UpNAWAy
Posts: 526
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2016 12:42 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:50 am

No they have not.
 
kbmiflyer
Posts: 262
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2004 11:47 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:58 am

MAH4546 wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
They have yet to remove a single seat IFE yet we have all these made up accounts of people refusing to fly AA for that reason?


738s have already begun to have IFE removed.


Some of the AA 738's with drop down IFE screens have been converted to Oasis, starting with those delivered after 2009. None of the 738's with seatback IFE have been converted, at least not to my knowledge.
 
JFKMan
Posts: 506
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:46 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:00 am

MAH4546 wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
They have yet to remove a single seat IFE yet we have all these made up accounts of people refusing to fly AA for that reason?


738s have already begun to have IFE removed.


Not true. No 738 with seatback IFE has been retrofitted yet. The older 738s that never had personal IFE are being retrofitted first.
NYC
 
rbavfan
Posts: 3243
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:53 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:06 am

compensateme wrote:
WeatherPilot wrote:
30 inch seat pitch? Might as well save a few bucks and fly Allegiant.


For the whopping 0.1% of potential AA consumers G6’s flights are applicable to...


Do you mean G4.
 
ABEguy
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:02 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:07 am

When it come to IFE , am I the only one that hasn’t owned a pair of headphones that can be plugged into something for several years now? The disposable head phone you’re going to get on a plane are totally useless from sound quality perspective. I haven’t used JetBlue’s IFE last couple time on them for that reason. Might be an unpopular opinion, but I’d rather stream on my phone or tablet, as long as I can charge and have a holder. Just me though.
 
JFKMan
Posts: 506
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:46 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:17 am

ABEguy wrote:
When it come to IFE , am I the only one that hasn’t owned a pair of headphones that can be plugged into something for several years now? The disposable head phone you’re going to get on a plane are totally useless from sound quality perspective. I haven’t used JetBlue’s IFE last couple time on them for that reason. Might be an unpopular opinion, but I’d rather stream on my phone or tablet, as long as I can charge and have a holder. Just me though.


Even when I do use the seatback IFE, Its only to put on the moving map. Then I watch my own stuff on my tablet.

Personally, I'm looking forward to more planes having the handy tablet holder the MAX has. Its so convenient to not have my tablet taking up half my tray table.
NYC
 
FSDan
Posts: 2619
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:34 am

ABEguy wrote:
Antarius wrote:
ABEguy wrote:

I’m sorry I’m not trying to be rude here but this is a perfect example of the kool aid I’m talking about. Dal 2018 total revenue was just under 44B, while AA did 44.5B. You must be talking about profit. Yes AA needs to improve their reliability and operation over all. I’d guess the discrepancy in profit between dal and AA can be attributed to waste by not running a efficient, on time, reliable airline. But the stuff with the seats is non sense sorry. Btw did anyone notice United’s new Max’s? No ptvs.


Yes, I'm talking about Profit. Revenue is meaningless as a standalone metric - AA is bigger , revenue should be higher. The fact that it's so close despite the size difference further reinforces my point.

Whether it comes down to seats or not is your speculation.

FTR, I do 100 -150k a year on American and very rarely fly DL. So I'm not trying to prop DL up for fun. I just do recognize that they are doing a better job, and the numbers back it up. AA needs to do something else, other than just be a poor mans imitation of DL.



892 mainline jets at dal and 952 at AA. Not that huge of a difference. As a frequent flyer you must notice that you’re flying on new airplane with AA? How about the admirals clubs all over the system? Terminal updates? That’s 25B dollars of investment by AA in the last 5 years. Again I see your point with the operation, but when people get on here and complain about AA coach seats, then say “deltas got the right idea”, it’s non sense. Btw delta MD jets are so cheap to operate for them that’s it’s a hell of a profit maker. AA decided to go a different route and retire theirs. That probably cost them in the short term.


Sounds like you're not particularly up to date on DL... DL's MD-88s will be retired within a 1-2 years of AA's MD-80s. And they're currently only really used on flights of 2 hours or less from ATL anyway. Meanwhile, DL is in the process of adding hundreds of new narrowbodies to their fleet (A220, 739, 321, 321neo), not to mention that most of their older aircraft (319/320s, 757s) have been refurbished in the last few years.

Terminal updates? DL's got major active projects at SEA, LAX, SLC, and LGA, recently completed a significant addition/upgrade at JFK T4, and has done interior upgrades at MSP and ATL (some of which are ongoing).
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
FSDan
Posts: 2619
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:40 am

JFKMan wrote:
MAH4546 wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
They have yet to remove a single seat IFE yet we have all these made up accounts of people refusing to fly AA for that reason?


738s have already begun to have IFE removed.


Not true. No 738 with seatback IFE has been retrofitted yet. The older 738s that never had personal IFE are being retrofitted first.


I don't see where MAH4546 said anything wrong... AA has, in fact, started removing IFE from 738s. And they have been taking deliveries of new aircraft that I believe at one point were planned to have AVOD, and now don't.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
ABEguy
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:02 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:52 am

FSDan wrote:
ABEguy wrote:
Antarius wrote:

Yes, I'm talking about Profit. Revenue is meaningless as a standalone metric - AA is bigger , revenue should be higher. The fact that it's so close despite the size difference further reinforces my point.

Whether it comes down to seats or not is your speculation.

FTR, I do 100 -150k a year on American and very rarely fly DL. So I'm not trying to prop DL up for fun. I just do recognize that they are doing a better job, and the numbers back it up. AA needs to do something else, other than just be a poor mans imitation of DL.



892 mainline jets at dal and 952 at AA. Not that huge of a difference. As a frequent flyer you must notice that you’re flying on new airplane with AA? How about the admirals clubs all over the system? Terminal updates? That’s 25B dollars of investment by AA in the last 5 years. Again I see your point with the operation, but when people get on here and complain about AA coach seats, then say “deltas got the right idea”, it’s non sense. Btw delta MD jets are so cheap to operate for them that’s it’s a hell of a profit maker. AA decided to go a different route and retire theirs. That probably cost them in the short term.


Sounds like you're not particularly up to date on DL... DL's MD-88s will be retired within a 1-2 years of AA's MD-80s. And they're currently only really used on flights of 2 hours or less from ATL anyway. Meanwhile, DL is in the process of adding hundreds of new narrowbodies to their fleet (A220, 739, 321, 321neo), not to mention that most of their older aircraft (319/320s, 757s) have been refurbished in the last few years.

Terminal updates? DL's got major active projects at SEA, LAX, SLC, and LGA, recently completed a significant addition/upgrade at JFK T4, and has done interior upgrades at MSP and ATL (some of which are ongoing).


Over 120 md88/90 still at delta. Over 170 b757/763, and refurbished or not, they’re going to need replaced soon. That’s going to require some serious investment. Not sure why you felt the need to point out all the terminals deltas renovating. Did you assume that because I said AA is doing it that it meant delta wasn’t? That was a statement meant for another poster that claims that deltas hard product is somehow superior to AAs, Things like seats and amenities.
 
ctrabs0114
Posts: 926
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:09 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:10 am

MAH4546 wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
They have yet to remove a single seat IFE yet we have all these made up accounts of people refusing to fly AA for that reason?


738s have already begun to have IFE removed.


I don't know how many 738s have already been through the Oasis "downgrade" scheme, but I know I was on one of them this afternoon (as noted earlier in the thread). And, to be honest, I knew the MD83s lacked IFE, but even knowing that, I chose to fly on an AA Mad Dog on DFW-SAT last Friday because of nostalgic reasons (I'm relatively new to air-fanning and I'd never flown any variation of the DC-9, so that was a factor).

To be honest, as someone who regularly flies WN, I'm used to using my tablet as opposed to having an IFE at my disposal. But, to me, even the Main Cabin Extra seats felt a little cramped to me.
2019: DAL, MCI, PHX, LAS, DFW, SAT, ORD, SLC, SEA, DTW, PHL, MIA, LAX; B73G (WN x3), B738 (WN, AA, DL), A20N (NK), MD83 (AA), B788 (AA x2), CS1 (DL), B739 (DL), B712 (DL), B752 (AA), B763 (AA), B77W (AA), B789 (AA)
Next: TBA
 
EChid
Posts: 546
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:00 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:42 am

ABEguy wrote:
Over 120 md88/90 still at delta. Over 170 b757/763, and refurbished or not, they’re going to need replaced soon. That’s going to require some serious investment. Not sure why you felt the need to point out all the terminals deltas renovating. Did you assume that because I said AA is doing it that it meant delta wasn’t? That was a statement meant for another poster that claims that deltas hard product is somehow superior to AAs, Things like seats and amenities.

I'm not sure what your point about their fleet is. Are you claiming they aren't handling their fleet planning or something? All of DL's recent fleet introductions have included more interior features and improvements, not less. Whether it's sliding doors in J or IFE in little planes, it's all been good. DL is receiving A321ceos and has neos on order to replace the 757s, the 339s are replacing some of their older 767s with room left to see if Boeing and/or AB whips up something appealing in the next few years. The replacements are en route and the resulting costs are in no way similar to AA's currently rather worrying debtload.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
FSDan
Posts: 2619
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:56 am

ABEguy wrote:
FSDan wrote:
ABEguy wrote:


892 mainline jets at dal and 952 at AA. Not that huge of a difference. As a frequent flyer you must notice that you’re flying on new airplane with AA? How about the admirals clubs all over the system? Terminal updates? That’s 25B dollars of investment by AA in the last 5 years. Again I see your point with the operation, but when people get on here and complain about AA coach seats, then say “deltas got the right idea”, it’s non sense. Btw delta MD jets are so cheap to operate for them that’s it’s a hell of a profit maker. AA decided to go a different route and retire theirs. That probably cost them in the short term.


Sounds like you're not particularly up to date on DL... DL's MD-88s will be retired within a 1-2 years of AA's MD-80s. And they're currently only really used on flights of 2 hours or less from ATL anyway. Meanwhile, DL is in the process of adding hundreds of new narrowbodies to their fleet (A220, 739, 321, 321neo), not to mention that most of their older aircraft (319/320s, 757s) have been refurbished in the last few years.

Terminal updates? DL's got major active projects at SEA, LAX, SLC, and LGA, recently completed a significant addition/upgrade at JFK T4, and has done interior upgrades at MSP and ATL (some of which are ongoing).


Over 120 md88/90 still at delta. Over 170 b757/763, and refurbished or not, they’re going to need replaced soon. That’s going to require some serious investment.


I was pointing out that AA didn't "go a different route" by retiring their MD-80s. Sure, DL did wait a few extra years to start retiring theirs while fuel prices were low, but they are following the same strategy and will be done not all that long after AA (IIRC, the M88s will be gone by the end of next year).

ABEguy wrote:
Not sure why you felt the need to point out all the terminals deltas renovating. Did you assume that because I said AA is doing it that it meant delta wasn’t? That was a statement meant for another poster that claims that deltas hard product is somehow superior to AAs, Things like seats and amenities.


Apologies, I think I did read your post the wrong way. Seems like you were actually pointing to some of AA's recent investments as having reduced their profits vs DL in the short term? I saw the initial comparison between DL and AA fleet numbers in your post and interpreted the following questions as comparisons as well. Sorry if that wasn't actually what you were intending.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
Ishrion
Topic Author
Posts: 1182
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:08 am

You can see here how many 737-800s have been retrofitted with Oasis: https://sites.google.com/site/newamericanfleet/home (Sometimes it may be a bit inaccurate and could take a couple days to fully update)

At the moment, 22.7% have been completed.
 
Yonderlust
Posts: 42
Joined: Sat Jun 02, 2018 8:32 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:36 am

Antarius wrote:
ABEguy wrote:
Antarius wrote:

The revenue number do not lie. DL is beating the shit out of AA. So AA can either 1. Double down on the strategy that seems to allow DL to beat the shit out of them 2. Try something else.

#2 seems like a decent idea. As an EXP for many years, AA is operationally a disaster. It's getting to the point that I may need to switch as it's starting to affect the reason I have to travel. Couple this operational cluster with Oasis, and you have a winning strategy to chase people away.


I’m sorry I’m not trying to be rude here but this is a perfect example of the kool aid I’m talking about. Dal 2018 total revenue was just under 44B, while AA did 44.5B. You must be talking about profit. Yes AA needs to improve their reliability and operation over all. I’d guess the discrepancy in profit between dal and AA can be attributed to waste by not running a efficient, on time, reliable airline. But the stuff with the seats is non sense sorry. Btw did anyone notice United’s new Max’s? No ptvs.


Yes, I'm talking about Profit. Revenue is meaningless as a standalone metric - AA is bigger , revenue should be higher. The fact that it's so close despite the size difference further reinforces my point.

Whether it comes down to seats or not is your speculation.

FTR, I do 100 -150k a year on American and very rarely fly DL. So I'm not trying to prop DL up for fun. I just do recognize that they are doing a better job, and the numbers back it up. AA needs to do something else, other than just be a poor mans imitation of DL.


Respectfully, as an accountant revenue is rarely meaningless as a stand-alone metric. It is very useful and many times a significant factor in company valuations. But, to be fair, I understand your point. Net profit/income (NI) is less a straight line than many people realize as there are some significant non-cash entries such as depreciation, amortization, bad debt, etc that determine net income. Buying new planes and taking first year bonus depreciation can have a huge effect on NI. I believe DAL has not been on a spending spree like AA and using older aircraft so depreciation is typically double-declining...meaning it lessens each year. I much prefer gross profit for such analysis...income less direct cost of sales (fuel, labor, catering and airport fees)...basically ignore the variable expenses which can wildly skew any picture. But, one caveat is that variable expenses are where I see my clients lose their shirt because they get punch drunk when cash flow is good.
 
questions
Posts: 2024
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 4:51 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:11 am

ctrabs0114 wrote:
But, to me, even the Main Cabin Extra seats felt a little cramped to me.


Main Cabin Extra pitch is 33”.

“More room throughout coach” pitch was 34”.

AA has downgraded its product and service offerings across all classes of service. That drunk Doug Parker has ruined the brand.
 
ctrabs0114
Posts: 926
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:09 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 11:41 am

questions wrote:
ctrabs0114 wrote:
But, to me, even the Main Cabin Extra seats felt a little cramped to me.


Main Cabin Extra pitch is 33”.

“More room throughout coach” pitch was 34”.

AA has downgraded its product and service offerings across all classes of service. That drunk Doug Parker has ruined the brand.


Honestly, Main Cabin Extra on an AA 738 wasn't that much different than the standard seats on WN's 3M8, at least from my perspective. MCE on the MD83 didn't feel as bad to me as it did on the Oasis 738s. Then again, this weekend was my first experience with AA, so maybe it was just "culture shock" after pretty much flying WN all the time (just wanted to try something different).
2019: DAL, MCI, PHX, LAS, DFW, SAT, ORD, SLC, SEA, DTW, PHL, MIA, LAX; B73G (WN x3), B738 (WN, AA, DL), A20N (NK), MD83 (AA), B788 (AA x2), CS1 (DL), B739 (DL), B712 (DL), B752 (AA), B763 (AA), B77W (AA), B789 (AA)
Next: TBA
 
DFW17L
Posts: 164
Joined: Fri Nov 20, 2015 2:53 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 2:31 pm

I've flown MCE and Y on OASIS 738s. I'm 6'1" and find the slimline seats comfortable, even on four hour flights, with plenty of room in MCE and sufficient (not cramped) in 30" Y. The streaming media works great and don't miss IFE at all. When I do fly on equipment with IFE, it feels like a casino (without the smoke). I do appreciate the slightly roomier A32x products that AA uses - and I'm an ex-Boeing guy.
 
EMB170
Posts: 328
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2007 1:16 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:05 pm

To answer an earlier poster's question, UA only has seatback IFE on a small (and shrinking) portion of their narrowbody fleet. The sCO 757s all have it as do a big chunk of their 73G/738/739s. Deliveries after a certain point, however, do not have the seatback IFE (just the streaming) and all of the MAX deliveries have it as well.

DL, on the other hand, has adopted seatback IFE almost fleetwide (and IMHO is a great decision). 737 fleet, 757 fleet, A319/A320/A321 fleet, and A220 fleet all have it. The only aircraft that don't have seatback IFE are the McDonnell Douglas jets (MD88, MD90, MD95/717), and they all feature streaming (as do the CRJ900s). Given sometimes the issues I've had getting the GoGo player to work properly on my laptop, I'll take the seatback screen any day.
IND ORD ATL MCO PIT EWR BUF CVG DEN RNO JFK DTW BOS BDL BWI IAD RDU CLT MYR CHS TPA CID MSP STL MSY DFW IAH AUS SLC LAS
 
flyboy80
Posts: 2022
Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2001 8:10 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 3:06 pm

I personally do not need seat back screens on a domestic flight. I'd rather they Invest in better internet and streaming entertainment IFE options, save the PTV installation and upkeep money and weight, maybe take a row of seats out making the plane more comfortable. Everyone has a cell phone, lap top, or ipad. The IFE screens flickering in the night and reflecting off the sidewalls are not pleasant. Obviously different travelers have different priorities.
 
bpat777
Posts: 669
Joined: Sun Nov 28, 1999 8:21 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:35 pm

What annoys me about when I travel on AA, UA or AS is that I've found that many times the outlets don't work. Same goes for WN since they don't offer outlets at all. So I have to choose to either do without IFE or deal with a drained battery when I arrive.
 
BoeingGuy
Posts: 6314
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2010 6:01 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 4:46 pm

questions wrote:
ctrabs0114 wrote:
But, to me, even the Main Cabin Extra seats felt a little cramped to me.


Main Cabin Extra pitch is 33”.

“More room throughout coach” pitch was 34”.

AA has downgraded its product and service offerings across all classes of service. That drunk Doug Parker has ruined the brand.


Yep, what's the incentive to pay extra for MCE when the seat pitch is a ridiculous 33". I did pony up for MCE on an upcoming 4 segment trip all on 738s and selected the Exit Row and Bulkhead Row Seats. Those have decent additional leg room. Otherwise, if all you are going to get is 33" why bother to pay extra?

37" seat pitch for First Class? Really?

Premium Economy on AS is 35-36" seat pitch.

I agree that short term thinking is hurting AA's reputation. It's just a continual cheapening of the product.
 
Detroit313
Posts: 253
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:56 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:00 pm

This thread is fake news. Someone on Twitter wrote it with no evidence.
 
ABEguy
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:02 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:08 pm

EChid wrote:
ABEguy wrote:
Over 120 md88/90 still at delta. Over 170 b757/763, and refurbished or not, they’re going to need replaced soon. That’s going to require some serious investment. Not sure why you felt the need to point out all the terminals deltas renovating. Did you assume that because I said AA is doing it that it meant delta wasn’t? That was a statement meant for another poster that claims that deltas hard product is somehow superior to AAs, Things like seats and amenities.

I'm not sure what your point about their fleet is. Are you claiming they aren't handling their fleet planning or something? All of DL's recent fleet introductions have included more interior features and improvements, not less. Whether it's sliding doors in J or IFE in little planes, it's all been good. DL is receiving A321ceos and has neos on order to replace the 757s, the 339s are replacing some of their older 767s with room left to see if Boeing and/or AB whips up something appealing in the next few years. The replacements are en route and the resulting costs are in no way similar to AA's currently rather worrying debtload.


That’s not what I’m saying at all. My point is that dal is in a much earlier phase of fleet replacement than AA. As a result they’re still currently operating some very old and cheap to own aircraft. That’s good for their bottom line and profit margins. However, they’ll soon be taking on new and expensive to own aircraft, so we’ll see how that affects their margins when compared to AA. Although delta is trying to refleet on the cheap, which is smart. If I’m not mistaking, their c-series purchase even caused a small trade dispute with Canada.

AA current management may not have been so quick to take on all that debt either, but remember they needed to massage the shareholders to get them onboard with the US/AA merger. Major share holders in AA include Boeing, Airbus, and GE. If Doug and company started cancelling aircraft orders, their mega merger dreams may have been DOA.
 
JFKMan
Posts: 506
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:46 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:34 pm

FSDan wrote:
JFKMan wrote:
MAH4546 wrote:

738s have already begun to have IFE removed.


Not true. No 738 with seatback IFE has been retrofitted yet. The older 738s that never had personal IFE are being retrofitted first.


I don't see where MAH4546 said anything wrong... AA has, in fact, started removing IFE from 738s. And they have been taking deliveries of new aircraft that I believe at one point were planned to have AVOD, and now don't.



AA's final 738 orders all arrived with AVOD/in seat IFE. And no AVOD/IFE system has been removed from an existing aircraft in the fleet. Therefore, MAH4546 saying IFE's "have already begun" to be removed is incorrect.
NYC
 
MSPNWA
Posts: 3437
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 2:48 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:04 pm

BoeingGuy wrote:
37" seat pitch for First Class? Really?


37" is now industry standard. Most domestic F is 37"-38" now. AA was late to the game in reducing F pitch.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 25752
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:18 pm

JFKMan wrote:
FSDan wrote:
JFKMan wrote:

Not true. No 738 with seatback IFE has been retrofitted yet. The older 738s that never had personal IFE are being retrofitted first.


I don't see where MAH4546 said anything wrong... AA has, in fact, started removing IFE from 738s. And they have been taking deliveries of new aircraft that I believe at one point were planned to have AVOD, and now don't.



AA's final 738 orders all arrived with AVOD/in seat IFE. And no AVOD/IFE system has been removed from an existing aircraft in the fleet. Therefore, MAH4546 saying IFE's "have already begun" to be removed is incorrect.


738 reconfiguration and IFE removal began months ago.

https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea.co ... s-comfort/

They are a fourth of the way through. If you refer to the fact that maybe they are starting with older planes that don't have IFE, fair.

But regardless, AA's race to the bottom continues. Spirit is a more premium airline these days.
a.
 
EChid
Posts: 546
Joined: Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:00 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:06 pm

ABEguy wrote:
That’s not what I’m saying at all. My point is that dal is in a much earlier phase of fleet replacement than AA. As a result they’re still currently operating some very old and cheap to own aircraft. That’s good for their bottom line and profit margins. However, they’ll soon be taking on new and expensive to own aircraft, so we’ll see how that affects their margins when compared to AA. Although delta is trying to refleet on the cheap, which is smart. If I’m not mistaking, their c-series purchase even caused a small trade dispute with Canada.

AA current management may not have been so quick to take on all that debt either, but remember they needed to massage the shareholders to get them onboard with the US/AA merger. Major share holders in AA include Boeing, Airbus, and GE. If Doug and company started cancelling aircraft orders, their mega merger dreams may have been DOA.

I don't know how a fleet replacement process can be 'earlier', since it's not like DL and AA replace their entire fleet in one fell swoop every few years. Replacements are happening all the time, it's constant in fleets this large. They've ordered 60 widebodies since 2013, taken delivery of most of 130 739s in the last 5 years, are concluding the delivery of 112 A321ceos this year before starting the delivery of their 100 neos, and is starting to receive some of the 90 A220s they've ordered. So, 260+ new planes operating in their fleet right now. They have fleet replacements either in delivery or ordered now for their 757s, 717s, MDs, most of their 767s, and their 744 fleet. They aren't really at an early stage of their fleet replacement, nor are they really doing it 'on the cheap.' The C-Series caused a "trade war" because Boeing was trying to block a new entrant to the market, not because of the costs.
2018: DRW-PER-HKG-ICN-MEL-AVV-BNE-OOL-SYD-YYZ-YYZ-YUL-YVR-PDX-SEA-SFO-PEK-KIX-CDG-IST-NRT-HND-BKK-FAT; AC J-TK J-OZ F-DL F-TG J/F-NH J/F-CX J-VA J
 
JFKMan
Posts: 506
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:46 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:15 pm

MAH4546 wrote:
JFKMan wrote:
FSDan wrote:

I don't see where MAH4546 said anything wrong... AA has, in fact, started removing IFE from 738s. And they have been taking deliveries of new aircraft that I believe at one point were planned to have AVOD, and now don't.



AA's final 738 orders all arrived with AVOD/in seat IFE. And no AVOD/IFE system has been removed from an existing aircraft in the fleet. Therefore, MAH4546 saying IFE's "have already begun" to be removed is incorrect.


738 reconfiguration and IFE removal began months ago.

https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea.co ... s-comfort/

They are a fourth of the way through. If you refer to the fact that maybe they are starting with older planes that don't have IFE, fair.

But regardless, AA's race to the bottom continues. Spirit is a more premium airline these days.


Reconfiguration? Yes. Removal of existing AVOD/IFE? No.

Spirit is a more premium airline? Lololol ok well not going to waste my time with nonsense hyperbole.
NYC
 
phlswaflyer
Posts: 73
Joined: Sat Oct 19, 2013 9:02 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:27 pm

strfyr51 wrote:
chonetsao wrote:
Economics is another concern. Should aviation market enters a downturn, AA can not fill the aircraft, that is a lot of capacity growth that would meet a potential free fall on passenger load factor figures.

I personally think they made a wrong decide to increase so much capacity statewide by adding seats. They are doing iat the height of economic growth which is another mistake and receipt for future disaster.

Maybe Douggie finally had a seat on the B738MAX and used the back lavatory the first time.

This is the USAir guys running American into the Ground. AA was WAY better than this in Bankruptcy!! But now? All the "hot" managers at American are NOW?
Running United in "cahoots" with the NWA managers let go from Delta, So therein lies their problem.


None of this is a surprise. Parker and Isom are crass profiteers and accountants who care less about the passenger experience. The 737MAX is a disaster and I would rather get on a Greyhound bus. They are driving me and my company my away.
 
OneX123
Posts: 62
Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2017 1:08 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 8:33 pm

I am based out of ORD and hold equivalent status on AA and UA. While I prefer UA, I don't find the experience all that different. If you're able to book Economy+ (or whatever the AA equivalent is) for free then I find the flying experience rather similar. I prefer UA's app over AA's but AA's updated portion of Terminal B at BOS is beautiful, and the free drinks in some of their premium economy rows is nice (kind of funny that the exit row is one...weird getting free vodka soda's in an exit row)
 
chonetsao
Posts: 303
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:55 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:15 pm

OneX123 wrote:
, and the free drinks in some of their premium economy rows is nice (kind of funny that the exit row is one...weird getting free vodka soda's in an exit row)


This, is very interesting topic to debate on.

In principle I would like guys and gals sitting in the exit row to be alcohol free, so that when emergency happens someone can help us all. (think of the crane operators, they can not drink before shift)

But then I am sure in practice, people will argue to death on the freedom to drink while sit in exit row. The chance to operate in exit row in today's world is billions to one.

I get why you feel weird, yet I think personally I am relaxed about drinking while sit in exit row.
 
musman9853
Posts: 833
Joined: Mon May 14, 2018 12:30 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:39 pm

ABEguy wrote:
When it come to IFE , am I the only one that hasn’t owned a pair of headphones that can be plugged into something for several years now? The disposable head phone you’re going to get on a plane are totally useless from sound quality perspective. I haven’t used JetBlue’s IFE last couple time on them for that reason. Might be an unpopular opinion, but I’d rather stream on my phone or tablet, as long as I can charge and have a holder. Just me though.



agreed. look at something like the s10+. 6.4 inch 3K display. there's no ife in existence that can match the quality of the phones we're carrying around in our pockets.
Welcome to the City Beautiful.
 
FSDan
Posts: 2619
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:10 am

JFKMan wrote:
MAH4546 wrote:
JFKMan wrote:


AA's final 738 orders all arrived with AVOD/in seat IFE. And no AVOD/IFE system has been removed from an existing aircraft in the fleet. Therefore, MAH4546 saying IFE's "have already begun" to be removed is incorrect.


738 reconfiguration and IFE removal began months ago.

https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea.co ... s-comfort/

They are a fourth of the way through. If you refer to the fact that maybe they are starting with older planes that don't have IFE, fair.

But regardless, AA's race to the bottom continues. Spirit is a more premium airline these days.


Reconfiguration? Yes. Removal of existing AVOD/IFE? No.


IFE = In Flight Entertainment. AVOD is a subset of IFE. Since overhead screens are also a form of IFE, if AA has been removing overhead screens from older 738s, that constitutes "removing IFE".
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
stock1985
Posts: 68
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 12:47 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:31 pm

Does anyone have any sense how much negative feedback AA is hearing re: Oasis / 737MAX? I cannot get on this plane in any class and be comfortable - no padding in the seat, the FAs having to do a manual safety demo (insane in 2019!), the seat pitch and the crazy lack of space!
 
ctrabs0114
Posts: 926
Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:09 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:40 pm

stock1985 wrote:
Does anyone have any sense how much negative feedback AA is hearing re: Oasis / 737MAX? I cannot get on this plane in any class and be comfortable - no padding in the seat, the FAs having to do a manual safety demo (insane in 2019!), the seat pitch and the crazy lack of space!


And, to make it worse, the safety demo announcements are automated while the FAs are demonstrating using the seat belts, etc. That's even crazier, in my opinion.
2019: DAL, MCI, PHX, LAS, DFW, SAT, ORD, SLC, SEA, DTW, PHL, MIA, LAX; B73G (WN x3), B738 (WN, AA, DL), A20N (NK), MD83 (AA), B788 (AA x2), CS1 (DL), B739 (DL), B712 (DL), B752 (AA), B763 (AA), B77W (AA), B789 (AA)
Next: TBA
 
User avatar
fanoftristars
Posts: 1639
Joined: Mon Jul 17, 2000 9:03 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Tue Mar 05, 2019 9:54 pm

Am i the only one that likes to login to the WiFi with my phone for internet, and then watch the seatback screen for entertainment? I find it disingenuous for people to say they prefer their airline has no seatback AVOD. Other than an AA or UA fanboy on this forum, if you asked 100 people in the general public if they'd rather have seat back AVOD and Streaming vs just streaming (which requires an app in most cases and which you can't download while in the air) 90/100 people would say give me the AVOD!!! It's easy to argue that Delta has the overall best and most consistent on board experience for domestic passengers with their fleet-wide power, move towards AVOD and upgraded 2KU Streaming WiFi, along with competitive offerings in Comfort+ and regular coach as far as seat and pitch goes.
"FLY DELTA JETS"
 
chonetsao
Posts: 303
Joined: Sun Nov 06, 2005 3:55 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:13 pm

fanoftristars wrote:
Am i the only one that likes to login to the WiFi with my phone for internet, and then watch the seatback screen for entertainment? I find it disingenuous for people to say they prefer their airline has no seatback AVOD. Other than an AA or UA fanboy on this forum, if you asked 100 people in the general public if they'd rather have seat back AVOD and Streaming vs just streaming (which requires an app in most cases and which you can't download while in the air) 90/100 people would say give me the AVOD!!! It's easy to argue that Delta has the overall best and most consistent on board experience for domestic passengers with their fleet-wide power, move towards AVOD and upgraded 2KU Streaming WiFi, along with competitive offerings in Comfort+ and regular coach as far as seat and pitch goes.


I don't know about others, but I prefer seatback AVOD. Give me seatback AVOD any day, just for the flight map I am satisfied.
 
wernerga3
Posts: 212
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:26 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Tue Mar 05, 2019 10:23 pm

UpNAWAy wrote:
They have yet to remove a single seat IFE yet we have all these made up accounts of people refusing to fly AA for that reason?


I flew a 738 ORD-DEN in February, and it didn't have seat IFE. I thought I could remember flying AA's 738 with the seat IFE a few years earlier, and thought I was losing my mind going over it and over it- but then I came across this thread. So they took out the seat IFE to compensate for the weight from the added seats?

BTW the seats were flimsy- the headrest was broken and would not stay up, and the seat back seemed like it was falling off. Forget space- It was horrendously tight- but the flight attendant was super cool and gave me a free beer since it was under 3 hours (I offered to pay!)
 
OB1504
Posts: 3680
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:10 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:58 pm

ctrabs0114 wrote:
stock1985 wrote:
Does anyone have any sense how much negative feedback AA is hearing re: Oasis / 737MAX? I cannot get on this plane in any class and be comfortable - no padding in the seat, the FAs having to do a manual safety demo (insane in 2019!), the seat pitch and the crazy lack of space!


And, to make it worse, the safety demo announcements are automated while the FAs are demonstrating using the seat belts, etc. That's even crazier, in my opinion.


On my most recent MAX flight I overheard some passengers commenting about how they must be on an old plane because of the manual safety demonstration.

The airplane was 2 months old.

fanoftristars wrote:
Am i the only one that likes to login to the WiFi with my phone for internet, and then watch the seatback screen for entertainment? I find it disingenuous for people to say they prefer their airline has no seatback AVOD. Other than an AA or UA fanboy on this forum, if you asked 100 people in the general public if they'd rather have seat back AVOD and Streaming vs just streaming (which requires an app in most cases and which you can't download while in the air) 90/100 people would say give me the AVOD!!! It's easy to argue that Delta has the overall best and most consistent on board experience for domestic passengers with their fleet-wide power, move towards AVOD and upgraded 2KU Streaming WiFi, along with competitive offerings in Comfort+ and regular coach as far as seat and pitch goes.


Not being able to download the app in flight is crazy to me. Infrequent fliers aren’t going realize that until the flight is on its way and by then the aircraft may as well not have any IFE for them.

wernerga3 wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
They have yet to remove a single seat IFE yet we have all these made up accounts of people refusing to fly AA for that reason?


I flew a 738 ORD-DEN in February, and it didn't have seat IFE. I thought I could remember flying AA's 738 with the seat IFE a few years earlier, and thought I was losing my mind going over it and over it- but then I came across this thread. So they took out the seat IFE to compensate for the weight from the added seats?


AA hasn’t ripped the PTVs out of any 737s yet. Aircraft 3LC thru 3NY are a subfleet delivered with in-seat IFE and none have received the Oasis downgrade yet.
 
wernerga3
Posts: 212
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:26 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 12:35 am

OB1504 wrote:

wernerga3 wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
They have yet to remove a single seat IFE yet we have all these made up accounts of people refusing to fly AA for that reason?


I flew a 738 ORD-DEN in February, and it didn't have seat IFE. I thought I could remember flying AA's 738 with the seat IFE a few years earlier, and thought I was losing my mind going over it and over it- but then I came across this thread. So they took out the seat IFE to compensate for the weight from the added seats?


AA hasn’t ripped the PTVs out of any 737s yet. Aircraft 3LC thru 3NY are a subfleet delivered with in-seat IFE and none have received the Oasis downgrade yet.



So was I flying on a Max? It def had no in-seat IFE. The screens folded up into the ceiling- but there was a safety video; not manual like people have been posting.
 
OB1504
Posts: 3680
Joined: Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:10 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 12:51 am

wernerga3 wrote:
OB1504 wrote:

wernerga3 wrote:

I flew a 738 ORD-DEN in February, and it didn't have seat IFE. I thought I could remember flying AA's 738 with the seat IFE a few years earlier, and thought I was losing my mind going over it and over it- but then I came across this thread. So they took out the seat IFE to compensate for the weight from the added seats?


AA hasn’t ripped the PTVs out of any 737s yet. Aircraft 3LC thru 3NY are a subfleet delivered with in-seat IFE and none have received the Oasis downgrade yet.



So was I flying on a Max? It def had no in-seat IFE. The screens folded up into the ceiling- but there was a safety video; not manual like people have been posting.


No, that was a non-Oasis, non-PTV 737-800.
 
Chemist
Posts: 582
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 4:46 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 1:33 am

Perhaps they could rename Oasis to Mirage. You know, as to the comfort.
 
BigPlaneGuy13
Posts: 31
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:01 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 2:28 am

If you look at an IFE from a cost-benefit analysis, it makes perfectly sound sense why IFE on domestic product is going away on UA and AA. All you Delta fanboys can crow about how much you and passengers love IFE now. But what everyone so far in this thread fails to take into account is how quickly technology ages. Objectively I think UA and AA's strategy will prevail.

Delta will be met with a pretty shitty proposition if you ask me. Do they: a) invest in replacing their tech every 5-10 years (very costly) or b) let the tech sit there for 20-30 years and give off an archaic vibe and leaving them stranded? (poor product) Delta is at the mercy of the tech companies to keep their product relevant. Seems like a losing battle to me.
 
ABEguy
Posts: 69
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:02 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 3:39 am

BigPlaneGuy13 wrote:
If you look at an IFE from a cost-benefit analysis, it makes perfectly sound sense why IFE on domestic product is going away on UA and AA. All you Delta fanboys can crow about how much you and passengers love IFE now. But what everyone so far in this thread fails to take into account is how quickly technology ages. Objectively I think UA and AA's strategy will prevail.

Delta will be met with a pretty shitty proposition if you ask me. Do they: a) invest in replacing their tech every 5-10 years (very costly) or b) let the tech sit there for 20-30 years and give off an archaic vibe and leaving them stranded? (poor product) Delta is at the mercy of the tech companies to keep their product relevant. Seems like a losing battle to me.


Agreed. Are deltas IFE’s coming with Bluetooth? If they are great, if not, there might not even be head phones in production very soon that come with a plug.
 
HPAEAA
Posts: 1114
Joined: Mon May 08, 2006 7:24 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 3:42 am

BigPlaneGuy13 wrote:
If you look at an IFE from a cost-benefit analysis, it makes perfectly sound sense why IFE on domestic product is going away on UA and AA. All you Delta fanboys can crow about how much you and passengers love IFE now. But what everyone so far in this thread fails to take into account is how quickly technology ages. Objectively I think UA and AA's strategy will prevail.

Delta will be met with a pretty shitty proposition if you ask me. Do they: a) invest in replacing their tech every 5-10 years (very costly) or b) let the tech sit there for 20-30 years and give off an archaic vibe and leaving them stranded? (poor product) Delta is at the mercy of the tech companies to keep their product relevant. Seems like a losing battle to me.

Not just pulling from the above quote but on the IFE discussion I think the following simple facts are this:
1. UA & AA are working to reduce the number of aircraft with Installed PTVs while DL is increasing the number of aircraft
2. PTVs and associated hardware add weight to aircraft which increases costs
3. There seems to be a pretty even split on this message board of the fans & detractors on the value of offering a PTV solution domestically
4. Technology has a pretty Short lifecycle
5. A large percentage of the traveling public carry a phone or tablet when they travel
6. Based on several quarters of financial results, DL has a strong RASM lead over AA & UA

Honestly, I wish we had access to some of the consumer data on trends which influence purchasing decisions, while it may not be the primary driver when purchasing a flight, it seems like there is a significant portion of the population (not 100%, but in the double digits easily) on this board that would purchase an flight with PTV equipped airlines over those without.

To address some of the posts:
I believe DL has mentioned that they are working with IFE manufacturers to develop a more flexible, lighter weight solution which could give them greater flexibility down the road. Given DL's current revenue premium, I think AA & UA should look hard at what their product disadvantages are to help close that gap. As mentioned, the Oasis project has taken a lot of criticism from the press & frequent fliers as a step too far densifying the B738 from what was 148 seats when introduced to 172 (Note, Oasis is densifying the aircraft from 160 to 172). Offering an in seat entertainment option is one component of this but aircraft interiors is another (lav size, seat pitch, storage), Operations (OTP, CXL Rates etc) & customer service are probably the other major categories influencing the decision which probably won't get settled without a fairly broad survey..

I’m glad if this rumor is true, I had some last minute transcon bookings recently on the A321T which required seats in the back of coach (everything else, , J and Y+ was sold out) and it was pretty miserable, from what I understand , Oasis is an even worse experience... if they’re finally looking at product quality, it’s a step in the right direction.
1.4mm and counting...
 
apodino
Posts: 3580
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 2:11 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 4:30 am

aemoreira1981 wrote:
The really telling thng has to be this article: https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea.co ... ns-profit/

If not for the frequent flyer program, would AA be losing money since anyone wanting full service from a legacy carrier is going elsewhere? B6 has eaten AA's lunch on most of the East Coast, DL does likewise at ATL and also in NYC, its second-biggest market. That basically leaves PHL, CLT, and DFW...with DL being strongest to a lot of Europe, Israel, and Africa, and UA being strongest to Asia. The solution isn't densification; it's offering a better flying experience on the plane.


I can tell you AA management is aware of this article because in the companies daily memo to their employees, they actually responded to this story with a fact vs fiction. The company spin is that flying passengers and cargo is the core of their business and allows them to make money in other ways as well, noting that Cargo did $1Billion in revenue in FY18.

Its a good way to spin the numbers, but reading deep into the company statement, flying the customers allows the company to sell the AAdvantage miles. Most of the revenue still comes from the passengers and cargo. But, most of the profit comes from ancillary revenue. Without it, AA loses money. That is an issue for them.
 
CMH2578
Posts: 22
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:52 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 4:40 am

BigPlaneGuy13 wrote:
If you look at an IFE from a cost-benefit analysis, it makes perfectly sound sense why IFE on domestic product is going away on UA and AA. All you Delta fanboys can crow about how much you and passengers love IFE now. But what everyone so far in this thread fails to take into account is how quickly technology ages. Objectively I think UA and AA's strategy will prevail.

Delta will be met with a pretty shitty proposition if you ask me. Do they: a) invest in replacing their tech every 5-10 years (very costly) or b) let the tech sit there for 20-30 years and give off an archaic vibe and leaving them stranded? (poor product) Delta is at the mercy of the tech companies to keep their product relevant. Seems like a losing battle to me.


Actually, DL has taken their seatback screen hardware in house. Initially partnering with Gogo Inflight, Delta has taken on commercialization with their wholy-owned subsidiary Delta Inflight Products.

https://runwaygirlnetwork.com/2019/01/20/delta-flight-products-expands-ife-platform-to-be-totally-delta-sourced/

https://news.delta.com/3-ways-delta-flight-products-revolutionizing-aircraft-interiors

Their in-house designed seatback screen uses a commercial-grade tablet (not literally a tablet you hold, see the photo below) at its core. This allows software and hardware to be upgraded as needed in the future at a fraction of the cost to the proprietaries systems on the market today. Additionally, the system is wireless-based, which saves one lbs/seat in wiring. Delta has said that the new system costs approximately a fourth of what they are/were current buying from outside vendors (read: Panasonic).

Image
 
questions
Posts: 2024
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2011 4:51 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 5:00 am

The seat pitch standard on domestic US flights should be:

F: 40”
Y+: 35”
Y: 32”

Full cabin divider, floor to bin between F and Y+.

Visual cabin divider between Y+ and Y.

Airlines need to stop trying to be Motel 6, Super 8, Comfort Inn and Fairfield Inn. If AA wants to run around with Spirit and Frontier, let them.

Courtyard Marriott, Westin, and JW Marriott would work.
 
MSPNWA
Posts: 3437
Joined: Thu Apr 23, 2009 2:48 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 5:00 am

apodino wrote:
I can tell you AA management is aware of this article because in the companies daily memo to their employees, they actually responded to this story with a fact vs fiction. The company spin is that flying passengers and cargo is the core of their business and allows them to make money in other ways as well, noting that Cargo did $1Billion in revenue in FY18.

Its a good way to spin the numbers, but reading deep into the company statement, flying the customers allows the company to sell the AAdvantage miles. Most of the revenue still comes from the passengers and cargo. But, most of the profit comes from ancillary revenue. Without it, AA loses money. That is an issue for them.


That's the story with every carrier. DL is currently the leader in "other revenue". Take away non-core revenue, and all the legacies are near their profit lines. There's no magic "cut line" that means AA is any more in danger than the others. The fact of the matter is that "other revenue" naturally comes with running an airline. In an industry with low margins, any revenue stream can "officially" take a carrier to profitability.
 
9w748capt
Posts: 1651
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:27 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines to Modify Project Oasis Planes.

Wed Mar 06, 2019 5:16 am

questions wrote:
The seat pitch standard on domestic US flights should be:

F: 40”
Y+: 35”
Y: 32”

Full cabin divider, floor to bin between F and Y+.

Visual cabin divider between Y+ and Y.

Airlines need to stop trying to be Motel 6, Super 8, Comfort Inn and Fairfield Inn. If AA wants to run around with Spirit and Frontier, let them.

Courtyard Marriott, Westin, and JW Marriott would work.


What? Come on now - surely you know that a Courtyard will never ever be a Westin or JW.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos