SpaceshipDC10
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Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 12:34 pm

After noticing yesterday that AC835 wasn't arriving at YUL, I searched and found out it was cancelled after the aircraft, A333 C-GHKW, had to return to the gate. Replacing flight should have left this morning some five hours ago but only left at noon local time with the Airbus that has landed today.
Now, today's return journey left the gate late with yesterday's aircraft but again had to return. Either it's delayed or cancelled. Being delayed is never fun, but especially when you were hoping to be home or overseas at such time of the year. Wonder if there are any other options left to carry passengers through different routings if necessary.
 
HBJZA
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 2:10 pm

Most certainly some pax were rerouted through JFK and ZRH with LX as they codeshare on that route. And maybe as well through IAD and EWR on UA?
 
HBJZA
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 2:17 pm

Just checked on GVA app and today’s 9am departed at 12:10 and there is another one that says info at 19pm. Maybe yesterday’s and today’s flight both fly today? Anyone has more info?
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:26 pm

HBJZA wrote:
Just checked on GVA app and today’s 9am departed at 12:10 and there is another one that says info at 19pm. Maybe yesterday’s and today’s flight both fly today? Anyone has more info?


The 9am flight was in fact yesterday's flight that got cancelled and rescheduled for this morning as AC2135. The one with info at 19pm is todays flight that had to return to the gate too, same aircraft as yesterday. Per AC's flight status, todays AC835 is cancelled.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:34 pm

HBJZA wrote:
Most certainly some pax were rerouted through JFK and ZRH with LX as they codeshare on that route. And maybe as well through IAD and EWR on UA?


Out of GVA, flights to JFK, EWR and IAD are scheduled one hour or more before AC's flight to YUL. Out of ZRH it's pretty much the same except if there's room and time to catch LX18 to EWR.
 
HBJZA
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 3:40 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
HBJZA wrote:
Most certainly some pax were rerouted through JFK and ZRH with LX as they codeshare on that route. And maybe as well through IAD and EWR on UA?


Out of GVA, flights to JFK, EWR and IAD are scheduled one hour or more before AC's flight to YUL. Out of ZRH it's pretty much the same except if there's room and time to catch LX18 to EWR.

Oh yes you are right! I didn’t think of looking at the schedule. Oops
But thanks for clarification anyway
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 4:25 pm

If I am not mistaken, tonight's AC834 YUL-GVA, and AC835 tomorrow appear to be operated with a 77W, if what's shown on AC's flight status is correct: https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/hom ... 019&fn=835
 
debonair
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:08 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Being delayed is never fun, but especially when you were hoping to be home or overseas at such time of the year. Wonder if there are any other options left to carry passengers through different routings if necessary.


Luckily it happend in Switzerland and not in Canada, so pax are covered with full EU rights. Free accommodation and meals, compensation etc.! Not too bad to stay an extra night in such a beautiful city like GVA, all expanses paid for and receiving 600EUR on top for flying the next day.
 
toltommy
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:31 pm

debonair wrote:
Luckily it happend in Switzerland and not in Canada, so pax are covered with full EU rights. Free accommodation and meals, compensation etc.! Not too bad to stay an extra night in such a beautiful city like GVA, all expanses paid for and receiving 600EUR on top for flying the next day.


Why would pax on a flight operated by a non-EU carrier, departing from a non-EU country (Switzerland) to a non-EU country (Canada), be covered by EU rules. Did the Swiss opt into to EU rules?
A300/A310/A319/A320/A321/A332/A333/707/712/727/732/733/734/735/738/739/752/753/762/763/764/772/789/DC8/DC9-10/30/40/50/MD81/83/87/88/90/L1011-/250/500/CRJ200/440/700/900/EMB135/140/145/170/175/190/328Jet/F70/SF3/BE1/J31
 
skipness1E
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:35 pm

debonair wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Being delayed is never fun, but especially when you were hoping to be home or overseas at such time of the year. Wonder if there are any other options left to carry passengers through different routings if necessary.


Luckily it happend in Switzerland and not in Canada, so pax are covered with full EU rights. Free accommodation and meals, compensation etc.! Not too bad to stay an extra night in such a beautiful city like GVA, all expanses paid for and receiving 600EUR on top for flying the next day.

Switzerland applies EU compensation rules? It’s not in the EU....
 
matt
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 6:56 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
If I am not mistaken, tonight's AC834 YUL-GVA, and AC835 tomorrow appear to be operated with a 77W, if what's shown on AC's flight status is correct: https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/hom ... 019&fn=835


Indeed, it appears that the flight will be operated by C-FJZS, one of AC’s seven 450-seat 777-300s. That is 158 seats more than the 333 (which has 292 seats). So this is in some ways a « recovery » flight which will be able to carry at least some of the stranded passengers.
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM
 
mutu
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 7:33 pm

skipness1E wrote:
debonair wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
Being delayed is never fun, but especially when you were hoping to be home or overseas at such time of the year. Wonder if there are any other options left to carry passengers through different routings if necessary.


Luckily it happend in Switzerland and not in Canada, so pax are covered with full EU rights. Free accommodation and meals, compensation etc.! Not too bad to stay an extra night in such a beautiful city like GVA, all expanses paid for and receiving 600EUR on top for flying the next day.

Switzerland applies EU compensation rules? It’s not in the EU....


I believe it is nonetheless in the EU US open skies agreement as part of its membership of the EEA or whatever
 
mutu
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 7:34 pm

And a such applies EU aviation rules
 
mutu
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 7:34 pm

And a such applies EU aviation rules
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:12 pm

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
If I am not mistaken, tonight's AC834 YUL-GVA, and AC835 tomorrow appear to be operated with a 77W, if what's shown on AC's flight status is correct: https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/hom ... 019&fn=835


The B77W is ready to go! surprising to see it in GVA, only large aircraft of the ME3

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA834/history/20190421/0100Z/CYUL/LSGG
CX - JL - LH - KE - KL - SQ - QR - QF - TG
 
MoonC
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:40 pm

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
If I am not mistaken, tonight's AC834 YUL-GVA, and AC835 tomorrow appear to be operated with a 77W, if what's shown on AC's flight status is correct: https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/hom ... 019&fn=835


The B77W is ready to go! surprising to see it in GVA, only large aircraft of the ME3

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA834/history/20190421/0100Z/CYUL/LSGG


Air China operates the A330-200, Ethiopian Airlines mix between 787-8/-9 + 777-200LR. 1 and a half month from now Kenya 787. Plus the daily Swiss A330. The United 767s too.
Last edited by MoonC on Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
fraT
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:47 pm

The compensation rule does apply in Switzerland and Norway although they are not part of the EU.
 
yyztpa2
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 8:54 pm

mutu wrote:
skipness1E wrote:
debonair wrote:

Luckily it happend in Switzerland and not in Canada, so pax are covered with full EU rights. Free accommodation and meals, compensation etc.! Not too bad to stay an extra night in such a beautiful city like GVA, all expanses paid for and receiving 600EUR on top for flying the next day.

Switzerland applies EU compensation rules? It’s not in the EU....


I believe it is nonetheless in the EU US open skies agreement as part of its membership of the EEA or whatever

What do flights between Switzerland and Canada have to do with EU US Open Skies agreement?
 
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Panagiotis
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:03 pm

Funny how everybody noticed when AC cancel a flight like that. But when Saudia does it the same way, one week before, no one talks about it.

HZ-ASA, an A320 of Saudia, came to GVA from JED on the 14th of April. He was due to leave the same day, but returned to his stand when taxiing and the flight got cancelled.

He was then rescheduled with the same passengers the next day. They boarded the plane, he left the position, and came back again. Same story, flight cancelled.

Until they finally sent an empty A320 on the 16th of April, to bring those passengers directly to MED, as a majority of them were supposed to fly there after JED.

It was certainly fun to see 3 A320 of Saudia at the same time on the ground.

I also found it funny when I heard about Air Canada having the same issue a week after..
 
Airlinerdude
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:11 pm

toltommy wrote:
debonair wrote:
Luckily it happend in Switzerland and not in Canada, so pax are covered with full EU rights. Free accommodation and meals, compensation etc.! Not too bad to stay an extra night in such a beautiful city like GVA, all expanses paid for and receiving 600EUR on top for flying the next day.


Why would pax on a flight operated by a non-EU carrier, departing from a non-EU country (Switzerland) to a non-EU country (Canada), be covered by EU rules. Did the Swiss opt into to EU rules?


EU air passenger rights apply:
...
EU means the 28 EU countries , including Guadeloupe, French Guiana, Martinique, Réunion Island, Mayotte, Saint-Martin (French Antilles), the Azores, Madeira and the Canary Islands as well as Iceland, Norway and Switzerland. It does not include the Faeroe Islands, the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands.


https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/t ... dex_en.htm
 
loveofflying
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 9:27 pm

Full story:
RMKS/FIN 936 RETURNED TO GATE DUE TO REPEAT MTCE ISSUE LH WING
AIR LEAK ISSUE. FLIGHT CANCELLED. PAX PROTECTED 21APR AC835 U
/G FROM A333 TO B777 HD.
And for April 19:
RMKS/FIN 936 RETURNED TO GATE DUE TO AIR LEFT WING LEAK. FLIGH
T CANCELLED DUE TO FURTHER MTCE INVESTIGATION. PAX PROTECTED O
N EXTRA SECTION AD2135 20APR 0900L DEPT.
Fly the DC10 before you can't!
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sat Apr 20, 2019 11:00 pm

matt wrote:
Indeed, it appears that the flight will be operated by C-FJZS, one of AC’s seven 450-seat 777-300s. That is 158 seats more than the 333 (which has 292 seats). So this is in some ways a « recovery » flight which will be able to carry at least some of the stranded passengers.


Right. I don't load the load factors for today and tomorrows flights, but if needed, they can still arrange travel through other ways for those that don't get a seat in that flight.


Panagiotis wrote:
Funny how everybody noticed when AC cancel a flight like that.


Whose everybody?

Panagiotis wrote:
But when Saudia does it the same way, one week before, no one talks about it.


Remember how the AC cancellation became noticed? Was the SV flight scheduled to get to YUL?
 
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Amwest2United
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:33 am

RainerBoeing777 wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
If I am not mistaken, tonight's AC834 YUL-GVA, and AC835 tomorrow appear to be operated with a 77W, if what's shown on AC's flight status is correct: https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/hom ... 019&fn=835


The B77W is ready to go! surprising to see it in GVA, only large aircraft of the ME3

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA834/history/20190421/0100Z/CYUL/LSGG


Since there are no 777 pilots in GVA, I would guess they are in for another overnight delay, unless they pre-positioned a full pilot crew there yesterday.
Life is what happens to you while you making plans to live it!
 
vfw614
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:41 am

For those who don't believe that EU compensation rules apply in Switzerland in principle - from the horse's mouth, the Swiss government:

https://www.bazl.admin.ch/bazl/en/home/ ... ights.html

As an EEA member, Switzerland (like Norway and Iceland) signed up to EU 261/04. However, because of Switzerland not being an EU member state, there is uncertainty whether or not passenger rights only kick in for flights from/to Switzerland to/from another EU/EEA member state or also to/from an non-EEA member state (like Canada). Swiss courts take the view that EU 261/04 has a narrow scope in Swiss law, whereas the regulator (BAZL) takes the view that third countries are covered as well. The problem is that there cannot be a binding decision by the ECJ on the question of law as Switzerland is only an EEA, but not an EU member state. As a result, ECJ decisions do not have a direct effect in Swiss law, but merely serve as non-binding guidance for Swiss courts.
 
matt
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sun Apr 21, 2019 12:14 pm

Amwest2United wrote:
RainerBoeing777 wrote:
SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
If I am not mistaken, tonight's AC834 YUL-GVA, and AC835 tomorrow appear to be operated with a 77W, if what's shown on AC's flight status is correct: https://www.aircanada.com/ca/en/aco/hom ... 019&fn=835


The B77W is ready to go! surprising to see it in GVA, only large aircraft of the ME3

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ACA834/history/20190421/0100Z/CYUL/LSGG


Since there are no 777 pilots in GVA, I would guess they are in for another overnight delay, unless they pre-positioned a full pilot crew there yesterday.


The plane just left GVA, which means that AC positioned a crew there ahead of time.
Next flights: YQM-YUL-MIA-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-LYS-YUL-YQM / YQM-YUL-FRA-MLA-FRA-YUL-YQM
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sun Apr 21, 2019 1:16 pm

matt wrote:
The plane just left GVA, which means that AC positioned a crew there ahead of time.


It left one hour late. As per the crew, AC must either been ready to move before yestrerday's cancellation or quickly put in place the measure of sending the 77W. I suspect the crew came from one of their European destinations served by the type.
 
xorrygva
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:10 pm

The flight was full with 450 pax according to dpts.org.
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Sun Apr 21, 2019 6:40 pm

xorrygva wrote:
The flight was full with 450 pax according to dpts.org.


Not really surprising since an A333 can seat 292 pax. The last time AC flew such large/high capacity aircraft to GVA was during the '80s when they flew there as tag-on from Paris IIRC.

By the way, C-GHKW just left GVA: https://www.flightradar24.com/ACA7051/203d14ec
 
SpaceshipDC10
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Mon Apr 22, 2019 10:36 pm

Here's a nice video from their local spotter of the long bird at GVA: https://youtu.be/MwpkpJAGHQI
 
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XAM2175
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Re: Bad luck for AC's passengers out of GVA

Mon Apr 22, 2019 11:09 pm

Oh wow the raccoon mask works so damn well head-on!

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