swacle
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Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2003 1:41 pm

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Nov 28, 2019 11:33 pm

CLE does not have a curfew. 0500 is the earliest I have seen scheduled ops on various carriers (NW used to have a 0500 DTW flight I remember) and HP had a LAS departure around 2300 for a while.
Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Nov 29, 2019 3:47 am

^Thanks. How about BKL? Though I imagine if CLE has no curfew, BKL doesn't either as CLE affects more residential areas than does Burke.
 
CleSyrRoc
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Joined: Tue May 21, 2019 2:47 pm

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Nov 30, 2019 1:01 am

Don't know for sure about Burke but I agree with the reasoning that it probably doesn't. Have to say I'd have been astounded if CLE had a curfew. The airport should be doing everything possible to make doing business there as easy for airlines as possible, not the opposite. I'll take some middle of the night flights every day if it means more service, including a flight or two across the pond.
 
swacle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Nov 30, 2019 7:14 pm

CleSyrRoc wrote:
Don't know for sure about Burke but I agree with the reasoning that it probably doesn't. Have to say I'd have been astounded if CLE had a curfew. The airport should be doing everything possible to make doing business there as easy for airlines as possible, not the opposite. I'll take some middle of the night flights every day if it means more service, including a flight or two across the pond.


And there are flights most of the night. Last scheduled passenger arrival is WN from DEN at 0125 right now, UPS/Fed Ex (and sometimes F9) start arriving around 0400 so not a long break.
Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sat Nov 30, 2019 9:24 pm

Most airlines operate at essentialLy a Monday schedule best I can tell for Sunday thanksgiving. The only exception I can find is UA on a single route, operating three flights SFO to CLE Sunday (as opposed to 1 they’ve been operating before and after a Thanksgiving this year). Then they have three CLE to SFO on Monday.

I’d love to know what data UA has to support extra capacity on that route for only one day in each direction, but no other routes or days. For instance LAX remains single daily through the thanksgiving period, and DEN remains at three daily.
 
LifetimeGS
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Dec 01, 2019 12:25 am

Additional extra Sunday flight:

UA 4079 Departing 10:48 pm
Cleveland, OH, US (CLE)
Arriving 11:20 pm
Chicago, IL, US (ORD)

Nonstop ERJ

Connects to the additional Sunday bank at ORD
 
greenair727
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Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 6:27 am

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:52 pm

I always look forward to Enilria's Sunday OAG lists, but there was no changes listed for CLE this week. In fact the list was rather short, DL and UA had only a handful of changes and AA had none. Other airlines' lists were short as well.
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Dec 02, 2019 12:12 am

CleSyrRoc wrote:
Don't know for sure about Burke but I agree with the reasoning that it probably doesn't. Have to say I'd have been astounded if CLE had a curfew. The airport should be doing everything possible to make doing business there as easy for airlines as possible, not the opposite. I'll take some middle of the night flights every day if it means more service, including a flight or two across the pond.


I was not in any way advocating a curfew, I was simply asking if there was one at CLE and BKL. I don't think there should be one either.
 
avtcle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Dec 02, 2019 12:21 am

Still trying to patiently wait on the F9 schedule extension.... At the time of this writing they only have bookings available through April 2020 — severely behind all other US carriers who have extended through at least August 2020. The longer they wait the more business they lose.

Last fall they released summer 2019 on November 20th!
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Dec 02, 2019 12:53 am

The F9 schedule extension is about the most interesting thing at CLE these days! I was by CLE today and note they are promoting SAN on the lighted sign at the entrance, but it's just as likely to be something that hasn't gotten around to being changed.

While no news in CLE I'm thoroughly flummoxed that PIT is getting double daily on AS to SEA in the summer and we are only likely to have non-daily crumbs on F9-- red eye being the only option back to CLE.
 
LifetimeGS
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Dec 02, 2019 2:33 am

AS OMA extra service too as CLE has nothing.
 
avtcle
Posts: 191
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:52 am

Fantastic. Still doesn’t change the fact that CLE has significantly more PPDEW to SEA than PIT. However when the airports can show airlines the $$$ new service will always come.
 
CleSyrRoc
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 12:12 am

The AA CLE-JFK Cancelations have now run into March according to the OAG Update
.
The good news? UA is adding one frequency each to EWR, ORD, and IAH for 8, 9, and 5 daily, respectively.

Did some dummy bookings to confirm, the ORD flights are all on 737's. Two of the EWR flights are 737's, and only one of the IAH frequencies is 737, the rest are non-mainline (Yikes). Passenger flows from CLE to IAH have really decreased since the CO hub days.
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:12 am

avtcle wrote:
Fantastic. Still doesn’t change the fact that CLE has significantly more PPDEW to SEA than PIT. However when the airports can show airlines the $$$ new service will always come.


I don’t recall seeing that PIT threw money to AS like they did BA? Especially for a second flight???And did CMH throw money at AS? Route development in CLE is a real disappointment. CMH beating CLE to Seattle, there is no excuse for that. I won’t sneeze at F9 flying A321s all day long but it’s not for the business flyers.
 
Jshank83
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:20 am

ncflyer wrote:
avtcle wrote:
Fantastic. Still doesn’t change the fact that CLE has significantly more PPDEW to SEA than PIT. However when the airports can show airlines the $$$ new service will always come.


I don’t recall seeing that PIT threw money to AS like they did BA? Especially for a second flight???And did CMH throw money at AS? Route development in CLE is a real disappointment. CMH beating CLE to Seattle, there is no excuse for that. I won’t sneeze at F9 flying A321s all day long but it’s not for the business flyers.



Alaska Airlines also is getting $500,000 over two years for marketing support and any other startup costs related to a flight to Seattle that started in September.

https://www.post-gazette.com/business/d ... 1811280096
 
swacle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:07 am

Could change but right now UA's Star Wars -800 is due in 12/3 at 1940 as 1293 from EWR and is scheduled out at 1100 on 12/4 as 814 to DEN.
Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:16 am

$500,000 is peanuts over two years. That’s probably Shake Shacks rent over the time period— hope that’s not the barrier to AS.
 
CleSyrRoc
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 3:39 am

I'm surprised DL hasn't started CLE-SEA yet. They're working on building up the SEA hub and would be the only carrier serving the route with daily, year-round service. There also is no DL SEA-CMH, SEA-BUF, or SEA-PIT service. It has to be on their radar.
 
Runway28L
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:16 am

ncflyer wrote:
avtcle wrote:
Fantastic. Still doesn’t change the fact that CLE has significantly more PPDEW to SEA than PIT. However when the airports can show airlines the $$$ new service will always come.


I don’t recall seeing that PIT threw money to AS like they did BA? Especially for a second flight???And did CMH throw money at AS? Route development in CLE is a real disappointment. CMH beating CLE to Seattle, there is no excuse for that. I won’t sneeze at F9 flying A321s all day long but it’s not for the business flyers.

The initial subsidy for Alaska was $500,000 to start service, most of it being allocated for marketing purposes. This second daily flight however is being added entirely on Alaska's own behalf.
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 4:56 am

ncflyer wrote:
avtcle wrote:
Fantastic. Still doesn’t change the fact that CLE has significantly more PPDEW to SEA than PIT. However when the airports can show airlines the $$$ new service will always come.


I don’t recall seeing that PIT threw money to AS like they did BA? Especially for a second flight???And did CMH throw money at AS? Route development in CLE is a real disappointment. CMH beating CLE to Seattle, there is no excuse for that. I won’t sneeze at F9 flying A321s all day long but it’s not for the business flyers.


"Route development in CLE is a real disappointment" that's putting it overly gently. Its outright incompetent. The head of route development is same ineffectual guy held over from the Ricky Smith days. The fact that Kennedy keeps him around shows he (Kennedy) doesn't really give a crap. If you tell a guy he's not allowed to quit, what do you expect him to do?
 
fun2fly
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 11:56 am

greenair727 wrote:
ncflyer wrote:
avtcle wrote:
Fantastic. Still doesn’t change the fact that CLE has significantly more PPDEW to SEA than PIT. However when the airports can show airlines the $$$ new service will always come.


I don’t recall seeing that PIT threw money to AS like they did BA? Especially for a second flight???And did CMH throw money at AS? Route development in CLE is a real disappointment. CMH beating CLE to Seattle, there is no excuse for that. I won’t sneeze at F9 flying A321s all day long but it’s not for the business flyers.


"Route development in CLE is a real disappointment" that's putting it overly gently. Its outright incompetent. The head of route development is same ineffectual guy held over from the Ricky Smith days. The fact that Kennedy keeps him around shows he (Kennedy) doesn't really give a crap. If you tell a guy he's not allowed to quit, what do you expect him to do?


Regardless of who the route guy is, it's Kennedy's shop and he's the one that stated TATL is the goal.

With that being said, we know they tried as Aer Lingus came to town per the billboards we discussed on this thread. Their own A321LR delays + FI's MAX issues might be legit, but it's still a "no go" for CLE again thus far. Disappointing.
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:10 pm

^I agree that its Kennedy's shop and I think, after he tried to quit, but failed, he just doesn't give a crap. As the mayor doesn't really care about the airport, he's probably fine to have Kennedy just there to mind the shop and collect a fat paycheck and make no waves. Kennedy could not even succeed in quitting his own job, so could he really bring in a major carrier for TATL? A good manager also delegates, but he's kept the incompetent air service manager. He doesn't even give enough of a crap to replace him with someone who could get AS or DL to SEA, let alone someone to LHR or AMS.
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 2:46 pm

My disappointment, which I've expressed here before, is that there is seemingly no effort to rally the business community behind better air service, a modern airport, and more professionalized governance. The table is being set to do absolutely nothing once the master facility plan is produced. I get that the region has bigger problems but so do most places outside of Austin and Nashville. I also fault the business community and civic leaders. You would have sure thought that getting beat by PIT with BA, or not being a semi-finalist for Amazon HQ would have been a wake up call.
 
jplatts
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 3:28 pm

CleSyrRoc wrote:
I'm surprised DL hasn't started CLE-SEA yet. They're working on building up the SEA hub and would be the only carrier serving the route with daily, year-round service. There also is no DL SEA-CMH, SEA-BUF, or SEA-PIT service. It has to be on their radar.


CVG is currently the only U.S. airport not served by AS that DL serves nonstop out of SEA, and DL is still operating CVG-SEA nonstop service since (a) CVG was a former DL hub, (b) DL still has a focus city at CVG, and (c) DL now has a hub at SEA.

There are a few other U.S. airports not served by AS that have nonstop service out of SEA on airlines other than AS or DL such as CLT, MDW, HOU, LGB, and MIA, but AS already serves ORD, IAH, LAX, and FLL in the Chicago, Houston, Los Angeles, and Miami/Fort Lauderdale markets.

I think that AS is more likely to add CLE-SEA than DL is since (a) most of DL's domestic adds out of SEA in the last 5 years were to destinations that already had nonstop service out of SEA on AS, and (b) AS had recently added nonstop service to SEA out of nearby markets such as CMH and PIT.
 
csizmpl
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 03, 2019 9:18 pm

swacle wrote:
Could change but right now UA's Star Wars -800 is due in 12/3 at 1940 as 1293 from EWR and is scheduled out at 1100 on 12/4 as 814 to DEN.


Changed again. No longer showing CLE again.
 
swacle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 12:29 am

csizmpl wrote:
swacle wrote:
Could change but right now UA's Star Wars -800 is due in 12/3 at 1940 as 1293 from EWR and is scheduled out at 1100 on 12/4 as 814 to DEN.


Changed again. No longer showing CLE again.


And only 4 hours before it was supposed to be here. Swapped it at about 3:30 this afternoon.
Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
 
avtcle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 1:31 am

United Airlines is ordering 50 A321XLR with orders beginning in 2024.... Opens up an interesting possibility for Cleveland, which could see some economically viable cities pairs emerge that this aircraft could operate. CLE to FRA is well within range capability of the plane, and would open up a huge UA/LH connecting hub to United's large FF base here.
 
fun2fly
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:28 am

avtcle wrote:
United Airlines is ordering 50 A321XLR with orders beginning in 2024.... Opens up an interesting possibility for Cleveland, which could see some economically viable cities pairs emerge that this aircraft could operate. CLE to FRA is well within range capability of the plane, and would open up a huge UA/LH connecting hub to United's large FF base here.


I thought the same thing, however their press release states EWR and IAD flying so I'm sure they'd get the first units. I'd surely hope that someone has entered the market by 2025. Geez. Maybe the master plan will be done by then, just the plan, not the new buildings...ha.
 
jplatts
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 11:50 am

avtcle wrote:
United Airlines is ordering 50 A321XLR with orders beginning in 2024.... Opens up an interesting possibility for Cleveland, which could see some economically viable cities pairs emerge that this aircraft could operate. CLE to FRA is well within range capability of the plane, and would open up a huge UA/LH connecting hub to United's large FF base here.


UA adding CLE-BRU or CLE-LIS nonstop service are also possibilities as UA's Star Alliance and codeshare partners SN and TP have hubs at BRU and LIS. BRU and LIS are also both closer to CLE than FRA is.
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 2:54 pm

Cleveland Cliffs just acquired AK Steel which has a large operations facility in Middletown, OH, which is between Cinci and Dayton. Assuming any AK Steel former HQ jobs move to CLE, the plant operations work will continue in Middletown, so there may be some increased demand on CLE-Cincinnati---which bodes well for the Burke-Lunken Ultimate operation.
 
goCOgo
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 3:25 pm

The A321XLR is the perfect aircraft for CLE-LHR (or FRA, CDG, AMS, or DUB), especially with its ability to take pallets and containers. However, United will never offer CLE-Europe service. We are more likely to see service from the AA, EI, or even F9 orders. The UA order is meaningless for CLE.
"Why you fly is your business, how you fly is ours"
 
AaronPGH
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 3:33 pm

Agreed that all that's going to happen with those XLRs is UA expanding offerings deep into secondary and tertiary intercontinental markets from their existing hubs. I really wish LH would order some XLRs and begin doing the same expansion but towards the states. Can't imagine CLE wouldn't be at the top of that list.
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 3:39 pm

AaronPGH wrote:
Agreed that all that's going to happen with those XLRs is UA expanding offerings deep into secondary and tertiary intercontinental markets from their existing hubs. I really wish LH would order some XLRs and begin doing the same expansion but towards the states. Can't imagine CLE wouldn't be at the top of that list.


I agree that TATL service will come from either a European carrier or a domestic ULCC, the only exception being if CLE pays the price DL asks. AA and UA, under their current managements, are not realistic possibilities.

All the TATL-hungry Ohio cities are no doubt awaiting the fate of the bill that would allow the State of Ohio to pay the subsidy.
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 3:49 pm

^Is there an active bill on the floor? I hope not. Unless written VERY carefully, it will doom Cleveland as all the money would go to propping up columbus.
 
737MAX7
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:09 pm

The obsession some of you on here have for UA reminds me of a scorned lover thinking their ex will come back to them. UA isn’t adding transatlantic service. UA isn’t going to make CLE a hub again and neither will any other airline.
 
avtcle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 7:48 pm

I 1000% agree that Cleveland will NEVER again be an United hub.... However a lot can change in five years in regards to United’s route strategy and Ohio’s airport incentives. I was just putting the thought out there — not suggesting it’s something that’s going to happen. ^
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 8:16 pm

Things change for sure but to my knowledge UA doesn't fly a single TATL route out of a nonhub. Delta-- different story. AA-- different story to a lesser degree. The thread on the A321XLR order has boatloads of uses for them that don't involve Cleveland.

When CLE had a hub, UA seemed more committed to adding 6th or 7th frequencies EWR to LHR than anything in CLE.

I read local news pretty religiously don't recall any mention of a bill working its way through committee in Columbus. But entirely possible it's not hitting the newspaper yet too, especially given how thin local newspapers are getting these days.
 
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CLEguy
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 04, 2019 9:31 pm

ncflyer wrote:
I read local news pretty religiously don't recall any mention of a bill working its way through committee in Columbus. But entirely possible it's not hitting the newspaper yet too, especially given how thin local newspapers are getting these days.


I don't believe any legislation is pending, but the Ohio Aviation Association lists it as one of its public policy objectives:

https://www.ohioaviation.org/assets/doc ... 0Final.pdf
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Dec 05, 2019 12:42 am

From CLEguys link: gives me no comfort whatsoever and why would a legislator in Cinci support this? Ohio has a natural disadvantage on this issue.


4. How do we determine how to divide incentive funds among the scheduled service commercial airports (Akron, Cleveland, Columbus, Dayton, Toledo, and Youngstown)? Due to the stringent restrictions imposed by the FAA, airports cannot participate in the determination of where air service development funds would be allocated by the State. The State could develop an oversight board or engage an air service development firm to develop an overall strategy and set of investment guidelines for the allocation of grants.
 
kavok
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Dec 05, 2019 1:07 am

CLEguy wrote:
ncflyer wrote:
I read local news pretty religiously don't recall any mention of a bill working its way through committee in Columbus. But entirely possible it's not hitting the newspaper yet too, especially given how thin local newspapers are getting these days.


I don't believe any legislation is pending, but the Ohio Aviation Association lists it as one of its public policy objectives:

https://www.ohioaviation.org/assets/doc ... 0Final.pdf


So what are other states doing? Obviously if you have been on A.net long enough you have heard about Indiana (IND) and the casino money for PIT... But this document indicates that many other states are also offering incentives. One example listed is neighboring Michigan, to which in all the years I have been on here, I have never once heard of Michigan offering incentives. Assuming the document linked is accurate, what are they doing?

I guess moreso, I would like to know what other places are doing, and specifically how they are offering incentives. Again, the only two I ever hear about on here are IND and PIT. Would be interested in learning what other mechanisms are in place.
 
avtcle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 6:41 am

Put together this list per my own interest and thought I would share:

These load factors are from United's final FULL month of hub operations in Cleveland -- January of 2014

Routes with an asterisk indicate routes that are still operating today. Note that loads below 30% are EAS routes.

CLE-SAN: 86% CLE-DFW: 84%
*CLE-LAX: 89% *CLE-SFO: 92%
CLE-LAS: 91% CLE-PHX: 86%
*CLE-DEN: 87% *CLE-IAH: 77%
CLE-AUS: 71% CLE-STL: 76%
CLE-BNA: 74% *CLE-CHS: 86%
CLE-BUF: 67% CLE-SYR: 86%
CLE-BTV: 91% CLE-BFD: 35%
CLE-PVD: 83% CLE-BDL: 71%
CLE-RDU: 64% *CLE-MCO: 79%
*CLE-FLL: 84% CLE-CUN: 67%
CLE-SJU: 82% *CLE-TPA: 86%
*CLE-RSW: 91% CLE-PBI: 94%
CLE-FKL: 24% CLE-ERI: 56%
CLE-ALB: 79% CLE-DAY: 66%
CLE-BOS: 72% CLE-CLT: 86%
CLE-MIA: 85% CLE-ATL: 71%
CLE-MSY: 79% CLE-YUL: 63%
CLE-YYZ: 50% CLE-ORD: 84%
CLE-MSP: 61% CLE-CMH: 58%
*CLE-LGA: 52% *CLE-DCA: 52%
*CLE-IAD: 73% CLE-SDF: 40%
CLE-MSN: 53% CLE-PHL: 85%
CLE-PIT: 53% CLE-MKE: 76%
CLE-ROC: 78% CLE-BWI: 75%
CLE-MCI: 53% CLE-OKC: 57%
*CLE-EWR: 65% CLE-GRR: 51%
CLE-GSP: 67% CLE-RIC: 61%
CLE-FNT: 50% CLE-DUJ: 28%
CLE-PKB: 28% CLE-IND: 57%
 
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xms3200
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 6:24 pm

What is the deal with the new freq. for CLE ground on 133.60 Mhz and approach control on 126.55 Mhz. Have they switched from 121.70 for ground and 124.0 for approach. The latest Jeppesen charts do not reflect this.
 
fedex1
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 7:41 pm

I believe ( today ) AS just added a 2nd daily for IND-SEA for summer, along with the daily DL IND-SEA. I can’t see why CLE couldn’t get daily SEA on DL or even AS....
 
jplatts
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Dec 08, 2019 9:35 pm

fedex1 wrote:
I believe ( today ) AS just added a 2nd daily for IND-SEA for summer, along with the daily DL IND-SEA. I can’t see why CLE couldn’t get daily SEA on DL or even AS....


I agree that the lack of SEA-CLE nonstop service on a non-ULCC is a huge hole, and I previously mentioned that AS is more likely to add CLE-SEA nonstop service than DL is since most of DL's domestic nonstop routes out of SEA are to destinations already served by AS.

Even though AS is more likely to add CLE-SEA nonstop service than DL is, DL would have a few advantages over AS if it adds CLE-SEA nonstop service, including the following:
(a) DL already has a FF base in the CLE market that it can tap into, whereas AS currently doesn't have a FF base in the CLE market,
and
(b) DL would be able to offer 1-stop connections onto its SEA to Asia nonstop flights from CLE if it adds CLE-SEA nonstop service.
 
corn4ahead
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Dec 10, 2019 9:49 pm

xms3200 wrote:
What is the deal with the new freq. for CLE ground on 133.60 Mhz and approach control on 126.55 Mhz. Have they switched from 121.70 for ground and 124.0 for approach. The latest Jeppesen charts do not reflect this.


121.7 is OTS. It will return whenever it gets fixed. 133.6 is just the back up frequency for Ground.
 
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xms3200
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:00 am

Is it the same story with App. control on 124.0 that is now using 126.55
 
corn4ahead
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 11, 2019 4:27 am

xms3200 wrote:
Is it the same story with App. control on 124.0 that is now using 126.55


And 125.35, and 125.5...... Let's just say that not much gets done around the holidays.
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 11, 2019 5:53 pm

Nothing new in the WN summer extension for CLE. 21 weekday flights and 6 weekend only destinations.

Diff subj: It looks as if UPS is gaining on Fedex in the CLE market. Typically, excluding Christmas extras, UPS is running an MD11 to SDF and a 752 to PHL, while Fedex sends a 763 to MEM and an A306 to IND. That's pretty close to even capacity, no? It used to be tilted in Fedex's favor.
 
greenair727
Posts: 1324
Joined: Wed Jan 10, 2007 6:27 am

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 11, 2019 6:18 pm

^Are these UPS and FedEx flights daily?
 
ncflyer
Posts: 1240
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2000 7:03 pm

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Dec 11, 2019 6:27 pm

endless chatter on here about WN adding this and adding that— and nothing at all this summer.

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