SonaSounds
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:29 pm

SeaEagle8 wrote:
SonaSounds wrote:
Planes4you wrote:
With AA replacing MEL-LAX does that mean that’s QF flight will be moved to DFW?


I believe that aircraft will be freed up to do BNE-ORD/SFO according to the QF memo


I don’t think the “memo” suggests anything about that. No announcements about frequency have been made. I doubt either will be daily. So it’s hard to say at this point how much metal will need to be committed to these new routes.


They literally say they will do this because of the JV tentative approval and AA taking over the LAX-MEL route. How does that not "suggest" that this is where the slack in their fleet for these two new routes came from?
 
kriskim
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:37 pm

SonaSounds wrote:
Planes4you wrote:
With AA replacing MEL-LAX does that mean that’s QF flight will be moved to DFW?


I believe that aircraft will be freed up to do BNE-ORD/SFO according to the QF memo


Those flights are most likely operated by BNE based 787’s which are currently doing the HKG runs. The capacity freed up from QF95/96 is from MEL based aircraft so I would expect that there was some sought of deal similar to Queensland where that aircraft will need to operate exMEL.

I think that once SFO becomes 787 exclusive, QF may get more flexibility in terms of scheduling as they can do SYD-SFO-MEL for example, at the moment it’s just doing MEL-SFO-MEL. The 787’s can be more easily roared between bases which may free up some flying for new routes.
A world built upon connectivity.
 
SonaSounds
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:43 pm

kriskim wrote:
SonaSounds wrote:
Planes4you wrote:
With AA replacing MEL-LAX does that mean that’s QF flight will be moved to DFW?


I believe that aircraft will be freed up to do BNE-ORD/SFO according to the QF memo


Those flights are most likely operated by BNE based 787’s which are currently doing the HKG runs. The capacity freed up from QF95/96 is from MEL based aircraft so I would expect that there was some sought of deal similar to Queensland where that aircraft will need to operate exMEL.

I think that once SFO becomes 787 exclusive, QF may get more flexibility in terms of scheduling as they can do SYD-SFO-MEL for example, at the moment it’s just doing MEL-SFO-MEL. The 787’s can be more easily roared between bases which may free up some flying for new routes.


Exactly. It is not the literal aircraft that is doing MEL-LAX that will be doing the new routes, but because of the JV and freeing up a frame from MEL-LAX that they can now create more slack in their fleet to operate these new routes (and possibly more(not just to NA)).
 
QF742
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Tue Jun 04, 2019 11:18 pm

SonaSounds wrote:
SeaEagle8 wrote:
SonaSounds wrote:

I believe that aircraft will be freed up to do BNE-ORD/SFO according to the QF memo


I don’t think the “memo” suggests anything about that. No announcements about frequency have been made. I doubt either will be daily. So it’s hard to say at this point how much metal will need to be committed to these new routes.


They literally say they will do this because of the JV tentative approval and AA taking over the LAX-MEL route. How does that not "suggest" that this is where the slack in their fleet for these two new routes came from?


AA is not replacing QF on MEL-LAX. QF currently operate a daily 388 flight and 2x week 789. While not officially announced, many are saying AA will replace the 2x 789 service with 3-5 x weekly flight.
 
Sydscott
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Tue Jun 04, 2019 11:34 pm

QF742 wrote:
SonaSounds wrote:
SeaEagle8 wrote:

I don’t think the “memo” suggests anything about that. No announcements about frequency have been made. I doubt either will be daily. So it’s hard to say at this point how much metal will need to be committed to these new routes.


They literally say they will do this because of the JV tentative approval and AA taking over the LAX-MEL route. How does that not "suggest" that this is where the slack in their fleet for these two new routes came from?


AA is not replacing QF on MEL-LAX. QF currently operate a daily 388 flight and 2x week 789. While not officially announced, many are saying AA will replace the 2x 789 service with 3-5 x weekly flight.


Well going through the current QF 789 rotations, and based on previous QF announcements, you currently have:

4 x 789 doing LHR-PER-MEL-LAX/SFO - LHR is daily and LAX started off 6 pw before they mixed SFO in;

4 x 789 doing BNE-LAX-JFK along with various services to Hong Kong.

So from a 789 fleet perspective if QF drops the MEL-LAX on the 789 then they'll need to be able to rotate the 789's to position them back to MEL to do MEL-PER-LHR. So that implies either a BNE-MEL domestic sector for the 789 for positioning on days SFO-MEL doesn't operate or that they will swap aircraft around in SFO. It also means the 789 comes off of Hong Kong so QF basically has 2 789's to cover off BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD. Do the maths on what the availability is for those along with any slackness in the 3 789's doing BNE-LAX-JFK and positioning requirements for MEL-PER-LHR that's how many potential services you have for the new BNE US routes. I'd say you've got a maximum or 7 to 8 frequencies per week available for them and that you'll likely see 3 per week to SFO. So that leaves probably 3 or 4 frequencies per week to ORD.
 
QF742
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:05 am

Sydscott wrote:
QF742 wrote:
SonaSounds wrote:

They literally say they will do this because of the JV tentative approval and AA taking over the LAX-MEL route. How does that not "suggest" that this is where the slack in their fleet for these two new routes came from?


AA is not replacing QF on MEL-LAX. QF currently operate a daily 388 flight and 2x week 789. While not officially announced, many are saying AA will replace the 2x 789 service with 3-5 x weekly flight.


Well going through the current QF 789 rotations, and based on previous QF announcements, you currently have:

4 x 789 doing LHR-PER-MEL-LAX/SFO - LHR is daily and LAX started off 6 pw before they mixed SFO in;

4 x 789 doing BNE-LAX-JFK along with various services to Hong Kong.

So from a 789 fleet perspective if QF drops the MEL-LAX on the 789 then they'll need to be able to rotate the 789's to position them back to MEL to do MEL-PER-LHR. So that implies either a BNE-MEL domestic sector for the 789 for positioning on days SFO-MEL doesn't operate or that they will swap aircraft around in SFO. It also means the 789 comes off of Hong Kong so QF basically has 2 789's to cover off BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD. Do the maths on what the availability is for those along with any slackness in the 3 789's doing BNE-LAX-JFK and positioning requirements for MEL-PER-LHR that's how many potential services you have for the new BNE US routes. I'd say you've got a maximum or 7 to 8 frequencies per week available for them and that you'll likely see 3 per week to SFO. So that leaves probably 3 or 4 frequencies per week to ORD.


Yes - that sounds about right. The 4 BNE based 789 are currently on BNE-LAX-JFK, BNE-LAX terminator and BNE/SYD-HKG. There are really only 2 spare frames (operating HKG and LAX terminator) which, as you say, will be able to cover about 7 weekly frequencies to the US.
 
jfk777
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:18 am

Sydscott wrote:
QF742 wrote:
SonaSounds wrote:

They literally say they will do this because of the JV tentative approval and AA taking over the LAX-MEL route. How does that not "suggest" that this is where the slack in their fleet for these two new routes came from?


AA is not replacing QF on MEL-LAX. QF currently operate a daily 388 flight and 2x week 789. While not officially announced, many are saying AA will replace the 2x 789 service with 3-5 x weekly flight.


Well going through the current QF 789 rotations, and based on previous QF announcements, you currently have:

4 x 789 doing LHR-PER-MEL-LAX/SFO - LHR is daily and LAX started off 6 pw before they mixed SFO in;

4 x 789 doing BNE-LAX-JFK along with various services to Hong Kong.

So from a 789 fleet perspective if QF drops the MEL-LAX on the 789 then they'll need to be able to rotate the 789's to position them back to MEL to do MEL-PER-LHR. So that implies either a BNE-MEL domestic sector for the 789 for positioning on days SFO-MEL doesn't operate or that they will swap aircraft around in SFO. It also means the 789 comes off of Hong Kong so QF basically has 2 789's to cover off BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD. Do the maths on what the availability is for those along with any slackness in the 3 789's doing BNE-LAX-JFK and positioning requirements for MEL-PER-LHR that's how many potential services you have for the new BNE US routes. I'd say you've got a maximum or 7 to 8 frequencies per week available for them and that you'll likely see 3 per week to SFO. So that leaves probably 3 or 4 frequencies per week to ORD.


Qantas is stretching the legs of their 787-9 fleet to the max, sounds like the time is here to excercise some more options for another 6 to 12 planes. What is going to replace he 744 to Santiago and Johannesburg after the 744 retires. Sydney to Haneda is also in need of a 744 replacement. The current answer seems to be the 787-9 unless Qantas orders something else.
 
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SeaEagle8
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 12:21 am

SonaSounds wrote:
SeaEagle8 wrote:
SonaSounds wrote:

I believe that aircraft will be freed up to do BNE-ORD/SFO according to the QF memo


I don’t think the “memo” suggests anything about that. No announcements about frequency have been made. I doubt either will be daily. So it’s hard to say at this point how much metal will need to be committed to these new routes.


They literally say they will do this because of the JV tentative approval and AA taking over the LAX-MEL route. How does that not "suggest" that this is where the slack in their fleet for these two new routes came from?


Where in the QF release does it say anything about AA taking over LAX-MEL? It doesn’t. It’s just speculation. There is nothing indicating what the MEL-LAX 789 flying will be used for.

The last few posts make much more sense as the whole fleet / network will probably be adjusted. I’m just saying nothing in the QF press release indicates anything other than the launching of the 2 new routes on QF metal. How that is achieved is still not public.
I would think perhaps 3-4 to SFO and 3-4 to ORD which may be handled with the current BNE based fleet.
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Sydscott
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 1:49 am

jfk777 wrote:
Sydscott wrote:
QF742 wrote:

AA is not replacing QF on MEL-LAX. QF currently operate a daily 388 flight and 2x week 789. While not officially announced, many are saying AA will replace the 2x 789 service with 3-5 x weekly flight.


Well going through the current QF 789 rotations, and based on previous QF announcements, you currently have:

4 x 789 doing LHR-PER-MEL-LAX/SFO - LHR is daily and LAX started off 6 pw before they mixed SFO in;

4 x 789 doing BNE-LAX-JFK along with various services to Hong Kong.

So from a 789 fleet perspective if QF drops the MEL-LAX on the 789 then they'll need to be able to rotate the 789's to position them back to MEL to do MEL-PER-LHR. So that implies either a BNE-MEL domestic sector for the 789 for positioning on days SFO-MEL doesn't operate or that they will swap aircraft around in SFO. It also means the 789 comes off of Hong Kong so QF basically has 2 789's to cover off BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD. Do the maths on what the availability is for those along with any slackness in the 3 789's doing BNE-LAX-JFK and positioning requirements for MEL-PER-LHR that's how many potential services you have for the new BNE US routes. I'd say you've got a maximum or 7 to 8 frequencies per week available for them and that you'll likely see 3 per week to SFO. So that leaves probably 3 or 4 frequencies per week to ORD.


Qantas is stretching the legs of their 787-9 fleet to the max, sounds like the time is here to excercise some more options for another 6 to 12 planes. What is going to replace he 744 to Santiago and Johannesburg after the 744 retires. Sydney to Haneda is also in need of a 744 replacement. The current answer seems to be the 787-9 unless Qantas orders something else.


I've maintained for a while now that the next 787 order we see from Qantas will be after the QF/AA JBA goes through. QF have another 6 789's on order and coming into the fleet to allow for the retirement of the 744. How are they backfilling capacity? On JNB they were going to deploy an A330 from PER so you'd have daily SYD on the 789 and the reduction in capacity handled by an A330 service from PER. (Which fell over thanks to the fee dispute between PER and QF) That's still the likeliest outcome for JNB.

On HND, QF have already started MEL and BNE to NRT and re-instated SYD-KIX so moving SYD - HND to a 789 or an A330 and doing supplementary services to SYD-NRT, or having JQ do them, would seem the likeliest outcome to make up for an loss of capacity.

The real question is on SCL but I think that has been partially answered by LATAM starting MEL-SCL service. So QF pulling back a bit of capacity on SYD-SCL while maintaining frequency is likely not a bad thing and with the ability to fly to GRU/GIG part of the project sunrise brief medium / long term 787's flying to SCL won't be an issue because you'll have a 2nd entry point to South America.
 
Gemuser
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 2:08 am

Planes4you wrote:
With AA replacing MEL-LAX does that mean that’s QF flight will be moved to DFW?

The flight being replaced by an AA flight is, if the information in this thread is correct, is QF 95/96 which is the second MEL-LAX flight currently running 2 per week, does not leave much capacity for it to be redeployed,especially as said above its going to BNE-ORD.

Gemuser
 
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SeaEagle8
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 2:24 am

[threeid][/threeid]
Gemuser wrote:
Planes4you wrote:
With AA replacing MEL-LAX does that mean that’s QF flight will be moved to DFW?

The flight being replaced by an AA flight is, if the information in this thread is correct, is QF 95/96 which is the second MEL-LAX flight currently running 2 per week, does not leave much capacity for it to be redeployed,especially as said above its going to BNE-ORD.

Gemuser


As stated above, all this is speculation. Neither AA or QF have said anything other than the two new routes. There is nothing that implies what is happening to MEL-LAX. If these a/c are MEL based how can they be redeployed to BNE. Wait to see what the frequencies are going to be and start dates before anything is actually set in stone. Too many variables at play here.
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ZK-NBT
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 2:38 am

SeaEagle8 wrote:
[threeid][/threeid]
Gemuser wrote:
Planes4you wrote:
With AA replacing MEL-LAX does that mean that’s QF flight will be moved to DFW?

The flight being replaced by an AA flight is, if the information in this thread is correct, is QF 95/96 which is the second MEL-LAX flight currently running 2 per week, does not leave much capacity for it to be redeployed,especially as said above its going to BNE-ORD.

Gemuser


As stated above, all this is speculation. Neither AA or QF have said anything other than the two new routes. There is nothing that implies what is happening to MEL-LAX. If these a/c are MEL based how can they be redeployed to BNE. Wait to see what the frequencies are going to be and start dates before anything is actually set in stone. Too many variables at play here.


Speculation is fun that’s what we do here, of course nothing is set in stone until it’s announced by AA/QF, it gets annoying when people start taking speculation as fact and spreading it like some rediculous threads about the 787/A350.

It has been said that AA will likely do 1 new route initially and QF 2, we no the QF ones while the AA one isn’t known publicly yet, there are rumblings however, it’s also known that capacity will be increased on some existing routes.

MEL-SFO could increase at the expense of QF95/96 to LAX or those extra aircraft days could be used to increase frequency ex BNE to ORD.
 
Detroit313
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 2:53 am

AA and Qantas will simply own the market. Good for them.
 
Sydscott
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:48 am

SeaEagle8 wrote:
[threeid][/threeid]
Gemuser wrote:
Planes4you wrote:
With AA replacing MEL-LAX does that mean that’s QF flight will be moved to DFW?

The flight being replaced by an AA flight is, if the information in this thread is correct, is QF 95/96 which is the second MEL-LAX flight currently running 2 per week, does not leave much capacity for it to be redeployed,especially as said above its going to BNE-ORD.

Gemuser


As stated above, all this is speculation. Neither AA or QF have said anything other than the two new routes. There is nothing that implies what is happening to MEL-LAX. If these a/c are MEL based how can they be redeployed to BNE. Wait to see what the frequencies are going to be and start dates before anything is actually set in stone. Too many variables at play here.


Actually they can be re-deployed from MEL to BNE quite easily either through a domestic sector or an international port. (Like QF is currently doing at HKG with the 789 and at LAX with the A380)

And there aren't that many variables at play here. QF only have 8 789's at the moment with 6 on the way but the 6 on the way will be backfilling 747 capacity. QF have said that they will do BNE - SFO and BNE - ORD so if they want to do a combined service of more than 3 or 4 per week on those 2 routes they will need more than the 1 surplus 789 currently flying HKG routes to position up to BNE. That in turn means MEL based aircraft currently doing LHR-PER-MEL-LAX / SFO need to assist in BNE.

So it's merely a frequency question out BNE. If QF are adding more than 3 or 4 services per week then MEL aircraft must assist. If MEL aircraft are needed out of BNE something will need to be reduced out of MEL and that something isn't going to be MEL-PER-LHR. Hence the speculation around the 789 LAX services out of MEL.
 
QF742
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:48 am

Sydscott wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
Sydscott wrote:

Well going through the current QF 789 rotations, and based on previous QF announcements, you currently have:

4 x 789 doing LHR-PER-MEL-LAX/SFO - LHR is daily and LAX started off 6 pw before they mixed SFO in;

4 x 789 doing BNE-LAX-JFK along with various services to Hong Kong.

So from a 789 fleet perspective if QF drops the MEL-LAX on the 789 then they'll need to be able to rotate the 789's to position them back to MEL to do MEL-PER-LHR. So that implies either a BNE-MEL domestic sector for the 789 for positioning on days SFO-MEL doesn't operate or that they will swap aircraft around in SFO. It also means the 789 comes off of Hong Kong so QF basically has 2 789's to cover off BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD. Do the maths on what the availability is for those along with any slackness in the 3 789's doing BNE-LAX-JFK and positioning requirements for MEL-PER-LHR that's how many potential services you have for the new BNE US routes. I'd say you've got a maximum or 7 to 8 frequencies per week available for them and that you'll likely see 3 per week to SFO. So that leaves probably 3 or 4 frequencies per week to ORD.


Qantas is stretching the legs of their 787-9 fleet to the max, sounds like the time is here to excercise some more options for another 6 to 12 planes. What is going to replace he 744 to Santiago and Johannesburg after the 744 retires. Sydney to Haneda is also in need of a 744 replacement. The current answer seems to be the 787-9 unless Qantas orders something else.


I've maintained for a while now that the next 787 order we see from Qantas will be after the QF/AA JBA goes through. QF have another 6 789's on order and coming into the fleet to allow for the retirement of the 744. How are they backfilling capacity? On JNB they were going to deploy an A330 from PER so you'd have daily SYD on the 789 and the reduction in capacity handled by an A330 service from PER. (Which fell over thanks to the fee dispute between PER and QF) That's still the likeliest outcome for JNB.

On HND, QF have already started MEL and BNE to NRT and re-instated SYD-KIX so moving SYD - HND to a 789 or an A330 and doing supplementary services to SYD-NRT, or having JQ do them, would seem the likeliest outcome to make up for an loss of capacity.

The real question is on SCL but I think that has been partially answered by LATAM starting MEL-SCL service. So QF pulling back a bit of capacity on SYD-SCL while maintaining frequency is likely not a bad thing and with the ability to fly to GRU/GIG part of the project sunrise brief medium / long term 787's flying to SCL won't be an issue because you'll have a 2nd entry point to South America.


Qantas will be able to match capacity by increasing frequency. Neither Johannesburg or Santiago are currently daily. The 789 could allow frequency to be increased to daily for both if Qantas wants to. As you mention, QF could also launch PER-JNB to account for some loss in capacity. Also remember that airlines like Qantas care more about yield than capacity, so in some cases they may prefer less capacity because it will mean better yields.

Also re Tokyo - Qantas have also launched a seasonal Sapporo service ex SYD and they may well just make SYD-Tokyo double daily - I could see a 789 to HND (larger business cabin + prem economy) and send a daily 332/333 to NRT.
 
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SeaEagle8
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:31 am

Sydscott wrote:
So it's merely a frequency question out BNE. If QF are adding more than 3 or 4 services per week then MEL aircraft must assist. If MEL aircraft are needed out of BNE something will need to be reduced out of MEL and that something isn't going to be MEL-PER-LHR. Hence the speculation around the 789 LAX services out of MEL.


Exactly. if if if. Too many conclusions are being made about what’s happening. AA MEL-LAX hasn’t even been confirmed by anyone. Sure it’s fun to speculate but all of this is based on conjecture. Until frequencies are established and start dates?
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:45 am

SeaEagle8 wrote:
Sydscott wrote:
So it's merely a frequency question out BNE. If QF are adding more than 3 or 4 services per week then MEL aircraft must assist. If MEL aircraft are needed out of BNE something will need to be reduced out of MEL and that something isn't going to be MEL-PER-LHR. Hence the speculation around the 789 LAX services out of MEL.


Exactly. if if if. Too many conclusions are being made about what’s happening. AA MEL-LAX hasn’t even been confirmed by anyone. Sure it’s fun to speculate but all of this is based on conjecture. Until frequencies are established and start dates?


That’s right, feel free to add your thoughts, exactly it is fun and is based on conjecture, but if we waited for every announcement to be made I think this would be quite a boring place most of the time.
 
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SeaEagle8
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 7:13 am

Agree with that. Speculate with a bit of effort backing up an opinion like the last few posters. Don’t speculate by saying something is in a press release that isn’t even mentioned in it.
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SonaSounds
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 05, 2019 3:13 pm

SeaEagle8 wrote:
SonaSounds wrote:
SeaEagle8 wrote:

I don’t think the “memo” suggests anything about that. No announcements about frequency have been made. I doubt either will be daily. So it’s hard to say at this point how much metal will need to be committed to these new routes.


They literally say they will do this because of the JV tentative approval and AA taking over the LAX-MEL route. How does that not "suggest" that this is where the slack in their fleet for these two new routes came from?


Where in the QF release does it say anything about AA taking over LAX-MEL? It doesn’t. It’s just speculation. There is nothing indicating what the MEL-LAX 789 flying will be used for.

The last few posts make much more sense as the whole fleet / network will probably be adjusted. I’m just saying nothing in the QF press release indicates anything other than the launching of the 2 new routes on QF metal. How that is achieved is still not public.
I would think perhaps 3-4 to SFO and 3-4 to ORD which may be handled with the current BNE based fleet.


I didn't say press release I was referencing the memo that was sent out to Qantas staff re:JV. I am not QF staff but was shared it. I think you assumed that by memo I mean press release. You are correct that the press release does not mention this. I would guess QF is waiting for official approval before making further announcements.

Like all things I will believe it when I see for sale but that is what is being said now.
 
Ishrion
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sun Jun 09, 2019 5:31 am

https://mobile.twitter.com/xJonNYC/stat ... 5768972288

Possible DFW-AKL, as expected... if it happens, wonder if it’ll affect NZ’s IAH flight.
 
Detroit313
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sun Jun 09, 2019 7:08 am

Wow! DFW - AKL would be great!
 
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SeaEagle8
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sun Jun 09, 2019 8:04 am

Is this source an AA source?

So his expectations are LAX-SYD remains a 789 and AA adds LAX-MEL and expands AKL with possible flights from DFW?
NSW based avgeek
 
JQ321
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sun Jun 09, 2019 8:21 am

Detroit313 wrote:
Wow! DFW - AKL would be great!

But it has no source. Nor supported evidence other than rumors.
 
Ishrion
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 19, 2019 2:03 am

https://www.regulations.gov/document?D= ... -0030-0141

JetBlue comments on the JV approval.

They claim to take no position on whether the DOT should or should not make the approval final.
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:26 am

In all honesty, it’s fairly hard for an airline like B6 to speak out too much about trans-Pacific flights that they don’t even come close to competing on.

Given that QF have come out already with announcements for BNE-SFO/ORD, they must be fairly confident it will get final approval.

Thinking outside the box, the only other reason to announce routes already would be as part of a PR strategy if it was to be rejected or watered down. They would then be in a position to try and look like the hard done by party in all this.

One would expect all signs point to full approval though :)
 
jcwr56
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jun 19, 2019 6:09 am

Like when NZ started ORD, discussions started a while back. I’m aware that operational data on taxi time, deicing protocols (if it’s done on stand or not) terminal location already have started.

What’s up next are days and times, given the IATA SC is taking place currently, I’m sure a more finalized schedule will be crafted based on availability at ORD in the event the JV is formally approved.
 
Ishrion
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Fri Jul 19, 2019 8:50 pm

https://www.regulations.gov/document?D= ... -0030-0144

The DOT has given final approval to the JV.
 
x1234
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Fri Jul 19, 2019 9:29 pm

Does the JV only cover Australia & NZ or does it also cover Asia? I think Singapore (QF focus city) could be added to the AA network to broaden OneWorld's focus in SE Asia. (I know LAX-SIN is long but UA said they could do it so...)
 
ZK-NBT
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Fri Jul 19, 2019 9:55 pm

x1234 wrote:
Does the JV only cover Australia & NZ or does it also cover Asia? I think Singapore (QF focus city) could be added to the AA network to broaden OneWorld's focus in SE Asia. (I know LAX-SIN is long but UA said they could do it so...)


SIN via QF? Yes it is long US-SIN but via Australia is much longer again. Not a very direct route via SYD, who do QF codeshare with in Asia, it would be much quicker via JL through NRT/HND.

UA didn’t last long on LAX-SIN due to length of the flight. AA have quite a few more seats on their aircraft.
 
ITSTours
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Fri Jul 19, 2019 10:08 pm

This JV covers North America - Australia/New Zealand. Includes Canada and Mexico but excludes Hawaii and Pacific territories.

Now United and Air New Zealand will definitely include Australia in their JV agreement.
 
Fargo
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Fri Jul 19, 2019 10:12 pm

Hopefully, this means one or both of DFW-MEL and DFW-AKL is on the horizon.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Fri Jul 19, 2019 11:26 pm

Formal final approval issued today.

Airlines have 6-months to commence JV and must comply with terms placed on them (7-year review, reporting requirements, inventory access and/or interline code-share with other airlines including new entrants, refrain from IATA tariff coordination activities, etc)

OST-2018-0030
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
smi0006
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:09 am

Great that final approval has been received - it’s the weekend now in AU, so press release will probs come out next week from both carriers, hopefully we hear a little more from the AA side now? MEL-LAX? I wonder if the 77W will return to SYD?

Future state I do hope we see QF on MEL-DFW.
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:37 am

Expectations
American Airlines
*LAX-SYD returns the Boeing 777-300ER
*will launch LAX-MEL/BNE
*will keep throughout the year LAX-AKL
*Potentially launch DFW-BNE/MEL

Qantas
*will launch BNE-ORD / SFO
*the Airbus A380 withdraws from the DFW and passes to Boeing 787-9
*They will launch MEL-DFW / BNE
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG
 
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chepos
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:23 am

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
Expectations
American Airlines
*LAX-SYD returns the Boeing 777-300ER
*will launch LAX-MEL/BNE
*will keep throughout the year LAX-AKL
*Potentially launch DFW-BNE/MEL

Qantas
*will launch BNE-ORD / SFO
*the Airbus A380 withdraws from the DFW and passes to Boeing 787-9
*They will launch MEL-DFW / BNE


It has been speculated LAX-SYD will remain a 789.


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RyanairGuru
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:54 am

About 6 months ago Doug Parker (IIRC, it might have been Vasu Raja) made some comments about their approach to the Australian market, which appear to have been confirmed by subsequent statements when the JV received interim approval. The short version is that people are expecting way to much in the way of new announcements from AA, Qantas will continue to do much of the heavy lifting in the market.

The original comments were that AA see seasonal opportunities in the Australian market as peak season for USA-Australia is Northern Winter which is the low season for USA-Europe. They can therefore shift capacity between the Atlantic and Pacific on a seasonal basis to maximise revenue.

This is basically the same approach to the one recently adopted by United. I can't remember which new TATL route it was (maybe SFO-AMS?) but at least one poster on this site noted when they announced it that United were scheduling 37/37 for the 788+789 fleet for Summer 2019, and therefore further schedule changes were almost inevitable to allow some slack in the fleet. A couple of months later they reduced frequencies on SYD-LAX/IAH which freed up the equivalent of one 789. It wasn't a direct swap, but in the network planning game of chess they basically moved that plane from Australia to Europe for Northern Summer. Both routes increase in frequency for Northern Winter when Europe is seasonally reduced. This maximises revenue on a year-round basis using their finite assets by seasonally adjusting capacity to follow the money.

This is a long winded way of me saying that I expect the following to occur: QF55/56 and QF95/96 to be cancelled, and AA to seasonally add LAX-MEL and/or LAX-BNE in the Northern Winter (starting from Winter 2020). This way QF fly a base load of capacity year-round and AA add additional capacity for peak season. I would expect AA72/73 to remain a 789 for the time being but could see that being seasonally operated by a 77W for Winter 2020 for the same reasons.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
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chepos
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:10 am

I do see LAX-AKL returning to year round.


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qf789
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:18 am

Qantas press release on final approval on QF/AA joint venture

Both airlines will add codeshares on existing services in coming days

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... ravellers/
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Ishrion
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:38 am

Per JonNYC:

https://twitter.com/xJonNYC/status/1152388425452085250

Announcement should come by October as to what AA/QF will be doing.

my *personal* betting line is still; AA adds DFW-AKL, LAX-MEL, LAX-SYD does not go 77W
 
a7ala
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:39 am

chepos wrote:
I do see LAX-AKL returning to year round.


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Speculation that AA LAX-CHC (I'm guessing seasonal nw) is on the cards and presumably a requirement of the JV in New Zealand.
 
Ishrion
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:39 am

qf789 wrote:
Qantas press release on final approval on QF/AA joint venture

Both airlines will add codeshares on existing services in coming days

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... ravellers/


AA has also announced the final approval: http://news.aa.com/news/news-details/20 ... fault.aspx

Nothing new, though.
 
Planes4you
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 5:39 pm

Fargo wrote:
Hopefully, this means one or both of DFW-MEL and DFW-AKL is on the horizon.



JONNYC did predict DFW-AKL
 
TryToFlySomeday
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sat Jul 20, 2019 8:19 pm

Planes4you wrote:
Fargo wrote:
Hopefully, this means one or both of DFW-MEL and DFW-AKL is on the horizon.



JONNYC did predict DFW-AKL

If JonNYC said AA DFW-AKL is happening, I believe him
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getluv
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sun Jul 21, 2019 2:56 am

a7ala wrote:
chepos wrote:
I do see LAX-AKL returning to year round.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Speculation that AA LAX-CHC (I'm guessing seasonal nw) is on the cards and presumably a requirement of the JV in New Zealand.


It's not a requirement at all. Out of all three countries in scope, NZ is probably the least resistant. Considering NZ/UA's near monopoly on New Zealand/US routes, the NZ market would welcome any form of competition.
I'm that bad type.
 
a7ala
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sun Jul 21, 2019 3:16 am

getluv wrote:
a7ala wrote:
chepos wrote:
I do see LAX-AKL returning to year round.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Speculation that AA LAX-CHC (I'm guessing seasonal nw) is on the cards and presumably a requirement of the JV in New Zealand.


It's not a requirement at all. Out of all three countries in scope, NZ is probably the least resistant. Considering NZ/UA's near monopoly on New Zealand/US routes, the NZ market would welcome any form of competition.


I wouldnt agree with that. The nz govt has become more and more sceptical of these alliances and the value they provide. And they are wanting the benefits of tourism to be spread more around the country and are keen for airlines to expand beyond akl as part of these alliances eg cx's seasonal to chc. It may not be formally written in the agreement but you can bet it will be taken into consideration when the alliance is being reassessed in a few years.
 
Detroit313
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:09 am

Congratulations on the final approval.
 
getluv
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Sun Jul 21, 2019 7:17 am

a7ala wrote:
getluv wrote:
a7ala wrote:

Speculation that AA LAX-CHC (I'm guessing seasonal nw) is on the cards and presumably a requirement of the JV in New Zealand.


It's not a requirement at all. Out of all three countries in scope, NZ is probably the least resistant. Considering NZ/UA's near monopoly on New Zealand/US routes, the NZ market would welcome any form of competition.


I wouldnt agree with that. The nz govt has become more and more sceptical of these alliances and the value they provide. And they are wanting the benefits of tourism to be spread more around the country and are keen for airlines to expand beyond akl as part of these alliances eg cx's seasonal to chc. It may not be formally written in the agreement but you can bet it will be taken into consideration when the alliance is being reassessed in a few years.


The NZ govt is very soft when it comes to regulation. And as I said, NZ/UA have a near monopoly on New Zealand to US flights, even more than what QF/AA have between Australia and the US.

The NZ govt would want a formidable competitor to compete with NZ in order to keep prices low, which you know is not cheap. Any competition will help lower prices on AKL-LAX and more so to the regions even without direct flights.
I'm that bad type.
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Tue Jul 23, 2019 5:35 pm

chepos wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
Expectations
American Airlines
*LAX-SYD returns the Boeing 777-300ER
*will launch LAX-MEL/BNE
*will keep throughout the year LAX-AKL
*Potentially launch DFW-BNE/MEL

Qantas
*will launch BNE-ORD / SFO
*the Airbus A380 withdraws from the DFW and passes to Boeing 787-9
*They will launch MEL-DFW / BNE


It has been speculated LAX-SYD will remain a 789.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Since LAX-LHR goes from 2 B77W to 1 B77W and 1 B77E, there are now more possibilities for the B77W to return between LAX-SYD
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG
 
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mercure1
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Tue Jul 23, 2019 11:44 pm

BNE-SFO eff 9 February 2020 - 3x weekly
BNE-ORD eff 20 April 2020 - 4x weekly


QANTAS FLIGHTS FROM BRISBANE TO CHICAGO AND SAN FRANCISCO OPEN FOR BUSINESS
https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... -business/
mercure f-wtcc
 
Ishrion
Topic Author
Posts: 862
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Re: American Airlines/Qantas Joint Venture Approved

Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:03 am

mercure1 wrote:
BNE-SFO eff 9 February 2020 - 3x weekly
BNE-ORD eff 20 April 2020 - 4x weekly


QANTAS FLIGHTS FROM BRISBANE TO CHICAGO AND SAN FRANCISCO OPEN FOR BUSINESS
https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... -business/



Interesting, February? Wasn’t it originally April? Anyways, congrats to Qantas!

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