NCAD95
Topic Author
Posts: 46
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2018 12:11 am

Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Fri May 03, 2019 4:15 pm

Was just wondering what direction as for as growth goes will Spirit Airlines take in the Detroit market.
 
EBiafore99
Posts: 75
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:03 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Fri May 03, 2019 7:39 pm

I think they will add here and there, but nothing drastic. Two things that will limit growth 1) there are plenty of growth opportunities elsewhere and 2) they may not want to poke the bear too much (i.e. - DL).
 
dtwpilot225
Posts: 265
Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:31 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Fri May 03, 2019 7:53 pm

They pretty much have all the cities covered that fit their business model, they could add frequencies to these routes for sure i see maybe bna in their future if it’s not already I haven’t looked in a bit
 
tphuang
Posts: 2895
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Fri May 03, 2019 7:56 pm

My read on NK is this. Their current network planner seems to be re-orienting their network toward WN. Maybe they see that WN doesn't get that much of a yield advantage over them and they have a definite cost advantage over WN. And they don't have to worry about basic economy with WN. They are doing pretty large buildups at LAS, MCO and MSY. We will see how this strategy turns out. They had a good calendar year and now have embarked on a pretty aggressive expansion. I see all of this causing their margins to shrink again. Maybe that's when get back to Detroit. I think until then, it will be more adds to Detroit as part of opening a new station rather than adds targeted for Detroit.
 
santi319
Posts: 794
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 3:24 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Fri May 03, 2019 8:03 pm

They specifically mentioned congested airports, so look for that in their future.

However NK will have 4 daily flights on DTW-MCO this summer it seems. That could be what the future of DTW will look like.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 5192
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Fri May 03, 2019 10:22 pm

Look at plausible leisure destinations from DTW. DL will kill them on business routes with frequency. Yes, NYC and LAX can be leisure destinations from DTW.
 
User avatar
flymco753
Posts: 3242
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:09 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sat May 04, 2019 2:38 am

I've looked a lot into what Sprit can do with DTW. My ideology is that they'll begin going into high yielding leisure destinations sans SRQ, PUJ, CHS/SAV. The market, much like Chicago has proven in the last few years that there's room for DL & NK on leisure routes. JAX, PBI, MBJ, & MYR are huge examples.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
727LOVER
Posts: 8281
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:22 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sat May 04, 2019 3:17 am

A very very very VERY very VERY very very very VERY very very VERY very VERY very very good source told a bunch of us that Spirit was very close to starting SRQ last year. They went with JAX instead..so I'm hoping for this year.


I assume DTW would be one of the routes
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
User avatar
flymco753
Posts: 3242
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:09 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sat May 04, 2019 12:54 pm

flymco753 wrote:
I've looked a lot into what Sprit can do with DTW. My ideology is that they'll begin going into high yielding leisure destinations sans SRQ, PUJ, CHS/SAV. The market, much like Chicago has proven in the last few years that there's room for DL & NK on leisure routes. JAX, PBI, MBJ, & MYR are huge examples.
I forgot to mention that my analysis has a line that draws basically "in the middle" of the forecast that separates Delta & Spirit. Aside from a very popular brand recognition due to Spirit being at DTW for so long, the market has 2 types of people that use these leisure routes.

For example, there's the group of people that use the MBJ flight and book a hotel separately to pinch their prices and walk away with a fairly decent priced vacation. Then there's the people that book Delta vacations for the convenience of having everything under a single reservation.

Domestically, there's the family of 6 going to a son/daughter/parents/grandparents house in Orlando for Disney, or they to to Fort Myers to stay with them and go to the beach.

There's a line, and while that line isnt present on many more routes, it gives NK the opportunity to split a route with DL. That's why I see BDL, EWR, CLT, SRQ, PUJ, and CHS or SAV as potential station or route additions. With opening SRQ & CHS or SAV, they'd be able to do ORD & BWI as well...maybe even FLL or MCO from CHS or SAV.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
jplatts
Posts: 2512
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sat May 04, 2019 1:29 pm

DTW-RIC nonstop service could also be added by NK since RIC is near many major tourist attractions in Greater Richmond, Colonial Williamsburg, Charlottesville, and surrounding areas.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 5192
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sat May 04, 2019 1:39 pm

I'd love to see a leisure traveler PDEW for DTW-RIC. I'm guessing it's single-digits. (I'd love to see a leisure traveler PDEW for DTW-RIC. I'm guessing it's single-digits. (The major tourist attraction Colonial Williamsburg sold 560,000 tickets in 2016. Disney World, 52 million.) I don't see BDL or CLT as leisure destinations, either (unlike the tourism capacity of NYC), and short flight distances mean quick trips that make frequency valuable. Plus, both DL and AA would squeeze hard on DTW-CLT.
 
User avatar
flymco753
Posts: 3242
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:09 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sat May 04, 2019 3:10 pm

jplatts wrote:
DTW-RIC nonstop service could also be added by NK since RIC is near many major tourist attractions in Greater Richmond, Colonial Williamsburg, Charlottesville, and surrounding areas.
There's a rather complex equation someone once taught me to find this out using yield fare prices. In the case of DTW-RIC, it's already a relatively small market. I think it comes out to around 15 or so a day. Look up the numbers for PHF or ROA, which is all leisure and it's similar to the amount of non business travel to RIC. None of those people are going on vacation either, I assume it's mostly people visiting friends/family and vice versa.

Same reason why JAX & PBI exist for NK because its mostly people visiting friends or family albeit the mix of vacationers. Not to forget, much of the FL markets served by NK are very connected with SE Michigan. Everyone there has an aunt or uncle who lives in Florida or vice versa.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
jplatts
Posts: 2512
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sat May 04, 2019 7:51 pm

flymco753 wrote:
jplatts wrote:
DTW-RIC nonstop service could also be added by NK since RIC is near many major tourist attractions in Greater Richmond, Colonial Williamsburg, Charlottesville, and surrounding areas.
There's a rather complex equation someone once taught me to find this out using yield fare prices. In the case of DTW-RIC, it's already a relatively small market. I think it comes out to around 15 or so a day. Look up the numbers for PHF or ROA, which is all leisure and it's similar to the amount of non business travel to RIC. None of those people are going on vacation either, I assume it's mostly people visiting friends/family and vice versa.


One big difference between RIC and most of the other major domestic markets is that RIC will lose 1-stop connecting service from DTW on any LCC's once WN discontinues ATL-DTW nonstop service, whereas WN has 1-stop connecting service from DTW to many domestic destinations that aren't currently served nonstop out of DTW on any LCC's such as ABQ, CLT, BDL, MEM, ORF, OKC, OMA, PDX, SMF, SLC, SAT, and TUL.

While I agree that there might not be enough demand for NK to add DTW-RIC nonstop service, NK might be able to stimulate additional demand for DTW-RIC nonstop service if NK adds DTW-RIC nonstop service.
 
umichman
Posts: 21
Joined: Sun Apr 07, 2019 2:42 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sun May 05, 2019 2:09 am

MIflyer12 wrote:
Look at plausible leisure destinations from DTW. DL will kill them on business routes with frequency. Yes, NYC and LAX can be leisure destinations from DTW.


What about MCI, MSP, and IAH? I think NK has clearly grown beyond the beach/gambling markets to something more. I'm betting there's not an insignificant amount of business travel on them these days. Leisure and friends and family travel only go so far when you've got daily flights to fill. Not all businesses have lavish travel budgets.
 
User avatar
flymco753
Posts: 3242
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:09 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sun May 05, 2019 9:27 pm

umichman wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
Look at plausible leisure destinations from DTW. DL will kill them on business routes with frequency. Yes, NYC and LAX can be leisure destinations from DTW.


What about MCI, MSP, and IAH? I think NK has clearly grown beyond the beach/gambling markets to something more. I'm betting there's not an insignificant amount of business travel on them these days. Leisure and friends and family travel only go so far when you've got daily flights to fill. Not all businesses have lavish travel budgets.
Those big front seats go pretty quick. The big front seat is highly appealing if someone is traveling on a budget. From a single observation, it seems a lot of the Mastercard holders like to purchase the fare using their miles and purchase the upgrade, so essentially they pay $100 RT.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
jplatts
Posts: 2512
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sun May 05, 2019 10:03 pm

umichman wrote:
What about MCI, MSP, and IAH? I think NK has clearly grown beyond the beach/gambling markets to something more. I'm betting there's not an insignificant amount of business travel on them these days. Leisure and friends and family travel only go so far when you've got daily flights to fill. Not all businesses have lavish travel budgets.


There is probably some leisure traffic on NK's DTW-IAH nonstop flights with Greater Houston having some major tourist attractions such as Galveston, Kemah Boardwalk, and the Johnson Space Center.
 
N292UX
Posts: 388
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2017 7:08 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Sun May 05, 2019 10:24 pm

SRQ wouldn't shock me if it happened at some point. Same with PHX/SJD
 
jplatts
Posts: 2512
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 4:44 pm

N292UX wrote:
SRQ wouldn't shock me if it happened at some point. Same with PHX/SJD


I agree that NK adding DTW-PHX nonstop service might happen since NK currently has a smaller presence at PHX than in the other leisure markets in the contiguous U.S. There are also other nonstop routes such as PHX-FLL, PHX-LAS, and PHX-MCO that could be added by NK out of PHX.
 
TwinStarRocket
Posts: 7
Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:24 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 5:00 pm

dtwpilot225 wrote:
They pretty much have all the cities covered that fit their business model, they could add frequencies to these routes for sure i see maybe bna in their future if it’s not already I haven’t looked in a bit


No, we don't. Our business model works in 550+ markets and we're only covering 75'ish right now. Our 1Q earnings call stated that we will continue 15% YOY growth through the end of 2023 and 10-12% through 2028. The Spirit effect is the new driver at airports and there's going to be a lot more yellow in the skies in the next decade.
 
kavok
Posts: 543
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 10:12 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 5:06 pm

The other thing with leisure travelers, particularly from DTW, is that if the destination is within a full one-day drive, it becomes much harder for a cost conscious traveler to fly, especially if they are traveling with others. Richmond is borderline, but still a long, but doable full one-day drive.

Florida is far enough away that you can’t get there in one day. Point being, even if you are budget conscious, once you are spending multiple days to get there, and multiple days to drive back, you are wasting vacation days traveling and thus become more willing to spend to fly.
 
tphuang
Posts: 2895
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 6:21 pm

TwinStarRocket wrote:
dtwpilot225 wrote:
They pretty much have all the cities covered that fit their business model, they could add frequencies to these routes for sure i see maybe bna in their future if it’s not already I haven’t looked in a bit


No, we don't. Our business model works in 550+ markets and we're only covering 75'ish right now. Our 1Q earnings call stated that we will continue 15% YOY growth through the end of 2023 and 10-12% through 2028. The Spirit effect is the new driver at airports and there's going to be a lot more yellow in the skies in the next decade.


While I generally agree that people are too eager to box in on who NK can capture and which routes work for them, this kind of confidence about continued growth is unfounded. A lot of the growth plan is based on assumption that economy will keep growing at a high rate and their margins will continue to be good as they really enter some legacy strongholds. It was only a year and half ago that legacy BE price matching forced NK into several bad quarters in a row. As NK is entering CLT this year along with AUS/RDU and building up LAS, they are going to put themselves in the cross hair of big 4. I personally like what they are doing. We need more competition in some of these airports, but not everything will go rosy in their expansion.
 
727LOVER
Posts: 8281
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:22 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 6:24 pm

kavok wrote:
The other thing with leisure travelers, particularly from DTW, is that if the destination is within a full one-day drive, it becomes much harder for a cost conscious traveler to fly, especially if they are traveling with others. Richmond is borderline, but still a long, but doable full one-day drive.

Florida is far enough away that you can’t get there in one day. Point being, even if you are budget conscious, once you are spending multiple days to get there, and multiple days to drive back, you are wasting vacation days traveling and thus become more willing to spend to fly.



So I did a dummy booking...leaving DTW on July 16 returning from MCO on July 20. For 2 adults, 2 kids ages 10 & 8. Including some frills, the total price was $818.00
Adding other things
4 hotel nights @125.00 each = $500.00

3 days car rental = $600.00

food for 4 people for nearly 5 days = $600

miscellaneous = $200.00

total = $2,718

How much would driving be, if you were to stay in Orlando for 4 days?
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
User avatar
flymco753
Posts: 3242
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:09 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 6:30 pm

kavok wrote:
The other thing with leisure travelers, particularly from DTW, is that if the destination is within a full one-day drive, it becomes much harder for a cost conscious traveler to fly, especially if they are traveling with others. Richmond is borderline, but still a long, but doable full one-day drive.

Florida is far enough away that you can’t get there in one day. Point being, even if you are budget conscious, once you are spending multiple days to get there, and multiple days to drive back, you are wasting vacation days traveling and thus become more willing to spend to fly.
Using RIC as an example, lets use the QSI method but lets throw away what people are willing to pay on similarly staged flights since that is too complex for anyone who doesn't know QSI well.

NK would operate say, 1 daily A319 and DL operates 2 CRJ-900's and -700's each making 4 daily flights. Lets also assume all of the passengers are traveling as leisure even thought most probably aren't. DTW is losing a connection on WN in ATL, so NK would know that they can steal from that in stage 1 of their QSI analysis. The PDEW stands around and average of 120 combined for 2018. DL still covers all of those passengers essentially in 2 RJ's, NK would have to begin another process in stage 2 which might require strategic pricing where they know DL won't match on all of their flights. Even then there might only be a gain in 20 or so passengers and there's no revenue to be made.

Of course though, NK makes that decision, and if they do jump in on RIC, then they did some good homework.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
User avatar
flymco753
Posts: 3242
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:09 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 6:33 pm

727LOVER wrote:
kavok wrote:
The other thing with leisure travelers, particularly from DTW, is that if the destination is within a full one-day drive, it becomes much harder for a cost conscious traveler to fly, especially if they are traveling with others. Richmond is borderline, but still a long, but doable full one-day drive.

Florida is far enough away that you can’t get there in one day. Point being, even if you are budget conscious, once you are spending multiple days to get there, and multiple days to drive back, you are wasting vacation days traveling and thus become more willing to spend to fly.



So I did a dummy booking...leaving DTW on July 16 returning from MCO on July 20. For 2 adults, 2 kids ages 10 & 8. Including some frills, the total price was $818.00
Adding other things
4 hotel nights @125.00 each = $500.00

3 days car rental = $600.00

food for 4 people for nearly 5 days = $600

miscellaneous = $200.00

total = $2,718

How much would driving be, if you were to stay in Orlando for 4 days?
Most Disney folks are going to use the Magical Express and get a meal plan which essentially becomes the same price if you combine a flight, it's probably the convenience of not wasting valuable time at the parks when a plane could get you there in under 3hrs.

Some people like the drive though. I know a couple who drive down from Minnesota every year for 2 weeks because they like seeing the other states.
...the carriage of liquids, gels, and aerosols are prohibited through the screening checkpoint except for travel size toiletries of 3 ounces or less...
 
User avatar
tjwgrr
Posts: 2388
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2000 4:09 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 6:33 pm

727LOVER wrote:
3 days car rental = $600.00



$200.00/ day.....really :confused: :?:
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
727LOVER
Posts: 8281
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:22 am

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Mon May 06, 2019 7:57 pm

tjwgrr wrote:
727LOVER wrote:
3 days car rental = $600.00



$200.00/ day.....really :confused: :?:


Well...SUV plus taking their insurance. I suppose some could get it for $400.00 or less :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
thedetroitpole
Posts: 198
Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2016 3:54 pm

Re: Future growth of Spirit Airlines in Detroit.

Wed May 08, 2019 12:03 am

727LOVER wrote:
tjwgrr wrote:
727LOVER wrote:
3 days car rental = $600.00



$200.00/ day.....really :confused: :?:


Well...SUV plus taking their insurance. I suppose some could get it for $400.00 or less :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
We have returned to Detroit after a short holiday in Orlando. We paid very cheap flights on Spirit. With an auto rental additional to the hotel we spend around one whole thousand for 5 family members.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos