Avelo Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Wneast · Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:47 am

I wonder what could they do if they come to GEG since a lot is already served ?

alohashirts · Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:48 am

cruisezone wrote:
ChrisPBacon wrote:
AVLAirlineFreq wrote:
I thought G4 flies PSC-LAX. Is it seasonal?

I had not looked but it appears they do, starting in June. So this whole PSC thing may be a ruse if Avelo is truly only entering unserved markets.

I believe Avelo is also looking at PHX, so PSC-PHX is a possibility since it is not currently served.

I wouldn’t be surprised to see AA start PSC-PSC sooner than later. With recent additions in Utah, Montana, and Idaho from AA to PHX, PSC looks like a logical add

BA744PHX · Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:52 am

alohashirts wrote:
cruisezone wrote:
ChrisPBacon wrote:

I had not looked but it appears they do, starting in June. So this whole PSC thing may be a ruse if Avelo is truly only entering unserved markets.

I believe Avelo is also looking at PHX, so PSC-PHX is a possibility since it is not currently served.

I wouldn’t be surprised to see AA start PSC-PSC sooner than later. With recent additions in Utah, Montana, and Idaho from AA to PHX, PSC looks like a logical add

I'm surprised AA hasn't added PSC either, the only other destinations missing from the region besides PSC are FCA and MSO. Otherwise AA has done well with recent adds from PHX

Wneast · Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:06 am

cruisezone wrote:
ChrisPBacon wrote:
AVLAirlineFreq wrote:
I thought G4 flies PSC-LAX. Is it seasonal?

I had not looked but it appears they do, starting in June. So this whole PSC thing may be a ruse if Avelo is truly only entering unserved markets.

I believe Avelo is also looking at PHX, so PSC-PHX is a possibility since it is not currently served.

I’m sorry but does anybody even want to go to PSC there not really a tourist or have anything to offer

nine4nine · Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:54 am

On the @flybur Instagram they posted the first arrival visit of Avelo today.

Tokushima · Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:14 am

They've announced 11 routes out of BUR:
Arcata/Eureka, CA (ACV)
Bend/Redmond, OR (RDM)
Bozeman, MT (BZN)
Eugene, OR (EUG)
Grand Junction, CO (GJT)
Medford, OR (MFR)
Pasco, WA (PSC)
Phoenix/Mesa, AZ (AZA)
Odgen, UT (OGD)
Redding, CA (RDD)
Santa Rosa, CA (STS)

More details in the attached link:
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/meet-avelo-americas-newest-airline-301264717.html

KLMatSJC · Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:36 am

Tokushima wrote:
They've announced 11 routes out of BUR:
Arcata/Eureka, CA (ACV)
Bend/Redmond, OR (RDM)
Bozeman, MT (BZN)
Eugene, OR (EUG)
Grand Junction, CO (GJT)
Medford, OR (MFR)
Pasco, WA (PSC)
Phoenix/Mesa, AZ (AZA)
Odgen, UT (OGD)
Redding, CA (RDD)
Santa Rosa, CA (STS)

More details in the attached link:
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/meet-avelo-americas-newest-airline-301264717.html

Wow, the first flight is in 20 days. That's quick.

448205 · Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:48 am

Tokushima wrote:
They've announced 11 routes out of BUR:
Arcata/Eureka, CA (ACV)
Bend/Redmond, OR (RDM)
Bozeman, MT (BZN)
Eugene, OR (EUG)
Grand Junction, CO (GJT)
Medford, OR (MFR)
Pasco, WA (PSC)
Phoenix/Mesa, AZ (AZA)
Odgen, UT (OGD)
Redding, CA (RDD)
Santa Rosa, CA (STS)

More details in the attached link:
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/meet-avelo-americas-newest-airline-301264717.html

Any more fleet additions? Seems impossible to serve this much with one airplane.

Polot · Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:50 am

Varsity1 wrote:
Tokushima wrote:
They've announced 11 routes out of BUR:
Arcata/Eureka, CA (ACV)
Bend/Redmond, OR (RDM)
Bozeman, MT (BZN)
Eugene, OR (EUG)
Grand Junction, CO (GJT)
Medford, OR (MFR)
Pasco, WA (PSC)
Phoenix/Mesa, AZ (AZA)
Odgen, UT (OGD)
Redding, CA (RDD)
Santa Rosa, CA (STS)

More details in the attached link:
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/meet-avelo-americas-newest-airline-301264717.html

Any more fleet additions? Seems impossible to serve this much with one airplane.

They have 2 or 3 planes. I’m not sure they are all in Avelo livery yet though.

Tokushima · Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:55 am

Varsity1 wrote:
Tokushima wrote:
They've announced 11 routes out of BUR:
Arcata/Eureka, CA (ACV)
Bend/Redmond, OR (RDM)
Bozeman, MT (BZN)
Eugene, OR (EUG)
Grand Junction, CO (GJT)
Medford, OR (MFR)
Pasco, WA (PSC)
Phoenix/Mesa, AZ (AZA)
Odgen, UT (OGD)
Redding, CA (RDD)
Santa Rosa, CA (STS)

More details in the attached link:
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/meet-avelo-americas-newest-airline-301264717.html

Any more fleet additions? Seems impossible to serve this much with one airplane.

This additional article says they have 3 planes and will add 3 more over the summer.

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/04/08/new-airline-avelo-thinks-its-the-perfect-time-to-start-flying-as-travel-picks-up.html

CRJ200flyer · Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:38 pm

Polot wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:
Tokushima wrote:
They've announced 11 routes out of BUR:
Arcata/Eureka, CA (ACV)
Bend/Redmond, OR (RDM)
Bozeman, MT (BZN)
Eugene, OR (EUG)
Grand Junction, CO (GJT)
Medford, OR (MFR)
Pasco, WA (PSC)
Phoenix/Mesa, AZ (AZA)
Odgen, UT (OGD)
Redding, CA (RDD)
Santa Rosa, CA (STS)

More details in the attached link:
https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/meet-avelo-americas-newest-airline-301264717.html

Any more fleet additions? Seems impossible to serve this much with one airplane.

They have 2 or 3 planes. I’m not sure they are all in Avelo livery yet though.

I saw two fully painted Avelo 737s sitting in IND early this week.

mperalta112 · Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:50 pm

Also shared a small clip on their Twitter feed.

https://twitter.com/fly_BUR/status/1379953523417247745

VirginFlyer · Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:09 pm

A bit more detail from the linked release:

BUR-STS - Daily
BUR-PSC - 3x weekly
BUR-BZN - 4x weekly
BUR-AZA - Daily
BUR-OGD - 6x weekly
BUR-GJT - 4x weekly
BUR-MFR - 4x weekly
BUR-EUG - 4x weekly
BUR-RDM - 3x weekly
BUR-ACV - 4x weekly
BUR-RDD - 3x weekly

All up, that’s 49 weekly flights, or 7 daily. What gate(s) will they use at BUR? There aren’t a great number which can handle a 737-800 are there?

http://www.gcmap.com/map?P=BUR-STS/PSC/ ... 0x540&PM=*

V/F

debonair · Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:26 pm

More infos about the launch, fares start at 19$, first bag 10$, hand-luggage 35$, 129 standard slimline 29-inch pitch seats and 60 seats with 31 to 38 inches of pitch.

https://worldairlinenews.com/2021/04/08 ... k-airport/

nine4nine · Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:27 pm

VirginFlyer wrote:
A bit more detail from the linked release:

BUR-STS - Daily
BUR-PSC - 3x weekly
BUR-BZN - 4x weekly
BUR-AZA - Daily
BUR-OGD - 6x weekly
BUR-GJT - 4x weekly
BUR-MFR - 4x weekly
BUR-EUG - 4x weekly
BUR-RDM - 3x weekly
BUR-ACV - 4x weekly
BUR-RDD - 3x weekly

All up, that’s 49 weekly flights, or 7 daily. What gate(s) will they use at BUR? There aren’t a great number which can handle a 737-800 are there?

http://www.gcmap.com/map?P=BUR-STS/PSC/ ... 0x540&PM=*

V/F

I believe they will be operating out of the Terminal B gates. Which if memory serves me right all but one gate are 800 capable.

Wneast · Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:33 pm

Wonder what they will do next after this first routes ?

joeblow10 · Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:44 pm

Some of these are absolutely bizarre... ACV and RDD? How on earth are you going to fill a 180+ seat 738 to/from cities of that size. UA runs CR2s for a reason - and even they aren’t full.

Many also make a lot of sense, but given the rapid launch, have to wonder how long this lasts imo. Wish them the best though

QXorVX · Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:26 pm

joeblow10 wrote:
Some of these are absolutely bizarre... ACV and RDD? How on earth are you going to fill a 180+ seat 738 to/from cities of that size. UA runs CR2s for a reason - and even they aren’t full.

Many also make a lot of sense, but given the rapid launch, have to wonder how long this lasts imo. Wish them the best though

Right, was it launch now or never have the funding to do it in the future?.. or do they feel this is really the time to go?

Will be interesting to see how much they can stimulate in some of these markets. BUR is great and everything, but for the budget traveler that is just “LA”. For the small-city to LA metro area there is competition for a lot of these routes on established carriers. 3x - 4x is a whole lot of capacity, which in turn means non-peak day flying to thin, odd markets. A model “successful” airlines like Frontier haven’t even been able to sustain even with name recognition, economies of scale, and operational expertise.

It feels like they just wanted to start and airline, not necessarily because they felt there was a market out there for them. Buy some planes and find the least-worst places to schedule them.

nine4nine · Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:52 pm

Well considering UA left the BUR-SFO route they’ve flown for decades which many of these cities connected through a lot of these I-5 corridor routes make sense. For sure a page out of the G4/NK playbook. Excited to see how these work and what else may come along.

Boiler905 · Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:17 pm

It's fun to see an airline attempt routes never attempted before, or at least not for decades.

Good luck to Avelo.

FATFlyer · Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:28 pm

I see Avelo as following the Allegiant early years. Back then there were also similar questions/comments on a.net about the routes G4 was attempting.

Like during his time with Allegiant, Levy will probably quickly reduce frequencies or cut routes that are not meeting Avelo's internal numbers.

phllax · Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:39 pm

nine4nine wrote:
VirginFlyer wrote:
A bit more detail from the linked release:

All up, that’s 49 weekly flights, or 7 daily. What gate(s) will they use at BUR? There aren’t a great number which can handle a 737-800 are there?

V/F

I believe they will be operating out of the Terminal B gates. Which if memory serves me right all but one gate are 800 capable.

With B6 not resuming until June, and with only the red-eye, they could use A9 during the day as well.

iAvgeek737 · Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:53 pm

(I hope the image inserted correctly)

Taken from the Burbank Airport twitter. Looks like they are using the Acro Series 6 seats (Which I think is found on Spirits new interior although theirs might be the 3)

wnflyguy · Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:59 pm

phllax wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
VirginFlyer wrote:
A bit more detail from the linked release:

All up, that’s 49 weekly flights, or 7 daily. What gate(s) will they use at BUR? There aren’t a great number which can handle a 737-800 are there?

V/F

I believe they will be operating out of the Terminal B gates. Which if memory serves me right all but one gate are 800 capable.

With B6 not resuming until June, and with only the red-eye, they could use A9 during the day as well.

Wasn't NK sharing Gate A9 with B6 at BUR?

Flyguy

RJNUT · Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:18 pm

Hope they have ample turn times. That's a lot of folks to load/off load when you're new and probably contracted out.

AC4500 · Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:26 pm

RJNUT wrote:
Hope they have ample turn times. That's a lot of folks to load/off load when you're new and probably contracted out.

Looking at their published schedule, it looks like their turn times are ~40 minutes, which I believe is similar to WN.

nine4nine · Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:56 pm

wnflyguy wrote:
phllax wrote:
nine4nine wrote:

I believe they will be operating out of the Terminal B gates. Which if memory serves me right all but one gate are 800 capable.

With B6 not resuming until June, and with only the red-eye, they could use A9 during the day as well.

Wasn't NK sharing Gate A9 with B6 at BUR?

Flyguy

NK only used the A gates during the temporary operations consolidation during the peak of the Covid shutdown when B was closed for a period of time.

KFTG · Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:06 pm

Do their -800s have onboard airstairs, e.g. Ryanair style?
Cities like Pasco (and BUR for that matter) do not have jetbridges.
Sure, they can use roll-up ones like G4, but it occurred to me...

maps4ltd · Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:59 pm

AC4500 wrote:
RJNUT wrote:
Hope they have ample turn times. That's a lot of folks to load/off load when you're new and probably contracted out.

Looking at their published schedule, it looks like their turn times are ~40 minutes, which I believe is similar to WN.

WN is closer to an hour now (like the legacies) but some 35/45 minute turns can still be found, typically involving -700s. But yeah, 190 pax in 40 minutes is pushing it.

DLASFlyer · Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:23 pm

KFTG wrote:
Do their -800s have onboard airstairs, e.g. Ryanair style?
Cities like Pasco (and BUR for that matter) do not have jetbridges.
Sure, they can use roll-up ones like G4, but it occurred to me...

Doubt it. So many folks in the US use wheelchairs that ramps are the typical solution.

MDW22L31C · Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:29 pm

Did this Airline look at ONT.

Can a 737 fly out of CCR I would think BUR-CCR on 737 would be great since JSX has flights on this route.

debonair · Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:59 pm

KFTG wrote:
Do their -800s have onboard airstairs, e.g. Ryanair style?

AFAIK, the previous owners operated them without airstairs - can't remember seeing any OR nor TK B738 order them.

jmc1975 · Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:42 pm

Delta350 wrote:
I think they have a chance at BHM

Not from BUR

travelin man · Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:28 am

maps4ltd wrote:
AC4500 wrote:
RJNUT wrote:
Hope they have ample turn times. That's a lot of folks to load/off load when you're new and probably contracted out.

Looking at their published schedule, it looks like their turn times are ~40 minutes, which I believe is similar to WN.

WN is closer to an hour now (like the legacies) but some 35/45 minute turns can still be found, typically involving -700s. But yeah, 190 pax in 40 minutes is pushing it.

Judging by these routes I don't think there will be 190 passengers on many of these flights.

FATFlyer · Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:05 am

DLASFlyer wrote:
Doubt it. So many folks in the US use wheelchairs that ramps are the typical solution.

Not just wheelchairs. Many people are just slow climbing stairs, then add in if they are managing kids or carryons. A ramp makes it easier.

dfw88 · Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:10 am

KFTG wrote:
Do their -800s have onboard airstairs, e.g. Ryanair style?
Cities like Pasco (and BUR for that matter) do not have jetbridges.
Sure, they can use roll-up ones like G4, but it occurred to me...

Looks like you haven't been to Pasco in a few years (can't blame you...). The new terminal has a jet bridge.

wedgetail737 · Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:12 am

dfw88 wrote:
KFTG wrote:
Do their -800s have onboard airstairs, e.g. Ryanair style?
Cities like Pasco (and BUR for that matter) do not have jetbridges.
Sure, they can use roll-up ones like G4, but it occurred to me...

Looks like you haven't been to Pasco in a few years (can't blame you...). The new terminal has a jet bridge.

Just one jet bridge?

Remember back in the 1980's and 1990's, DL flew 727-200's between SLC and PSC. I'm sure it'll be nice to see mainline aircraft again at PSC.

FATFlyer · Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:30 am

wedgetail737 wrote:
Just one jet bridge?

Remember back in the 1980's and 1990's, DL flew 727-200's between SLC and PSC. I'm sure it'll be nice to see mainline aircraft again at PSC.

Allegiant currently operates at PSC to LAS and AZA, with LAX and SAN routes starting in the next few months.

AntonioMartin · Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:10 am

It's just Casino Express renamed...but with a new clientele focus.

pranav7478 · Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:50 am

dabpit wrote:
According to Avelo's Contract of Carriage (posted on their website now), they will only be offering nonstop routes, will not have any interline agreements, first checked bag is free (fees apply for additional and overweight), one cabin bag is free (no idea if that is a personal item or a bag for the overhead bin), tickets are fully refundable minus an administration fee of $5 (probably only tickets purchased in a refundable fare class), there could be more than one cabin seat option (standard economy and extra legroom?), and the 737-800 will have 189 seats.

Guessing that is all subject to change prior to the actual launch of flights.

checked bag 10 bucks, overhead bin carryon is 35 bucks, i think personal item is free

rbavfan · Fri Apr 09, 2021 6:07 am

Rdh3e wrote:
downdata wrote:
Rdh3e wrote:
You can routinely buy MEL-SYD for $50. That is amazing value. You can also get a first class ticket tomorrow for under $500.

In my travels I've found Australia to be one of the most affordable air markets (Domestically).

LAX - SFO costs substantially less. As are JFK - BOS. And they have far less frequencies than MEL - SYD.

You are incorrect. The Bay to the Basin has the most frequency of any city pair in the entire world. In April this year there are 190 daily round trips. That's about double the Melbourne to Sydney frequency.

Again, you can go buy a ticket for tomorrow in MEL-SYD for $50, doing the same for LAX-SFO is triple that, currently at $150.

The largest number of daily flights between 2 cities if Jeju to Seoul Gimpo Airport with 113 daily flights. Not a single LA to SF Bay city pair come close to that.

As a matter of fact LAX-JFK #29, is the first US route on the list of largest number of passengers between airports Jeju-Seaoul is at #1 & Mel-Syd is #3. So no
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_b ... air_routes

VirginFlyer · Fri Apr 09, 2021 6:25 am

rbavfan wrote:
Rdh3e wrote:
downdata wrote:

LAX - SFO costs substantially less. As are JFK - BOS. And they have far less frequencies than MEL - SYD.

You are incorrect. The Bay to the Basin has the most frequency of any city pair in the entire world. In April this year there are 190 daily round trips. That's about double the Melbourne to Sydney frequency.

Again, you can go buy a ticket for tomorrow in MEL-SYD for $50, doing the same for LAX-SFO is triple that, currently at $150.

The largest number of daily flights between 2 cities if Jeju to Seoul Gimpo Airport with 113 daily flights. Not a single LA to SF Bay city pair come close to that.

As a matter of fact LAX-JFK #29, is the first US route on the list of largest number of passengers between airports Jeju-Seaoul is at #1 & Mel-Syd is #3. So no
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_b ... air_routes

Airport to Airport yes, but I think the figure being looked at was Bay Area overall (SFO/SJC/OAK/STS) to Greater Los Angeles (LAX/BUR/LGB/ONT/SNA).

The other one I've found interesting recently is LAX-LAS, which has a whopping ten operators between the two airports, or more if you count regional separately:

Alaska (+ Horizon)
Allegiant
American
Delta (+ Connection)
Frontier
JetBlue
Southwest
Spirit
Sun Country
United (+ Express)

I can't find another route (airport-to-airport or city-to-city) that has that many operators, and there are only a few airport-to-airport worldwide that have 10 or more operators from what I have been able to find: Jinghong-Kunming (12), Chongqing-Shenzhen (10), Zhengzhou-Urumqi (10) (though I'm sure someone will chime in with a few more now I've posted this)

An interesting resource in this regard (although it only shows airport to airport as opposed to city to city) is OAG's 2020 Busiest Routes report, which has data from calendar year 2019: https://www.oag.com/hubfs/free-reports/ ... s-2020.pdf and OAG's Busiest Routes Right Now page: https://www.oag.com/busiest-routes-right-now

Sorry, this is obviously rather off topic!

V/F

Chasensfo · Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:04 am

I plan to be on the first STS-BUR and the next day BUR-STS, anyone else going along?

FlyingElvii · Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:04 am

cruisezone wrote:
ChrisPBacon wrote:
AVLAirlineFreq wrote:
I thought G4 flies PSC-LAX. Is it seasonal?

I had not looked but it appears they do, starting in June. So this whole PSC thing may be a ruse if Avelo is truly only entering unserved markets.

I believe Avelo is also looking at PHX, so PSC-PHX is a possibility since it is not currently served.

AZA? Better cost structure than PHX.

FlyingElvii · Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:13 am

CRJ200flyer wrote:
Polot wrote:
Varsity1 wrote:

Any more fleet additions? Seems impossible to serve this much with one airplane.

They have 2 or 3 planes. I’m not sure they are all in Avelo livery yet though.

I saw two fully painted Avelo 737s sitting in IND early this week.

IFE install? That seems to be an AAR Indianapolis specialty, and has been for years.

DaCubbyBearBar · Fri Apr 09, 2021 8:59 am

Hey... I didn’t think that they were going to get off the ground, but good for Avelo. Another G4, F9, or NK I suppose, but Levy has a lot of knowledge. It could work. Best of luck to them!

micstatic · Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:29 am

I get that they don't appear to be a business traveler airline. But by not accepting amex they are certainly completely shutting themselves off to many business travelers who work at large companies. Just about all of them carry the green amex.

BA744PHX · Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:33 am

micstatic wrote:
I get that they don't appear to be a business traveler airline. But by not accepting amex they are certainly completely shutting themselves off to many business travelers who work at large companies. Just about all of them carry the green amex.

Many companies prefer clients not to use Amex due to their horrific fees to vendors. Amex is the Expedia of OTA's to vendors, you don't want them but eventually you have to deal with the devil.

Also Amex I believe is no longer the preferred large company corporate card, that tittle has been slipping away for many years.

QXorVX · Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:39 pm

micstatic wrote:
I get that they don't appear to be a business traveler airline. But by not accepting amex they are certainly completely shutting themselves off to many business travelers who work at large companies. Just about all of them carry the green amex.

Carry over from Levy’s Allegiant days as the same policy was in place over there. Allegiant later decided to let customers give give them money in any form they want, adding obstacles to the purchase path likely costs more than it could potentially save.

This policy is kind of eye opening actually, looks like they are using the 2000/2010 “ULCC toolbox” to start an airline in 2021.

MIflyer12 · Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:40 pm

BA744PHX wrote:
Many companies prefer clients not to use Amex due to their horrific fees to vendors.

Those companies have no reason to care about Amex fees to vendors. They care about spending management reporting. The price is the same whether Visa gets a 1.8% cut or Amex gets a 2.2% cut.

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