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Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:56 pm
by CRJ5000
3x a day to LAS to start.
This comes after BUR announcement yesterday.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 4:59 pm
by santi319
Oh boy, the WN fanboys will be melting down in 3, 2, 1...

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:07 pm
by smflyer
oh sweet! WN has had a monopoly on this route for far too long. F9 entered the route late last summer and only operates 3x weekly currently and is going daily starting May. WN has only lowered its fare on the day and time F9 operates since WN has something in the order of 9x daily frequencies to LAS. This will be a welcome addition and will keep WN from gouging the SMF market. There have been far too many times I've had to pay $300+ roundtrip on the fairly short SMF-LAS flight.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:11 pm
by B747forever
Slowly building up their LAS hub. This will be their 5th LAS-CA route.

SAN
LAX
BUR
OAK
SMF

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:15 pm
by Midwestindy
I will be interested to see how F9/WN/G4 react to the recent NK build up

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:17 pm
by CRJ5000
http://ir.spirit.com/file/Index?KeyFile=397103653

Press release above.
I think they'll eventually expand both SMF and BUR to a few new routes.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:25 pm
by tphuang
Unlike BUR, this is actually a really profitable route for WN. I don't see how WN can keep ignoring NK building a hub at LAS. There has to be some retaliation coming.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:26 pm
by dbo861
santi319 wrote:
Oh boy, the WN fanboys will be melting down in 3, 2, 1...


I guess you could call me a WN fanboy and I’m excited about this. I live in Sacramento and go to LAS a few times a year. 3x daily flights will keep prices down.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:29 pm
by flymco753
SMF was a when as opposed to an if. Good for them!

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:37 pm
by Pi7472000
This is great!! SW service has gone downhill and their prices are hardly reasonable anymore compared to other airlines. Great to see more competition!!

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:51 pm
by msycajun
I guess it's clever of NK to go knocking in WN territory at a time when WN is completely tied up with Hawaii and possibly a need to either ground or update a big chunk of its fleet.

NK seems to like to announce several things in close succession. Wonder if we'll see another new station or new routes announced tomorrow?

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:54 pm
by flymco753
Well, considering the VP of network planning has worked at WN & AS according to press releases I've found, explains these adds.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:54 pm
by stlgph
Ah hell, give it another year or two and Spirit will be looking at Hawaii.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 5:57 pm
by klm617
msycajun wrote:
I guess it's clever of NK to go knocking in WN territory at a time when WN is completely tied up with Hawaii and possibly a need to either ground or update a big chunk of its fleet.

NK seems to like to announce several things in close succession. Wonder if we'll see another new station or new routes announced tomorrow?


Would be nice to see something meaningful like this added out of DTW. Perhaps DTW-MDW

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:05 pm
by TWA772LR
Is NK hopping in to the Battle of California?

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:14 pm
by Midwestindy
msycajun wrote:
I guess it's clever of NK to go knocking in WN territory at a time when WN is completely tied up with Hawaii and possibly a need to either ground or update a big chunk of its fleet.

NK seems to like to announce several things in close succession. Wonder if we'll see another new station or new routes announced tomorrow?


Was just thinking that....

“What we look for are over-fared markets,” said John Kirby, Spirit’s vice president of network planning.

Kirby said the new flights are part of the company’s efforts to strengthen its presence in Vegas.

So I'm guessing another California, West Coast, Western destination to LAS?

Maybe ABQ-LAS, SAT-LAS, RNO-LAS, LAS-PHX, ONT-LAS(would be odd after BUR, but you never know)?

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:18 pm
by wnflyguy
On the BUR release I said you watch Spirit will over take WN in LAS in the next 5 yrs.
There service now resembles FL vs Ryan air of the USA. Overall cost advantage they have over WN going to make WN struggle.
I'm the BIGGEST WN FANBOY but WN cost now mirror the old legacy airlines they once undercut vs the nimble Texas start up they once were.

WN battling AS going for Hawaii but the Wolf is at the door.

Next 10yrs will see a new battle on all fronts for WN.

Flyguy

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 6:30 pm
by jplatts
msycajun wrote:
NK seems to like to announce several things in close succession. Wonder if we'll see another new station or new routes announced tomorrow?


The 10 largest markets in the contiguous U.S. not already served by NK (not including markets with already announced future NK service) include STL, SAT, CVG, BNA, PHF/ORF, MKE, OKC, MEM, SDF, and SLC.

NK will likely add service to STL, SAT, PHF/ORF, MKE, and MEM in the near future since (a) all 5 of these markets were served by FL prior to the WN-FL merger, (b) all 5 of these markets are in the 10 largest markets in the U.S. that are not currently served by NK, and (c) NK has recently added service to other former FL destinations such as AVL, CLT, CMH, IND, JAX, RDU, and RIC.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:00 pm
by dcaproducer
jplatts wrote:
msycajun wrote:
NK seems to like to announce several things in close succession. Wonder if we'll see another new station or new routes announced tomorrow?


The 10 largest markets in the contiguous U.S. not already served by NK (not including markets with already announced future NK service) include STL, SAT, CVG, BNA, PHF/ORF, MKE, OKC, MEM, SDF, and SLC.

NK will likely add service to STL, SAT, PHF/ORF, MKE, and MEM in the near future since (a) all 5 of these markets were served by FL prior to the WN-FL merger, (b) all 5 of these markets are in the 10 largest markets in the U.S. that are not currently served by NK, and (c) NK has recently added service to other former FL destinations such as AVL, CLT, CMH, IND, JAX, RDU, and RIC.


I think NK would struggle against DL at SLC, but it would make sense as an add from LAS as part of that build up. I just think DL would fight back hard.
I think STL and BNA make the most sense, maybe SAT. I don’t see them jumping on CVG.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:27 pm
by MIflyer12
wnflyguy wrote:
I'm the BIGGEST WN FANBOY but WN cost now mirror the old legacy airlines they once undercut vs the nimble Texas start up they once were.


No, they don't. WN still has a huge advantage in costs vs. AA/DL/UA, and a significant advantage vs. AS - even if they aren't as cheap as Spirit. Costs are published info. Distance-normalized costs across carriers have made their way into public presentations. Get some info.

WN had a 40% share in domestic passenger count at LAS 12/2017-11/2018, with mainline AA at #2 with 9.9%. The idea that NK is going to overtake WN at LAS is babble.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:32 pm
by dc10lover
smflyer wrote:
oh sweet! WN has had a monopoly on this route for far too long. F9 entered the route late last summer and only operates 3x weekly currently and is going daily starting May. WN has only lowered its fare on the day and time F9 operates since WN has something in the order of 9x daily frequencies to LAS. This will be a welcome addition and will keep WN from gouging the SMF market. There have been far too many times I've had to pay $300+ roundtrip on the fairly short SMF-LAS flight.

"Supply and (no competition) demand".
$300+ round trip for that short of distance is a lot.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:37 pm
by SANFan
FYI, NK is repeating their past w/c entry.

In 2011, NK announced PDX-LAS on 6/20 (with 2 daily r/t), OAK-LAS (3 daily r/t) was announced on 6/22, then on 6/23, they announced SAN-LAS (3 daily r/t.) Service on these 3 routes began in August & Sept 2011. (To be clear, these represented NK's entry in the PDX, SAN and OAK markets.)

bb

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:51 pm
by dc10lover
jplatts wrote:
msycajun wrote:
NK seems to like to announce several things in close succession. Wonder if we'll see another new station or new routes announced tomorrow?


The 10 largest markets in the contiguous U.S. not already served by NK (not including markets with already announced future NK service) include STL, SAT, CVG, BNA, PHF/ORF, MKE, OKC, MEM, SDF, and SLC.

NK will likely add service to STL, SAT, PHF/ORF, MKE, and MEM in the near future since (a) all 5 of these markets were served by FL prior to the WN-FL merger, (b) all 5 of these markets are in the 10 largest markets in the U.S. that are not currently served by NK, and (c) NK has recently added service to other former FL destinations such as AVL, CLT, CMH, IND, JAX, RDU, and RIC.

Top 10 routes from LAS not served by Spirit Airlines SFO, PHX. I don't see them adding JFK.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarra ... al_Airport

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 7:52 pm
by SurfandSnow
Wonderful news! Keep in mind that after NK announced CLT service, Greater Sacramento had been the second most populous domestic market without Spirit Airlines service (after Greater St. Louis). The only metropolitan areas with more than 2 million people that still lack NK are:
1) Greater St. Louis (population estimated to be over 2.9 million)
2) Salt Lake City metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2.5 million)
3) Greater San Antonio (population estimated to be over 2.4 million)
4) Greater Cincinnati (population estimated to be over 2.2 million)
5) Milwaukee metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2 million)
6) Nashville metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2 million)

F9 has already set up shop at STL, SLC, SAT, CVG, MKE and BNA however NK never seems to be afraid of competition. If I had to guess, the markets with sizable populations *and* considerable tourist appeal - SLC, SAT and BNA - must be prime candidates for Spirit Airlines expansion in the near future. MKE may make sense too since that airport is so popular with bargain-hunting pax in Chicago's northern suburbs...

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:21 pm
by jplatts
dc10lover wrote:
Top 10 routes from LAS not served by Spirit Airlines SFO, PHX. I don't see them adding JFK.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/McCarra ... al_Airport


NK already has nonstop service to LAS from both EWR and OAK.

I agree that NK adding PHX-LAS nonstop service might happen since PHX is located in the largest market currently served by NK that doesn't already have nonstop service to LAS on NK.

NK could also add CLT-LAS nonstop service since CLT is located in the largest market in the contiguous U.S. that doesn't currently have nonstop service to LAS on any LCC's. It is unusual for a market in the contiguous U.S. that is as big as CLT to not have nonstop service to CLT on at least one ULCC. All of the other markets in the contiguous U.S. that are as big as CLT already have nonstop service to LAS on at least one ULCC.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 8:38 pm
by Beechtobus
[quote="jplatts"I agree that NK adding PHX-LAS nonstop service might happen since PHX is located in the largest market currently served by NK that doesn't already have nonstop service to LAS on NK.[/quote]

I too am surprised that NK hasn’t jumped back on PHX. When NK started the Phoenix area(2012ish), they served IWA and I think LAS-IWA ran double, maybe triple daily. IWA-LAS didn’t last more than a year. I’m surprised that they didn’t try PHX-LAS when Spirits ops moved there. With the roll NK seems to be on of late of LAS, I wouldn’t be surprised to see PHX-LAS announced soon.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:08 pm
by ctrabs0114
Beechtobus wrote:
I too am surprised that NK hasn’t jumped back on PHX. When NK started the Phoenix area(2012ish), they served IWA and I think LAS-IWA ran double, maybe triple daily. IWA-LAS didn’t last more than a year. I’m surprised that they didn’t try PHX-LAS when Spirits ops moved there. With the roll NK seems to be on of late of LAS, I wouldn’t be surprised to see PHX-LAS announced soon.


NK doesn't seem to be afraid to go after AA (see: CLT) or WN (see: SMF, BUR), and considering that both AA and WN have frequent service on PHX-LAX (I flew WN PHX-LAS last month), that route certainly going to be on the radar for NK.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:08 pm
by SANFan
Beechtobus wrote:
I too am surprised that NK hasn’t jumped back on PHX. When NK started the Phoenix area(2012ish), they served IWA and I think LAS-IWA ran double, maybe triple daily. IWA-LAS didn’t last more than a year. I’m surprised that they didn’t try PHX-LAS when Spirits ops moved there. With the roll NK seems to be on of late of LAS, I wouldn’t be surprised to see PHX-LAS announced soon.

With WN hubs on both ends of LAS-PHX and an AA hub on one end of the city-pair, there are a LOT of flights already in that market; I personally would be surprised to see Spirit start up again.

I also wonder if some of this Vegas expansion is that perhaps NK is feeling that AS might be seriously looking at enhancing their LAS-to-CA schedules? F9 is also adding routes from Vegas to nearby western destinations, such as SAN...

bb

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:53 pm
by maps4ltd
SurfandSnow wrote:
Wonderful news! Keep in mind that after NK announced CLT service, Greater Sacramento had been the second most populous domestic market without Spirit Airlines service (after Greater St. Louis). The only metropolitan areas with more than 2 million people that still lack NK are:
1) Greater St. Louis (population estimated to be over 2.9 million)
2) Salt Lake City metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2.5 million)
3) Greater San Antonio (population estimated to be over 2.4 million)
4) Greater Cincinnati (population estimated to be over 2.2 million)
5) Milwaukee metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2 million)
6) Nashville metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2 million)

F9 has already set up shop at STL, SLC, SAT, CVG, MKE and BNA however NK never seems to be afraid of competition. If I had to guess, the markets with sizable populations *and* considerable tourist appeal - SLC, SAT and BNA - must be prime candidates for Spirit Airlines expansion in the near future. MKE may make sense too since that airport is so popular with bargain-hunting pax in Chicago's northern suburbs...


I could see STL happening (of course, I may be a bit biased since that is my home airport). I'm not sure if it would go down like this (announce multiple cities from LAS) or like Columbus/Asheville (announce three or so routes to Florida/Vegas). I suspect it would be the latter.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:04 pm
by fsafsx
It is too bad that Spirit doesnt want to expand more out of Indy, Cbus or Minneapolis. Me thinks that San Diego, Los Angeles, Oakland, Portland and Seattle routes would be home runs for Spirit. It would be a dream to see them add Sacramento to Minneap.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:08 pm
by PlanesNTrains
Nice add. They should add a few more ex-BUR and ex-SMF.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:12 pm
by 727LOVER
SANFan wrote:
FYI, NK is repeating their past w/c entry.

In 2011, NK announced PDX-LAS on 6/20 (with 2 daily r/t), OAK-LAS (3 daily r/t) was announced on 6/22, then on 6/23, they announced SAN-LAS (3 daily r/t.) Service on these 3 routes began in August & Sept 2011. (To be clear, these represented NK's entry in the PDX, SAN and OAK markets.)

bb



That makes me wonder....should we play...WHAT AIRPORT WILL NK ANNOUNCE ON THURSDAY?.................or Friday? :lol:

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:41 pm
by AirFiero
jplatts wrote:
msycajun wrote:
NK seems to like to announce several things in close succession. Wonder if we'll see another new station or new routes announced tomorrow?


The 10 largest markets in the contiguous U.S. not already served by NK (not including markets with already announced future NK service) include STL, SAT, CVG, BNA, PHF/ORF, MKE, OKC, MEM, SDF, and SLC.


Ahem, SJC ;)

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:26 pm
by MIflyer12
SurfandSnow wrote:
1) Greater St. Louis (population estimated to be over 2.9 million)
2) Salt Lake City metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2.5 million)
3) Greater San Antonio (population estimated to be over 2.4 million)
4) Greater Cincinnati (population estimated to be over 2.2 million)
5) Milwaukee metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2 million)
6) Nashville metropolitan area (population estimated to be over 2 million)


Carriers don't look at population irrespective of competition to primary destinations.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 2:44 am
by raddek
NK could really put pressure out west on WN if they were to add LAS-GEG/BOI into the fray. That would really enhance their Network out west even further, outside of the cities mentioned above already.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:07 am
by crownvic
tphuang wrote:
Unlike BUR, this is actually a really profitable route for WN. I don't see how WN can keep ignoring NK building a hub at LAS. There has to be some retaliation coming.


Like others are saying, WN fares out of LAS are too high and they have been taking advantage of LAS pax for too long now. They deserve a good kick in their butt. DL had the best shot of building up LAS, but they chose not to for several reasons. AS, in my opinion, was "sleeping at the wheel" and let an opportunity slip by. NK saw an opportunity in LAS and is now going after it. I don't think at this stage, NK really fears anyone and is willing to take on even the giants at WN, AA, DL and UA, regardless of the city pairs.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 3:59 am
by 777Mech
crownvic wrote:
tphuang wrote:
Unlike BUR, this is actually a really profitable route for WN. I don't see how WN can keep ignoring NK building a hub at LAS. There has to be some retaliation coming.


Like others are saying, WN fares out of LAS are too high and they have been taking advantage of LAS pax for too long now. They deserve a good kick in their butt. DL had the best shot of building up LAS, but they chose not to for several reasons. AS, in my opinion, was "sleeping at the wheel" and let an opportunity slip by. NK saw an opportunity in LAS and is now going after it. I don't think at this stage, NK really fears anyone and is willing to take on even the giants at WN, AA, DL and UA, regardless of the city pairs.


AS and DL both had bigger fish to fry battling each other at SEA. LAS is still lower yielding, unless there's a city pair ex-LAS that's a monopoly. I do see NK adding more flights out of LAS, and the clientele going to LAS matches the passengers theu're going after. Why spend $300 on WN going SMF-LAS when you can pay $50. That's more gambling money!

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:35 am
by zackary747
fsafsx wrote:
It is too bad that Spirit doesnt want to expand more out of Indy, Cbus or Minneapolis. Me thinks that San Diego, Los Angeles, Oakland, Portland and Seattle routes would be home runs for Spirit. It would be a dream to see them add Sacramento to Minneap.


https://www.theindychannel.com/news/loc ... Dc3mK2auNU

Don't speak to soon about Indy.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:43 am
by FLYKTPA
fsafsx wrote:
It is too bad that Spirit doesnt want to expand more out of Indy, Cbus or Minneapolis. Me thinks that San Diego, Los Angeles, Oakland, Portland and Seattle routes would be home runs for Spirit. It would be a dream to see them add Sacramento to Minneap.


They have hundreds of potential routes to add and only so many aircraft. I’m sure they’d love to add those routes. Just give them a chance to do it lol.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:11 pm
by flyfresno
727LOVER wrote:
SANFan wrote:
FYI, NK is repeating their past w/c entry.

In 2011, NK announced PDX-LAS on 6/20 (with 2 daily r/t), OAK-LAS (3 daily r/t) was announced on 6/22, then on 6/23, they announced SAN-LAS (3 daily r/t.) Service on these 3 routes began in August & Sept 2011. (To be clear, these represented NK's entry in the PDX, SAN and OAK markets.)

bb



That makes me wonder....should we play...WHAT AIRPORT WILL NK ANNOUNCE ON THURSDAY?.................or Friday? :lol:


FAT? :hissyfit:

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:15 pm
by SteveXC500
zackary747 wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
It is too bad that Spirit doesnt want to expand more out of Indy, Cbus or Minneapolis. Me thinks that San Diego, Los Angeles, Oakland, Portland and Seattle routes would be home runs for Spirit. It would be a dream to see them add Sacramento to Minneap.


https://www.theindychannel.com/news/loc ... Dc3mK2auNU

Don't speak to soon about Indy.



Gate space for NK at MSP is getting tight. They have two and sometimes a third in use, but the E-concourse is packed with NK, UA, AA, F9, and AK. Delta "owns" the rest of T1. T2 is fairly full as well most of the day.
Until some gates open up or expansion at T2 happens in a few years, carriers such as NK will be hard pressed to expand.
Note: BOS and SEA are not returning this summer.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:43 pm
by fsafsx
zackary747 wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
It is too bad that Spirit doesnt want to expand more out of Indy, Cbus or Minneapolis. Me thinks that San Diego, Los Angeles, Oakland, Portland and Seattle routes would be home runs for Spirit. It would be a dream to see them add Sacramento to Minneap.


https://www.theindychannel.com/news/loc ... Dc3mK2auNU

Don't speak to soon about Indy.
I hope Indy is announced as a focus city tonight. It would be nice to see it become almost as large as Ohare. I think they will be adding Boston, Hartford, Newark, Philly, Baltimore, Raleigh, Richmond, Tampa, Ft Myers, West Palm, Atlanta, Austin, Dallas, Denver, Houston, Ft Lauderdale, Nee Orleans, Kansas City, Minneap, Seattle, LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Oakland and Sacramento today.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:44 pm
by fsafsx
SteveXC500 wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
It is too bad that Spirit doesnt want to expand more out of Indy, Cbus or Minneapolis. Me thinks that San Diego, Los Angeles, Oakland, Portland and Seattle routes would be home runs for Spirit. It would be a dream to see them add Sacramento to Minneap.


https://www.theindychannel.com/news/loc ... Dc3mK2auNU

Don't speak to soon about Indy.



Gate space for NK at MSP is getting tight. They have two and sometimes a third in use, but the E-concourse is packed with NK, UA, AA, F9, and AK. Delta "owns" the rest of T1. T2 is fairly full as well most of the day.
Until some gates open up or expansion at T2 happens in a few years, carriers such as NK will be hard pressed to expand.
Note: BOS and SEA are not returning this summer.
Oh they will return alright when they expand Minneap to be a focus city one day.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:45 pm
by tphuang
crownvic wrote:
tphuang wrote:
Unlike BUR, this is actually a really profitable route for WN. I don't see how WN can keep ignoring NK building a hub at LAS. There has to be some retaliation coming.


Like others are saying, WN fares out of LAS are too high and they have been taking advantage of LAS pax for too long now. They deserve a good kick in their butt. DL had the best shot of building up LAS, but they chose not to for several reasons. AS, in my opinion, was "sleeping at the wheel" and let an opportunity slip by. NK saw an opportunity in LAS and is now going after it. I don't think at this stage, NK really fears anyone and is willing to take on even the giants at WN, AA, DL and UA, regardless of the city pairs.


Let's get one thing out of the way. There is no chance of DL or any other legacies building up in LAS. The yields are too low and point of sale is always on the side.

The only one with the cost structure to really challenge this type of mostly leisure destinations dominated by WN is NK. That's why you see them building up in MSY/MCO also.

Again, this depends on which LAS route you are referring to.
average fares from Q1 to Q3 + yields for WN. Remember, WN fares have to be higher due to the free luggage and no change fees
BUR $154 $108
LAX $104 $83
SNA $163 $133
ONT $154 $120
LGB $73 $54
SMF $184 $139

I would agree that SMF is a little high, but the LA basin airport (with the exception of SNA) are all below average in margin for the system. WN is not milking BUR and ONT. That's not matched in reality. If you want to complain by comparing ONT/BUR to LAX, I can tell you that LAS-LAX is one of the biggest money losers in WN system. Airlines who are willing to loose money to support their LAX hub aren't willing to do it the secondary airports.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:47 pm
by Midwestindy
fsafsx wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
It is too bad that Spirit doesnt want to expand more out of Indy, Cbus or Minneapolis. Me thinks that San Diego, Los Angeles, Oakland, Portland and Seattle routes would be home runs for Spirit. It would be a dream to see them add Sacramento to Minneap.


https://www.theindychannel.com/news/loc ... Dc3mK2auNU

Don't speak to soon about Indy.
I hope Indy is announced as a focus city tonight. It would be nice to see it become almost as large as Ohare. I think they will be adding Boston, Hartford, Newark, Philly, Baltimore, Raleigh, Richmond, Tampa, Ft Myers, West Palm, Atlanta, Austin, Dallas, Denver, Houston, Ft Lauderdale, Nee Orleans, Kansas City, Minneap, Seattle, LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Oakland and Sacramento today.


fsafsx wrote:
SteveXC500 wrote:
zackary747 wrote:



Gate space for NK at MSP is getting tight. They have two and sometimes a third in use, but the E-concourse is packed with NK, UA, AA, F9, and AK. Delta "owns" the rest of T1. T2 is fairly full as well most of the day.
Until some gates open up or expansion at T2 happens in a few years, carriers such as NK will be hard pressed to expand.
Note: BOS and SEA are not returning this summer.
Oh they will return alright when they expand Minneap to be a focus city one day.


What in the world.....

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:54 pm
by zackary747
Midwestindy wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
I hope Indy is announced as a focus city tonight. It would be nice to see it become almost as large as Ohare. I think they will be adding Boston, Hartford, Newark, Philly, Baltimore, Raleigh, Richmond, Tampa, Ft Myers, West Palm, Atlanta, Austin, Dallas, Denver, Houston, Ft Lauderdale, Nee Orleans, Kansas City, Minneap, Seattle, LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Oakland and Sacramento today.


fsafsx wrote:
SteveXC500 wrote:


Gate space for NK at MSP is getting tight. They have two and sometimes a third in use, but the E-concourse is packed with NK, UA, AA, F9, and AK. Delta "owns" the rest of T1. T2 is fairly full as well most of the day.
Until some gates open up or expansion at T2 happens in a few years, carriers such as NK will be hard pressed to expand.
Note: BOS and SEA are not returning this summer.
Oh they will return alright when they expand Minneap to be a focus city one day.


What in the world.....


Yeah Midwestindy. I don't know either. XD

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:29 pm
by DesertAir
The one Frontier flight to LAS does not pose much challenge to WN but 3 on Spirit is going to be interesting.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:25 pm
by Beechtobus
fsafsx wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
It is too bad that Spirit doesnt want to expand more out of Indy, Cbus or Minneapolis. Me thinks that San Diego, Los Angeles, Oakland, Portland and Seattle routes would be home runs for Spirit. It would be a dream to see them add Sacramento to Minneap.


https://www.theindychannel.com/news/loc ... Dc3mK2auNU

Don't speak to soon about Indy.
I hope Indy is announced as a focus city tonight. It would be nice to see it become almost as large as Ohare. I think they will be adding Boston, Hartford, Newark, Philly, Baltimore, Raleigh, Richmond, Tampa, Ft Myers, West Palm, Atlanta, Austin, Dallas, Denver, Houston, Ft Lauderdale, Nee Orleans, Kansas City, Minneap, Seattle, LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Oakland and Sacramento today.


I think your hopes may be a little overly ambitious. There are probably several other cities that Spirit would set up a focus city or otherwise expand in a current focus city before IND if they had the airframes. no offense to Indy, I’m sure it’s a wonderful place, I just can’t see a mass expansion in a city they just started serving yesterday. Spirits recent large expansion in MCO, with Orlandos mass draw and huge O and D, took months and months if not years of research and planning and building up and only happened after 20 or so years of Spirit flying there.

As far as the to be announced routes out of IND, I see TPA, FLL, and/or maybe RSW likely seasonal and less than daily. There may be a curveball like LAX, DEN, or BWI, or perhaps something really out of left field like CUN or MBJ. I don’t see anything other than a few of the above.

I guess we will find out in a few hours.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 9:33 pm
by dcaproducer
Beechtobus wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
I hope Indy is announced as a focus city tonight. It would be nice to see it become almost as large as Ohare. I think they will be adding Boston, Hartford, Newark, Philly, Baltimore, Raleigh, Richmond, Tampa, Ft Myers, West Palm, Atlanta, Austin, Dallas, Denver, Houston, Ft Lauderdale, Nee Orleans, Kansas City, Minneap, Seattle, LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Oakland and Sacramento today.


I think your hopes may be a little overly ambitious. There are probably several other cities that Spirit would set up a focus city or otherwise expand in a current focus city before IND if they had the airframes. no offense to Indy, I’m sure it’s a wonderful place, I just can’t see a mass expansion in a city they just started serving yesterday. Spirits recent large expansion in MCO, with Orlandos mass draw and huge O and D, took months and months if not years of research and planning and building up and only happened after 20 or so years of Spirit flying there.

As far as the to be announced routes out of IND, I see TPA, FLL, and/or maybe RSW likely seasonal and less than daily. There may be a curveball like LAX, DEN, or BWI, or perhaps something really out of left field like CUN or MBJ. I don’t see anything other than a few of the above.

I guess we will find out in a few hours.


Not to mention Spirit has bases at ORD and DTW. IND makes no sense.

Re: Spirit Announces SMF

Posted: Fri Mar 15, 2019 12:55 am
by zackary747
Beechtobus wrote:
fsafsx wrote:
zackary747 wrote:
I hope Indy is announced as a focus city tonight. It would be nice to see it become almost as large as Ohare. I think they will be adding Boston, Hartford, Newark, Philly, Baltimore, Raleigh, Richmond, Tampa, Ft Myers, West Palm, Atlanta, Austin, Dallas, Denver, Houston, Ft Lauderdale, Nee Orleans, Kansas City, Minneap, Seattle, LA, San Diego, Phoenix, Oakland and Sacramento today.


I think your hopes may be a little overly ambitious. There are probably several other cities that Spirit would set up a focus city or otherwise expand in a current focus city before IND if they had the airframes. no offense to Indy, I’m sure it’s a wonderful place, I just can’t see a mass expansion in a city they just started serving yesterday. Spirits recent large expansion in MCO, with Orlandos mass draw and huge O and D, took months and months if not years of research and planning and building up and only happened after 20 or so years of Spirit flying there.

As far as the to be announced routes out of IND, I see TPA, FLL, and/or maybe RSW likely seasonal and less than daily. There may be a curveball like LAX, DEN, or BWI, or perhaps something really out of left field like CUN or MBJ. I don’t see anything other than a few of the above.

I guess we will find out in a few hours.


A little overly ambitious? I think a lot overly ambitious. The new routes are IND-TPA/RSW daily year around.