T4thH
Posts: 519
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:29 pm

OK, we will know it tomorrow morning, before the stock market in London will start. They will have to announce the result latest around one hour before official start of the market.
Last edited by T4thH on Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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OA260
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:29 pm

Rescue hopes fade as Thomas Cook slides towards collapse
KPMG is being lined up to oversee the insolvency of Thomas Cook’s UK tour operating business, Sky News learns.

Insiders told Sky News that the Official Receiver was expected to be involved in any insolvency process, with KPMG, the big four accountancy firm, handling the administration or liquidation of Thomas Cook's UK tour operating division - which comprises more than 550 high street shops.

AlixPartners is expected to oversee the insolvency of the group's airlines, with the Department for Transport and Civil Aviation Authority co-ordinating the biggest-ever peacetime repatriation of British citizens.

https://news.sky.com/story/rescue-hopes ... e-11817447
Last edited by OA260 on Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
flyjay123
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:32 pm

OA260 wrote:
Rescue hopes fade as Thomas Cook slides towards collapse
KPMG is being lined up to oversee the insolvency of Thomas Cook’s UK tour operating business, Sky News learns.

https://news.sky.com/story/rescue-hopes ... e-11817447


It's probably Alex feeding them with information!
 
AngelsDecay
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:32 pm

https://www.itv.com/news/2019-09-22/tho ... istration/

This link works, however I CANNOT ASSURE if is true or not!!
(hope not)

All the best for our british colleagues.
"Well be thy one,
and wisdom too.
And grew, and joyed in my growth.
From a word to a word, I was lead to a Wyrd.
From a deed, to another deed."
 
smallvoyageur
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:33 pm

According to ITV News, they are preparing for administration. https://www.itv.com/news/2019-09-22/tho ... istration/
 
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OA260
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:36 pm

flyjay123 wrote:
OA260 wrote:
Rescue hopes fade as Thomas Cook slides towards collapse
KPMG is being lined up to oversee the insolvency of Thomas Cook’s UK tour operating business, Sky News learns.

https://news.sky.com/story/rescue-hopes ... e-11817447


It's probably Alex feeding them with information!


Mark Kleinman from Sky News is the source and usually very reliable sadly.
 
smallvoyageur
Posts: 171
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:38 pm

Another notice, this time Las Vegas hotels not accepting TC customers https://twitter.com/AlexInAir/status/11 ... 28512?s=19
 
Kilopond
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:42 pm

The beforementioned A380 9M-MNF, flight MAS8490 is over Czechia now.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:44 pm

This is what happens when you work for an unstable operation. Plenty of legacy & stable ULCC"s in Europe to work for.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
bobradamus
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:45 pm

Anyone identified any of the first positioning flights for the repatriation, that the BBC - well Ben Thompson - has tweeted about?
 
NG263
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:46 pm

Condor is sharing on social media now that they will continue their flight operation, hoping for the best (and LH).
 
T4thH
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:46 pm

smallvoyageur wrote:
Another notice, this time Las Vegas hotels not accepting TC customers https://twitter.com/AlexInAir/status/11 ... 28512?s=19

Please note. Did a hotel regular get email addresses of guests from the travel agencies? Till now (OK, this will pretty sure change on 31-Oct-2019 at 11 pm), UK is still part of the European Union and the data protection laws are still existing.
 
Prost
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:47 pm

This is what happens when you work for an unstable operation. Plenty of legacy & stable ULCC"s in Europe to work for.

I don’t think blaming the TC employees right now is helping the discussion.
Last edited by Prost on Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Salomon
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:47 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
This is what happens when you work for an unstable operation.


Thomas Cook has been around for 178 years.
Takeoffs are optional; landings are mandatory.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:49 pm

Salomon wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
This is what happens when you work for an unstable operation.


Thomas Cook has been around for 178 years.


The travel side of the company, yes. The airline operation is newer and was always pretty unstable.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
findingnema
Posts: 83
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:53 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
This is what happens when you work for an unstable operation. Plenty of legacy & stable ULCC"s in Europe to work for.


With greatest of respect, many of the employees who have been with Thomas Cook for some time pre-date the ULCC competition. From the legacy TCX side, Caledonian Airways was formed in 1988 as a rebrand from British Airtours (itself dating to 1969 as the charter brand of BEA). On the legacy MyTravel side, Airtours International began in 1991, merging in 1993 with Inter European Airways who were formed in 1987. On the continent, Condor was the charter arm of Lufthansa and Premiair was at one time, when it was called Scanair, part owned by SAS. Thomas Cook as a group has been a staple of the tourism industry for over 180 years in the U.K. and internationally through various acquisitions of renowned brands. Taking aside for one moment the huge external factors which have not just rocked Thomas Cook but the whole industry, many of the financial problems since 2011 that the Fosun buyout was meant to help, have only come about since the 2007 merger with Mytravel.
My postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent my employer’s positions, strategies or opinions
 
flyjay123
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:54 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
Salomon wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
This is what happens when you work for an unstable operation.


Thomas Cook has been around for 178 years.


The travel side of the company, yes. The airline operation is newer and was always pretty unstable.



So unstable the airline is profitable!
Last edited by flyjay123 on Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:55 pm

I should have clarified, I'm not saying the company as a whole is/was unstable, I recognize their long history, I'm saying their airline operation is/was unstable. Big difference between working on their travel/hospitality side and working on their airline side.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:55 pm

flyjay123 wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
Salomon wrote:

Thomas Cook has been around for 178 years.


The travel side of the company, yes. The airline operation is newer and was always pretty unstable.



So unstable its profitable!


You tell me, aren't they the ones looking for an emergency loan/could go into administration tonight?
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
T4thH
Posts: 519
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:55 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
Salomon wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
This is what happens when you work for an unstable operation.


Thomas Cook has been around for 178 years.


The travel side of the company, yes. The airline operation is newer and was always pretty unstable.

I can only say something about Condor and Condor was always running pretty well, earning money every year under TC e.g. They did an according job, also the TC group took all win and there was no investment in new jets...

And Condor is old enough and more than well established.
 
a350lover
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:00 pm

What would happen to the Spanish & Swedish AOCs of the group?
 
metroline2006
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:07 pm

It’s another sad loss due to so much uncertainty in the U.K. with poor exchange rates making for even more uncertainty
 
AngelsDecay
Posts: 38
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:08 pm

Does anyone knows if the german division:
"Thomas Cook Aviation GmbH (Ex-Air Berlin Aviation GmbH), IATA »» H3 ; ICAO »» TCN and Callsign NAUTILUS" still operating?
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Cook_Aviation
Tks
Last edited by AngelsDecay on Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:09 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"Well be thy one,
and wisdom too.
And grew, and joyed in my growth.
From a word to a word, I was lead to a Wyrd.
From a deed, to another deed."
 
findingnema
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:08 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
I should have clarified, I'm not saying the company as a whole is/was unstable, I recognize their long history, I'm saying their airline operation is/was unstable. Big difference between working on their travel/hospitality side and working on their airline side.


Again, which part of the airline? In Germany, Condor has always been a very successful leisure airline - whether as the charter offshoot of Lufthansa or after being spun off as the integrated charter airline for C&N Touristic. The Scandinavian op is also, alongside its aligned tour operators, allegedly profitable and there are interested parties if its sold off. In the U.K., any volatility is really only from mergers as the parent company has bought other tour operators who had their own airlines but they haven’t had any instability as far as huge swingeing fleet or base cuts on the TCX side (although did between 2004-2006 on the MYT side, where most of this debt originated).
My postings on this site are my own and don’t necessarily represent my employer’s positions, strategies or opinions
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:12 pm

RobK wrote:
eagles94 wrote:
As I mentioned earlier, somebody on another forum is crew for TC and is flying Lgw-DLM-LGW tonight and has just checked in, maybe it’s not the doomsday scenario we al think as if I remember correctly Monarch cancelled all of their night flights


Check with him again. TCX3W (MT508) and TCX8AG (MT509) flight plans both now cancelled.... ho-hum. All the TCX G- registered flights filed for tomorrow have disappeared and the only TCX ones are the LY-VE* frames. Something afoot behind the scenes?

Someone just smelt the finanical coffee.
you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
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usxguy
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:22 pm

And there it goes...

Inventory in Sabre zero'd out.

27SEP FRI MAN/Z‡1 MCO/EDT-5
1MT 2604 Y0 O0 A0 Z0*MANMCO 940A 200P 332 M 0 MF DC /E
B0 M0 H0 V0 K0 E0 T0 U0 G0 Q0

27SEP FRI MCO/EDT MAN/‡5
1MT 2605 Y0 O0 A0 Z0*MCOMAN 400P 520A‡1 332 M 0 MF DC /E
B0 M0 H0 V0 K0 E0 T0 U0 G0 Q0
2MT 2975 Y0 O0 A0 Z0*MCOLGW 505P 635A‡1 332 M 0 F DC /E
B0 M0 H0 V0 K0 E0 T0 U0 G0 Q0
3MT 1012 Y0 B0 Z0 A0* TFS 200P 625P 32B G 0 J DC /E
M0 O0 J0 H0 P0 R0 V0 I0 K0 D0
xx
 
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usxguy
Posts: 1752
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:25 pm

usxguy wrote:
They are still selling flights in the short term... normally they zap inventory before an announcement is made (you legally can't sell a seat once a decision has been made to stand down flights)

27SEP FRI MAN/Z‡1 MCO/EDT-5
1MT 2604 Y2 O2 A0 Z0*MANMCO 940A 200P 332 M 0 MF DC /E
B4 M4 H4 V4 K4 E4 T3 U0 G0 Q0

27SEP FRI FRA/Z‡2 BWI/EDT-6
1DE/** 2074 B9 M9 H9 V9 K0 FRABWI 240P 545P 332 0 XTQS DCA /E
E0 T0 U0 G0 Q0 L9 W0


And its now zero'd out (MT) -- see above post.
xx
 
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usxguy
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:31 pm

Condor still selling.. so that's a good sign, or they haven't received word yet.

27SEP FRI FRA/Z‡2 PUJ/AST-6
1DE 2228 C4 D4 I2*FRAPUJ 1230P 440P 76W 0 F DCA /E
Y9 O9 A9 B9 M9 H9 V7 K5 E3 T0 U0

25SEP WED YVR/PDT FRA/‡9
1DE 2455 C0 D0 I0 Y0*YVRFRA 530P 1245P‡1 76W 0 XMTF DCA /E
O0 A0 B9 M9 H9 V9 K9 E9 T9 U9
xx
 
Zyklotrop
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:38 pm

usxguy wrote:
Condor still selling.. so that's a good sign, or they haven't received word yet.


According to Condor's Twitter account they'll be continuing flight operations. Press release is still pending at this moment though.

https://twitter.com/Condor/status/1175885838091280386
 
akb88
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:42 pm

Hopefully Condor survives.
 
PlaneInsomniac
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:45 pm

usxguy wrote:
Condor still selling.. so that's a good sign, or they haven't received word yet.

27SEP FRI FRA/Z‡2 PUJ/AST-6
1DE 2228 C4 D4 I2*FRAPUJ 1230P 440P 76W 0 F DCA /E
Y9 O9 A9 B9 M9 H9 V7 K5 E3 T0 U0

25SEP WED YVR/PDT FRA/‡9
1DE 2455 C0 D0 I0 Y0*YVRFRA 530P 1245P‡1 76W 0 XMTF DCA /E
O0 A0 B9 M9 H9 V9 K9 E9 T9 U9


Hilarious reporting by Germany's main news programme (tagesschau) at 8 pm on Sunday night. They featured an aviation expert who said that Condor was fairly independent from TC and that a TC bankruptcy would "not immediately" translate to Condor collapsing. His very next sentence was that he "would however advise against making now bookings" on Condor. Not very confidence inspring :D
Am I cured? Slept 5 hours on last long-haul flight...
 
BOAC1966
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:49 pm

Seem to be 36 MT flights inbound ....nothing outbound!
 
eagles94
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:49 pm

Something very odd about this. There’s no foreign aircraft flying in, there’s no chartered widebodies(apart from a single MAS380) coming in, the repatriation effort is either very half arsed, badly organised, or there isn’t one.
 
EthanMcLean
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:51 pm

eagles94 wrote:
Something very odd about this. There’s no foreign aircraft flying in, there’s no chartered widebodies(apart from a single MAS380) coming in, the repatriation effort is either very half arsed, badly organised, or there isn’t one.

There are 2 eastern 767’s sitting at Shannon ready to go.
 
eagles94
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:54 pm

EthanMcLean wrote:
eagles94 wrote:
Something very odd about this. There’s no foreign aircraft flying in, there’s no chartered widebodies(apart from a single MAS380) coming in, the repatriation effort is either very half arsed, badly organised, or there isn’t one.

There are 2 eastern 767’s sitting at Shannon ready to go.


Okay, 3 aircraft in total......that’s no repatriation operation.
 
CWL757
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:54 pm

eagles94 wrote:
Something very odd about this. There’s no foreign aircraft flying in, there’s no chartered widebodies(apart from a single MAS380) coming in, the repatriation effort is either very half arsed, badly organised, or there isn’t one.

It's not official until 0200. I'd imagine planes are crewed and ready to go as soon as the CAA confirms the administration.
A319, A320, 738, 743, 744, 752, 772, 788, C150, E175, E190, F70, R22
 
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F737NG
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:54 pm

metroline2006 wrote:
It’s another sad loss due to so much uncertainty in the U.K. with poor exchange rates making for even more uncertainty


While it plays a part, TCX woes are due to much more than just 'uncertainty in the UK'.

Namely:
- A long-term consumer shift away from high street travel agents and package holidays to self-made booking online and a la carte choices,
- Pressure from LCCs, particularly Ryanair and easyJet on the short -haul bucket and spade routes.
- A hot summer in 2018 which reduced forward bookings for summer 2019.
- Unsettled political and/or safety environments in Egypt, Tunisia and Turkey dissuading people from booking these destinations.
- Prices of European destinations driven up as a result. Inventory booked-up, but overall customer numbers down and revenue from higher prices not offsetting the lower customer volume?

Good luck to everyone at Thomas Cook. I sincerely hope that job offers will be coming their way soon.
 
DDR
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:56 pm

Here is to hoping that Condor is not affected. Condor is older than I am and ever since I found love for the airlines, Condor has been there. I equate them with Lufthansa as the German airline.
 
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RobK
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:58 pm

BOAC1966 wrote:
Seem to be 36 MT flights inbound ....nothing outbound!


G-TCDD has just filed FPLs for Glasgow to ZTH at 4am and the return back to Glasgow for 12.30pm.

G-TCDL has plans filed for Manchester to Split and return as well.

Those are in addition to a full day of Avion Express's and some SmartLynx's as TCX as well.


Condor is flying as normal tomorrow from flight plan filings, as is the Viking branch.

:scratchchin:
 
T4thH
Posts: 519
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:58 pm

eagles94 wrote:
Something very odd about this. There’s no foreign aircraft flying in, there’s no chartered widebodies(apart from a single MAS380) coming in, the repatriation effort is either very half arsed, badly organised, or there isn’t one.

Please note, "officially" till now everything is still fine. TC is still fine and existing till...

When does the stock market in London starts this morning? Program your alarm clock for one hour and 10 min prior start of the London stock exchange, wait, till it is one hour prior start and read the just announced official press release.

And than the stress and whining will start.

Condor continues its flight operation. We will publish updates on our website shortly http://condor.com

Pretty sure, you can also read an according announcement additional on http://www.condor.com
Last edited by T4thH on Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
eagles94
Posts: 109
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:02 pm

RobK wrote:
BOAC1966 wrote:
Seem to be 36 MT flights inbound ....nothing outbound!


G-TCDD has just filed FPLs for Glasgow to ZTH at 4am and the return back to Glasgow for 12.30pm.

G-TCDL has plans filed for Manchester to Split and return as well.

Those are in addition to a full day of Avion Express's and some SmartLynx's as TCX as well.


Condor is flying as normal tomorrow from flight plan filings, as is the Viking branch.

:scratchchin:




How can Smartlynx and Avion operate a full schedule when all the cabin crew are Thomas Cook employees. It’s only the flight crew who are from the operating carrier.
 
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RobK
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:08 pm

eagles94 wrote:
How can Smartlynx and Avion operate a full schedule when all the cabin crew are Thomas Cook employees. It’s only the flight crew who are from the operating carrier.


Pass! :biggrin:
 
Vapidity
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:56 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:08 pm

You see a lot of people blaming this all on brexit. But to be honest they have been in trouble way before brexit. You have to remember, they almost went into administrative measures way back in 2011, and they have never really recovered. And a lot of people are complaining about the government not paying anything. But you have to look at it, unlike other companies where they sell assets, Thomas Cook, as such doesn’t sell assets, in a way it’s more of a asset storage company for people buying holidays. If you can’t trust someone to hold your money, you won’t give them it, looking at this, a lot of the public will loose trust in them, in all honesty, if they don’t go under today (being Monday) then they will of gone under in the next 2 years. It’s hard to regain trust, which is why the government won’t help. Economically it’s cheaper for them to pay for them closing down now, rather than fund them 200 millions and have to pay the same as what they would now 6 months down the line.
 
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JannEejit
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:08 pm

RobK wrote:
BOAC1966 wrote:
Seem to be 36 MT flights inbound ....nothing outbound!


G-TCDD has just filed FPLs for Glasgow to ZTH at 4am and the return back to Glasgow for 12.30pm.

G-TCDL has plans filed for Manchester to Split and return as well.

Those are in addition to a full day of Avion Express's and some SmartLynx's as TCX as well.


Condor is flying as normal tomorrow from flight plan filings, as is the Viking branch.

:scratchchin:


Yes but come 2am or so ?
 
Sunbao
Posts: 23
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2016 12:27 am

Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:12 pm

RobK wrote:
BOAC1966 wrote:
Seem to be 36 MT flights inbound ....nothing outbound![/quote


Condor is flying as normal tomorrow from flight plan filings, as is the Viking branch.

Well thats expected that those two would keep flying.
 
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RobK
Posts: 3645
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:17 pm

By the way, to put the Hi-fly A380 rumours to bed, it flies back from CDG to Beja tomorrow at 10Z.
 
Gingersnap
Posts: 887
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:23 pm

9M-MNF has touched down at MAN just now.
Flown on: A306 A319/20/21 A332 B732/3/4/5/7/8 B742/4 B752 B762/3 B772/W B788 C152 E195 F70/100 MD-82 Q400
 
scouseflyer
Posts: 2190
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:23 pm

Just listened to some entitled prat on BBC R5 who had a flight only with TC tomorrow whining at the BBC travel expert about the airline not phoning him to tell him that they hadn’t gone bust yet and how was he going to get home from his yachting trip.
He’s the epitome of the problem in that we all all expect to be able to pick and mix holiday elements at discounted prices from 3 or 4 different companies and then expect concierge style service when something goes wrong.
I don’t envy companies like TC from trying to make a living!
 
KingB123
Posts: 76
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:28 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
This is what happens when you work for an unstable operation. Plenty of legacy & stable ULCC"s in Europe to work for.


Aye can think of a few US airliners that also had unstable operations :roll:
King B
 
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Super80Fan
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Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:29 pm

Here's hoping Condor comes out of this strong. They don't deserve to go down.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways

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