Varsity1
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:14 pm

emuwarveteran wrote:
THEY ACTUALLY DID IT THE ABSOLUTE MADMEN

i wish them luck, hopefully this will be a success


best response so far.

bravo
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AEROFAN
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:14 pm

Congrats to JB in deciding to fly to London. Look forward to J fares reducing.
 
Cunard
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:21 pm

airbazar wrote:
2021 is when BOS is expected to open the new international terminal expansion. Makes perfect sense.


2021 is also when the new arrivals terminal at STN is expected to open with the existing terminal being reconfigurd as the departure terminal creating over 50% increase in the departure lounge.

By 2021 the whole terminal experience at STN will be greatly improved and the airport passenger figures are growing making it the third busiest London airport and the third busiest airport in the United Kingdom with the airport currently handling upto 27m a year with a planned capacity for 45m a year, plenty of slots, no competition on the transatlantic market, a modern and efficient airport with great connections and a direct if what rather slow train link to Liverpool Street Station right in the heart of the City of London.

Although Ryanair don't connect with other airlines STN has the ability for JetBlue to take advantage of the many European destinations currently flown from the airport throughout Europe, many of those destinations are not available from LGW or LHR.

I honestly think that STN is the best option for JetBlue, slots at LHR are too expensive and fairly hard to obtain and there is far too much competition for JetBlue to have any real impact, AA/BA, DL/VS and UA would all eat them alive. LGW slots on the other hand could possibly be obtained but they would be up against Norwegian and British Airways along with the proposed flights by Delta/Virgin who would all react in a way that would hurt JetBlue.

So in my opinion STN is the best option for JetBlue as it's a great airport and is only going to get greater, even Emirates have realised the potential of STN after recently announcing a second daily B773 flight from DXB with F class within a year of the first flight taking place.

I've always admired JetBlue as an airline and I have enjoyed several domestic flights with them and I'm rather excited now that they have officially announced there intentions of flying transatlantic to London especially after all the hype, although I'm a British Airways frequent flyer I will be very tempted to fly JetBlue from London to either Boston and New York JFK.

On a personal note I'm rooting for STN when JetBlue finally announce their choice of London airport for the reasons that I have given but in saying that STN is 125 miles and approximately a two hour drive away from my front door where as LHR is far closer at 60 miles and takes less than an hour's drive
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emuwarveteran
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:25 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
I am completely underwhelmed by this announcement: 18 months from now is October 2020. Spring/summer 2021 is TWO YEARS from now!
A lot can happen in two years. The economy could have a complete melt down and JetBlue might go down with it.


This forum in a nutshell: "Airlines shouldn't do anything because the economy could collapse, WHAT HAPPENS THEN???"
jetBlue survived the 2008 recession i think they will survive the next one, especially since apparently it's likely not to be as bad as the last one
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spacecadet
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:34 pm

Dieuwer wrote:
I am completely underwhelmed by this announcement: 18 months from now is October 2020. Spring/summer 2021 is TWO YEARS from now!
A lot can happen in two years. The economy could have a complete melt down and JetBlue might go down with it.


I have no idea what your frame of reference is, but two years is nothing.

The economy having a meltdown would affect *every* company in *every* industry. Companies can't just throw up their hands and say "welp, may as well not plan anything because someday the economy's gonna tank."

People here still have this weird idea that JetBlue is somehow special and will be singled out by any economic downturn. JetBlue is no different than any other airline in that regard, and they're no less able to weather it if that were to happen. Companies have plans in place for that too.
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DeltaB717
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:43 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
SunsetLimited wrote:
2021? Nothing like giving the competition even more time to up their game and make it even more difficult for B6.


This is the part that has me scratching my head as well. Was the idea to boost the stock price by telegraphing their strategy now, teasing a premium-heavy configuration?


Would they have been required by law to announce to the (stock) market that they were adjusting the A321 order book? Is the change that material? If they had to announce the change to the market, surely it'd be sensible to announce at the same time why they had made that change.
 
Scarebus34
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:44 pm

Lol this is a bunch of nothing. I see it as trying to inflate their short-term value in the event of an acquisition.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:45 pm

Cunard wrote:
By 2021 the whole terminal experience at STN will be greatly improved and the airport passenger figures are growing making it the third busiest London airport and the third busiest airport in the United Kingdom with the airport currently handling upto 27m a year with a planned capacity for 45m a year, plenty of slots, no competition on the transatlantic market, a modern and efficient airport with great connections and a direct if what rather slow train link to Liverpool Street Station right in the heart of the City of London.

Interesting post.

I quoted the NY Times that JB wants to offer Mint class service. Will those customers be OK with ending up at STN rather then LHR or LGW? Will they be the ones working on iteneraries connecting to FR's varied destinations? Or am I overplaying the Mint angle?

I guess in my own case I could see myself 'splurging' on BOS-STN Mint service then jumping on FR to some of those varied destinations, but I don't know if there are a lot of other people who would do this.

Cunard wrote:
So in my opinion STN is the best option for JetBlue as it's a great airport and is only going to get greater, even Emirates have realised the potential of STN after recently announcing a second daily B773 flight from DXB with F class within a year of the first flight taking place.

Indeed. More options is a good thing.
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VS4ever
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:48 pm

DeltaB717 wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
SunsetLimited wrote:
2021? Nothing like giving the competition even more time to up their game and make it even more difficult for B6.


This is the part that has me scratching my head as well. Was the idea to boost the stock price by telegraphing their strategy now, teasing a premium-heavy configuration?


Would they have been required by law to announce to the (stock) market that they were adjusting the A321 order book? Is the change that material? If they had to announce the change to the market, surely it'd be sensible to announce at the same time why they had made that change.



From their official press release, i suspect this is why they didn't announce to the stock market. No material change in their financials or expected financial commitments on the aircraft order front. So basically Airbus is giving them the LR for the same price as their existing orders.

http://blueir.investproductions.com/inv ... -221648594


This conversion does not impact JetBlue’s external financial commitments or represent incremental capital expenditures as the current order book remains the same. Furthermore, JetBlue remains committed to delivering earnings per share between $2.50 and $3.00 by 2020. This update to the fleet plan is part of JetBlue’s vision to continue improving its earnings per share beyond 2020
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:49 pm

spinkid wrote:
Fex180 wrote:
the official statement makes multiple mentions of "low fares" which probably rules out an all-mint product.

It could be Premium Heavy with something like 10 rows of coach in the far back. Other Carriers have done that.

CEO Hayes is quoted by NYT as saying TATL Premium fares are "obscene" which suggests his idea of "low" might not lower than "obscene" but not LCC/ULCC class pricing.
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Fex180
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:52 pm

Revelation wrote:
spinkid wrote:
Fex180 wrote:
the official statement makes multiple mentions of "low fares" which probably rules out an all-mint product.

It could be Premium Heavy with something like 10 rows of coach in the far back. Other Carriers have done that.

CEO Hayes is quoted by NYT as saying TATL Premium fares are "obscene" which suggests his idea of "low" might not lower than "obscene" but not LCC/ULCC class pricing.


what I meant was that no airline would use the keyword "low fares" to advertise an all-premium product. I could see maybe 60-80 Y seats on the new LR's
 
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Revelation
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:55 pm

Fex180 wrote:
Revelation wrote:
spinkid wrote:
It could be Premium Heavy with something like 10 rows of coach in the far back. Other Carriers have done that.

CEO Hayes is quoted by NYT as saying TATL Premium fares are "obscene" which suggests his idea of "low" might be lower than "obscene" but not LCC/ULCC class pricing.

what I meant was that no airline would use the keyword "low fares" to advertise an all-premium product. I could see maybe 60-80 Y seats on the new LR's

I too have a hard time seeing an all-Mint service.

It'll be interesting to see what it ends up looking like.
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jfk777
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:56 pm

JB flying a few A321neo to the UK, not earth shattering news. You are talking about adding the capacity of one Virgin Atlantic "beach fleet" 747-400 from JFK & Boston to Stansted. Norwegian is way more a "force" then Jetblue will be in this market. These are niche flights in markets full of 744, 777, 787 and A330's. Hey hoping JB can make it work but very limited capacity addition here to the UK market.
 
VS11
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Wed Apr 10, 2019 11:59 pm

I am disappointed for the lack of details. Like everyone else, I was expecting actual schedules announced with airports, intro fares, etc. I guess we are going to have to speculate for at least another year. Nevertheless, I think we should recognize that it is a big deal for jetBlue to launch all of these services. It definitely sets them apart from Southwest, Frontier, Spirit, Alaska, etc. I agree with other posters that they could be serving more than one London airport even though I personally don't think that getting LHR slots is going to be a problem for them.
 
ctrabs0114
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:10 am

SWADawg wrote:
Gulfstream500 wrote:
Kind of a letdown that it won’t be until 2021... that’s almost two years from now. In that much time, NK could by flying to Hawaii...

WN could technically preempt B6 and fly BOS/PVD-LON as well, not that I think they will, but having ETOPS Authorization gives them the ability.


Isn't ETOPS for TPAC service different from ETOPS for TATL service? Because I don't think that's how it works...

Unless you were being highly sarcastic, which I doubt, since you didn't call for B6 to merge with WN/AS/NK/whomever we've decided on this week.
2019: DAL, MCI, PHX, LAS, DFW, SAT, ORD, SLC, SEA, DTW; B73G (WN x3), B738 (WN, AA, DL), A20N (NK), MD83 (AA), B788 (AA x2), CS1 (DL), 739 (DL), 712 (DL)
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:16 am

Cunard wrote:
airbazar wrote:
2021 is when BOS is expected to open the new international terminal expansion. Makes perfect sense.


I honestly think that STN is the best option for JetBlue, slots at LHR are too expensive and fairly hard to obtain and there is far too much competition for JetBlue to have any real impact, AA/BA, DL/VS and UA would all eat them alive. LGW slots on the other hand could possibly be obtained but they would be up against Norwegian and British Airways along with the proposed flights by Delta/Virgin who would all react in a way that would hurt JetBlue.


I would love nothing more than a BOS-STN flight. My family lives just north of there and LHR is the absolute worst LON option for me. However, I think there's little chance that B6's first London route would be to anything other than LHR. For better or for worse STN=Ryanair and that's just not the look B6 is going after. But things could change and in 18 months who knows.
Yes slots are expensive at LHR but B6 has the money for it. People are acting like B6 is this poor little backwater airline that could never afford to buy slots. They made half a billion $ in profits last year. Alternatively, I'm sure that for the right price there would be enough airlines willing to lease them LHR slots. That's lower risk, and at a controllable cost.
Last edited by airbazar on Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
Waterbomber2
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:19 am

VS11 wrote:
I am disappointed for the lack of details. Like everyone else, I was expecting actual schedules announced with airports, intro fares, etc. I guess we are going to have to speculate for at least another year. Nevertheless, I think we should recognize that it is a big deal for jetBlue to launch all of these services. It definitely sets them apart from Southwest, Frontier, Spirit, Alaska, etc. I agree with other posters that they could be serving more than one London airport even though I personally don't think that getting LHR slots is going to be a problem for them.


Yes, this definitely sets them apart in the U.S. non-legacy scenery.
B6's strength in JFK and BOS will serve them well.

However, this is not really huge news. They may succeed in London and Paris with multiple daily frequencies, but I would forget about the other European cities.
 
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NameOmitted
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:20 am

spinkid wrote:
It could be Premium Heavy with something like 10 rows of coach in the far back. Other Carriers have done that.

How does that impact weight and balance?
 
EADSYABSOB73857
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:30 am

Some key takeaways from this...

-Congratulations to jetBlue... this has been a highly anticipated announcement for the last 18-24 months.
-It seems as though London and Paris are guaranteed right out of the gate. DUB, MAN, BRU, AMS.. amongst others will follow- 13 LRs to be ordered, so additional destinations/frequencies to be announced are all but guaranteed.
-I think B6 is playing a bit of a poker game with their announcement, particularly in two key ways; 1) they have not officially announced a start date, frequency, aircraft or cabin configuration for these flights.... so anything is possible. 2) They emphasized London with their announcement, but their event cake alludes to the launch of Paris flights (given the Eiffel Tower was illustrated on the cake). So while it just seems like London is being launched, within 18 months who knows what else could be announced (I view this as part of their strategy as a way to throw off other carriers and anticipate additional route offerings before official launch). This gives B6 ability to work behind the scenes and throw some curve balls by potentially announcing additional destinations/frequencies at a fast clip as they work towards their ETOPs cert and await new aircraft deliveries.

Additionally... B6 will have immense flexibility to expand/shrink their TATL offering at any point in time. In terms of expansion- they will be ordering LRs, but theoretically they could bring in neos (non LR option) to expand their operations at any time... If Primera could run an A321neo on CDG-BOS, announce MAD/BRU/FRA/TXL-BOS utilizing 737-9 MAX (A321neoLR has significantly longer range) why can’t B6 go further with their LRs, and even bring in neos to facilitate expansion if the situation warrants? (Especially if the aircraft are premium heavy, which we would expect given the implementation of Mint class on the flights... In fact, I would argue that the range circle B6 drew on their map is not completely accurate, and they can in fact serve destinations further out with their LRs. On the flip side, if TATL proves to not be profitable, the aircraft can easily be redeployed. I will add however, that an aspect of the aircraft distance illustrated on the map may not in fact be indicative of actual aircraft max distance, but instead shows the furthest it could fly while being most profitable (which we refer to in finance as the efficient frontier).

I’m an aviation analyst on Wall Street for a major firm, and there are some significant aspects that differentiate jetBlue from a lot of other players in the industry: 1) their balance sheet; 2) their poise and pace at which they do things; 3) their relatively low prescriptive operational costs (this does not include costs associated with their delays, cancelations, etc as those factors are construed as non-planned); and perhaps most importantly 4) the large success of their Mint class and 4b) the cost impact that Mint has on other industry players. B6 is one of the most profitable airlines in the industry (based on margin and bottom line earnings) and while so many people are quick to criticize their slow pace of making announcements and business decisions, if we look at the opposite end of the spectrum (fast growth and hasty business decisions) we get- Primera, WOW, Norwegian... the list goes on. Now, I agree that jetBlue may not be the most efficiently managed company and drag their feet all too much and have missed big opportunities and opportune times. If there is an economic downtown in 2020 (which is projected by several analysts/Wall Street firms) this will have immense negative impact on B6’s ability to deliver on their expansion model, and inhibit their margin revenue.
 
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Dieuwer
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:35 am

I'm not waiting two years. I'm flying out TONIGHT to London in VS Upper Class. :D
 
EADSYABSOB73857
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:40 am

Revelation wrote:
Fex180 wrote:
Revelation wrote:
CEO Hayes is quoted by NYT as saying TATL Premium fares are "obscene" which suggests his idea of "low" might be lower than "obscene" but not LCC/ULCC class pricing.

what I meant was that no airline would use the keyword "low fares" to advertise an all-premium product. I could see maybe 60-80 Y seats on the new LR's

I too have a hard time seeing an all-Mint service.

It'll be interesting to see what it ends up looking like.


B6 will definitely not be running all Mint, because if they do, then they will be catering to only one particular type of clientele, and that does not align with their business model. Additionally, they would become mince meat in a recession as the purchase of business fares, as well as prices would plummet, and that would completely sink their TATL model. For an airline with a conservative approach, that would amount to excessive risk exposure beyond what they would be willing to accommodate.
 
jetwet1
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Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:01 am

Revelation wrote:
Cunard wrote:
By 2021 the whole terminal experience at STN will be greatly improved and the airport passenger figures are growing making it the third busiest London airport and the third busiest airport in the United Kingdom with the airport currently handling upto 27m a year with a planned capacity for 45m a year, plenty of slots, no competition on the transatlantic market, a modern and efficient airport with great connections and a direct if what rather slow train link to Liverpool Street Station right in the heart of the City of London.

Interesting post.

I quoted the NY Times that JB wants to offer Mint class service. Will those customers be OK with ending up at STN rather then LHR or LGW? Will they be the ones working on iteneraries connecting to FR's varied destinations? Or am I overplaying the Mint angle?

I guess in my own case I could see myself 'splurging' on BOS-STN Mint service then jumping on FR to some of those varied destinations, but I don't know if there are a lot of other people who would do this.


For some I am sure STN would be fine, connecting on to an FR flight, well, would they really notice the difference between an FR aircraft and BA, sure, until they sat in the BA aircraft and found that it is not a premium airline. I guess that is more of a slap at BA than a praising of FR. I used to use STN when Maxjet was flying, for me, STN is just a massive pain in the butt, it's the wrong side of London, however, that's me, do I think B6 would have any issue finding 16 people a day to fill the Mint cabin, not at all, there are people on here who seem to regard B6 as a small little airline that doesn't have a FF base, sorry folks, to the people looking at this as a move that will sink the airline, you are in for a surprise, great move by B6, though why they are announcing it now for service in 2021 is beyond me, way to far out to care about at this time.
 
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gatibosgru
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:13 am

I love how everyone set themselves up for disappointment by speculating what the news would be and then are surprised to feel underwhelmed.

Wish B6 the best of luck and I hope they prove all the "experts" here wrong.
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jetbluefan1
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:13 am

EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
Some key takeaways from this...

-Congratulations to jetBlue... this has been a highly anticipated announcement for the last 18-24 months.
-It seems as though London and Paris are guaranteed right out of the gate. DUB, MAN, BRU, AMS.. amongst others will follow- 13 LRs to be ordered, so additional destinations/frequencies to be announced are all but guaranteed.
-I think B6 is playing a bit of a poker game with their announcement, particularly in two key ways; 1) they have not officially announced a start date, frequency, aircraft or cabin configuration for these flights.... so anything is possible. 2) They emphasized London with their announcement, but their event cake alludes to the launch of Paris flights (given the Eiffel Tower was illustrated on the cake). So while it just seems like London is being launched, within 18 months who knows what else could be announced (I view this as part of their strategy as a way to throw off other carriers and anticipate additional route offerings before official launch). This gives B6 ability to work behind the scenes and throw some curve balls by potentially announcing additional destinations/frequencies at a fast clip as they work towards their ETOPs cert and await new aircraft deliveries.

Additionally... B6 will have immense flexibility to expand/shrink their TATL offering at any point in time. In terms of expansion- they will be ordering LRs, but theoretically they could bring in neos (non LR option) to expand their operations at any time... If Primera could run an A321neo on CDG-BOS, announce MAD/BRU/FRA/TXL-BOS utilizing 737-9 MAX (A321neoLR has significantly longer range) why can’t B6 go further with their LRs, and even bring in neos to facilitate expansion if the situation warrants? (Especially if the aircraft are premium heavy, which we would expect given the implementation of Mint class on the flights... In fact, I would argue that the range circle B6 drew on their map is not completely accurate, and they can in fact serve destinations further out with their LRs. On the flip side, if TATL proves to not be profitable, the aircraft can easily be redeployed. I will add however, that an aspect of the aircraft distance illustrated on the map may not in fact be indicative of actual aircraft max distance, but instead shows the furthest it could fly while being most profitable (which we refer to in finance as the efficient frontier).

I’m an aviation analyst on Wall Street for a major firm, and there are some significant aspects that differentiate jetBlue from a lot of other players in the industry: 1) their balance sheet; 2) their poise and pace at which they do things; 3) their relatively low prescriptive operational costs (this does not include costs associated with their delays, cancelations, etc as those factors are construed as non-planned); and perhaps most importantly 4) the large success of their Mint class and 4b) the cost impact that Mint has on other industry players. B6 is one of the most profitable airlines in the industry (based on margin and bottom line earnings) and while so many people are quick to criticize their slow pace of making announcements and business decisions, if we look at the opposite end of the spectrum (fast growth and hasty business decisions) we get- Primera, WOW, Norwegian... the list goes on. Now, I agree that jetBlue may not be the most efficiently managed company and drag their feet all too much and have missed big opportunities and opportune times. If there is an economic downtown in 2020 (which is projected by several analysts/Wall Street firms) this will have immense negative impact on B6’s ability to deliver on their expansion model, and inhibit their margin revenue.


Thanks for the logical analysis. I agree with everything you said. B6 gets criticized on here for its very slow decision making, which sometimes results in missed opportunities, but they are still around and have lived to see VX, Primera, WOW, Independence Air etc to be born and to die. Not to mention their ability to fend off Song, Ted.

Frankly, this announcement is very in line with B6’s nature. It confuses the heck out of competitors since it has some info but not anything specific other than “London”, a Mint 2.0 which will have more than 16 seats and feel like being on a “private plane” (I assume will be all-aisle access, but the aircraft will notbe all-Mint), and confirmation of conversion of 321neo’s to LR. Service will launch sometime in 2021, multiple times a day, from BOS and JFK.

Was DL’s announcement last week - which was also vague - all for naught?

A few things that are for sure: this announcement separates B6 from WN, and especially NK and F9. Given their incredibly loyal following in NY and Boston, this is only a natural evolution and people will be very, very excited to try this out. And yes, it’s way overdue.
 
jetwet1
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:31 am

jetbluefan1 wrote:

Frankly, this announcement is very in line with B6’s nature. It confuses the heck out of competitors since it has some info but not anything specific other than “London”, a Mint 2.0 which will have more than 16 seats and feel like being on a “private plane” (I assume will be all-aisle access, but the aircraft will notbe all-Mint), and confirmation of conversion of 321neo’s to LR. Service will launch sometime in 2021, multiple times a day, from BOS and JFK.


As you can see from my post above, I am confident B6 will do well on these routes, but, let's be clear, this is not going to be a B6 love fest, the competition they will face on these routes will be like nothing they have seen before, the US majors, BA and VS will match their prices AND offer other incentives to keep their premium passengers on their jets rather than B6's.

I will say this again though, I think B6 can find enough people to fill the cabin each day, heck even the wife asked if these flights have an easy US west coast connection (meaning west coast-JFK/BOS-LON)....which with the times that have been posted here it looks like it is possible, so who knows, if the price is right, at least for some B6 fanatics (like my wife) a one stop is actually a viable alternative to a non stop.
 
VS11
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:32 am

Waterbomber2 wrote:
They may succeed in London and Paris with multiple daily frequencies, but I would forget about the other European cities.


Well, let's not forget that A321 is about 3 times lighter than A330/B787 so it is much cheaper to operate and easier to fill.
 
YYZORD
Posts: 292
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:26 pm

Re: Jetblue “Save the Date” All Hands - April 10

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:42 am

B6 already flies to FLL and LAX out of BUF which is good atm from YYZ but I totally get your pain. I hate flying AC so I fly out of BUF a lot to get WN and B6 service easily from Toronto. However, it would be nice for either airlines to expand to Canada too.

LMFNINJA wrote:
x1234 wrote:
I find it interesting that JetBlue will fly to London before Toronto, Montreal or Vancouver. I heard JetBlue says airport fees in Canada are too high yet they will fly to London where they are even higher!? I pray for a Canadian expansion after this announcement!


I would like them to fly to YYZ but I have a feeling that if they do the only service will be to BOS and JFK.

I would definitely fly them if they went to LAS, LAX or FLL from YYZ but I doubt that they can compete with AC who rules these markets.
 
airplaneboy
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Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 11:59 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:47 am

cledaybuck wrote:
This feels a lot like WN’s announcement of their intentions to serve Hawaii a couple of years ago.


WN announced plans to serve Hawai’i in October of 2017. Their ETOPS certification was delayed due to the government shutdown, and they commenced flights in March 2019. That’s 17 months... which is still about the average length for ETOPS certification despite the government delays.
 
Ziyulu
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Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:35 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 1:51 am

Very surprising to see so many people talking about Helijet. I would love to fly a helicopter across the Atlantic Ocean.
 
Boof02671
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:14 am

ctrabs0114 wrote:
SWADawg wrote:
Gulfstream500 wrote:
Kind of a letdown that it won’t be until 2021... that’s almost two years from now. In that much time, NK could by flying to Hawaii...

WN could technically preempt B6 and fly BOS/PVD-LON as well, not that I think they will, but having ETOPS Authorization gives them the ability.


Isn't ETOPS for TPAC service different from ETOPS for TATL service? Because I don't think that's how it works...

Unless you were being highly sarcastic, which I doubt, since you didn't call for B6 to merge with WN/AS/NK/whomever we've decided on this week.

ETOPS is ETOPS, just depends on the duration they choose.

ETOPS-75
ETOPS-90
ETOPS-120/138
ETOPS-180/207
ETOPS-240
ETOPS-270
ETOPS-330
ETOPS-370
 
EADSYABSOB73857
Posts: 19
Joined: Mon Apr 08, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:27 am

VS11 wrote:
I am disappointed for the lack of details. Like everyone else, I was expecting actual schedules announced with airports, intro fares, etc. I guess we are going to have to speculate for at least another year. Nevertheless, I think we should recognize that it is a big deal for jetBlue to launch all of these services. It definitely sets them apart from Southwest, Frontier, Spirit, Alaska, etc. I agree with other posters that they could be serving more than one London airport even though I personally don't think that getting LHR slots is going to be a problem for them.


Coming out and announcing vague details is actually the best thing that B6 could have done... very strategic, especially given there is 18 months to launch. No one knows (aside from LON) where they are going to fly and what the aircraft configuration is going to be. And let’s get this out there now, since I have not seen this discussed in large scale... B6 launching this service on Mint equipped aircraft is going to destroy profits for major air carriers. Before this announcement, we’ve seen airlines make recent updates to service (BA/AA increasing premium heavy aircraft to the US, UA announcing an initiative to increase premium seats on short-haul and LONG-HAUL flights, DL announce more premium heavy LHR flights and additional flights to London for 2020, etc)... Now that B6 have announced their ambition to launch TATL flights for 2020/2021 the best thing they can do is maintain their elusiveness about their additional offerings. Of course, once it makes sense from a business standpoint, announce the new destinations/additional flights.
 
DDR
Posts: 1591
Joined: Sat Sep 28, 2013 11:09 pm

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:30 am

gatibosgru wrote:
I love how everyone set themselves up for disappointment by speculating what the news would be and then are surprised to feel underwhelmed.

Wish B6 the best of luck and I hope they prove all the "experts" here wrong.


Totally agree with you. I think this is very exciting news for those who could not afford business class previously.
 
spacecadet
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:36 am

jetwet1 wrote:
As you can see from my post above, I am confident B6 will do well on these routes, but, let's be clear, this is not going to be a B6 love fest, the competition they will face on these routes will be like nothing they have seen before, the US majors, BA and VS will match their prices AND offer other incentives to keep their premium passengers on their jets rather than B6's.


The legacies will absolutely not match JetBlue's Mint prices, or come close to doing so. You can bank on that. I will eat my hat, film it and post the video here if they do.

They will try other promotions, but they will not *be able* to match Mint prices, much less want to. They would consider it devaluing their product. Instead they will talk up all the ways their premium classes are better than JetBlue's, but that's going to be a stretch.

Digressing, a few people are speculating about these being all-Mint planes - that's not happening. It's a larger Mint cabin than on transcon routes but it sounds like at least half the plane is still Y. The Y cabin is getting an upgrade for TATL service, though what that exactly means I haven't seen specified.
I'm tired of being a wanna-be league bowler. I wanna be a league bowler!
 
B595
Posts: 199
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:51 am

I’m a B6 fan, personally, but I think the best thing about today’s announcement is that unofficial yet amazing cake :birthday: that someone posted up thread. Talk about stealing the show....
 
flyby519
Posts: 1413
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 3:31 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 3:21 am

winginit wrote:
Revelation wrote:
Or the competitors will start flying A321neoLR as well, and perhaps NMA/A322/etc some day as well.


This is, I think, a very important hypothetical that could easily become reality in the near term. Delta, just as an example, has 100 321neos on order that will start being delivered in 2020. This advance notice from B6 gives DL ample time to have a think on how they can respond competitively, and I think such a response includes the possibility of LRs being used across the Atlantic. DL has the ability to now pre-empt B6 at every step of their TATL endeavor.


I can't see AA/BA, DL/VS using 321LRs on their premium LON routes, why would this make sense?
 
Boof02671
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Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:10 am

First of all neither AA, BA, DL nor VS have the A321LR, and it won’t be able to carry the cargo a widebody does.
 
wnflyguy
Posts: 1670
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:58 pm

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:31 am

Congratulations to JetBlue for thinking big and making the leap toward Europe.
This will stir up the Big boys into a frenzy.
Give everyone 18 months to counter act with a similar product.
Or Might cause a Bigger fish Like AA to try and swallow up B6 and gain back stronger hold in the north east.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
Posts: 7267
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 11:45 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 4:35 am

There is room for all to co-exist in the market.

The way I see it is that B6 isn't going to be adding enough seats to to materially change the market.
Instead they will be offering a product at a a price point that doesn't really exist today.
Both in Y and Mint.

The close-in/last-minute F/J tickets from large professional service firms / financial houses / I-Bank / consultancies are all still likely to flow to the legacies.

B6 is likely going to attract and fill up with the customers that are looking for a better product, that book in advance, and looking for an upgraded experience at a reasonable price point. Basically up-sell but not at sky-high legacies fares.
 
strfyr51
Posts: 3820
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:04 pm

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:04 am

IF JBLU can get slots at LHR or LGW then they should. Only of it's just a Pair of slots at LHR or LGW. If they have to go to STN? Then, that's what they'll have to do until they can do Better. but they can't do "chicken little" to stay out of the way of the other Majors. They'll have to go in like they belong there.
 
strfyr51
Posts: 3820
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:04 pm

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:09 am

spacecadet wrote:
Dieuwer wrote:
I am completely underwhelmed by this announcement: 18 months from now is October 2020. Spring/summer 2021 is TWO YEARS from now!
A lot can happen in two years. The economy could have a complete melt down and JetBlue might go down with it.


I have no idea what your frame of reference is, but two years is nothing.

The economy having a meltdown would affect *every* company in *every* industry. Companies can't just throw up their hands and say "welp, may as well not plan anything because someday the economy's gonna tank."

People here still have this weird idea that JetBlue is somehow special and will be singled out by any economic downturn. JetBlue is no different than any other airline in that regard, and they're no less able to weather it if that were to happen. Companies have plans in place for that too.

they cannot succumb to defeatist ideas or thinking! JBLU has every tight to serve London. It they're going to step up and take their shot? Then Have at it!!
 
mutu
Posts: 484
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:04 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 5:56 am

I wish them well and hope they succeed. I am sure they have done their homework on yields and costs.
The core corporate contract business wont move as it already gets good deals for volume from the main players and offers huge flexibility in frequencies and open jaw routing options. The premium leisure market may be tempted but typically that market buys in the 3x annual fare sale window where LHR/JFK can be bought for £1300 to £1700 which isnt a bad deal arguably. But the small business market flying premium economy might be tempted to Mint for a more.modest fare whatever the choice of London Gateway. And there is a market year round for a couple of frequencies with a Mint 321LR.
And of course I don't suppose B6 are after cramming in economy pax so any sensible price point will get following.
I just question the very early heads up which does give others time to focus their new fleet/hard productroll out towards B6 planned routing to really up the pressure.
Mind you it could be argued BA are trying to diminish somewhat the connecting traffic on key hub to hubs especially JFK by opening up secondary routes to reduce that traffic as slots are short both ends if LHR JFK. This may end up encouraging them to open more secondaries and drop a frequency on the trunk route with little impact on them financially.

So I don't see a bloodbath necessarily just another market adjustment and consumers benefitting.

B6 now need to do work on getting their costs right for this expansion
 
UAL777UK
Posts: 2337
Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:16 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 7:19 am

So looking at this. A couple of years out.

Gives them the time to get slots at LHR or perhaps LGW. I don't see them going anywhere else. If they get the former then UA ponies up, buys B6. Hey Presto. UA are back in the game at JFK. Easy :stirthepot:

I wish B6 all the best. This could get interesting
 
Bricktop
Posts: 1375
Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:04 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 7:24 am

gatibosgru wrote:
I love how everyone set themselves up for disappointment by speculating what the news would be and then are surprised to feel underwhelmed.

Wish B6 the best of luck and I hope they prove all the "experts" here wrong.

Yeah it’s typical for here.but it’s nothing like the buildup to an iPhone release. The Apple fanboys are nuts in comparison. Underwhelming is the hype for adding WiFi we went through with Spirit a while back.

One other thing is that it adds a great aspirational route to the FF program, as HI does for WN. That strengthens domestic loyalty too.
 
Andy33
Posts: 2427
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:30 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 7:36 am

santi319 wrote:

Is LGW slot restricted?

Sure is. Slots are traded, just like at LHR.
 
pabloeing
Posts: 579
Joined: Wed Dec 10, 2014 3:00 pm

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 7:45 am

¿Difference between BOS-LAX and BOS-LHR in time or plane configuration?= ZERO........is a simple movement to flight to europe for B6
 
Andy33
Posts: 2427
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2009 9:30 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 8:01 am

Bobloblaw wrote:
So they’re suppose to sit on slots for two years?


All depends what you mean by slot-sitting. Both LHR and LGW have an 80% use-it-or-lose-it rule. If the slots are not used on 80% of all possible dates, they are confiscated without compensation.
There are separate sets of slots for IATA summer and winter seasons, and slots are time specific but not destination specific (except a handful awarded as competition remedies on individual routes as a result of takeovers or JV formation).
There are several ways airlines avoid confiscation happening - one is to lease out slots to another airline which does operate them as part of their normal service pattern (and hopes to obtain slots of their own before the lease period expires), the second is to yourself lease slots from another airline only starting from the date you want to commence service. These are the only two that are really open to JetBlue. The others are to actually operate flights using your owned slots, usually flights that cost the minimum to operate or roughly break-even; or to juggle the schedule round so that individual flights are only planned to operate on 80% of dates they could, but the holes in the schedule are filled by using slots that are fairly close in time, on the dates the original slots aren't used.

Suggestions by other posters that legal action might result in slots being removed from from airlines and handed to Jet Blue are ignoring the fact that the current arrangements are the result of competition authority investigations and consequential slot adjustments, most recently into the BA/AA JV, and the IAG takeovers of BMI and Aer Lingus. Some of these have already been challenged in court and upheld - Richard Branson was always hopeful of picking up extra slots this way.
 
TC957
Posts: 3449
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:12 pm

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 8:20 am

Fascinating news and predicted for some time this would happen.
But a few words of caution to JetBlue.
1...Announcing their plans so far ahead will give the competition, and there's plenty of that, a chance to react with sales and marketing strategies.
2...STN has a long history of failed TATL services.
3...Will the UK business traveller take to flying TATL on a narrow-bodied A321?
4...Will winter winds mean regular fuel-stops ?
 
RDUDDJI
Posts: 2082
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 4:42 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:58 am

From USAToday:
JetBlue President and Chief Operating Officer Joanna Geraghty said in a statement. “London is the largest metro area JetBlue doesn’t yet serve from both Boston and New York, and we could not be more thrilled to be changing that in the years ahead.


COO apparently isn’t good at geography...
Sometimes we don't realize the good times when we're in them
 
User avatar
Dieuwer
Posts: 1343
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Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:03 am

strfyr51 wrote:
spacecadet wrote:
Dieuwer wrote:
I am completely underwhelmed by this announcement: 18 months from now is October 2020. Spring/summer 2021 is TWO YEARS from now!
A lot can happen in two years. The economy could have a complete melt down and JetBlue might go down with it.


I have no idea what your frame of reference is, but two years is nothing.

The economy having a meltdown would affect *every* company in *every* industry. Companies can't just throw up their hands and say "welp, may as well not plan anything because someday the economy's gonna tank."

People here still have this weird idea that JetBlue is somehow special and will be singled out by any economic downturn. JetBlue is no different than any other airline in that regard, and they're no less able to weather it if that were to happen. Companies have plans in place for that too.

they cannot succumb to defeatist ideas or thinking! JBLU has every tight to serve London. It they're going to step up and take their shot? Then Have at it!!


Sure, JetBlue has all the right to announce whatever they want. Hell, they could announce 2029 Paris service ! Why not right? Ten years in advance! But doing so clearly leaves many people wondering if the top at JetBlue has mental issues.
 
mutu
Posts: 484
Joined: Tue Mar 21, 2006 7:04 am

Re: Confirmed: Jetblue Announces Flights to London from JFK and BOS from 2021

Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:07 pm

Some chatter in the financial district in London - MIGHT (might not) be LCY with A220s which would not require Shannon fuel stop. But I don't know whether that would still require an all J configuration? And going head to head with BA (who I am sure could blag a couple of A220s if they were up for a fight) with so many BA corporates on the LCY doorstep might be a bad idea!

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