul 24, 2019 6:02 am

Cvgspotter15 wrote:
Cvgspotter15 wrote:
AA is starting daily seasonal service to PHX from CVG on an A319 running December 18- April 6! Super excited about this one!!


Link: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cincin ... 1805046001

Wow, looks like I didn't have to wait long! Seasonal is a good start, hopefully they'll be able to expand to year-round eventually, or may run CVG-LAX in the peak spring/summer period.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Thu Jul 25, 2019 12:12 am

AS ran an A321 into CMH on both Saturday and today: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASA ... /KCMH/KSEA

Some sort of same-day upgauge tied to demand, maybe?
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
SkyVoice
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:27 am

Cvgspotter15 wrote:
Cvgspotter15 wrote:
AA is starting daily seasonal service to PHX from CVG on an A319 running December 18- April 6! Super excited about this one!!


Link: https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cincin ... 1805046001


Leave it to the Cincinnati Enquirer to print a pic of a 737 in "scissors eagle" livery to accompany a story about new service into CVG with an A319 that will be in "bad flag" livery.

Despite that, I, too, am excited about new mainline service coming to CVG! Thanks, AA! :bigthumbsup:
"Your talents may take you where your character can not keep you." - Terry Nelson
 
CMHtraveler
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Thu Jul 25, 2019 12:02 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
AS ran an A321 into CMH on both Saturday and today: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASA ... /KCMH/KSEA

Some sort of same-day upgauge tied to demand, maybe?


After posting a 97% LF for June, it wouldn’t be too surprising for them to be thinking about upguages, or even testing a second daily flight (at least for the summer months). I was worried about the sustainability of this route before launch. Not any more!
 
cledaybuck
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Thu Jul 25, 2019 12:24 pm

CMHtraveler wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
AS ran an A321 into CMH on both Saturday and today: https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASA ... /KCMH/KSEA

Some sort of same-day upgauge tied to demand, maybe?


After posting a 97% LF for June, it wouldn’t be too surprising for them to be thinking about upguages, or even testing a second daily flight (at least for the summer months). I was worried about the sustainability of this route before launch. Not any more!

It's a good start, but the winter months are going to be the real test.
As we celebrate mediocrity, all the boys upstairs want to see, how much you'll pay for what you used to get for free.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Jul 28, 2019 4:24 pm

I know there was talk that G4 was "cutting" flights to DAY, but the OAG thread last week showed DAY-PGD comes back in March. Not sure of the operating seasons of the other routes.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
jplatts
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Jul 28, 2019 5:47 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
I know there was talk that G4 was "cutting" flights to DAY, but the OAG thread last week showed DAY-PGD comes back in March. Not sure of the operating seasons of the other routes.


There is less demand for G4 service out of DAY than out of surrounding markets CVG, LCK, FWA, IND, LEX, SDF, or TOL. G4 also carried more passengers out of FWA and LEX than it did out of DAY, even though FWA and LEX are located in smaller markets (by population) than DAY.

Here is the number of passengers per year that G4 carried out of DAY and surrounding airports in 2018:
CVG - 1,078,546
IND - 530,432
LCK - 300,856
LEX - 246,839
SDF - 246,240
FWA - 166,384
TOL - 107,343
DAY - 98,965

While the proximity of DAY to CVG and the much bigger G4 presence at CVG are likely weakening demand for G4 service out of DAY, I am unsure why demand for G4 service out of DAY is much weaker than other nearby stations.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Jul 28, 2019 9:02 pm

jplatts wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
I know there was talk that G4 was "cutting" flights to DAY, but the OAG thread last week showed DAY-PGD comes back in March. Not sure of the operating seasons of the other routes.


There is less demand for G4 service out of DAY than out of surrounding markets CVG, LCK, FWA, IND, LEX, SDF, or TOL. G4 also carried more passengers out of FWA and LEX than it did out of DAY, even though FWA and LEX are located in smaller markets (by population) than DAY.

Here is the number of passengers per year that G4 carried out of DAY and surrounding airports in 2018:
CVG - 1,078,546
IND - 530,432
LCK - 300,856
LEX - 246,839
SDF - 246,240
FWA - 166,384
TOL - 107,343
DAY - 98,965

While the proximity of DAY to CVG and the much bigger G4 presence at CVG are likely weakening demand for G4 service out of DAY, I am unsure why demand for G4 service out of DAY is much weaker than other nearby stations.


Look at the number of destinations served from each of the above and you'll see the disparity (I know LCK has 12 and CVG has a pile as a focus city). Not saying DAY should be a huge G4 station but, if done right, it should be able to hold its own; if I'm flying G4 and the fare at DAY is slightly higher than CVG, but the convenience makes the premium worth it, I'm going out of DAY.

edit: On that note, DAY numbers in June: AA +1.6%, DL +2.3%, G4 -50.1%, UA +4%.

YTD for DAY: AA -1.6%, DL +1.9%, G4 -33.3%, UA +2.3%

http://www.flydayton.com/wp-content/upl ... 201906.pdf
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
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Harvestman
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Jul 29, 2019 6:41 am

jtwall wrote:
Not news, but just an observation on the ULCC market in Cincinnati. I’ve noticed both Southwest and especially Allegiant have been very present in the Cincinnati market with sponsorship, while Frontier has been noticeably absent. Southwest at Washington Park, Allegiant with FC Cincinnati and Fountain Square, among others I’m sure. Good to see their commitment to the market.

...and, interestingly, Ultimate Air Shuttle at US Bank Arena and Kentucky Speedway. Didn't think business was quite that good for them.

I just recently noticed that several DHL jets have been parked behind the main CVG fire station/post office buildings directly next to FedEx's ops for servicing. Anyone know whether this is connected to FEAM's recent expansion?
 
SkyVoice
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Wed Jul 31, 2019 6:15 am

While driving through pouring rain & lightning at CVG on Tuesday, July 30, I saw that FedEx had two aircraft standing on their ramp, which is located at the old DHL facility. I know that FedEx has flown one widebody Airbus A300 and/or an A310 between CVG & MEM each day for many years. So, when did FedEx expand their air freight service at CVG? Or, was one of those aircraft at CVG due to a weather diversion?
"Your talents may take you where your character can not keep you." - Terry Nelson
 
cledaybuck
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Wed Jul 31, 2019 12:26 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
I know there was talk that G4 was "cutting" flights to DAY, but the OAG thread last week showed DAY-PGD comes back in March. Not sure of the operating seasons of the other routes.

G4 is flying absolutely nothing after Labor Day until the middle of November when PGD comes back. PIE is flying now until Labor Day and then comes back in February. SFB also comes back in February.
As we celebrate mediocrity, all the boys upstairs want to see, how much you'll pay for what you used to get for free.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Wed Jul 31, 2019 10:35 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
I know there was talk that G4 was "cutting" flights to DAY, but the OAG thread last week showed DAY-PGD comes back in March. Not sure of the operating seasons of the other routes.

G4 is flying absolutely nothing after Labor Day until the middle of November when PGD comes back. PIE is flying now until Labor Day and then comes back in February. SFB also comes back in February.


That's one of those "Well, it could be worse, but it's not great" situations. How much does it cost G4 to have facilities (ticket counter, gate) sit empty for two months? It's been a long time since I've been past TSA at DAY, so I don't know what sort of signage they have at A26, but they've got a permanent counter space.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
cledaybuck
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Thu Aug 01, 2019 12:24 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
cledaybuck wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
I know there was talk that G4 was "cutting" flights to DAY, but the OAG thread last week showed DAY-PGD comes back in March. Not sure of the operating seasons of the other routes.

G4 is flying absolutely nothing after Labor Day until the middle of November when PGD comes back. PIE is flying now until Labor Day and then comes back in February. SFB also comes back in February.


That's one of those "Well, it could be worse, but it's not great" situations. How much does it cost G4 to have facilities (ticket counter, gate) sit empty for two months? It's been a long time since I've been past TSA at DAY, so I don't know what sort of signage they have at A26, but they've got a permanent counter space.

I don't know, but it can't be that much. Gate space isn't exactly at a premium.
As we celebrate mediocrity, all the boys upstairs want to see, how much you'll pay for what you used to get for free.
 
atbPy
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Fri Aug 02, 2019 12:38 am

I took the SFO-CMH redeye last week and it was pretty full - probably only about 10-12 empty seats on the A320. It was nice to be able to not have to connect through EWR or ORD for once coming from the west.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sat Aug 03, 2019 2:42 am

atbPy wrote:
I took the SFO-CMH redeye last week and it was pretty full - probably only about 10-12 empty seats on the A320. It was nice to be able to not have to connect through EWR or ORD for once coming from the west.


I had a friend pass along that they flew CMH-SLC and back recently and it was packed as well. Combine that with your trip and the LF for SEA and things appear to be going really well for the new transcons so far.
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flyCMH
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sat Aug 03, 2019 11:28 am

atbPy wrote:
I took the SFO-CMH redeye last week and it was pretty full - probably only about 10-12 empty seats on the A320. It was nice to be able to not have to connect through EWR or ORD for once coming from the west.


This reminded me: I was on the inaugural CMH-SFO flight on UA back on June 7. The CRAA put on another really nice celebration for the event, similar to the Alaska Airlines inaugural in May. The flight departed about 2 hours late due to delayed inbound aircraft. The load was about 85% full that morning. Below are some photos from the occassion:

Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
 
CMHtraveler
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:54 pm

Thanks for sharing your photos flyCMH!

Forgive me if this has been discussed already, but over at the CMH Republic MX hangar, there’s a 175 in DL livery that appears to be getting parted out. Titles have been painted over and it’s parked outside missing the nose cone and many other parts. Does anyone know which bird this is and what the story is?
 
CMHtraveler
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Aug 04, 2019 2:11 pm

From today’s OAG thread:

*F9 CMH-RDU SEP 0.4>0.1[0] OCT 0.5>0[0]


It was always going to be seasonal but is now being cut in September instead of November. I doubt it will return. Another seasonal Tues/Thurs dud from F9, not going well for them at CMH since their return.
 
flyCMH
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:11 am

Yeah, Frontier just hasn't been able to get a secure foothold in the market. They've had a lot working against them, from their ill-fated first attempt to TTN to their sub-optimal flight times and days. Everything outside of DEN and MCO has been a dud, and even those 2 markets they've struggled to maintain some kind of frequency. If they could only provide a daily schedule to those 2 markets and less-than-daily, seasonal service to AUS, SAT, MKE, BDL, PBI, and the like - I think they could carve a nice niche in the market. None of those markets seem to be coming back or on the horizon, however.

Also, AA's updated schedule for November didn't yield too much for CMH. A mainline E90 continues to LGA, MIA maintains 4x daily - one of which is upgauged to an E75, and ORD goes all-E75 except for 1 CR7 (maintains 9x daily service). No mainline return to ORD or CLT...yet, hopefully.
 
DeltaRules
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:17 am

flyCMH wrote:
Yeah, Frontier just hasn't been able to get a secure foothold in the market. They've had a lot working against them, from their ill-fated first attempt to TTN to their sub-optimal flight times and days. Everything outside of DEN and MCO has been a dud, and even those 2 markets they've struggled to maintain some kind of frequency. If they could only provide a daily schedule to those 2 markets and less-than-daily, seasonal service to AUS, SAT, MKE, BDL, PBI, and the like - I think they could carve a nice niche in the market. None of those markets seem to be coming back or on the horizon, however.

Also, AA's updated schedule for November didn't yield too much for CMH. A mainline E90 continues to LGA, MIA maintains 4x daily - one of which is upgauged to an E75, and ORD goes all-E75 except for 1 CR7 (maintains 9x daily service). No mainline return to ORD or CLT...yet, hopefully.


I seem to remember F9 yanked TTN not long after they started it because of what they saw as greener pastures at CVG and CLE, which led to the operations they have there today. There was discussion around here that they'd built the schedule out but ran the fares to exorbitant levels to discourage people from booking through the end of service.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
CMHtraveler
Posts: 104
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:48 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Aug 05, 2019 11:17 am

flyCMH wrote:
Also, AA's updated schedule for November didn't yield too much for CMH. A mainline E90 continues to LGA, MIA maintains 4x daily - one of which is upgauged to an E75, and ORD goes all-E75 except for 1 CR7 (maintains 9x daily service). No mainline return to ORD or CLT...yet, hopefully.


Hey, an E75 upguage to MIA is a big deal! We’ve been whining about the endless 50-seaters on that particular route forever on this thread, even within the last few pages. Someone in route planning must be reading Anet. :lol:
 
NoTime
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 06, 2019 1:10 am

CMHtraveler wrote:
flyCMH wrote:
Also, AA's updated schedule for November didn't yield too much for CMH. A mainline E90 continues to LGA, MIA maintains 4x daily - one of which is upgauged to an E75, and ORD goes all-E75 except for 1 CR7 (maintains 9x daily service). No mainline return to ORD or CLT...yet, hopefully.


Hey, an E75 upguage to MIA is a big deal! We’ve been whining about the endless 50-seaters on that particular route forever on this thread, even within the last few pages. Someone in route planning must be reading Anet. :lol:


Amen! It's about time!
 
DeltaRules
Topic Author
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:16 pm

Kind of a cool thread going on right now about DL's old concourse at DAY if anybody here has anything to add:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1428837
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
flyguy89
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:09 pm

Looking through the November schedules and DL seems to have scheduled a surprising flex in mainline flying at CVG, driven mostly by the 717. Mainline flying at CVG has typically hovered at 25-ish daily flights, but looks like on certain days in November, DL will operate a peak of 32 daily mainline flights. Looks to be driven mostly by up-gauging on CVG-MSP/BOS/DCA along with the addition of CVG-PHX flying, which I don't believe operated in the fall last year. Either way, great to see more mainline action at CVG!
 
WWads
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:11 pm

flyguy89 wrote:
Looking through the November schedules and DL seems to have scheduled a surprising flex in mainline flying at CVG, driven mostly by the 717. Mainline flying at CVG has typically hovered at 25-ish daily flights, but looks like on certain days in November, DL will operate a peak of 32 daily mainline flights. Looks to be driven mostly by up-gauging on CVG-MSP/BOS/DCA along with the addition of CVG-PHX flying, which I don't believe operated in the fall last year. Either way, great to see more mainline action at CVG!


Sadly CVG-DCA is down to 2x daily on some weekdays in the fall. I'd rather have 4x daily on CRJs than only 2x on 717s. Axing the 8:30PM CVG-DCA particularly stings. I know that they had to move a slot to DCA-BOS, but I wish it didn't have to come from CVG.
 
WWads
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:12 pm

WWads wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
Looking through the November schedules and DL seems to have scheduled a surprising flex in mainline flying at CVG, driven mostly by the 717. Mainline flying at CVG has typically hovered at 25-ish daily flights, but looks like on certain days in November, DL will operate a peak of 32 daily mainline flights. Looks to be driven mostly by up-gauging on CVG-MSP/BOS/DCA along with the addition of CVG-PHX flying, which I don't believe operated in the fall last year. Either way, great to see more mainline action at CVG!


Sadly CVG-DCA is down to 2x daily on some weekdays in the fall. I'd rather have 4x daily on CRJs than only 2x on 717s. Axing the 8:30PM CVG-DCA particularly stings. I know that they had to move slots to DCA-BOS, but I wish one didn't have to come from CVG.
 
flyguy89
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Aug 11, 2019 10:32 pm

WWads wrote:
flyguy89 wrote:
Looking through the November schedules and DL seems to have scheduled a surprising flex in mainline flying at CVG, driven mostly by the 717. Mainline flying at CVG has typically hovered at 25-ish daily flights, but looks like on certain days in November, DL will operate a peak of 32 daily mainline flights. Looks to be driven mostly by up-gauging on CVG-MSP/BOS/DCA along with the addition of CVG-PHX flying, which I don't believe operated in the fall last year. Either way, great to see more mainline action at CVG!


Sadly CVG-DCA is down to 2x daily on some weekdays in the fall. I'd rather have 4x daily on CRJs than only 2x on 717s. Axing the 8:30PM CVG-DCA particularly stings. I know that they had to move a slot to DCA-BOS, but I wish it didn't have to come from CVG.

When? Schedules seem to show it at 3x daily pretty consistently throughout the fall on weekdays.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Sun Aug 11, 2019 11:33 pm

flyguy89 wrote:
Looking through the November schedules and DL seems to have scheduled a surprising flex in mainline flying at CVG, driven mostly by the 717. Mainline flying at CVG has typically hovered at 25-ish daily flights, but looks like on certain days in November, DL will operate a peak of 32 daily mainline flights. Looks to be driven mostly by up-gauging on CVG-MSP/BOS/DCA along with the addition of CVG-PHX flying, which I don't believe operated in the fall last year. Either way, great to see more mainline action at CVG!


DL CVG-PHX started at the same time last year:
https://www.bizjournals.com/cincinnati/ ... -city.html
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
DeltaRules
Topic Author
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Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Aug 12, 2019 2:30 am

Just booked myself on SLC-CMH on the tail end of a trip out west in October and, of the four segments, that was the flight with the fewest seats left.
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CMHtraveler
Posts: 104
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:48 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Aug 12, 2019 3:15 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
Just booked myself on SLC-CMH on the tail end of a trip out west in October and, of the four segments, that was the flight with the fewest seats left.


Anecdotally (and from the AS data), it seems the three S’s (SEA/SFO/SLC) launched this spring are doing well. With these holes filled, it seems that Nardone and company are largely focused on the big TATL prize, but your post got me thinking about other potential domestic adds for CMH/LCK. Here are unserved/underserved cities amongst the top 50 U.S. cities in order of population (MSA) and potential operators:

1. SAN (AS/WN/NK)
2. SAT (F9 again/WN)
3. PDX (AS)
4. SMF (AS/WN)
5. PIT (too close)
6. CVG (too close)
7. AUS (DL/F9 again/G4/WN)
8. MCI (WN)
9. CLE (too close)
10. IND (too close)
11. SJC (AS/WN)
12. ORF (F9/G4)
13. PVD (AA)
14. MKE (WN)
15. JAC (F9/G4)
16. OKC (WN)
17. MEM (DL)
18. SDF (too close)
19. MSY (NK/WN)
20. BDL (AA)
21. BHM (WN)
22. BUF (WN)

I think the top 10 (excluding the nearby cities) are all current possibilities, along with MSY which I included because I think we can do better than seasonal weekends. With AS’ success I’m particularly interested in whether they consider some of the other west coast adds. What do you all think?
 
ChasChandler
Posts: 30
Joined: Wed May 09, 2018 11:00 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Aug 12, 2019 4:15 pm

CMHtraveler wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
Just booked myself on SLC-CMH on the tail end of a trip out west in October and, of the four segments, that was the flight with the fewest seats left.


Anecdotally (and from the AS data), it seems the three S’s (SEA/SFO/SLC) launched this spring are doing well. With these holes filled, it seems that Nardone and company are largely focused on the big TATL prize, but your post got me thinking about other potential domestic adds for CMH/LCK. Here are unserved/underserved cities amongst the top 50 U.S. cities in order of population (MSA) and potential operators:

1. SAN (AS/WN/NK)
2. SAT (F9 again/WN)
3. PDX (AS)
4. SMF (AS/WN)
5. PIT (too close)
6. CVG (too close)
7. AUS (DL/F9 again/G4/WN)
8. MCI (WN)
9. CLE (too close)
10. IND (too close)
11. SJC (AS/WN)
12. ORF (F9/G4)
13. PVD (AA)
14. MKE (WN)
15. JAC (F9/G4)
16. OKC (WN)
17. MEM (DL)
18. SDF (too close)
19. MSY (NK/WN)
20. BDL (AA)
21. BHM (WN)
22. BUF (WN)

I think the top 10 (excluding the nearby cities) are all current possibilities, along with MSY which I included because I think we can do better than seasonal weekends. With AS’ success I’m particularly interested in whether they consider some of the other west coast adds. What do you all think?

I've always thought without a hub, the maximum for CMH would be flights to the top 50 US markets with a couple of TATL flights to major European business centers and a flight to Asia. In time I think we'll get there.
 
ILNFlyer
Posts: 391
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 8:34 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Aug 12, 2019 4:47 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
cledaybuck wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
I know there was talk that G4 was "cutting" flights to DAY, but the OAG thread last week showed DAY-PGD comes back in March. Not sure of the operating seasons of the other routes.

G4 is flying absolutely nothing after Labor Day until the middle of November when PGD comes back. PIE is flying now until Labor Day and then comes back in February. SFB also comes back in February.


That's one of those "Well, it could be worse, but it's not great" situations. How much does it cost G4 to have facilities (ticket counter, gate) sit empty for two months? It's been a long time since I've been past TSA at DAY, so I don't know what sort of signage they have at A26, but they've got a permanent counter space.


Bottom line is you fly when the traffic will support the route.
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 389
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Mon Aug 12, 2019 11:28 pm

I think that CVG will be getting some new destinations announced tomorrow by G4. Pure speculation at this point but I'm fairly confident that it's gonna happen.
A319, A320, A321, B1900F, B737-300, B737-400, B737-400F, B737-700, B737-800, B757-200, B757-200F, B767-200F, B767-300F, CRJ-200, CRJ-700, ERJ-145, E-170, E-175, MD-80, SD3-60F
 
Jshank83
Posts: 2903
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:37 am

AirportRival wrote:
I think that CVG will be getting some new destinations announced tomorrow by G4. Pure speculation at this point but I'm fairly confident that it's gonna happen.


Why are you so confident if it is just speculation? just curious.
 
jplatts
Posts: 2786
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:47 am

AirportRival wrote:
I think that CVG will be getting some new destinations announced tomorrow by G4. Pure speculation at this point but I'm fairly confident that it's gonna happen.


There are a few more nonstop routes to existing G4 destinations that could be added by G4 out of CVG such as CVG-GPT, CVG-OAK, CVG-PSP, and CVG-PVU.

Other possible expansion opportunities for G4 out of CVG include
(a) G4 adding new international nonstop routes out of CVG
and
(b) G4 adding nonstop service out of CVG to additional domestic Gulf Coast destinations not currently served by G4 such as HRL, CRP, HOU, MOB, BFM, or PNS.
 
Springs1816
Posts: 39
Joined: Fri Feb 02, 2018 3:11 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:50 am

Jshank83 wrote:
AirportRival wrote:
I think that CVG will be getting some new destinations announced tomorrow by G4. Pure speculation at this point but I'm fairly confident that it's gonna happen.


Why are you so confident if it is just speculation? just curious.


What could they pick up? All the low hanging fruit seems to be picked already.

BLI would be cool as a summer seasonal route but nothing from there comes as far east as CVG.

Would like to see SLC and PBI but those would both be new cities for G4 so I'm not really sure.

Maybe something international that has been rumored recently?
 
jplatts
Posts: 2786
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:21 am

Springs1816 wrote:
Would like to see SLC and PBI but those would both be new cities for G4 so I'm not really sure.


G4 already serves OGD and PVU in the Greater Salt Lake City area, and G4 would probably add CVG-OGD or CVG-PVU instead of CVG-SLC if G4 adds nonstop service to Utah from CVG. OGD is also close enough to Downtown Salt Lake City for OGD to be a viable alternative to SLC.
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 389
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:05 am

Jshank83 wrote:
AirportRival wrote:
I think that CVG will be getting some new destinations announced tomorrow by G4. Pure speculation at this point but I'm fairly confident that it's gonna happen.


Why are you so confident if it is just speculation? just curious.


Part of my job is to look at the flight schedules for the airlines we handle as far in advance as possible. They are pretty good at hiding new cities that haven't been announced yet but there are certain clues that allows me to guess.
A319, A320, A321, B1900F, B737-300, B737-400, B737-400F, B737-700, B737-800, B757-200, B757-200F, B767-200F, B767-300F, CRJ-200, CRJ-700, ERJ-145, E-170, E-175, MD-80, SD3-60F
 
User avatar
AirportRival
Posts: 389
Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:24 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:08 am

Springs1816 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
AirportRival wrote:
I think that CVG will be getting some new destinations announced tomorrow by G4. Pure speculation at this point but I'm fairly confident that it's gonna happen.


Why are you so confident if it is just speculation? just curious.


What could they pick up? All the low hanging fruit seems to be picked already.

BLI would be cool as a summer seasonal route but nothing from there comes as far east as CVG.

Would like to see SLC and PBI but those would both be new cities for G4 so I'm not really sure.

Maybe something international that has been rumored recently?


I think one thing to remember about G4 at CVG is that they kind of use the market as a testing bed for new destinations. Few people thought that CVG would have the destinations that it does through G4 at this point. It honestly wouldn't shock me to see them announce CVG-ORD/MDW or CVG-BNA. Not saying that that is what is gonna happen, just saying that they are more willing to take chances than most airlines.
A319, A320, A321, B1900F, B737-300, B737-400, B737-400F, B737-700, B737-800, B757-200, B757-200F, B767-200F, B767-300F, CRJ-200, CRJ-700, ERJ-145, E-170, E-175, MD-80, SD3-60F
 
DeltaRules
Topic Author
Posts: 4967
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:00 pm

G4 added CVG-PBI. Given they also are starting IND and PIT, I wouldn't be surprised to see it to expand to some combination of LCK/DAY/TOL/CLE in the future if those work.

ChasChandler wrote:
CMHtraveler wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
Just booked myself on SLC-CMH on the tail end of a trip out west in October and, of the four segments, that was the flight with the fewest seats left.


Anecdotally (and from the AS data), it seems the three S’s (SEA/SFO/SLC) launched this spring are doing well. With these holes filled, it seems that Nardone and company are largely focused on the big TATL prize, but your post got me thinking about other potential domestic adds for CMH/LCK. Here are unserved/underserved cities amongst the top 50 U.S. cities in order of population (MSA) and potential operators:

1. SAN (AS/WN/NK)
2. SAT (F9 again/WN)
3. PDX (AS)
4. SMF (AS/WN)
5. PIT (too close)
6. CVG (too close)
7. AUS (DL/F9 again/G4/WN)
8. MCI (WN)
9. CLE (too close)
10. IND (too close)
11. SJC (AS/WN)
12. ORF (F9/G4)
13. PVD (AA)
14. MKE (WN)
15. JAC (F9/G4)
16. OKC (WN)
17. MEM (DL)
18. SDF (too close)
19. MSY (NK/WN)
20. BDL (AA)
21. BHM (WN)
22. BUF (WN)

I think the top 10 (excluding the nearby cities) are all current possibilities, along with MSY which I included because I think we can do better than seasonal weekends. With AS’ success I’m particularly interested in whether they consider some of the other west coast adds. What do you all think?

I've always thought without a hub, the maximum for CMH would be flights to the top 50 US markets with a couple of TATL flights to major European business centers and a flight to Asia. In time I think we'll get there.


SAN, PDX, AUS, MCI, and MSY seem like the only really likely targets for new/expanded service. CMH-MKE feels like it'd be ripe for the coming YX rebirth.

edit- I guess BDL could work if somebody wanted to restart the old HP/DL insurance company shuttle bus.
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
flyinryan99
Posts: 1494
Joined: Sat Feb 17, 2001 6:54 am

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:17 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
G4 added CVG-PBI. Given they also are starting IND and PIT, I wouldn't be surprised to see it to expand to some combination of LCK/DAY/TOL/CLE in the future if those work.


I wouldn't expect much from G4 out of TOL. MYR was only around one summer and I expect VPS not to come back after year one. I get the feeling they are in TOL just to pick off the bottom of the barrel from the DTW travelers. Their schedules for both MYR and VPS have been severely undesirable yet filled them close to systemwide load factors once the flights caught on. Heck, Allegiant has been around in TOL for a long time and have yet to increase summer flying past 2x weekly for SFB, PGD, and PIE. PGD is consistently the best performer, yet has gone seasonal...They will increase next year's spring flying but no where near the increases that other markets in the area are seeing...I'm just kind of at a loss for this market...Kinda wish Sun Country would fly in and out of here...
 
jplatts
Posts: 2786
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:05 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
I guess BDL could work if somebody wanted to restart the old HP/DL insurance company shuttle bus.


DL adding CMH-BDL nonstop service is a possibility as DL already has p2p nonstop service between BDL and CLE.
 
flyCMH
Posts: 2273
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 1999 12:15 pm

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:30 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
G4 added CVG-PBI. Given they also are starting IND and PIT, I wouldn't be surprised to see it to expand to some combination of LCK/DAY/TOL/CLE in the future if those work.

ChasChandler wrote:
CMHtraveler wrote:

Anecdotally (and from the AS data), it seems the three S’s (SEA/SFO/SLC) launched this spring are doing well. With these holes filled, it seems that Nardone and company are largely focused on the big TATL prize, but your post got me thinking about other potential domestic adds for CMH/LCK. Here are unserved/underserved cities amongst the top 50 U.S. cities in order of population (MSA) and potential operators:

1. SAN (AS/WN/NK)
2. SAT (F9 again/WN)
3. PDX (AS)
4. SMF (AS/WN)
5. PIT (too close)
6. CVG (too close)
7. AUS (DL/F9 again/G4/WN)
8. MCI (WN)
9. CLE (too close)
10. IND (too close)
11. SJC (AS/WN)
12. ORF (F9/G4)
13. PVD (AA)
14. MKE (WN)
15. JAC (F9/G4)
16. OKC (WN)
17. MEM (DL)
18. SDF (too close)
19. MSY (NK/WN)
20. BDL (AA)
21. BHM (WN)
22. BUF (WN)

I think the top 10 (excluding the nearby cities) are all current possibilities, along with MSY which I included because I think we can do better than seasonal weekends. With AS’ success I’m particularly interested in whether they consider some of the other west coast adds. What do you all think?

I've always thought without a hub, the maximum for CMH would be flights to the top 50 US markets with a couple of TATL flights to major European business centers and a flight to Asia. In time I think we'll get there.


SAN, PDX, AUS, MCI, and MSY seem like the only really likely targets for new/expanded service. CMH-MKE feels like it'd be ripe for the coming YX rebirth.

edit- I guess BDL could work if somebody wanted to restart the old HP/DL insurance company shuttle bus.


My take on this:

1. SAN - probably just on the borderline of feasibility from CMH. A seasonal nonstop would probably the most realistic option at this point. As for possible carriers, WN would be a great candidate, but they might be gun shy after their shaky attempt at OAK. F9 seems to have had success serving SAN from neighboring airports, but has a far smaller footprint at CMH and far less success in maintaining new routes long-term.
2. SAT - I would like to see F9 give this one a go again. A seasonal, 3-4x weekly schedule seems like it could work for the route. Other than Frontier, not sure who else could make the route work. At this point, probably no one. Maybe Moxy if/when they begin flying?
3. PDX - this route is like SAN, on the borderline of possibility. It would be great to see AS pursue this route on a seasonal basis, but it would have to stand on its own an not cannibalize much from SEA. WN and F9 would be long, long shots.
4. SMF - I doubt any airline could make CMH-SMF work.
7. AUS - this too I would like to see F9 try again. AUS complemented with SAT on a 3-4 weekly schedule would be great. Maybe WN could give it a go, but they've been pretty methodical on Texas expansion from CMH, with DAL and HOU being very recent additions, the latter starting at weekend-only nonstops. Serving AUS nonstop might cannibalize other routes.
8. MCI - this is on the top of my wish list. I think WN could fly CMH-MCI 1x daily pretty easily. However, fleet and terminal constraints at MCI are likely keeping this route from becoming a reality.
11. SJC - like SMF, there's not much of a business case for SJC nonstop, in my opinion.
12. ORF - with G4 breaking the mold here, it could be a possibility. They seem to have had success in neighboring markets, maybe G4 could give it a go 2-4 weekly seasonal.
13. PVD - see SMF, and SJC
14. MKE - also on the top of my wish list. WN 1x daily seems like a good possibility. The revived Midwest Express would also be a logical choice, if they get off the ground. I'd love to see Delta do the route 2x daily (along with IND-MKE), but it would likely cannibalize DTW.
15. JAC - can't see a logical case for it
16. OKC - likewise
17. MEM - no
19. MSY - content with our less-than-daily seasonal service.Maybe WN or NK could increase service after the new terminal opens.
20. BDL - another at the top of the wish list. I think F9 could do the route 4x weekly successfully. Ideally, the route would be flown 2x daily by Delta, reviving the insurance shuttle (similar to MKE, I'd also like to see IND-BDL service).
21. BHM - no
22. BUF -no
 
DeltaRules
Topic Author
Posts: 4967
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

Re: The Rest of Ohio - 2019

Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:36 pm

flyCMH wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
G4 added CVG-PBI. Given they also are starting IND and PIT, I wouldn't be surprised to see it to expand to some combination of LCK/DAY/TOL/CLE in the future if those work.

ChasChandler wrote:
I've always thought without a hub, the maximum for CMH would be flights to the top 50 US markets with a couple of TATL flights to major European business centers and a flight to Asia. In time I think we'll get there.


SAN, PDX, AUS, MCI, and MSY seem like the only really likely targets for new/expanded service. CMH-MKE feels like it'd be ripe for the coming YX rebirth.

edit- I guess BDL could work if somebody wanted to restart the old HP/DL insurance company shuttle bus.


My take on this:

1. SAN - probably just on the borderline of feasibility from CMH. A seasonal nonstop would probably the most realistic option at this point. As for possible carriers, WN would be a great candidate, but they might be gun shy after their shaky attempt at OAK. F9 seems to have had success serving SAN from neighboring airports, but has a far smaller footprint at CMH and far less success in maintaining new routes long-term.
2. SAT - I would like to see F9 give this one a go again. A seasonal, 3-4x weekly schedule seems like it could work for the route. Other than Frontier, not sure who else could make the route work. At this point, probably no one. Maybe Moxy if/when they begin flying?
3. PDX - this route is like SAN, on the borderline of possibility. It would be great to see AS pursue this route on a seasonal basis, but it would have to stand on its own an not cannibalize much from SEA. WN and F9 would be long, long shots.
4. SMF - I doubt any airline could make CMH-SMF work.
7. AUS - this too I would like to see F9 try again. AUS complemented with SAT on a 3-4 weekly schedule would be great. Maybe WN could give it a go, but they've been pretty methodical on Texas expansion from CMH, with DAL and HOU being very recent additions, the latter starting at weekend-only nonstops. Serving AUS nonstop might cannibalize other routes.
8. MCI - this is on the top of my wish list. I think WN could fly CMH-MCI 1x daily pretty easily. However, fleet and terminal constraints at MCI are likely keeping this route from becoming a reality.
11. SJC - like SMF, there's not much of a business case for SJC nonstop, in my opinion.
12. ORF - with G4 breaking the mold here, it could be a possibility. They seem to have had success in neighboring markets, maybe G4 could give it a go 2-4 weekly seasonal.
13. PVD - see SMF, and SJC
14. MKE - also on the top of my wish list. WN 1x daily seems like a good possibility. The revived Midwest Express would also be a logical choice, if they get off the ground. I'd love to see Delta do the route 2x daily (along with IND-MKE), but it would likely cannibalize DTW.
15. JAC - can't see a logical case for it
16. OKC - likewise
17. MEM - no
19. MSY - content with our less-than-daily seasonal service.Maybe WN or NK could increase service after the new terminal opens.
20. BDL - another at the top of the wish list. I think F9 could do the route 4x weekly successfully. Ideally, the route would be flown 2x daily by Delta, reviving the insurance shuttle (similar to MKE, I'd also like to see IND-BDL service).
21. BHM - no
22. BUF -no


I'm curious as to what DL's going to do with their AUS "focus city". If it involves adding routes and some sort of connecting network, I could see them adding CMH-AUS on an RJ to open up a Southern route (if you will) out West, though I'd be concerned about it cannibalizing SLC. (DL briefly ran CMH-DFW on ERJs just before they pulled the DFW hub.)

If it's just DL's answer to WN's "Hometown Airline" thing (of which CMH is on the list), then no.
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