Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
BrianDromey
Posts: 2832
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2006 2:23 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:35 am

SCQ83 wrote:
The most affected airports in % would be at this point Reus (10.95% of total PAX in 2018 flew TC), Almería and Tenerife Sur. There is also Lleida Airport which had Thomas Cook charters from the UK and probably is the most affected by far in %. But that airport is managed by Catalonia so it doesn't report to AENA.


Lleida are charters operated for Neilson Holidays. Neilson are a winter/summer activity holiday specialist. They used to be part of TCG but they were sold off about 5 years ago. I imagine Llieda will have the usual London, Manchester, Bristol and Southampton flights and I think Jet2 might be operating in their own right this coming season. The flights have been operated by TCX in the main, but Norwegian, Jet2 and flyBe also operated flights over the years.
 
BOAC1966
Posts: 424
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 6:55 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:38 am

The airline industry particularly those serving the leisure sectors have an appalling financial record dating back to the 1970s with the first big collapse of Clarkson! Few industries have such a bad performance worldwide! Part of the reason is there are few barriers to entry, poor financial stewardship and a general lack of managerial depth to be viable. And yes fickle passengers and vagaries of destinations served! A sad day impacting many .....I hope the much spoken about other possible failure is avoided although should it happen a much needed industry restructuring and improved regulation will follow!
 
User avatar
Super80Fan
Posts: 1622
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2017 4:14 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:38 am

Hope the staff take anything not nailed down to the floor home with them.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
RIP US Airways
 
User avatar
AlexA340B777
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 4:37 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:42 am

ei146 wrote:
Interesting detail from Condor: https://www.condor.com/de/flug-vorberei ... dungen.jsp
Alle Condor Flüge finden planmäßig statt +++ Wichtiger Hinweis für Thomas Cook Gäste

Hinweis für Gäste, die eine Reise mit Thomas Cook, Neckermann, Oeger Tours, Air Marin und Bucher Reisen gebucht haben:

Condor wurde von Ihrem Reiseveranstalter informiert, dass eine Gewährleistung zur Durchführung Ihrer Reise heute und morgen nicht gegeben ist. Wir dürfen Sie daher für Ihren Flug nicht annehmen, was uns außerordentlich leid tut.


The flights still go, but passengers who booked with one of the Thomas Cook branches are not accepted.


So I assume the majority of passengers would be those who booked a package deal with TC, Condor planes likely operating very empty then I guess?
6 continents, 85 countries, 748 flights, 90 airlines, 37 aircraft types
 
T4thH
Posts: 1130
Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2019 11:17 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:54 am

T4thH wrote:
Last five Thomas Cook jets in the air on the regular flight/way home to UK. Verify fast, these will be the last.regular flights. The last will be home in 2:45 h
https://uk.flightaware.com/live/fleet/TCX
Normal duty for Condor., now many are on their way out and on the way back.
https://de.flightaware.com/live/fleet/CFG


Empty sky, now they are all home Thomas Cook airways.
https://uk.flightaware.com/live/fleet/TCX
 
jules48
Posts: 25
Joined: Sat Nov 01, 2008 4:25 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:55 am

Malaysian A380,s and Eastern 767,s involved aswell for Manchester I believe
 
Jetty
Posts: 1357
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 12:27 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:55 am

Boeing74741R wrote:
I can see where you're coming from about not diversifying the stores. A few doors down from their store in the Trafford Centre is a Virgin Holidays store. Straight away this store entices you in with a free drink from the bar by the front door, they also have samples of VS' PE and Upper seats to try as well as a virtual reality room so people can sample for themselves what they can get. It's one way of keeping stores relevant in an era where there's a modal shift towards doing everything online and being less reliant on 'bricks and mortar'.

Britain seems a bit behind on other parts of the western world when it comes to online business seeing that a brand with over 500 stores managed to survive this long, but stores aren't going to be the place to buy a package holiday regardless of whether they are diversified.
 
ei146
Posts: 314
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 9:54 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:58 am

AlexA340B777 wrote:
ei146 wrote:
Interesting detail from Condor: https://www.condor.com/de/flug-vorberei ... dungen.jsp
Alle Condor Flüge finden planmäßig statt +++ Wichtiger Hinweis für Thomas Cook Gäste

Hinweis für Gäste, die eine Reise mit Thomas Cook, Neckermann, Oeger Tours, Air Marin und Bucher Reisen gebucht haben:

Condor wurde von Ihrem Reiseveranstalter informiert, dass eine Gewährleistung zur Durchführung Ihrer Reise heute und morgen nicht gegeben ist. Wir dürfen Sie daher für Ihren Flug nicht annehmen, was uns außerordentlich leid tut.


The flights still go, but passengers who booked with one of the Thomas Cook branches are not accepted.


So I assume the majority of passengers would be those who booked a package deal with TC, Condor planes likely operating very empty then I guess?


I know that other tour operators book Condor flights, even TUI does. Also nowadays quite a few people book directly with the airline. But I don't know the numbers. I can imagine that there are many empty seats today.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5827
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:04 am

Jetty wrote:
Britain seems a bit behind on other parts of the western world when it comes to online business seeing that a brand with over 500 stores managed to survive this long, but stores aren't going to be the place to buy a package holiday regardless of whether they are diversified.


Not really. For instance, e-commerce expense per capita is substantially higher in the UK than in Germany or France.

It is just that the air holiday market in the UK is much bigger than in FR/Germany for obvious geographic reasons (the UK is an island, so driving to a Mediterranean destination is much less likely). Spain-UK is the busiest air market in Europe if not in the world.
 
Arion640
Posts: 3162
Joined: Fri Mar 31, 2017 5:15 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:10 am

Very sad. Same feeling as when concorde was taken out of service.
 
Lewton
Posts: 149
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2019 12:46 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:25 am

scouseflyer wrote:
Just listened to some entitled prat on BBC R5 who had a flight only with TC tomorrow whining at the BBC travel expert about the airline not phoning him to tell him that they hadn’t gone bust yet and how was he going to get home from his yachting trip.
He’s the epitome of the problem in that we all all expect to be able to pick and mix holiday elements at discounted prices from 3 or 4 different companies and then expect concierge style service when something goes wrong.
I don’t envy companies like TC from trying to make a living!

Excuse me, if TC does not want people to buy only some elements of their product range then they should not offer them separately.
The guy bought something that TC was selling to him.
From Hamburg with love.
 
StdTank80002
Posts: 40
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2019 10:42 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:25 am

Not sure how Jet2 online prices are worked out, whether it is done by an automatic algorithm based on demand or if this has been done intentionally, but some routes prices have jumped by over 100%, some even further. Same with a friend who was due to fly to LA with Thomas Cook in October, price now being quoted by Virgin is over £4000 return.
 
User avatar
TheLion
Posts: 691
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 1:14 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:26 am

Deeply saddened by the demise of Thomas Cook. Thoughts are with their hardworking staff and stranded customers, for whom this will be a distressing experience.

I do hope Condor & TC’s Scandinavian brands will be saved from following their parent into liquidation. They do appear viable as standalone entities so we should soon find out.

Further to what others have said upthread, I fervently hope there will be no more airline failures this year. The choice is already seriously diminished by TC, Monarch & flybmi going under in the UK, plus Primera, Aigle Azur, Germania, XL and others in Europe, events that will reduce competition in the industry while putting more loyal employees out into the job market, so creating downward pressure on wages.

With Brexit and global economic headwinds blowing our way, the immediate future is worrying for the travel industry.
Last edited by TheLion on Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
asdf
Posts: 708
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2014 12:03 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:29 am

Super80Fan wrote:
Hope the staff take anything not nailed down to the floor home with them.


very strange comment, isnt it?

under pretty all european employee regulations employees ALWAYS get their full salary in case of bancrupt of the employer
it may take a few weeks but they get all wwhat they are supposed to get, including surcharges and else
- from the mandatory insurance the employer has to pay for each employee, or
- from a goverment fund for such cases

to take property which is already owned by the creditors seems not a good idea
not from a legally point of few, neither from a morally, because one affected takes it from another affected

But it has given a pretty good look at your way of thinking .....
 
User avatar
AlexA340B777
Posts: 163
Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 4:37 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:31 am

How about those who have booked a holiday in the next months, but not yet paid the final balance which is due about 1 month prior departure.

Does this final balance still need to be paid as a contract has been made between them and TC? Or the payment can be cancelled, as the contract will surely not be fulfilled?
6 continents, 85 countries, 748 flights, 90 airlines, 37 aircraft types
 
User avatar
OA260
Posts: 24895
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:50 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:31 am

StdTank80002 wrote:
Not sure how Jet2 online prices are worked out, whether it is done by an automatic algorithm based on demand or if this has been done intentionally, but some routes prices have jumped by over 100%, some even further. Same with a friend who was due to fly to LA with Thomas Cook in October, price now being quoted by Virgin is over £4000 return.


Yes one of the downsides for the consumer will be higher prices and airlines will seek to get whatever they can in terms of revenue its business sadly. Same when there is a football trip they jack up prices.
 
User avatar
OA260
Posts: 24895
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:50 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:34 am

AlexA340B777 wrote:
How about those who have booked a holiday in the next months, but not yet paid the final balance which is due about 1 month prior departure.

Does this final balance still need to be paid as a contract has been made between them and TC? Or the payment can be cancelled, as the contract will surely not be fulfilled?



If you have a future booking and have not traveled yet

If, however, you booked an ATOL-protected holiday with Thomas Cook but your flights are with an airline unrelated to the Thomas Cook Group, your flights may still be available, but your accommodation and transfers may not be. For more information see below.

https://thomascook.caa.co.uk/customers/ ... veled-yet/
 
MartijnNL
Posts: 1016
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2017 11:44 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:36 am

StdTank80002 wrote:
Not sure how Jet2 online prices are worked out, whether it is done by an automatic algorithm based on demand or if this has been done intentionally, but some routes prices have jumped by over 100%, some even further. Same with a friend who was due to fly to LA with Thomas Cook in October, price now being quoted by Virgin is over £4000 return.

I am sure you can still fly from the United Kingdom to Los Angeles in October for way less than £4000. Does your friend have to fly on a specific route on a specific day and on a specific time?
 
leghorn
Posts: 1297
Joined: Sun Jan 22, 2017 9:13 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:39 am

GB £ was at US $1.47 on Brexit vote day on 23rd June 2016.
It never got back near that in the last three years.
When your main centre of interest in the UK and you are buying inputs to your business in Dollars and Euro that doesn't give you the oxygen to breath when your business needs to handle a step change like the move by Consumers to internet bookings of flights and accommodation.
 
User avatar
NearMiss
Posts: 190
Joined: Sun May 22, 2016 5:10 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:41 am

If I'd been the captain on that last Thomas Cook flight I would've been sobbing my guts out while speaking to Manchester tower and passengers.
"There is an art, it says, or rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
 
StdTank80002
Posts: 40
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2019 10:42 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:43 am

MartijnNL wrote:
StdTank80002 wrote:
Not sure how Jet2 online prices are worked out, whether it is done by an automatic algorithm based on demand or if this has been done intentionally, but some routes prices have jumped by over 100%, some even further. Same with a friend who was due to fly to LA with Thomas Cook in October, price now being quoted by Virgin is over £4000 return.

I am sure you can still fly from the United Kingdom to Los Angeles in October for way less than £4000. Does your friend have to fly on a specific route on a specific day and on a specific time?


Well yes, this is for specific Manchester to Las Vegas direct, which already generally has a higher price. But the flights were not that price before, which was the point I was making. October half term in the UK as well which does not help. I have suggested that they might have to abandon the direct flight if they want a reasonable price.
 
JoshM01
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2019 1:08 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 9:54 am

having had a look through the caa website, it appears that malaysian aircraft (presumably the a380) will be used on palma to manchester flights, starting with mh991 this evening

https://thomascook.caa.co.uk/customers/ ... september/
 
simonriat
Posts: 174
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2010 8:03 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:09 am

Can anyone tell me what the reg was of the last TCX a330 to land at Manchester?
 
716131
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 11:51 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:12 am

9M-MNF of MH is heading to MAN because to take stranded passengers. I saw MNF on FR24 is positioning KUL-MAN.
If it's not Boeing, I'm not going!
 
User avatar
OA260
Posts: 24895
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:50 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:14 am

simonriat wrote:
Can anyone tell me what the reg was of the last TCX a330 to land at Manchester?


G-MLJL
 
User avatar
OA260
Posts: 24895
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:50 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:14 am

SQ789 wrote:
9M-MNF of MH is heading to MAN because to take stranded passengers. I saw MNF on FR24 is positioning KUL-MAN.


Heading to PMI


Date 23 September
Flight code MH991
Departure airport Palma De Mallorca (PMI)
Arrival airport Manchester (MAN)
Departure time (local) 19:40
Arrival time (local) 21:30
 
clipperlondon
Posts: 87
Joined: Sun Jan 27, 2019 4:43 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:22 am

Just seen some pics on the BBC news of loads of TC aircraft parked up on remote stands at MAN. Interestingly, the Malaysian 380 is also in the same parking area.Such a sad end for a 178 - year old company, the oldest Travel Company in the world.
 
melpax
Posts: 2089
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 12:13 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:22 am

asdf wrote:
Super80Fan wrote:
Hope the staff take anything not nailed down to the floor home with them.


very strange comment, isnt it?

under pretty all european employee regulations employees ALWAYS get their full salary in case of bancrupt of the employer
it may take a few weeks but they get all wwhat they are supposed to get, including surcharges and else
- from the mandatory insurance the employer has to pay for each employee, or
- from a goverment fund for such cases

to take property which is already owned by the creditors seems not a good idea
not from a legally point of few, neither from a morally, because one affected takes it from another affected


It's not unusual for Administrators/Recievers in Australia to have security on hand to protect against theft & sabotage, especially if there was little warning to staff.

There's a youtube video of a news report on Ansett the day before they went into Administration, which showed workshop staff taking away their personal tools in case they were locked out by the Administrators.

I remember TC having a decent shopfront presence in Australia as well, I booked my first flight thru them in the late 90's. All the Australian TC outlets were sold off & rebranded in around 2000. Flight Centre is now the 'iconic' brand here, with STA a distant second. Though I find that STA's service is much better than Fright Centre.
 
David_itl
Posts: 6436
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2001 7:39 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:23 am

The A380 leaving MAN about 14.30ish i believe to go to PMI having arrived at about 00.15 this morning from KUL.
 
vfw614
Posts: 3884
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 12:34 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:30 am

AlexA340B777 wrote:
ei146 wrote:
Interesting detail from Condor: https://www.condor.com/de/flug-vorberei ... dungen.jsp
Alle Condor Flüge finden planmäßig statt +++ Wichtiger Hinweis für Thomas Cook Gäste

Hinweis für Gäste, die eine Reise mit Thomas Cook, Neckermann, Oeger Tours, Air Marin und Bucher Reisen gebucht haben:

Condor wurde von Ihrem Reiseveranstalter informiert, dass eine Gewährleistung zur Durchführung Ihrer Reise heute und morgen nicht gegeben ist. Wir dürfen Sie daher für Ihren Flug nicht annehmen, was uns außerordentlich leid tut.


The flights still go, but passengers who booked with one of the Thomas Cook branches are not accepted.


So I assume the majority of passengers would be those who booked a package deal with TC, Condor planes likely operating very empty then I guess?


No. According to German media, only 30 per cent of all Condor passengers are TC customers. I suppose that is the reason why Condor is so bullish about staying in the market. They are much less dependent on TC customers than TCX or Thomas Cook Nordic.

There reason why Condor is not allowed to accept TC customers is pretty obvious: The Condor flight is only part of the travel package and all others parts will not be available upon arrival (hotel, transfer etc.), therefore it is pointless to fly passengers to a place where they will be stranded anyway.
 
716131
Posts: 892
Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 11:51 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:31 am

Anyone knows other planes that will rescue remaining TC passengers that are stranded.
If it's not Boeing, I'm not going!
 
ktof
Posts: 51
Joined: Sun Nov 29, 2015 11:31 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:32 am

Really sad news, I have 5 or 6 friends who are/were employed by TCX and they are all heartbroken. Can't imagine what they're going through right now.
Last edited by ktof on Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
User avatar
OA260
Posts: 24895
Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 8:50 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:33 am

SQ789 wrote:
Anyone knows other planes that will rescue remaining TC passengers that are stranded.


Yes full list at the CAA website lots of airlines and different aircraft types as I posted above.

Link here to all flights :

https://thomascook.caa.co.uk/customers/ ... stination/
 
Lewton
Posts: 149
Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2019 12:46 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:50 am

vfw614 wrote:
There reason why Condor is not allowed to accept TC customers is pretty obvious: The Condor flight is only part of the travel package and all others parts will not be available upon arrival (hotel, transfer etc.), therefore it is pointless to fly passengers to a place where they will be stranded anyway.

This makes sense obviously.
At the same time, is Condor allowing TC customers to board their return flight?
From Hamburg with love.
 
FB330
Posts: 111
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2016 9:46 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 10:51 am

Thomas Cook is a true historic brand in the UK and I'm gutted for all involved in their collapse.

Is the airline just a few years old? I think it started mid 2000's (so maybe 15 years old in its current form) and made up of various mergers and acqusitions; including Mytravel (Airtours), Flying Colours, Calendonian (JMC), Airworld? I bet the family tree of what makes up TC Airline is quite complicated.
 
vfw614
Posts: 3884
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 12:34 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:02 am

Lewton wrote:
vfw614 wrote:
There reason why Condor is not allowed to accept TC customers is pretty obvious: The Condor flight is only part of the travel package and all others parts will not be available upon arrival (hotel, transfer etc.), therefore it is pointless to fly passengers to a place where they will be stranded anyway.

This makes sense obviously.
At the same time, is Condor allowing TC customers to board their return flight?


According to the media: Yes.

And it is not only Condor that is refusing to fly Thomas Cook customers from Germany to the beaches. Other airlines, e.g. Eurowings, do the same. Which apparently is causing some confusion among the more intellectually challenged punters who have difficulties understanding the concept of a package holiday booked with a Thomas Cook-group tour operator that involves a flight onboard an aircraft that has not Thomas Cook written on it.
Last edited by vfw614 on Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
akb88
Posts: 169
Joined: Sat Feb 09, 2019 2:44 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:04 am

 
sandyb123
Posts: 976
Joined: Mon Oct 15, 2007 9:29 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:07 am

Hi Fly HFM311P is on the move at CDG. Is that a rescue or something else? Destination unknown to FR24. Sandyb123
Member of the mile high club
 
EthanMcLean
Posts: 16
Joined: Sat Aug 19, 2017 8:26 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:10 am

sandyb123 wrote:
Hi Fly HFM311P is on the move at CDG. Is that a rescue or something else? Destination unknown to FR24. Sandyb123

Apparently it’s repositioning back to Beja
 
FW200
Posts: 69
Joined: Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:35 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:17 am

AlexA340B777 wrote:
ei146 wrote:
The flights still go, but passengers who booked with one of the Thomas Cook branches are not accepted.


So I assume the majority of passengers would be those who booked a package deal with TC, Condor planes likely operating very empty then I guess?


According to this article on average less than 20 % TC-package customers on Condor-flights:
https://www.airliners.de/condor-thomas-cook-kunden/51955


Lewton wrote:
vfw614 wrote:
There reason why Condor is not allowed to accept TC customers is pretty obvious: The Condor flight is only part of the travel package and all others parts will not be available upon arrival (hotel, transfer etc.), therefore it is pointless to fly passengers to a place where they will be stranded anyway.

This makes sense obviously.
At the same time, is Condor allowing TC customers to board their return flight?


Yes. See article quoted above and:

»Condor has been informed by your tour operator that unfortunatly your flight will not be carried out as planned today or tomorrow. Therefore, it is with are sincerest apologies that we will not be able to accept on for your outbound flight. You can board your return flight as planned
https://www.facebook.com/58867199966/posts/10151116278804967?sfns=mo
 
Boeing74741R
Posts: 1450
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 5:44 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:21 am

SCQ83 wrote:
Jetty wrote:
Britain seems a bit behind on other parts of the western world when it comes to online business seeing that a brand with over 500 stores managed to survive this long, but stores aren't going to be the place to buy a package holiday regardless of whether they are diversified.


Not really. For instance, e-commerce expense per capita is substantially higher in the UK than in Germany or France.

It is just that the air holiday market in the UK is much bigger than in FR/Germany for obvious geographic reasons (the UK is an island, so driving to a Mediterranean destination is much less likely). Spain-UK is the busiest air market in Europe if not in the world.


Additionally (to answer the store question), it's not as easy as Thomas Cook deciding they will close dozens of stores right away due to leases, cost of making staff redundant, risk of losing presence in some towns to TUI and independent agents etc.

StdTank80002 wrote:
MartijnNL wrote:
StdTank80002 wrote:
Not sure how Jet2 online prices are worked out, whether it is done by an automatic algorithm based on demand or if this has been done intentionally, but some routes prices have jumped by over 100%, some even further. Same with a friend who was due to fly to LA with Thomas Cook in October, price now being quoted by Virgin is over £4000 return.

I am sure you can still fly from the United Kingdom to Los Angeles in October for way less than £4000. Does your friend have to fly on a specific route on a specific day and on a specific time?


Well yes, this is for specific Manchester to Las Vegas direct, which already generally has a higher price. But the flights were not that price before, which was the point I was making. October half term in the UK as well which does not help. I have suggested that they might have to abandon the direct flight if they want a reasonable price.


In the case of MAN-LAS and MAN-LAX, VS are now the sole operator on that route albeit seasonally.

ktof wrote:
Really sad news, I have 5 or 6 friends who are/were employed by TCX and they are all heartbroken. Can't imagine what they're going through right now.


My thoughts go out to your friends. I hope they find new jobs very soon.

FB330 wrote:
Thomas Cook is a true historic brand in the UK and I'm gutted for all involved in their collapse.

Is the airline just a few years old? I think it started mid 2000's (so maybe 15 years old in its current form) and made up of various mergers and acqusitions; including Mytravel (Airtours), Flying Colours, Calendonian (JMC), Airworld? I bet the family tree of what makes up TC Airline is quite complicated.


The name "Thomas Cook Airlines" dates back to 2003 when they rebranded JMC Airways which was only formed 3 years prior through a merger of Flying Colours and Caledonian, with the last big change being the MyTravel acquisition in 2008. It's certainly a fascinating history and such a shame it's all come to an end in these circumstances. :cry:
 
musman9853
Posts: 961
Joined: Mon May 14, 2018 12:30 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:32 am

eagles94 wrote:
VS4ever wrote:
eagles94 wrote:

The MAS 380 is taxiing in KUL, destination N/A


Well it’s on it’s way somewhere as MH8490 which is clearly not a regular flight number, but as it’s 13 hours from KUL, not getting there by 6pm local time for sure. As I type running through 18,000ft.
Source: flightradar24 but can’t copy a link I am afraid.


It’ll here to the U.K. for around midnight which unfortunately is “ideal” for the CAA. Let’s hope it’s off to do a hajj charter or something


Hajj was 2 months ago lol
Welcome to the City Beautiful.
 
Gulfstream500
Posts: 478
Joined: Sat Oct 20, 2018 2:30 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:46 am

Uck! Fares are going to go up even higher than before... as if losing WOW was enough!

Here’s who is left:
- Norwegian
- TAP Portugal
- WestJet (on a whole five destinations!)
- LEVEL (if Norwegian goes bust, they’ll get dissolved into Iberia, Aer Lingus, and BA)
So... when will the Northwest DC-9s be retired?
 
User avatar
jfklganyc
Posts: 6139
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:31 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:52 am

330 still parked on T4 ramp at JFK this morning.

I would upload a picture but this site makes that a pain in the behind so use your imagination.

Sad end
 
User avatar
aemoreira1981
Posts: 3687
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:17 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 11:57 am

jfklganyc wrote:
330 still parked on T4 ramp at JFK this morning.

I would upload a picture but this site makes that a pain in the behind so use your imagination.

Sad end


If not for UN Week, OY-VKF would likely have been towed to a remote stand.
 
User avatar
jfklganyc
Posts: 6139
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:31 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:02 pm

That is not for UN week.

UN planes park by the deice pad.
 
BDKLEZ
Posts: 1796
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 11:57 am

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:02 pm

Simply a damn shame. Regardless of the circumstances, it's a sad day in the world of aviation/travel/tourism and business in general.
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
TC957
Posts: 3924
Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:12 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:03 pm

Super80Fan wrote:
Hope the staff take anything not nailed down to the floor home with them.

TC retail staff have been told not to enter their shops. I went to my local TC shop early this morning assuring staff they had a future in travel with the homeworking travel company I'm with and was told this, instead they had to go to the manager's home and await a conference call.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 8767
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Thomas Cook Bankruptcy Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:05 pm

Gulfstream500 wrote:
Uck! Fares are going to go up even higher than before... as if losing WOW was enough!

Here’s who is left:
- Norwegian
- TAP Portugal
- WestJet (on a whole five destinations!)
- LEVEL (if Norwegian goes bust, they’ll get dissolved into Iberia, Aer Lingus, and BA)


Do you need somebody to explain market economics to you?

Thomas Cook went into administration because they ran out of money. On a long-term basis their fares and load factors didn't cover costs on the routes and frequencies they chose to fly!

If you don't want the market to set prices, routes and frequencies, who do you suggest do this? Are you aware of the scale of price declines seen in the U.S. and Europe two decades after deregulation of the industry?

Yes, removing capacity will allow average prices to go up. That will strengthen the balance sheets of remaining carriers and perhaps lessen the likelihood that one (or more) of them goes into administration, too. One would struggle to argue that a carrier the size of Thomas Cook Airlines (34 aircraft per planespotters.net), or WOW (23 aircraft) provides essential competition across Europe given the size of Ryanair (419 aircraft), Easyjet (165) or Wizz (108).
 
azz767
Posts: 151
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2016 9:08 am

Re: Thomas Cook Airlines News and Discussion Thread

Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:05 pm

danipawa wrote:
juliuswong wrote:

The collapse will pushed 116 aircraft into the used aircraft market. Breakdown would be, according to planespotters.net:
16 A320
57 A321
12 A330
15 B757
16 B767


But lot of those ac are very old, so might be end like scrapp...let see who can get those B753, B767 can get second life as Freigthers


Actually they aren't too old at all. Three of the A330's are just over 10 years old (TCX*) and would be prime for VS to pick up and expand at MAN, three to four more are the perfect amount as well for VS as you wouldn't want overkill.
Furthermore UK at least 15 A321's are between 3-6 years old and were delivered to TCX group from new. I'm sure these will be able to find a new home relatively easily. The remainder are 16,19 or 20 years old so the 16 year old ones should have some life in them yet, and the 19/20 year olds could find homes with Avion, Smartlynx, Olympus etc.
The 757/767 are with Condor and for now they appear to be continuing operations as normal.
The older A330's I agree will struggle to find a new home but as a short term solution for someone there is always hope.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos