CleSyrRoc
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue May 21, 2019 2:47 pm

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 23, 2019 11:12 am

Good news for CLE! Always nice to see more mainline aircraft at the gates. Based on my anecdotal experience, UA has definitely made the transition to pushing passengers through IAD if possible. I booked a trip CLE-ZRH in June and the pricing incentive to book a connection essentially anywhere but EWR was STRONG.

Ended up being booked on a 739 to IAD. Big change from a few years ago when it was all RJ's.
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 23, 2019 11:18 pm

I get public AED machines in airports and on planes, but is public bleeding a big issue as well? 100 "Stop the Bleed" kits bought--95 for CLE and 5 for BKL.

https://www.jems.com/articles/supplemen ... bleed.html
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri May 24, 2019 2:25 pm

I noticed Castle Aviation, a freight feeder, has switched from Cessna Caravans to Fairchild-Swearingen SA-227s. Specs are a little scanty on cargo versions of the new plane. Is this a step up in capacity for them?
 
chrisjake
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri May 24, 2019 3:55 pm

masseybrown wrote:
I noticed Castle Aviation, a freight feeder, has switched from Cessna Caravans to Fairchild-Swearingen SA-227s. Specs are a little scanty on cargo versions of the new plane. Is this a step up in capacity for them?


Unless something has changed recently, Castle has used a variety of Caravan's, Metroliner's, and Aerostars for awhile now. I still see their Caravans plying the NEOhio skies.
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon May 27, 2019 5:34 am

There is interesting speculation in Crain's Cleveland about the sale of the inactive half of the Ford engine works near the airport as well as the old Walton Hills stamping plant to a single buyer. The paper says it would be a "game-changer." Well, we've heard that before, but who knows? It could be.

It's supposed to happen by the end of the year. I'm wondering if the buyer might be somehow air freight or distribution related.

https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-es ... ohio-sites
 
corn4ahead
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon May 27, 2019 12:49 pm

masseybrown wrote:
There is interesting speculation in Crain's Cleveland about the sale of the inactive half of the Ford engine works near the airport as well as the old Walton Hills stamping plant to a single buyer. The paper says it would be a "game-changer." Well, we've heard that before, but who knows? It could be.

It's supposed to happen by the end of the year. I'm wondering if the buyer might be somehow air freight or distribution related.

https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-es ... ohio-sites


Can you post here? It's behind a paywall.
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon May 27, 2019 3:27 pm

3 flights on UA to LAX we hardly knew ya. Gone for July too, down to 2 most days. Probably max related like the June cancellation,given that the flights were cancelled with little lead time.
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon May 27, 2019 4:25 pm

corn4ahead wrote:
masseybrown wrote:
There is interesting speculation in Crain's Cleveland about the sale of the inactive half of the Ford engine works near the airport as well as the old Walton Hills stamping plant to a single buyer. The paper says it would be a "game-changer." Well, we've heard that before, but who knows? It could be.

It's supposed to happen by the end of the year. I'm wondering if the buyer might be somehow air freight or distribution related.

https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-es ... ohio-sites


Can you post here? It's behind a paywall.


I think that would violate copyright laws ... Trust me - I gave you the meat of the story. There is a lot of filler about how hot industrial property in NEO is at the moment as well as the history and size of the properties and who is involved (Ford, UAW, real estate people). CBRE is handling the sale; nobody is talking about who the buyer might be; and more buyers than one are possibly interested, but only one proposes to buy both pieces).

Bullard may eventually hint at more, if he knows anything, on Twitter. https://twitter.com/CrainRltyWriter/sta ... 6601196544
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Mon May 27, 2019 7:58 pm

Going by the schedule, September 3rd will be the last AA MD-80 flight at CLE, all 738s thereafter..
 
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CLEguy
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 28, 2019 3:46 pm

masseybrown wrote:
There is interesting speculation in Crain's Cleveland about the sale of the inactive half of the Ford engine works near the airport as well as the old Walton Hills stamping plant to a single buyer. The paper says it would be a "game-changer." Well, we've heard that before, but who knows? It could be.

It's supposed to happen by the end of the year. I'm wondering if the buyer might be somehow air freight or distribution related.

https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-es ... ohio-sites


I just read this article this morning and thought that this location could be a great spot for a new terminal or other such infrastructure (parking, hotel) connected via bridge over Rt. 237 for aircraft to the existing airfield. Operations at the old terminal could could continue while new construction takes place at the new site. But if a decision is immanent, then this option is seemingly off the table.
 
avtcle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 28, 2019 5:32 pm

Here’s an interesting route development that will come to pass next week —

United Airlines and Allegiant Airlines will both begin flights to Charleston, SC. They’ll join Frontier Airlines to become the 2nd and 3rd airlines to be flying between Cleveland and the small tourist city. At this point, United operating this route is just a luxury for Cleveland and not really necessary.

It’ll be interesting to see how these 3 airlines fight for the demand on this route. Frontier and Allegiant will certainly stimulate a lot of demand! It appears at this point that Frontier is the only airline that will fly the route year-round.

Also Allegiant flights for Norfolk begin next week as well!
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 28, 2019 5:54 pm

avtcle wrote:
At this point, United operating this route is just a luxury for Cleveland and not really necessary.


I think that's true of CUN and the Florida routes as well. They probably do it to give their frequent fliers some mileage burners. If, as, and when that base of business melts away, so will the routes.
 
Trk1
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 28, 2019 8:04 pm

Post 562. Please note that while cheap the non-stops stimulate demand--2 times per week service really limits options. Time shares weeks/weekend golf packages etc do not allow such limited schedules. Note that while UA non-stop is only on Saturday it is paired with 4 times daily IAD connections. This along with new service to Hilton Head and Myrtle Beach along with SAV offers a very wide range of options to the well healed travelers as opposed to bargain hunters. Note that AA and DL will also have many daily options to all the mentioned cities that dwarf the 2 times per week.

The Florida reference also may miss the point of Flordia service. Peak time from CLE is late December/early Jan and lateFeb to Mid April. UA was running as high as 7 non-stops per day on key weekends and 4 per day on weekdays. These numbers are up from past years and are expected to increase this next winter season.
 
corn4ahead
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 28, 2019 8:05 pm

CLEguy wrote:
masseybrown wrote:
There is interesting speculation in Crain's Cleveland about the sale of the inactive half of the Ford engine works near the airport as well as the old Walton Hills stamping plant to a single buyer. The paper says it would be a "game-changer." Well, we've heard that before, but who knows? It could be.

It's supposed to happen by the end of the year. I'm wondering if the buyer might be somehow air freight or distribution related.

https://www.crainscleveland.com/real-es ... ohio-sites


I just read this article this morning and thought that this location could be a great spot for a new terminal or other such infrastructure (parking, hotel) connected via bridge over Rt. 237 for aircraft to the existing airfield. Operations at the old terminal could could continue while new construction takes place at the new site. But if a decision is immanent, then this option is seemingly off the table.


It would be a game-changer but I can't see it happening.

That would really open up the door for a lot of improvements to not only the terminal/parking situation, but also the airport layout (as far as taxiways, etc).

Hopefully this new firm creating the updates materplan at least looks into the possibility.
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 28, 2019 8:46 pm

If the Crains story is true then Ford isn’t waiting around for the CLE master plan. Can’t say I blame Ford but it’s too bad. CLE airport has such a small foot print of land compared to any airport this side of LaGuardia or DCA. The ford plant could be a game changer. I think it’s gping to be ridiculously expensive for Hopkins to modernize, unlike MCI or PIT there’s not enough land to build something greenfield. I can’t see the IX center owners selling out for a reasonable price— too bad there’s plenty of land over there too.
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue May 28, 2019 8:52 pm

^I believe the IX Center is already owned by the city. Re Ford, its in Brook Park---so using the Ford site for anything airport-related is a moot point. Based on history, Brook Park would say--OK, CLE, give us $5B and we'll let you build and we'll take 1/2 of all revenue for 100 years. Dealing with Brook Park is not worth it. No partnership in 'regionalization' when it comes to that suburb.
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 29, 2019 5:44 pm

This is a slender thread to hang on ... but ... IcelandAir has not removed CLE from its route map and destination list. DFW, another discontinued city, HAS been dropped from the map/dest. list. I wonder if they are planning to try again after the Max grounding thing is over - say spring of '20. Last summer's data said IcelandAir carried good loads; and, with WOW competition gone, I'm guessing FI could improve their yields somewhat. MAybe CLE is worth a second shot.

Alternatively, it's possible they just haven't felt updating their map is a priority. (Occam's razor says go with this.)
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 29, 2019 5:55 pm

I think your first case makes more sense. CLE did well for FI and they would do even better without WW in the picture, and with no new competing carriers, no reason to not operate CLE-KEF. It was on the books for 2019---only at the last minute did they drop per the 737max8 issues. So if nothing else changes and the Max's are back, I'd expect CLE to be back as well. Your statement about DTW supports this thinking as well.
 
CleSyrRoc
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 29, 2019 7:44 pm

Slightly different topic, but does anyone have a map of the new airfield layout once this summer's construction on 6L-24R and associated taxiways is completed? Interested to see the changes that will be taking place.
 
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CLEguy
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 29, 2019 10:26 pm

Two UA 777 diversions at CLE now...PUJ-CLE and PEK-CLE, due to poor weather in EWR. Also a 757 from LAX and a 737-900 from LAS.
 
corn4ahead
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 29, 2019 10:35 pm

CLEguy wrote:
Two UA 777 diversions at CLE now...PUJ-CLE and PEK-CLE, due to poor weather in EWR. Also a 757 from LAX and a 737-900 from LAS.


Don't mean to be that guy but, the first one, UA88, came from PEK. The second one, UA87, came from PVG.
 
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CLEguy
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed May 29, 2019 11:04 pm

corn4ahead wrote:
CLEguy wrote:
Two UA 777 diversions at CLE now...PUJ-CLE and PEK-CLE, due to poor weather in EWR. Also a 757 from LAX and a 737-900 from LAS.


Don't mean to be that guy but, the first one, UA88, came from PEK. The second one, UA87, came from PVG.


That's what I meant, but didn't catch my error in time to edit! :)
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 1:06 am

Just curious, does the 3-hr rule apply to diversions that land at an airport?

UA87 arrived at 623pm and departed 836pm
UA88 arrived at 515pm and departed 805pm---almost three hours.

Did either plane disembark pax? If so, I assume they'd have to clear INS at CLE. If UA88 wasn't set to depart until 816pm or later, would UA be forced to deplane everyone?
 
csizmpl
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 1:42 am

No pax deplaned on the diversions. They were all parked within Pad-1 and Pad-3 (de-icing pads and near the new tower)
 
klm617
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 1:52 am

masseybrown wrote:
This is a slender thread to hang on ... but ... IcelandAir has not removed CLE from its route map and destination list. DFW, another discontinued city, HAS been dropped from the map/dest. list. I wonder if they are planning to try again after the Max grounding thing is over - say spring of '20. Last summer's data said IcelandAir carried good loads; and, with WOW competition gone, I'm guessing FI could improve their yields somewhat. MAybe CLE is worth a second shot.

Alternatively, it's possible they just haven't felt updating their map is a priority. (Occam's razor says go with this.)


The only thing you're missing though is why did FI keep MCI when that was a MAX8 route as well.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
klm617
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 1:54 am

greenair727 wrote:
I think your first case makes more sense. CLE did well for FI and they would do even better without WW in the picture, and with no new competing carriers, no reason to not operate CLE-KEF. It was on the books for 2019---only at the last minute did they drop per the 737max8 issues. So if nothing else changes and the Max's are back, I'd expect CLE to be back as well. Your statement about DTW supports this thinking as well.



But FI knew WW was out of the picture when they canceled CLE so they would have had bookings into summer 2019 without WW as a factor.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
Gulfstream500
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 2:02 am

klm617 wrote:
greenair727 wrote:
I think your first case makes more sense. CLE did well for FI and they would do even better without WW in the picture, and with no new competing carriers, no reason to not operate CLE-KEF. It was on the books for 2019---only at the last minute did they drop per the 737max8 issues. So if nothing else changes and the Max's are back, I'd expect CLE to be back as well. Your statement about DTW supports this thinking as well.



But FI knew WW was out of the picture when they canceled CLE so they would have had bookings into summer 2019 without WW as a factor.


They also now know that they can make just a decent amount of money codesharing with JetBlue on CLE-BOS-KEF (with their already-booked passengers), causing it to be the first to the chopping block for MAX cuts.
What's the deal with airplane food?

Frontier Airlines: Spirit of the west
 
joeman
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 3:07 am

klm617 wrote:
masseybrown wrote:
This is a slender thread to hang on ... but ... IcelandAir has not removed CLE from its route map and destination list. DFW, another discontinued city, HAS been dropped from the map/dest. list. I wonder if they are planning to try again after the Max grounding thing is over - say spring of '20. Last summer's data said IcelandAir carried good loads; and, with WOW competition gone, I'm guessing FI could improve their yields somewhat. MAybe CLE is worth a second shot.

Alternatively, it's possible they just haven't felt updating their map is a priority. (Occam's razor says go with this.)


The only thing you're missing though is why did FI keep MCI when that was a MAX8 route as well.

I thought it was 3x wkly 757 like shown in the FI announcement in this link: https://www.icelandair.com/blog/inaugur ... nsas-city/
As opposed to 9x wkly CLE flights between WW 321 and FI 737MAX
 
fun2fly
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 10:19 am

greenair727 wrote:
Just curious, does the 3-hr rule apply to diversions that land at an airport?

UA87 arrived at 623pm and departed 836pm
UA88 arrived at 515pm and departed 805pm---almost three hours.

Did either plane disembark pax? If so, I assume they'd have to clear INS at CLE. If UA88 wasn't set to depart until 816pm or later, would UA be forced to deplane everyone?


15hrs from PVG and then a 4 hour min total time diversion to CLE...not your lucky day at all. I get why they didn't deplane due to FIS/Baggage issues, but that's a real bummer for the traveler. Tough week or so in aviation with the weather, delays and diversions.
 
lawair
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 10:42 am

greenair727 wrote:
Just curious, does the 3-hr rule apply to diversions that land at an airport?

UA87 arrived at 623pm and departed 836pm
UA88 arrived at 515pm and departed 805pm---almost three hours.

Did either plane disembark pax? If so, I assume they'd have to clear INS at CLE. If UA88 wasn't set to depart until 816pm or later, would UA be forced to deplane everyone?


Yes the rule applies to diversions. For international flights the time limit is four hours, and absent some exception to the rule, they would have to provide an opportunity to deplane within that time frame.
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 2:49 pm

There's now a CLE-FLL line on WN's route map, but I can't find any flights in the schedule extension. Maybe it's not all loaded yet.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 2:59 pm

masseybrown wrote:
There's now a CLE-FLL line on WN's route map, but I can't find any flights in the schedule extension. Maybe it's not all loaded yet.


Its in there check the last few Saturdays in the schedule, 5am departure CLE-FLL
Delta Diamond Medallion and AAdvantage Gold for 2019
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 3:14 pm

Let's see ... 5AM departure, get to the airport by 4AM, leave home by 3AM, get the kids up at 2:30AM, get self up by 2AM ... It better be cheap.
 
avtcle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 3:22 pm

I'll try to keep doing this from month to month as they come out, but here are the load factors from Cleveland for January 2019

January 2019: Keep in mind that January is typically the slowest month of the year -- most loads are much lower than average with the exception of the snowbird routes to Florida.

Air Canada
CLE-YYZ: 52%

American Airlines
CLE-LGA: 47%
CLE-JFK: 56%
CLE-DFW: 72%
CLE-MIA: 91%
CLE-CLT: 76%
CLE-ORD: 67%
CLE-DCA: 56%

Delta Airlines
CLE-ATL: 80%
CLE-DTW: 56%
CLE-MSP: 81%
CLE-RDU: 73%
CLE-BDL: 48%
CLE-SLC: 92%
CLE-LGA: 39%
CLE-JFK: 54%

United Airlines
CLE-BOS: 77%
CLE-LGA: 61%
CLE-EWR: 81%
CLE-DCA: 57%
CLE-IAD: 87%
CLE-RSW: 80%
CLE-CUN: 75%
CLE-DEN: 78%
CLE-ORD: 76%
CLE-IAH: 86%
CLE-LAX: 83%
CLE-MCO: 90%
CLE-SFO: 81%
CLE-FLL: 82%

Frontier Airlines
CLE-DEN: 87%
CLE-RSW: 88%
CLE-TPA: 94%
CLE-CUN: 81%
CLE-SRQ: 84%
CLE-PBI: 74%
CLE-PUJ: 72%
CLE-MCO: 88%
CLE-PHX: 82%
CLE-LAS: 84%

Allegiant Airlines
CLE-PGD: 86%
CLE-SAV: 70%
CLE-PIE: 78%

Spirit Airlines:
CLE-LAX: 73%
CLE-TPA: 67%
CLE-MCO: 82%
CLE-RSW: 73%
CLE-FLL: 80%
CLE-ATL: 75%
CLE-MSY: 63%
CLE-LAS: 86%

Southwest Airlines
CLE-MKE: 45%
CLE-ATL: 76%
CLE-RSW: 90%
CLE-DEN: 88%
CLE-MCO: 90%
CLE-BWI: 68%
CLE-MDW: 70%
CLE-LAS: 85%
CLE-PHX: 86%
CLE-BNA: 81%
CLE-STL: 78%

Jetblue Airways
CLE-BOS: 76%
CLE-FLL: 80%
 
masseybrown
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 3:24 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
masseybrown wrote:
There's now a CLE-FLL line on WN's route map, but I can't find any flights in the schedule extension. Maybe it's not all loaded yet.


Its in there check the last few Saturdays in the schedule, 5am departure CLE-FLL


Ok, I see it. 5:10AM departure for $161 lowest fare. I guess that's cheper than driving.

New subj: Heard a rumor about the Ford plant that should give us lots to talk about if it's true. :stirthepot:
 
CleSyrRoc
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 3:37 pm

What is with WN starting these once per week weekend routes recently? Can think of DAL off the top of my head as well. Trying to improve aircraft utilization? This puts four carriers on the CLE-FLL route; WN, UA, B6, and NK.
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 5:10 pm

avtcle wrote:
I'll try to keep doing this from month to month as they come out, but here are the load factors from Cleveland for January 2019

January 2019: Keep in mind that January is typically the slowest month of the year -- most loads are much lower than average with the exception of the snowbird routes to Florida.

Air Canada
CLE-YYZ: 52%


Thanks for this list. Surprisingly some numbers lower than expected, even if it is January. AC to YYZ is particularly low. What's the source of the data?
 
greenair727
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 5:13 pm

masseybrown wrote:
New subj: Heard a rumor about the Ford plant that should give us lots to talk about if it's true. :stirthepot:


Massey! You can't tease us like that. Please share the rumor. That's what a rumor is, by definition, "a currently circulating story or report of uncertain or doubtful truth.", so it must be shared--and there is no obligation for accuracy. I am intrigued if there is a airport connection as you are suggesting.
 
fun2fly
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 5:24 pm

greenair727 wrote:
masseybrown wrote:
New subj: Heard a rumor about the Ford plant that should give us lots to talk about if it's true. :stirthepot:


Massey! You can't tease us like that. Please share the rumor. That's what a rumor is, by definition, "a currently circulating story or report of uncertain or doubtful truth.", so it must be shared--and there is no obligation for accuracy. I am intrigued if there is a airport connection as you are suggesting.


Well, the Amazon hub is going to CVG so it's not them. For once, let's hope the CLE rumor is 1) good for CLE and 2) comes to fruition.

I was thinking about the Ford land on the East Side (Walton Hills) and compared it to the Chrysler Twinsburg plant that was pretty well re-developed, despite not being in as good of a location. CLE is in desperate need of large WH/Manufacturing space. If it's not for the airport, let's at least hope it's for some good redevelopment.
Last edited by fun2fly on Thu May 30, 2019 5:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
ncflyer
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 5:31 pm

Wow I know it’s january but some of those loads are miserable— LGA and DCA and JFK on all airlines. MKE on Southwest. Not sure why CLE has so many seats to those cities, at least in the winter.

Lots of threads on here post load factors for various airports I never remember seeing something so low as 45% for MKE or 50s for Lga and dca. I’m even surprised B6 has 80% to FLL during peak season, yet the flight survives even though it got cut in PIT and DTW.

Other than LAS, F9 has higher load factors than NK on overlapping markets for whatever reason.
 
avtcle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 5:44 pm

greenair727 wrote:
avtcle wrote:
I'll try to keep doing this from month to month as they come out, but here are the load factors from Cleveland for January 2019

January 2019: Keep in mind that January is typically the slowest month of the year -- most loads are much lower than average with the exception of the snowbird routes to Florida.

Air Canada
CLE-YYZ: 52%


Thanks for this list. Surprisingly some numbers lower than expected, even if it is January. AC to YYZ is particularly low. What's the source of the data?


I’ll post the loads form December just so you all can compare how drastically different January is compared to the rest of the year. This data is from Aviation Database Traffic Query, but I also check the FAA stats webpage, whatever releases first.
 
fun2fly
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 6:08 pm

Delta Airlines
CLE-ATL: 80%
CLE-DTW: 56%
CLE-MSP: 81%
CLE-RDU: 73%
CLE-BDL: 48%
CLE-SLC: 92%
CLE-LGA: 39%
CLE-JFK: 54%

Even with 92% LF, DL cut back SLC? Seems odd especially with BDL at 48% holding firm. On LGA, they may have better planes than UA, but at half empty, it seems like the wrong size plane or too much frequency.
 
avtcle
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Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 6:17 pm

avtcle wrote:
I'll try to keep doing this from month to month as they come out, but here are the load factors from Cleveland for January 2019

January 2019: Keep in mind that January is typically the slowest month of the year -- most loads are much lower than average with the exception of the snowbird routes to Florida.

Air Canada
CLE-YYZ: 52%

American Airlines
CLE-LGA: 47%
CLE-JFK: 56%
CLE-DFW: 72%
CLE-MIA: 91%
CLE-CLT: 76%
CLE-ORD: 67%
CLE-DCA: 56%

Delta Airlines
CLE-ATL: 80%
CLE-DTW: 56%
CLE-MSP: 81%
CLE-RDU: 73%
CLE-BDL: 48%
CLE-SLC: 92%
CLE-LGA: 39%
CLE-JFK: 54%

United Airlines
CLE-BOS: 77%
CLE-LGA: 61%
CLE-EWR: 81%
CLE-DCA: 57%
CLE-IAD: 87%
CLE-RSW: 80%
CLE-CUN: 75%
CLE-DEN: 78%
CLE-ORD: 76%
CLE-IAH: 84%
CLE-LAX: 83%
CLE-MCO: 90%
CLE-SFO: 81%
CLE-FLL: 82%

Frontier Airlines
CLE-DEN: 87%
CLE-RSW: 88%
CLE-SAN: 85%
CLE-TPA: 94%
CLE-CUN: 81%
CLE-SRQ: 84%
CLE-PBI: 74%
CLE-PUJ: 72%
CLE-MCO: 92%
CLE-PHX: 82%
CLE-LAS: 84%

Allegiant Airlines
CLE-PGD: 82%
CLE-SAV: 73%
CLE-PIE: 76%

Spirit Airlines:
CLE-LAX: 73%
CLE-TPA: 67%
CLE-MCO: 82%
CLE-RSW: 73%
CLE-FLL: 80%
CLE-ATL: 75%
CLE-MSY: 63%
CLE-LAS: 86%

Southwest Airlines
CLE-MKE: 45%
CLE-ATL: 76%
CLE-DEN: 88%
CLE-MCO: 88%
CLE-BWI: 68%
CLE-MDW: 70%
CLE-LAS: 85%
CLE-PHX: 86%
CLE-BNA: 81%
CLE-STL: 78%

Jetblue Airways
CLE-BOS: 76%
CLE-FLL: 80%


Here are the loads from December 2018 -- Note the drastic differences on the loads for key business markets like DCA, LGA, MKE, JFK in particular

Air Canada
CLE-YYZ: 64%

American Airlines
CLE-LGA: 57%
CLE-JFK: 71%
CLE-DFW: 80%
CLE-MIA: 94%
CLE-CLT: 86%
CLE-ORD: 76%
CLE-DCA: 61%

Delta Airlines
CLE-ATL: 84%
CLE-DTW: 56%
CLE-MSP: 81%
CLE-RDU: 51%
CLE-BDL: 58%
CLE-SLC: 85%
CLE-LGA: 76%
CLE-JFK: 65%

United Airlines
CLE-BOS: 80%
CLE-LGA: 70%
CLE-EWR: 81%
CLE-DCA: 67%
CLE-IAD: 89%
CLE-RSW: 94%
CLE-CUN: 79%
CLE-DEN: 85%
CLE-ORD: 83%
CLE-IAH: 86%
CLE-LAX: 88%
CLE-MCO: 92%
CLE-SFO: 82%
CLE-FLL: 93%

Frontier Airlines
CLE-DEN: 98%
CLE-RSW: 88%
CLE-SAN: 81%
CLE-TPA: 82%
CLE-CUN: 84%
CLE-SRQ: 86%
CLE-PBI: 75%
CLE-MCO: 88%
CLE-PHX: 80%
CLE-LAS: 87%

Allegiant Airlines
CLE-PGD: 86%
CLE-SAV: 70%
CLE-PIE: 82%

Spirit Airlines:
CLE-LAX: 87%
CLE-TPA: 85%
CLE-MCO: 99% (WOW!)
CLE-RSW: 86%
CLE-FLL: 94%
CLE-ATL: 91%
CLE-MSY: 80%
CLE-LAS: 88%

Southwest Airlines
CLE-MKE: 60%
CLE-ATL: 83%
CLE-RSW: 90%
CLE-DEN: 92%
CLE-MCO: 90%
CLE-BWI: 80%
CLE-MDW: 75%
CLE-LAS: 86%
CLE-PHX: 80%
CLE-BNA: 87%
CLE-STL: 82%

Jetblue Airways
CLE-BOS: 80%
CLE-FLL: 92%
 
masseybrown
Posts: 5331
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 6:29 pm

greenair727 wrote:
Massey! You can't tease us like that. Please share the rumor.


Sorry, I probably shouldn't have said anything. If my rumor comes true it won't generate anything like a new hub, but it would probably generate one very nice new route.

Back to CLE-FLL: WN has added four flights on the four Saturdays that bracket Thanksgiving and Christmas. Maybe it will come back for Presidents Day - Easter
Last edited by masseybrown on Thu May 30, 2019 6:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
joeman
Posts: 805
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:55 am

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 6:41 pm

greenair727 wrote:

Thanks for this list. Surprisingly some numbers lower than expected, even if it is January. AC to YYZ is particularly low. What's the source of the data?


The outrageous fares AC charges on CLE-YYZ maybe compensates their bank account but turns off potential customers, lightens load weight, and further reduces operating costs
 
joeman
Posts: 805
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:55 am

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 7:00 pm

masseybrown wrote:
greenair727 wrote:
Massey! You can't tease us like that. Please share the rumor.


Sorry, I probably shouldn't have said anything. If my rumor comes true it won't generate anything like a new hub, but it would probably generate one very nice new route.


That would seem to indicate that CLE is by definition not automatically out of the competition as so widely and ignorantly believed.
 
User avatar
CLEguy
Posts: 228
Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2016 10:49 pm

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 7:34 pm

joeman wrote:
masseybrown wrote:
greenair727 wrote:
Massey! You can't tease us like that. Please share the rumor.


Sorry, I probably shouldn't have said anything. If my rumor comes true it won't generate anything like a new hub, but it would probably generate one very nice new route.


That would seem to indicate that CLE is by definition not automatically out of the competition as so widely and ignorantly believed.


Out of what "competition?" I'm obviously missing something here.
 
avtcle
Posts: 56
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:21 am

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 7:38 pm

UA804 Heavy NRT-IAD diverted to CLE. Arrival in 5-6 minutes.
 
joeman
Posts: 805
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:55 am

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 7:56 pm

CLEguy wrote:
joeman wrote:
masseybrown wrote:

Sorry, I probably shouldn't have said anything. If my rumor comes true it won't generate anything like a new hub, but it would probably generate one very nice new route.


That would seem to indicate that CLE is by definition not automatically out of the competition as so widely and ignorantly believed.


Out of what "competition?" I'm obviously missing something here.

Relax...all I meant was competition with other cities for any expanded or relocated business
Last edited by joeman on Thu May 30, 2019 7:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
joeman
Posts: 805
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:55 am

Re: Cleveland Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu May 30, 2019 7:57 pm

filler....a double do

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