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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 16, 2019 2:49 pm

Somoa Airways 737MAX9 DQ-TFL doing a touch and go at PAE (11 Mar)

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 11072?s=20
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 16, 2019 2:50 pm

SpiceJet 737MAX8 VT-MXL doing a low approach and touch and go at PAE (11 Mar)

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 92897?s=20
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 16, 2019 2:59 pm

Icelandair latest 737MAX9 on first flight from RNT to BFI via PAE (12 Mar 19)

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 91712?s=20
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WoodysAeroimag
Posts: 252
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sun Mar 17, 2019 4:34 pm

5728 42556 N8703J 737-8 Southwest Airlines - Test Flight (16MAR19)
Image5728 42556 N8703J 737-8 Southwest Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7318 61853 B-207Q 737-8 Lucky Air - Engines Installed
Image7318 61853 B-207Q 737-8 Lucky Air by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7346 61142 B-208J 737-8 Shenzhen Airlines - Test Flight (16MAR19)
Image7346 61142 B-208J 737-8 Shenzhen Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7463 43452 N27515 737-9 United Airlines - First Flight (16MAR19)
Image7463 43452 N27515 737-9 United Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
WoodysAeroimag
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Mar 20, 2019 3:49 am

Air Italy MAX's in Long Term Storage at Paine Field
7345 64609 N982BA 737-8 Air Italy
7325 64608 N981BA 737-8 Air Italy
ImageAir Italy MAX's in Storage by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
WoodysAeroimag
Posts: 252
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Mar 20, 2019 3:54 am

7376 44865 VT-JXJ 737-8 Jet Airways - Engines Installed
Image7376 44865 VT-JXJ 737-8 Jet Airways by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7415 63277 B-208F 737-8 China Southern - Engines Installed
Image7415 63277 B-208F 737-8 China Southern by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7509 63436 HL8348 737-8 Korean Air - In Final Assembly
Image7509 63436 HL8348 737-8 Korean Air by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7514 737-8 Corendon Airlines
Image7514 737-8 Corendon Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7516 737-8 LOT Polish Airlines
Image7516 737-8 LOT Polish Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

LN #2 of the final assembly. All MAX's and the 3rd line to the right only has 3 NG's on it. Line #1 is all MAX's also.
ImageFinal Assembly by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
WoodysAeroimag
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:32 pm

6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines - RE-Work has begun on the 2nd MAX7 test frame.
Image6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7376 44865 VT-JXJ 737-8 Jet Airways - Being prepped for ferry flight to long term storage.
Image7376 44865 VT-JXJ 737-8 Jet Airways by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7396 44866 VT-JXK 737-8 Jet Airways - Engines Installed
Image7396 44866 VT-JXK 737-8 Jet Airways by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7426 61636 B-208W 737-8 Shanghai Airlines - Engines Installed
Image7426 61636 B-208W 737-8 Shanghai Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7460 60009 CN-MAZ 737-8 Royal Air Maroc - Painted
Image7460 60009 CN-MAZ 737-8 Royal Air Maroc by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7489 64084 N788BJ 737-8 Boeing Business Jets
Image7489 64084 N788BJ 737-8 Boeing Business Jets by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7493 61143 737-8 Shenzhen Airlines
Image7493 61143 737-8 Shenzhen Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7501 44302 EC-NBL 737-8 Air Europa
Image7501 44302 EC-NBL 737-8 Air Europa by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7504 61200 TC-SOI 737-8 SunExpress
Image7504 61200 TC-SOI 737-8 SunExpress by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7518 737-8 UTair
Image7518 737-8 UTair by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

And the following air frames have been flown to Everett for storage over the past few days.

7263 61374 B-206L 737-8 9Air
7346 61142 B-208J 737-8 Shenzhen Airlines
7351 63276 B-208E 737-8 China Southern
7420 60434 ZS-ZCB 737-8 Comair Limited
7424 60223 VT-MXL 737-8 SpiceJet
7425 44568 TF-ICB 737-9 IcelandAir
7429 60134 OK-SWJ 737-8 Smartwings
7436 44251 9V-MBG 737-8 Silk Air
7438 63358 A4O-MF 737-8 Oman Air
7450 43917 UR-MXA 737-8 Ukraine International Airlines

See https://twitter.com/JenSchuld's twitter feed for pictures as she caught them arriving.
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 23, 2019 12:40 am

Boeing is gonna need the MAX back in the air ASAP. Lots of aircraft incoming.
 
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:17 pm

SpiceJet 737MAX8 VT-MXL and 9 Air B-206L arriving at PAE for parking (21 Mar)

Image

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 62336?s=20
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:26 pm

Oman Air 737MAX8 A4O-MF and Smartwings 737MAX8 OK-SWJ arrive at PAE from BFI for parking (22 Mar)

Image

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 27936?s=20
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:34 pm

SilkAir 737MAX8 9V-MBG and China Southern 737MAX8 B-208E arrive at PAE from BFI for parking (22 Mar)

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 60480?s=20

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 45536?s=20
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WoodysAeroimag
Posts: 252
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 23, 2019 10:59 pm

6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines - Winglets removed
Image6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7371 63284 B-209A 737-8 China Southern - Engines installed
Image7371 63284 B-209A 737-8 China Southern by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7376 44865 VT-JXJ 737-8 Jet Airways - Compass Rose visit today
Image7376 44865 VT-JXJ 737-8 Jet Airways by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7506 737-8 Air China - rolled out
Image7506 737-8 Air China by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
WoodysAeroimag
Posts: 252
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Tue Mar 26, 2019 1:31 am

7273 60712 B-207R 737-8 Air Changan - Engines Installed
Image7273 60712 B-207R 737-8 Air Changan by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7376 44865 VT-JXJ 737-8 Jet Airways - First Flight
Image7376 44865 VT-JXJ 737-8 Jet Airways by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7455 42586 N7203U 737-7 Southwest Airlines
Image7455 42586 N7203U 737-7 Southwest Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7479 44359 TF-ICC 737-9 IcelandAir - Painted
Image7479 44359 TF-ICC 737-9 IcelandAir by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7488 44304 737-8 NordStar Airlines
Image7488 44304 737-8 NordStar Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7503 737-9 Corendon Airlines
Image7503 737-9 Corendon Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
WoodysAeroimag
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Mar 30, 2019 4:07 am

6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines - Rudder removed
Image6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7408 63287 B-209C 737-8 China Southern - Engines Installed
Image7408 63287 B-209C 737-8 China Southern by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7440 61637 737-8 Shanghai Airlines - Engines Installed
Image7440 61637 737-8 Shanghai Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7443 64610 737-8 Air Italy - Engines Installed
Image7443 64610 737-8 Air Italy by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7448 HP-9907CMP 737-9 Copa Airlines - First Flight
Image7448 HP-9907CMP 737-9 Copa Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7451 62182 737-8 Hainan Airlines - Painted
Image7451 62182 737-8 Hainan Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7454 44650 D-AMAA 737-8 TUIfly - First Flight
Image7454 44650 D-AMAA 737-8 TUIfly by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7483 43301 737-8 Sunwing - Engines Installed
Image7483 43301 737-8 Sunwing by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7503 737-9 Corendon Airlines
Image7503 737-9 Corendon Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7508 61448 737-8 Shandong Airlines
Image7508 61448 737-8 Shandong Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7511 737-8 China Southern
Image7511 737-8 China Southern by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
WoodysAeroimag
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sun Mar 31, 2019 4:49 am

7418 737-9 SCAT Airlines
Image7418 737-9 SCAT Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7466 737-8 Jet Airways
Image7466 737-8 Jet Airways by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7478 61236 C-GEKZ 737-8 Air Canada
Image7478 61236 C-GEKZ 737-8 Air Canada by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7484 64967 D-ASMC 737-9 SunExpress - Painted
Image7484 64967 D-ASMC 737-9 SunExpress by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7489 64084 N788BJ 737-8 Boeing Business Jets
Image7489 64084 N788BJ 737-8 Boeing Business Jets by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7491 62869 EI-RZA 737-8 Neos
Image7491 62869 EI-RZA 737-8 Neos by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7501 44302 EC-NBL 737-8 Air Europa
Image7501 44302 EC-NBL 737-8 Air Europa by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 01, 2019 6:46 am

The first 737MAX10 fuselage has arrived in the Seattle area for final assembly. LN7644 is the first production 737MAX10 and will be operated by United Airlines

Image

https://twitter.com/DWHonan/status/1112 ... 24928?s=20

Image

https://twitter.com/DWHonan/status/1112 ... 76865?s=20
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keesje
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:55 am

qf789 wrote:
The first 737MAX10 fuselage has arrived in the Seattle area for final assembly. LN7644 is the first production 737MAX10 and will be operated by United Airlines

Image

https://twitter.com/DWHonan/status/1112 ... 24928?s=20

Image

https://twitter.com/DWHonan/status/1112 ... 76865?s=20


The first real -10 picture, nice!
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
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SamYeager2016
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 01, 2019 11:54 am

WoodysAeroimag wrote:
6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines - Rudder removed

Is this because a fault was identified with it?
 
jeffrey0032j
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 01, 2019 1:44 pm

SamYeager2016 wrote:
WoodysAeroimag wrote:
6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines - Rudder removed

Is this because a fault was identified with it?

No, new or repainted rudders in WN's livery will be installed as part of test frame change incorporation/rework to bring it up to production standard.
 
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7BOEING7
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:31 pm

jeffrey0032j wrote:
SamYeager2016 wrote:
WoodysAeroimag wrote:
6798 42569 N7202U 737-7 Southwest Airlines - Rudder removed

Is this because a fault was identified with it?

No, new or repainted rudders in WN's livery will be installed as part of test frame change incorporation/rework to bring it up to production standard.


Anytime a rudder needs to be repainted, it needs to be rebalanced which can’t be accomplished on the airplane — you can’t paint a rudder while installed.
 
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 03, 2019 7:55 pm

Forum Moderator
 
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 03, 2019 7:57 pm

Lucky Air 737MAX8 B-207Q arriving at PAE for storage

Image

https://twitter.com/royalscottking/stat ... 67808?s=20
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Someone83
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:25 pm

Have Boeing stored MAXes other places than Renton and Everett?
Last edited by Someone83 on Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:35 pm

Hainan Airlines 737MAX8 B-209L arriving at PAE (1 Apr)

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 86560?s=20
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:43 pm

An all white Jet Airways 737MAX8 VT-JXJ arrives at PAE from BFI

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 79488?s=20
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:44 pm

Air Changan 737MAX8 arriving at PAE from BFI, will position later to VCV for storage

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 47744?s=20
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smartplane
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Wed Apr 03, 2019 8:53 pm

What are 737 non-deliveries doing to Boeing's cash? Undelivered 737's must be consuming at least USD500m a week ($2b a month) plus interest, at a time when 748, 767 and 777 deliveries are slow. Boeing, rather than customers and their financiers, presumably making the 3rd to last engine milestone payment, to enable test and storage flights.

At times like this high production rates and share buybacks don't look so good. Thank goodness for another strong product line.
 
WoodysAeroimag
Posts: 252
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 04, 2019 2:58 am

Someone83 wrote:
Have Boeing stored MAXes other places than Renton and Everett?


Currently only being stored at Paine Field and Boeing Field.

16 at PAE
8 at BFI

The rest are either being painted or finishing pre-delivery flight testing before being placed into storage.
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
WoodysAeroimag
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 04, 2019 3:00 am

qf789 wrote:
Air Changan 737MAX8 arriving at PAE from BFI, will position later to VCV for storage

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 47744?s=20


Heading to VCV for paint only. Will be re-positioned back to PAE or BFI for storage.
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
WoodysAeroimag
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 04, 2019 3:05 am

7481 44472 N316SE 737-8 American Airlines - Engines Installed
Image7481 44472 N316SE 737-8 American Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7495 43993 PR-XMH 737-8 Gol Transportes Aéreos
Image7495 43993 PR-XMH 737-8 Gol Transportes Aéreos by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7498 43454 N37516 737-9 United Airlines
Image7498 43454 N37516 737-9 United Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7500 60059 TC-LCR 737-8 Turkish Airlines
Image7500 60059 TC-LCR 737-8 Turkish Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7505 61234 C-GELJ 737-8 Air Canada
Image7505 61234 C-GELJ 737-8 Air Canada by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7509 63436 HL8348 737-8 Korean Air
Image7509 63436 HL8348 737-8 Korean Air by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr

7510 42588 N7205U 737-7 Southwest Airlines
Image7510 42588 N7205U 737-7 Southwest Airlines by 737 MAX Production, on Flickr
Tracking MAX Production https://737-max.blogspot.com/
 
travaz
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 04, 2019 3:30 am

I would assume that all of the aircraft in storage would have to undergo the software upgrade. Anyone know how much time that entails for each aircraft?
 
Oykie
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Thu Apr 04, 2019 5:01 am

travaz wrote:
I would assume that all of the aircraft in storage would have to undergo the software upgrade. Anyone know how much time that entails for each aircraft?


The announced fix is said to take an hour or aircraft.
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travaz
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2001 1:03 am

Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Fri Apr 05, 2019 1:19 am

Oykie wrote:
travaz wrote:
I would assume that all of the aircraft in storage would have to undergo the software upgrade. Anyone know how much time that entails for each aircraft?


The announced fix is said to take an hour or aircraft.

Thanks For the info.

That's the best news I have heard about this whole affair. When they get the go ahead they should be able to upgrade pretty quickly.
 
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qf789
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Fri Apr 05, 2019 9:10 am

Oman Air 737MAX8 A4O-MG and Comair 737MAX8 ZS-ZCB ferried to PAE for storage

Image

Image

https://twitter.com/JenSchuld/status/11 ... 50400?s=20
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mjoelnir
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Fri Apr 05, 2019 11:13 am

travaz wrote:
Oykie wrote:
travaz wrote:
I would assume that all of the aircraft in storage would have to undergo the software upgrade. Anyone know how much time that entails for each aircraft?


The announced fix is said to take an hour or aircraft.

Thanks For the info.

That's the best news I have heard about this whole affair. When they get the go ahead they should be able to upgrade pretty quickly.


That is if the regulators agree that the software upgrade is all that is needed.
 
art
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Fri Apr 05, 2019 11:36 am

travaz wrote:
Oykie wrote:
travaz wrote:
I would assume that all of the aircraft in storage would have to undergo the software upgrade. Anyone know how much time that entails for each aircraft?


The announced fix is said to take an hour or aircraft.

Thanks For the info.

That's the best news I have heard about this whole affair. When they get the go ahead they should be able to upgrade pretty quickly.


I don't think it matters too much how long the software download takes. To me what does matter is when (or conceivably whether) the software patch is sanctioned by FAA. Even if FAA approves it I think there is a big question mark over whether EASA and other agencies will rubber stamp the FAA decision. You might see the MAX return to service in the USA in a month or two but it may be that that is the only place it is allowed to fly in the near future.

If that happens, perhaps Boeing will try to bring forward deliveries to US customers to mitigate stacking MAX's high at their own facilities and in the desert.
 
astuteman
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 5:26 am

I looked through the thread but could not see this. Apologies if I missed it.
Boeing is cutting 737 production from 52 per month to 42 per month

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47834556

Boeing is temporarily cutting production of its best-selling 737 airliner in the continuing fall-out from crashes in Ethiopia and Indonesia.
Production will drop from 52 planes a month to 42 from mid-April, Boeing has said in a statement.
The decision is a response to a halt in deliveries of the 737 Max - the model involved in the two accidents.


Rgds
 
Armaghman
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 6:11 am

I wonder if it anyone can tell if any commercial tactics as regards the cuts.

Makes sense to cut from airlines where reappraisal will be longer.

Will Boeing inlmvolve customers in the descipn?
 
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Stitch
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 4:14 pm

Armaghman wrote:
I wonder if it anyone can tell if any commercial tactics as regards the cuts.


No information about Boeing instructing suppliers to reduce their ship-sets from the current 52 per month, so this may be to just reduce the number of frames clogging up RNT, PAE and other dispersion sites during the grounding period.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 4:52 pm

art wrote:
travaz wrote:
Oykie wrote:

The announced fix is said to take an hour or aircraft.

Thanks For the info.

That's the best news I have heard about this whole affair. When they get the go ahead they should be able to upgrade pretty quickly.


I don't think it matters too much how long the software download takes. To me what does matter is when (or conceivably whether) the software patch is sanctioned by FAA. Even if FAA approves it I think there is a big question mark over whether EASA and other agencies will rubber stamp the FAA decision. You might see the MAX return to service in the USA in a month or two but it may be that that is the only place it is allowed to fly in the near future.

If that happens, perhaps Boeing will try to bring forward deliveries to US customers to mitigate stacking MAX's high at their own facilities and in the desert.

You are setting a dangerous precident. At that point the FAA can scrutinize every EASA decision, Russian, or Chinese. I'm not saying mistakes weren't made. You are just opening a political can of worms. At this stage EASA is engaged and making parallel decisions just as the FAA had information during NEO testing. But at this point EASA will be fully involved.

It is fine if someone doesn't trust the FAA. Politically, it means the FAA doesn't have to trust them.

Overall, US certification has been outstanding. It has made aviation the safest way to travel. In this black and white generation, one error isn't all. EASA didn't fully test A320 avionics at EIS. While the A350 went smooth, I'm privy to A380 decisions that I question.

By all means look at the data. The fix will have to be bullet proof. Expect whatever delays happen to be returned. That is diplomacy (tit for tat).

Today's certification is already far more expensive. The issue is the FAA nor EASA having the skill set on software. China never should have certified the ARJ-21. I won't fly that plane as engine externals did not undergo a proper qual test program. I know engines, what else was missed? (In fact, I can identify parts that do not pass FAA requirements). The Su100 has had major issues that grounded most of the aircraft, yet I approve of the FAA accepting Russian certifications.

The 787 has done great since the battery issue was fixed.

Should we investigate EASA on all the RR issues? Or should we accept there was an error. This is expected. The FAA should have been more proactive and will be in the future.

But making this political means both sides. e.g., ground Trent's? I don't think that should happen, but RR testing was not properly overseen in my opinion..

Politics is not nice. Let the engineers solve this with regulatory oversight. The FAA is obviously scrutinizing now.

Lightsaber
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mjoelnir
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 5:09 pm

Stitch wrote:
Armaghman wrote:
I wonder if it anyone can tell if any commercial tactics as regards the cuts.


No information about Boeing instructing suppliers to reduce their ship-sets from the current 52 per month, so this may be to just reduce the number of frames clogging up RNT, PAE and other dispersion sites during the grounding period.


It could be that Boeing needs to inform the supplier a certain time in advance to cut production. If I remember right they have to give Spirit for example a one years warning in advance for production reductions Everything and contracts were geared for ramping up..
 
mxaxai
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 6:57 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
Stitch wrote:
Armaghman wrote:
I wonder if it anyone can tell if any commercial tactics as regards the cuts.


No information about Boeing instructing suppliers to reduce their ship-sets from the current 52 per month, so this may be to just reduce the number of frames clogging up RNT, PAE and other dispersion sites during the grounding period.


It could be that Boeing needs to inform the supplier a certain time in advance to cut production. If I remember right they have to give Spirit for example a one years warning in advance for production reductions Everything and contracts were geared for ramping up..

I assume it's easier to store aircraft parts than the complete product. Just rent an empty warehouse somewhere or put up a tent in the parking lot. And when the ramp up does come, it's easier to have most parts already in stock. For all we know, this is just a short term delay of the planned ramp up and a temporary rate reduction, not a permanent change in strategy.
 
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Stitch
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 7:10 pm

mjoelnir wrote:
It could be that Boeing needs to inform the supplier a certain time in advance to cut production. If I remember right they have to give Spirit for example a one years warning in advance for production reductions Everything and contracts were geared for ramping up..


So perhaps more evidence this is a short-term reduction for storage purposes and perhaps a sign that Boeing is not expecting a long-term production halt due to an extended period before the MAX is declared airworthy again. Also perhaps a sign that mid-and-long-lead customers are not negotiating cancellations.
 
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 7:26 pm

There is no shortage of space to store aircraft in the desert, so it doesn't make sense to me to reduce production rates.
Imo Boeing should keep producing aircraft at full rate to limit the financial impact of this mess.
 
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 7:40 pm

Stitch wrote:
mjoelnir wrote:
It could be that Boeing needs to inform the supplier a certain time in advance to cut production. If I remember right they have to give Spirit for example a one years warning in advance for production reductions Everything and contracts were geared for ramping up..


So perhaps more evidence this is a short-term reduction for storage purposes and perhaps a sign that Boeing is not expecting a long-term production halt due to an extended period before the MAX is declared airworthy again. Also perhaps a sign that mid-and-long-lead customers are not negotiating cancellations.


If it would be short term they would not reduce. Having after 3 month 30 frames more or less on the premises, does not matter when you start delivering again.

I assume after a month or so we will see the next reduction.
 
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 8:03 pm

Stitch wrote:
Armaghman wrote:
I wonder if it anyone can tell if any commercial tactics as regards the cuts.

No information about Boeing instructing suppliers to reduce their ship-sets from the current 52 per month, so this may be to just reduce the number of frames clogging up RNT, PAE and other dispersion sites during the grounding period.

I think it's more about the idea that a set of parts that become a flyable airplane get different accounting treatment than a set of parts that are a flyable airplane.

Besides, whenever the ability to deliver finally gets turned back on, there is a finite limit to how many they can deliver due to the number of people needed to do the final acceptance tests, delivery paperwork, etc.

Therefore there is a real need to throttle back production.
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 8:30 pm

Waterbomber2 wrote:
There is no shortage of space to store aircraft in the desert, so it doesn't make sense to me to reduce production rates.
Imo Boeing should keep producing aircraft at full rate to limit the financial impact of this mess.

But there is a cost of hanging engines on them all, when Airbus may be in a position to accept more LEAPS in the meantime.

As production reduces, will be interesting to see whose aircraft are not built, a possible indicator of cancellation or deferral.
 
trex8
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 9:12 pm

smartplane wrote:
Waterbomber2 wrote:
There is no shortage of space to store aircraft in the desert, so it doesn't make sense to me to reduce production rates.
Imo Boeing should keep producing aircraft at full rate to limit the financial impact of this mess.

But there is a cost of hanging engines on them all, when Airbus may be in a position to accept more LEAPS in the meantime.

As production reduces, will be interesting to see whose aircraft are not built, a possible indicator of cancellation or deferral.

If there is no set date when these planes can be delivered can BA make the customer continue to make previously scheduled progress payments? Presumably suppliers still need to be paid by B even if the plane is not delivered but B will not begetting paid.This could get quite expensive.
I doubt CFM can just ramp up LEAP1A production quickly, the fan is a different size and a long lead item
 
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 9:40 pm

Someone83 wrote:
Have Boeing stored MAXes other places than Renton and Everett?



There are no max’s stored in Everett
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smartplane
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Re: Boeing 737MAX Delivery/Production Thread - 2019

Sat Apr 06, 2019 9:47 pm

trex8 wrote:
smartplane wrote:
Waterbomber2 wrote:
There is no shortage of space to store aircraft in the desert, so it doesn't make sense to me to reduce production rates.
Imo Boeing should keep producing aircraft at full rate to limit the financial impact of this mess.

But there is a cost of hanging engines on them all, when Airbus may be in a position to accept more LEAPS in the meantime.

As production reduces, will be interesting to see whose aircraft are not built, a possible indicator of cancellation or deferral.

If there is no set date when these planes can be delivered can BA make the customer continue to make previously scheduled progress payments? Presumably suppliers still need to be paid by B even if the plane is not delivered but B will not begetting paid.This could get quite expensive.
I doubt CFM can just ramp up LEAP1A production quickly, the fan is a different size and a long lead item

Most customers use pre-delivery finance, then on delivery, sometimes the same financier (usually different), will take out the pre-shipment finance.

Even if the customer is feeling charitable towards Boeing, will the financier? Very unlikely.

Payment milestones come thick and fast as delivery nears. Working backwards, the last payment is post-delivery, referred to as a withholding payment (sometimes eliminated / offset by retrospective credits, but not usually, as this can have tax implications). Usually 5-10% of the total value, though care if the engines have been negotiated direct by the owner (these earn separate retrospective credits). Boeing won't be receiving these payments, on already delivered grounded aircraft.

There is a payment on technical delivery. The biggest made, usually 20-40%, but again, care with engines. No customers / financiers will be making those either. Shareholders will ask some hard questions if they do, when the aircraft heads to storage.

When engines are attached, and aircraft deemed 'complete' (can be minus buyer supplied items), another payment is due.

Both Boeing and Airbus have attempted to stop / discourage the practice of customers sourcing engines direct, with Boeing further down this track than Airbus. When everything is running smoothly, it means the air frame OEM has more control over price and revenue streams (including maintenance). When there is a delivery issue, as now, it means instead of the customer having direct exposure to the engine OEM, Boeing has that honour. Boeing are invoiced by CFM, and can't pass that on to the customer.

Likely Boeing has called in some favours with CFM, who have struggled with assembly and some component volumes. May enable assembly to catch up with component stocks. Would expect CFM are deferring invoicing, or extending due dates for progress payments and delivered engines.

How is Boeing handling? Will Boeing Capital be settling for already built / stored aircraft? Will Boeing Capital be settling for future completed aircraft? A flurry of new subsidiaries, one for each customer?
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