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FlapsOne
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Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 4:39 pm

The bloodbath in the skies continue in Europe it would seem. Rumours abound of foreign based planes returned to England, nightstops over the weekend cancelled and crew changed to home standby which is not a good sign.
Tickets remain on sale at this time.

https://aviationanalyst.co.uk/2019/02/16/exclusive%E2%80%8B-flybmi-set-to-collapse/

Not only would it be devastating to those who rely on and use bmi, it would be a tragedy to see another iconic name disappear from the skies.

At 16:44 UK time flight BMR9162 is routing Karlstad to Norwich and BMR9162 is rioting Munich to Norwich. BMR1846 just touched down in Bristol from Munich. Could this possibly be the last ever scheduled flight under the bmi name.

A very basic history if you’re not familiar with bmi; it can trace its history back to the 1930’s, the British Midland name has been around since 1964 and the ‘bmi’ brand since 2001. In the end it was three entities; bmi (short haul and a long haul hub in MAN - Manchester), bmi baby (low cost carrier) and bmi regional (commuter routes). Mainline and baby went years ago but bmi regional (later re-rebranding to bmi) continues to fly regional routes on ERJs mainly to, from and within the UK. Wiki explains it in greater details.
Last edited by FlapsOne on Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
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SASViking
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 4:57 pm

It would be a shame. I've flown them a few times and the service was great.
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
FlapsOne
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:04 pm

A second plane has left Munich as BMR9163 with Norwich as a destination.
 
FlapsOne
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:06 pm

SASViking wrote:
It would be a shame. I've flown them a few times and the service was great.


It’s sad for the employees and sad from a nostalgic point of view. I also fear gravely for UK regional connectivity. Many markets can’t sustain A319/320/737 services and the alternatives are basket cases and I have no faith in flyBE or Eastern Airways stepping up to provide a reliable alternative.
 
Fitlikemin
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:08 pm

Imagine what it may be like for ABZ - many regional flights are bmi, Flybe or Eastern!!
 
by738
Posts: 3102
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2000 7:59 am

Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:15 pm

Hope this does not impact on the other airline within the group Loganair. Though with their critical social services, would be the sort of thing Scottish Government would probably intervene with
 
FlapsOne
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Posts: 156
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:44 pm

No flights seem to be bookable on Bristol to Munich, Munich to Bristol, Bristol to Aberdeen, Standsted to Londonderry or Newcastle to Brussels over the next few days. There certainly was Newcastle to Brussels flights available for tomorrow when I checked so something has changed.
 
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OA260
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:18 pm

Sad to see unless they can secure funding in the next few hours it seems another brand will be gone from the UK skies.
 
skipness1E
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:33 pm

The sheer glee and self importance of Alex Macheras makes me sick
 
LHRFlyer
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Re: Trouble at BMI?i

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:37 pm

skipness1E wrote:
The sheer glee and self importance of Alex Macheras makes me sick


The same happened with Monarch. He was completely oblivious to how he much was upsetting staff with his tweets.
 
davidjohnson6
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:38 pm

All over - see www.flybmi.com
 
FlapsOne
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:38 pm

skipness1E wrote:
The sheer glee and self importance of Alex Macheras makes me sick


He is a disgusting little creature but his upbringing is far removed from any money worries that the crews will be having soon. He's never actually worked an honest day in his life and is wheeled out whenever there's a crash to give his expert opinion on events. The privilege of having a comfortable upbringing and well connected parents.

There's a meeting for staff at 1830BST.
 
mattyfitzg
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FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:50 pm

Another very sad day for UK aviation, flybmi ceased operations at 18:30 today 16/02/19.

See www.flybmi.com for a statement from the airline.

Let’s hope this trend doesn’t continue
 
Armodeen
Posts: 1265
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:56 pm

Airline Flybmi goes into administration http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47267901

Breaking news on BBC right now.

I am shocked, I didn’t think it would come to this.
 
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JannEejit
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:57 pm

Just hitting the news now. What will it mean for sister group airline Loganair, if anything ?

BBC News - Airline Flybmi goes into administration
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-47267901
 
TheDBCooper
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:57 pm

What a shame, I hoped they'd be able to continue flying. Any word on what effect this will have on Loganair?
 
UKflyboy
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:57 pm

Gutted for them.
 
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Channex757
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:59 pm

That would explain the transfer of two aircraft to Loganair that BM were internally leasing to them. A sad day nonetheless, but Embraer 145s and 135s are hard to make money with as a standalone fleet.
 
Midland2ev
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:01 pm

What a shame, I used to work for BMI at lhr,good little airline back in the day, I hoped the BMI Regional would do well but it’s a cut throat business
 
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Channex757
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:05 pm

TheDBCooper wrote:
What a shame, I hoped they'd be able to continue flying. Any word on what effect this will have on Loganair?

Separate company, apparently. They may have had the same ownership in AIL but the two brands were retained as standalone units with different business profiles.
 
Summa767
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:12 pm

The statement by flybmi is quite candid in its explanation about how Brexit has proven to be its downfall.
 
TC957
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:14 pm

Perhaps this could be a shot in the arm for Flybe, and save them from a similar fate.
 
jomur
Posts: 353
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:20 pm

Summa767 wrote:
The statement by flybmi is quite candid in its explanation about how Brexit has proven to be its downfall.


Far too easy nowadays to blame Brexit.....
 
Summa767
Posts: 1847
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 1:30 am

Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:24 pm

jomur wrote:

Far too easy nowadays to blame Brexit.....


Have you even bothered to read the statement? Or do you have your own “alternative facts”?
 
skipness1E
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:26 pm

TC957 wrote:
Perhaps this could be a shot in the arm for Flybe, and save them from a similar fate.

This could kill flybe. Look at the number of social media posts conflating flybmi and flybe going bust tonight.
 
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JannEejit
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Re: Trouble at BMI?

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:27 pm

Channex757 wrote:
TheDBCooper wrote:
What a shame, I hoped they'd be able to continue flying. Any word on what effect this will have on Loganair?

Separate company, apparently. They may have had the same ownership in AIL but the two brands were retained as standalone units with different business profiles.


Loganair unaffected apparently.
 
Fitlikemin
Posts: 73
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 6:20 pm

Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:28 pm

jomur wrote:
Summa767 wrote:
The statement by flybmi is quite candid in its explanation about how Brexit has proven to be its downfall.


Far too easy nowadays to blame Brexit.....


Far too easy for doubters to dismiss Brexit as a valid reason for a company to go under. Surely they would be in best position to know, and if they have referenced it then there must be some substance behind it.

One wonders how bad job losses must get before Brexiteers wake up and smell the gammon.
 
Armaghman
Posts: 125
Joined: Tue Sep 13, 2016 8:34 pm

Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:36 pm

This will be a big impact on Derry airport. Only 2 days ago announced additional funding for nex 3 years for standees route

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern- ... t-47237041
 
Gingersnap
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:37 pm

Fitlikemin wrote:
jomur wrote:
Summa767 wrote:
The statement by flybmi is quite candid in its explanation about how Brexit has proven to be its downfall.


Far too easy nowadays to blame Brexit.....


Far too easy for doubters to dismiss Brexit as a valid reason for a company to go under. Surely they would be in best position to know, and if they have referenced it then there must be some substance behind it.

One wonders how bad job losses must get before Brexiteers wake up and smell the gammon.


The fact you used the word "gammon" says enough about where your loyalties lay. That doesn't mean anything other than you're also on the blame everything on Brexit train, which is fine.

Just don't try and present it as fact.

They were a poor airline, with routes that made no sense to anyone for the most part with a brand that should have died off when the original went under. I was never sure they knew what they wanted to be. But that would be admitting failure, so it's much easier to throw the blame on something else which other airlines are having little to no trouble navigating.

Easy cop out IMHO.
Flown on: A306 A319/20/21 A332 B732/3/4/5/7/8 B742/4 B752 B762/3 B772/W B788 C152 E195 F70/100 MD-82 Q400
 
MHG
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:37 pm

jomur wrote:
Summa767 wrote:
The statement by flybmi is quite candid in its explanation about how Brexit has proven to be its downfall.


Far too easy nowadays to blame Brexit.....

Although it may seem like a cheap excuse - I believe it´s not.

If you take a closer look at their business model you may recognize that a substantial number of their flights operate solely within EU (the EU without UK after march 29)
flyBMI has been looking for investors/partners in the EU for quite a while in order to secure their EU OPS after Brexit.
Seems they failed to find investors due to the uncertaincy Brexit in its most likely scenario has created.
Combined with limited opportunities on the British domestic market the general outlook was not very promising.

So, IMHO they are indeed an early victim of Brexit.
Although Brexit certainly is not the sole reason it was likely the one which finally broke their neck.
Last edited by MHG on Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Flying is not inherently dangerous but it is very unforgiving in case of carelessness, incapacity or neglect.
 
BTC
Posts: 23
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:38 pm

skipness1E wrote:
TC957 wrote:
Perhaps this could be a shot in the arm for Flybe, and save them from a similar fate.

This could kill flybe. Look at the number of social media posts conflating flybmi and flybe going bust tonight.


Do they still do flying for Flybe? And if they do, what happens to that?
As for that so called "expert", you're spot on.
Flown in :- A319, A320, A321, A332, A359, BAC ATP, BAC-1-11, BAE146, B722, B732, B733, B734, B738, B744, B752, B762, B763, B772, B788, CS3, CRJ7, CRJ9, Dash 8, DC10, Dornier 328, E170, E190, HS 121 Trident, Shorts 360
 
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OA260
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:43 pm

Armaghman wrote:
This will be a big impact on Derry airport. Only 2 days ago announced additional funding for nex 3 years for standees route

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern- ... t-47237041


Certainly will it remains to be seen if they can find a replacement carrier interested in linking LDY to any London Airport.
 
FlapsOne
Topic Author
Posts: 156
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:47 pm

BTC wrote:
skipness1E wrote:
TC957 wrote:
Perhaps this could be a shot in the arm for Flybe, and save them from a similar fate.

This could kill flybe. Look at the number of social media posts conflating flybmi and flybe going bust tonight.


Do they still do flying for Flybe? And if they do, what happens to that?
As for that so called "expert", you're spot on.


Although they’re a complete horror show on wings, the best synergies I see would be for Eastern. They already operate the type and the former bmi routes could complement their Aberdeen hub so could take on a couple of jets and pilots. I don’t think another type would do flyBE any favours.
 
FlapsOne
Topic Author
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:48 pm

Summa767 wrote:
Funny how people like Gingersnap have their own alternative facts. Populism is so infective.
Flybmi’s statement is quite clear in its explanation of reasons for its downfall. The carbon trading scheme disruption due to Brexit is verifiable. The explanation of how its curgent and future contracts are affected by Brexit also make total sense. And yet there are people who prefer make up their own reasons. Interesting times.


It’s also funny how people like you can’t have a discussion without lowering themselves to personal attacks.
 
INFINITI329
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:53 pm

I wonder if Virgin Atlantic/Flybe would be interested in taking over some of the former BMI routes..
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:54 pm

We the customers are losers again, they had really good staff. So now 80 plus pilots suddenly looking for an airline, good luck people. :(
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
Summa767
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:57 pm

FlapsOne wrote:

It’s also funny how people like you can’t have a discussion without lowering themselves to personal attacks.


Please quote my “personal attack”.
In any case, there is little to debate. The airline has shut down. The reasons for its downfall are explained in the statement.
 
TC957
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:00 pm

INFINITI329 wrote:
I wonder if Virgin Atlantic/Flybe would be interested in taking over some of the former BMI routes..

That's what I meant in my post above that this could be a good opportunity for FlyBe.
 
vfw614
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:00 pm

522 000 pax on 29 000 flights as per their press release equals an average load of 18 pax which translates into an average load factor of 37,7 per cent.

Could explain today's news to some extent.
 
FlapsOne
Topic Author
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:06 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
We the customers are losers again, they had really good staff. So now 80 plus pilots suddenly looking for an airline, good luck people. :(


Indeed but there’s a lot of recruitment going on. Hopefully they’ll upgrade to A320/737 operators. I wouldn’t advise any go to flyBE unless they’re desperate as they risk going through the same thing again and don’t want to get stuck on turboprops forever.
 
leghorn
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:09 pm

vfw614 wrote:
522 000 pax on 29 000 flights as per their press release equals an average load of 18 pax which translates into an average load factor of 37,7 per cent.

Could explain today's news to some extent.

Your post here is almost word for word the comment I was going to add but you got there first. 18 pax on each of their 17 EMB135/145 according to airfleets.net
and of course BREXIT uncertainty affecting load and future prospects.
I wouldn't fancy getting around the UK from now on. FlyBMI is gone, FlyBE will be ripped to shreds.
Driving up and down the motorways of the UK is no fun at all.
 
Breathe
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:10 pm

leghorn wrote:
I wouldn't fancy getting around the UK from now on. FlyBMI is gone, FlyBE will be ripped to shreds.
Driving up and down the motorways of the UK is no fun at all.

Trains do exist in the UK too...
 
leghorn
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:17 pm

Breathe wrote:
leghorn wrote:
I wouldn't fancy getting around the UK from now on. FlyBMI is gone, FlyBE will be ripped to shreds.
Driving up and down the motorways of the UK is no fun at all.

Trains do exist in the UK too...

Yeah. quality service doesn't though. That's a problem of the UK's own making again.
 
TC957
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:26 pm

My Japanese missus sums up Britain perfectly : It's a lovely country as long as to don't have to travel in it, pay taxes in it or are ill in it.
 
Bhoy
Posts: 548
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:50 pm

Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:27 pm

BTC wrote:
skipness1E wrote:
TC957 wrote:
Perhaps this could be a shot in the arm for Flybe, and save them from a similar fate.

This could kill flybe. Look at the number of social media posts conflating flybmi and flybe going bust tonight.


Do they still do flying for Flybe? And if they do, what happens to that?
As for that so called "expert", you're spot on.

bmi Regional didn't operate for Flybe - their franchisees are Eastern and Blue Islands, with Stobart operating some of the E-Jets.
 
leghorn
Posts: 1297
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Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:28 pm

18 pax per plane. Paying all that airport departure tax because of the size of the planes.
 
Bhoy
Posts: 548
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:50 pm

Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:28 pm

leghorn wrote:
Breathe wrote:
leghorn wrote:
I wouldn't fancy getting around the UK from now on. FlyBMI is gone, FlyBE will be ripped to shreds.
Driving up and down the motorways of the UK is no fun at all.

Trains do exist in the UK too...

Yeah. quality service doesn't though. That's a problem of the UK's own making again.

Don't worry, HS2 will soon shave 10 minutes off a 70 mile journey no Airline operates. :roll:
 
C010T3
Posts: 1956
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 5:48 am

Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:33 pm

The impact will be felt in Germany too. Peripheral airports had already suffered with Germania's demise, now this. Perhaps Luxair could launch a flight to MUC from SCN, but I don't think new service will be started from RLG.
 
BTC
Posts: 23
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2017 10:23 pm

Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:34 pm

Bhoy wrote:
BTC wrote:
skipness1E wrote:
This could kill flybe. Look at the number of social media posts conflating flybmi and flybe going bust tonight.


Do they still do flying for Flybe? And if they do, what happens to that?
As for that so called "expert", you're spot on.

bmi Regional didn't operate for Flybe - their franchisees are Eastern and Blue Islands, with Stobart operating some of the E-Jets.


Ok. A few of the E-Jets are showing still as bmi Regional's but doing the FlyBe Aberdeen-Norwich services.
One of those flights is cancelled for tomorrow.
Flown in :- A319, A320, A321, A332, A359, BAC ATP, BAC-1-11, BAE146, B722, B732, B733, B734, B738, B744, B752, B762, B763, B772, B788, CS3, CRJ7, CRJ9, Dash 8, DC10, Dornier 328, E170, E190, HS 121 Trident, Shorts 360
 
DutchBoeing
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2010 10:48 pm

Re: FlyBmi ceases operations.

Sat Feb 16, 2019 8:36 pm

For the people here who dismiss the Brexit as a major reason for their downfall: believe me, it's true. I own an air charter company in continental Europe (charter brokerage) and we most certainly avoid chartering a/c from UK airlines for contracts beyond March - and this not just our choice: our clients are willing to pay more for a non UK based a/c. It is all because we have no idea how legally all is going to play out AND because we don't know if airlines will be around long enough to actually operate the flights. I have been doing this work for more than 15 years and have dealt with an awful lot of bankruptcies over the years. The economic prospect for the UK does not look bright in the near future and we all know how little it takes for an airline to go bust. Flybmi did a lot of ad hocs / leases in continental Europe and we are not the only company avoiding UK airlines at the moment. So yes, Brexit most certainly made them loose a lot of business and business which will not be coming back soon for them. Sorry pro leavers: there will be serious consequences for leaving the EU, as aviation is not the only industry this is happening in...

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