jplatts
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:52 am

Jshank83 wrote:
I think BOS on DL seems logical but the airport director said it it more likely on SY.


I agree that DL adding STL-BOS nonstop service seems logical as DL has a hub and a significant FF base on the BOS end to support STL-BOS nonstop service. DL also would be able to offer connections to some European destinations from STL through BOS if DL adds STL-BOS nonstop service.

DL also already serves BOS nonstop from some domestic destinations that aren't currently served by B6 such as CVG, CMH, IND, MCI, MKE, and ORF.
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 10, 2019 1:10 pm

Good news: Owensboro Airport recommends to keep Cape Air as their EAS provider. They want to keep STL and add BNA also. DOT has to approve still.

https://www.messenger-inquirer.com/news ... c02b7.html
 
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flymco753
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 10, 2019 3:02 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
flymco753 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
Put this together last night.


Image
What are your thoughts on Delta starting STL-BOS some day?


Can we block this guy or what... :spin:
:lol:
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:16 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
Good news: Owensboro Airport recommends to keep Cape Air as their EAS provider. They want to keep STL and add BNA also. DOT has to approve still.

https://www.messenger-inquirer.com/news ... c02b7.html

So we loose one flight a day right?
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Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:18 pm

stl07 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
Good news: Owensboro Airport recommends to keep Cape Air as their EAS provider. They want to keep STL and add BNA also. DOT has to approve still.

https://www.messenger-inquirer.com/news ... c02b7.html

So we loose one flight a day right?


That would be my guess. Unless they do 2 to BNA and 1 to STL but I would guess it is just moving one from STL to BNA.
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:00 pm

Looking through BLV numbers for the first time in awhile.

1st qtr of the year passengers were down 9.8%

Jan -19%
Feb -14%
March was flat.

Summer is up a couple flights but I am curious to see where the 20% jump this year they are projecting is coming from.
 
PhilMcCrackin
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:57 pm

Yet they want to expand and are solely dependent on one airline......
 
dcaproducer
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:36 pm

Are the load factors down at BLV or seats?
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:43 pm

dcaproducer wrote:
Are the load factors down at BLV or seats?


Jan was down 4 flights a week (I think that was around 25%)

Feb down 1 flight

March was up 1 flight.
 
dcaproducer
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:09 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
dcaproducer wrote:
Are the load factors down at BLV or seats?


Jan was down 4 flights a week (I think that was around 25%)

Feb down 1 flight

March was up 1 flight.


Got it. So the LF isn't really down, just seats/service levels. When the numbers aren't huge, like at BLV, even small changes make dramatic swings in passenger totals.
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:21 pm

dcaproducer wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
dcaproducer wrote:
Are the load factors down at BLV or seats?


Jan was down 4 flights a week (I think that was around 25%)

Feb down 1 flight

March was up 1 flight.


Got it. So the LF isn't really down, just seats/service levels. When the numbers aren't huge, like at BLV, even small changes make dramatic swings in passenger totals.


Yea, I looked thru LFs and most were good. Not sure why the Feb number is down so much. But I only take a one week snapshot each month not the entire month so maybe flight differences other weeks differed more. Vegas is getting cut mid august (SY was quick to jump on it for a few months). Don't totally get that one. Not sure if it will be back next spring or not. But I would guess not.

Also flight wise
April was flat
May I didn't do for last year so I can't compare
June is up 2 flights
July is up 1 flight.
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:01 pm

Next up on the EAS proposals. Marion, IL (MWA)

Cape Air (current holder), Skywest, Air Choice One, Boutique Air, and Southern Airways all have applied.

You can view all the proposals here (skywest and boutique has theirs for Quincy/Marion/Cape G).

And even vote on them for MWA!

https://www.veteransairport.com/survey_ ... ne2019.php
 
atrude777
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Jul 12, 2019 1:24 am

Jshank83 wrote:
Next up on the EAS proposals. Marion, IL (MWA)

Cape Air (current holder), Skywest, Air Choice One, Boutique Air, and Southern Airways all have applied.

You can view all the proposals here (skywest and boutique has theirs for Quincy/Marion/Cape G).

And even vote on them for MWA!

https://www.veteransairport.com/survey_ ... ne2019.php


*HYPERVENTILATES*

I voted for SkyWest for MWA!

Ya'll I was born and raised in Carbondale, 15 min from MWA. I remember flying out of MWA on TWA to STL, or Charter flights MWA-ORD on the TWA 727's.

We have never had scheduled non stop flights to Chicago, it would be a dream!

Cape Air offers a great proposal too..I am curious to see the subsidary is less? SkyWest wants $118 per passenger for MWA-ORD versus $200 for Cape Air?

Yet the overall subsidiary, makes SkyWest a bit more expensive?

Sure hope SkyWest wins!

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Jul 12, 2019 1:40 am

^^The feds said the "per passenger" thing wouldn't fly, as cape air could come in with an a380 and say their per passenger rate was less. The overall for SkyWest isn't much more, so we'll see what the feds have to say on this one
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atrude777
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Jul 12, 2019 2:51 am

stl07 wrote:
^^The feds said the "per passenger" thing wouldn't fly, as cape air could come in with an a380 and say their per passenger rate was less. The overall for SkyWest isn't much more, so we'll see what the feds have to say on this one


That's fair! Both UIN and CGI in 2017 were higher then Cape Air, and both cities and the DOT selected SkyWest!

Hell...if Cape Air voted to fly in an Airbus A380 I would vote for them too! :P

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Jul 12, 2019 3:46 am

atrude777 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
^^The feds said the "per passenger" thing wouldn't fly, as cape air could come in with an a380 and say their per passenger rate was less. The overall for SkyWest isn't much more, so we'll see what the feds have to say on this one


That's fair! Both UIN and CGI in 2017 were higher then Cape Air, and both cities and the DOT selected SkyWest!

Hell...if Cape Air voted to fly in an Airbus A380 I would vote for them too! :P

Alex


I think if the city picks Skywest it will get approved. Decatur is the only one that picked Skywest and DOT said no so far. I think they had a bigger gap in price.

I am really curious to see what happens with Quincy cause cape is way below Skywest. Over a million difference if you take the STL only route. Even the split STL/ORD is 500k cheaper. I’m not sure DOT would approve Skywest if they pick it.
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:51 am

atrude777 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
^^The feds said the "per passenger" thing wouldn't fly, as cape air could come in with an a380 and say their per passenger rate was less. The overall for SkyWest isn't much more, so we'll see what the feds have to say on this one


That's fair! Both UIN and CGI in 2017 were higher then Cape Air, and both cities and the DOT selected SkyWest!

Hell...if Cape Air voted to fly in an Airbus A380 I would vote for them too! :P

Alex

I'm pretty excited for what gets picked, because no matter what happens, all of the options are a huge upgrade from today. Even cape suggested Nashville and brand new airplanes.
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Fri Jul 12, 2019 5:51 am

Jshank83 wrote:
atrude777 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
^^The feds said the "per passenger" thing wouldn't fly, as cape air could come in with an a380 and say their per passenger rate was less. The overall for SkyWest isn't much more, so we'll see what the feds have to say on this one


That's fair! Both UIN and CGI in 2017 were higher then Cape Air, and both cities and the DOT selected SkyWest!

Hell...if Cape Air voted to fly in an Airbus A380 I would vote for them too! :P

Alex


I think if the city picks Skywest it will get approved. Decatur is the only one that picked Skywest and DOT said no so far. I think they had a bigger gap in price.

I am really curious to see what happens with Quincy cause cape is way below Skywest. Over a million difference if you take the STL only route. Even the split STL/ORD is 500k cheaper. I’m not sure DOT would approve Skywest if they pick it.

The locals want cape back for some reason
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:30 pm

AA ORD-STL OCT 6>5[7]
AA has reached a new low on this route with just 5 daily frequencies. UA and WN both have 8.
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:41 pm

pmanni1 wrote:
AA ORD-STL OCT 6>5[7]
AA has reached a new low on this route with just 5 daily frequencies. UA and WN both have 8.


To be fair UA runs a bunch of RJs on it and AA runs mostly mainline. This reduction to 5 is probably MAX related. I’m guessing it will go back up once they are in service.
 
jplatts
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Sun Jul 14, 2019 8:18 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
pmanni1 wrote:
AA ORD-STL OCT 6>5[7]
AA has reached a new low on this route with just 5 daily frequencies. UA and WN both have 8.


To be fair UA runs a bunch of RJs on it and AA runs mostly mainline. This reduction to 5 is probably MAX related. I’m guessing it will go back up once they are in service.


WN also has some connecting feed on its STL-MDW nonstops from destinations that don't have nonstop service to MDW such as DSM, LIT, TUL, and ICT.
 
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:54 am

I am not one to say one big business makes enough demand for a TATL flight but I just want to make note. With the governor involved I would hope it actually will be a big expansion. Bayer already moved their NA headquarters to STL from North Carolina. They closed their PIT office. It can do nothing but help the chances if they are centralizing and growing the office here. There are already a fair amount of German companies (some pretty large) in STL. I always thought it was weird how much the airport keeps mentioning LH in meetings because on its face it doesn't make much sense for STL. But maybe this gets Bayer to put in some incentive money or something. I am also not sure they have the right equipment for it. But we will see.

"Missouri governor says ag company planning 'significant' expansion in St. Louis"

https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... a73a5.html
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:13 am

^^their 787s don't come in till like 2023 so I'm confused on what the airport is saying as well. I feel like Bayer, sigma, ect would throw money at condor instead as their subsidy requirements are much lower and the plane is a good size (767) Compared to 330 and 350 at Lufthansa right now.
Last edited by stl07 on Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:17 am

Jshank83 wrote:
I am not one to say one big business makes enough demand for a TATL flight but I just want to make note. With the governor involved I would hope it actually will be a big expansion. Bayer already moved their NA headquarters to STL from North Carolina. They closed their PIT office. It can do nothing but help the chances if they are centralizing and growing the office here. There are already a fair amount of German companies (some pretty large) in STL. I always thought it was weird how much the airport keeps mentioning LH in meetings because on its face it doesn't make much sense for STL. But maybe this gets Bayer to put in some incentive money or something. I am also not sure they have the right equipment for it. But we will see.

"Missouri governor says ag company planning 'significant' expansion in St. Louis"

https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... a73a5.html

The governor came in for phizer moving their office from St. Charles to Chesterfield and opening up a nicer building so it doesn't take much to get him here. Even still, just for a new job announcement it's got to be big. I like your thinking
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:19 am

International LF for Jan 2019

Total combined both ways

Air Canada 62.5%
Frontier Cancun 75%
Frontier Punta Cana 75%
Southwest Cancun 74%
Volaris/Apple HUX 57%
Volaris/Apple Cabo 55%
WOW 65% (85% inbound)
 
Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:21 am

stl07 wrote:
^^their 787s don't come in till like 2023 so I'm confused on what the airport is saying as well. I feel like Bayer, sigma, ect would throw money at condor instead as their subsidy requirements are much lower and the plane is a good size (767) Compared to 330 and 350 at Lufthansa right now.


Yeah I really don't get the LH over Condor talk. Condor almost always comes in first. The only thing I can think of is someone is seriously throwing in some money and wants premium seating. But even that seems like a long shot. But maybe they will surprise us.
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 3:01 am

But Condor has a nice buisness class. I doubt Bayer would need F. But who knows, this is why I'm not an airport director.
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TWA302
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:59 pm

I work at a global tech company in STL and have numerous employs that are based in the UK and travel here often. We also have, on a weekly basis large groups of international customers visiting. I know many of them that would pay an arm and a leg NOT to connect via another airport prior to STL. I know it is a drop in the bucket but hopefully, sooner or later this will become a reality AND sustainable for the city and airline(s).
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:28 pm

Yay, 500 more people in west county.

In all seriousness though, this was a good announcement and only puts us one step closer.
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TWA302
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:07 pm

stl07 wrote:
Yay, 500 more people in west county.

In all seriousness though, this was a good announcement and only puts us one step closer.


One step closer to TATL? According to Boyd we aren't even on the radar. :!:
Image
I think this guy throws darts at a map while he is blindfolded. :talktothehand:
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:16 pm

Grand rapids ha!
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TWA302
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:30 pm

stl07 wrote:
Grand rapids ha!


My favorite place during the summer is Ludington, MI. Been going to our place on Lake Michigan all my life. Amazing weather.

I am sure BA could run 2x daily to GRR. :lol: I don't really get it either.
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:32 pm

TWA302 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
Grand rapids ha!


My favorite place during the summer is Ludington, MI. Been going to our place on Lake Michigan all my life. Amazing weather.

I am sure BA could run 2x daily to GRR. :lol: I don't really get it either.

Oh I love going to MI for the dunes too haha
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jplatts
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:19 pm

TWA302 wrote:
One step closer to TATL? According to Boyd we aren't even on the radar. :!:
Image


STL is located in a bigger metro area than the 12 destinations shown on the map above. BA also would be able to offer 1-stop connections to many destinations in Europe, Africa, the Middle East, and Asia through LHR if BA adds STL-LHR nonstop service.

10 of the 12 destinations shown on the map above are closer to Europe than STL is, but STL is closer to Europe than MEM and JAX are.
 
dcaproducer
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:57 pm

TWA302 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
Yay, 500 more people in west county.

In all seriousness though, this was a good announcement and only puts us one step closer.


One step closer to TATL? According to Boyd we aren't even on the radar. :!:
Image
I think this guy throws darts at a map while he is blindfolded. :talktothehand:


This is a bunch of click bait garbage.
 
stlgph
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:16 pm

Jshank83 wrote:
I am not one to say one big business makes enough demand for a TATL flight but I just want to make note. With the governor involved I would hope it actually will be a big expansion. Bayer already moved their NA headquarters to STL from North Carolina. They closed their PIT office. It can do nothing but help the chances if they are centralizing and growing the office here. There are already a fair amount of German companies (some pretty large) in STL. I always thought it was weird how much the airport keeps mentioning LH in meetings because on its face it doesn't make much sense for STL. But maybe this gets Bayer to put in some incentive money or something. I am also not sure they have the right equipment for it. But we will see.

"Missouri governor says ag company planning 'significant' expansion in St. Louis"

https://www.stltoday.com/business/local ... a73a5.html


Could be Bayer but Rabo Agri Finance is also doing a big hiring push. A number of jobs posted and if you follow the chain closely, you'll see a hiring chain of Specialists - Managers - Directors etc etc for certain departments.

**Amendment** - looks like Bayer is bringing jobs in - as I was slow on the news cycle here. But will be interesting to see what Rabo is doing - as a lot of their hiring seems to be focused around department managers and operations - something which could support more expansion down the road.

Go StL.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
atrude777
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 12:14 am

Our local newspaper is picking up the news about the 5 airlines bidding for MWA EAS service...

Interview by the Airport Director as well...

https://thesouthern.com/news/local/more ... -top-story

One thing I CAN agree with, it is an honor to be even looked at by 5 airlines and this truly is the most I can ever recall.

If the folks want frequency and consistent service with a great airline, then absolutely, Cape Air is your airline.

For years though, the region has been begging for non stop jet service to Chicago, and SkyWest is finally offering it!

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 1:13 am

^it will be interesting to see what happens. I think Quincy is seriously looking at going back to cape air. They said Skywest only has 40% on time flights. Jet service doesn’t do you much good if you keep missing connections.
 
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 1:25 am

Jshank83 wrote:
^it will be interesting to see what happens. I think Quincy is seriously looking at going back to cape air. They said Skywest only has 40% on time flights. Jet service doesn’t do you much good if you keep missing connections.


40% on time!? I wonder how much of it is factored to United's flow control out of ORD...

I am surprised Quincy would want to go back to Cape Air...

I am curious then how CGI and PAH's on time percentage is with UIN because they all follow the same flow...

Chicago is very delay prone no doubt...I can't even remember Cape Air being delayed except for weather in STL.

For comparison I am curious how Cape Air's flights have been out of DEC to Chicago!

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
STLflyer
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 3:09 am

TWA302 wrote:
stl07 wrote:
Yay, 500 more people in west county.

In all seriousness though, this was a good announcement and only puts us one step closer.


One step closer to TATL? According to Boyd we aren't even on the radar. :!:
Image
I think this guy throws darts at a map while he is blindfolded. :talktothehand:


GRR?

Image
 
PhilMcCrackin
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 3:32 am

stl07 wrote:
But Condor has a nice buisness class. I doubt Bayer would need F. But who knows, this is why I'm not an airport director.


Condor seems to prefer US destinations that have tourism appeal, which STL really doesn't. I don't think LH has an aircraft small enough to attempt this route with and frankly, there are probably better targets in the US that are unserved by them.

I still think BA is the best bet.
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:13 am

PhilMcCrackin wrote:
stl07 wrote:
But Condor has a nice buisness class. I doubt Bayer would need F. But who knows, this is why I'm not an airport director.


Condor seems to prefer US destinations that have tourism appeal, which STL really doesn't. I don't think LH has an aircraft small enough to attempt this route with and frankly, there are probably better targets in the US that are unserved by them.

I still think BA is the best bet.

Neither does PIT or arguably AUS though
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Jshank83
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:34 am

atrude777 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
^it will be interesting to see what happens. I think Quincy is seriously looking at going back to cape air. They said Skywest only has 40% on time flights. Jet service doesn’t do you much good if you keep missing connections.


40% on time!? I wonder how much of it is factored to United's flow control out of ORD...

I am surprised Quincy would want to go back to Cape Air...

I am curious then how CGI and PAH's on time percentage is with UIN because they all follow the same flow...

Chicago is very delay prone no doubt...I can't even remember Cape Air being delayed except for weather in STL.

For comparison I am curious how Cape Air's flights have been out of DEC to Chicago!

Alex


If you look at comments on articles or Facebook about picking service a lot of people in Quincy want STL back and complain about Skywest. Mostly because of not being on time. So I think they like the idea of Cape going to both cities.

I haven’t really seen anything from CGI on preferences.

Quincy article.

https://wgem.com/2019/07/15/city-looks- ... l-airport/

Not surprisingly it looks like Marion is down to Cape with flights to STL and BNA or Skywest.

https://www.kfvs12.com/2019/07/16/veter ... -new-bids/
Last edited by Jshank83 on Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
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stl07
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:40 am

Jshank83 wrote:
International LF for Jan 2019

Total combined both ways

Air Canada 62.5%
Frontier Cancun 75%
Frontier Punta Cana 75%
Southwest Cancun 74%
Volaris/Apple HUX 57%
Volaris/Apple Cabo 55%
WOW 65% (85% inbound)

The atrocious apple loads only strengthen my suspicion that the flights to non Cancun/PV destinations, especially HUX, are relying on the subsidy by the Mexican government.
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Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:41 am

stl07 wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:
International LF for Jan 2019

Total combined both ways

Air Canada 62.5%
Frontier Cancun 75%
Frontier Punta Cana 75%
Southwest Cancun 74%
Volaris/Apple HUX 57%
Volaris/Apple Cabo 55%
WOW 65% (85% inbound)

The atrocious apple loads only strengthen my suspicion that the flights to non Cancun/PV destinations, especially HUX, are relying on the subsidy by the Mexican government.


Someone has to be. They are already scheduled to keep going next year.
 
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symphonicpoet
Posts: 45
Joined: Wed Sep 06, 2017 8:57 am

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:30 am

^To be fair, the Apple loads are part of package deals with hotel stays and possibly other services, correct? So I'd guess they're not going to use quite the same calculus as your usual airline execs. The flight could be the "loss leader" in the package. They need a plane. They took the most reasonable one they could get on the lease and tried to make sure it didn't suck up their profit from all the other stuff?
TW AA MU JL KE DL UA LOF GJS SKW WN
STL JFK FRA GVA CDG IAD ORD PVG SGN NRT ICN ATL SFO HKG MDW LGA BNA
L1011 MD82 83 88 B737 738 741 744 762 772 773 777 A320 E175 C700
 
acentauri
Posts: 242
Joined: Wed Jun 22, 2016 12:35 am

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:53 am

PhilMcCrackin wrote:
stl07 wrote:
But Condor has a nice buisness class. I doubt Bayer would need F. But who knows, this is why I'm not an airport director.


Condor seems to prefer US destinations that have tourism appeal, which STL really doesn't. I don't think LH has an aircraft small enough to attempt this route with and frankly, there are probably better targets in the US that are unserved by them.

I still think BA is the best bet.

PDX, PIT, PVD, MSP, BWI, ANC, et al. surely can't be considered "Tourist Destinations" for Europeans.
 
dcaproducer
Posts: 167
Joined: Wed Jan 06, 2016 5:26 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 12:55 pm

acentauri wrote:
PhilMcCrackin wrote:
stl07 wrote:
But Condor has a nice buisness class. I doubt Bayer would need F. But who knows, this is why I'm not an airport director.


Condor seems to prefer US destinations that have tourism appeal, which STL really doesn't. I don't think LH has an aircraft small enough to attempt this route with and frankly, there are probably better targets in the US that are unserved by them.

I still think BA is the best bet.

PDX, PIT, PVD, MSP, BWI, ANC, et al. surely can't be considered "Tourist Destinations" for Europeans.


The BW in BWI stands for Baltimore-Washington. BWI is a third airport in the DC metro and a popular choice for tourists coming to Washington. It's about the same distance from downtown DC as IAD. (32 Miles from BWI to Capitol Hill, 28 Miles from IAD to Capitol Hill) BA has had a daily BWI-LHR flight for years, and this is in additional to multiple daily flights at IAD.

ANC has huge tourist draw, but I don't know if I'd say it's coming from Europe.

I agree with PIT, PVD, MSP
According to stats provided by each city, looking at PIT vs STL, STL booked 620,000 room nights in 2018 compared to PIT 330,000.
Sources: https://explorestlouis.com/wp-content/u ... t-2018.pdf
Sources: https://issuu.com/visitpittsburgh/docs/ ... 8/68743514
 
atrude777
Posts: 4316
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 11:23 pm

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 3:07 pm

Jshank83 wrote:

Not surprisingly it looks like Marion is down to Cape with flights to STL and BNA or Skywest.

https://www.kfvs12.com/2019/07/16/veter ... -new-bids/


A quote from the Article from Doug, whom I happen to know. His Wife used to be my 4th grade teacher hahaha

"“You’ve got a smaller aircraft on Cape Air. A nine seat airplane that can operate with high frequency and a low fair, generally under $100 round trip,” Kimmel said, “and then you have a larger aircraft, 50 seat capability offered by Skywest, and less frequency, and a fair that would be higher.”

That didn't look good for SkyWest...he used negative remarks... "less frequency, and a fare that would be higher"...Hahahaha

I am seeing the comments on FB too like you mentioned, and it's a lot of STL/BNA split or Chicago.


The other wording in the article threw me off...

"According to Airport Director Doug Kimmel, if the airport decides to go with two proposals they are leaning towards, people will be able to take a short plane ride to Chicago and Nashville on top of the service to St. Louis they already offer."

It's either/or?? It claims "and on top of the service they already offer"...poor choice of wording perhaps?

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
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flyPIT
Posts: 1587
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 6:21 am

Re: St. Louis Aviation Thread - 2019

Wed Jul 17, 2019 3:41 pm

acentauri wrote:
PDX, PIT, PVD, MSP, BWI, ANC, et al. surely can't be considered "Tourist Destinations" for Europeans.

They aren't going to ANC to hang out at Darwin's.


dcaproducer wrote:
According to stats provided by each city, looking at PIT vs STL, STL booked 620,000 room nights in 2018 compared to PIT 330,000.
Sources: https://explorestlouis.com/wp-content/u ... t-2018.pdf
Sources: https://issuu.com/visitpittsburgh/docs/ ... 8/68743514

Those stats appear to only be room nights booked by conventions:
"THE EXPLORE ST. LOUIS SALES TEAM BOOKED 363 CONVENTIONS/MEETINGS FOR A TOTAL OF 620,451 ROOM NIGHTS"
FLYi

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