pabloeing
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LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 3:57 pm

Amazing news is coming.....the LEVEL CEO interview:
https://www.routesonline.com/news/29/br ... e+in+place
 
pabloeing
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:03 pm

¿Maybe the logical option is the A338 for the B787 backlog?
 
junlinwong94
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:08 pm

since they still have another 2 A330ceos on order, the most logical choice would be gong for the A338neo imo
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:10 pm

I wouldn’t rule out the 787. It has been the go to aircraft for Low-Cost Long-Haul airlines.
 
leyland1989
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:11 pm

they are probably throwing A330-800 in the bid hoping that Boeing will give them a better discount on the 787.
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:20 pm

This will be a very interesting sales-battle to watch. There will be commonality within IAG for both aircraft, and both manufacturers are going to be very keen to come out on top.
...love is just a camouflage for what resembles rage again...
 
BrianDromey
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:26 pm

Interesting they would look at the A338 over the A339. Their A332 configuration is surprisingly dense, seating 21/293 Vs Norwegians 787s 32/259(-8) and 35/309(-9). I would imagine that the A330 has a good chance.

In the wider group, 787s are already on-property and EI are looking for replacements of their five-strong A332 fleet. They may possibly want more for expansion, but they will have 12-16 A321LRs to digest until 2021. EI have mentioned A333s as 332 replacements, but if they want new -300s they are running out of time. I would think that a joint A330neo order would be in the region of 30-50.
 
senatorflyer
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:27 pm

Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.
 
Antarius
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:32 pm

senatorflyer wrote:
Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.


The list price of the 788 and a338 is nearly identical, IIRC.
2018: AUA CLT IAH HOU DFW COS DEN CLL ORD PEK PVG PHX SFO SJC OAK PHL YYC STL DTW HNL OGG JFK LGA EWR GIG GRU IGU CWB SDU MDW BOS IAD DCA PBI FLL MIA
 
pabloeing
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:34 pm

.....the delivery date will be the key......
 
senatorflyer
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:43 pm

Antarius wrote:
senatorflyer wrote:
Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.


The list price of the 788 and a338 is nearly identical, IIRC.


Willy was talking crap then... unless the journalist got it wrong and he referred to something else.
 
flipdewaf
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:47 pm

senatorflyer wrote:
Antarius wrote:
senatorflyer wrote:
Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.


The list price of the 788 and a338 is nearly identical, IIRC.


Willy was talking crap then... unless the journalist got it wrong and he referred to something else.


Or they don't pay list... :wink2:
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jbs2886
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:52 pm

senatorflyer wrote:
Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.


IIRC that was before Boeing really started playing ball on 787 pricing.
 
tommy1808
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:58 pm

BrianDromey wrote:
Interesting they would look at the A338 over the A339. Their A332 configuration is surprisingly dense, seating 21/293 Vs Norwegians 787s 32/259(-8) and 35/309(-9). I would imagine that the A330 has a good chance.


Makes sense for them to look at the -800 because they have a dense config. An A338 with smartlav and galley will seat a few extra people, giving you 32t of payload. You are then down to A339 brochure range. If you have such a dense config in an A339 you run out of range quite early and EZE is a bit far away.

That is also probably why they even consider it vs. the 788, that little A338 extra range on top of the, at normal density, ample range for almost all city pairs, starts to matter.

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tistpaa727
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:00 pm

Yep, pretty sure that was before, when Boeing was charging a premium to get in line for the 787. Now that they are coming down in price it is likely very different. Also, what else was he going to say? He can't say the price is perfect. He would lose all negotiation power with both manufacturers at that point.
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:13 pm

Antarius wrote:
senatorflyer wrote:
Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.


The list price of the 788 and a338 is nearly identical, IIRC.


I would expect the decision to be between the B789 ($281.6m) and A338 ($259.9m). The 788 is actually a fair bit cheaper at $239m, but is not well suited to the LCC market.
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wingman
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:21 pm

PlymSpotter wrote:
I would expect the decision to be between the B789 ($281.6m) and A338 ($259.9m). The 788 is actually a fair bit cheaper at $239m, but is not well suited to the LCC market.


Will the 788 be better suited once the 789 features are fully incorporated? I don't know if those will address efficiency, commonality or both. But if delivery dates are sufficiently far out then the 788 might contend here.
 
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JerseyFlyer
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:25 pm

Do they pick up any freight on the Spain to South America routes? I imagine the freight flow is strong there. That might make a difference in terms of the freight capability they need in addition to a full pax load.
 
Antarius
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:33 pm

PlymSpotter wrote:
Antarius wrote:
senatorflyer wrote:
Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.


The list price of the 788 and a338 is nearly identical, IIRC.


I would expect the decision to be between the B789 ($281.6m) and A338 ($259.9m). The 788 is actually a fair bit cheaper at $239m, but is not well suited to the LCC market.


Good point. I'm surprised the a338 is in discussion as well. Figured a 339 would be similarly better for a LCC.

Regardless, list is one thing, actual is another. Boeing has been playing aggressive with the 787 and I expect them to continue doing so.
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:50 pm

wingman wrote:
PlymSpotter wrote:
I would expect the decision to be between the B789 ($281.6m) and A338 ($259.9m). The 788 is actually a fair bit cheaper at $239m, but is not well suited to the LCC market.


Will the 788 be better suited once the 789 features are fully incorporated? I don't know if those will address efficiency, commonality or both. But if delivery dates are sufficiently far out then the 788 might contend here.


It may help, but it's still not going to drop the CASM significantly - the 788 accommodates around 50 fewer seats.
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behramjee
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:51 pm

The choice is actually between the B789 and A338.

The A338 I feel here can win as they would be sold at a very heavy discount price which Boeing won’t be able to match. Hence the lower capital purchase costs will end up being the big decider as I expect these planes to be with Level for the next 15 years at least.

Plus the CCQ - cross crew qualification rating with the A321 and A330 will help in saving costs over the long run !
 
BAWLGW
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:52 pm

What markets do we think LEVEL can 'aggressively' expand to?
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:56 pm

senatorflyer wrote:
Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.


In a vacuum, yes. However, financing for an A338, which has only about 10 orders right now, is a major issue. The 787-9 as a top-up order from the British Airways order book could make more sense. I’m expecting a direct order here.

BAWLGW wrote:
What markets do we think LEVEL can 'aggressively' expand to?


Once Level gets its own Spanish AOC, as well as using its French AOC, I suspect that they could fly on the Spanish AOC to lower-yield LATAM destinations as well as from BCN, allowing the A332s to get more premium seating. I could also see A332s transferred to Aer Lingus for expansion there. On the French AOC, could Level try overseas French territories, competing with Air France which uses heavier planes?
Last edited by aemoreira1981 on Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Antarius
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:01 pm

behramjee wrote:
The choice is actually between the B789 and A338.

The A338 I feel here can win as they would be sold at a very heavy discount price which Boeing won’t be able to match. Hence the lower capital purchase costs will end up being the big decider as I expect these planes to be with Level for the next 15 years at least.

Plus the CCQ - cross crew qualification rating with the A321 and A330 will help in saving costs over the long run !


I disagree. Boeing is pistol-whipping the a330 neo family; their supply chain is so good that they can and have been beating Airbus on price, while still being profitable. They even managed to get HA to dump their a338 order.

The a338 has a shot, for sure, but it won't be because Boeing is too expensive, IMO.
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:04 pm

Antarius wrote:
PlymSpotter wrote:
Antarius wrote:

The list price of the 788 and a338 is nearly identical, IIRC.


I would expect the decision to be between the B789 ($281.6m) and A338 ($259.9m). The 788 is actually a fair bit cheaper at $239m, but is not well suited to the LCC market.


Good point. I'm surprised the a338 is in discussion as well. Figured a 339 would be similarly better for a LCC.

Regardless, list is one thing, actual is another. Boeing has been playing aggressive with the 787 and I expect them to continue doing so.


The 339 is on paper a better choice but, as Tommy1808 mentions above, in a dense LCC configuration the A339's range is reduced. BCN-EZE may just be possible, (marginal?) as that's similar to KUL-LON (which is supposedly possible now, and key to AirAsia's order) however BCN-SCL at approaching 7,000 miles is going to be out of range. Plus if they are considering future expansion, the A339 is going to be more restricted at MEX, BOG, UIO etc... than an A338.
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georgiabill
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:11 pm

As much as I would like to see Level acquire 787 aircraft, I believe this is an A330NEO battle to lose. Fleet compatibility with IB will be the deciding consideration unless Airbus is unwilling or unable to make a competitive bid.
 
WaywardMemphian
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:18 pm

Well, they wanted Norwegians 788s and 789s.
 
Elshad
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:22 pm

Would be weird if LEVEL got the 787 since BA is the only other IAG operator (indeed the only operator of any Boeing aircraft)
 
rlo4934
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:32 pm

Willy Walsh also said in Feb. 2018:

"There is a development opportunity with Airbus and Boeing, but we see the Boeing 787 more and more as a future development opportunity for Level" quoted in Airliner Watch Feb. 26, 2018.

https://airlinerwatch.com/low-cost-long ... oeing-787/

I would still give Airbus the inside track on this one.
 
BAWLGW
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:36 pm

WaywardMemphian wrote:
Well, they wanted Norwegians 788s and 789s.


If they were to take DY's 787 from either a take over or by buying their assets after they've folded, I would imagine that they'd eventually be placed into BA's fleet.
 
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reidar76
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:38 pm

Antarius wrote:
behramjee wrote:
The choice is actually between the B789 and A338.

The A338 I feel here can win as they would be sold at a very heavy discount price which Boeing won’t be able to match. Hence the lower capital purchase costs will end up being the big decider as I expect these planes to be with Level for the next 15 years at least.

Plus the CCQ - cross crew qualification rating with the A321 and A330 will help in saving costs over the long run !


I disagree. Boeing is pistol-whipping the a330 neo family; their supply chain is so good that they can and have been beating Airbus on price, while still being profitable. They even managed to get HA to dump their a338 order.

The a338 has a shot, for sure, but it won't be because Boeing is too expensive, IMO.


Boeing has been very aggressive, trying to prevent the A330neo gaining any sales momentum. What Boeing did to win the HA order (sold at a loss), they can't repeat with this possible LEVEL order. It is strictly forbidden to sell below cost in a foreign market, when there is a locally produced competing product. In your home market you can sell your products at any price. That's why Airbus lost the HA order (Boeing home market), and why Boeing will lose the LEVEL order (Airbus home market).

The competition will be 787-9 vs A330-800. I wonder if LEVEL will go 9 abreast in the A330-800. The new Airspace by Airbus cabin might be good enough to make the shift to 9 abreast. There is no doubt that the A330neo wins the CASM competition when both aircraft is configured in 9 abreast layout.
 
Bricktop
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:38 pm

This is a must win for the A338. At any price.
 
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scbriml
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:46 pm

rlo4934 wrote:
Willy Walsh also said in Feb. 2018:

"There is a development opportunity with Airbus and Boeing, but we see the Boeing 787 more and more as a future development opportunity for Level" quoted in Airliner Watch Feb. 26, 2018.

https://airlinerwatch.com/low-cost-long ... oeing-787/

I would still give Airbus the inside track on this one.


He also said the 777X was “a perfect fit” then ordered a fleet of A35K. :wink2:
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VSMUT
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:05 pm

ikolkyo wrote:
I wouldn’t rule out the 787. It has been the go to aircraft for Low-Cost Long-Haul airlines.


Eh? Isn't it just Scoot, Norwegian and Jetstar? Combined about 60-ish 787s? Scoot and Jetstar both inherited the planes from their mother companies. Norwegian and Jetstar ordered and received the planes before the A330NEO had even been launched. By comparison, the Air Asia X order for A330NEOs is for 100x planes, putting the Airbus in the lead among the long-haul LCCs ;)

There has been some talk about LEVEL just being a loss-making tool to kill off Norwegian and other LCCs, after which it can be expected to shut down. IMHO, the fleet choice will reflect this - either the planes will be cheap and easily disposed of (leased planes), of be of a type that fits into the future IAG fleet. In case of the former, the A330NEO could be the favorite, while the latter currently favours the 787. It is worth mentioning that only BA uses the 787 in the IAG group, and future Aer Lingus and Iberia orders could upend that equation completely.
 
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seabosdca
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:37 pm

reidar76 wrote:
What Boeing did to win the HA order (sold at a loss)


Source? Boeing is not in the habit of selling aircraft at (intentionally) loss-making prices. If they were willing to do so, they would have won a whole bunch of potential 747-8 orders that they lost on pricing. The consensus seems to be that the HA order was enabled by an aggressive and successful effort to cut production costs.

reidar76 wrote:
The competition will be 787-9 vs A330-800. I wonder if LEVEL will go 9 abreast in the A330-800. The new Airspace by Airbus cabin might be good enough to make the shift to 9 abreast. There is no doubt that the A330neo wins the CASM competition when both aircraft is configured in 9 abreast layout.


If the payload requirement is low enough that the 338 is preferable to the 339, why wouldn't the 788 be in the mix as well? Unlike the 338, it has real empty weight savings (mostly as a result of smaller, lighter main gear) compared to big sister 787-9. It has a range deficit compared to the 338, but I have a hard time believing LEVEL is going to be flying ULH.
 
ramzi
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:02 pm

I will be very surprised if they pick the 787s. Isn't LEVEL essentially a brand operated by Iberia so far? Commonality with Iberia, and to a lesser extent Vueling, makes this a no brainer.
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jfk777
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:09 pm

senatorflyer wrote:
Willy once said the 787 is too expensive (purchase) for a LCC. Given that both IB and AerLingus operate A330s I would place my bet on the A330 not the 787.


Several years from now Level could take old BA 787-8 and IAG could buy new 787-9/ -10 for BA. Hopefully new BA planes with a new Club World. A350-900 could do the job too at Level too. IAG could always merge with Norwegian or,if they go broke, buy their 787-9 at the Bankruptcy auction. Level id growing one way or another.
 
smartplane
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:16 pm

Another factor influencing selection, given the possible implications of IAG operations post-Brexit, is to make a pro-European acquisition.
 
PlymSpotter
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:20 pm

seabosdca wrote:
If the payload requirement is low enough that the 338 is preferable to the 339, why wouldn't the 788 be in the mix as well? Unlike the 338, it has real empty weight savings (mostly as a result of smaller, lighter main gear) compared to big sister 787-9. It has a range deficit compared to the 338, but I have a hard time believing LEVEL is going to be flying ULH.


It is the performance requirement, not payload. Certain airports in South and Central America are outside of the 'safe' range of the A339 from BCN, or are at an altitude where departures back to Europe are likely face payload restrictions with a high density layout.

Level are already going to be operating BCN-SCL - that's almost 7000 miles and 14h 40m outbound - basically approaching an ULH route.
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seabosdca
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:48 pm

PlymSpotter wrote:
Level are already going to be operating BCN-SCL - that's almost 7000 miles and 14h 40m outbound - basically approaching an ULH route.


That is well within the capability of the 788. Both the 788 and the 332 have outstanding hot and high performance, and I'd expect the 338 to as well. The 789 is good but not as good.
 
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Irehdna
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:49 pm

Yeah this is interesting. Keep in mind though that I would associate LV with IAG as a whole, not just IB. IIRC BA has never owned/operated the A330.

Personally, I think LV will end up choosing the 788. The A338 will force a slightly-lower 8-abreast configuration, while it would be easier to pack more people into a 788's 3-3-3 economy. They could even try 2-3-2 business/premium with the 788.

Some of the upcoming LV routes are rather long. The upcoming BCN-SCL will by a couple km beat AR's FCO-EZE as the longest A330 flight, and with LV's relatively more dense configuration, the A332 may already be pushed to the limits on that flight. Keep in mind that many S. American airports (not SCL, but think SJO, BOG, UIO) are high-altitude, which further diminishes a twinjet's capability. The 788 should have the range for such flights, not so sure about the A338/A339.
 
downdata
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:23 pm

Irehdna wrote:
Yeah this is interesting. Keep in mind though that I would associate LV with IAG as a whole, not just IB. IIRC BA has never owned/operated the A330.

Personally, I think LV will end up choosing the 788. The A338 will force a slightly-lower 8-abreast configuration, while it would be easier to pack more people into a 788's 3-3-3 economy. They could even try 2-3-2 business/premium with the 788.

Some of the upcoming LV routes are rather long. The upcoming BCN-SCL will by a couple km beat AR's FCO-EZE as the longest A330 flight, and with LV's relatively more dense configuration, the A332 may already be pushed to the limits on that flight. Keep in mind that many S. American airports (not SCL, but think SJO, BOG, UIO) are high-altitude, which further diminishes a twinjet's capability. The 788 should have the range for such flights, not so sure about the A338/A339.


The A338 has 500nm more range than 788 at a similar payload (hence more payload at a similar range). Remeber 789 is the longer ranged aircraft in the 787 family.
 
marcogr12
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:38 pm

Why should it be either/or and not both the A338 n A339 (firm.orders n options with the right to convert), catering to the needs of every route with the appropriate a/c..?
 
PlymSpotter
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:38 pm

seabosdca wrote:
PlymSpotter wrote:
Level are already going to be operating BCN-SCL - that's almost 7000 miles and 14h 40m outbound - basically approaching an ULH route.


That is well within the capability of the 788. Both the 788 and the 332 have outstanding hot and high performance, and I'd expect the 338 to as well. The 789 is good but not as good.


Yes it is - but I was explaining why the A338 is preferable to the A339 here, not talking about the 788 or 789.

Irehdna wrote:
Personally, I think LV will end up choosing the 788. The A338 will force a slightly-lower 8-abreast configuration, while it would be easier to pack more people into a 788's 3-3-3 economy. They could even try 2-3-2 business/premium with the 788.

Some of the upcoming LV routes are rather long. The upcoming BCN-SCL will by a couple km beat AR's FCO-EZE as the longest A330 flight, and with LV's relatively more dense configuration, the A332 may already be pushed to the limits on that flight. Keep in mind that many S. American airports (not SCL, but think SJO, BOG, UIO) are high-altitude, which further diminishes a twinjet's capability. The 788 should have the range for such flights, not so sure about the A338/A339.


This will almost certainly be a B789 vs A338 competition. The B788 is quite a lot smaller than the A332 and would likely not offer a significant reduction in CASM compared to the current fleet. Both the A338 and the B788/789 will have no meaningful performance or range issues from the hot and high airports, not so with the larger A339.
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seabosdca
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:58 pm

PlymSpotter wrote:
This will almost certainly be a B789 vs A338 competition. The B788 is quite a lot smaller than the A332 and would likely not offer a significant reduction in CASM compared to the current fleet. Both the A338 and the B788/789 will have no meaningful performance or range issues from the hot and high airports, not so with the larger A339.


The 788 is a bit (not a lot) smaller than the 332 in floor area, but assuming 8Y in the 332 and 9Y in the 788, the two aircraft typically have almost the same capacity. The 789 by contrast is quite a lot bigger.

As an example where hot and high performance is relevant, look at Avianca - the 332 has 252 seats, and the 788 has 250--and that's with a less space-efficient business product on the 788.

Similarly, Qatar has 252 on their 788s and 262, with a tighter business-class product, on their 332 configuration that is most similar in density to the 788.

If LEVEL is looking at 9Y A330s, that's a different story, but their current 332 product is 8Y.

I don't mean to dwell endlessly on this; I just don't see why the 788 wouldn't be considered in this contest or be a reasonable product for these missions.
 
Byrdluvs747
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Sat Jan 12, 2019 12:15 am

I don't understand the rush to order 787/A338s when there are so few NB aircraft in the LV fleet. Their VIE operation is rather pathetic and is in desperate need of more A320 metal.
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musman9853
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Sat Jan 12, 2019 3:59 am

Iberia and level combined only have like 25 ceos. With the financing advantage the 787 has over the neo, I think this is Boeings order to lose
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:39 am

VSMUT wrote:
ikolkyo wrote:
I wouldn’t rule out the 787. It has been the go to aircraft for Low-Cost Long-Haul airlines.

Eh? Isn't it just Scoot, Norwegian and Jetstar?

Depends on how one defines "Low-Cost Longhaul" airlines.

Can definitely add Thomson (and arguably) WestJet, to that list.
Last edited by LAX772LR on Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:39 am, edited 1 time in total.
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ewt340
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:39 am

I'd say A330-800 because the big big discount Airbus willing to give to them.
 
tommy1808
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Re: LEVEL to order B787 or A330-800

Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:17 am

seabosdca wrote:
PlymSpotter wrote:
This will almost certainly be a B789 vs A338 competition. The B788 is quite a lot smaller than the A332 and would likely not offer a significant reduction in CASM compared to the current fleet. Both the A338 and the B788/789 will have no meaningful performance or range issues from the hot and high airports, not so with the larger A339.


The 788 is a bit (not a lot) smaller than the 332 in floor area, but assuming 8Y in the 332 and 9Y in the 788, the two aircraft typically have almost the same capacity. The 789 by contrast is quite a lot bigger.
.......
I don't mean to dwell endlessly on this; I just don't see why the 788 wouldn't be considered in this contest or be a reasonable product for these missions.


Because the 787-8 has less range. 6000nm great circle, BCN-SCL, are on the very edge what it can do with a high density cabin. The 787-9 and A338 do that comfortably, with the A338 outranging the Boeing, simply because of less payload due to the smaller cabin and the extra fuel that allows on board.

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