• 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 15
 
jetblueguy22
Posts: 3182
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:26 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Jan 24, 2019 4:06 pm

mcg wrote:
jetblueguy22 wrote:
JayinKitsap wrote:
I suspect Amazon is cherry picking the best shipments to in house, but that is a natural choice. Let FedEX and UPS do the deliveries that cost more, keep the profitable ones for oneself.

That’s exactly how it works. Give the TVs, furniture, and other irregular stuff to the carriers and keep the light, small, easy stuff for themselves. It’s smart.

Now I’m not saying they aren’t handing smalls over to the Big 3, they most certainly do. But in areas where they do have their service up and running it’s going through their network. I believe they also base it on whether or not a carrier will be in the general area. They don’t have stop density on their side. UPS and Fedex drivers will service a smaller geographic area (especially UPS) because they have so much other work to fill in the holes, Amazon doesn’t have that. Yet.....


Last fall I was driving between Libby and Troy Montana. This is a very rural area far from anything really, and rumbling down the road came a UPS package delivery truck. It made me wonder what UPS would be bringing to Troy Montana and after just a moment the I figured it was Amazon stuff. People in rural Montana might actually like free two delivery more than more suburban or urban folks. It also seemed to me that Amazon might be leaving UPS the relatively difficult and expensive ( I suspect a delivery in Troy is more expensive than in most places) items to deliver. I wonder how this changes the relationship between UPS and Amazon.

I started my career at brown in a rural building. I never thought that farmers and other rural folks would order online as much as they do. It was pretty surprising how much rural work there was from e-commerce.

That stuff may be high cost, but there is a rural surcharge that gets slapped on it. I’m sure Amazon pays less than the listed price, but they still pay it
Look at sweatpants guy. This is a 90 million dollar aircraft, not a Tallahassee strip club
 
hkcanadaexpat
Posts: 3802
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2012 3:33 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:45 am

Anyone have any idea what N752AX is doing @ ROW? Flew there on 1/19.
 
User avatar
Spacepope
Posts: 4227
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 1999 11:10 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 5:38 am

hkcanadaexpat wrote:
Anyone have any idea what N752AX is doing @ ROW? Flew there on 1/19.

Last SDR entry was from what appears to be a heavy check 4 years ago. Had 45000 cycles on it then. Even odds on scrapping it or getting painted all white.
The last of the famous international playboys
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Jan 30, 2019 6:04 am

Spacepope wrote:
hkcanadaexpat wrote:
Anyone have any idea what N752AX is doing @ ROW? Flew there on 1/19.

Last SDR entry was from what appears to be a heavy check 4 years ago. Had 45000 cycles on it then. Even odds on scrapping it or getting painted all white.


I'm thinking paint at Dean Baldwin. Plainly, DHL is using fewer and fewer 767-200s at ABX (I think they're down to one), and since this is in DHL paint, then it needs to be changed if it's going to be used generally at ABX or leased out. Unless the thing is to be exported to DHX, etc., whereupon it might be getting fresh DHL paint, because the existing DHL colors are looking a little ratty.

My money is on 798AX as being the next CAM 767-200 to be parted out (following 792AX, which was WFU on 4/25/18 and was recently re-registered to AMES from CAM.) So I think 752AX likely has a little more life left in her; I'm guessing she's about 47,000 cycles. If she is in paint, we should know in about a week. (Figure 2 weeks to paint her, which is a Saturday, so it may roll over to the next Monday or Tuesday, depending on how busy Dean Baldwin is.) I make this EWAG while cognizant of the fact that she's probably due for another heavy check pretty-soon. So it is possible she's gonna sit for a while if they don't have a use for her, and they'll do the heavy check then. But i'm still guessing paint and possibly lease to someone else for 3-5 years.
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sat Feb 02, 2019 7:30 am

hkcanadaexpat wrote:
Anyone have any idea what N752AX is doing @ ROW? Flew there on 1/19.


Looks like it was paint. Back in service today, with a round-trip CVG-ORD under an ABX 2000 flight number. Not sure what service that is; 2000-series is not usually DHL. And I think ABX is now down to a single 767-200 route for DHL, unless there has been a change recently (which is possible)...

Anybody got pix?
 
KCVGSpotter
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Sep 16, 2017 5:07 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:42 am

wjcandee wrote:
hkcanadaexpat wrote:
Anyone have any idea what N752AX is doing @ ROW? Flew there on 1/19.


Looks like it was paint. Back in service today, with a round-trip CVG-ORD under an ABX 2000 flight number. Not sure what service that is; 2000-series is not usually DHL. And I think ABX is now down to a single 767-200 route for DHL, unless there has been a change recently (which is possible)...

Anybody got pix?


I can confirm 752 is in all white ABX Air (2012) livery. 783 and 798 are the last two -200 series freighters wearing DHL livery.
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:58 am

KCVGSpotter wrote:

I can confirm 752 is in all white ABX Air (2012) livery. 783 and 798 are the last two -200 series freighters wearing DHL livery.


Thanks for the confirmation!
 
User avatar
1337Delta764
Posts: 5649
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:02 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:53 pm

I just got another shipment from Reno, this time OnTrac. Reno is always an atypical carrier (OnTrac and UPS Ground so far) because I think Amazon doesn't run a linehaul route between Reno and Phoenix.
Yes, I wear Fairy Tale Pink IZOD shirts. I am a real man.
 
cmairplaneman
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 3:14 am

354AA is currently at ILN getting worked on. I hear the plan is that she will get converted some time. Unusual to see ATSG get a 1988 763 when most of the newer arrivals are at least early 1990s.
Glider Pilot & CVG/ILN Spotter
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:20 am

cmairplaneman wrote:
354AA is currently at ILN getting worked on. I hear the plan is that she will get converted some time. Unusual to see ATSG get a 1988 763 when most of the newer arrivals are at least early 1990s.


Everything pointed to that aircraft being converted, despite her age. She has a lot of hours, but only 20-ish thousand cycles. I'm sure she was inexpensive, so ATSG can afford to invest some dollars with Airborne (the new name of AMES) in order to really bring her up to snuff before she is sent for conversion.

(PS AMES owns PEMCO, and had its name changed to Airborne. The hangar space in ILN and TPA are basically the same size. The way the branding has worked for a few months is that Pemco was split in two: Airborne [Maintenance and Engineering] in Tampa for the MRO stuff and Pemco Conversions for the conversions. Meanwhile, what was AMES's ILN shop is now Airborne in Wilmington. So Airborne now has two shops, Wilmington and Tampa, and Pemco Conversions works out of Tampa.) That Tampa shop gets a lot of work, with all of Frontier's 84 aircraft getting heavy checks there, as well as drop-in maintenance and induction. And it looks like CAM's 757s are all getting their C-checks done at Tampa now (except for the one that went all to hell after it's C-check at Pemco, and had to be sent to ILN for weeks to get it flyable again). They also seem to be doing avionics work on CAM's 767s. For example, N741AX, which was a lease return from Amerijet destined for a new customer, had major heavy maintenance done at ILN, then was flown to TPA for, I understand, some significant upgrades of its avionics that the new customer needed.
 
User avatar
1337Delta764
Posts: 5649
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:02 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:03 pm

I actually wonder how does Amazon determine which fulfillment centers to run linehaul routes from to specific markets. For example, Phoenix apparently does not have linehaul routes from the Las Vegas area fulfillment centers. I think the Las Vegas area fulfillment centers fulfill a significant number of orders in Southern California, so it could be demand related, although the Phoenix area fulfillment centers also have linehaul routes to the Sortation Center in San Bernardino (the Sortation Center for Southern California), so it appears that Phoenix fulfills quite a few Southern California orders as well. Phoenix though also has several linehauls from the Inland Empire and a few from Northern California, Texas, the Denver area, and the Salt Lake City area.
Yes, I wear Fairy Tale Pink IZOD shirts. I am a real man.
 
User avatar
Spacepope
Posts: 4227
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 1999 11:10 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:22 pm

wjcandee wrote:
cmairplaneman wrote:
354AA is currently at ILN getting worked on. I hear the plan is that she will get converted some time. Unusual to see ATSG get a 1988 763 when most of the newer arrivals are at least early 1990s.


Everything pointed to that aircraft being converted, despite her age. She has a lot of hours, but only 20-ish thousand cycles. I'm sure she was inexpensive, so ATSG can afford to invest some dollars with Airborne (the new name of AMES) in order to really bring her up to snuff before she is sent for conversion.

(PS AMES owns PEMCO, and had its name changed to Airborne. The hangar space in ILN and TPA are basically the same size. The way the branding has worked for a few months is that Pemco was split in two: Airborne [Maintenance and Engineering] in Tampa for the MRO stuff and Pemco Conversions for the conversions. Meanwhile, what was AMES's ILN shop is now Airborne in Wilmington. So Airborne now has two shops, Wilmington and Tampa, and Pemco Conversions works out of Tampa.) That Tampa shop gets a lot of work, with all of Frontier's 84 aircraft getting heavy checks there, as well as drop-in maintenance and induction. And it looks like CAM's 757s are all getting their C-checks done at Tampa now (except for the one that went all to hell after it's C-check at Pemco, and had to be sent to ILN for weeks to get it flyable again). They also seem to be doing avionics work on CAM's 767s. For example, N741AX, which was a lease return from Amerijet destined for a new customer, had major heavy maintenance done at ILN, then was flown to TPA for, I understand, some significant upgrades of its avionics that the new customer needed.


It had going on 116,000 hours on it back in 2016, so a lot of hours is almost an understatement. What's the average annual utilization per frame now on this Amazon project, it's gotta be nearing 2000 hours and 900 cycles.

This dance of airframe hours, cycles and CF-6 reliability (yes, I know there are a few token Pratt frames mixed in) is going to be very interesting to watch in about 2 years time as the fleet contnues to expand, utilization increases and the older conversions near their next heavy check.
The last of the famous international playboys
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:54 pm

I am not particularly concerned about it, although it will be interesting to watch. I think that atsg has a lot of experience with end-of-life 767 frames, and seems to be able to fly them reliably right up to the end. The next one to go at ABX air is right at the very end in terms of Cycles, and is still flying every day.
 
User avatar
Acey559
Posts: 1324
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 3:30 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 07, 2019 3:58 am

I have a stat some may find interesting, though as a caveat, this is the whole fleet including 757 Freighters and Combi aircraft, not just Amazon 767s.

We (ATI) flew 52,000 hours and 15,000 cycles in 2018. The Combi aircraft (4) are higher hour/lower cycle and the 757 Freighters (4) are higher cycle/lower hours. The 767s (19 with 14 dedicated fully to Amazon with a couple of spares sprinkled in along with a few others flying various other contracts) are a mix of both and make up the vast majority of the fleet, so you can extrapolate accordingly.

Hopefully that will shed a little light on utilization of the 767s with Amazon, especially going forward with aircraft that are, and getting even more so, long in the tooth.
In Dixie Land I'll take my stand to live and die in Dixie.
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 07, 2019 7:14 am

Acey559 wrote:
The 767s (19 with 14 dedicated fully to Amazon with a couple of spares sprinkled in along with a few others flying various other contracts) are a mix of both and make up the vast majority of the fleet, so you can extrapolate accordingly..


Great summary, Acey! Specifically, right now 14 at ATI are dry-leased to Amazon and operated by ATI. Those 14 do a mix of transcons, multi-stoppers, and short out-and-backs to CVG. In the Amazon schedule, at least one is scheduled to sit somewhere as a hot spare, sometimes 2. So at least 1/14th of the fleet isn't moving every day. Of the remaining 5, N295CM (762) and 395CM (763) operate both as maintenance spares (on top of the hot spares) and do military routes. The military work isn't daily. Obviously, when sitting spare, they're not flying. N376AN and N373AA are now doing 4X weekly 2-hour out-and-backs between PHL-Florida. N399CM is actually an aircraft dry-leased by CAM to Northern Aviation (Aloha Cargo), but since they're not yet able to fly it to Hawaii, ATI does it for them on a CMI basis, so it's currently on the ATI certificate. It does a daily average-5-hour-each-way round-trip between LAX and HNL. So one can see that that average number is made up of some low-cycle, high-hour trips and some low-ish-cycle, low-hour trips. And some sitting. And some aircraft have a more-consistent schedule than others. Still, the overall average gives some insight.

And like I said earlier, ATSG/CAM seem to be able to take aircraft like recently-retired 792AX (ln 110) and soon-to-be-wfu 798AX (ln 143), and run them right up to the Limit of Validity on cycles in a reliable fashion. 798 flew today, just like it has basically every day recently.
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 8:18 pm

N354AA should be leaving today (2/9/19) from ILN to TLV. It's the next into conversion. After a bit of hiatus, ATSG is sending new feedstock to TLV. (The last was N730WE on 8/30/18, about 5 months ago. 730 is the only CAM aircraft currently in conversion, and it should be done within the next few weeks.)
 
User avatar
yochai
Posts: 244
Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:19 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:56 pm

N354AA is making a U-turn over eastern Canada and is heading back to the US, anyone has any more info?
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:44 pm

Looks like it turned around near Portland, Maine (about 150km from Eastern Canada -- almost over the border but just before).

Not the first time one of these has had issues on a ferry flight. IIRC, there have been windshield problems more than once. Mad respect for the guys that do the ferries.
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:08 pm

In other ILN news: It looks as if N743AX is going to go back to Amerijet. I had understood that aircraft to be a lease return when it and 741AX arrived in ILN about 9 months ago. 741 is definitely going to a different carrier after avionics upgrades at PEMCO (I mean "Airborne Tampa"), but I wasn't clear on the plans for 743.

AJT is doing what I assume is a test flight on the frame right now (2/9/19), so I guess they are taking it back for a while. This makes some sense, because Amerijet's new management has brought in a lot of business, and they are pounding their 3 recent 767-300s with many, many hours and many, many cycles daily. It is currently in the low-43,000s of cycles and low-90,000s of hours, so given that CAM will run some of them to the Limit of Validity (50,000 FC on the 767), there's a fair bit of life left in her.
 
cmairplaneman
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:25 pm

I was flying today and could see 354AA flying in the distance. Looks like it’s about to land
Glider Pilot & CVG/ILN Spotter
 
cmairplaneman
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:26 pm

Also pretty sure 743AX is staying with AJT
Glider Pilot & CVG/ILN Spotter
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 1:54 am

yochai wrote:
N354AA is making a U-turn over eastern Canada and is heading back to the US, anyone has any more info?


Right engine losing and continuing to lose oil quantity. Didn't declare an emergency, but turned around and returned to ILN.
 
User avatar
yochai
Posts: 244
Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:19 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:09 am

wjcandee wrote:
yochai wrote:
N354AA is making a U-turn over eastern Canada and is heading back to the US, anyone has any more info?


Right engine losing and continuing to lose oil quantity. Didn't declare an emergency, but turned around and returned to ILN.


Thanks, hope to see (and photograph) it in TLV soon!
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 4:09 am

yochai wrote:
Thanks, hope to see (and photograph) it in TLV soon!


Looking forward to seeing your photos!
 
cmairplaneman
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 2:53 pm

At least it gives me another chance to spot 354AA when it leaves ILN again. It was really neat to see it inflight in the distance as I was flying
Glider Pilot & CVG/ILN Spotter
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:40 pm

cmairplaneman wrote:
At least it gives me another chance to spot 354AA when it leaves ILN again. It was really neat to see it inflight in the distance as I was flying


Looks like it is in the air again, 2/13/19 at 3pm-ish EST, heading again to TLV. https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N35 ... /KILN/LLBG
 
User avatar
yochai
Posts: 244
Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 6:19 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:04 pm

wjcandee wrote:
cmairplaneman wrote:
At least it gives me another chance to spot 354AA when it leaves ILN again. It was really neat to see it inflight in the distance as I was flying


Looks like it is in the air again, 2/13/19 at 3pm-ish EST, heading again to TLV. https://flightaware.com/live/flight/N35 ... /KILN/LLBG


Looks like a rerun from a few days ago, just before starting to cross the Atlantic it makes a U turn and seems to heading back to ILN....what is going on with this aircraft??
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:15 am

It IS a rerun of the other night. Exact same problem. Diminishing oil quantity in the right engine. "The number two engine does not like to keep oil in it," according to the pilot.
 
BTVB6Flyer
Posts: 485
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:20 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 12:54 am

Anyone have an active list of routes? Would love to try to create a route map like the old threads use to have.

I have TPA's routes, but anything else I would be guessing.
 
cmairplaneman
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:11 am

Wow, I think that’s the record for ILN-TLV deversions for an aircraft. Also just curious, where did you hear that the oil is low again? Did you listen to the radio
Glider Pilot & CVG/ILN Spotter
 
Delta28L
Posts: 208
Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2018 2:00 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:20 am

BTVB6Flyer wrote:
Anyone have an active list of routes? Would love to try to create a route map like the old threads use to have.

I have TPA's routes, but anything else I would be guessing.


I know gcmap did a map for the holiday rush for the past two years.
 
BTVB6Flyer
Posts: 485
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 3:20 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:41 am

Delta28L wrote:
BTVB6Flyer wrote:
Anyone have an active list of routes? Would love to try to create a route map like the old threads use to have.

I have TPA's routes, but anything else I would be guessing.


I know gcmap did a map for the holiday rush for the past two years.


Link? I have not seen that. That's kinda what I'm looking for, especially if it covered this past holiday peak.
 
CallmeJB
Posts: 70
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:19 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:49 am

Here's what I believe is the currently scheduled Atlas Amazon network:

CVG Arrivals:
SCK-CVG(x2)
TPA-CVG
PDX-CVG
PHX-CVG
IAH-CVG
MIA-CVG
RFD-CVG
SKF-CVG
MSP-CVG

CVG Departures:
CVG-SCK(x2)
CVG-TPA(x2)
CVG-PDX
CVG-PHX
CVG-IAH
CVG-MIA
CVG-RFD
CVG-DEN

ONT/RIV Arrivals:
CVG-ONT
RFD-RIV
IAH-RIV
BWI-RIV
HNL-ONT
DEN-ONT
SCK-ONT

ONT/RIV Departures:
ONT-CVG
ONT-RFD
RIV-IAH
RIV-BWI
RIV-HNL
ONT-SKF
ONT-MIA

BWI Arrivals:
MIA-BWI
TPA-BWI
IAH-BWI

BWI Departures:
BWI-MIA
BWI-TPA
BWI-MSP

Other Routes:
PHX-RFD
RFD-SCK
TPA-SCK
SCK-BDL
BDL-PDX
PDX-PHX
MIA-IAH

GCMAP Link:

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=SCK-CVG%0D ... =wls&DU=mi
Last edited by CallmeJB on Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:54 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
DeltaRules
Posts: 4921
Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2001 11:57 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:53 am

Any word on what routes ILN will run?
A310/319/320/321/333, ARJ, BN2, B717/722/73S/733/734/735/73G/738/739/744/757/753/767/763/764/777, CR1/2/7/9, DH6, 328, EM2/ERJ/E70/E75/E90, F28/100, J31, L10/12/15, DC9/D93/D94/D95/M80/M88/M90/D10, SF3, SST
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 2:55 am

cmairplaneman wrote:
Wow, I think that’s the record for ILN-TLV deversions for an aircraft. Also just curious, where did you hear that the oil is low again? Did you listen to the radio


You are correct, Sir! He was speaking to Moncton Center. When he switched to ZBW, unfortunately, the scanner was locked on the other channel (blabby Portland Approach) so I didn't hear that initial exchange. But it was clear enough. Since there was no emergency, Center asked something along the lines of whether they had just decided to have a quick trip out to look at the Ocean before turning around. The pilot asked if the controller had been working on Saturday and said that this was exactly the same thing that had happened then, in the same engine. He then made the comment about oil that I quoted. Center said something about it probably not being a good night to cross the Atlantic, then.
 
User avatar
Spacepope
Posts: 4227
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 1999 11:10 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 3:08 am

wjcandee wrote:
cmairplaneman wrote:
Wow, I think that’s the record for ILN-TLV deversions for an aircraft. Also just curious, where did you hear that the oil is low again? Did you listen to the radio


You are correct, Sir! He was speaking to Moncton Center. When he switched to ZBW, unfortunately, the scanner was locked on the other channel (blabby Portland Approach) so I didn't hear that initial exchange. But it was clear enough. Since there was no emergency, Center asked something along the lines of whether they had just decided to have a quick trip out to look at the Ocean before turning around. The pilot asked if the controller had been working on Saturday and said that this was exactly the same thing that had happened then, in the same engine. He then made the comment about oil that I quoted. Center said something about it probably not being a good night to cross the Atlantic, then.

Is there a way to know what engines are hung on this frame? The ones from delivery to ILN from AA? Some high time ones that the rest of the fleet won’t miss when they’re on an Israeli vacation for 6 months? Or did CAM hang their own power plants on it in ROW before it ferried out?
The last of the famous international playboys
 
cmairplaneman
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 3:14 am

Spacepope wrote:
wjcandee wrote:
cmairplaneman wrote:
Wow, I think that’s the record for ILN-TLV deversions for an aircraft. Also just curious, where did you hear that the oil is low again? Did you listen to the radio


You are correct, Sir! He was speaking to Moncton Center. When he switched to ZBW, unfortunately, the scanner was locked on the other channel (blabby Portland Approach) so I didn't hear that initial exchange. But it was clear enough. Since there was no emergency, Center asked something along the lines of whether they had just decided to have a quick trip out to look at the Ocean before turning around. The pilot asked if the controller had been working on Saturday and said that this was exactly the same thing that had happened then, in the same engine. He then made the comment about oil that I quoted. Center said something about it probably not being a good night to cross the Atlantic, then.

Is there a way to know what engines are hung on this frame? The ones from delivery to ILN from AA? Some high time ones that the rest of the fleet won’t miss when they’re on an Israeli vacation for 6 months? Or did CAM hang their own power plants on it in ROW before it ferried out?


Don’t know. I do know that 354AA while in storage, had engines removed. Also, I’ve seen it at ILN where they don’t have engines during the checks prior to the flights to TLV.
Glider Pilot & CVG/ILN Spotter
 
User avatar
1337Delta764
Posts: 5649
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:02 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:36 am

CallmeJB wrote:
Here's what I believe is the currently scheduled Atlas Amazon network:

PDX-PHX



This seems to be a new one. I have yet to recieve any items from the Portland area, however, I once got an item that took an odd routing via Amazon Logistics from SEA-CVG-PHX. I don't see how that was cheaper than shipping it via UPS 2nd Day Air which could have taken the much more direct route of SEA-ONT-PHX.
Yes, I wear Fairy Tale Pink IZOD shirts. I am a real man.
 
CallmeJB
Posts: 70
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:19 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 5:48 am

1337Delta764 wrote:
CallmeJB wrote:
Here's what I believe is the currently scheduled Atlas Amazon network:

PDX-PHX



This seems to be a new one. I have yet to recieve any items from the Portland area, however, I once got an item that took an odd routing via Amazon Logistics from SEA-CVG-PHX. I don't see how that was cheaper than shipping it via UPS 2nd Day Air which could have taken the much more direct route of SEA-ONT-PHX.

It's cheaper because the scheduled Amazon Air flights are a sunk cost. If there's room to throw it on the planes going SEA-CVG-PHX, then it's basically free for Amazon to do that. At a tactical level, the planes are flying whether there are packages on them or not. (They are scheduled based on anticipated demand; a strategic planning level)

As for the PDX-PHX flight, it arrives every day, 0630z. All of the flights on that list operate on a daily basis, 7 days a week.
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 6:07 am

CallMeJB: That's a nice list! I haven't had a chance to verify it, but I assume that you are all over it. It will be interesting to see what things look like when one adds in the ATI/ABX routes.
 
User avatar
Spacepope
Posts: 4227
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 1999 11:10 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 1:55 pm

cmairplaneman wrote:
Spacepope wrote:
wjcandee wrote:

You are correct, Sir! He was speaking to Moncton Center. When he switched to ZBW, unfortunately, the scanner was locked on the other channel (blabby Portland Approach) so I didn't hear that initial exchange. But it was clear enough. Since there was no emergency, Center asked something along the lines of whether they had just decided to have a quick trip out to look at the Ocean before turning around. The pilot asked if the controller had been working on Saturday and said that this was exactly the same thing that had happened then, in the same engine. He then made the comment about oil that I quoted. Center said something about it probably not being a good night to cross the Atlantic, then.

Is there a way to know what engines are hung on this frame? The ones from delivery to ILN from AA? Some high time ones that the rest of the fleet won’t miss when they’re on an Israeli vacation for 6 months? Or did CAM hang their own power plants on it in ROW before it ferried out?


Don’t know. I do know that 354AA while in storage, had engines removed. Also, I’ve seen it at ILN where they don’t have engines during the checks prior to the flights to TLV.


Thanks.

I'm just very intrigued as this engine in particular seems to be giving a few more problems than we normally see reliability wise with the usual day to day operations. During conversion, do these engines just sit around waiting for the project to get finished or are these units serviced/overhauled at the same time?
The last of the famous international playboys
 
cvgComair
Posts: 2040
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2016 3:48 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 4:39 pm

Amazon Air route map (w HNL): http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=BDL-CVG,+B ... -IAH&DU=mi
Amazon Air route map (w/o HNL): http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=ABE-CVG/DF ... -IAH&DU=mi
ABX route map: http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=BDL-CVG,+B ... -BWI&DU=mi
ATI route map: http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=ABE-CVG/DF ... -DFW&DU=mi
Atlas route map: http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=SCK-CVG,+S ... -IAH&DU=mi

See CallmeJB's post above for Atlas schedule.

Here is the ABX schedule:
BDL-CVG

BWI-CVG
BWI-SMF

CLT-CVG
CLT-ONT

CVG-BDL
CVG-BWI
CVG-CLT

ONT-CLT
ONT-CVG

SMF-BWI

And the ATI Schedule:
ABE-CVG
ABE-DFW
ABE-RFD
ABE-SEA
ABE-SMF

BDL-ONT

CVG-ABE
CVG-DFW
CVG-SEA

DFW-ABE
DFW-CVG
DFW-SEA
DFW-SMF

ONT-ABE
ONT-DFW

PHX-ABE

RFD-PHX
RFD-SEA

SEA-BDL
SEA-CVG
SEA-ONT
SEA-SMF

SMF-ABE
SMF-RFD
SMF-TPA

TPA-DFW
 
sunking737
Posts: 1437
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:33 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 5:00 pm

One day a group of folks are going to say, LETS FLY PEOPLE on these flights to make extra money
I'm a SUNDUCK......Worked for RC & SY @ MSP
 
Whiplash6
Posts: 129
Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:30 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:13 pm

Anyone know exactly how much stock percentages-wise Amazon currently owns in AAWW and ATSG?
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:39 pm

Whiplash6 wrote:
Anyone know exactly how much stock percentages-wise Amazon currently owns in AAWW and ATSG?


Did they ever actually convert any warrants? There would be a press release or SEC filing somewhere if they did.
 
CallmeJB
Posts: 70
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:19 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Thu Feb 14, 2019 10:46 pm

wjcandee wrote:
Whiplash6 wrote:
Anyone know exactly how much stock percentages-wise Amazon currently owns in AAWW and ATSG?


Did they ever actually convert any warrants? There would be a press release or SEC filing somewhere if they did.

What a timely question. Amazon.com, Inc. just disclosed that they own 8.1% of AAWW common stock. I am not sure about ATSG.

https://fintel.io/soh/us/aaww/amazon-com

This is almost the same percentage that they purchased when they first got the warrants in May 2016. Since then their position has gone down and back up. It appears that they bough low, sold high, and bought low again. What a concept.
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7750
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:12 am

JB: I'm not so sure about this. Here's how I think it works. You have to file if the shares that you "beneficially own" are votable. Common stock plainly is. So far so good.

You have to disclose if you "beneficially own" votable shares of more than X percentage of the class of security. Also so far so good.

"Beneficially own" means to have the power to vote or direct the voting of a security, the power to dispose of or direct the disposition of a security and/or to have the right to acquire the security within 60 days through the exercise of a warrant or option.

So...if they hold warrants exercisable within 60 days, they have to disclose as if they owned the security outright.

The warrants vest pursuant to the terms of the agreement, which I think in general causes them to vest over time and in relation to how many aircraft Amazon dry-leases from AAWH's subsidiaries, such as Andromeda and Titan.

Moreover, because of the structure of the agreements, the warrants upon exercise cause the issuance of shares such that the higher the market price of AAWH stock, the fewer shares Amazon gets, and the lower the price, the more Amazon gets. So the reporting of different amounts of shares beneficially held can in whole or part be the result of variances in the price of AAWH stock at the time of the reporting. If it goes up, fewer shares; if it goes down, more shares. Once could validate this by examining the rise and fall of Amazon share beneficial ownership reported and comparing it to the AAWH market price. There should be a direct relationship if Amazon owns only warrants.

So I'm not sure this filing means that they actually have exercised any warrants.
 
CallmeJB
Posts: 70
Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:19 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Fri Feb 15, 2019 1:28 am

wjcandee wrote:
So I'm not sure this filing means that they actually have exercised any warrants.

That all checks out to me. Thanks for the explanation. I stand corrected.

:bigthumbsup:
 
cmairplaneman
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Fri Feb 15, 2019 3:44 am

Spacepope wrote:
cmairplaneman wrote:
Spacepope wrote:
Is there a way to know what engines are hung on this frame? The ones from delivery to ILN from AA? Some high time ones that the rest of the fleet won’t miss when they’re on an Israeli vacation for 6 months? Or did CAM hang their own power plants on it in ROW before it ferried out?


Don’t know. I do know that 354AA while in storage, had engines removed. Also, I’ve seen it at ILN where they don’t have engines during the checks prior to the flights to TLV.


Thanks.

I'm just very intrigued as this engine in particular seems to be giving a few more problems than we normally see reliability wise with the usual day to day operations. During conversion, do these engines just sit around waiting for the project to get finished or are these units serviced/overhauled at the same time?


I don’t think the engines are overhauled during conversion.
Glider Pilot & CVG/ILN Spotter
 
cmairplaneman
Posts: 132
Joined: Fri Oct 21, 2016 6:09 pm

Re: Amazon Fleet Discussion - 2019

Fri Feb 15, 2019 3:45 am

I wonder once 354AA arrives in TLV if that crew will bring back 730WE
Glider Pilot & CVG/ILN Spotter
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 15

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos