DeltaB717 wrote:moa999 wrote:Would VA be able to get better EDTO for their 777s these days if they wanted to restart JNB?
From memory it quit the route in 2010/11.
And longer ETOPS approval for the type didn't come for later - eg. NZ has operating using ETOPS330 since 2015
You're correct - the changes to Australia's EDTO rules came in 2015 by which time VA had been off JNB for many years.
To answer your question - yes, at least in theory. Back when VA was on JNB, CASA did not permit polar operations (or operations south of 60 degrees south, as Gemuser called it) on twins and only allowed EDTO180 (then called ETOPS and having different rules for tris and quads). Now, there is no EDTO time limit and polar operations with twins are permitted, subject to being granted approval. I think with a fleet of only 5 B777s, this would be a harder ask for VA than for QF.
On QF, they have quite extensive experience with what is now EDTO, having had the A330s certified for many, many years. I'm not sure, but I assume the A330s are certified to EDTO240 or thereabouts given the ops to Japan and Hawaii (and previously on AKL-LAX). The 787s must be at a similar level, too, and QF is no doubt using their ongoing experience with the B787 to build their case for EDTO330 ahead of the type being deployed to JNB and/or SCL.
Boof - I agree, as I said earlier, that QF should have no issue whatsoever achieving EDTO330. However, my read (and I did study ETOPS/EDTO for a postgrad a few years ago) of the situation when CASA changed the rules in 2015 (thanks for linking, by the way) was that CASA did so quite reluctantly following extensive lobbying by QF and, to a lesser extent, VA. I'm not sure I've seen anything to suggest they are any less reluctant to permit Australian carriers to operate twins on EDTO>180 or polar operations. I hope I'm wrong, because continuing any such reluctance flies in the face of the technical capabilities of the B787 and A350.
I am 98% certain that the A330s (and 787s for that matter) are EDTO180.
There are only three routes in Qantas' network that exceed 180: SYD-SCL, SYD-JNB and SYD-DFW. The deviation to remain within 180 on SYD-DFW is fairly minor, so SCL and JNB are the only routes where this is a major issue.
It is pretty much inevitable that Qantas will seek EDTO240 and EDTO330 for the 787 fleet, but I doubt they'd bother for the A330 fleet that don't fly anywhere outside of 180 range.