wnflyguy
Posts: 1652
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:58 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 2:22 pm

enilria wrote:
wnflyguy wrote:
enilria wrote:
I'll give them credit. The pattern is quite good. We'll see if they maintain it. They have a reputation of letting the pattern morph into an unbalanced schedule of all mornings or something similar. If they maintain this pattern they will grab some good market share.

Interestingly, even though WN is known for multi-stop flights, looking at the current schedule, none of the flights continue onward to California. The plane just goes back and forth on this route and rotates on the RON. So, while I think they will do well on the locals with this pattern, I don't see how they can compete with HA without at least through passengers. Maybe that will change later on? That's when it will get harder to maintain the local pattern.


In Oct 2019 the first morning flight KOA-HNL #1853 same plane has a 105 min connection/ Etops turn to Flight HNL-OAK #4996
2nd morning KOA-HNL #443 flight same plane 105 min connection/Etops turn to flight HNL-SJC #4980.
First OAK-HNL flight 808 is now a One stop 50 min stop no plane change thru flight to KOA.
SJC-HNL flight #792 has a 110min connection to HNL-KOA #1869.
Sources from my Hawaii trip said that 792 will be a one stop thru flight to LIH in Oct.

Since the east bound flights all require a ETOPS preparation nothing will be a thru flight to the mainland.
But it will give those passengers time to use the New HNL WN gate area restrooms,charging stations,Starbucks and Kona Brewing before the treak to the mainland.
It also eliminates the switching of seats on ground time by the thru passengers taking away prime seats options from Business select and A List customers going on the long haul. It's a ongoing problem on the mainland flights today.

Sounds like ITO is going to happening sometime in 2020 with the same 4 Daily inter island flight schedule times as KOA.

I think as the MAX8 returns to service freeing up the ETOPS NG800 cities like LAX,SAN,PDX,LAS and PHX will Get Added. This will add more aircraft For WN to grow inter island flights from HNL only to around 6 each day from HNL-OGG/KOA/LIH/ITO. 24 daily inter island flights.
I don't see anything beyond that from WN.
So HA will keep it's monopoly on other inter island flights like OGG-KOA or LIH-KOA ect ect.

Flyguy

Hey, thanks for correcting me, but what you have posted is not the published schedule for today or yesterday when I posted this. I'm not sure where you are getting that schedule. Today's schedule shows flight 808 arriving at 1045 into HNL. Flight 4100 from OGG arrives at 1055. There is a 1210 to OGG flight 4231 and there is a flight to OAK at 1245 flight 2369. There is no through flight.


I used October 21 2019 on Southwest.com as a reference for my posting.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
frmrCapCadet
Posts: 2848
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 8:24 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 2:54 pm

I think a review of the impact of European civilization on Hawaii would not find it was the tourists who are at fault.
Buffet: the airline business...has eaten up capital...like..no other (business)
 
mcdu
Posts: 1493
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:23 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 4:57 pm

Silver1SWA wrote:
DarthLobster wrote:
tphuang wrote:
I think HA is in a lot of trouble.


I’m sure everyone in Hawaii remembers what go! did to Aloha in similar circumstances, and it’s a safe bet there are very few WN loyalists amongst the locals. The tourists (well, the cheap ones) won’t care but the locals just might not look kindly on what WN is trying to do to HA.


The locals are tired of Hawaiian’s high inter-island fares and welcome the competition.


No we aren’t. I have a home here and lots of locals are friends. If anything this is making the locals more loyal to HA. There is great desire to preserve Hawaiian companies and Southwest is looked at like the outsider here. It is fine for the flip flop, t-shirt clad tourist that want to say “Aloha” and feel like they are speaking a different language. But the locals are not tired of Hawaiian.
 
mcdu
Posts: 1493
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:23 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 4:59 pm

Silver1SWA wrote:
77H wrote:
Jshank83 wrote:

State government can block an airlines expansion? Wouldn't that be illegal, especially towards a US airline? Honest question, I have no clue.


Not directly no. But all major airports in Hawaii are owned by and operated by the state and could make it very difficult for WN to expand. Both HNL and OGG are gate constrained through much of the day. Limiting WN’s access to gates would be an effective way to block expansion covertly.

77H


This is already happening in some ways. They’re definitely making WN play by their rules.



An example please. Or is it just that shark eating the little fish in the fancy ETOPS planning area in OAK that is your reference?
 
chrisair
Posts: 2035
Joined: Fri Sep 01, 2000 11:32 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 5:38 pm

77H wrote:
Besides, plenty of locals disrespect the ā’ina by littering, graffitiing, etc... If we want visitors to respect our home, we must lead by example.

77H


100% agree with you.

mcdu wrote:
It is fine for the flip flop, t-shirt clad tourist that want to say “Aloha” and feel like they are speaking a different language. But the locals are not tired of Hawaiian.


You local? I have my doubts, but whatever.

As for the locals, it depends on who you ask, and what circles you run in, brah. The locals I know are happy to have WN.

airbazar wrote:
As for the turtles it's a bit of a double standard considering the locals don't seem to have a problem in owning beach front property which is the single biggest cause of death for sea turtles.


Definitely true, but I think there's more of an awareness now about the loss of turtle habitat amongst the locals and natives than there was 10-20 years ago. Besides, most natives and many locals can't afford the beachfront property, especially on the main islands.

Of course, now my diatribe is taking this way off course, so I'll go back to my hiding spot. Hawaii's a wonderful place. If anyone doesn't feel safe there, please don't go.
 
INFINITI329
Posts: 2426
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 12:53 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 6:25 pm

wnflyguy wrote:
enilria wrote:
I'll give them credit. The pattern is quite good. We'll see if they maintain it. They have a reputation of letting the pattern morph into an unbalanced schedule of all mornings or something similar. If they maintain this pattern they will grab some good market share.

Interestingly, even though WN is known for multi-stop flights, looking at the current schedule, none of the flights continue onward to California. The plane just goes back and forth on this route and rotates on the RON. So, while I think they will do well on the locals with this pattern, I don't see how they can compete with HA without at least through passengers. Maybe that will change later on? That's when it will get harder to maintain the local pattern.


In Oct 2019 the first morning flight KOA-HNL #1853 same plane has a 105 min connection/ Etops turn to Flight HNL-OAK #4996
2nd morning KOA-HNL #443 flight same plane 105 min connection/Etops turn to flight HNL-SJC #4980.
First OAK-HNL flight 808 is now a One stop 50 min stop no plane change thru flight to KOA.
SJC-HNL flight #792 has a 110min connection to HNL-KOA #1869.
Sources from my Hawaii trip said that 792 will be a one stop thru flight to LIH in Oct.

Since the east bound flights all require a ETOPS preparation nothing will be a thru flight to the mainland.
But it will give those passengers time to use the New HNL WN gate area restrooms,charging stations,Starbucks and Kona Brewing before the treak to the mainland.
It also eliminates the switching of seats on ground time by the thru passengers taking away prime seats options from Business select and A List customers going on the long haul. It's a ongoing problem on the mainland flights today.

Sounds like ITO is going to happening sometime in 2020 with the same 4 Daily inter island flight schedule times as KOA.

I think as the MAX8 returns to service freeing up the ETOPS NG800 cities like LAX,SAN,PDX,LAS and PHX will Get Added. This will add more aircraft For WN to grow inter island flights from HNL only to around 6 each day from HNL-OGG/KOA/LIH/ITO. 24 daily inter island flights.
I don't see anything beyond that from WN.
So HA will keep it's monopoly on other inter island flights like OGG-KOA or LIH-KOA ect ect.

Flyguy


I don't think PHX and LAS are ever gonna happen.
 
Jshank83
Posts: 2619
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 2:23 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 6:48 pm

INFINITI329 wrote:
wnflyguy wrote:
enilria wrote:
I'll give them credit. The pattern is quite good. We'll see if they maintain it. They have a reputation of letting the pattern morph into an unbalanced schedule of all mornings or something similar. If they maintain this pattern they will grab some good market share.

Interestingly, even though WN is known for multi-stop flights, looking at the current schedule, none of the flights continue onward to California. The plane just goes back and forth on this route and rotates on the RON. So, while I think they will do well on the locals with this pattern, I don't see how they can compete with HA without at least through passengers. Maybe that will change later on? That's when it will get harder to maintain the local pattern.


In Oct 2019 the first morning flight KOA-HNL #1853 same plane has a 105 min connection/ Etops turn to Flight HNL-OAK #4996
2nd morning KOA-HNL #443 flight same plane 105 min connection/Etops turn to flight HNL-SJC #4980.
First OAK-HNL flight 808 is now a One stop 50 min stop no plane change thru flight to KOA.
SJC-HNL flight #792 has a 110min connection to HNL-KOA #1869.
Sources from my Hawaii trip said that 792 will be a one stop thru flight to LIH in Oct.

Since the east bound flights all require a ETOPS preparation nothing will be a thru flight to the mainland.
But it will give those passengers time to use the New HNL WN gate area restrooms,charging stations,Starbucks and Kona Brewing before the treak to the mainland.
It also eliminates the switching of seats on ground time by the thru passengers taking away prime seats options from Business select and A List customers going on the long haul. It's a ongoing problem on the mainland flights today.

Sounds like ITO is going to happening sometime in 2020 with the same 4 Daily inter island flight schedule times as KOA.

I think as the MAX8 returns to service freeing up the ETOPS NG800 cities like LAX,SAN,PDX,LAS and PHX will Get Added. This will add more aircraft For WN to grow inter island flights from HNL only to around 6 each day from HNL-OGG/KOA/LIH/ITO. 24 daily inter island flights.
I don't see anything beyond that from WN.
So HA will keep it's monopoly on other inter island flights like OGG-KOA or LIH-KOA ect ect.

Flyguy


I don't think PHX and LAS are ever gonna happen.


PHX will. I’ve heard it will be next (after SAN/SMF) by people I think would be in the know. But I don’t know if it’s a done deal, so we will see how it plays out. Either way next or not, I think it will happen.
 
mcdu
Posts: 1493
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 8:01 pm

chrisair wrote:
77H wrote:
Besides, plenty of locals disrespect the ā’ina by littering, graffitiing, etc... If we want visitors to respect our home, we must lead by example.

77H


100% agree with you.

mcdu wrote:
It is fine for the flip flop, t-shirt clad tourist that want to say “Aloha” and feel like they are speaking a different language. But the locals are not tired of Hawaiian.


You local? I have my doubts, but whatever.

As for the locals, it depends on who you ask, and what circles you run in, brah. The locals I know are happy to have WN.

airbazar wrote:
As for the turtles it's a bit of a double standard considering the locals don't seem to have a problem in owning beach front property which is the single biggest cause of death for sea turtles.


Definitely true, but I think there's more of an awareness now about the loss of turtle habitat amongst the locals and natives than there was 10-20 years ago. Besides, most natives and many locals can't afford the beachfront property, especially on the main islands.

Of course, now my diatribe is taking this way off course, so I'll go back to my hiding spot. Hawaii's a wonderful place. If anyone doesn't feel safe there, please don't go.



I own a home in Hawaii. Have been here over 25 years. No, I am not a local and would never claim to be. I know my place in the pecking order. However I have lots of good friends that are local and know how protective they are of local business.
 
Silver1SWA
Posts: 4547
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 6:11 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 8:22 pm

mcdu wrote:
chrisair wrote:
77H wrote:
Besides, plenty of locals disrespect the ā’ina by littering, graffitiing, etc... If we want visitors to respect our home, we must lead by example.

77H


100% agree with you.

mcdu wrote:
It is fine for the flip flop, t-shirt clad tourist that want to say “Aloha” and feel like they are speaking a different language. But the locals are not tired of Hawaiian.


You local? I have my doubts, but whatever.

As for the locals, it depends on who you ask, and what circles you run in, brah. The locals I know are happy to have WN.

airbazar wrote:
As for the turtles it's a bit of a double standard considering the locals don't seem to have a problem in owning beach front property which is the single biggest cause of death for sea turtles.


Definitely true, but I think there's more of an awareness now about the loss of turtle habitat amongst the locals and natives than there was 10-20 years ago. Besides, most natives and many locals can't afford the beachfront property, especially on the main islands.

Of course, now my diatribe is taking this way off course, so I'll go back to my hiding spot. Hawaii's a wonderful place. If anyone doesn't feel safe there, please don't go.



I own a home in Hawaii. Have been here over 25 years. No, I am not a local and would never claim to be. I know my place in the pecking order. However I have lots of good friends that are local and know how protective they are of local business.


Hmm... :scratchchin:

mcdu wrote:
No we aren’t. I have a home here and lots of locals are friends.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
Wingtips56
Posts: 1147
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 10:42 pm

Question: does WN need to maintain the relatively long turn times with every flight? Or are they good as long as they get the occasional breather, so that if a plane is running late, they can do a quick turn to get back to schedule?
Worked for WestAir, Apollo Airways, Desert Pacific, Western, AirCal and American Airlines (Retired). Flight Memory: 178 airports, 89 airlines, 71 a/c types, 397 routes, 56 countries (by air), 6 continents. 1,101,154 passenger miles.

Home airport : CEC
 
mcdu
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 11:40 pm

Silver1SWA wrote:
mcdu wrote:
chrisair wrote:

100% agree with you.



You local? I have my doubts, but whatever.

As for the locals, it depends on who you ask, and what circles you run in, brah. The locals I know are happy to have WN.



Definitely true, but I think there's more of an awareness now about the loss of turtle habitat amongst the locals and natives than there was 10-20 years ago. Besides, most natives and many locals can't afford the beachfront property, especially on the main islands.

Of course, now my diatribe is taking this way off course, so I'll go back to my hiding spot. Hawaii's a wonderful place. If anyone doesn't feel safe there, please don't go.



I own a home in Hawaii. Have been here over 25 years. No, I am not a local and would never claim to be. I know my place in the pecking order. However I have lots of good friends that are local and know how protective they are of local business.


Hmm... :scratchchin:

mcdu wrote:
No we aren’t. I have a home here and lots of locals are friends.


We as in residents on the islands. I do pay taxes here. While not a native I think I am allowed to say we in this case.
Last edited by mcdu on Fri May 03, 2019 11:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
wnflyguy
Posts: 1652
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Fri May 03, 2019 11:40 pm

Wingtips56 wrote:
Question: does WN need to maintain the relatively long turn times with every flight? Or are they good as long as they get the occasional breather, so that if a plane is running late, they can do a quick turn to get back to schedule?


50 min turn times are standard on the 175 seat 737-800/MAX8 At WN.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
User avatar
jaybird
Posts: 340
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2001 4:23 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 12:08 am

mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
DarthLobster wrote:

I’m sure everyone in Hawaii remembers what go! did to Aloha in similar circumstances, and it’s a safe bet there are very few WN loyalists amongst the locals. The tourists (well, the cheap ones) won’t care but the locals just might not look kindly on what WN is trying to do to HA.


The locals are tired of Hawaiian’s high inter-island fares and welcome the competition.


No we aren’t. I have a home here and lots of locals are friends. If anything this is making the locals more loyal to HA. There is great desire to preserve Hawaiian companies and Southwest is looked at like the outsider here. It is fine for the flip flop, t-shirt clad tourist that want to say “Aloha” and feel like they are speaking a different language. But the locals are not tired of Hawaiian.


1 - Hawaiian isn't in trouble
2 - It's not like Hawaiian has no competition - they compete with everyone already flying to Hawaii
3 - SOME locals only remember the $25 fares .. the cheap coupons, but don't realize that fares at that price level are not sustainable. They think it's okay to get cheap rates and if the airline goes out of business, so be it. Hawaiian isn't subsidized by the State of Hawaii like TheBus - they need to charge enough money to cover expenses and make a profit. As the travel manager where I work in Honolulu - our staff is not tired of Hawaiian. Interisland or to/from the mainland. I actually have more flying Hawaiian to the mainland (and ditching United) than before.

Southwest brings choice - that's all - the same way the do across the 48. They don't offer $29 fares on every seat - it's a limited number and the fares go up considerably after that. But everyone thinks Southwest and $29 go hand-in-hand. It will be good to have extra lift at peak periods, and it will be good to have choice. But it's not a reason for anyone to think Hawaiian is in trouble. They've been through worse and they've survived!
 
9w748capt
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 12:43 am

frmrCapCadet wrote:
I think a review of the impact of European civilization on Hawaii would not find it was the tourists who are at fault.


Oh really? Let's ask the native Hawaiians what they think.
 
Silver1SWA
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 12:52 am

jaybird wrote:
mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:

The locals are tired of Hawaiian’s high inter-island fares and welcome the competition.


No we aren’t. I have a home here and lots of locals are friends. If anything this is making the locals more loyal to HA. There is great desire to preserve Hawaiian companies and Southwest is looked at like the outsider here. It is fine for the flip flop, t-shirt clad tourist that want to say “Aloha” and feel like they are speaking a different language. But the locals are not tired of Hawaiian.


3 - SOME locals only remember the $25 fares .. the cheap coupons, but don't realize that fares at that price level are not sustainable. They think it's okay to get cheap rates and if the airline goes out of business, so be it.


In my experience the most common complaint is that it cost them as much (or more) to visit family on other islands as it costs for a trip to the mainland and they associate that with lack of competition. SOME even speak badly of HA for taking advantage of them.

But that’s just my experience. YMMV.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
User avatar
jaybird
Posts: 340
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 1:11 am

Silver1SWA wrote:
jaybird wrote:
mcdu wrote:

But that’s just my experience. YMMV.


What's YMMV? that's a new one for me ..
 
Silver1SWA
Posts: 4547
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 6:11 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 1:30 am

jaybird wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
jaybird wrote:


What's YMMV? that's a new one for me ..


Your mileage may vary.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
User avatar
jaybird
Posts: 340
Joined: Mon Mar 19, 2001 4:23 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 1:33 am

HAHAHA .. okay I never would have figured it out - I take TheBus .. I don't care about mileage .. :-)
 
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STT757
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 1:44 am

I didn’t see it mentioned but WN is the one really at a competitive disadvantage as they don’t interline. That’s something that HA really benefits from, Ive taken my wife to Hawaii a couple
Of times and each time we flew the nonstop from EWR and interlined to HA to get to Maui and Kaui.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
77H
Posts: 1371
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 1:54 am

STT757 wrote:
I didn’t see it mentioned but WN is the one really at a competitive disadvantage as they don’t interline. That’s something that HA really benefits from, Ive taken my wife to Hawaii a couple
Of times and each time we flew the nonstop from EWR and interlined to HA to get to Maui and Kaui.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I mentioned it upthread and it is not so much interlining as codesharing that gives WN the advantage. They codeshare with the US3 and quite a few international carriers.

77H
 
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TWA772LR
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 2:11 am

san88 wrote:
I’m working the island hops today. Water or juice and pretzels if there’s time. Same aircraft with four legs. Some of schedules later in the month are 5 legs with the SJC startup. Apparently similar to working “HOU -AUS” said someone in Dallas :rotfl:

I used to work for SWA as an intern and a CSA and I came to the conclusion that 98% of the people that work in HDQ are way out of touch from what happens in the operation.
When wasn't America great?


The thoughts and opinions shared under this username are mine and are not influenced by my employer.
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 3:42 am

77H wrote:
STT757 wrote:
I didn’t see it mentioned but WN is the one really at a competitive disadvantage as they don’t interline. That’s something that HA really benefits from, Ive taken my wife to Hawaii a couple
Of times and each time we flew the nonstop from EWR and interlined to HA to get to Maui and Kaui.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


I mentioned it upthread and it is not so much interlining as codesharing that gives WN the advantage. They codeshare with the US3 and quite a few international carriers.

77H


Interlining is still a useful source of revenue. They have ticketing interline arrangements with a lot the international carriers that they don't codeshare with.

Qantas comes to mind as an example. QF and HA don't codeshare but Qantas does interline onto the HA inter-island network and sells tickets that include HA. Last year some of my family flew SYD-HNL//HNL-LIH//LIH-HNL-SYD. One ticket on Qantas 081 stock, even the standalone HNL-LIH.
Worked Hard, Flew Right
 
INFINITI329
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 8:58 am

TWA772LR wrote:
san88 wrote:
I’m working the island hops today. Water or juice and pretzels if there’s time. Same aircraft with four legs. Some of schedules later in the month are 5 legs with the SJC startup. Apparently similar to working “HOU -AUS” said someone in Dallas :rotfl:

I used to work for SWA as an intern and a CSA and I came to the conclusion that 98% of the people that work in HDQ are way out of touch from what happens in the operation.


I second this. That is a true statement
 
Silver1SWA
Posts: 4547
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 6:11 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 9:17 am

TWA772LR wrote:
san88 wrote:
I’m working the island hops today. Water or juice and pretzels if there’s time. Same aircraft with four legs. Some of schedules later in the month are 5 legs with the SJC startup. Apparently similar to working “HOU -AUS” said someone in Dallas :rotfl:

I used to work for SWA as an intern and a CSA and I came to the conclusion that 98% of the people that work in HDQ are way out of touch from what happens in the operation.


There’s a clear disconnect, that’s for sure.
Last edited by Silver1SWA on Sat May 04, 2019 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
lorm
Posts: 379
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2004 4:31 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 9:17 am

mcdu wrote:
Silver1SWA wrote:
DarthLobster wrote:

I’m sure everyone in Hawaii remembers what go! did to Aloha in similar circumstances, and it’s a safe bet there are very few WN loyalists amongst the locals. The tourists (well, the cheap ones) won’t care but the locals just might not look kindly on what WN is trying to do to HA.


The locals are tired of Hawaiian’s high inter-island fares and welcome the competition.


No we aren’t. I have a home here and lots of locals are friends. If anything this is making the locals more loyal to HA. There is great desire to preserve Hawaiian companies and Southwest is looked at like the outsider here. It is fine for the flip flop, t-shirt clad tourist that want to say “Aloha” and feel like they are speaking a different language. But the locals are not tired of Hawaiian.


Yeah sure buddy. The locals aren't tired... Thanks for that laugh. You with that "lots of locals are friends" is almost as hilarious as some white guy saying "I understand racism because I have black friends" You just being a resident and a transplant was expected. Like the guy above, I wonder about your circles brah.

It should be more than obvious to anyone that Hawai'i locals aren't asking for the the ridiculously unsustainable $25 go!-like interisland fares during the aloha vs Mesa Ornstein war. But we are asking for a reasonable fares. Competition is good for any market obviously in the high costs we already deal with here.
As for Hawaiian "local", an airline is only as local as it's workforce. Hell, Hawaiian had a white CEO in Dunkerly, running the show for 15 years who led Hawaiian's turnaround and now it has another Haole guy in Ingram. I'm pretty sure it ain't all mainlanders working the ramps at "them mainlander" airlines such United, Delta, AA, nor are they at Southwest. I'd even argue that pre-merger United's presence and history in Hawaii aviation was just as "local" as Hawaiian.
Brick Windows
 
wnflyguy
Posts: 1652
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 2:39 pm

WN will never beat HA at the inter island flight game and they know it.
What WN brings to inter island flights is affordable fares back to the Hawaiian people.
Hawaiian will drawl the inter island business pax with its frequency. WN catering to the Island hopping tourist. First week of flights have already seen a large number of Asian tourists. They Fly Airlines like Scoot spent a few days in HNL use WN for a quick island hop to see another island before hop back to HNL for their flight home. This is a common trend for many years in LAX many Asian budget travelers book non inter line flights.
The free Baggage allowance drawls the budget over packing crowds.
I think the most frequent service you will see in Hawaii is 6 flights a day between markets.
I will be shocked if they offer anything beyond the HNL-feed like KOA-LIH for example.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
jagraham
Posts: 837
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Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 3:55 pm

wnflyguy wrote:
rbavfan wrote:
wnflyguy wrote:

In Oct 2019 the first morning flight KOA-HNL #1853 same plane has a 105 min connection/ Etops turn to Flight HNL-OAK #4996
2nd morning KOA-HNL #443 flight same plane 105 min connection/Etops turn to flight HNL-SJC #4980.
First OAK-HNL flight 808 is now a One stop 50 min stop no plane change thru flight to KOA.
SJC-HNL flight #792 has a 110min connection to HNL-KOA #1869.
Sources from my Hawaii trip said that 792 will be a one stop thru flight to LIH in Oct.

Since the east bound flights all require a ETOPS preparation nothing will be a thru flight to the mainland.
But it will give those passengers time to use the New HNL WN gate area restrooms,charging stations,Starbucks and Kona Brewing before the treak to the mainland.
It also eliminates the switching of seats on ground time by the thru passengers taking away prime seats options from Business select and A List customers going on the long haul. It's a ongoing problem on the mainland flights today.

Sounds like ITO is going to happening sometime in 2020 with the same 4 Daily inter island flight schedule times as KOA.

I think as the MAX8 returns to service freeing up the ETOPS NG800 cities like LAX,SAN,PDX,LAS and PHX will Get Added. This will add more aircraft For WN to grow inter island flights from HNL only to around 6 each day from HNL-OGG/KOA/LIH/ITO. 24 daily inter island flights.
I don't see anything beyond that from WN.
So HA will keep it's monopoly on other inter island flights like OGG-KOA or LIH-KOA ect ect.

Flyguy



With the Southwest seat layout & The Phoenix heat I doubt PHX-Hawaii is doable in a 737-8 due to ETOPS requirements.


WN small Sub fleet of 737-MAX7 ETOPS will bring in cities like PHX,LAS and DEN without payload restrictions.
WN can use the 800NG To Hawaii but I've been told the estimated seat cap West bound only would be at 155 from both PHX and LAS.
I don't think from LAS the seat cap would hurt WN at making Revenue against Hawaiian.
PHX on the other Hand has both Hawaiian and American on the sectors. With WN plan of non Red Eye flying and Limited connections even with the 737MAX7 could be a losing battle from PHX.
I believe near term PHX-OAK-HNL same plane thru flight service starts in July or August.

Flyguy


If the 787-800 can handle 155 pax from PHX then the 7M8 should be able to handle full pax from PHX. Not max structural payload of course, but the 7M8 should be able to handle some cargo as well. Once they get them back.
 
wnflyguy
Posts: 1652
Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:58 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sat May 04, 2019 4:59 pm

jagraham wrote:
wnflyguy wrote:
rbavfan wrote:


With the Southwest seat layout & The Phoenix heat I doubt PHX-Hawaii is doable in a 737-8 due to ETOPS requirements.


WN small Sub fleet of 737-MAX7 ETOPS will bring in cities like PHX,LAS and DEN without payload restrictions.
WN can use the 800NG To Hawaii but I've been told the estimated seat cap West bound only would be at 155 from both PHX and LAS.
I don't think from LAS the seat cap would hurt WN at making Revenue against Hawaiian.
PHX on the other Hand has both Hawaiian and American on the sectors. With WN plan of non Red Eye flying and Limited connections even with the 737MAX7 could be a losing battle from PHX.
I believe near term PHX-OAK-HNL same plane thru flight service starts in July or August.

Flyguy


If the 787-800 can handle 155 pax from PHX then the 7M8 should be able to handle full pax from PHX. Not max structural payload of course, but the 7M8 should be able to handle some cargo as well. Once they get them back.


I don't know if they will have space for cargo on ETOPS flights California-Hawaii flights even with the MAX8. As of now these flights are basically the Florida-Havana style of flights in terms of HIGH checked baggage. I believe WN already had to cap the limit at 2 checked Bags max per passenger. so no 3ed,4th,5th ect ect for a additional fee because of lack of Bin space.

Flyguy
my post are my opinion only and not those of southwest airlines and or airtran airlines.
 
HALFA
Posts: 1063
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2004 8:24 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 3:53 am

77H wrote:
chrisair wrote:
san88 wrote:
Apparently similar to working “HOU -AUS” said someone in Dallas :rotfl:


Better scenery though. :D

N809FR wrote:
Still don’t get the desire to travel to Hawaii when you have SJD no more than 3 hours from anywhere on the west coast. The locals don’t like tourists, what more reason does anyone need not to travel there?


Locals don’t like tourists who destroy the land, disrespect the culture, ruin sacred areas, and harass wildlife (like picking up turtles!). If you’re a good person who respects the Āina and the culture, you’ll never find a more welcoming place.


The problem is, the state does a crap job of educating inbound tourists about the culture or wildlife conservation considerations. Most people don’t know that touching coral or sea life can be harmful. Most people are unaware of the cultural history. Tourists come for the warm weather, sun and ocean. The state should educate tourists about the unique aspects of Hawaii. Hell, each passenger fills out the Ag form with the useless HTA tourism survey on the back. Instead, there should be an educational guide with a list of “do’s and don’ts”. There is an opportunity.

Besides, plenty of locals disrespect the ā’ina by littering, graffitiing, etc... If we want visitors to respect our home, we must lead by example.

77H


Interesting that you brought this up. Hawaiian is now showing these short video clips on all inbound flights to Hawaii from the Hawaii Department of Land and Natural Resources to educate visitors about our culture and environmental awareness. It's a start.
https://vimeo.com/album/5625814

Aloha,
HALFA
Hawaiian Airlines Since 1929...........
 
77H
Posts: 1371
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2016 11:27 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 6:22 am

HALFA wrote:
77H wrote:
chrisair wrote:

Better scenery though. :D



Locals don’t like tourists who destroy the land, disrespect the culture, ruin sacred areas, and harass wildlife (like picking up turtles!). If you’re a good person who respects the Āina and the culture, you’ll never find a more welcoming place.


The problem is, the state does a crap job of educating inbound tourists about the culture or wildlife conservation considerations. Most people don’t know that touching coral or sea life can be harmful. Most people are unaware of the cultural history. Tourists come for the warm weather, sun and ocean. The state should educate tourists about the unique aspects of Hawaii. Hell, each passenger fills out the Ag form with the useless HTA tourism survey on the back. Instead, there should be an educational guide with a list of “do’s and don’ts”. There is an opportunity.

Besides, plenty of locals disrespect the ā’ina by littering, graffitiing, etc... If we want visitors to respect our home, we must lead by example.

77H


Interesting that you brought this up. Hawaiian is now showing these short video clips on all inbound flights to Hawaii from the Hawaii Department of Land and Natural Resources to educate visitors about our culture and environmental awareness. It's a start.
https://vimeo.com/album/5625814

Aloha,
HALFA


I read about that. The state should encourage all the airlines do something similar. I had an idea in college years ago to make a hand out that would accompany the Ag/HTA form to the same effect. Went in a different direction for a senior project.

77H
 
barney captain
Posts: 2166
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2001 5:47 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 3:08 pm

A few observations from my first inter-island flying (2 RT's between OGG-HNL) -

1) Absolutely hands down the funnest flying I've ever done.
2) Full. We had 170+ on every leg (this was the afternoon/evening volley).
3) The locals seem to love us. Way beyond just the pax, it was repeated in people I met everywhere.
4) The FA's managed the abbreviated service with little issue on those 20 minute flights.
5) None of our turn times ended up being less than an hour.

Cubsrule -

The seniority definitely tends to be quite high on these trips.
Southeast Of Disorder
 
san88
Posts: 108
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:30 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 3:19 pm

Observations working 4 island hop flights. I would do island hopping over the Texas two-step any day. Flight time is around 22-23 minutes (OGG-HNL-OGG-HNL-OGG) but SUPER easy service. Mostly locals on the flights, overwhelmingly many compliments and thanking us that WN has entered the market. The folks are very thankful they have another option and its family galore on those flights. Overall if WN can remain reasonable in pricing, they will be very successful. We all know the $29 tickets won't last forever.

Only one minor issue being "worked out" with the USDA is the HNL operations is in the mainland terminal so currently, passengers cannot carry fruits/ veggies in their carry-on luggage on the inter-island flights (needs to be checked, free of course)
sit on the Captain side when you fly into SAN
 
Aptivaboy
Posts: 755
Joined: Fri Jul 15, 2016 3:32 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 3:35 pm

Locals don’t like tourists who destroy the land, disrespect the culture, ruin sacred areas, and harass wildlife (like picking up turtles!). If you’re a good person who respects the Āina and the culture, you’ll never find a more welcoming place.


I tend to agree. I travel to Hawaii a lot, usually 1-3 times per year, and apart from some stink eye from the locals in the boonies behind Hana (as a co-worker who was raised in Hawaii and cheered for the Univ. of Hawaii put it, "Those people are out of Deliverance!"), I've never been treated poorly. The bottom line is that wherever you go, respect the local culture, respect the land, and you'll be fine. I remember being on a trip to England in the mid-'80s and watching a drunk American tourist urinate atop one of the towers at Warwick Castle. Talk about embarrassing. Things like that make Europeans dislike tourists. Here in SoCal, we're pretty laid back but we hate tourists who litter our beaches. In Hawaii, the quote above is quote apropos. On my last trip, I saw a Canadian tour group (sorry, Canada) thought it would be fun to swim with the turtles, literally touching and herding them. We all just shook our heads and called over a local guide who "educated" them and threatened to call the authorities. Just behave and be respectful and you'll have a wonderful time and be treated equally wonderfully by the locals. It really is that simple.
 
san88
Posts: 108
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:30 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 3:46 pm

A new promotion that has been creating a huge buzz on the islands the past few days is new valid Hawaiian address rapid reward accounts received 5,000 points just for signing up. Enough for a free roundtrip inter-island ticket at the $29 prices. It's smart marketing in trying to create goodwill and loyalty to the people of Hawaii.
sit on the Captain side when you fly into SAN
 
Silver1SWA
Posts: 4547
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 6:11 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 5:03 pm

barney captain wrote:
A few observations from my first inter-island flying (2 RT's between OGG-HNL) -

1) Absolutely hands down the funnest flying I've ever done.
2) Full. We had 170+ on every leg (this was the afternoon/evening volley).
3) The locals seem to love us. Way beyond just the pax, it was repeated in people I met everywhere.
4) The FA's managed the abbreviated service with little issue on those 20 minute flights.
5) None of our turn times ended up being less than an hour.

Cubsrule -

The seniority definitely tends to be quite high on these trips.


I hope that wasn’t yesterday when I had my first push using a towbar after over 2 years using towbarless at my previous station! :scared: :covereyes:

But yeah I’ve heard the same thing about interisland flying from some of the pilots passing through.

Bookings started off very slow the first half of last week but have quickly filled up to nearly completely full all this weekend.

For us here it’s been fun seeing customers and crew get such a kick out of the outdoor boarding process.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
Carfield
Posts: 2165
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 5:49 pm

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 5:10 pm

barney captain wrote:
A few observations from my first inter-island flying (2 RT's between OGG-HNL) -

4) The FA's managed the abbreviated service with little issue on those 20 minute flights.

Cubsrule -

The seniority definitely tends to be quite high on these trips.


Do you mind me asking what is the abbreviated service? I can't imagine Southwest passing these tiny juice cups that Hawaiian passes out.
Maybe just a water service?

Carfield
 
san88
Posts: 108
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 3:30 am

Re: Southwest starts Interisland service

Sun May 05, 2019 5:45 pm

Carfield wrote:
barney captain wrote:
A few observations from my first inter-island flying (2 RT's between OGG-HNL) -

4) The FA's managed the abbreviated service with little issue on those 20 minute flights.

Cubsrule -

The seniority definitely tends to be quite high on these trips.


Do you mind me asking what is the abbreviated service? I can't imagine Southwest passing these tiny juice cups that Hawaiian passes out.
Maybe just a water service?

Carfield


Inter-island service is a choice of cup of water (poured) or packaged fruit juice cup + pretzels.
sit on the Captain side when you fly into SAN

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