sunking737
Posts: 1416
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Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Tue Oct 30, 2018 4:02 am

F9Animal wrote:
sunking737 wrote:
Remember SY had a hub in LAS for their charters before 9/11. They had a commissary there too. You don't have catering if you don't have a lot of service.


Yes they did, and it was a good sized operation. Sun Country filled a majority of the original A Gates, and the activity was pretty crazy. Tons of 727 and DC-10's galore.


I know I still worked for them. We used to load LAS Commissary supplies in the DC -10 belly's. So much was cheaper to buy in MSP and send to LAS. Beer, coffee, wine, paper supplies, the bev napkins etc. We are talking pallet of just about every thing. Not all at once but daily.
I'm a SUNDUCK......Worked for RC & SY @ MSP
 
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enilria
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Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Tue Oct 30, 2018 5:48 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
enilria wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
Ben has lost his mind.

I think he's becoming a one trick pony. He seems a little too fixated on a past job. I've seen that lead to bad decisions with other execs because one carrier doing well in a market does not immediately follow that another will. Each carrier has its own strengths and weaknesses.


It's interesting to see how he appears to be applying simplistic approaches to these markets; "There's X number of PDEW to be served, SY's CASM is Y, and because it's lower than the CASM of the other carriers, it's likely to be a winner..." without considering other important factors that could doom a new entrant to the market.

Having said that, he turned a director job at one company into a VP job at another, so he evidently did enough of a salesmanship job on the execs at SY to win their trust. We'll see how it pans out for him.

He's a very smart guy. He just needs to broaden his vision a bit.
 
PlanesNTrains
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Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:13 pm

They've added west coast-Hawaii. They've added some one-off LAS frequencies. They've added some PDX focus. They've added STS. They've added some other unique routes. For the size of carrier, what else could/should they be trying?
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
rainaviation
Topic Author
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:28 pm

Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Wed Oct 31, 2018 3:06 am

PlanesNTrains wrote:
They've added west coast-Hawaii. They've added some one-off LAS frequencies. They've added some PDX focus. They've added STS. They've added some other unique routes. For the size of carrier, what else could/should they be trying?


I think that the markets that they have expanded into make a lot of sense and the airline has even said they were profitable with the HNL service. If they wait for this massive fall expansion into BNA and PDX play out and it works, expand in those very markets for summer seasonal routes. They also should look at ways to expand in the Northeast. Maybe some flights out of CVG or SYR to places in Florida, which seems to match their current pattern of flights.

Past that, too rapid of an expansion may see them losing money. We will know a year from now if they will do good as an airline or not.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 9527
Joined: Tue Feb 01, 2005 4:19 pm

Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:34 am

rainaviation wrote:
PlanesNTrains wrote:
They've added west coast-Hawaii. They've added some one-off LAS frequencies. They've added some PDX focus. They've added STS. They've added some other unique routes. For the size of carrier, what else could/should they be trying?


I think that the markets that they have expanded into make a lot of sense and the airline has even said they were profitable with the HNL service. If they wait for this massive fall expansion into BNA and PDX play out and it works, expand in those very markets for summer seasonal routes. They also should look at ways to expand in the Northeast. Maybe some flights out of CVG or SYR to places in Florida, which seems to match their current pattern of flights.

Past that, too rapid of an expansion may see them losing money. We will know a year from now if they will do good as an airline or not.


Well my comment was related to the "broaden his vision" comment but I didn't quote the post. I was just pondering what that might look like to someone on the outside?
-Dave


MAX’d out on MAX threads. If you are starting a thread, and it’s about the MAX - stop. There’s already a thread that covers it.
 
32andBelow
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Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:00 am

EA CO AS wrote:
enilria wrote:
The head of Network Planning at SY as of earlier this year came from AS and the parade of former AS/VX routes continues. 3 of the 4 are current or former AS/VX routes.



Ben has lost his mind.

Ben M? That’s what happens when you out a mechanic in charge
 
zippy
Posts: 139
Joined: Sun May 11, 2014 9:46 pm

Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:08 am

DeltaPrince wrote:
Even after over 30 years of operations in various iterations, Sun Country’s public recognition footprint is just not big enough, IMHO, to pull off a sudden large expansion. They are no Southwest.


Huh? I recognize that name from when they abandoned a plane full of people in Mexico.
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:49 am

32andBelow wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
enilria wrote:
The head of Network Planning at SY as of earlier this year came from AS and the parade of former AS/VX routes continues. 3 of the 4 are current or former AS/VX routes.



Ben has lost his mind.

Ben M? That’s what happens when you out a mechanic in charge


No, Ben Brookman.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
LyingElectric
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Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Wed Oct 31, 2018 4:08 pm

enilria wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
enilria wrote:
I think he's becoming a one trick pony. He seems a little too fixated on a past job. I've seen that lead to bad decisions with other execs because one carrier doing well in a market does not immediately follow that another will. Each carrier has its own strengths and weaknesses.


It's interesting to see how he appears to be applying simplistic approaches to these markets; "There's X number of PDEW to be served, SY's CASM is Y, and because it's lower than the CASM of the other carriers, it's likely to be a winner..." without considering other important factors that could doom a new entrant to the market.

Having said that, he turned a director job at one company into a VP job at another, so he evidently did enough of a salesmanship job on the execs at SY to win their trust. We'll see how it pans out for him.

He's a very smart guy. He just needs to broaden his vision a bit.


He's not a very smart guy, that's a mischaracterization. I've worked with him before. He thinks he's the smartest guy in the room. He has gotten extremely lucky in his career and was days away from getting fired at both US and AS. He is the epitome of good timing.
 
ucdtim17
Posts: 548
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Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Wed Oct 31, 2018 6:26 pm

Chasensfo wrote:
But the majority of those flights aren't daily, and most travelers to LAS leave from SFO.


Just barely "most": OAK (509k) + SJC (435k) = 944k annual passengers to LAS, while SFO is 996k. Major regional markets have much more parity between the airports than transcons and international destinations that skew much heavier to SFO.
 
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enilria
Posts: 9288
Joined: Fri Feb 22, 2008 7:15 pm

Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Wed Oct 31, 2018 7:06 pm

LyingElectric wrote:
enilria wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:

It's interesting to see how he appears to be applying simplistic approaches to these markets; "There's X number of PDEW to be served, SY's CASM is Y, and because it's lower than the CASM of the other carriers, it's likely to be a winner..." without considering other important factors that could doom a new entrant to the market.

Having said that, he turned a director job at one company into a VP job at another, so he evidently did enough of a salesmanship job on the execs at SY to win their trust. We'll see how it pans out for him.

He's a very smart guy. He just needs to broaden his vision a bit.


He's not a very smart guy, that's a mischaracterization. I've worked with him before. He thinks he's the smartest guy in the room. He has gotten extremely lucky in his career and was days away from getting fired at both US and AS. He is the epitome of good timing.

Wow, quite a first post.
 
rainaviation
Topic Author
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:28 pm

Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 5:43 pm

SY149 (which is a scheduled flight number, not a charter) is flying from JFK to LAS right now. What is this all about? Did they start service from JFK to LAS?

Also shows that it is scheduled for Mon and Tues as well!
 
rainaviation
Topic Author
Posts: 188
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 5:51 pm

Did SY try to advertise those flights? I never even saw them make an announcement.
 
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jbpdx
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:13 pm

CES.
 
jetwet1
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Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:42 am

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:52 pm

UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> viewtopic.php?t=1407211



jbpdx wrote:
CES.


No, as I said in the thread linked above and was totally ignored by everyone who were thinking way to hard about it, Sun Country and Ceasers Entertainment are now both owned by Apollo Capital, Sun Country will (and has been for a while in some markets) show up where Ceasers has hotel casinos and Apollo can earn revenue on both sides.
 
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jbpdx
Posts: 690
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 8:57 pm

jetwet1 wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> viewtopic.php?t=1407211



jbpdx wrote:
CES.


No, as I said in the thread linked above and was totally ignored by everyone who were thinking way to hard about it, Sun Country and Ceasers Entertainment are now both owned by Apollo Capital, Sun Country will (and has been for a while in some markets) show up where Ceasers has hotel casinos and Apollo can earn revenue on both sides.


I see JFK-LAS for three days on their schedule, 6-8 January. After that, zip.
 
rajincajun01
Posts: 660
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2010 2:16 am

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:31 pm

jbpdx wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1407211



jbpdx wrote:
CES.


No, as I said in the thread linked above and was totally ignored by everyone who were thinking way to hard about it, Sun Country and Ceasers Entertainment are now both owned by Apollo Capital, Sun Country will (and has been for a while in some markets) show up where Ceasers has hotel casinos and Apollo can earn revenue on both sides.


I see JFK-LAS for three days on their schedule, 6-8 January. After that, zip.


And what’s going on in LAS during that time? Hmm....
A319 A320 A321 A332 B1900 B717 B727 B737 B757 B767 B777 B787 CR2 CR7 CRJ9 E120 ERJ135 ERJ145 L1011 MD80 SF340 AvGeek Superstore
 
blacksoviet
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Sun Jan 06, 2019 10:29 pm

What terminal does Sun Country use at JFK?
 
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jbpdx
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:14 am

blacksoviet wrote:
What terminal does Sun Country use at JFK?


After 8 January, none.
 
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RWA380
Posts: 5421
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:17 am

jbpdx wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1407211



jbpdx wrote:
CES.


No, as I said in the thread linked above and was totally ignored by everyone who were thinking way to hard about it, Sun Country and Ceasers Entertainment are now both owned by Apollo Capital, Sun Country will (and has been for a while in some markets) show up where Ceasers has hotel casinos and Apollo can earn revenue on both sides.


I see JFK-LAS for three days on their schedule, 6-8 January. After that, zip.


On the SY interactive route map, BOS also has a non-stop to LAS, also LAS is connected to DFW, SFO, MSP, PDX & LAX.
707, 717, 720, 727-1/2, 737-1/2/3/4/5/7/8/9, 747-1/2/3, 757, 767-2/3/4, 777-2/3, DC8, DC9, MD80/2/7/8, D10-1/3/4, M11, L10-2/5, A300/310/319/320
AA AC AQ BM BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WN WP YS 8M
 
e38
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Joined: Sun May 04, 2008 10:09 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:43 am

I have seen Sun Country aircraft at JFK at Terminal 4, Gate A-2; occasionally at Gate A-3 and A-4 as well.

e38
 
User avatar
FA9295
Posts: 1770
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 12:45 am

jbpdx wrote:
blacksoviet wrote:
What terminal does Sun Country use at JFK?


After 8 January, none.

Don't they have a JFK-MSP flight?
 
heretothere
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:50 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 1:15 am

UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> viewtopic.php?t=1407211


Lol, the OP is the one who started that thread in which this question was already answered.

jetwet1 wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> viewtopic.php?t=1407211



jbpdx wrote:
CES.


No, as I said in the thread linked above and was totally ignored by everyone who were thinking way to hard about it, Sun Country and Ceasers Entertainment are now both owned by Apollo Capital, Sun Country will (and has been for a while in some markets) show up where Ceasers has hotel casinos and Apollo can earn revenue on both sides.


This was simply an opportunistic add for CES in conjunction with SY’s exit from JFK-MSP. Not sure what is happening to their slots after this week.
 
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stl07
Posts: 1344
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:09 am

Wait wait what... The OP is the same in both this thread and the old one.
Interesting how every thread is spammed with "bring back paid membership, there are too many spammers"
 
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RWA380
Posts: 5421
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:40 am

UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1407211


Same OP, also OP is the last poster in the past thread, OP knew the answer to this question & is recycling old news to obtain attention. It's nice to have your topic take off & create a cool conversation, but why waste time when you've been given the answer over 2 months ago?
707, 717, 720, 727-1/2, 737-1/2/3/4/5/7/8/9, 747-1/2/3, 757, 767-2/3/4, 777-2/3, DC8, DC9, MD80/2/7/8, D10-1/3/4, M11, L10-2/5, A300/310/319/320
AA AC AQ BM BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WN WP YS 8M
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:43 am

Sun Country ends JFK this week.

No announcement. No fanfare.

They have continually served JFK for decades.

All very odd
 
rainaviation
Topic Author
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:28 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 2:59 am

RWA380 wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> viewtopic.php?t=1407211


Same OP, also OP is the last poster in the past thread, OP knew the answer to this question & is recycling old news to obtain attention. It's nice to have your topic take off & create a cool conversation, but why waste time when you've been given the answer over 2 months ago?


Because I totally forgot about that thread. Sorry I do not keep track of every single question I ask on this site.
 
rainaviation
Topic Author
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:28 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 3:01 am

jfklganyc wrote:
Sun Country ends JFK this week.

No announcement. No fanfare.

They have continually served JFK for decades.

All very odd


They are not ending JFK. I have asked many people working at SY and they are just working on their JFK schedule a bit late. They have always released their JFK schedule later than their other routes.

Unless something has changed since I asked. They could be choosing to discontinue JFK for IAD but that is doubtful. Who knows with SY, I could predict the lottery numbers easier than their route schedules.
 
KICT
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 4:59 am

LAS is hopping this week due to CES - Consumer Electronics Show.
People are saying. Believe me.
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 1:09 pm

It isn’t bookable starting this week. So a little late is an understatement
 
rainaviation
Topic Author
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:28 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 3:41 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
It isn’t bookable starting this week. So a little late is an understatement


I guess!
 
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spinotter
Posts: 466
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 1:37 am

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 5:10 pm

rainaviation wrote:
RWA380 wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Search and you will find your answer >>> https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1407211


Same OP, also OP is the last poster in the past thread, OP knew the answer to this question & is recycling old news to obtain attention. It's nice to have your topic take off & create a cool conversation, but why waste time when you've been given the answer over 2 months ago?


Because I totally forgot about that thread. Sorry I do not keep track of every single question I ask on this site.


Doesn't pass the probability test.
 
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SQ22
Moderator
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 5:41 pm

I have moved the old thread into the new one.

Advice: Please do a quick search for some users and for the others please keep a bit more relaxed. Some topics are popping up on a weekly basis.
 
asuflyer
Posts: 419
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 12:48 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 6:25 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
It isn’t bookable starting this week. So a little late is an understatement


SY is not cutting JFK. They have made JFK seasonal and it returns February 4th. BOS is seasonal too, resuming in April. The month of January the slowest travel month in NYC and for business travelers. Additionally, SY is short on A/C during their winter season, leasing 2 A/C from Transavia and can make more money sending the A/C to the Caribbean.
 
sunking737
Posts: 1416
Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:33 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:37 pm

SY is short one 737-800 for flying. N860AM, ship 831 has NOT be approved by the FAA due to govt shut down. It has been sitting in RFD for conformity before joining the fleet. Once D.C gets its act together then and only then can the plane leave RFD
I'm a SUNDUCK......Worked for RC & SY @ MSP
 
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spinkid
Posts: 1862
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2001 5:59 am

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 7:48 pm

JFK has been year round for quite a while now, so making it seasonal, even by just cutting it for a month is a surprise somehwat. I'm pretty sure they have some FF who aren't used to that. I'm surprised they don't add a sun destination from JFK and let themselves have a MSP-JFK--------------anywhere warm destination. They could keep JFK-MSP daily and offer JFK-PUJ 3X MBJ 3X and SKB 1X
 
heretothere
Posts: 36
Joined: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:50 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:29 pm

asuflyer wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
It isn’t bookable starting this week. So a little late is an understatement


SY is not cutting JFK. They have made JFK seasonal and it returns February 4th. BOS is seasonal too, resuming in April. The month of January the slowest travel month in NYC and for business travelers. Additionally, SY is short on A/C during their winter season, leasing 2 A/C from Transavia and can make more money sending the A/C to the Caribbean.


Doesn’t appear to be bookable on their website. Seems odd if it’s supposed to return.
 
airlinereporter
Posts: 108
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 2010 1:34 am

Re: Sun Country adds BOS-LAS, JFK-LAS, LAX-LAS, SFO-LAS

Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:52 pm

717atOGG wrote:
heretothere wrote:
Guys, they only added these routes for CES in early January. Time to calm down

Agreed...IMO this is a total non-event, and they're just shooting fish in a barrel for CES. They're literally only operating 3 RTs on LAX-LAS, for example.



Agreed, this isn't a thing and Sun Country shouldn't have added it to its map. JFK-LAS operated Jan 6-8 in that direction only. It'll do the reverse LAS-JFK Jan 11-13 and that's all that's in the schedule. This is merely some quasi-charter CES lift.
 
rainaviation
Topic Author
Posts: 188
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:28 pm

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Tue Jan 08, 2019 2:00 am

asuflyer wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
It isn’t bookable starting this week. So a little late is an understatement


SY is not cutting JFK. They have made JFK seasonal and it returns February 4th. BOS is seasonal too, resuming in April. The month of January the slowest travel month in NYC and for business travelers. Additionally, SY is short on A/C during their winter season, leasing 2 A/C from Transavia and can make more money sending the A/C to the Caribbean.


Where do you see it returning on February 4th?
 
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FA9295
Posts: 1770
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Tue Jan 08, 2019 2:03 am

rainaviation wrote:
asuflyer wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
It isn’t bookable starting this week. So a little late is an understatement


SY is not cutting JFK. They have made JFK seasonal and it returns February 4th. BOS is seasonal too, resuming in April. The month of January the slowest travel month in NYC and for business travelers. Additionally, SY is short on A/C during their winter season, leasing 2 A/C from Transavia and can make more money sending the A/C to the Caribbean.


Where do you see it returning on February 4th?

https://www.google.com/flights#flt=JFK. ... .USD.48830

But the price is awfully high right now ($489 one way), which usually happens when an airline removes a flight from their network. Is it not showing up on Sun Country's website?

Edit: Yep, it's not on their website--which likely means that they just recently removed the flight from their reservation system.
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Tue Jan 08, 2019 2:46 am

It has been removed for a while.

I have been actively looking on their website

Looks like they are done at JFK for now
 
F9Animal
Posts: 4192
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:13 am

Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:01 am

[*]Well, Sun Country is a different kind of animal now. I remember when HP had packed redeye flights into LAS, and JFK was a no brainer. And TWA also had a nightly JFK. Is there room for them? Is LAS a popular place for it? I really think Sun Country has done their homework. I wish them success and I really hope they prove the nay sayers wrong!! As most of you know, I love to side with the underdog.

Edit!!! I am late to the show! LOL
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
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jfklganyc
Posts: 5336
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Re: Sun Country JFK-LAS?

Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:42 pm

Looks like they are trading JFK for EWR

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