Is there any chance AA adds back FRA or MUC in the future from PHL?

Nicknuzzii wrote:

Is there any chance AA adds back FRA or MUC in the future from PHL?

I would guess once the XLR is on property it could be a possibility.


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Ishrion wrote:

Detroit313 wrote:

It would just be so odd to have a daily, successful route that has proven itself like ORD - ATH end on October the 7th while the brand new routes to Krakow, Prague and Budapest which are not daily and there's no history to rely on that they'll do well, fly until the 23rd.

In other words Athens would be an anomaly because every single other route ends on the 23rd. So fingers crossed.

Looks like PHL-DBV/TXL/ATH and ORD-ATH aren’t available anymore. So a week extension it seems like.

Well, that's sad. If Budapest and Prague can run until the 23rd of October both from ORD and PHL, Athens definitely could too in my opinion.

Detroit313 wrote:

Ishrion wrote:

Detroit313 wrote:

It would just be so odd to have a daily, successful route that has proven itself like ORD - ATH end on October the 7th while the brand new routes to Krakow, Prague and Budapest which are not daily and there's no history to rely on that they'll do well, fly until the 23rd.

In other words Athens would be an anomaly because every single other route ends on the 23rd. So fingers crossed.

Looks like PHL-DBV/TXL/ATH and ORD-ATH aren’t available anymore. So a week extension it seems like.

Well, that's sad. If Budapest and Prague can run until the 23rd of October both from ORD and PHL, Athens definitely could too in my opinion.

I’m not sure the Summer schedule is set in stone, more changes can come along. But with ATH being a very seasonal market it seems demand drops heavily into October.


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chepos wrote:

Detroit313 wrote:

Ishrion wrote:

Looks like PHL-DBV/TXL/ATH and ORD-ATH aren’t available anymore. So a week extension it seems like.

Well, that's sad. If Budapest and Prague can run until the 23rd of October both from ORD and PHL, Athens definitely could too in my opinion.

I’m not sure the Summer schedule is set in stone, more changes can come along. But with ATH being a very seasonal market it seems demand drops heavily into October.


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But it doesn't drop for Budapest, Prague and Krakow, for example? I mean, they run for a couple of weeks more, not a huge difference. But still.

Detroit313 wrote:

chepos wrote:

Detroit313 wrote:

Well, that's sad. If Budapest and Prague can run until the 23rd of October both from ORD and PHL, Athens definitely could too in my opinion.

I’m not sure the Summer schedule is set in stone, more changes can come along. But with ATH being a very seasonal market it seems demand drops heavily into October.


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But it doesn't drop for Budapest, Prague and Krakow, for example? I mean, they run for a couple of weeks more, not a huge difference. But still.

It might not drop as much. ORD-ATH seems targeted to cruise passengers or those going to the Greek islands for a beach/sun holiday. The other cities are themselves the attraction. No one goes to PRG for the beaches, so I wouldn't be surprised if PRG passenger counts stay high a bit longer. What a stunning city during Christmas too - wow!

Ishrion wrote:

DFW-KOA switches to the 763 from February 13 to March 5

I doubt that will stick. DFW does not see 763's. The schedule is only finalized to.2/12.

In March one of the 2 LAX-OKC frequencies will be operated by an A319. This isn't groundbreaking news for most of you, but significant for OKC as historically we have only had mainline service to only the largest of nearby hubs (ATL, DEN, IAH, DFW, etc.). It is encouraging to now get mainline service to other cities that have only been flown by RJ's.

vlad1971 wrote:

AA has no presence in IAD I think .....

I also think there is a good chance of IAD seasonally at least. As with BOS, no feed needed and there are very few large areas on the east coast that could support LHR with a 787/777 left.

Ishrion wrote:

usflyer msp wrote:

Ishrion wrote:

DFW-KOA switches to the 763 from February 13 to March 5

I doubt that will stick. DFW does not see 763's. The schedule is only finalized to.2/12.

There were some DFW-PHL and some other 763 routes over the summer.

There was also a 763 MIA-DFW service today.

I'm sure there will be more changes, but currently PHL only has 1x 788 flight a day for S20.

Ishrion wrote:

usairways85 wrote:

I'm sure there will be more changes, but currently PHL only has 1x 788 flight a day for S20.

What do you mean? Temporary DFW/LAX/ORD-PHL 788 at the beginning, then PHL-AMS/MAN/ZRH on the 788 before MAN goes 763 in March. Then ZRH will temporarily switch to the A332 for a month then revert to the 788. AMS will remain 788 the entire year.

I meant 1x on TA flights. Looks like PHL-MAN will be a 763. I was mistaken that ZRH is a 332 only up until the start of S20, but that schedule can change further into S20. And with only 1-2x 788 TA flights, the DFW/ORD-PHL 788 schedule may change.

PHL-ZRH on the 332 for a month is a bit random. Anybody know the reason for the up gauge, and for a month?


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chepos wrote:

PHL-ZRH on the 332 for a month is a bit random. Anybody know the reason for the up gauge, and for a month?

Probably covering a 767 retirement while waiting for a 787 on order to be delivered.

Ishrion wrote:

usflyer msp wrote:

Ishrion wrote:

DFW-KOA switches to the 763 from February 13 to March 5

I doubt that will stick. DFW does not see 763's. The schedule is only finalized to.2/12.

There were some DFW-PHL and some other 763 routes over the summer.

AA does not have a 763 base in DFW. All the 763 flights are to PHL or MIA where the 763 fleet is based.

Ishrion wrote:

usflyer msp wrote:

Ishrion wrote:

There were some DFW-PHL and some other 763 routes over the summer.

AA does not have a 763 base in DFW. All the 763 flights are to PHL or MIA where the 763 fleet is based.

The A333 isn’t based in PHX, yet it operates CLT-PHX-HNL. Don’t see why the 763 can’t do MIA-DFW-KOA.

It is possible but the the 763 fleet was consolidated to PHL and MIA was because AA management believed the spread out ops were part of the reason they were so unreliable. Having them fly DFW-OGG, away from their spare parts and crews would defeat the logic behind that move...

Delta will fly to Athens in 2020 from April 1st until the end of October. AA should start ATH on April 1st too.

Detroit313 wrote:

Delta will fly to Athens in 2020 from April 1st until the end of October. AA should start ATH on April 1st too.

I think they either start May 4th or April 4th, can't remember

Does anyone know what the plan in SEA is? They've essentially cut nearly 50% of flying to PHX, PHL, CLT, ORD and MIA while DFW has lost one frequency and LAX is left untouched. JFK unsurprisingly was cut.

Not sure if this was already mentioned, but good to see some 757 movements!
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... ia-in-w19/

Charlotte – Boston 08JAN20 – 12FEB20 1 daily
Charlotte – Dallas/Ft. Worth 18DEC19 – 06JAN20 6 weekly
Philadelphia – Orlando 03NOV19 – 17DEC19 1 daily
Philadelphia – Vail/Eagle 21DEC19 – 04APR20 1 weekly

CanadianRedneck wrote:

Not sure if this was already mentioned, but good to see some 757 movements!
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... ia-in-w19/

Charlotte – Boston 08JAN20 – 12FEB20 1 daily
Charlotte – Dallas/Ft. Worth 18DEC19 – 06JAN20 6 weekly
Philadelphia – Orlando 03NOV19 – 17DEC19 1 daily
Philadelphia – Vail/Eagle 21DEC19 – 04APR20 1 weekly

Also seeing the 757 on PHL-SAN mid-February.

IIRC I saw a post on here about 330's being transitioned for more domestic ops, can anyone confirm?

Sancho99504 wrote:

Does anyone know what the plan in SEA is? They've essentially cut nearly 50% of flying to PHX, PHL, CLT, ORD and MIA while DFW has lost one frequency and LAX is left untouched. JFK unsurprisingly was cut.

I don't know but I definitely don't see them building a hub in SEA. Delta is eating them alive there. Unless a merger with Alaska happens, but I highly doubt it.

Interesting piece on AA's objective in Charlotte. I didn't realize that it was the world's 3rd largest hub (in terms departures) and AA is planning on adding flights, upgauging, grabbing more gates (as previous posted here). The article mentions MAD a potential year round destination using the 321Neos. What changes do you foresee or predict?

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tedreed/20 ... b229727759

Well,

DL in ATL and AA in DFW are larger. Didn't realize AA in CLT was larger than UA in ORD

Ishrion wrote:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/tedreed/2019/11/18/after-building-dallas-american-airlines-eyes-charlotte-for-growth-with-700-daily-departures/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

One international route American is targeting is Charlotte-Madrid, which currently has seasonal summer service but can go to year-round with the 321XLR.

I read this article earlier today and was very intrigued by that statement about CTL-MAD. I wonder if a lot of current seasonal European routes from CTL and even PHL could go year round because of the 321XLRs.

Departures is a dumb way to measure carrier size. It ignores both gauge and distance. RPMs or ASMs is better; seats, if that's the best you can do.

Before adding more gates and flights, the ground operation needs to be upgraded. after landing, taking 15-25 minutes to reach the gate is just too long and its been this way for years.

There is *nothing* dump about hub departures; it gives a fairly good indication of the hub power in terms of connection possibilities. Not to mention future growth potential.

And for aviation nuts like me, the number of departures is closely correlated to the number of plane movements, which is a very good measure in my book anyway . . .

Like to see CLT build 4th and 5th runways

Is there any good measure of a hub that is based SOLELY on one aspect? Of course not. Each case is unique and worthy of its own independent examination.

For example, Chicago is a hub for three airlines at two different airports. AA's market share at ORD will be lower than at CLT, but that variable has now been accounted for.

In the case of AA at CLT, the number of departures - including regional service - is quite impressive! The fact that it continues to grow indicates that premium demand is strong, and thus will continue.

If CLT completes a 360 degree circling of the airport with taxiways, allowing planes to circumnavigate the entire airport rather than just via south of the terminals, efficiency will climb astronomically. It all depends on what needs to be done. If you can start to claim that your airport can "get 'em in and then get 'em out", you'll do well.

Congratulations to AA and CLT!!

MIflyer12 wrote:

Departures is a dumb way to measure carrier size. It ignores both gauge and distance. RPMs or ASMs is better; seats, if that's the best you can do.

RPMs and ASMs are good ways of measuring Airlines' sizes, but dumb for measuring airport sizes.

Airports are generally sized according to either the number of plane movements or the number of passenger arrival and departures.

How far someone is flying makes no difference to the airport...only planes and passengers.

chunhimlai wrote:

Like to see CLT build 4th and 5th runways

They are building the fourth.

Looking at capacity offered in the upcoming months, there is some evidence that AA is shifting connection capacity from PHL to CLT for Northeast-Southeast/Florida flow.
CLT may have some ground limitations, but PHL is located in the middle of a Northeast inflight logjam every time the weather clouds over.

I would love to see more nonstops in the west: Portland (more than one seasonal daily red eye), Orange County, maybe a resumption of Honolulu. With 700+ departures, I am still skeptical about an Asian nonstop, but who knows. I don't know the business and cultural connections between CLT/NC and Asia.

airlineworker wrote:

Before adding more gates and flights, the ground operation needs to be upgraded. after landing, taking 15-25 minutes to reach the gate is just too long and its been this way for years.

The only way to change that is to basically demolish the entire terminal and rebuild in a better layout. But I agree CLT is very annoying when it comes to ground movement and having to sit multiple times in a congo line waiting for an alleyway to clear for someone. God help you if you are on an Eagle flight landing on 36L/18R.