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BA744PHX
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:33 am

micstatic wrote:
I get that they don't appear to be a business traveler airline. But by not accepting amex they are certainly completely shutting themselves off to many business travelers who work at large companies. Just about all of them carry the green amex.


Many companies prefer clients not to use Amex due to their horrific fees to vendors. Amex is the Expedia of OTA's to vendors, you don't want them but eventually you have to deal with the devil.

Also Amex I believe is no longer the preferred large company corporate card, that tittle has been slipping away for many years.
 
QXorVX
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:39 pm

micstatic wrote:
I get that they don't appear to be a business traveler airline. But by not accepting amex they are certainly completely shutting themselves off to many business travelers who work at large companies. Just about all of them carry the green amex.


Carry over from Levy’s Allegiant days as the same policy was in place over there. Allegiant later decided to let customers give give them money in any form they want, adding obstacles to the purchase path likely costs more than it could potentially save.

This policy is kind of eye opening actually, looks like they are using the 2000/2010 “ULCC toolbox” to start an airline in 2021.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:40 pm

BA744PHX wrote:
Many companies prefer clients not to use Amex due to their horrific fees to vendors.


Those companies have no reason to care about Amex fees to vendors. They care about spending management reporting. The price is the same whether Visa gets a 1.8% cut or Amex gets a 2.2% cut.
 
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BA744PHX
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:44 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
BA744PHX wrote:
Many companies prefer clients not to use Amex due to their horrific fees to vendors.


Those companies have no reason to care about Amex fees to vendors. They care about spending management reporting. The price is the same whether Visa gets a 1.8% cut or Amex gets a 2.2% cut.


Incorrect, Amex fees lean towards 8% and Visa, Master are 4%. It adds up

Same with Expedia at 25-30% mark up and Booking.com at 15-17% who do you think vendors prefer? I can tell you where our company puts more inventory in.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:47 pm

joeblow10 wrote:
Some of these are absolutely bizarre... ACV and RDD? How on earth are you going to fill a 180+ seat 738 to/from cities of that size. UA runs CR2s for a reason - and even they aren’t full.


Good luck! Filling 738s from BUR to ACV and RDD, with no interlining? Hah hah hah. Not even at $19 each way, and they won't be making a profit at $19.
 
sxf24
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:02 pm

I have a feeling if Breeze launched the same routes with A220s, A.net would say the strategy is brilliant.
 
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Polot
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:11 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
BA744PHX wrote:
Many companies prefer clients not to use Amex due to their horrific fees to vendors.


Those companies have no reason to care about Amex fees to vendors. They care about spending management reporting. The price is the same whether Visa gets a 1.8% cut or Amex gets a 2.2% cut.

Until the vendor passes the higher fee onto the company.
 
micstatic
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:48 pm

BA744PHX wrote:
micstatic wrote:
I get that they don't appear to be a business traveler airline. But by not accepting amex they are certainly completely shutting themselves off to many business travelers who work at large companies. Just about all of them carry the green amex.


Many companies prefer clients not to use Amex due to their horrific fees to vendors. Amex is the Expedia of OTA's to vendors, you don't want them but eventually you have to deal with the devil.

Also Amex I believe is no longer the preferred large company corporate card, that tittle has been slipping away for many years.


I don't agree about amex no longer being the preferred large company corporate card. I don't have the evidence. But I don't think you are correct.
 
QXorVX
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:30 pm

sxf24 wrote:
I have a feeling if Breeze launched the same routes with A220s, A.net would say the strategy is brilliant.


I think if Breeze launched a load of small cities from a single base at 3x/4x weekly- they probably should be questioned. But I doubt that is what we will see from them (obviously based on a feeling and not actual knowledge).

Breeze at least gives the impression they have a vision, a network and revenue plan and will build an airline around that. Based on the launch yesterday and info coming out about their policies it seems like Avelo has a cost structure and is trying to build an airline from there up.

It smells like early Allegiant for sure. Except when G4 was up and coming they were able to grow up in massive leisure markets. They (along with F9 and NK) have expanded into most major leisure markets and have adjusted their models accordingly to be the modern version of a ULCC. Avelo is kinda stuck with BUR as the next best option and running a model that might not be up to snuff for the current environment. These flights will have some pax in Jun or July, but how are they going to look in late September? Maybe there is more to come soon.
 
sxf24
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:54 pm

QXorVX wrote:
sxf24 wrote:
I have a feeling if Breeze launched the same routes with A220s, A.net would say the strategy is brilliant.


I think if Breeze launched a load of small cities from a single base at 3x/4x weekly- they probably should be questioned. But I doubt that is what we will see from them (obviously based on a feeling and not actual knowledge).

Breeze at least gives the impression they have a vision, a network and revenue plan and will build an airline around that. Based on the launch yesterday and info coming out about their policies it seems like Avelo has a cost structure and is trying to build an airline from there up.

It smells like early Allegiant for sure. Except when G4 was up and coming they were able to grow up in massive leisure markets. They (along with F9 and NK) have expanded into most major leisure markets and have adjusted their models accordingly to be the modern version of a ULCC. Avelo is kinda stuck with BUR as the next best option and running a model that might not be up to snuff for the current environment. These flights will have some pax in Jun or July, but how are they going to look in late September? Maybe there is more to come soon.


The network plans from Avelo and Breeze are not that different: connecting underserved cities.

I’ve seen loads more substance coming from Avelo than from Breeze. All Neelman has shared is it's going to be an app-centered airline staffed by part-time flight attendants who are attending college.
 
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dabpit
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:25 pm

pranav7478 wrote:
dabpit wrote:
According to Avelo's Contract of Carriage (posted on their website now), they will only be offering nonstop routes, will not have any interline agreements, first checked bag is free (fees apply for additional and overweight), one cabin bag is free (no idea if that is a personal item or a bag for the overhead bin), tickets are fully refundable minus an administration fee of $5 (probably only tickets purchased in a refundable fare class), there could be more than one cabin seat option (standard economy and extra legroom?), and the 737-800 will have 189 seats.

Guessing that is all subject to change prior to the actual launch of flights.

checked bag 10 bucks, overhead bin carryon is 35 bucks, i think personal item is free

My post was prior to their announcement and was based on their published contract of carriage at the time.
Carpe Diem
 
QXorVX
Posts: 52
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:39 pm

sxf24 wrote:
QXorVX wrote:
sxf24 wrote:
I have a feeling if Breeze launched the same routes with A220s, A.net would say the strategy is brilliant.


I think if Breeze launched a load of small cities from a single base at 3x/4x weekly- they probably should be questioned. But I doubt that is what we will see from them (obviously based on a feeling and not actual knowledge).

Breeze at least gives the impression they have a vision, a network and revenue plan and will build an airline around that. Based on the launch yesterday and info coming out about their policies it seems like Avelo has a cost structure and is trying to build an airline from there up.

It smells like early Allegiant for sure. Except when G4 was up and coming they were able to grow up in massive leisure markets. They (along with F9 and NK) have expanded into most major leisure markets and have adjusted their models accordingly to be the modern version of a ULCC. Avelo is kinda stuck with BUR as the next best option and running a model that might not be up to snuff for the current environment. These flights will have some pax in Jun or July, but how are they going to look in late September? Maybe there is more to come soon.


The network plans from Avelo and Breeze are not that different: connecting underserved cities.

I’ve seen loads more substance coming from Avelo than from Breeze. All Neelman has shared is it's going to be an app-centered airline staffed by part-time flight attendants who are attending college.


Completely true there has been more substance from Avelo than Breeze- due to the fact they made a route announcement yesterday. Otherwise their network was also based solely on speculation. And no one other than those involved have any idea how Breeze will stack up. Maybe it will raise just as many eyebrows.

I do somewhat take issue with the perspective presented by Avelo these are underserved markets. BUR is a Los Angeles basin airport no mater how you cut it and LAX/SNA/LGB/ONT will have some portion of overlap with BUR (large portion of leisure pax from small cities overlap?). So on a broader perspective most of these markets are not unserved and arguably not even under-served either:

STS - AS/SNA, AS & AA/LAX
ACV - UA/LAX
MFR - G4/SNA, G4 & AS & UA/LAX
EUG - G4 & AS & UA/LAX
RDD - UA/LAX
PSC - G4/LAX
BZN - G4 & AA & AS & DL & B6 & UA/LAX (!!!) Maybe specializing in BUR will be an advantage here?
OGD - None from OGD, would have to compare PVU and SLC
GJT - AA/LAX, G4/SNA
AZA - None from AZA, would have to compare PHX
 
nine4nine
Posts: 730
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 6:23 pm

QXorVX wrote:
sxf24 wrote:
QXorVX wrote:

I think if Breeze launched a load of small cities from a single base at 3x/4x weekly- they probably should be questioned. But I doubt that is what we will see from them (obviously based on a feeling and not actual knowledge).

Breeze at least gives the impression they have a vision, a network and revenue plan and will build an airline around that. Based on the launch yesterday and info coming out about their policies it seems like Avelo has a cost structure and is trying to build an airline from there up.

It smells like early Allegiant for sure. Except when G4 was up and coming they were able to grow up in massive leisure markets. They (along with F9 and NK) have expanded into most major leisure markets and have adjusted their models accordingly to be the modern version of a ULCC. Avelo is kinda stuck with BUR as the next best option and running a model that might not be up to snuff for the current environment. These flights will have some pax in Jun or July, but how are they going to look in late September? Maybe there is more to come soon.


The network plans from Avelo and Breeze are not that different: connecting underserved cities.

I’ve seen loads more substance coming from Avelo than from Breeze. All Neelman has shared is it's going to be an app-centered airline staffed by part-time flight attendants who are attending college.


Completely true there has been more substance from Avelo than Breeze- due to the fact they made a route announcement yesterday. Otherwise their network was also based solely on speculation. And no one other than those involved have any idea how Breeze will stack up. Maybe it will raise just as many eyebrows.

I do somewhat take issue with the perspective presented by Avelo these are underserved markets. BUR is a Los Angeles basin airport no mater how you cut it and LAX/SNA/LGB/ONT will have some portion of overlap with BUR (large portion of leisure pax from small cities overlap?). So on a broader perspective most of these markets are not unserved and arguably not even under-served either:

STS - AS/SNA, AS & AA/LAX
ACV - UA/LAX
MFR - G4/SNA, G4 & AS & UA/LAX
EUG - G4 & AS & UA/LAX
RDD - UA/LAX
PSC - G4/LAX
BZN - G4 & AA & AS & DL & B6 & UA/LAX (!!!) Maybe specializing in BUR will be an advantage here?
OGD - None from OGD, would have to compare PVU and SLC
GJT - AA/LAX, G4/SNA
AZA - None from AZA, would have to compare PHX



While there is overlap mostly with LAX, SNA id rule out since it’s in not an adjacent area to BUR, you have to take in the fact that LAX is still a nightmare, traffic is nearly back to pre-Covid levels and after June 15 the state fully reopens and were back to the meyhem. I’m sure that no matter what LAX offers in comparison, it will never compare in ease and convenience to BUR. I think that post Covid many of these flights and possibly others will be very successful. People will also worry and be a bit sensitive still about large crowds and what better way to avoid masses of people than by smaller metro airports.
717, 727-100, 727-200, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 748, 752, 753, 762, 763, 772, 77W, 787-10, DC9, MD80/88/90, DC10, 319, 220-300, 320, 321, 321n, 332, 333, CS100, CRJ200, Q400, E175, E190, ERJ145, EMB120
 
alohashirts
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:57 pm

As far as OGD goes, I don’t see it working out. G4 tried OGD- LAX and it only lasted maybe six weeks. If LAX doesn’t work on G4 I don’t see OGD-BUR working.
 
QXorVX
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:34 pm

nine4nine wrote:
QXorVX wrote:
sxf24 wrote:

...



...




While there is overlap mostly with LAX, SNA id rule out since it’s in not an adjacent area to BUR, you have to take in the fact that LAX is still a nightmare, traffic is nearly back to pre-Covid levels and after June 15 the state fully reopens and were back to the meyhem. I’m sure that no matter what LAX offers in comparison, it will never compare in ease and convenience to BUR. I think that post Covid many of these flights and possibly others will be very successful. People will also worry and be a bit sensitive still about large crowds and what better way to avoid masses of people than by smaller metro airports.


I do think all of your points here are valid to an extent. BUR and SNA do represent somewhat different markets and from cities like SLC or DEN I think these are for sure different enough to warrant individual service. Ex someone in Denver is not going to fly into BUR to take the kids to Disneyland. But from cities like PSC or MFR I don't know if there is enough depth to the LA metro passenger base to warrant specialized service to the degree it is going to be provided, at least not to a profitable level. Realistically there is not that much drawing pax to the Burbank in the first place, I imagine Avelo intends these to be seen by potential pax as LA area flights that just happen to be to/from BUR.

For some reason, LAX is king. And I am kind of on your side raising my eyebrows wondering why, but it is what it is. There is a premium from LAX just look at the example of jetBlue giving up after YEARS in LGB to consolidate operations at LAX. The Disney pax will skew towards SNA given the option. So where does that place Avelo, in my eyes it leaves them competing for LA traffic out of the area's 'third' airport.

I think they will really show their network chops when they push the schedule into the fall. Because outside of 2 or 3 of their markets, it is going to be pretty rough if they stick to the same network or same frequencies.
 
wedgetail737
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Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:08 am

QXorVX wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
QXorVX wrote:

...




While there is overlap mostly with LAX, SNA id rule out since it’s in not an adjacent area to BUR, you have to take in the fact that LAX is still a nightmare, traffic is nearly back to pre-Covid levels and after June 15 the state fully reopens and were back to the meyhem. I’m sure that no matter what LAX offers in comparison, it will never compare in ease and convenience to BUR. I think that post Covid many of these flights and possibly others will be very successful. People will also worry and be a bit sensitive still about large crowds and what better way to avoid masses of people than by smaller metro airports.


I do think all of your points here are valid to an extent. BUR and SNA do represent somewhat different markets and from cities like SLC or DEN I think these are for sure different enough to warrant individual service. Ex someone in Denver is not going to fly into BUR to take the kids to Disneyland. But from cities like PSC or MFR I don't know if there is enough depth to the LA metro passenger base to warrant specialized service to the degree it is going to be provided, at least not to a profitable level. Realistically there is not that much drawing pax to the Burbank in the first place, I imagine Avelo intends these to be seen by potential pax as LA area flights that just happen to be to/from BUR.

For some reason, LAX is king. And I am kind of on your side raising my eyebrows wondering why, but it is what it is. There is a premium from LAX just look at the example of jetBlue giving up after YEARS in LGB to consolidate operations at LAX. The Disney pax will skew towards SNA given the option. So where does that place Avelo, in my eyes it leaves them competing for LA traffic out of the area's 'third' airport.

I think they will really show their network chops when they push the schedule into the fall. Because outside of 2 or 3 of their markets, it is going to be pretty rough if they stick to the same network or same frequencies.


The LA Basin isn't just about Disneyland. The Burbank area is local to two large motion picture studios of WB and Universal Studios. It's also close to Hollywood and Beverly Hills. Then to the north, you have Magic Mountain.

If there is a future for Avelo, they could introduce other SoCal cities like ONT or maybe even LGB (provided LGB frees up slots for them).

It will be interesting how they do (or don't do).
 
wedgetail737
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:10 am

How will Avelo do after the Honeymoon is over?
 
JonnyGT
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 2:57 am

I'm not sure there will be a honeymoon. As a BUR regular I can tell you my friends and I are ... underwhelmed by some of these city choices. Phoenix, sure - though it is on the far end of the city. I'm not sure why Tucson wouldn't have been a smarter choice. BUR flyers like the ability to go to places like LAS and Pac. NW without the Bataan Death March of going over the 405 to LAX. (If you live in the San Fernando Valley, and someone says they are going to LAX to fly to Vegas, we'll look at you as if you're insane because you would likely be approaching the Nevada border by the time you took off from LAX if you factor in traffic, check-in, etc.)

I could see cities like Kansas City, Minneapolis, Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, St. George, Fresno being a much bigger draw for residents here. Wine Country? Uh, sure. Bend? I guess. Bozeman? Maybe the smartest decision, as folks here love their National Parks. Grand Junction and Ogden and Pasco and Redding?! Really?
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5521
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 3:31 am

JonnyGT wrote:
I'm not sure there will be a honeymoon. As a BUR regular I can tell you my friends and I are ... underwhelmed by some of these city choices. Phoenix, sure - though it is on the far end of the city. I'm not sure why Tucson wouldn't have been a smarter choice. BUR flyers like the ability to go to places like LAS and Pac. NW without the Bataan Death March of going over the 405 to LAX. (If you live in the San Fernando Valley, and someone says they are going to LAX to fly to Vegas, we'll look at you as if you're insane because you would likely be approaching the Nevada border by the time you took off from LAX if you factor in traffic, check-in, etc.)

I could see cities like Kansas City, Minneapolis, Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, St. George, Fresno being a much bigger draw for residents here. Wine Country? Uh, sure. Bend? I guess. Bozeman? Maybe the smartest decision, as folks here love their National Parks. Grand Junction and Ogden and Pasco and Redding?! Really?


Yeah...what happens when the $19 intro fares are gone? That's what I was referring to the "honeymoon." But keep in mind that G4 has run flights between two points that nobody would even consider and look at them now. But with a lot of start-ups, I'm still skeptical as to how long this airline will last.

I flew CA Pacific once SJC-CLD RT and I think that airline lasted two to three weeks.
 
phllax
Posts: 665
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 6:53 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 3:59 am

I see this as a two-toned Allegiant approach. It’s getting LA people out to Montana, Utah and Wine Country, while getting folks at the other destinations to LA.
 
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lesfalls
Posts: 3478
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:08 am

wedgetail737 wrote:
JonnyGT wrote:
I'm not sure there will be a honeymoon. As a BUR regular I can tell you my friends and I are ... underwhelmed by some of these city choices. Phoenix, sure - though it is on the far end of the city. I'm not sure why Tucson wouldn't have been a smarter choice. BUR flyers like the ability to go to places like LAS and Pac. NW without the Bataan Death March of going over the 405 to LAX. (If you live in the San Fernando Valley, and someone says they are going to LAX to fly to Vegas, we'll look at you as if you're insane because you would likely be approaching the Nevada border by the time you took off from LAX if you factor in traffic, check-in, etc.)

I could see cities like Kansas City, Minneapolis, Colorado Springs, Santa Fe, St. George, Fresno being a much bigger draw for residents here. Wine Country? Uh, sure. Bend? I guess. Bozeman? Maybe the smartest decision, as folks here love their National Parks. Grand Junction and Ogden and Pasco and Redding?! Really?


Yeah...what happens when the $19 intro fares are gone? That's what I was referring to the "honeymoon." But keep in mind that G4 has run flights between two points that nobody would even consider and look at them now. But with a lot of start-ups, I'm still skeptical as to how long this airline will last.

I flew CA Pacific once SJC-CLD RT and I think that airline lasted two to three weeks.


It seems that their non-intro fares still stand at a similar price range ($29) from what I have seen. Still seems that the overall aim is to have such a low fare structure in the long term ( not as low as $19 but under $100 I'm sure of).
Lufthansa: Einfach ein bisschen besser.
 
MarkATL
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Jul 03, 2004 10:07 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:06 pm

Well I just booked an ACV-BUR-ACV trip with the $19 fare. With all the extras the total came to $68 r/t. I've spoken to some other people up here. A few (like me) are buying tickets for the "hell of it". Like me, they're going down to see friends and relatives and the fares are worth it. General consensus is... enjoy it while it lasts. Nobody expects this to be a long term thing...but hey, who knows.
 
airlineworker
Posts: 285
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:20 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 6:16 pm

MarkATL wrote:
Well I just booked an ACV-BUR-ACV trip with the $19 fare. With all the extras the total came to $68 r/t. I've spoken to some other people up here. A few (like me) are buying tickets for the "hell of it". Like me, they're going down to see friends and relatives and the fares are worth it. General consensus is... enjoy it while it lasts. Nobody expects this to be a long term thing...but hey, who knows.


As a rule, not all seats are $19.00, even the majors offer a few low cost seats with a price sliding scale depending on how full the plane looks, what have loads been in the past and how full the plane is close to the departure date is what will determine if more low cost seats are opened up. AA was the first airline I believe to use yield management software. An empty seat earns nothing.
 
nine4nine
Posts: 730
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2017 3:44 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:31 pm

Just booked for BUR-BZN for 4th of July weekend. Looking forward to trying it out. Under $200rt for two on a holiday weekend is super rad!
717, 727-100, 727-200, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 748, 752, 753, 762, 763, 772, 77W, 787-10, DC9, MD80/88/90, DC10, 319, 220-300, 320, 321, 321n, 332, 333, CS100, CRJ200, Q400, E175, E190, ERJ145, EMB120
 
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Coronado990
Posts: 1545
Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:12 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:47 pm

I'm surprised they are not flying to EKO.
SFO=NoCal LAX=SoCal SAN=LoCal
 
alohashirts
Posts: 97
Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2021 8:45 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:06 pm

nine4nine wrote:
Just booked for BUR-BZN for 4th of July weekend. Looking forward to trying it out. Under $200rt for two on a holiday weekend is super rad!

I wonder if Avelo will even be around come July.
 
sxf24
Posts: 1098
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2007 12:22 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 8:26 pm

alohashirts wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
Just booked for BUR-BZN for 4th of July weekend. Looking forward to trying it out. Under $200rt for two on a holiday weekend is super rad!

I wonder if Avelo will even be around come July.


Why wouldn't they be? They've been around for a few years already, surviving off a single airplane flying charters.

They're in a heck of a lot better position than other start-ups, with more cash and lower expenses.
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5521
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:12 pm

MarkATL wrote:
Well I just booked an ACV-BUR-ACV trip with the $19 fare. With all the extras the total came to $68 r/t. I've spoken to some other people up here. A few (like me) are buying tickets for the "hell of it". Like me, they're going down to see friends and relatives and the fares are worth it. General consensus is... enjoy it while it lasts. Nobody expects this to be a long term thing...but hey, who knows.


And I think that was the whole point of Avelo...getting people to fly...just for the heck of it. I'm sure it will be nice to see mainline aircraft at ACV, for however long they last.
 
Goldenshield
Posts: 5029
Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2001 3:45 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sat Apr 10, 2021 11:12 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
And I think that was the whole point of Avelo...getting people to fly...just for the heck of it. I'm sure it will be nice to see mainline aircraft at ACV, for however long they last.


Pretty much this. People don't wish a new grocery store to go out of business because there's an established one with more offerings on the other side of town.
Two all beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles, onions on a sesame seed bun.
 
MarkATL
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Jul 03, 2004 10:07 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 1:49 am

wedgetail737 wrote:
MarkATL wrote:
Well I just booked an ACV-BUR-ACV trip with the $19 fare. With all the extras the total came to $68 r/t. I've spoken to some other people up here. A few (like me) are buying tickets for the "hell of it". Like me, they're going down to see friends and relatives and the fares are worth it. General consensus is... enjoy it while it lasts. Nobody expects this to be a long term thing...but hey, who knows.


And I think that was the whole point of Avelo...getting people to fly...just for the heck of it. I'm sure it will be nice to see mainline aircraft at ACV, for however long they last.


I'd agree with most of that except living up here in ACV the fares are normally outrageous. As such, being able to "see" mainline aircraft is a far second to just seeing any competition. Admittedly though, I always take North Central Ave instead of Murray Rd just to see what's going on at the ACV terminal. :-)
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5521
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 2:22 am

MarkATL wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:
MarkATL wrote:
Well I just booked an ACV-BUR-ACV trip with the $19 fare. With all the extras the total came to $68 r/t. I've spoken to some other people up here. A few (like me) are buying tickets for the "hell of it". Like me, they're going down to see friends and relatives and the fares are worth it. General consensus is... enjoy it while it lasts. Nobody expects this to be a long term thing...but hey, who knows.


And I think that was the whole point of Avelo...getting people to fly...just for the heck of it. I'm sure it will be nice to see mainline aircraft at ACV, for however long they last.


I'd agree with most of that except living up here in ACV the fares are normally outrageous. As such, being able to "see" mainline aircraft is a far second to just seeing any competition. Admittedly though, I always take North Central Ave instead of Murray Rd just to see what's going on at the ACV terminal. :-)


Before Avelo, I think your cheapest option was/is through CEC on Contour to OAK.

I'm hoping that people will fly and continue to fly Avelo once service starts. Because if they don't fly Avelo...they won't have any issues with saying "C-ya."

Secondly, I know they will be a ULCC but hopefully they are dependable and customer service is good. Otherwise, people will quit flying Avelo in a heartbeat...and the airline will leave. And nobody will miss it.
 
flyoregon
Posts: 818
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:41 am

Of the Pacific Northwest cities announced (specifically Oregon), EUG, MFR, and RDM all have service to/from the LA area. Not saying Avelo won’t work, but Salem seems like it would have been a smarter choice with more potential. No competition, good sized catchment area, and a good PDX alternative to go to Southern California. Granted, facilities in Salem are pathetic and could use some updating, but for a low cost startup airline, that keeps costs down for operations and passengers.
 
jetmatt777
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:59 am

I don’t think they are swinging for the fences on these initial routes. These are a little optimistic, but this is also a somewhat proof-of-concept phase. I would expect them to see what works, and what doesn’t - and then apply that model going forward in their other future “anchor” cities.

Part of figuring out what works is trying out what doesn’t. There might be a few of these that stick that are unexpected.

Give them some time.
 
AC4500
Posts: 486
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 2:25 pm

flyoregon wrote:
Of the Pacific Northwest cities announced (specifically Oregon), EUG, MFR, and RDM all have service to/from the LA area. Not saying Avelo won’t work, but Salem seems like it would have been a smarter choice with more potential. No competition, good sized catchment area, and a good PDX alternative to go to Southern California. Granted, facilities in Salem are pathetic and could use some updating, but for a low cost startup airline, that keeps costs down for operations and passengers.

Can SLE even support a 737 operation? (runway length, jetbridge, etc.).
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5521
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:52 pm

AC4500 wrote:
flyoregon wrote:
Of the Pacific Northwest cities announced (specifically Oregon), EUG, MFR, and RDM all have service to/from the LA area. Not saying Avelo won’t work, but Salem seems like it would have been a smarter choice with more potential. No competition, good sized catchment area, and a good PDX alternative to go to Southern California. Granted, facilities in Salem are pathetic and could use some updating, but for a low cost startup airline, that keeps costs down for operations and passengers.

Can SLE even support a 737 operation? (runway length, jetbridge, etc.).


Yeah...I think it's possible considering SNA is 5701 X 150. SLE is 5811 X 150.
 
MarkATL
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Jul 03, 2004 10:07 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:49 pm

Before Avelo, I think your cheapest option was/is through CEC on Contour to OAK.


Ironically you would think so. However, most people around here aren't even aware of the Contour flights from CEC. To top it off the constant closures and up to two hour construction/repair delays on US101 make travel to CEC a not very desirable option. Most folks around here will either shell out the highway robbery fares at ACV or drive to SMF, OAK or SFO.
 
alasizon
Posts: 2854
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:11 pm

MarkATL wrote:
Before Avelo, I think your cheapest option was/is through CEC on Contour to OAK.


Ironically you would think so. However, most people around here aren't even aware of the Contour flights from CEC. To top it off the constant closures and up to two hour construction/repair delays on US101 make travel to CEC a not very desirable option. Most folks around here will either shell out the highway robbery fares at ACV or drive to SMF, OAK or SFO.


Between Avelo and AA coming to ACV, fares should come down a little bit.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5521
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:56 pm

MarkATL wrote:
Before Avelo, I think your cheapest option was/is through CEC on Contour to OAK.


Ironically you would think so. However, most people around here aren't even aware of the Contour flights from CEC. To top it off the constant closures and up to two hour construction/repair delays on US101 make travel to CEC a not very desirable option. Most folks around here will either shell out the highway robbery fares at ACV or drive to SMF, OAK or SFO.


OAK/SFO is a haul of a drive from Eureka area...I would imagine STS would be an option. But hopefully people surrounding ACV will fly Avelo while it's available.
 
flyoregon
Posts: 818
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2015 5:29 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 7:19 pm

AC4500 wrote:
flyoregon wrote:
Of the Pacific Northwest cities announced (specifically Oregon), EUG, MFR, and RDM all have service to/from the LA area. Not saying Avelo won’t work, but Salem seems like it would have been a smarter choice with more potential. No competition, good sized catchment area, and a good PDX alternative to go to Southern California. Granted, facilities in Salem are pathetic and could use some updating, but for a low cost startup airline, that keeps costs down for operations and passengers.

Can SLE even support a 737 operation? (runway length, jetbridge, etc.).


I know there have been a few military charters on 737s from Salem with Sun Country and I want to say I’ve seen pictures of Sierra Pacific in and out of there years ago. But with a relatively short stage length like SLE to BUR, I think a 737 could do it, but not positive.

https://www.airliners.net/photo/Sun-Cou ... 01Ww%3D%3D
 
303dk
Posts: 509
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2016 11:26 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 9:28 pm

BA744PHX wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
BA744PHX wrote:
Many companies prefer clients not to use Amex due to their horrific fees to vendors.


Those companies have no reason to care about Amex fees to vendors. They care about spending management reporting. The price is the same whether Visa gets a 1.8% cut or Amex gets a 2.2% cut.


Incorrect, Amex fees lean towards 8% and Visa, Master are 4%. It adds up

Same with Expedia at 25-30% mark up and Booking.com at 15-17% who do you think vendors prefer? I can tell you where our company puts more inventory in.


While those rates may have been right 30 years ago, that’s not even close to reality. Even small businesses don’t pay more than about 3% for AMEX and that’s the high side. Large companies pay about 1.5% for all 4 majors.
 
ChrisPBacon
Posts: 41
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2021 6:14 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 9:55 pm

alohashirts wrote:
I wonder if Avelo will even be around come July.


They are very well funded. I'm sure there are cashflow bench marks they expect to meet. I'm not saying they expect to be cashflow positive by then, I have no idea. Aside from any seismic shifts affecting the industry (further COVID lockdowns, fuel price spikes) I think they have the funding to wait out their plan. There will be tweaking, odds of getting everything right on the first try are slim.
 
MarkATL
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Jul 03, 2004 10:07 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:28 pm

wedgetail737 wrote:
MarkATL wrote:
Before Avelo, I think your cheapest option was/is through CEC on Contour to OAK.


Ironically you would think so. However, most people around here aren't even aware of the Contour flights from CEC. To top it off the constant closures and up to two hour construction/repair delays on US101 make travel to CEC a not very desirable option. Most folks around here will either shell out the highway robbery fares at ACV or drive to SMF, OAK or SFO.


OAK/SFO is a haul of a drive from Eureka area...I would imagine STS would be an option. But hopefully people surrounding ACV will fly Avelo while it's available.


Yes it is. However the fares at STS are pretty hight too and not enough of a savings not to just pay the ACV fares. The savings at SFO and OAK over STS make the additional ride worth it. A couple of months ago I had to go to RDU and TPA. I shelled out the $$$ to UA. The fare was a $150-200 more than flying from the Bay Area. The way I looked at it was between the loss of two days from driving and the cost of gas and parking at SFO, OAK or SMF made the premium worth it on that trip.

I find that living here here in the ACV area with all it has to offer is well worth the drawbacks. Yes, some things like gas and airfares are higher, but the positive parts of living here far outweigh those inconveniences.
 
User avatar
sunking737
Posts: 1731
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Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 10:51 pm

Does anyone know who in each station will be doing their ground handling?? I assume all catering, what ever they have, will be done at BUR??
"Don't believe it unless its parked on the ramp, or printed in the schedule...SUBJECT TO CHANGE"
Retired MSP Ramper
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5521
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:46 pm

MarkATL wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:
MarkATL wrote:

Ironically you would think so. However, most people around here aren't even aware of the Contour flights from CEC. To top it off the constant closures and up to two hour construction/repair delays on US101 make travel to CEC a not very desirable option. Most folks around here will either shell out the highway robbery fares at ACV or drive to SMF, OAK or SFO.


OAK/SFO is a haul of a drive from Eureka area...I would imagine STS would be an option. But hopefully people surrounding ACV will fly Avelo while it's available.


Yes it is. However the fares at STS are pretty hight too and not enough of a savings not to just pay the ACV fares. The savings at SFO and OAK over STS make the additional ride worth it. A couple of months ago I had to go to RDU and TPA. I shelled out the $$$ to UA. The fare was a $150-200 more than flying from the Bay Area. The way I looked at it was between the loss of two days from driving and the cost of gas and parking at SFO, OAK or SMF made the premium worth it on that trip.

I find that living here here in the ACV area with all it has to offer is well worth the drawbacks. Yes, some things like gas and airfares are higher, but the positive parts of living here far outweigh those inconveniences.


Would SMF be any better or is the time to drive to SMF the same as driving to the Bay Area?
 
MarkATL
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Jul 03, 2004 10:07 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Apr 12, 2021 12:05 am

wedgetail737 wrote:
MarkATL wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:

OAK/SFO is a haul of a drive from Eureka area...I would imagine STS would be an option. But hopefully people surrounding ACV will fly Avelo while it's available.


Yes it is. However the fares at STS are pretty hight too and not enough of a savings not to just pay the ACV fares. The savings at SFO and OAK over STS make the additional ride worth it. A couple of months ago I had to go to RDU and TPA. I shelled out the $$$ to UA. The fare was a $150-200 more than flying from the Bay Area. The way I looked at it was between the loss of two days from driving and the cost of gas and parking at SFO, OAK or SMF made the premium worth it on that trip.

I find that living here here in the ACV area with all it has to offer is well worth the drawbacks. Yes, some things like gas and airfares are higher, but the positive parts of living here far outweigh those inconveniences.


Would SMF be any better or is the time to drive to SMF the same as driving to the Bay Area?


It all depends on the traffic once you hit the Bay Area. You have to time it just right. Also SFO requires you to hit the city streets for a few miles. As for SMF, the construction on CA-299 (Arcata-Redding) can screw things up as well, but not as bad as the Bay Area traffic. Plus SMF is north of town so you miss almost all of the Sacramento traffic.
 
wedgetail737
Posts: 5521
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2003 8:44 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Apr 12, 2021 12:58 am

MarkATL wrote:
wedgetail737 wrote:
MarkATL wrote:

Yes it is. However the fares at STS are pretty hight too and not enough of a savings not to just pay the ACV fares. The savings at SFO and OAK over STS make the additional ride worth it. A couple of months ago I had to go to RDU and TPA. I shelled out the $$$ to UA. The fare was a $150-200 more than flying from the Bay Area. The way I looked at it was between the loss of two days from driving and the cost of gas and parking at SFO, OAK or SMF made the premium worth it on that trip.

I find that living here here in the ACV area with all it has to offer is well worth the drawbacks. Yes, some things like gas and airfares are higher, but the positive parts of living here far outweigh those inconveniences.


Would SMF be any better or is the time to drive to SMF the same as driving to the Bay Area?


It all depends on the traffic once you hit the Bay Area. You have to time it just right. Also SFO requires you to hit the city streets for a few miles. As for SMF, the construction on CA-299 (Arcata-Redding) can screw things up as well, but not as bad as the Bay Area traffic. Plus SMF is north of town so you miss almost all of the Sacramento traffic.


Well, Avelo should provide a little bit of relief while it lasts. It's just too bad the destinations are a bit limited. On a separate note, I hope AS starts ACV service to SEA.
 
FATFlyer
Posts: 5198
Joined: Fri May 18, 2001 4:12 am

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Apr 12, 2021 4:11 am

ChrisPBacon wrote:
alohashirts wrote:
I wonder if Avelo will even be around come July.


They are very well funded. I'm sure there are cashflow bench marks they expect to meet. I'm not saying they expect to be cashflow positive by then, I have no idea. Aside from any seismic shifts affecting the industry (further COVID lockdowns, fuel price spikes) I think they have the funding to wait out their plan. There will be tweaking, odds of getting everything right on the first try are slim.


Avelo raised $125 million last year, it was posted a few pages back.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-02-12/former-united-cfo-raises-125-million-for-startup-u-s-airline

Breeze raised $83 million in Series A financing last year. Combined with the earlier finanacing it is also over $100 million.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
debonair
Posts: 4171
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2004 10:50 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Apr 12, 2021 4:57 pm

MarkATL wrote:
Well I just booked an ACV-BUR-ACV trip with the $19 fare. With all the extras the total came to $68 r/t. I've spoken to some other people up here. A few (like me) are buying tickets for the "hell of it". Like me, they're going down to see friends and relatives and the fares are worth it. General consensus is... enjoy it while it lasts. Nobody expects this to be a long term thing...but hey, who knows.


I am awaiting a TR...
To take this company serious, it has to fly and stay on the routes - which might be difficult due to low demand and COVID19. Hopefully they learned the lessons from EASTWIND AIRLINES, which was notoriously known for cancelling and merging flights only weeks or even days of their launch.
 
nine4nine
Posts: 730
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2017 3:44 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:00 pm

Wonder what the chances are of them securing at least two slots at PAE, or does AS have rights to all?
717, 727-100, 727-200, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 748, 752, 753, 762, 763, 772, 77W, 787-10, DC9, MD80/88/90, DC10, 319, 220-300, 320, 321, 321n, 332, 333, CS100, CRJ200, Q400, E175, E190, ERJ145, EMB120
 
alasizon
Posts: 2854
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:09 pm

nine4nine wrote:
Wonder what the chances are of them securing at least two slots at PAE, or does AS have rights to all?


Between AS and UA, all the slots are spoken for.
Airport (noun) - A construction site which airplanes tend to frequent

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