Planeboy17
Posts: 289
Joined: Tue Feb 06, 2018 2:18 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:37 am

Jet-lagged wrote:
vadodara wrote:
Seems like with Tech companies choosing to migrate east from likes of Seattle and Si Valley, AS’s best bet for expansion would be to follow them.


The tech companies aren’t migrating east, it is the other way around. Some are getting so big that they need to open campuses in more cities, but by and large the East continues to drained of tech headquarters and top talent as the West Coast’s dominanace endures and some secondary cities like Austin and Raleigh do OK.

Here is one recent example illustrating that, and it is pretty much the same story as the last several years.

https://www.unitedvanlines.com/contact- ... study-2018

What does van moving data have to do with tech companies?
I’m not saying your wrong but you should find some better data to support your claim.
 
Jet-lagged
Posts: 874
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2002 11:58 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 1:15 am

Planeboy17 wrote:

What does van moving data have to do with tech companies?
I’m not saying your wrong but you should find some better data to support your claim.[/quote]

Fair question. Other movers show similar patterns. These are families who are moving lives from on place to a another, and the old tech center are on the wrong end of the migration. Yes it’s broad strokes but it doesn’t contradict my argument.

Two years ago I had the chance to dig into some other data at the county level. Although states like California and Texas were basically neutral, when you dig into he Bay Area counties and Austin area there was a clear net inflow. I’m fact the Bay Area was a net gainer versus all other tech sites......except King County eg Seattle metro. In the case of NYC amd Boston/Cambridge the ratio was like 4:1 in Seattle’s favor. Again this is IT, not for example life science or finance.

You can watch the hundreds and thouands of high end jobs being added at each site by most of the world’s top tech companies. Geek Wire sort of keeps a list.

Also look at IT HQs or market cap. The Bay Area is in a league by itself and that doesn’t seem to be changing significantly, except for the PacNW, Austin to much lesser degree, and definitely China.

We will see what the future holds, but the tides have been flowing big for quite some years.

As far as Alaska Airlines goes, if they had to pick a region of the country to be concentrated in, they’d be hard pressed to find a better one than where they are now.
 
Buffalomatt1027
Posts: 381
Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2017 4:02 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:32 pm

AS flight from Boston to LA diverted to Buffalo. LOTS of people on social media not happy. The crew and pilots left ....and no one had a clue what was going on. Buffalo airport was closed for the most part. Not a good look for AS.
 
Chugach
Posts: 1206
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:18 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:37 pm

BoeingGuy wrote:

I am surprised that AS doesn’t fly to more destinations from ANC. They’ve tried and discontinued SFO, GEG, DEN, YVR, and LAS from ANC.


I think you answered your own question. DEN and YVR are Star Alliance hubs that can funnel connecting traffic from around the continent and beyond. AS had to rely on local traffic with a smaller market and hub on the ANC end.

They’ve been off and on with ANC-Vegas over the years. Seems to depend on aircraft slack and fuel prices as much as anything.

ANC-GEG was a shot in the dark. It only ran once weekly for one summer; personally I think it might have actually done better if it ran more than once a week but AS knows what the connecting patterns are between Anchorage and Spokane.

I still opine that ANC-SFO will come back eventually. It makes too much sense after the VX purchase and subsequent SFO expansion.
 
N174UA
Posts: 1010
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:44 pm

Seems to me like they are missing out on a growing market in PSC. This corner of southeastern Washington is growing fast, and will continue to do so. PSC recently completed a very nice remodel of their terminal, and gate 1 is a huge, spacious area that Alaska operates from.

But yet their only destination is SEA, with Dash 8s. They've tried on and off with service PDX, which was recently terminated once again.

Contrast that with Delta, which services SEA, MSP, and SLC. In peak travel times, SLC is served with 737s and A320s. Most of DL's flights from here are on the E175, with an occasional CRJ. UA serves SFO, DEN and soon LAX at the end of March. Allegiant (G4?) flies to LAS, and Mesa, AZ. DL, UA, and Allegiant operate with all jets.

I realize PSC is a much smaller market than the hubs, but other airlines here are building their service as demand grows, while AS maintains the status quo.
 
wedgetail737
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Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:21 pm

N174UA wrote:
Seems to me like they are missing out on a growing market in PSC. This corner of southeastern Washington is growing fast, and will continue to do so. PSC recently completed a very nice remodel of their terminal, and gate 1 is a huge, spacious area that Alaska operates from.

But yet their only destination is SEA, with Dash 8s. They've tried on and off with service PDX, which was recently terminated once again.

Contrast that with Delta, which services SEA, MSP, and SLC. In peak travel times, SLC is served with 737s and A320s. Most of DL's flights from here are on the E175, with an occasional CRJ. UA serves SFO, DEN and soon LAX at the end of March. Allegiant (G4?) flies to LAS, and Mesa, AZ. DL, UA, and Allegiant operate with all jets.

I realize PSC is a much smaller market than the hubs, but other airlines here are building their service as demand grows, while AS maintains the status quo.


Give it time. AS is pretty distracted with integrating VX along with PAE. I've seen more mainline aircraft being added to satellite WA airports for a while like GEG and BLI. They've even returned to BOI. So maybe they'll go to other destinations (other hubs) with at least E-175s.

DL/WA has always had a presence at PSC from SLC, initially with 727-200's.
 
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RWA380
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:04 am

Chugach wrote:
They’ve been off and on with ANC-Vegas over the years. Seems to depend on aircraft slack and fuel prices as much as anything.

ANC-GEG was a shot in the dark. It only ran once weekly for one summer; personally I think it might have actually done better if it ran more than once a week but AS knows what the connecting patterns are between Anchorage and Spokane.

I still opine that ANC-SFO will come back eventually. It makes too much sense after the VX purchase and subsequent SFO expansion.


I agree that with a rather low yielding market like Vegas, fuel prices have to be on the lower end of things to remain profitable to run, it's still a 5+ hour flight.

ANC-GEG was an experiment for a Saturday only service to see if it could be a supportable service, kudos to AS for trying. I too expect had it been more than once a week it may have had a better shot of returning.

I also would expect to see ANC-SFO on AS & from a hub to hub perspective it makes perfect sense. AS has flown it, but at the time SFO wasn't an AS hub. However one has to wonder, if AS added SFO n/s from ANC, would it create any single connection options that do not already exist going via SEA, PDX or LAX?

The local O/D market seems rather low (I am assuming based on past performance & also what UA offers in the market) compared to the SEA/PDX/LAX O/D market. With the longer stage length (x LAX), I think unless AS can capture most of the O/D, and / or make a true transit hub at SFO this may not be a front burner idea quite yet. I hope I'm wrong.

N174UA wrote:
Seems to me like they are missing out on a growing market in PSC. This corner of southeastern Washington is growing fast, and will continue to do so. PSC recently completed a very nice remodel of their terminal, and gate 1 is a huge, spacious area that Alaska operates from.

But yet their only destination is SEA, with Dash 8s. They've tried on and off with service PDX, which was recently terminated once again.

Contrast that with Delta, which services SEA, MSP, and SLC. In peak travel times, SLC is served with 737s and A320s. Most of DL's flights from here are on the E175, with an occasional CRJ. UA serves SFO, DEN and soon LAX at the end of March. Allegiant (G4?) flies to LAS, and Mesa, AZ. DL, UA, and Allegiant operate with all jets.

I realize PSC is a much smaller market than the hubs, but other airlines here are building their service as demand grows, while AS maintains the status quo.


WA/DL has owned Pasco since before I lived out in Hermiston in the 90's. Once they brought multiple times daily service to Pasco QX started losing passengers to DL. QX & UA were tied up & one could fly PSC-SEA-DEN, then QX split from UA & joined AS. UAX had their own PNW routes, competing with QX for years. I flew J-31's PSC-PDX-SEA-PSC.

QX is now feeding their SEA hub, the one flight a day they had to PDX was timed for East Coast & Hawaii connections mostly. It was good for a PDX day trip from PSC too.

wedgetail737 wrote:
Give it time. AS is pretty distracted with integrating VX along with PAE. I've seen more mainline aircraft being added to satellite WA airports for a while like GEG and BLI. They've even returned to BOI. So maybe they'll go to other destinations (other hubs) with at least E-175s.


AS has a mid-day r/t from SEA on a 738 to RDM & at least one MFR rotation is going to the E-175, both from Q-400's. The RON AS was taking at RDM on a 738, is going back to the Q-400 though. BOI & GEG will both continue to see E-175 & 737 jets. AS had reduced it's 25 flights a day to SEA out of PDX to just 16, with three flights a day being mainline (739, 738 & 320). Four flights a day are on the E-175, all QX operated & the remainder are Q's.
707, 717, 720, 727-1/2, 737-1/2/3/4/5/7/8/9, 747-1/2/3, 757, 767-2/3/4, 777-2/3, DC8, DC9, MD80/2/7/8, D10-1/3/4, M11, L10-2/5, A300/310/319/320
AA AC AQ BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WN WP YS 8M
 
jplatts
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:36 am

N174UA wrote:
Seems to me like they are missing out on a growing market in PSC. This corner of southeastern Washington is growing fast, and will continue to do so. PSC recently completed a very nice remodel of their terminal, and gate 1 is a huge, spacious area that Alaska operates from.

But yet their only destination is SEA, with Dash 8s. They've tried on and off with service PDX, which was recently terminated once again.

Contrast that with Delta, which services SEA, MSP, and SLC. In peak travel times, SLC is served with 737s and A320s. Most of DL's flights from here are on the E175, with an occasional CRJ. UA serves SFO, DEN and soon LAX at the end of March. Allegiant (G4?) flies to LAS, and Mesa, AZ. DL, UA, and Allegiant operate with all jets.


Connecting through SLC or MSP on DL is a much better option than connecting through SEA on AS if you are connecting to destinations east of the West Coast from PSC. UA also serves SFO and DEN nonstop from PSC, and connecting to Southern California or LAS through SFO from PSC is a much better option than connecting through SEA.

While SLC, MSP, SFO, and DEN are much better options than SEA is for the majority of domestic connections from PSC, SEA is a good option for connections to Alaska, Hawaii, British Columbia, and Asia from PSC.
 
wedgetail737
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:51 am

jplatts wrote:
N174UA wrote:
Seems to me like they are missing out on a growing market in PSC. This corner of southeastern Washington is growing fast, and will continue to do so. PSC recently completed a very nice remodel of their terminal, and gate 1 is a huge, spacious area that Alaska operates from.

But yet their only destination is SEA, with Dash 8s. They've tried on and off with service PDX, which was recently terminated once again.

Contrast that with Delta, which services SEA, MSP, and SLC. In peak travel times, SLC is served with 737s and A320s. Most of DL's flights from here are on the E175, with an occasional CRJ. UA serves SFO, DEN and soon LAX at the end of March. Allegiant (G4?) flies to LAS, and Mesa, AZ. DL, UA, and Allegiant operate with all jets.


Connecting through SLC or MSP on DL is a much better option than connecting through SEA on AS if you are connecting to destinations east of the West Coast from PSC. UA also serves SFO and DEN nonstop from PSC, and connecting to Southern California or LAS through SFO from PSC is a much better option than connecting through SEA.

While SLC, MSP, SFO, and DEN are much better options than SEA is for the majority of domestic connections from PSC, SEA is a good option for connections to Alaska, Hawaii, British Columbia, and Asia from PSC.



I respect your input on this subject matter, but I respectfully disagree with your statement that DEN and MSP are better hubs to connect to west coast cities than SEA. You will not find anybody connecting at MSP to go to LAX or SAN. I don't think it's too likely you will find many people going to DEN for west coast cities.

Even SFO sucks for connections to any cities (especially this time of year) because of the chronic delays that SFO consistently gets. But there will be many who do especially if they are Star Alliance or UA FF fliers.

SEA really isn't that bad when it comes to connections with AS...you only have three concourses for AS that are in the same area of the airport...the same goes for DL on the south side of the airport. Also, PSC-SEA flights are pretty short...about 30 to 40 minutes on Q400's. QX is also pretty centralized in the C-concourse. So, lots of connections are close, except for the N-gates. Now, there is a fly in the ointment since the train station at the C concourse will be closed for about a year. It's just my opinion, but I find SEA very easy to navigate and get-around to make connections.
 
N174UA
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:51 am

jplatts wrote:
N174UA wrote:
Seems to me like they are missing out on a growing market in PSC. This corner of southeastern Washington is growing fast, and will continue to do so. PSC recently completed a very nice remodel of their terminal, and gate 1 is a huge, spacious area that Alaska operates from.

But yet their only destination is SEA, with Dash 8s. They've tried on and off with service PDX, which was recently terminated once again.

Contrast that with Delta, which services SEA, MSP, and SLC. In peak travel times, SLC is served with 737s and A320s. Most of DL's flights from here are on the E175, with an occasional CRJ. UA serves SFO, DEN and soon LAX at the end of March. Allegiant (G4?) flies to LAS, and Mesa, AZ. DL, UA, and Allegiant operate with all jets.


Connecting through SLC or MSP on DL is a much better option than connecting through SEA on AS if you are connecting to destinations east of the West Coast from PSC. UA also serves SFO and DEN nonstop from PSC, and connecting to Southern California or LAS through SFO from PSC is a much better option than connecting through SEA.

While SLC, MSP, SFO, and DEN are much better options than SEA is for the majority of domestic connections from PSC, SEA is a good option for connections to Alaska, Hawaii, British Columbia, and Asia from PSC.


Definitely agree with you on SLC...not only does it have beautiful scenery around the airport, there seems to be no impact at all (yet?) from the complete rebuild they are doing there. I've never had any trouble connecting there, and look forward to when the new concourses are open in 2020. I've connected through MSP twice; not a big fan as it's such a huge airport, and DL operates those tiny CRJ's on the 3 hr flight to/from PSC. I'd love to see the E175 on this route, or bigger.
 
blacksoviet
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 3:20 am

Alaska is about to give up 7 gates in Terminal 1 West at SAN. Southwest will be taking over all of these gates. Alaska will be given 7 gates at Terminal 2 East. Soon, Frontier and Southwest will be the only airlines remaining at Terminal 1.
 
crescent
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 3:36 am

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:
AS flight from Boston to LA diverted to Buffalo. LOTS of people on social media not happy. The crew and pilots left ....and no one had a clue what was going on. Buffalo airport was closed for the most part. Not a good look for AS.


This sounds like a fun 24+ hours. Using fr24 data:

Original flight AS1367 BOS-LAX 615p-1017p on A320 N854VA left about 90 mins late.
Diverted to BUF after going about as far as ERI, landed BUF at 930p
AS sent another A320 (N837VA) which was in BNA, having done SFO-BNA and landing 3.5 hours late at 944pm. The return BNA-SFO at 715p was cancelled.
Deadhead flight goes BNA-BUF, leaving at 1204am, arriving at 254am.
Passengers are taken back to BOS, leaving at 426am, arriving at 525am.
The same aircraft (N837VA) now operating as AS9204, left BOS at 547pm, due into LAX at 904pm.
 
wedgetail737
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Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 4:02 am

blacksoviet wrote:
Alaska is about to give up 7 gates in Terminal 1 West at SAN. Southwest will be taking over all of these gates. Alaska will be given 7 gates at Terminal 2 East. Soon, Frontier and Southwest will be the only airlines remaining at Terminal 1.


There are 7 gates available in T2? Where?
 
LAXBUR
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:21 am

N174UA wrote:
Seems to me like they are missing out on a growing market in PSC. This corner of southeastern Washington is growing fast, and will continue to do so. PSC recently completed a very nice remodel of their terminal, and gate 1 is a huge, spacious area that Alaska operates from.

But yet their only destination is SEA, with Dash 8s. They've tried on and off with service PDX, which was recently terminated once again.

Contrast that with Delta, which services SEA, MSP, and SLC. In peak travel times, SLC is served with 737s and A320s. Most of DL's flights from here are on the E175, with an occasional CRJ. UA serves SFO, DEN and soon LAX at the end of March. Allegiant (G4?) flies to LAS, and Mesa, AZ. DL, UA, and Allegiant operate with all jets.

I realize PSC is a much smaller market than the hubs, but other airlines here are building their service as demand grows, while AS maintains the status quo.


A lot of airports all over the country are seeing growth but airline resources are finite. Especially for Alaska these days. If you look at the other small/medium airports in the Northwest you’ll see Alaska hasn’t done much. Boise will have over 4mil passengers for 2018 and is one of the fastest growing places in the US. Even with that Alaska cut Lewiston and will cut Salt Lake City from BOI. Spokane after all these years only has AS flights to SEA, PDX, and BOI. So the likelihood of PSC seeing anything but SEA is unlikely. All non-hub Northwest cities to LAX flying is done. SFO is too competitive and thus far only sees SEA and PDX service from the Northwest. For the time being there just isn’t anyplace for Alaska to go from PSC.

In summary, after this merger the Northwest is a lot less important to Alaska.
 
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FA9295
Topic Author
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 1:37 pm

LAXBUR wrote:
In summary, after this merger the Northwest is a lot less important to Alaska.

:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark:
 
tphuang
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:15 pm

I think PNW is just as important to AS as ever. They are finding out that the only place they can make money is in PNW. PDX may be loosing a couple of destinations, but it's still very profitable. They just adopted (imo the right one) of defending SEA at all cost. I don't see how they can adopt any other strategy given how important SEA is to them and how much money DL is willing to lose there. If anything, they are cutting back at main VX stations and continuing slow expansion in places they know well SAN/SJC.
 
LAXBUR
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 4:32 pm

tphuang wrote:
I think PNW is just as important to AS as ever. They are finding out that the only place they can make money is in PNW. PDX may be loosing a couple of destinations, but it's still very profitable. They just adopted (imo the right one) of defending SEA at all cost. I don't see how they can adopt any other strategy given how important SEA is to them and how much money DL is willing to lose there. If anything, they are cutting back at main VX stations and continuing slow expansion in places they know well SAN/SJC.


The Northwest includes other places that are not SEA and PDX - as noted. They have cut routes and eliminated stations within the Northwest over the years and those are that are left aren’t likely to see much in the way of new routes.
 
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SANFan
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:44 pm

LAXBUR wrote:
A lot of airports all over the country are seeing growth but airline resources are finite. Especially for Alaska these days. If you look at the other small/medium airports in the Northwest you’ll see Alaska hasn’t done much. Boise will have over 4mil passengers for 2018 and is one of the fastest growing places in the US. Even with that Alaska cut Lewiston and will cut Salt Lake City from BOI. Spokane after all these years only has AS flights to SEA, PDX, and BOI. So the likelihood of PSC seeing anything but SEA is unlikely. All non-hub Northwest cities to LAX flying is done. SFO is too competitive and thus far only sees SEA and PDX service from the Northwest. For the time being there just isn’t anyplace for Alaska to go from PSC.

GEG gained nonstop service to SAN late last year, and BOI is connected to both SAN and SJC (both of AS's focus cities)

I'm not saying that nonstops from Pasco to SAN and SJC are imminent, but I don't believe it correct to say there are no options for AS from the PNW besides SEA; SFO and LAX are perhaps unlikely, but my point is, those are certainly not the only CA cities that AS is growing these days.

bb
 
LAXBUR
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Jan 07, 2019 11:16 pm

SANFan wrote:
LAXBUR wrote:
A lot of airports all over the country are seeing growth but airline resources are finite. Especially for Alaska these days. If you look at the other small/medium airports in the Northwest you’ll see Alaska hasn’t done much. Boise will have over 4mil passengers for 2018 and is one of the fastest growing places in the US. Even with that Alaska cut Lewiston and will cut Salt Lake City from BOI. Spokane after all these years only has AS flights to SEA, PDX, and BOI. So the likelihood of PSC seeing anything but SEA is unlikely. All non-hub Northwest cities to LAX flying is done. SFO is too competitive and thus far only sees SEA and PDX service from the Northwest. For the time being there just isn’t anyplace for Alaska to go from PSC.

GEG gained nonstop service to SAN late last year, and BOI is connected to both SAN and SJC (both of AS's focus cities)

I'm not saying that nonstops from Pasco to SAN and SJC are imminent, but I don't believe it correct to say there are no options for AS from the PNW besides SEA; SFO and LAX are perhaps unlikely, but my point is, those are certainly not the only CA cities that AS is growing these days.

bb


Yes I forgot GEG got SAN service. BOI has service to SJC, SMF, and SAN on Alaska in California. Keep in mind SJC and SMF have been around for years now - maybe even a couple decades for SJC. Well before SJC was focus city. Those routes were also served from GEG, but cut. If we’re being realistic an airport like PSC will not be getting those routes anytime soon if GEG can’t handle them. Over the years Alaska cut BOI/GEG/MFR/RDM/EUG-LAX. They just ended EUG-SJC. GEG just got the SAN add. Boise is the third largest metro in the Northwest and Spokane fourth - both have large catchment areas because they’re very remote for lower 48 cities. Everything else is smaller. So I’ll stand by statement that these airports aren’t likely to see much in the way of Alaska route additions. Nothing against these places, but based on recent trends smaller airports aren’t very likely to see Alaska love.
 
Buffalomatt1027
Posts: 381
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:43 am

crescent wrote:
Buffalomatt1027 wrote:
AS flight from Boston to LA diverted to Buffalo. LOTS of people on social media not happy. The crew and pilots left ....and no one had a clue what was going on. Buffalo airport was closed for the most part. Not a good look for AS.


This sounds like a fun 24+ hours. Using fr24 data:

Original flight AS1367 BOS-LAX 615p-1017p on A320 N854VA left about 90 mins late.
Diverted to BUF after going about as far as ERI, landed BUF at 930p
AS sent another A320 (N837VA) which was in BNA, having done SFO-BNA and landing 3.5 hours late at 944pm. The return BNA-SFO at 715p was cancelled.
Deadhead flight goes BNA-BUF, leaving at 1204am, arriving at 254am.
Passengers are taken back to BOS, leaving at 426am, arriving at 525am.
The same aircraft (N837VA) now operating as AS9204, left BOS at 547pm, due into LAX at 904pm.



yeah i saw that on twitter ...... what a crazy 24+ hours. I am sure AS is not always like that.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9527
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:03 am

Buffalomatt1027 wrote:
crescent wrote:
Buffalomatt1027 wrote:
AS flight from Boston to LA diverted to Buffalo. LOTS of people on social media not happy. The crew and pilots left ....and no one had a clue what was going on. Buffalo airport was closed for the most part. Not a good look for AS.


This sounds like a fun 24+ hours. Using fr24 data:

Original flight AS1367 BOS-LAX 615p-1017p on A320 N854VA left about 90 mins late.
Diverted to BUF after going about as far as ERI, landed BUF at 930p
AS sent another A320 (N837VA) which was in BNA, having done SFO-BNA and landing 3.5 hours late at 944pm. The return BNA-SFO at 715p was cancelled.
Deadhead flight goes BNA-BUF, leaving at 1204am, arriving at 254am.
Passengers are taken back to BOS, leaving at 426am, arriving at 525am.
The same aircraft (N837VA) now operating as AS9204, left BOS at 547pm, due into LAX at 904pm.



yeah i saw that on twitter ...... what a crazy 24+ hours. I am sure AS is not always like that.


Most airlines aren’t like that but most have their moments. The hope is that they learn from them.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
LAXBUR
Posts: 260
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Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:54 am

Alaska doesn’t serve Buffalo and flight crews rarely get involved once passengers are off the plane. From my experience FAs and pilots are the first to claim “not my job.” And it isn’t really - they wouldn’t have a clue what to do. A bad situation but without further details hard to say what else could be done. Plus, being a former VX crew they probably felt even less obliged to do anything since their “culture” is gone. I drive rideshares sometimes and picked up a VX FO and he openly told the other passenger in my car Alaska is an “embarrassment” and at the “bottom for customer service.” They’re really not happy it seems about their “culture”.
 
chrisair
Posts: 2041
Joined: Fri Sep 01, 2000 11:32 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 6:11 am

LAXBUR wrote:
They’re really not happy it seems about their “culture”.


Sure bet they love the new paycheck though, even if it’s the fifth best in the industry.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9527
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 7:25 am

LAXBUR wrote:
Alaska doesn’t serve Buffalo and flight crews rarely get involved once passengers are off the plane. From my experience FAs and pilots are the first to claim “not my job.” And it isn’t really - they wouldn’t have a clue what to do. A bad situation but without further details hard to say what else could be done. Plus, being a former VX crew they probably felt even less obliged to do anything since their “culture” is gone. I drive rideshares sometimes and picked up a VX FO and he openly told the other passenger in my car Alaska is an “embarrassment” and at the “bottom for customer service.” They’re really not happy it seems about their “culture”.


Well I’m sure some are happy and some aren’t. The one and only diversion I was on was MorrisAir ANCSEA diverting into PDX at the crack of dawn due to fog. The crew ditched us in a dark terminal after proclaiming help was on the way. You’re right - probably not a lot they can do - but you do feel a bit abandoned and left to fend for yourselves. I’d hope that the communication would be better.
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
PacificWest
Posts: 90
Joined: Sun May 06, 2007 3:52 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 8:37 am

I think the saddest part of AS being forced to go all-in on SEA, is that they will end up cannibalizing the genuine loyalty of Pacific Northwest travelers in the long run -- and I mean real loyalty, not that kind that's bought with generous (expensive) mileage programs & status.

For those of you that grew up in the region: you fly Alaska Airlines for the same reason you go to Les Schwab instead of Tire Rack, or go to Bi-Mart instead of Walmart/Walgreens.

You think all the Amazon, Microsoft, and Nordstrom employees grew up flying AS/QX?

The loyalty of SEA business travelers will only get harder and more expensive to hang on to -- and if AS waters down it's loyalty program too much, Delta will crush them. Delta has a superior onboard product and a massive network that AS can't compete with. It's sad, but it's true.
 
airplaneboy
Posts: 678
Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 11:59 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 10:28 am

PacificWest wrote:
I think the saddest part of AS being forced to go all-in on SEA, is that they will end up cannibalizing the genuine loyalty of Pacific Northwest travelers in the long run -- and I mean real loyalty, not that kind that's bought with generous (expensive) mileage programs & status.

For those of you that grew up in the region: you fly Alaska Airlines for the same reason you go to Les Schwab instead of Tire Rack, or go to Bi-Mart instead of Walmart/Walgreens.

You think all the Amazon, Microsoft, and Nordstrom employees grew up flying AS/QX?

The loyalty of SEA business travelers will only get harder and more expensive to hang on to -- and if AS waters down it's loyalty program too much, Delta will crush them. Delta has a superior onboard product and a massive network that AS can't compete with. It's sad, but it's true.



Spot on. This is why Delta is willing to continue operating it’s SEA hub at less than ideal margins as evidenced by a.net user tphuang’s data in recent posts. Delta knows this, and they also know that a long term sacrifice will produce even better results down the road. What Delta can offer in terms of onboard product, as well as domestic and international network- far outrivals what AS can. Even despite Alaska’s rich history and well known reputation for customer service.
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 15375
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:13 pm

PacificWest wrote:
I think the saddest part of AS being forced to go all-in on SEA, is that they will end up cannibalizing the genuine loyalty of Pacific Northwest travelers in the long run -- and I mean real loyalty, not that kind that's bought with generous (expensive) mileage programs & status.

For those of you that grew up in the region: you fly Alaska Airlines for the same reason you go to Les Schwab instead of Tire Rack, or go to Bi-Mart instead of Walmart/Walgreens.

You think all the Amazon, Microsoft, and Nordstrom employees grew up flying AS/QX?


You don't believe AS has a laser-focus on ensuring their service isn't compromised? If that's what you believe, I can tell you that you're mistaken. AS knows they're built on providing caring, genuine service - it's the only thing that separates them from, well, everyone else. So that will never be given up, ever, and AS is spending $15M this year on having all employees attend a mandatory session with senior leadership to reinforce this very premise, that all employees, regardless of if they were hired by AS, QX, VX, etc. must pull together to provide that legendary service.

You mentioned Nordstrom. Ever hear the story of the Nordstrom clerk who once accepted a return of 4 tires simply because Nordstrom was known for their service?

He's my boss at AS.

Believe me when I tell you, the service difference at AS is real, and it's not going anywhere.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
jplatts
Posts: 2683
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:30 pm

airplaneboy wrote:
Spot on. This is why Delta is willing to continue operating it’s SEA hub at less than ideal margins as evidenced by a.net user tphuang’s data in recent posts. Delta knows this, and they also know that a long term sacrifice will produce even better results down the road. What Delta can offer in terms of onboard product, as well as domestic and international network- far outrivals what AS can. Even despite Alaska’s rich history and well known reputation for customer service.


CVG and JAC are the only U.S. destinations with nonstop service out of SEA on DL that aren't currently served by AS. All of the other U.S. destinations that currently have nonstop service out of SEA on DL already have nonstop service out of SEA on AS.

On the other hand, there are many smaller markets in Alaska, California, and Washington State that are served by AS but not by DL.
 
jbs2886
Posts: 2113
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2015 9:07 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:38 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
PacificWest wrote:
I think the saddest part of AS being forced to go all-in on SEA, is that they will end up cannibalizing the genuine loyalty of Pacific Northwest travelers in the long run -- and I mean real loyalty, not that kind that's bought with generous (expensive) mileage programs & status.

For those of you that grew up in the region: you fly Alaska Airlines for the same reason you go to Les Schwab instead of Tire Rack, or go to Bi-Mart instead of Walmart/Walgreens.

You think all the Amazon, Microsoft, and Nordstrom employees grew up flying AS/QX?


You don't believe AS has a laser-focus on ensuring their service isn't compromised? If that's what you believe, I can tell you that you're mistaken. AS knows they're built on providing caring, genuine service - it's the only thing that separates them from, well, everyone else. So that will never be given up, ever, and AS is spending $15M this year on having all employees attend a mandatory session with senior leadership to reinforce this very premise, that all employees, regardless of if they were hired by AS, QX, VX, etc. must pull together to provide that legendary service.

You mentioned Nordstrom. Ever hear the story of the Nordstrom clerk who once accepted a return of 4 tires simply because Nordstrom was known for their service?

He's my boss at AS.

Believe me when I tell you, the service difference at AS is real, and it's not going anywhere.


That may be the case and I am a big fan of AS. But, anecdotally, most people I talk to still feel DL has as good if not better service. For example, on my mother's probably dozen CHS-SEA flights, AS has forgotten to load her bag on non-stop SEA-CHS segments no less than 3 times. She is there 2 hours before the flight, on a non-stop, and AS has admitted its not a weight issue...the airline simply forgot.
 
User avatar
FA9295
Topic Author
Posts: 1770
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:44 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:59 pm

Due to the government shut down, PAE flights have been delayed until March 4th: https://blog.alaskaair.com/alaska-airli ... t=z0fIC36v
 
717atOGG
Posts: 831
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2015 2:10 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 8:16 pm

AS just loaded their first routes for the 737 MAX 9, which will begin in July/August: SEA-LAX/SJC/SAN.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... e-20190210
Long live the Boeing 757!
 
B6WNQX
Posts: 200
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2006 12:28 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:25 pm

717atOGG wrote:
AS just loaded their first routes for the 737 MAX 9, which will begin in July/August: SEA-LAX/SJC/SAN.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... e-20190210


Looking at the seat map, it appears they won’t have premium seats initially. Is this just an error or is something changing?
 
dc10lover
Posts: 1535
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2014 6:11 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:42 pm

Many people from PSC (Pasco Washington) take the short drive to Spokane and fly out especially if they are flying Southwest Airlines.

PSC: https://flightaware.com/live/airport/KPSC
Why endure the nightmare and congestion of LAX when BUR, LGB, ONT & SNA is so much easier to fly in and out of. Same with OAK & SJC when it comes to SFO.
 
AS737MAX
Posts: 455
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:48 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:02 pm

B6WNQX wrote:
717atOGG wrote:
AS just loaded their first routes for the 737 MAX 9, which will begin in July/August: SEA-LAX/SJC/SAN.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... e-20190210


Looking at the seat map, it appears they won’t have premium seats initially. Is this just an error or is something changing?


Tempted to book it but it's more than 5 months away still. Wonder what would happen if one were to book a seat where the rest of the fleet has premium..

AS737MAX (Clearly been waiting a while for this!)
 
LAXBUR
Posts: 260
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:05 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:19 pm

AS737MAX wrote:
B6WNQX wrote:
717atOGG wrote:
AS just loaded their first routes for the 737 MAX 9, which will begin in July/August: SEA-LAX/SJC/SAN.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... e-20190210


Looking at the seat map, it appears they won’t have premium seats initially. Is this just an error or is something changing?


Tempted to book it but it's more than 5 months away still. Wonder what would happen if one were to book a seat where the rest of the fleet has premium..

AS737MAX (Clearly been waiting a while for this!)


It appears to be defaulting to the old 739 map. If you book a standard seat in the current premium area they’ll simply move you when they upload the new seat map. Your assigned seat isn’t guaranteed. Especially if you’re not paying the premium up charge.
 
AS737MAX
Posts: 455
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 1:48 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Sun Feb 10, 2019 11:53 pm

LAXBUR wrote:
AS737MAX wrote:
B6WNQX wrote:

Looking at the seat map, it appears they won’t have premium seats initially. Is this just an error or is something changing?


Tempted to book it but it's more than 5 months away still. Wonder what would happen if one were to book a seat where the rest of the fleet has premium..

AS737MAX (Clearly been waiting a while for this!)


It appears to be defaulting to the old 739 map. If you book a standard seat in the current premium area they’ll simply move you when they upload the new seat map. Your assigned seat isn’t guaranteed. Especially if you’re not paying the premium up charge.


Figured - makes sense.
 
n7371f
Posts: 1552
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 3:15 am

Comparing Nordstrom to Alaska is comically bad. Sounds like a great boss though. Nordstrom service has always been exceptional.

EA CO AS wrote:
PacificWest wrote:
I think the saddest part of AS being forced to go all-in on SEA, is that they will end up cannibalizing the genuine loyalty of Pacific Northwest travelers in the long run -- and I mean real loyalty, not that kind that's bought with generous (expensive) mileage programs & status.

For those of you that grew up in the region: you fly Alaska Airlines for the same reason you go to Les Schwab instead of Tire Rack, or go to Bi-Mart instead of Walmart/Walgreens.

You think all the Amazon, Microsoft, and Nordstrom employees grew up flying AS/QX?


You don't believe AS has a laser-focus on ensuring their service isn't compromised? If that's what you believe, I can tell you that you're mistaken. AS knows they're built on providing caring, genuine service - it's the only thing that separates them from, well, everyone else. So that will never be given up, ever, and AS is spending $15M this year on having all employees attend a mandatory session with senior leadership to reinforce this very premise, that all employees, regardless of if they were hired by AS, QX, VX, etc. must pull together to provide that legendary service.

You mentioned Nordstrom. Ever hear the story of the Nordstrom clerk who once accepted a return of 4 tires simply because Nordstrom was known for their service?

He's my boss at AS.

Believe me when I tell you, the service difference at AS is real, and it's not going anywhere.
 
User avatar
FA9295
Topic Author
Posts: 1770
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 7:44 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:44 am

717atOGG wrote:
AS just loaded their first routes for the 737 MAX 9, which will begin in July/August: SEA-LAX/SJC/SAN.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... e-20190210

I'm surprised they're not starting them off on longer routes, like SEA-BOS/JFK/EWR/RDU/ATL...

Aren't these 737 MAX jets more efficient than the 737 NG jets on longer routes...?
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 4975
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:01 am

I think we'll see the MAX airplanes on longer routes soon. These short runs are probably to get the pilots prepared for them. They probably would be very effective to HI and Costa Rica.
 
ericm2031
Posts: 1055
Joined: Tue Jun 19, 2012 8:46 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:11 am

Probably want to keep the MAX on the West Coast to start where their crews and mechanics can get used to the fleet and work out any initial problems closer to home.

I'd expect them to make their way some of the longer haul SEA routes and routes that struggle against the winds.
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 15375
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:53 am

FA9295 wrote:
717atOGG wrote:
AS just loaded their first routes for the 737 MAX 9, which will begin in July/August: SEA-LAX/SJC/SAN.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... e-20190210

I'm surprised they're not starting them off on longer routes, like SEA-BOS/JFK/EWR/RDU/ATL...

Aren't these 737 MAX jets more efficient than the 737 NG jets on longer routes...?


They're starting them in places like SEA, LAX, SJC, and SAN to get maximum crew and MX/fleet service exposure to them early on, then move 'em onto far longer stages.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 15375
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:02 am

n7371f wrote:
Comparing Nordstrom to Alaska is comically bad.


Actually, that's the company Alaska Airlines has most consistently been compared to when dealing with retail. Although if you ask Brad Tilden, he'll tell you they don't want to be compared to Nordstrom anymore, they'd rather be like Costco; a place where you can get high-value, reasonably-priced items and service consistently and easily.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9527
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Mon Feb 11, 2019 6:42 am

EA CO AS wrote:
n7371f wrote:
Comparing Nordstrom to Alaska is comically bad.


Actually, that's the company Alaska Airlines has most consistently been compared to when dealing with retail. Although if you ask Brad Tilden, he'll tell you they don't want to be compared to Nordstrom anymore, they'd rather be like Costco; a place where you can get high-value, reasonably-priced items and service consistently and easily.


Makes sense. "Value".
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
n7371f
Posts: 1552
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:54 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Wed Feb 13, 2019 6:22 am

Compared to according to who?

Not trying to be a dick but come on, comparing Nordstrom to Alaska?

Would Nordstrom Air give a mere $50 to a 75k MVP for being downgraded from confirmed first class to a center seat in standard coach?

Would Nordstrom Air provide a pre-flight beverage in 1st class vs sometimes a bottle of water while 2 flight attendants chat in the forward galley?

Would Nordstrom Air charge for luggage?

Would Nordstrom Air charge for special seating?

Would Nordstrom Air charge a change fee?

Would Nordstrom Air wait until midday Monday, February 11 to initiate a weather waiver for the next day (given the forecast)?

Would Nordstrom Air have Club reps who can't handle reservation irrops but can enforce the 3 drink limit in multi-hour delays?

I could keep on and on...Don't compare Nordstrom to Alaska other than their headquarters. I'd also add Nordstrom has done a lot better expanding outside of Seattle vs Alaska.

Alaska is a good airline for Seattle who have had little expectations for decades.

EA CO AS wrote:
n7371f wrote:
Comparing Nordstrom to Alaska is comically bad.


Actually, that's the company Alaska Airlines has most consistently been compared to when dealing with retail. Although if you ask Brad Tilden, he'll tell you they don't want to be compared to Nordstrom anymore, they'd rather be like Costco; a place where you can get high-value, reasonably-priced items and service consistently and easily.
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 15375
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:23 am

n7371f wrote:
Not trying to be a dick


Sure.

You have yourself a nice day.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
JayWings
Posts: 72
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2016 7:26 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Wed Feb 13, 2019 12:01 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
n7371f wrote:
Not trying to be a dick


Sure.

You have yourself a nice day.


I have never wanted a “like” button on these threads more than I do for this.

Back on topic... excited to see what AS does with the MAX!
 
LAXBUR
Posts: 260
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:05 pm

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Wed Feb 13, 2019 1:59 pm

n7371f wrote:
Compared to according to who?

Not trying to be a dick but come on, comparing Nordstrom to Alaska?

Would Nordstrom Air give a mere $50 to a 75k MVP for being downgraded from confirmed first class to a center seat in standard coach?

Would Nordstrom Air provide a pre-flight beverage in 1st class vs sometimes a bottle of water while 2 flight attendants chat in the forward galley?

Would Nordstrom Air charge for luggage?

Would Nordstrom Air charge for special seating?

Would Nordstrom Air charge a change fee?

Would Nordstrom Air wait until midday Monday, February 11 to initiate a weather waiver for the next day (given the forecast)?

Would Nordstrom Air have Club reps who can't handle reservation irrops but can enforce the 3 drink limit in multi-hour delays?

I could keep on and on...Don't compare Nordstrom to Alaska other than their headquarters. I'd also add Nordstrom has done a lot better expanding outside of Seattle vs Alaska.

Alaska is a good airline for Seattle who have had little expectations for decades.

EA CO AS wrote:
n7371f wrote:
Comparing Nordstrom to Alaska is comically bad.


Actually, that's the company Alaska Airlines has most consistently been compared to when dealing with retail. Although if you ask Brad Tilden, he'll tell you they don't want to be compared to Nordstrom anymore, they'd rather be like Costco; a place where you can get high-value, reasonably-priced items and service consistently and easily.


And the Oscar goes to...

Based on this rant I think it was wise Alaska denied you more drinks in the Alaska Lounge. It seems like you would have likely had a meltdown that could be disruptive to passengers and employees alike.
 
phxa340
Posts: 1063
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:07 am

Re: Alaska Airlines Network Thread - 2019

Wed Feb 13, 2019 5:21 pm

n7371f wrote:
Compared to according to who?

Not trying to be a dick but come on, comparing Nordstrom to Alaska?

Would Nordstrom Air give a mere $50 to a 75k MVP for being downgraded from confirmed first class to a center seat in standard coach?

Would Nordstrom Air provide a pre-flight beverage in 1st class vs sometimes a bottle of water while 2 flight attendants chat in the forward galley?

Would Nordstrom Air charge for luggage?

Would Nordstrom Air charge for special seating?

Would Nordstrom Air charge a change fee?

Would Nordstrom Air wait until midday Monday, February 11 to initiate a weather waiver for the next day (given the forecast)?

Would Nordstrom Air have Club reps who can't handle reservation irrops but can enforce the 3 drink limit in multi-hour delays?

I could keep on and on...Don't compare Nordstrom to Alaska other than their headquarters. I'd also add Nordstrom has done a lot better expanding outside of Seattle vs Alaska.

Alaska is a good airline for Seattle who have had little expectations for decades.

EA CO AS wrote:
n7371f wrote:
Comparing Nordstrom to Alaska is comically bad.


Dude - half glass empty much ?

Alaska:
Complimentary upgrades to all elites
4 one way gold guest upgrades
Earn miles based on distance
About 1/2 the cost of majors to change tickets
FAs who actually care about people
31” pitch or more in planes
20 minute bag guarantee
Transparency on everything they do (see recent saver email that went out to elites)

AS offers all of these perks because they don’t offer the network that the majors do, and it works. Elites stick with them even though they might only offer 1x daily flights to a particular destination while Delta can offer 12x via a connection. To say that they people should have little expectations from them is, well... not based in fact.

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