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IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:49 am

Cancelling the order? Now that’s a very bold move for something that is still being investigated.

If they were ready to be delivered then it may raise more questions about accepting them at this time, but given that is not yet due, let’s wait and see what the outcome is.

If I was operating the aircraft now though, I would certainly be feeling underpressure on the best course of action until the investigations are completed. The doubt it raises would likely cause some restless nights for management teams.
 
cam747
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:49 am

CityRail wrote:
JQ321 wrote:
CityRail wrote:
Unlikely to happen, however I argue Boeing 737 Max 8/10 is not suitable for VA for commercial reasons:
1. MAX does not have sufficient range to Asia, even VA gets them, they cannot fly far
2. MAX has small cargo hold and holds too little passengers that they won't achieve as many benefits as Airbus to VA to expand.
Solution: Drop MAX Order and replace with 150 x A321XLR. XLR will have sufficient range and capacity to replace all B738 and A332 and enables VA to operate Asian long haul profitably.

我從使用 Tapatalk 的 G3226 發送

If the MAX has a small cargo hold what does the A321XLR have a tiny one. Also the A321XLR doesn't have the range for VA's current Asian Routes except Indonesia.


Negative.

A321LR has 4700nm Range fully loaded, therefore A321XLR, which claims it can fly an extra 700nm, will have 5400nm.

With A321XLR, this is what Virgin can do:

1. Introduce 2 configuration: Short Haul and Long Haul
Short Haul: 4 J (With The Business Seats), 8 W (With B737 Business Class Seats), 30 Economy X and 132 Economy Seats - Total Guests 174
Long Haul: 8 J (With The Business Seats), 12 W (With B737 Business Class Seats), 30 Economy X and 96 Economy Seats - Total Guests 146

2. Have a look at GC Map on how far 5400nm can go:

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?R=5400nm%40PER
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?R=5400nm%40SYD

3. This is what Virgin can do with 150 strong A321LR/XLR:
a) Introduce PER - AUH with XLR, something that EY cannot do it profitably with A330 and B787
b) Introduce PER - JNB with XLR, and I am sure this will be much more profitable than SA
c) Introduce MEL - HNL, something HA don't have a suitable fleet to do (MEL - HNL is 5504nm, if range is an issue, VA can add a stop at CBR)
d) Introduce SYD/BNE - PPT, a route that none of Virgin's widebody can do at the moment
e) Introduce PER - AKL and PER - CHC, and compete against NZ's B787
f) Introduce SYD-IPC-EZE, and break the monopoly of LATAM
g) Introduce SYD-BOM and PER-DEL, and connect with Vistara

4. A321XLR can literally go to most parts of China, all of SE Asia and East/NE Asia and it will make these routes viable because VA does not have partner in these places. JQ is planning to use A321 to SE Asia and I am sure Virgin can and should do it so that it can feed more passengers into Australia and make it profitable due to high LF from lower number of seats available.

5. If VA install 'The Business' on all A321s I am sure QF will surrender because wherever QF's B738 go, Virgin has a better product to beat them.

6. VA can easily eliminate 1 more type of aircraft by replacing B77W and A332 with A350-1000. They should consider ordering 12 of them and have 5 based on East Coast for LAX, 5 based at PER for LHR and FCO and 2 for HKG.


Love your positivity and big thinking, but unfortunately none of its realistic. I love VA and want to see them expand, but if they were to implement just a couple of your suggestions they would bleed cash and fail pretty quickly.

VA capital position isn't strong as it is, and to go on a spending spree of 150 new type aircraft would be complete madness. Some of your route suggestions are interesting, but again, it takes a lot of cash and usually many months of losses to introduce a new international route. VA need to very slowly & carefully build & refine what they've already got and hope fuel prices stay low so they can keep improving profits and shore up their capital position over the coming years.
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 1:29 am

cam747 wrote:
CityRail wrote:
JQ321 wrote:
If the MAX has a small cargo hold what does the A321XLR have a tiny one. Also the A321XLR doesn't have the range for VA's current Asian Routes except Indonesia.


Negative.

A321LR has 4700nm Range fully loaded, therefore A321XLR, which claims it can fly an extra 700nm, will have 5400nm.

With A321XLR, this is what Virgin can do:

1. Introduce 2 configuration: Short Haul and Long Haul
Short Haul: 4 J (With The Business Seats), 8 W (With B737 Business Class Seats), 30 Economy X and 132 Economy Seats - Total Guests 174
Long Haul: 8 J (With The Business Seats), 12 W (With B737 Business Class Seats), 30 Economy X and 96 Economy Seats - Total Guests 146

2. Have a look at GC Map on how far 5400nm can go:

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?R=5400nm%40PER
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?R=5400nm%40SYD

3. This is what Virgin can do with 150 strong A321LR/XLR:
a) Introduce PER - AUH with XLR, something that EY cannot do it profitably with A330 and B787
b) Introduce PER - JNB with XLR, and I am sure this will be much more profitable than SA
c) Introduce MEL - HNL, something HA don't have a suitable fleet to do (MEL - HNL is 5504nm, if range is an issue, VA can add a stop at CBR)
d) Introduce SYD/BNE - PPT, a route that none of Virgin's widebody can do at the moment
e) Introduce PER - AKL and PER - CHC, and compete against NZ's B787
f) Introduce SYD-IPC-EZE, and break the monopoly of LATAM
g) Introduce SYD-BOM and PER-DEL, and connect with Vistara

4. A321XLR can literally go to most parts of China, all of SE Asia and East/NE Asia and it will make these routes viable because VA does not have partner in these places. JQ is planning to use A321 to SE Asia and I am sure Virgin can and should do it so that it can feed more passengers into Australia and make it profitable due to high LF from lower number of seats available.

5. If VA install 'The Business' on all A321s I am sure QF will surrender because wherever QF's B738 go, Virgin has a better product to beat them.

6. VA can easily eliminate 1 more type of aircraft by replacing B77W and A332 with A350-1000. They should consider ordering 12 of them and have 5 based on East Coast for LAX, 5 based at PER for LHR and FCO and 2 for HKG.


Love your positivity and big thinking, but unfortunately none of its realistic. I love VA and want to see them expand, but if they were to implement just a couple of your suggestions they would bleed cash and fail pretty quickly.

VA capital position isn't strong as it is, and to go on a spending spree of 150 new type aircraft would be complete madness. Some of your route suggestions are interesting, but again, it takes a lot of cash and usually many months of losses to introduce a new international route. VA need to very slowly & carefully build & refine what they've already got and hope fuel prices stay low so they can keep improving profits and shore up their capital position over the coming years.


I wasn't sure if the OP was "trolling", but at the same time he did seem a bit 'enthusiastic'.
As pointed out previously by pretty much almost everyone, VA's capital position isn't that strong enough for rapid expansion and they are only recently recovering after many years of loss.

Also it's partly the reason why people should'nt expect VA to "join an alliance" anytime soon. Even then, SkyTeam is VA's only option. VA is a non-starter in OneWorld, and Star Alliance is pretty much closed thanks to the bust-up with NZ (not to mention NZ does have veto power), after the VA shareholders all went against Luxon/NZ over Luxon's alleged demands for VA "to give up all international" and feed everything into his airline (NZ).

Saying that, 150 aircraft is way too much and is well out of VA's CAPEX. As many would predict, VA is expected to 'slow' their expansion to a sustainable level (e.g maintaining LAX and HKG, and only incremental increases/decreases to NZ as per demand). Many of VA's upcoming MAX aircraft are largely expected to replace the 738s that are earmarked to be transferred to TigerAir, which only leaves a modest increase for domestic and/or Trans-Tasman/South Pacific adjustments/expansion where needed.
 
TasFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:28 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
TasFlyer wrote:
Sorry to bring up this chestnut from the February thread, but having checked the schedules for NW19, three things may be of interest:

  • The 717 will cease operating SYD-ADL, SYD-BNE, and BNE-ADL for NS19; I don't recall this being announced
  • The new SYD-MCY and SYD-HBA flying has evidently come at the expense of the above, and thus appears unrelated to the ASP-DRW switch from 717 to 73H; so where has this 717 been redeployed? BNE?
  • Unless I have missed some flying (I've included SYD to HBA, CBR, OOL, MCY, and HTI), then there appears to be capacity to increase flying out of SYD; one aircraft only does half a day's flying (perhaps maintenance is performed during the other half day?), and the others have some two to three hour layovers, even longer midweek when some SYD-OOL and SYD-HBA sectors don't run (not exactly the eight sector days the 717 was designed for)

Happy to be corrected.


In all honesty I wouldn't pay too much attention to schedules for IATA Winter yet. A lot can change in 6 months and I would suggest that the schedules are still work in progress.


Sorry, I meant NS19, i.e. three weeks' time.

However, I'm aware a lot can change quickly. My original comment about low utilisation was based on
a glitch in the schedules where the additional MCY and HBA had been added, but the SYD-ADL flying hadn't yet been removed; hence, I incorrectly assumed there was an additional 717 that overnighted in SYD, which exacerbated the low utilisation.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:49 am

Forum Moderator
 
SYDSpotter
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 8:57 am

CityRail wrote:

Negative.

A321LR has 4700nm Range fully loaded, therefore A321XLR, which claims it can fly an extra 700nm, will have 5400nm.

With A321XLR, this is what Virgin can do:

1. Introduce 2 configuration: Short Haul and Long Haul
Short Haul: 4 J (With The Business Seats), 8 W (With B737 Business Class Seats), 30 Economy X and 132 Economy Seats - Total Guests 174
Long Haul: 8 J (With The Business Seats), 12 W (With B737 Business Class Seats), 30 Economy X and 96 Economy Seats - Total Guests 146

2. Have a look at GC Map on how far 5400nm can go:

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?R=5400nm%40PER
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?R=5400nm%40SYD


Hmm, where are you getting 4700nm for the A321LR neo from? Try 4000nm:

https://www.airbus.com/aircraft/passeng ... tml#a321lr

Given the A321LR only has up to 4000nm (which won't be at full payload given prevailing jet streams), you can forget about 5400nm for the A321XLR and your pipedreams for VA's future fleet and list of destinations.
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SYDSpotter
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:09 am

JQ321 wrote:
I asked about this because i care about the safety of all people. I also don' want more people, especially Australians, to Die in any more 737MAX crashes.
Also your comparing apples and oranges. They were faults in the plane. This is a fatal crash not this is not just a fault.


There are some smart boys and girls working at Boeing, if there is a design flaw/issue with the aircraft, they will find a solution to it. You can be rest assured that QF/VA are not going to fly a plane that is not safe or unairworthy. Why speculate when the root cause of the ET crash has yet to be established? If we get to the point where it is found that there are serious design flaws with the 737MAX, then yes absolutely the discussion will be had on whether VA should cancel the order. But as another poster previously said, why ask this hypothetical question immediately after a crash where we don't even know the cause...
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Ryanair01
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:49 pm

qf789 wrote:


In view of the two ongoing investigations I find this statement unwise.

The 737 MAX is a ‘new’ aircraft requiring low speed Angle of Attack stability enhancement. MCAS provides this. There are two AoA sensors on the MAX, if one has a fault, i.e. single point of failure, then what is the automation to do? The MAX doesn't alert pilots when the sensors disagree with each other. Sensor failure can pose significant difficulties for pilots especially if they are not alerted to data mismatches which hint at what may be happening. That leaves pilots needing to very quickly identify what is going on to ensure safe flight. In early flight stages there is precious little time to refer to checklists.

Holding Boeing in high regard is one thing, having faith in air accident investigator finding and believing regulators will implement their findings is another. However I'm surprised Virgin's unions are defending a design where single point of failure puts such extreme time pressure on pilots because they're not alerted with information they need to maintain safe flight, a so far unresolved issue.
 
downdata
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:01 pm

Its a bit weird, why do they feel necessary to comment on a type that has never been operated by VA and for which the pilots never received training on. The union has no more insight into the plane than any random person on the street.
 
DeltaB717
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:39 pm

TasFlyer wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
TasFlyer wrote:
Sorry to bring up this chestnut from the February thread, but having checked the schedules for NW19, three things may be of interest:

  • The 717 will cease operating SYD-ADL, SYD-BNE, and BNE-ADL for NS19; I don't recall this being announced
  • The new SYD-MCY and SYD-HBA flying has evidently come at the expense of the above, and thus appears unrelated to the ASP-DRW switch from 717 to 73H; so where has this 717 been redeployed? BNE?
  • Unless I have missed some flying (I've included SYD to HBA, CBR, OOL, MCY, and HTI), then there appears to be capacity to increase flying out of SYD; one aircraft only does half a day's flying (perhaps maintenance is performed during the other half day?), and the others have some two to three hour layovers, even longer midweek when some SYD-OOL and SYD-HBA sectors don't run (not exactly the eight sector days the 717 was designed for)

Happy to be corrected.


In all honesty I wouldn't pay too much attention to schedules for IATA Winter yet. A lot can change in 6 months and I would suggest that the schedules are still work in progress.


Sorry, I meant NS19, i.e. three weeks' time.

However, I'm aware a lot can change quickly. My original comment about low utilisation was based on
a glitch in the schedules where the additional MCY and HBA had been added, but the SYD-ADL flying hadn't yet been removed; hence, I incorrectly assumed there was an additional 717 that overnighted in SYD, which exacerbated the low utilisation.


There are currently two aircraft offline for what appears to be maintenance, so if ADL flying is being swapped onto B737s (as is some CBR flying) it's most likely related to that rather than a permanent change, especially if it's only over the next few weeks...
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:08 am

DeltaB717 wrote:
TasFlyer wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:

In all honesty I wouldn't pay too much attention to schedules for IATA Winter yet. A lot can change in 6 months and I would suggest that the schedules are still work in progress.


Sorry, I meant NS19, i.e. three weeks' time.

However, I'm aware a lot can change quickly. My original comment about low utilisation was based on
a glitch in the schedules where the additional MCY and HBA had been added, but the SYD-ADL flying hadn't yet been removed; hence, I incorrectly assumed there was an additional 717 that overnighted in SYD, which exacerbated the low utilisation.


There are currently two aircraft offline for what appears to be maintenance, so if ADL flying is being swapped onto B737s (as is some CBR flying) it's most likely related to that rather than a permanent change, especially if it's only over the next few weeks...


Also with more 737 pilots online to take over SYD-BNE, SYD-ADL etc it will give them more slack to put 717s through repaint.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:36 am

Fairfax business editor raises the question of whether Virgin Australia should nix its B737MAX order, especially as a move by incoming CEO Paul Scurrah to reign in costs.

"Costly and unnecessary: Virgin should take fresh look at MAX 8 order"
https://www.smh.com.au/business/compani ... 513jh.html

What I found interesting was this:

The MAX 8 order has at times been contentious, given Virgin’s troubled financial history.
It is said to have been the primary reason for the departure of John Thomas from the group in 2017 after less than a year in charge of the group’s operations. Thomas was regarded as the heir-apparent to John Borghetti as Virgin chief executive. Thomas is believed to have argued against the order.


Does anybody know more on this? Was JT staunchly against the MAX and did that have anything to do with his being fired?
 
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eta unknown
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 6:52 am

I believe JT had a personality clash with board member Liz Grimes (who has no aviation experience).

Given the VA route network, except for SYD/BNE-DPS I don't see why they really need the max either... are the operating costs on mainly shorthaul flights really that more impressive than already leased cheaper NG's?
 
aerokiwi
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 7:26 am

eta unknown wrote:
I believe JT had a personality clash with board member Liz Grimes (who has no aviation experience).

Given the VA route network, except for SYD/BNE-DPS I don't see why they really need the max either... are the operating costs on mainly shorthaul flights really that more impressive than already leased cheaper NG's?


Well JQ should nix the 32X order too, on that logic. Not that there's a lot of logic going on re the MAX these days - a lot of assertions without evidence.

I'd note also that QF has been criticised for deferring capex on aircraft, helping the balancesheet short term by deferring 737 renewals but likely to have a hefty impact down the road. Maybe it's a better approach but clearly it's not cut and dry. And at least some of VA's older 737s will be kept and "milked"... over at Tiger. So yeah, there's that to consider.
 
743Flyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:17 am

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/ ... a/10894426

ABC reporting that CASA has suspended 737 Max 8 operations within Australia
 
qf002
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:21 am

aerokiwi wrote:
Well JQ should nix the 32X order too, on that logic. Not that there's a lot of logic going on re the MAX these days - a lot of assertions without evidence.


Except that JQ is very profitable and has a tangible use for their A321neos unlike VA which seems to be buying for the sake of it.

The issue in this case isn't the MAX as an aircraft, it's VA as an airline.
 
oskarclare
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:30 am

Brisbane Airport last night at Routes Asia won the Marketing award for 20 million+ passengers. Brisbane Marketing also won the destination award.The overall award was won by them as well.. Congrats to them, hopefully they will be able to attract more services and airlines.

Also Perth won the category of 4 - 20million passengers. Congrats to them also, they have done well in the last year with new flights to London and now Tokyo Narita. Hopefully they too are able to attract more carriers. Adelaide got highly commended in that category as well.

https://australianaviation.com.au/2019/ ... ing-award/
 
aerokiwi
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:37 am

qf002 wrote:
aerokiwi wrote:
Well JQ should nix the 32X order too, on that logic. Not that there's a lot of logic going on re the MAX these days - a lot of assertions without evidence.


Except that JQ is very profitable and has a tangible use for their A321neos unlike VA which seems to be buying for the sake of it.

The issue in this case isn't the MAX as an aircraft, it's VA as an airline.


It was raised because of the MAX as an aircraft by the journalist. VA domestic is very profitable too, actually, which is where these planes are going. Which is moot anyway because the logic of the post was - do they really make enough of a cost savings to warrant their purchase? Same applies to JQ and, eventually, QF.

And you really think they're just "buying it for the sake of it"...? Really?! Because that's how billion dollar deals are done. Ugh.

If the CASA ban is true, though, it does raise serious issues and implications that VA will have to consider going forward. I don't believe the initial financial logic of the order is one of them.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:48 am

743Flyer wrote:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/boeing-737-max-8-suspended-operations-australia/10894426

ABC reporting that CASA has suspended 737 Max 8 operations within Australia


There is no significant impact at this point, as FJ is the only other carrier (besides MI - which Singapore had earlier suspended 737 MAX ops) to fly the 737 MAX into Australia.

aerokiwi wrote:
If the CASA ban is true, though, it does raise serious issues and implications that VA will have to consider going forward.


Why? It is only a temporary suspension of the aircraft type at this stage. If an appropriate fix is made by Boeing, than the suspension is likely to be lifted. At this exact moment, neither the FAA/EASA have grounded the entire worldwide fleet. If the grounding occurs for a substantial period of time, then yes VA would certainly need to reconsider given their first delivery occurs in November.

When the FAA/EASA grounded the 787 fleet worldwide, that didn't change QF/JQ's intention to order the 787 as an appropriate fix to the battery issues was found and re-certified by the FAA/EASA. If there is indeed a design flaw with the 737 MAX, then you can be sure Boeing will make the required modifications.
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Ryanair01
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 8:56 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Fairfax business editor raises the question of whether Virgin Australia should nix its B737MAX order, especially as a move by incoming CEO Paul Scurrah to reign in costs.

"Costly and unnecessary: Virgin should take fresh look at MAX 8 order"
https://www.smh.com.au/business/compani ... 513jh.html

What I found interesting was this:

The MAX 8 order has at times been contentious, given Virgin’s troubled financial history.
It is said to have been the primary reason for the departure of John Thomas from the group in 2017 after less than a year in charge of the group’s operations. Thomas was regarded as the heir-apparent to John Borghetti as Virgin chief executive. Thomas is believed to have argued against the order.


Does anybody know more on this? Was JT staunchly against the MAX and did that have anything to do with his being fired?


That was the rumor, NZ & JT allegedly opposed with LG and other shareholders in favour of maintaining a younger fleet.

downdata wrote:
Its a bit weird, why do they feel necessary to comment on a type that has never been operated by VA and for which the pilots never received training on. The union has no more insight into the plane than any random person on the street.


Quite, especially as worker safety is a core value of unions and the two investigations are still open (not proven to be a problem nor cleared). Hardly reassuring.

743Flyer wrote:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/boeing-737-max-8-suspended-operations-australia/10894426

ABC reporting that CASA has suspended 737 Max 8 operations within Australia


Easy move for CASA, especially as it just impacts Fiji Airways. None the less Virgin will have an uphill struggle convincing lazy Journos not to regurgitate this ban when their MAXs arrive. Plug in a bit of social media hysteria and it's going to be tricky. Still, nothing like as tricky as for the 300 or so families involved in these crashes, very sad.
 
SYDSpotter
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:13 am

Ryanair01 wrote:
None the less Virgin will have an uphill struggle convincing lazy Journos not to regurgitate this ban when their MAXs arrive. Plug in a bit of social media hysteria and it's going to be tricky. Still, nothing like as tricky as for the 300 or so families involved in these crashes, very sad.


Yup, I can remember the aftermath of QF32 the media went into overdrive on aviation matters. If a Qantas flight left 30 mins late because of a tech issue it became front page news.

And in our current social media age, if there is any sort of incident/delay no matter how minor, you can be sure the twitter/facebook warriors will be letting the world how their lives have been severely impacted
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qf002
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 9:28 am

aerokiwi wrote:
It was raised because of the MAX as an aircraft by the journalist.


Fair enough. I didn't read the article, was just responding to the points which were brought across into the thread.

aerokiwi wrote:
And you really think they're just "buying it for the sake of it"...? Really?! Because that's how billion dollar deals are done. Ugh.


Well, yeah.

VA has made plenty of very questionable moves over the last 8 years. Borghetti's primary focus as CEO seems to have been securing the next injection of cash and then deciding what to waste it on. Vanity has played a bigger role than actual intelligent strategy. There has been little financial restraint and realistically VA wasn't in a position to be ordering new aircraft at the time when the MAXs were ordered.

There are plenty of examples of airlines ordering beyond their means out of vanity.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:03 am

Thought that was a pretty decent move by mr. Joyce:
Qantas boss Alan Joyce responds to letter from 10yo CEO of Oceania Express
Qantas has delivered a lesson in marketing 101 while responding to a letter from a 10-year-old asking for advice on how to run an airline.

Alex Jacquot sent a handwritten note to chief executive Alan Joyce saying he had already taken the first steps in starting an airline and was wondering what to do next.

"I have already started some stuff like what type of planes I'll need, flight numbers, catering and more," Alex wrote.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/ ... r/10893572
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 10:33 am

SYDSpotter wrote:
Ryanair01 wrote:
None the less Virgin will have an uphill struggle convincing lazy Journos not to regurgitate this ban when their MAXs arrive. Plug in a bit of social media hysteria and it's going to be tricky. Still, nothing like as tricky as for the 300 or so families involved in these crashes, very sad.


Yup, I can remember the aftermath of QF32 the media went into overdrive on aviation matters. If a Qantas flight left 30 mins late because of a tech issue it became front page news.

And in our current social media age, if there is any sort of incident/delay no matter how minor, you can be sure the twitter/facebook warriors will be letting the world how their lives have been severely impacted


I’m actually suprised over the restraint of the media atm, a QF 737 had a decompression and a ‘precautionary disembarkation’ with slides in recent months, I was suprised the media weren’t going nuts over that. Or haven’t joined dots now that don’t exsist.
 
aerokiwi
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Joined: Sun Jul 30, 2000 1:17 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:07 am

SYDSpotter wrote:
743Flyer wrote:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-03-12/boeing-737-max-8-suspended-operations-australia/10894426

ABC reporting that CASA has suspended 737 Max 8 operations within Australia


There is no significant impact at this point, as FJ is the only other carrier (besides MI - which Singapore had earlier suspended 737 MAX ops) to fly the 737 MAX into Australia.

aerokiwi wrote:
If the CASA ban is true, though, it does raise serious issues and implications that VA will have to consider going forward.


Why? It is only a temporary suspension of the aircraft type at this stage. If an appropriate fix is made by Boeing, than the suspension is likely to be lifted. At this exact moment, neither the FAA/EASA have grounded the entire worldwide fleet. If the grounding occurs for a substantial period of time, then yes VA would certainly need to reconsider given their first delivery occurs in November.

When the FAA/EASA grounded the 787 fleet worldwide, that didn't change QF/JQ's intention to order the 787 as an appropriate fix to the battery issues was found and re-certified by the FAA/EASA. If there is indeed a design flaw with the 737 MAX, then you can be sure Boeing will make the required modifications.


Generally I agree. But I imagine the first VA 737 MAX will be entering production soon - is it still a 2019 delivery? - and I guess they have to consider the possibility of a lengthy suspension. Would Boeing penalise them if they don't accept delivery straight away? Surely not.

qf002 wrote:
aerokiwi wrote:
It was raised because of the MAX as an aircraft by the journalist.


Fair enough. I didn't read the article, was just responding to the points which were brought across into the thread.

aerokiwi wrote:
And you really think they're just "buying it for the sake of it"...? Really?! Because that's how billion dollar deals are done. Ugh.


Well, yeah.

VA has made plenty of very questionable moves over the last 8 years. Borghetti's primary focus as CEO seems to have been securing the next injection of cash and then deciding what to waste it on. Vanity has played a bigger role than actual intelligent strategy. There has been little financial restraint and realistically VA wasn't in a position to be ordering new aircraft at the time when the MAXs were ordered.

There are plenty of examples of airlines ordering beyond their means out of vanity.


I just don't believe an order for 40 737s, when you're operating a fleet of over 80, some dated from 2004, with another dozen or so of those planning a new life at sister airline, Tiger, is unreasonable. Especially when at the time the carrier was looking at removing A330s from domestic and competing on Bali flights more. And you rarely find vanity irders from publicly listed airlines.

The NZ kerfuffle was because of their demand for VA to essentially eliminate long haul and feed NZ's Auckland hub, which the entire board balked at. I don't believe it had anything to do with the MAX order.

VA has made some questionable decisions, sure. But I don't believe the 737MAX is one of them.
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Tue Mar 12, 2019 11:52 am

If NZ/Luxon wanted VA to dump all international, "dump Delta" and feed everything into his airline, Luxon should've made a takeover bid for VA himself, then should he had been successful in his bid, then proceed to strip VA of all international and turn VA into "Air New Zealand Australia", a feeder for "Air New Zealand", as he wanted.

Saying that, all of VA's other shareholders told Luxon/NZ off for being selfish, and with that, any chances of Star Alliance membership walked out the door the moment Luxon/NZ quit VA, leaving only SkyTeam and VA's long time USA BFF, DL.

If anything, if VA are to revert primarily to being a "domestic carrier" in the future, the closest they're going to get is probably under a potential "majority DL ownership", with VA's only international being NZ and LAX (DL hub), with the nickname of "Delta Australia", much like how Virgin Atlantic is nicknamed "Delta UK"
 
tayser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:25 am

"ScoMo and Dan" had a media conference on the platforms at Sunshine station this morning to announce they've signed a Heads of Agreement on MARL - Melbourne Airport Rail Link. This effectively formalises Federal and State commitments already outlined ($10 billion).

Business case (and no doubt a reference design) have been underway and it should be released by year end / early 2020. Construction start scheduled for 2022 according to this media release: https://www.premier.vic.gov.au/airport- ... nt-signed/

Geotechnical investigations have already begun along the route which broadly speaking is Southern Cross -> Sunshine -> Melbourne Airport. The 'how' those points will be connected is not set in stone (that's what the business case is for) and the line is part of a wider program of rail projects - the Suburban Rail Loop and the expansion of trackage more broadly in Western Melbourne (the Ballarat Line from Sunshine to Melton will likely be electrified / quadruplicated and similar from Deer Park to Wyndham Vale will be electrified and quadruplicated to enable new metro services to operate independently of regional Vline services). All that new level of rail service - Melton, Wyndham Vale, Airport (and the Suburban Rail Loop services which is a separate business case) needs another track pair between Sunshine and the City - hence MARL is the first cab off the rank.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:09 am

SCFlyer wrote:
If NZ/Luxon wanted VA to dump all international, "dump Delta" and feed everything into his airline, Luxon should've made a takeover bid for VA himself, then should he had been successful in his bid, then proceed to strip VA of all international and turn VA into "Air New Zealand Australia", a feeder for "Air New Zealand", as he wanted.

Saying that, all of VA's other shareholders told Luxon/NZ off for being selfish, and with that, any chances of Star Alliance membership walked out the door the moment Luxon/NZ quit VA, leaving only SkyTeam and VA's long time USA BFF, DL.

If anything, if VA are to revert primarily to being a "domestic carrier" in the future, the closest they're going to get is probably under a potential "majority DL ownership", with VA's only international being NZ and LAX (DL hub), with the nickname of "Delta Australia", much like how Virgin Atlantic is nicknamed "Delta UK"


A few points
    VA is already a primarily domestic operator and has always been. It has an extensive and profitable domestic network and a fairly small international network of its own which is not surprising given it is very hard for a new entrant to get rights & slots to major routes
    VA has always maintained that it doesn't want to join an alliance and given their relationship with both SQ and DL it doesn't really make sense anyway. Alliances are very expensive to be a part of so they'd need to quantify the benefits before even thinking about it.
    Much is made of NZ's supposed veto rights in Star but even an egotist like Luxon would recognise that NZ is a very small fish in Star and if SQ, LH and UA wanted something (and we don't know know that they do in this case), NZ would be expected to comply.
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smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:44 am

tullamarine wrote:
SCFlyer wrote:
If NZ/Luxon wanted VA to dump all international, "dump Delta" and feed everything into his airline, Luxon should've made a takeover bid for VA himself, then should he had been successful in his bid, then proceed to strip VA of all international and turn VA into "Air New Zealand Australia", a feeder for "Air New Zealand", as he wanted.

Saying that, all of VA's other shareholders told Luxon/NZ off for being selfish, and with that, any chances of Star Alliance membership walked out the door the moment Luxon/NZ quit VA, leaving only SkyTeam and VA's long time USA BFF, DL.

If anything, if VA are to revert primarily to being a "domestic carrier" in the future, the closest they're going to get is probably under a potential "majority DL ownership", with VA's only international being NZ and LAX (DL hub), with the nickname of "Delta Australia", much like how Virgin Atlantic is nicknamed "Delta UK"


A few points
    VA is already a primarily domestic operator and has always been. It has an extensive and profitable domestic network and a fairly small international network of its own which is not surprising given it is very hard for a new entrant to get rights & slots to major routes
    VA has always maintained that it doesn't want to join an alliance and given their relationship with both SQ and DL it doesn't really make sense anyway. Alliances are very expensive to be a part of so they'd need to quantify the benefits before even thinking about it.
    Much is made of NZ's supposed veto rights in Star but even an egotist like Luxon would recognise that NZ is a very small fish in Star and if SQ, LH and UA wanted something (and we don't know know that they do in this case), NZ would be expected to comply.


If I’m honest, I take a lot of what I hear about the NZ/VA split with a grain of salt. I don’t think a lot of the strategic items mentioned here, and emotional personality clashes occurred- VA wasn’t returning the invents NZ wanted so they moved on....

I think alliances are increasingly irrelevant or not the necessity they once were; QF as an aligned carrier have significant agreements with NZ,CZ,MU,EK and codeshares with WS,AS,AF etc. No reason why VA can’t contiue with their same approach.

Only change I would have thought would have added value is a greater share of flying between partners and JVs eg - SQ JV with VA flying to SIN to add some revenue (As they do to LAX with DL). But SQ doesn’t need this, nor do they really need to VA to be hugely profitable, as long as the value of velocity adds enough directly to the SQ bottom line.
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:43 am

My understanding from what i read in regards to Star Alliance joining procedures is that a new member has to be unanimously voted in by all full members. In other words all full Star Alliance members have one vote, and one veto. Which means it can take one no vote by a member to decline a application, however if the vast majority wanted a specific member, the declining ceo/airline would be spoken to sort out a deal, which from what I read is how SQ got in as allegedly TG originally wanted to vote no.

This is as opppsed to the OneWorld or SkyTeam method where only the founder members have the veto.
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:12 am

smi0006 wrote:
Only change I would have thought would have added value is a greater share of flying between partners and JVs eg - SQ JV with VA flying to SIN to add some revenue (As they do to LAX with DL). But SQ doesn’t need this, nor do they really need to VA to be hugely profitable, as long as the value of velocity adds enough directly to the SQ bottom line.


SQ pretty much has all the SIN flying covered. Adding VA would basically dilute yield and i dont think SQ are willing to trade any SIN flying to VA, considerng SQ are a hands-off investor in VA and have minimal/no influence on VA's operations apart from 'acquiring' the velocity FF base.
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:19 am

SCFlyer wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
Only change I would have thought would have added value is a greater share of flying between partners and JVs eg - SQ JV with VA flying to SIN to add some revenue (As they do to LAX with DL). But SQ doesn’t need this, nor do they really need to VA to be hugely profitable, as long as the value of velocity adds enough directly to the SQ bottom line.


SQ pretty much has all the SIN flying covered. Adding VA would basically dilute yield and i dont think SQ are willing to trade any SIN flying to VA, considerng SQ are a hands-off investor in VA and have minimal/no influence on VA's operations apart from 'acquiring' the velocity FF base.


Sorry, agreed I wasn’t clear. I only meant VA flying to SIN in lieu of SQ metal to share the revenue- not add capacity!
 
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Zkpilot
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:41 am

SCFlyer wrote:
If NZ/Luxon wanted VA to dump all international, "dump Delta" and feed everything into his airline, Luxon should've made a takeover bid for VA himself, then should he had been successful in his bid, then proceed to strip VA of all international and turn VA into "Air New Zealand Australia", a feeder for "Air New Zealand", as he wanted.

Saying that, all of VA's other shareholders told Luxon/NZ off for being selfish, and with that, any chances of Star Alliance membership walked out the door the moment Luxon/NZ quit VA, leaving only SkyTeam and VA's long time USA BFF, DL.

If anything, if VA are to revert primarily to being a "domestic carrier" in the future, the closest they're going to get is probably under a potential "majority DL ownership", with VA's only international being NZ and LAX (DL hub), with the nickname of "Delta Australia", much like how Virgin Atlantic is nicknamed "Delta UK"

Take that with a truckload of salt. The main cause of the rift from what I have heard is that Luxon was sick of bailing out VA to the tune of hundreds of millions and demanded that they turn a profit (which at the time almost all airlines around the world were doing). Not an unreasonable request. Of course one way to do that would be to cut back on international flying and get rid of the 77W fleet (freeing up capital as well as reducing losses).
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:57 am

Zkpilot wrote:
SCFlyer wrote:
If NZ/Luxon wanted VA to dump all international, "dump Delta" and feed everything into his airline, Luxon should've made a takeover bid for VA himself, then should he had been successful in his bid, then proceed to strip VA of all international and turn VA into "Air New Zealand Australia", a feeder for "Air New Zealand", as he wanted.

Saying that, all of VA's other shareholders told Luxon/NZ off for being selfish, and with that, any chances of Star Alliance membership walked out the door the moment Luxon/NZ quit VA, leaving only SkyTeam and VA's long time USA BFF, DL.

If anything, if VA are to revert primarily to being a "domestic carrier" in the future, the closest they're going to get is probably under a potential "majority DL ownership", with VA's only international being NZ and LAX (DL hub), with the nickname of "Delta Australia", much like how Virgin Atlantic is nicknamed "Delta UK"

Take that with a truckload of salt. The main cause of the rift from what I have heard is that Luxon was sick of bailing out VA to the tune of hundreds of millions and demanded that they turn a profit (which at the time almost all airlines around the world were doing). Not an unreasonable request. Of course one way to do that would be to cut back on international flying and get rid of the 77W fleet (freeing up capital as well as reducing losses).


Source for NZ/Luxon's alleged demands to "give up all international" (Reuters):
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-virg ... SKCN1LL36K

While Luxon's financial concerns were valid, unfortunately he wasn't able to keep his ego in check against another bloke with an ego.

Charging in and demanding "they give up all international" was never going to work when VA was never a coherent unit with shareholders all having their own agendas.

Had Luxon kept his ego in check by withholding his "alleged demands" to "give up all international" while making his pitch to oust the outgoing VA CEO over mismanagement, then perhaps NZ may still be a shareholder of VA today with a different CEO.
 
TG788
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:46 pm

Pilbara Airlines is now taking bookings from PHE to SIN/MNL/SGN.

https://thewest.com.au/news/north-west- ... 881128729z
 
ArtV
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:31 pm

TG788 wrote:
Pilbara Airlines is now taking bookings from PHE to SIN/MNL/SGN.

https://thewest.com.au/news/north-west- ... 881128729z


I have been told these will be initially flown with wet leased Royal Brunei aircraft, but given the history of previous cancellations (original announcements were to fly to SGN only with VN aircraft), who knows..
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:09 pm

SCFlyer wrote:
Zkpilot wrote:
SCFlyer wrote:
If NZ/Luxon wanted VA to dump all international, "dump Delta" and feed everything into his airline, Luxon should've made a takeover bid for VA himself, then should he had been successful in his bid, then proceed to strip VA of all international and turn VA into "Air New Zealand Australia", a feeder for "Air New Zealand", as he wanted.

Saying that, all of VA's other shareholders told Luxon/NZ off for being selfish, and with that, any chances of Star Alliance membership walked out the door the moment Luxon/NZ quit VA, leaving only SkyTeam and VA's long time USA BFF, DL.

If anything, if VA are to revert primarily to being a "domestic carrier" in the future, the closest they're going to get is probably under a potential "majority DL ownership", with VA's only international being NZ and LAX (DL hub), with the nickname of "Delta Australia", much like how Virgin Atlantic is nicknamed "Delta UK"

Take that with a truckload of salt. The main cause of the rift from what I have heard is that Luxon was sick of bailing out VA to the tune of hundreds of millions and demanded that they turn a profit (which at the time almost all airlines around the world were doing). Not an unreasonable request. Of course one way to do that would be to cut back on international flying and get rid of the 77W fleet (freeing up capital as well as reducing losses).


Source for NZ/Luxon's alleged demands to "give up all international" (Reuters):
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-virg ... SKCN1LL36K

While Luxon's financial concerns were valid, unfortunately he wasn't able to keep his ego in check against another bloke with an ego.

Charging in and demanding "they give up all international" was never going to work when VA was never a coherent unit with shareholders all having their own agendas.

Had Luxon kept his ego in check by withholding his "alleged demands" to "give up all international" while making his pitch to oust the outgoing VA CEO over mismanagement, then perhaps NZ may still be a shareholder of VA today with a different CEO.


I think Zkpilot is on the money. NZ didn't just dump their substantial stake in VA, and take a massive loss on their investment, just because of a temper tantrum.

I don't doubt that Luxon suggested that VA should leave the long haul international market. However I don't believe it was a 'tantrum' as much as part of a a broader observation that VA was underperforming financially and needed to address that. Long haul is at best marginally profitable for VA, and certainly isn't delivering any meaningful ROIC.

Either way I don't think NZ would be a shareholder today. They weren't prepared to continue to prop up VA and after multiple rounds of capital raising had had enough. Hence the comment about it being time for Virgin to make a profit. The board however were prepared to give Borghetti's strategy more time so NZ walked away. They didn't have faith in the company's direction, and didn't want to continually pump money into the business. Staying exposed NZ to too much risk.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:46 am

Either way I don't think NZ would be a shareholder today. They weren't prepared to continue to prop up VA and after multiple rounds of capital raising had had enough. Hence the comment about it being time for Virgin to make a profit. The board however were prepared to give Borghetti's strategy more time so NZ walked away. They didn't have faith in the company's direction, and didn't want to continually pump money into the business. Staying exposed NZ to too much risk.


NZ is only a small airline; VA is actually larger in terms of fleet, staff and annual revenue. It probably should not be in the business of investing in other airlines given it is a semi-nationalised entity supported by the NZ Government. Exiting an equity position in VA made sense.

Having said that, exiting the alliance with VA probably doesn't make as much sense and will probably eventually be seen as a strategic mistake. The cancellation has meant NZ has lost access to the 7,000,000 Velocity members who may have considered NZ attractive for international travel. No Star FF program has much foothold in AU. NZ's international business relies heavily on Australian transits and, without VA, it really can only compete on price; in terms of product it is only average and there are often much faster direct options. The QF partnership really offers very little; they cannot get closer due to competition issues and QF have no real interest in channeling passengers onto NZ services.
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waoz1
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:57 am

Air Asia commencing PER-LOP

Starting 9th of June - 4 weekly

https://thewest.com.au/travel/air-aviat ... 881135163z
 
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bjwonline
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 4:40 am

A couple of observations at SYD this afternoon (Thursday):
1. A QF 744 is docked at T3 preparing to operate a domestic sector. I'm assuming this is make a bit of extra cash as it positions to MEL (as has happened a few times of late). So my question is what is the international sector is it due to carry out from MEL (or whoever it ends up)?

2. A CI A350 is over in the hanger at the QF jet base. Again assuming it's for emergency maintenance but anyone know more specifics? I can't help but kick the hornets nest a bit and suggest that QF are maybe enjoying the opportunity at taking a sneaky closer look at the A350 for their own future plans???
 
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Dan23
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:19 am

bjwonline wrote:
A couple of observations at SYD this afternoon (Thursday):
1. A QF 744 is docked at T3 preparing to operate a domestic sector. I'm assuming this is make a bit of extra cash as it positions to MEL (as has happened a few times of late). So my question is what is the international sector is it due to carry out from MEL (or whoever it ends up)?

According to FR24 it is VH-OEB which will only be operating a SYD-MEL-SYD QF469/462 rotation this evening.
 
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SeaEagle8
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:23 am

Dan23 wrote:
bjwonline wrote:
A couple of observations at SYD this afternoon (Thursday):
1. A QF 744 is docked at T3 preparing to operate a domestic sector. I'm assuming this is make a bit of extra cash as it positions to MEL (as has happened a few times of late). So my question is what is the international sector is it due to carry out from MEL (or whoever it ends up)?

According to FR24 it is VH-OEB which will only be operating a SYD-MEL-SYD QF469/462 rotation this evening.


Perhaps Grand Prix related? Is there a flyby scheduled?
NSW based avgeek
 
downdata
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 5:41 am

tullamarine wrote:
Either way I don't think NZ would be a shareholder today. They weren't prepared to continue to prop up VA and after multiple rounds of capital raising had had enough. Hence the comment about it being time for Virgin to make a profit. The board however were prepared to give Borghetti's strategy more time so NZ walked away. They didn't have faith in the company's direction, and didn't want to continually pump money into the business. Staying exposed NZ to too much risk.


NZ is only a small airline; VA is actually larger in terms of fleet, staff and annual revenue. It probably should not be in the business of investing in other airlines given it is a semi-nationalised entity supported by the NZ Government. Exiting an equity position in VA made sense.


Air NZ is in fact around twice the size of VA in terms of market cap and profits; similar in terms of revenue and employees. NZ's fleet is 106 vs VA's 133 but NZ has more WBs and smaller TPs.

Image
 
decry
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:54 am

I’d say the QF 747 is being used domestically for flight cancellation recovery due to storms in Sydney this afternoon and onwards into this evening.
 
Gemuser
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:58 am

bjwonline wrote:
A couple of observations at SYD this afternoon (Thursday):
1. A QF 744 is docked at T3 preparing to operate a domestic sector. I'm assuming this is make a bit of extra cash as it positions to MEL (as has happened a few times of late). So my question is what is the international sector is it due to carry out from MEL (or whoever it ends up)?

2. A CI A350 is over in the hanger at the QF jet base. Again assuming it's for emergency maintenance but anyone know more specifics? I can't help but kick the hornets nest a bit and suggest that QF are maybe enjoying the opportunity at taking a sneaky closer look at the A350 for their own future plans???

If it was going to MEL to operate an international sector it would go from the international terminal and carry domestic passengers under the D-pass system. Much more likely as suggested above it's QF playing catch-up.

Gemuser
 
decry
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:03 am

Also the CI a350 in the hangar would be maintenance of some sort. Qantas’ hangars have had many different airlines visit over the past few years such as SQ & UPS 744Fs, FedEx MD11F, Qatar a380, Virgin Australia a330 & e190, Cathay a343, Emirates a380 & Jetstar a320s & 788s.
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:06 am

w
decry wrote:
I’d say the QF 747 is being used domestically for flight cancellation recovery due to storms in Sydney this afternoon and onwards into this evening.


I believe QF have done storm recovery a number of times. Makes sense, especially with high load factors for the Grand Prix.

Shame the 400s won’t wnd their days as the 300s did on transcon and Tasman services
 
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rtav
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:32 am

waoz1 wrote:
Air Asia commencing PER-LOP

Starting 9th of June - 4 weekly

https://thewest.com.au/travel/air-aviat ... 881135163z


For those who are interested.

QZ470 LOP1445 - 1840PER 320 1357
QZ471 PER1930 - 2325LOP 320 1357

In short, Monday, Wednesday, Friday, Sunday. Arrival at PER 1840 departure at 1930 starting June 9th with A320
 
dredgy
Posts: 506
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 8:01 am

ArtV wrote:
TG788 wrote:
Pilbara Airlines is now taking bookings from PHE to SIN/MNL/SGN.

https://thewest.com.au/news/north-west- ... 881128729z


I have been told these will be initially flown with wet leased Royal Brunei aircraft, but given the history of previous cancellations (original announcements were to fly to SGN only with VN aircraft), who knows..


While I wouldn't place money on something called "Pilbara Airlines" that only sells tickets through one travel agency, there is demand from PHE to South East Asia.
Not the destinations I would have chosen though - given the high population of Malay & Indonesian people in Hedland as well as cashed up leisure travellers, Lombok and Kuala Lumpur would have made more sense to me.
Singapore I'm not sure about, Manilla and Ho Chi Minh I don't have high hopes for.
 
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SeaEagle8
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - March 2019

Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:06 am

Wicked weather continuing.

Many flights diverting including EK, NZ, MH and HA heading to MEL.
The QF744 from MEL-SYD now circling as well.
NSW based avgeek
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