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Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:06 pm
by vulindlela744
It’s official. Just annnounced that Southwest Airlines has passed all ETOPS certification from the FAA and is cleared to begin service to the beautiful Hawaiian Islands

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:09 pm
by Super80Fan
Yeah, still not going to happen for a while until they get their operational mess under control. Can't have planes operate Hawaii routes when you don't have enough to operate your current schedule.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:11 pm
by vulindlela744
Super80Fan, it’ll be happening a lot sooner than you think

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:15 pm
by B747forever
vulindlela744 wrote:
Super80Fan, it’ll be happening a lot sooner than you think


Really excited to see what will be announced and at what fares. Hopefully they will start to sell flights the next couple of days.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:01 pm
by FriscoHeavy
Super80Fan wrote:
Yeah, still not going to happen for a while until they get their operational mess under control. Can't have planes operate Hawaii routes when you don't have enough to operate your current schedule.



They will be selling flights any day now, so a lot sooner than you believe.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 10:35 pm
by strfyr51
Super80Fan wrote:
Yeah, still not going to happen for a while until they get their operational mess under control. Can't have planes operate Hawaii routes when you don't have enough to operate your current schedule.

That may or may Not be true. Not every Southwest airplane will be going to Hawaii, Only the ETOPS Overwater equipped airplanes. AND YOU CAN bet those airplanes will NOT be fooled with, Because a guy is putting his BUTT on the LINE (literally) for the safety of that airplane and the FAA would have an Extremely Dim View of any shenanigans with those ETOPS airplanes due to the restrictions in operating ETOPS flights. The Reporting on those flights is pretty stiff and it doesn't take much to ground or restrict an ETOPS airplane. Plus? It's Highly visible as well..

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:16 pm
by RWA380
Is there any public link to this announcement?

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:17 pm
by Scarebus34
Enjoy your crackers and fruit snacks!

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:41 pm
by EvanWSFO
RWA380 wrote:
Is there any public link to this announcement?


It's on this afternoon's ATW Online newsletter, but I can't copy the link.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:46 pm
by RWA380
EvanWSFO wrote:
RWA380 wrote:
Is there any public link to this announcement?


It's on this afternoon's ATW Online newsletter, but I can't copy the link.


Thank you, I found one actually: https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/27/southwe ... awaii.html

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:56 pm
by PSAatSAN4Ever
While I realize that ETOPS are a completely different ballgame, SAN-HNL/OGG is only slightly longer a distance than SAN-BWI, and the ability of the proper 737 to fly to the islands has been proven over a period of many years and many operators, The operations manuals are out there, and I have no doubt that when Southwest begins these routes, everything will be ready.

Coincidentally, what is Southwest's longest route flown today? The longest I can find reference to is LAS-MHT, but that appears to be history.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:00 am
by lightsaber
Finally! I have no worries on ETOPS aircraft. That is work in a fish bowl (100% visible). I like options. In particular direct flights!

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:04 am
by MIflyer12
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
While I realize that ETOPS are a completely different ballgame, SAN-HNL/OGG is only slightly longer a distance than SAN-BWI, and the ability of the proper 737 to fly to the islands has been proven over a period of many years and many operators, The operations manuals are out there, and I have no doubt that when Southwest begins these routes, everything will be ready.


Aloha, 737-700s Honolulu-Oakland, February 2000. The fact it's taken WN this long for 737NG ETOPS is an utter embarrassment.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:18 am
by strfyr51
MIflyer12 wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
While I realize that ETOPS are a completely different ballgame, SAN-HNL/OGG is only slightly longer a distance than SAN-BWI, and the ability of the proper 737 to fly to the islands has been proven over a period of many years and many operators, The operations manuals are out there, and I have no doubt that when Southwest begins these routes, everything will be ready.


Aloha, 737-700s Honolulu-Oakland, February 2000. The fact it's taken WN this long for 737NG ETOPS is an utter embarrassment.

You think so? Personally? I don't think WN was ready to do it! Hell!! They Still might not be as ready as they think.. We'll see soon enough though in their performance to and In Hawaii won't we?

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:34 am
by departedflights
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Coincidentally, what is Southwest's longest route flown today? The longest I can find reference to is LAS-MHT, but that appears to be history.


According to the Corporate Fact Sheet available at swamedia.com :

"The shortest daily Southwest flight is between Chicago (MDW) and Grand Rapids (GRR) (137 miles). The longest daily Southwest flight is between Newark (EWR) and Oakland (OAK) (2,555 miles)."

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:45 am
by MrBretz
departedflights wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Coincidentally, what is Southwest's longest route flown today? The longest I can find reference to is LAS-MHT, but that appears to be history.


According to the Corporate Fact Sheet available at swamedia.com :

"The shortest daily Southwest flight is between Chicago (MDW) and Grand Rapids (GRR) (137 miles). The longest daily Southwest flight is between Newark (EWR) and Oakland (OAK) (2,555 miles)."


OAK to HNL is "only" 2409 miles. So EWR to OAK will still be the longest.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 1:03 am
by B747forever
Scarebus34 wrote:
Enjoy your crackers and fruit snacks!


So what, you can't go without food for 5 hours?

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 1:18 am
by BWIAirport
B747forever wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
Enjoy your crackers and fruit snacks!


So what, you can't go without food for 5 hours?

And airport terminals are barren wastelands with no available food, so it's likely passengers will be rail thin by the time they land in Hawaii. :roll:

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 1:33 am
by PSAatSAN4Ever
departedflights wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Coincidentally, what is Southwest's longest route flown today? The longest I can find reference to is LAS-MHT, but that appears to be history.


According to the Corporate Fact Sheet available at swamedia.com :

"The shortest daily Southwest flight is between Chicago (MDW) and Grand Rapids (GRR) (137 miles). The longest daily Southwest flight is between Newark (EWR) and Oakland (OAK) (2,555 miles)."


Thank you for looking that up! I'll remember that page for future reference.

I think Southwest has been very good to study the Hawai'i market and formulate a plan on how to do it profitably. There are a lot of carriers flying to Hawai'i, and there's a lot of brand loyalty to established carriers. If their business plan indicates they can do Hawai'i their way, and do it right, they will get it started.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 1:39 am
by wjcandee
I think they'll do okay West Coast to Hawaii, because Hawaii is to that area kind of like South Florida is to the Northeast. It will be interesting to see if they draw from anywhere else.

Allegiant was supposed to bury everyone on this route, and ended up going away with their tails between their legs. There were a lot of reasons for that, including hotel non-participation rates, some operational hiccups that the media was delighted to publicize, competitors and their unions planting scare stories, etc. But it goes to show that even a very-successful model may have difficulty adapting to the unique market that is Hawaii.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:20 am
by jetblueguy22
Scarebus34 wrote:
Enjoy your crackers and fruit snacks!

You mean the same thing you get on DL, UA, and AA?

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:45 am
by SFOtoORD
RWA380 wrote:
EvanWSFO wrote:
RWA380 wrote:
Is there any public link to this announcement?


It's on this afternoon's ATW Online newsletter, but I can't copy the link.


Thank you, I found one actually: https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/27/southwe ... awaii.html


Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 4:55 am
by SANFan
I just noticed something interesting on SWA.com.

When you enlarge the Route Map (link: https://www.southwest.com/travel_center ... p_dyn.html ) with the little broken square icon in the upper right-hand corner, the map displayed magically includes the Hawaiian Islands (as well as Alaska!)

Maybe this has always been the case but it seems they have at least that tool ready for some soon-to-be-announced new routes! (Unfortunately, there are no blue lines to or from HI yet...)

bb

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 5:03 am
by B1168
MrBretz wrote:
departedflights wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Coincidentally, what is Southwest's longest route flown today? The longest I can find reference to is LAS-MHT, but that appears to be history.


According to the Corporate Fact Sheet available at swamedia.com :

"The shortest daily Southwest flight is between Chicago (MDW) and Grand Rapids (GRR) (137 miles). The longest daily Southwest flight is between Newark (EWR) and Oakland (OAK) (2,555 miles)."


OAK to HNL is "only" 2409 miles. So EWR to OAK will still be the longest.


Yikes. No “fine dining” for a 5 hour flight.
Though I don’t think most of those transcontinentals in United States come with complimentary food. That will be a good reference.
Fun fact, I heard someone complaining “food downgrade” for not offering full complimentary food (instead, they opted for fruit “meal”) in Y for a 1.5hr hop between PEK and PVG. Had I been able to opt for HSR, I would absolutely do.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 5:05 am
by Silver1SWA
SFOtoORD wrote:
RWA380 wrote:
EvanWSFO wrote:

It's on this afternoon's ATW Online newsletter, but I can't copy the link.


Thank you, I found one actually: https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/27/southwe ... awaii.html


Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.


It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:16 am
by Bradin
SFOtoORD wrote:
RWA380 wrote:
EvanWSFO wrote:

It's on this afternoon's ATW Online newsletter, but I can't copy the link.


Thank you, I found one actually: https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/27/southwe ... awaii.html


Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.


Poor execution? Please explain?

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:18 am
by mcdu
Silver1SWA wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
RWA380 wrote:


Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.


It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.


I have a home in Hawaii and I have met not one local that wanted WN. No one cares. Most shop on Expedia or via their loyalty miles with HA UA etc.

You made a bold statement so where is the data that the people of Hawaii want WN. I guess the same way they wanted Allegiant.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:36 am
by tphuang
it doesn't matter if HI people want WN since they are carrying passengers from rest of the country to HI.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:05 am
by CARST
BWIAirport wrote:
B747forever wrote:
Scarebus34 wrote:
Enjoy your crackers and fruit snacks!


So what, you can't go without food for 5 hours?

And airport terminals are barren wastelands with no available food, so it's likely passengers will be rail thin by the time they land in Hawaii. :roll:


What wouldn't be so bad considering how obese people in the US are on average.

Actually if SWA would promise me to arrive thin as a rail after a transcon flight with them, I would book them immediately! Free diets for everyone when you buy a ticket now!

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:15 am
by PlanesNTrains
mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:

Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.


It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.


I have a home in Hawaii and I have met not one local that wanted WN. No one cares. Most shop on Expedia or via their loyalty miles with HA UA etc.

You made a bold statement so where is the data that the people of Hawaii want WN. I guess the same way they wanted Allegiant.


So you've conducted a poll. How many have you asked? I'm sure your friends and acquaintances wouldn't phrase it in the negative in deference to your employment at UA.

FWIW, I doubt most Hawaiians care either, but I'm quite certain some do.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:19 am
by Silver1SWA
mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:

Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.


It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.


I have a home in Hawaii and I have met not one local that wanted WN. No one cares. Most shop on Expedia or via their loyalty miles with HA UA etc.

You made a bold statement so where is the data that the people of Hawaii want WN. I guess the same way they wanted Allegiant.


I moved to O’ahu last month and it wasn’t until I arrived that I realized the people here are excited to see Southwest for two reasons. One, the folks at the airport are excited for potential jobs. And two, they want to see competition within the islands because they are tired of ridiculous inter-island fares. Oh, I lied because I get a third question, they want to know if we will have flights to LAS. If I’m in uniform, I get stopped and asked with excitement. When I’m around town and the topic of why I recently moved here comes up, as soon as I mention Southwest they light up in excitement and immediately ask the questions above. Next time you’re spending time at your home, put on a Southwest shirt and see for yourself.

I know it doesn’t fit your narrative but Southwest’s presence on the islands has been very much welcomed.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:34 am
by PlanesNTrains
Silver1SWA wrote:
mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:

It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.


I have a home in Hawaii and I have met not one local that wanted WN. No one cares. Most shop on Expedia or via their loyalty miles with HA UA etc.

You made a bold statement so where is the data that the people of Hawaii want WN. I guess the same way they wanted Allegiant.


I moved to O’ahu last month and it wasn’t until I arrived that I realized the people here are excited to see Southwest for two reasons. One, the folks at the airport are excited for potential jobs. And two, they want to see competition within the islands because they are tired of ridiculous inter-island fares. Oh, I lied because I get a third question, they want to know if we will have flights to LAS. If I’m in uniform, I get stopped and asked with excitement. When I’m around town and the topic of why I recently moved here comes up, as soon as I mention Southwest they light up in excitement and immediately ask the questions above. Next time you’re spending time at your home, put on a Southwest shirt and see for yourself.

I know it doesn’t fit your narrative but Southwest’s presence on the islands has been very much welcomed.


I'd guess some of that is for the same reasons you mentioned - you're wearing the shirt. We all like to be nice and if we are talking to someone who works for A, we'll usually show interest as a courtesy, if not genuinely. If, however, they work for B, then we'll show interest in B (same reasons) and perhaps dis' A just to put the cherry on top. Again, it's likely somewhere in the middle, but there will absolutely be people who are looking forward to WN arriving. Heck, I'm sure there're more than a few people who have moved to the islands that were regular WN passengers before.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:41 am
by Silver1SWA
PlanesNTrains wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
mcdu wrote:

I have a home in Hawaii and I have met not one local that wanted WN. No one cares. Most shop on Expedia or via their loyalty miles with HA UA etc.

You made a bold statement so where is the data that the people of Hawaii want WN. I guess the same way they wanted Allegiant.


I moved to O’ahu last month and it wasn’t until I arrived that I realized the people here are excited to see Southwest for two reasons. One, the folks at the airport are excited for potential jobs. And two, they want to see competition within the islands because they are tired of ridiculous inter-island fares. Oh, I lied because I get a third question, they want to know if we will have flights to LAS. If I’m in uniform, I get stopped and asked with excitement. When I’m around town and the topic of why I recently moved here comes up, as soon as I mention Southwest they light up in excitement and immediately ask the questions above. Next time you’re spending time at your home, put on a Southwest shirt and see for yourself.

I know it doesn’t fit your narrative but Southwest’s presence on the islands has been very much welcomed.


I'd guess some of that is for the same reasons you mentioned - you're wearing the shirt. We all like to be nice and if we are talking to someone who works for A, we'll usually show interest as a courtesy, if not genuinely. If, however, they work for B, then we'll show interest in B (same reasons) and perhaps dis' A just to put the cherry on top. Again, it's likely somewhere in the middle, but there will absolutely be people who are looking forward to WN arriving. Heck, I'm sure there're more than a few people who have moved to the islands that were regular WN passengers before.


What I’ve gotten out of the experience so far is that they are excited to see Southwest here and they have specific reasons why. Whether or not their expectations will be met, I don’t know. I hope so.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:08 am
by Maksvell88
Wow. So which airline will suffer the most from this??? I feel Alaska is squeezed

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:11 am
by PlanesNTrains
Silver1SWA wrote:
PlanesNTrains wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:

I moved to O’ahu last month and it wasn’t until I arrived that I realized the people here are excited to see Southwest for two reasons. One, the folks at the airport are excited for potential jobs. And two, they want to see competition within the islands because they are tired of ridiculous inter-island fares. Oh, I lied because I get a third question, they want to know if we will have flights to LAS. If I’m in uniform, I get stopped and asked with excitement. When I’m around town and the topic of why I recently moved here comes up, as soon as I mention Southwest they light up in excitement and immediately ask the questions above. Next time you’re spending time at your home, put on a Southwest shirt and see for yourself.

I know it doesn’t fit your narrative but Southwest’s presence on the islands has been very much welcomed.


I'd guess some of that is for the same reasons you mentioned - you're wearing the shirt. We all like to be nice and if we are talking to someone who works for A, we'll usually show interest as a courtesy, if not genuinely. If, however, they work for B, then we'll show interest in B (same reasons) and perhaps dis' A just to put the cherry on top. Again, it's likely somewhere in the middle, but there will absolutely be people who are looking forward to WN arriving. Heck, I'm sure there're more than a few people who have moved to the islands that were regular WN passengers before.


What I’ve gotten out of the experience so far is that they are excited to see Southwest here and they have specific reasons why. Whether or not their expectations will be met, I don’t know. I hope so.


Well, that's good. It beats it being a negative, which is about all we get on A.net anymore. Good luck with the expansion.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:53 am
by WN732
mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:

Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.


It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.


I have a home in Hawaii and I have met not one local that wanted WN. No one cares. Most shop on Expedia or via their loyalty miles with HA UA etc.

You made a bold statement so where is the data that the people of Hawaii want WN. I guess the same way they wanted Allegiant.


I think you should be over on the United and Delta threads, those airlines seem to be more of your thing. Obviously, you have some issue with WN - and that's fine. But, your continuous bashing is getting ridiculous. It's as if you wait for anyone to trickle some new info and a little joy into a thread, only for you to come and bash it down. And for you to be a fellow airman, that's sad. It must suck to fly for Spirit, but don't bash everyone else having a decent time. Pro tip, don't go into a thread about something you don't like. It's not productive and you'll be spinning your wheels.

As for the rest of us, we are here because we want to gain more knowledge and stay abreast of the coming events. I'm sure a few, including myself, will even be on the inaugural flight over there. WN isn't perfect, but the hard-working people over there do a fine job. You may not support them, but there are countless others that do.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:56 am
by barney captain
MIflyer12 wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
While I realize that ETOPS are a completely different ballgame, SAN-HNL/OGG is only slightly longer a distance than SAN-BWI, and the ability of the proper 737 to fly to the islands has been proven over a period of many years and many operators, The operations manuals are out there, and I have no doubt that when Southwest begins these routes, everything will be ready.


Aloha, 737-700s Honolulu-Oakland, February 2000. The fact it's taken WN this long for 737NG ETOPS is an utter embarrassment.


737s having been doing ETOPS long before Aloha...and you still fail to make a valid point.

Once it was decided to launch Hawaii, it took just over a year to achieve ETOPS authorization, a perfectly normal timeframe.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 9:13 am
by RWA380
PlanesNTrains wrote:
mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:

It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.


I have a home in Hawaii and I have met not one local that wanted WN. No one cares. Most shop on Expedia or via their loyalty miles with HA UA etc.

You made a bold statement so where is the data that the people of Hawaii want WN. I guess the same way they wanted Allegiant.


So you've conducted a poll. How many have you asked? I'm sure your friends and acquaintances wouldn't phrase it in the negative in deference to your employment at UA.

FWIW, I doubt most Hawaiians care either, but I'm quite certain some do.


I belong to two FB groups that are Big Island & Maui oriented & there are hundreds of folks, just on those sites about ready to pee their pants over WN arriving. I have been asked several times & have obtained hundreds of replies over this lone subject. It is inaccurate to claim that he people of Hawaii are not awaiting a new option for Inter Island traffic, that is false. The local media has made a very big deal about this.

Popular views from locals show, they believe HA rips them off on Inter Island fares & since there is no other large carrier to offer what they require to move around their own state, they think WN is going to be bringing lowerfares between islands & they may. The Inter Island to the locals is the bigger part of the excitement. If you had a new airline to fly around your state, you’d be happy too, I think.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 9:16 am
by Silver1SWA
barney captain wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
While I realize that ETOPS are a completely different ballgame, SAN-HNL/OGG is only slightly longer a distance than SAN-BWI, and the ability of the proper 737 to fly to the islands has been proven over a period of many years and many operators, The operations manuals are out there, and I have no doubt that when Southwest begins these routes, everything will be ready.


Aloha, 737-700s Honolulu-Oakland, February 2000. The fact it's taken WN this long for 737NG ETOPS is an utter embarrassment.


737s having been doing ETOPS long before Aloha...and you still fail to make a valid point.

Once it was decided to launch Hawaii, it took just over a year to achieve ETOPS authorization, a perfectly normal timeframe.


If I’m not mistaken, the certification process takes an average of 12-18 months. By my count it took WN 16 months after announcing plans. Seems to be as “12-18 months” as you can get.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 9:29 am
by tphuang
Maksvell88 wrote:
Wow. So which airline will suffer the most from this??? I feel Alaska is squeezed


The most obvious ones are AS and HA. I ran through some numbers out of each airports a while back. I think there is plenty of room for fares to drop in all 4 cities. SMF will be a huge bloodbath next year and so will SAN be. Today, I saw fare alert for $258 RT between SAN-OGG on both AS and HA. I think they are feeling the pressure of impending WN fare sales.

Now aside from that, I think legacies will also suffer from all the connection itineraries right now that go through LAX/PHX/DEN/SFO.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 10:21 am
by airportugal310
Silver1SWA wrote:
PlanesNTrains wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:

I moved to O’ahu last month and it wasn’t until I arrived that I realized the people here are excited to see Southwest for two reasons. One, the folks at the airport are excited for potential jobs. And two, they want to see competition within the islands because they are tired of ridiculous inter-island fares. Oh, I lied because I get a third question, they want to know if we will have flights to LAS. If I’m in uniform, I get stopped and asked with excitement. When I’m around town and the topic of why I recently moved here comes up, as soon as I mention Southwest they light up in excitement and immediately ask the questions above. Next time you’re spending time at your home, put on a Southwest shirt and see for yourself.

I know it doesn’t fit your narrative but Southwest’s presence on the islands has been very much welcomed.


I'd guess some of that is for the same reasons you mentioned - you're wearing the shirt. We all like to be nice and if we are talking to someone who works for A, we'll usually show interest as a courtesy, if not genuinely. If, however, they work for B, then we'll show interest in B (same reasons) and perhaps dis' A just to put the cherry on top. Again, it's likely somewhere in the middle, but there will absolutely be people who are looking forward to WN arriving. Heck, I'm sure there're more than a few people who have moved to the islands that were regular WN passengers before.


What I’ve gotten out of the experience so far is that they are excited to see Southwest here and they have specific reasons why. Whether or not their expectations will be met, I don’t know. I hope so.



You’ve been on island one month and you’re an expert on the local market? Try 15 years here and you have no idea what you’re talking about

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:21 pm
by SFOtoORD
Silver1SWA wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:
RWA380 wrote:


Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.


It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.


They have been talking about Hawaii for a long time and every time someone writes another set of articles about it. At one point in 2017 they were talking about flights starting in 2018. They obviously knew what ETOPS took to get done and yet every 3 months for the last two years we’ve gotten a set of articles that prompted another set of threads. We even had a set of articles and threads on this test flight. It’s just an excessive amount of press on a topic that is a pedestrian accomplishment for normal airlines. Even Sun Country started Hawaii flights. So congrats to WN, but, wow, way to drag this story out for an eternity.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:33 pm
by wnflyguy
Silver1SWA wrote:
barney captain wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:

Aloha, 737-700s Honolulu-Oakland, February 2000. The fact it's taken WN this long for 737NG ETOPS is an utter embarrassment.


737s having been doing ETOPS long before Aloha...and you still fail to make a valid point.

Once it was decided to launch Hawaii, it took just over a year to achieve ETOPS authorization, a perfectly normal timeframe.


If I’m not mistaken, the certification process takes an average of 12-18 months. By my count it took WN 16 months after announcing plans. Seems to be as “12-18 months” as you can get.


Well technically it's been 11yrs and 6mo to achieve ETOPS for Hawaii.
When WN announced it was getting the 800's with Etops was "the game changer". It spent time and got side letter agreements with it's MX,Pilots and FA so it could add Hawaii with Red Eyes included. Then fuel prices spiked ATA went belly up and Hawaii got put on hold. WN decided to buy AirTran instead.
With Hawaii on hold WN was focused only on Caribbean international expansion Until the devastation from the Hurricane season stopped everything.
This lead the opportunity retired the 500&300's lower it's MX cost and restart the ETOPS Hawaii program.
Needless to say it's exciting and a long time coming but hopefully by all accounts on Monday morning there's going to be a press conference At HNL.
Rumor still has Sunday March 17 Saint Patrick's Day as the first day of service.
Flight schedule prediction will be 11 Daily flights at both HNL and OGG.
Inter island on Day one.
HNL-OGG 6
West coast
OAK 2
SAN 1
SMF 1
SJC 1
I will be waiting to by a ticket on the first flight.
Aloha Flyguy

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:36 pm
by pate6924
Rumor I've heard is that tickets will go on sale next Tuesday (3/5).

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:39 pm
by N312RC
barney captain wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
While I realize that ETOPS are a completely different ballgame, SAN-HNL/OGG is only slightly longer a distance than SAN-BWI, and the ability of the proper 737 to fly to the islands has been proven over a period of many years and many operators, The operations manuals are out there, and I have no doubt that when Southwest begins these routes, everything will be ready.


Aloha, 737-700s Honolulu-Oakland, February 2000. The fact it's taken WN this long for 737NG ETOPS is an utter embarrassment.


737s having been doing ETOPS long before Aloha...and you still fail to make a valid point.

Once it was decided to launch Hawaii, it took just over a year to achieve ETOPS authorization, a perfectly normal timeframe.


Everyone keeps looking at WN's incredibly, even glacially slow ETOPS certification process (which it was, frankly) as a one-off event, or worse, completely excusing the company altogether (ahem, fanboys). The problem is that it wasn't. They dithered forever in even making a decision on Hawaii, then acted like it was some sort of never-before-accomplished mission to the moon.

They dithered forever with upgrading their res system (again, glacially slow) which cost them a codesharing opportunity with WS. Even after taking incredibly long they screwed that up and were all over the news.

They're still dithering over how to sell tickets to non-US point of sale. Not like that wasn't cracked years ago by just about every other airline on earth.

Just makes me laugh when people see WN as the savior. They are not an innovative or transformative airline in the slightest. Someone higher up said enjoy your pretzels and fruit snacks and they are exactly right. All the other US majors flying to the islands allow you to buy a sandwich, at the very least. So yes, enjoy those pretzels and fruit snacks. Enjoy watching TV on your phone for a couple hours because once your battery dies, there's nowhere to charge it. Heck, you'll lose live TV and internet in a couple hours anyway because they haven't figured out how to crack global satellite Wi-Fi yet.

They're a faux-LCC that is frankly an operational mess (horrendous mishandled bag rate, crappy D0) with a great PR department and an awesome customer complaints department that gives away the farm (ie buying goodwill). Just laughable.

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:46 pm
by bob75013
mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
SFOtoORD wrote:

Not sure why this is such a big story. Poor execution by Southwest to have taken this long to get here. Nice that they’ve finally gotten to this point, but would be far less newsworthy for any other carrier.


It’s newsworthy because it has been highly anticipated. Southwest customers want it. The people in Hawaii want it.

Not sure why people can’t just let them celebrate the milestone for the company.


I have a home in Hawaii and I have met not one local that wanted WN. No one cares. Most shop on Expedia or via their loyalty miles with HA UA etc.

You made a bold statement so where is the data that the people of Hawaii want WN. I guess the same way they wanted Allegiant.


We all just KNEW hat it was only a mater of time for the WN hater to chime in with more WN hate, didn't we?

Well to answer your questions, take this:

from today's Honolulu Star Advertiser: : https://www.cntraveler.com/story/why-we ... -to-hawaii

and this: https://www.kitv.com/story/39903487/sou ... -to-hawaii

and this: https://www.staradvertiser.com/2019/02/ ... 47da977836

and this: https://www.hawaiitribune-herald.com/20 ... i-flights/

and this: https://www.hawaiitribune-herald.com/20 ... lo-market/

so, mcdu, why all of the interest in Southwest's Hawaii flights if people in HAwaii don't care about it? hmmmmmmm?

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 2:54 pm
by bob75013
N312RC wrote:
barney captain wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:

Aloha, 737-700s Honolulu-Oakland, February 2000. The fact it's taken WN this long for 737NG ETOPS is an utter embarrassment.


737s having been doing ETOPS long before Aloha...and you still fail to make a valid point.

Once it was decided to launch Hawaii, it took just over a year to achieve ETOPS authorization, a perfectly normal timeframe.


Everyone keeps looking at WN's incredibly, even glacially slow ETOPS certification process (which it was, frankly) as a one-off event, or worse, completely excusing the company altogether (ahem, fanboys). The problem is that it wasn't. They dithered forever in even making a decision on Hawaii, then acted like it was some sort of never-before-accomplished mission to the moon.

They dithered forever with upgrading their res system (again, glacially slow) which cost them a codesharing opportunity with WS. Even after taking incredibly long they screwed that up and were all over the news.

They're still dithering over how to sell tickets to non-US point of sale. Not like that wasn't cracked years ago by just about every other airline on earth.

Just makes me laugh when people see WN as the savior. They are not an innovative or transformative airline in the slightest. Someone higher up said enjoy your pretzels and fruit snacks and they are exactly right. All the other US majors flying to the islands allow you to buy a sandwich, at the very least. So yes, enjoy those pretzels and fruit snacks. Enjoy watching TV on your phone for a couple hours because once your battery dies, there's nowhere to charge it. Heck, you'll lose live TV and internet in a couple hours anyway because they haven't figured out how to crack global satellite Wi-Fi yet.

They're a faux-LCC that is frankly an operational mess (horrendous mishandled bag rate, crappy D0) with a great PR department and an awesome customer complaints department that gives away the farm (ie buying goodwill). Just laughable.


And yet Southwest's dithering has resulted in 40+ profitable years (unlike the big three), passenger growth consistently higher than the big three, no bankruptcy (unlike the big three), no involuntary layoffs (unlike the big three), a profit level that beats the hell out of the big three, and customer satisfaction that exceeds the bg three.

so your point is .....?

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:08 pm
by N312RC
Woah there fanboy, calm down.

My point is that they're frankly a hulking monolith that refuses to innovate. Great product for DAL-AMA, not so great for BWI-OAK.

How many other airlines have declared maintenance emergencies lately?

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:20 pm
by bob75013
N312RC wrote:
Woah there fanboy, calm down.

My point is that they're frankly a hulking monolith that refuses to innovate. Great product for DAL-AMA, not so great for BWI-OAK.

How many other airlines have declared maintenance emergencies lately?


My point was that Southwest innovates enough to support excellence in the metrics i cited -- maybe not in the way you want, but certainly in the ways the shareholders and passengers want..

Re: Southwest get final authorization from FAA to begin Hawaii service

Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:22 pm
by Silver1SWA
airportugal310 wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
PlanesNTrains wrote:

I'd guess some of that is for the same reasons you mentioned - you're wearing the shirt. We all like to be nice and if we are talking to someone who works for A, we'll usually show interest as a courtesy, if not genuinely. If, however, they work for B, then we'll show interest in B (same reasons) and perhaps dis' A just to put the cherry on top. Again, it's likely somewhere in the middle, but there will absolutely be people who are looking forward to WN arriving. Heck, I'm sure there're more than a few people who have moved to the islands that were regular WN passengers before.


What I’ve gotten out of the experience so far is that they are excited to see Southwest here and they have specific reasons why. Whether or not their expectations will be met, I don’t know. I hope so.



You’ve been on island one month and you’re an expert on the local market? Try 15 years here and you have no idea what you’re talking about


I never claimed to be an expert. I responded to anecdotal evidence with my own based on personal encounters with people here.