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LAXintl
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Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:02 pm

Virgin Australia and Hawaiian Air have filed with the DOT to expand their relationship.

Carriers seek to establish broad codeshares covering routes between USA-Australia, within Australia and between Australia-New Zealand.

Carriers since 2009 have existing codeshare covering HA operated flights between HNL and Australia and some inter-island services, but now seek to establish broader partnership including joint marketing.

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janders
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:34 pm

How will this over lap with VA’s partnership with DL?
"We make war that we may live in peace." -- Aristotle
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:20 pm

Not sure what Delta will think of it, but the applications actually references Delta stating the contemplating codesharing arrangements with HA would be consistent to previously approved one with Delta.
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SCFlyer
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:37 pm

Seeing that DL and HA are also partners, I do wonder if its easier to add HA to the VA/DL JV to make it a DL/VA/HA 3 way JV?
 
smi0006
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:59 pm

Interesting, I’m not sure I understand the value of this move. But maybe the Hawaiian market is bigger than I thought ex-AU.

I do hope this increases HAs chances of adding MEL one day.
 
FlyBitcoin
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:04 pm

SCFlyer wrote:
Seeing that DL and HA are also partners, I do wonder if its easier to add HA to the VA/DL JV to make it a DL/VA/HA 3 way JV?


If DL does go full JV with HA, it would likely mean an exit from NRT, Osaka and Nagoya to HNL on their own metal. Which I think they want to do once they get all of the TPAC slots they need at HND.
 
winginit
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:32 pm

FlyBitcoin wrote:
SCFlyer wrote:
Seeing that DL and HA are also partners, I do wonder if its easier to add HA to the VA/DL JV to make it a DL/VA/HA 3 way JV?


If DL does go full JV with HA, it would likely mean an exit from NRT, Osaka and Nagoya to HNL on their own metal. Which I think they want to do once they get all of the TPAC slots they need at HND.


The scope of the DL/VA JV is between the US/CA and I believe AU/NZ. Thus, requested ATI between DL and HA within a scope that's within the United States (ie Hawaii to Mainland) could not be integrated into the existing DL/VA JV. An entirely new JV would need to be applied for.

For that reason, I think it's highly unlikely that we see a JV between DL and HA in the foreseeable future.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:43 pm

winginit wrote:
FlyBitcoin wrote:
SCFlyer wrote:
Seeing that DL and HA are also partners, I do wonder if its easier to add HA to the VA/DL JV to make it a DL/VA/HA 3 way JV?


If DL does go full JV with HA, it would likely mean an exit from NRT, Osaka and Nagoya to HNL on their own metal. Which I think they want to do once they get all of the TPAC slots they need at HND.


The scope of the DL/VA JV is between the US/CA and I believe AU/NZ. Thus, requested ATI between DL and HA within a scope that's within the United States (ie Hawaii to Mainland) could not be integrated into the existing DL/VA JV. An entirely new JV would need to be applied for.

For that reason, I think it's highly unlikely that we see a JV between DL and HA in the foreseeable future.


Subject to approval, they could extend the existing JV to HA for flights from US/CA to AU/NZ but not within US/CA. See the UA-AC-LH as an example.Trans-border flying is not included in the JV, only TATL.

As an example of what that would most likely look like in practice is that DL would sell HA AKL-HNL but then put you on their own metal HNL-mainland.
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MIflyer12
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Thu Mar 14, 2019 11:59 pm

SCFlyer wrote:
Seeing that DL and HA are also partners...


Is there anything more than interlining and very limited (inter-island) FF mileage earning and redemption?

As noted, I don't see HA looking to get into an anti-trust immunized JV with Delta.
 
azjubilee
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sat Mar 16, 2019 5:47 pm

How did this become a HA/DL JV thread? I read all of the originally referenced documents and nothing in them suggest anything of the sort. The documents clearly state they (VA) are asking for an exemption to codeshare such as the one they already have with DL, which is the only reference to DL. The documents further explain that the exemption will involve codesharing between HA/VA within Australia and from Australia to NZ, in conjunction with HA's services to Australia. So... Suggesting some sort of DL/HA JV is a massive stretch.
Last edited by azjubilee on Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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spinotter
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sat Mar 16, 2019 5:53 pm

FlyBitcoin wrote:
SCFlyer wrote:
Seeing that DL and HA are also partners, I do wonder if its easier to add HA to the VA/DL JV to make it a DL/VA/HA 3 way JV?


If DL does go full JV with HA, it would likely mean an exit from NRT, Osaka and Nagoya to HNL on their own metal. Which I think they want to do once they get all of the TPAC slots they need at HND.


You don't think DL would prefer that HA serve these beach markets in the future, as part of DL's exit from NRT?
 
WPvsMW
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:59 pm

DL's NRT operation does not currently impact FUK, KIX, or NGO service. Why should axing HNL/NRT change that? EB has said nothing about drawing down Japan, only about drawing down NRT, and DL has applied for HNL/HND.
 
azjubilee
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sat Mar 16, 2019 8:45 pm

WPvsMW wrote:
DL's NRT operation does not currently impact FUK, KIX, or NGO service. Why should axing HNL/NRT change that? EB has said nothing about drawing down Japan, only about drawing down NRT, and DL has applied for HNL/HND.


What on earth does this have to do with code-sharing between VA and HA?
 
smi0006
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sat Mar 16, 2019 9:28 pm

azjubilee wrote:
WPvsMW wrote:
DL's NRT operation does not currently impact FUK, KIX, or NGO service. Why should axing HNL/NRT change that? EB has said nothing about drawing down Japan, only about drawing down NRT, and DL has applied for HNL/HND.


What on earth does this have to do with code-sharing between VA and HA?


Haven’t you been reading this forum very long? Everything has to do with DL.... it’s the chosen airline and all foreign carriers should model themselves off DL.

Back to the topic; I wonder if VA would ever use a 330 to HNL ex-MEL. Do they still send on to NAN a few times a week? Surely HNL operated with HA would be higher yielding?
 
WPvsMW
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:59 pm

azjubilee wrote:
WPvsMW wrote:
DL's NRT operation does not currently impact FUK, KIX, or NGO service. Why should axing HNL/NRT change that? EB has said nothing about drawing down Japan, only about drawing down NRT, and DL has applied for HNL/HND.


What on earth does this have to do with code-sharing between VA and HA?


It's a tangent... opposite over adjacent. DL is a leg in every triangle. :cry2:
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:24 am

smi0006 wrote:
azjubilee wrote:
WPvsMW wrote:
DL's NRT operation does not currently impact FUK, KIX, or NGO service. Why should axing HNL/NRT change that? EB has said nothing about drawing down Japan, only about drawing down NRT, and DL has applied for HNL/HND.


What on earth does this have to do with code-sharing between VA and HA?


Haven’t you been reading this forum very long? Everything has to do with DL.... it’s the chosen airline and all foreign carriers should model themselves off DL.

Back to the topic; I wonder if VA would ever use a 330 to HNL ex-MEL. Do they still send on to NAN a few times a week? Surely HNL operated with HA would be higher yielding?


I think MEL-PER is likely to be more higher-yielding than MEL-HNL, in addition to VA's widebody fleet being stretched as it is.
MEL-NAN A330 is flown seasonally on Saturdays (where the aircraft would've otherwise been overnighting or in maintenance).
I also think it's a better chance that HA will be flying the MEL-HNL route as their fleet of 789s get progressively delivered
 
oskarclare
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sun Mar 17, 2019 7:26 am

If this was to be approved, would think HA would increase BNE to 5x weekly and AKL to daily (both have been talked about in the past for increases). VA have a good Aus domestic network from BNE which could encourage people to connect here. VA also has a good presence in AKL so both would be justified for increases.
 
Obzerva
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:38 am

Will the expanded codeshare include BNE-HNL.

From what I can see VA only seem to codeshare on HA's SYD-HNL flight, but not on the BNE flight.
 
Qantas16
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:39 am

oskarclare wrote:
If this was to be approved, would think HA would increase BNE to 5x weekly and AKL to daily (both have been talked about in the past for increases). VA have a good Aus domestic network from BNE which could encourage people to connect here. VA also has a good presence in AKL so both would be justified for increases.


Connections ex-BNE are difficult given their 1945-2045 arrival time (depending on season)... There are no VA domestic (or international) flights that pax could connect to that night. Routing via-SYD is easier with the earlier arrival time.
 
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qf789
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Re: Hawaiian Air - Virgin Australia expand partnership

Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:27 am

Qantas16 wrote:
oskarclare wrote:
If this was to be approved, would think HA would increase BNE to 5x weekly and AKL to daily (both have been talked about in the past for increases). VA have a good Aus domestic network from BNE which could encourage people to connect here. VA also has a good presence in AKL so both would be justified for increases.


Connections ex-BNE are difficult given their 1945-2045 arrival time (depending on season)... There are no VA domestic (or international) flights that pax could connect to that night. Routing via-SYD is easier with the earlier arrival time.


SYD is not much better for connections, the flight currently arrives 1945 so connections to ADL/PER require to overnight. Typically the last flight to depart SYD to PER is 1900 (VA569) however saying that tonight they are running VA571, 2100 departure from SYD, if VA could run a flight with a similar departure time for most of the year maybe SYD connections off HA could work
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