kimimm19
Posts: 310
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2013 9:34 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:01 am

vhqpa wrote:
In this specific example given that most major Canadian airports have US pre clearance facilities. Wouldn't it be possible in theory that the aircraft could dock and disembark passengers back into the precleared departures lounge, then continue their journey arriving as a domestic passenger like any other precleared transborder flight.

In practice though depending on the nature of the diversion it's probably more likely they'll sit at a remote bay until they can depart again.

A more extreme example would be a ORY-RUN flight diverting to somewhere on the African continent with no preclearance facilities at all.


That would of course be the sensible way of doing things.
 
User avatar
mooseofspruce
Posts: 106
Joined: Thu May 25, 2017 10:28 am

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:55 am

An interesting read on when a DL 757 (N6713Y) flying DL1088 from MSP to ANC diverted to YXY, more or less a couple years and a week to the day (March 4, 2017): http://explorenorth.com/wordpress/delta ... hitehorse/

Pax were held in the in-transit lounge whether or not they had a passport, while another DL 757 (N538US) from SEA was flown up to YXY to drop off a mechanic and to fly the pax onward to ANC. In the meantime YXY and folks at 4N (Air North) went full hospitality mode and ordered pizza for them the night they diverted, and then served the pax breakfast and coffee the next morning before they continued to ANC.

(The above link, as shared on 4N's Facebook page.)
Last edited by mooseofspruce on Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
I saw a flock of Moosen! Many much moosen! Out in the woods, in the wood-es, in the woodsen!
 
senatorflyer
Posts: 314
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 10:57 am

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 9:59 am

B8887 wrote:
Is there even a case in which a tech or medical diversion caused a serious diplomatic or security incident?..

I don't think there's even one actually. You'd probably need to go way back in time, but even then I'm not sure it ever happened..

Boredom usually becomes the worst part I think.

Regards.

B8887


I am not sure it qualifies for a serious diplomatic or security incident. However, a friend of mine told me once a story that she and her husband (US citizens) were on a SAA flight on the way to SA. The plane had to do an emergency landing somewhere in Africa, can’t recall which country. This happend during Apartheit. So the welcome of the SAA plane was everything but friendly.
 
nname
Posts: 28
Joined: Mon Jul 18, 2016 6:53 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:16 am

I remembered in 2016 there was a UA flight from ANC to DEN diverted to YVR...
 
dgimage
Posts: 13
Joined: Wed Dec 05, 2007 1:42 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:19 am

We used to have a regular problem in GLASGOW when Atlantic Airways flights from Denmark-Faroe Islands flights would divert in due to weather at FAE.
This was regarded as a domestic flight and no-one had passports. UK Immigration had big problems dealing with these, even though the pax would be overnighting on the airport hotel,
and it was only when on one flight, a group of danish MPs were on board, and caused such a stink at very high level with the UK Government, that a special arrangement was put in place to accomodate these
flights.
 
Bostrom
Posts: 761
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2016 7:11 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:21 am

ro1960 wrote:
This has nothing to do with Schengen. Travel occurs within the French territory so no passport is required. However a valid ID is necessary to board a plane pretty much anywhere in Europe. A national ID card will do between France and RUN to verify the passenger's identity matches that of the boarding pass. But no border control.


It has very much to do with Schengen as all passengers entering or leaving the Schengen area has to go through immigration. And I've done a couple of domestic flights last year where I didn't have to show any kind of ID at all.
 
expat92
Posts: 18
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 11:03 am

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:21 am

Everyone is talking about technical or medical diversions but what about if the airspace is closed? You can't just leave them in an airport lounge for days. What happened on 9/11? there must have been domestic flights that got diverted elsewhere. (Even though I was a tourist in Boston at the time) my memory is feeble and I can't remember if non "mainland" airspace was closed. Would they land in foreign territory, refuel and return to their origin? If in Canada or Mexico, maybe special coaches could be laid on to transport them to the border. I remember that I was planning on doing the reverse to get home but the airspace opened in time.

just wondering.

expat
 
Bostrom
Posts: 761
Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2016 7:11 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:24 am

dgimage wrote:
We used to have a regular problem in GLASGOW when Atlantic Airways flights from Denmark-Faroe Islands flights would divert in due to weather at FAE.
This was regarded as a domestic flight and no-one had passports. UK Immigration had big problems dealing with these, even though the pax would be overnighting on the airport hotel,
and it was only when on one flight, a group of danish MPs were on board, and caused such a stink at very high level with the UK Government, that a special arrangement was put in place to accomodate these
flights.


For that reason I've seen people recommending that you bring a passport on flights between Iceland and Scandinavia, in case of diversions.
 
mackdad
Posts: 63
Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2016 4:16 am

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:27 am

[photoid][/photoid]
303dk wrote:
mackdad wrote:
The domestic route that has the most potential of diverting in a foreign country would be anything coming in and out of Puerto Rico and US Virgin Islands. You have the Dominican Republic, Turks & Caicos, Bermuda and Bahamas as all divert options,

Flights from the USVI to the states or PR have to clear customs before boarding. When preclearance is closed, they’re an international arrival. Same with Guam to Hawaii.



When traveling between US mainland to US territories a passport is not required if you never touched a foreign port. It’s suggested you have government issued ID and birth certificate.

https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail ... erritories


Traveling to insular territories there is a custom check since Guam, USVI, American Samoa is outside the duty zone of US customs. Still don’t need a US passport.

Puerto Rico is domestic. There is no customs check and flights on all major carriers fly back and forth as if was a state. While we can argue samatics but flights to and from Puerto Rico and to some extend USVI are considered domestic since a passport isn’t required. Now many people will confuse USDA and Customs checks as crossing a border but you never left the United States.

I just did a trip two weeks ago in which I went to St Thomas with my drivers license and connected on a puddle jumper to San Juan. Customs entered my information in the system and asked me If I purchased any alcohol or tabaco. I told him no since I just arrived from the mainland and went thru to board my flight to San Juan. A week later I left San Juan and had my bags put thru an x ray machine for USDA inspection. Used my driver license to pass TSA security and boarded my flight back the mainland no customs, no border patrol, and no passport.
 
User avatar
ro1960
Posts: 1106
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:19 am

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:43 am

konkret wrote:
ro1960 wrote:
A national ID card will do between France and RUN to verify the passenger's identity matches that of the boarding pass. But no border control.


You are wrong - when traveling between mainland France and its overseas departments/territories there is passport/ID control by the "police nationale".


I stand corrected but I'm not totally wrong. There is one check done by the "police nationale" and has nothing to do with border crossing. Then there is the Schengen border crossing, check done by the "polices aux frontières". The French and the EU legislation are mixed up here so it's easy to be confused.

The French authorities strongly recommend to carry a valid passport when traveling to the overseas "départements" as the flight may have to divert to a foreign country but it's not mandatory.
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
User avatar
ro1960
Posts: 1106
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:19 am

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:47 am

Bostrom wrote:
ro1960 wrote:
This has nothing to do with Schengen. Travel occurs within the French territory so no passport is required. However a valid ID is necessary to board a plane pretty much anywhere in Europe. A national ID card will do between France and RUN to verify the passenger's identity matches that of the boarding pass. But no border control.


It has very much to do with Schengen as all passengers entering or leaving the Schengen area has to go through immigration. And I've done a couple of domestic flights last year where I didn't have to show any kind of ID at all.


Yes, I stand corrected but no passport required although recommended. National ID is enough.

ID checks policies are very uneven throughout the EU. Sometimes they require it, sometimes not. And sometimes the border police does random checks within the Schengen space.
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
303dk
Posts: 470
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:26 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:55 am

mackdad wrote:
[photoid][/photoid]
303dk wrote:
mackdad wrote:
The domestic route that has the most potential of diverting in a foreign country would be anything coming in and out of Puerto Rico and US Virgin Islands. You have the Dominican Republic, Turks & Caicos, Bermuda and Bahamas as all divert options,

Flights from the USVI to the states or PR have to clear customs before boarding. When preclearance is closed, they’re an international arrival. Same with Guam to Hawaii.



When traveling between US mainland to US territories a passport is not required if you never touched a foreign port. It’s suggested you have government issued ID and birth certificate.

https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail ... erritories


Traveling to insular territories there is a custom check since Guam, USVI, American Samoa is outside the duty zone of US customs. Still don’t need a US passport.

Puerto Rico is domestic. There is no customs check and flights on all major carriers fly back and forth as if was a state. While we can argue samatics but flights to and from Puerto Rico and to some extend USVI are considered domestic since a passport isn’t required. Now many people will confuse USDA and Customs checks as crossing a border but you never left the United States.

I just did a trip two weeks ago in which I went to St Thomas with my drivers license and connected on a puddle jumper to San Juan. Customs entered my information in the system and asked me If I purchased any alcohol or tabaco. I told him no since I just arrived from the mainland and went thru to board my flight to San Juan. A week later I left San Juan and had my bags put thru an x ray machine for USDA inspection. Used my driver license to pass TSA security and boarded my flight back the mainland no customs, no border patrol, and no passport.

That’s exactly what I said.
 
ghYHZ
Posts: 394
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:26 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:17 am

expat92 wrote:
Everyone is talking about technical or medical diversions but what about if the airspace is closed? You can't just leave them in an airport lounge for days. What happened on 9/11? there must have been domestic flights that got diverted elsewhere. (Even though I was a tourist in Boston at the time) my memory is feeble and I can't remember if non "mainland" airspace was closed. Would they land in foreign territory, refuel and return to their origin? If in Canada or Mexico, maybe special coaches could be laid on to transport them to the border. I remember that I was planning on doing the reverse to get home but the airspace opened in time......


Never heard of what happen in Gander on 9-11? 8,000 passengers put up by a town that only has a pop of 10,000 !

Search 'Gander 9-11' and 'Come from Away' ....lots of stories
 
ghYHZ
Posts: 394
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:26 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:21 am

ninspeed wrote:
canyonblue17 wrote:
What happens if during the diversion, someone has a medical issue that requires being transported to a hospital?

Simple, a Customs officer will usually remain with the passenger during the visit to the hospital. I have seen diversions if planes going to west coast US from Europe or east coast US from Asia make a diversion here in YYC ( Calgary Alberta) where the passenger is sent off in an ambulance and there is a customs officer following the ambulance.


That happens all the time here at east coast airports with medical diversions to YYT, YQX, YHZ but I’ve never seen CBSA follow the ambulance. These are International flights (not domestic like this topic) and the passengers would have passports (possibly not a Visa) CBSA attends the aircraft, does a cursory inspection if the passenger is conscious. If not, the airline has a manifest and I’m sure someone has checked a wallet or purse for ID or a health or medic alert card etc anyway.
 
ghYHZ
Posts: 394
Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 4:26 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:27 am

Just about every flight between the Maritime Provinces and central Canada…. YHZ, YQM, YYG etc to YUL, YOW, YYZ is in US airspace for about 200 miles across Maine and depending on the route…may also be over northern NY, VT & NH so I guess it’s possible a mechanical or medical emergency could bring them into BGR. On a recent Halifax – Toronto we overflew just north of Albany and also on a Halifax – Toronto flight….due to weather they gave Rochester as our alternate and I still boarded with just my Driver’s License……they weren’t locking for a Passport just incase!

There’s also the story of the Air Canada/Air Nova early morning flight from Halifax to Boston which stopped in YQI on the way. Yarmouth at the very southern tip of Nova Scotia is known for its morning fog….so when these flights couldn’t land there…. an intending YHZ-YQI domestic passenger would just be carried over to BOS and dropped off in YQI on the way back later that morning after the fog burned off. This was pre-911 and that domestic passenger to YQI didn’t even need a photo ID to board let alone a passport.

So I imagine with the long standing relationship between the US and Canada agreements are already in place for just such diversions as they could happen to citizens of either country with the number of daily overflights that occur between the two countries. Hopefully common sense would prevail!!
 
airway1
Posts: 138
Joined: Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:02 am

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:55 am

I flew Phoenix to London 2004 we landed in Montreal emergency landing. We were allowed to enter Canada even though I did not have a Canadian Visa. Was surprised how quickly they let us in
 
konkret
Posts: 268
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2016 9:26 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:21 pm

ro1960 wrote:
konkret wrote:
ro1960 wrote:
A national ID card will do between France and RUN to verify the passenger's identity matches that of the boarding pass. But no border control.


You are wrong - when traveling between mainland France and its overseas departments/territories there is passport/ID control by the "police nationale".


I stand corrected but I'm not totally wrong. There is one check done by the "police nationale" and has nothing to do with border crossing. Then there is the Schengen border crossing, check done by the "polices aux frontières". The French and the EU legislation are mixed up here so it's easy to be confused.


In fact you are wrong once again - there are no additional checks - “police aux frontières” is one of the units of “police nationale”
Have you ever traveled between mainland France and its overseas territories?
 
BOSMEMFlyer
Posts: 85
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 7:40 pm

Re: What if a domestic flight diverts to a foreign airport?

Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:35 pm

Was flying UA on BOS-DEN several years ago, and we had to divert to YYZ due to an engine issue. After about an hour on the plane, they had us all deplane and quarantined in a pretty isolated gate in the international terminal just vacated by an Etihad flight. We waited about five hours for a new 757 to get flown up from ORD and were on our way (very delayed) to DEN.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos