https://viewfromthewing.boardingarea.co ... tic-fleet/

Currently rumored. This would bring seatback IFEs on planes that don't have them, specifically the Oasis 737 MAX and A321neo.

Nothing yet on the Classic 737-800 and LUS A321s.

I believe AA hasn't removed any seatback IFEs on LAA A321s and the newer 738s.

Can't wait to see how this develops. I really hope to see AA making positive moves again.

Please. Please do. Doug "Cheapo" Parker needs to open his eyes or get the hell out.

I flew SBA-DFW-BWI the other day on AA (L-AA A319 and 738) and both planes had PTVs.

The "streaming revolution" that DP & Co claim is occurring couldn't have been more false on those two flights. When I got up to use the lav, almost everyone was using the seatback screen, rather than just using the screen for the Airshow. The content available and the interface was pretty good for a domestic flight I must add.

I would welcome this decision, and *Gasp* I would be OK with the Oasis config in Y if the planes had PTVs.

For once, Dougie and Co. thought they figured out Delta's next move, then reacted quickly to announcing plan of removing seatback IFE so that they can claim for once Delta would be following AA. Instead DL laughed at AA and told the whole world that they will be ADDING IFE so passenger can enjoy more of the famous Delta experience.

There must be a panic moment in Phoenix (or Dallas) that how could Dougie and Co. get done by Delta. Dougie and Co. wants to be seen as leaders, and they were doing a terrible job as followers too!

I'm still waiting for Leff's last AA interior rumor to come true.

I don't know if the new seats can even be retrofitted for screens. They certainly would have to be modified. With dozens of aircraft already with new seats and many more imminently coming, this is more like a pipe dream than a rumor.

I doubt it. Getting rid of IFE just makes sense. As legroom shrinks and seatbacks get thinner, the space of the equipment matters as much as the cost. They probably spend more maintaining IFEs than when they first buy them. Eventually ALL US3 will get decent WIFI and then people will forget what IFE even stood for. Most IFE product other than the latest Airshow sucks anyway. Wouldn't you rather watch Netflix or Sam Chui than free CNN?

If this is true, then about how long would it take them to finish it? In other words, approximately how many years would it take to put IFE in all their Oasis 737s and A321-neos?
~Just wondering

I hope this is true. AA IFE is actually pretty decent and user friendly. I recently flew to MIA and back from LGA on 737-800s. The flight to MIA was a newer 737-800 with the Signature interior and the new Oasis densified cabin with the thinner seats. It looked neat and tidy, but a little sad. The return flight was on an older 737-800 with PTVs and it was a really much better.

BYOD is much better than seatback IFE. Even when IFE is available, I use my iPad to stream content via WiFi.

I don’t understand what the obsession with PTVs is? What did you all do on flights before airlines started to put them in?

77H

DFW17L wrote:

BYOD is much better than seatback IFE. Even when IFE is available, I use my iPad to stream content via WiFi.

I much prefer IFE's. I don't want to hold anything, I can put on live TV (news usually) and work on my laptop. Although I wish you could bluetooth your own headset to it.

MRYapproach wrote:

I doubt it. Getting rid of IFE just makes sense. As legroom shrinks and seatbacks get thinner, the space of the equipment matters as much as the cost. They probably spend more maintaining IFEs than when they first buy them. Eventually ALL US3 will get decent WIFI and then people will forget what IFE even stood for. Most IFE product other than the latest Airshow sucks anyway. Wouldn't you rather watch Netflix or Sam Chui than free CNN?

DL's system for the A220 is basically a tablet.

Plus, I don't want to have to use my phone as an IFE device because Doug Parker assumes everyone does.

Forget IFE...drop the bag fees and I'll care.

77H wrote:

I don’t understand what the obsession with PTVs is? What did you all do on flights before airlines started to put them in?

77H

Visit the flight deck and smoke. (Not necessarily in conjunction with one another.)

KFLLCFII wrote:

Forget IFE...drop the bag fees and I'll care.

That ship has sailed... and it's not coming back.

The First Fees
It was May 2008 when American Airlines announced it would begin charging a fee for all checked-bags, the first major U.S. carrier to do so. Smaller, discount carriers such as Allegiant and Spirit had been charging bag fees since 2007 or earlier, but this was a huge step for a legacy carrier.

https://www.farecompare.com/travel-advi ... s-history/

fpetrutiu wrote:

DFW17L wrote:

BYOD is much better than seatback IFE. Even when IFE is available, I use my iPad to stream content via WiFi.

I much prefer IFE's. I don't want to hold anything, I can put on live TV (news usually) and work on my laptop. Although I wish you could bluetooth your own headset to it.

Bingo.

The high-value business customer loves this method of use of Delta’s IFE.


ILL

This is so hilarious. So Dougie gets it all of a sudden? Yeah right. AA's identity crisis is beyond absurd. On one hand they introduce a sparkling new flagship lounge at DFW, and with the other foot their domestic product is worse than even Spirit's. Yet more proof that LCC management just doesn't get it.

KFLLCFII wrote:

Forget IFE...drop the bag fees and I'll care.

Just get one of the 22 AA branded credit cards that comes with a free bag.

This could be true. Seems like AA realizes they went too far with the Oasis planes particularly the F product is just not good enough. If they are renovating could see screens go into F and maybe main cabin extra. AA operates alot on Transcons so it's been particularly stinging for frequent flyers who seemed to voiced in enough volume that AA realizes they have to do something.

People on here love to scream no one cares about PTVs but my personal experience flying alot totally disagrees.

MIflyer12 wrote:

KFLLCFII wrote:

Forget IFE...drop the bag fees and I'll care.

That ship has sailed... and it's not coming back.

The First Fees
It was May 2008 when American Airlines announced it would begin charging a fee for all checked-bags, the first major U.S. carrier to do so. Smaller, discount carriers such as Allegiant and Spirit had been charging bag fees since 2007 or earlier, but this was a huge step for a legacy carrier.

https://www.farecompare.com/travel-advi ... s-history/

You left out another major carrier which has consistently refused to introduce bag fees, and which consistently gets my business over every other US major when luggage is required for a trip because the bottom-line total cost of travel ends up consistently being the least (along with the added bonus of funds transferrability without penalty).

It's my business to lose...or gain.

If only!

DFW17L wrote:

BYOD is much better than seatback IFE. Even when IFE is available, I use my iPad to stream content via WiFi.

I definitely think it’s a matter of personal preference. I fly the ULCCs (usually F9) way more than I fly the legacies (2-4 flights a month on F9 vs 3-4 the entire year on legacies and always download stuff from iTunes (usually episodes of whatever show I’ve been watching at home) to watch on those flights. It works for me, and have even started doing that on legacies where IFE (either seatback or personal device streaming) is offered. Even on F9 flights as long as MCO-LAS it keeps me entertained. I’ve done it on AA, DL, and UA flights with PDE and seatback screens in the past and enjoy it too (DL CDG-DTW I watched episodes of The Office downloaded on my phone for a few hours before switching to seatback).

Just yesterday, I flew AA LAS-DFW-BWI (LAS-DFW on a LUS A321 with PDE, DFW-BWI on a B738 with PDE and overhead screens) and on both segments watched episodes of Grey’s Anatomy (two episodes on each segment) I downloaded on my iPhone instead of accessing whatever was offered on AA’s streaming service. Tomorrow, I’m flying UA BWI-DEN with PDE as well as seatback screens and already have several more episodes of Grey’s Anatomy downloaded and ready to go.

Again, like I said, just a personal preference. I can definitely see why seatback IFE may be preferred by some people.

9w748capt wrote:

This is so hilarious. So Dougie gets it all of a sudden? Yeah right. AA's identity crisis is beyond absurd. On one hand they introduce a sparkling new flagship lounge at DFW, and with the other foot their domestic product is worse than even Spirit's. Yet more proof that LCC management just doesn't get it.

KFLLCFII wrote:

Forget IFE...drop the bag fees and I'll care.

Just get one of the 22 AA branded credit cards that comes with a free bag.

You hate AA we get it.

chonetsao wrote:

For once, Dougie and Co. thought they figured out Delta's next move, then reacted quickly to announcing plan of removing seatback IFE so that they can claim for once Delta would be following AA. Instead DL laughed at AA and told the whole world that they will be ADDING IFE so passenger can enjoy more of the famous Delta experience.

There must be a panic moment in Phoenix (or Dallas) that how could Dougie and Co. get done by Delta. Dougie and Co. wants to be seen as leaders, and they were doing a terrible job as followers too!

What is it with calling Doug Parker "Dougie" by some here like he's a 5 year old? I don't like what has happened to the AA domestic product under his leadership either, but I don't understand the Dougie thing as it just doesn't make any sense. Do toddlers not like IFE or seat pitch and that's why he is Dougie?

Is it too difficult to criticize someone using their proper name rather than calling him as you would ask a child to eat his carrots?

I hope this happens and forces UA to follow suit.

For me IFE on a flight is a big deal. A good IFE system makes even long flights in cramped quarters a breeze. The funny thing is I rarely sit down to watch TV or a movie at home. But in the air I find it a great opportunity to sit back, relax and catch up on movies I've missed. Being able to stream to my phone on a flight that does not have a seat back screen in an improvement over nothing, but it does not compare. The screen is smaller, it is usually a pain to hold it or position it, and the viewing angle is inferior. If I'm looking at two flights, and I know only one has IFE, it is no contest which I'd prefer.

DFW17L wrote:

BYOD is much better than seatback IFE. Even when IFE is available, I use my iPad to stream content via WiFi.

Right choices aren't good. Wifi will continue and Seatback should also. Movies take too much memory. Wifi is sketchy at best. All the delays while sitting on the ground and I can watch stuff rather then wifi that makes me wait till cruise altitude. IT DOESN"T HAVE TO BE ONE OR THE OTHER, Im sure BYOD is good for some. Bringing 4 tablets for a family of four.

A bunch of people all streaming content on the planes wifi.

I much prefer seatback IFE. I don't want to mess with my phone for entertainment (too small) and don't carry a tablet. I mostly fly longhaul and typically watch 3-4 movies each segment. For any flights less than 3 hours? Who cares.

DFW17L wrote:

BYOD is much better than seatback IFE. Even when IFE is available, I use my iPad to stream content via WiFi.

I have no need for a tablet other than being forced to buy one for use on my United flights.

77H wrote:

I don’t understand what the obsession with PTVs is? What did you all do on flights before airlines started to put them in?

77H

Doesn't matter what we did before, its about today and looking forward. I don't care to worry about managing movies or tv shows I want to watch.

The benefits of having a media in customers hands to Raise the COMFORT level through DISTRACTION with today media addiction is short sighted.

MIflyer12 wrote:

KFLLCFII wrote:

Forget IFE...drop the bag fees and I'll care.

That ship has sailed... and it's not coming back.

The First Fees
It was May 2008 when American Airlines announced it would begin charging a fee for all checked-bags, the first major U.S. carrier to do so. Smaller, discount carriers such as Allegiant and Spirit had been charging bag fees since 2007 or earlier, but this was a huge step for a legacy carrier.

https://www.farecompare.com/travel-advi ... s-history/

It was US air before the merger actually.

Why not have both?
I personally like AA IFE. As a frequent MIA-LAX flyer I enjoy the excellent selection of entertainment (even though they could change the choices more often).

The streaming guys can still do their streaming and us IFE peeps will not have to worry about loading up iPads, tablets and laptops for every trip.
Maybe Duggie can't think "outside the box". BTW Mr Parker I'm waiting for your stock to make some money.

One issue I've had with PTVs is that I can't completely trust them. I've had the IFE system not work. I've had screens not work. I've had audio jacks not work. I would never travel without a backup if IFE is a must-have. And of course sometimes my personal devices have better screens and work better anyway. Are PTVs nice to have? Sure. Do I like paying extra for it? No. And generally the public agrees.

I absolutely think the peanut gallery that's cheerleading for no IFE likely takes one flight a year, if that, with their parents. I fly 3 or flights per month and many are 2-3 hour RSW-DTW-RSW or similar. I absolutely love my IFE, one movie and the flight is over. Without it, id find a way, but it would suck, period.

Not too mention, not everyone has or wishes to carry a laptop, and watching anything on your phone, cmon, you were dropped when you were a baby

PTV can be even better. What's the future of PTV? DL Flight Products newest stuff is very slim high res tablets that use wifi (so no bulky case under seat), don't require full system resets if there are issues, are line replaceable, and dont require a seat mod to add newer hardware in the future. A goal they are working on is allowing you to access your subscription entertainment via the seatback and have full access to your library (think netflix/hulu/prime/spotify/pandora etc). If they can get bluetooth onboard too, I think it's checkmate for entertainment.

Without PTVs, I'm having to either watch on a small screen phone, or pull out a tablet/laptop and make sure I have a charging cord (is there even an outlet?). If I have to rely on a battery, I've either already drained too much or I'll be drained on landing. Do I hold it or put it on the tray table? Hold it: hand gets tired or poor viewing angle. Tray table: no room for my food/drink, and the seat in front smashes everything when they recline. Middle or aisle seat? Neighbor needs to get out and I'm a mess with crap and cords, and I essentially have to wait for their return to setup camp again.

Quality PTV? Smooth. No issues with cloggig the aisle packing/unpacking crap, battery life, food/beverage real estate, getting out of seat, etc. But who says it has to be streaming vs PTV? Why not both, so everybody is happy?

I think that maybe AA has realized that their margins (and profits) are suffering because they thought the consumer would fly them and pay whatever no matter what their product was. DL offers a better experience product both soft and hard and it shows in the profits. Even AS gives out tablets while AA gets further left behind ... I am more surprised the shareholders haven’t booted Doug Parker from AA yet.

Cactusjuba wrote:

PTV can be even better. What's the future of PTV? DL Flight Products newest stuff is very slim high res tablets that use wifi (so no bulky case under seat), don't require full system resets if there are issues, are line replaceable, and dont require a seat mod to add newer hardware in the future. A goal they are working on is allowing you to access your subscription entertainment via the seatback and have full access to your library (think netflix/hulu/prime/spotify/pandora etc). If they can get bluetooth onboard too, I think it's checkmate for entertainment.

Without PTVs, I'm having to either watch on a small screen phone, or pull out a tablet/laptop and make sure I have a charging cord (is there even an outlet?). If I have to rely on a battery, I've either already drained too much or I'll be drained on landing. Do I hold it or put it on the tray table? Hold it: hand gets tired or poor viewing angle. Tray table: no room for my food/drink, and the seat in front smashes everything when they recline. Middle or aisle seat? Neighbor needs to get out and I'm a mess with crap and cords, and I essentially have to wait for their return to setup camp again.

Quality PTV? Smooth. No issues with cloggig the aisle packing/unpacking crap, battery life, food/beverage real estate, getting out of seat, etc. But who says it has to be streaming vs PTV? Why not both, so everybody is happy?

Absolutly its forward thinking and You can buy amazing stuff and get them(companies) to sponsor it.

MSPNWA wrote:

And generally the public agrees.

Oh really? Then why is it that DL continues to outperform AA and UA? Clearly people are paying more to fly DL. DL continues to invest in IFE. So how is it that people aren't willing to pay for a better experience?

DDR wrote:

9w748capt wrote:

This is so hilarious. So Dougie gets it all of a sudden? Yeah right. AA's identity crisis is beyond absurd. On one hand they introduce a sparkling new flagship lounge at DFW, and with the other foot their domestic product is worse than even Spirit's. Yet more proof that LCC management just doesn't get it.

KFLLCFII wrote:

Forget IFE...drop the bag fees and I'll care.

Just get one of the 22 AA branded credit cards that comes with a free bag.

You hate AA we get it.

No, I don't hate AA, I hate Dougie and what his LCC management has done to AA.

I've always found it interesting how AA gets so much more flack than UA does for phasing out PTVs on the domestic fleet. The criticism of AA on this one seems to always be so much more vocal, meanwhile UA is doing the exact same thing.

Really, I don't care that much, though that may because most of my domestic flights are around two hours.

If anything happens, they could have the flight attendants pass out tablets. Maybe charge a fee in economy and complimentary in first class.

intotheair wrote:

I've always found it interesting how AA gets so much more flack than UA does for phasing out PTVs on the domestic fleet. The criticism of AA on this one seems to always be so much more vocal, meanwhile UA is doing the exact same thing.

Really, I don't care that much, though that may because most of my domestic flights are around two hours.

Great point - most of the whining on a.net anyway tends to come from AA fanboys like me. I think part of it is we saw what Horton and Vahidi were aiming for which was a premium product across the board, including in Y. Well then Dougie's crew comes in and destroys literally everything, from meals to seat pitch to the AAdvantage program.

In the meantime UA was stuck in the SMI/J regime, and is only now pulling themselves out.

I think the difference between AA and UA is that pre-merger as part of the transformation to becoming the "new American", AA committed that all new planes would come equipped with PTVs, only for the Parker team to cancel those plans. IIRC the commitment to seatback video was pretty well advertised during the brand relaunch (https://www.ispot.tv/ad/71Qt/american-a ... time-flies). It's easier to attack AA because L-AA fanboys can use the IFE removal as another way to complain about Parker (make no mistake, I am no L-AA fanboy but I do resent the IFE removal decision).

Smisek and now Oscar never made a big IFE announcement like AA did. Sure, they did remove Directv from the 753s and removed the overhead screens on the Domestic 777/319/320, but I think the majority of the 737 fleet that had DirecTv still does.

Forget seat back screens, bring back hot meals and I'll be happy.

I think they can do both...ie don’t rip ife from existing....revise outstanding Airbus and Boeing deliveries to include...deploy the ife fleet to 3 hour or longer and the balance without on 3 hours or less (more or less the md80 routes out of DFW/ORD and CLT to Florida/northeast) ...

DeltaRules wrote:

MRYapproach wrote:

I doubt it. Getting rid of IFE just makes sense. As legroom shrinks and seatbacks get thinner, the space of the equipment matters as much as the cost. They probably spend more maintaining IFEs than when they first buy them. Eventually ALL US3 will get decent WIFI and then people will forget what IFE even stood for. Most IFE product other than the latest Airshow sucks anyway. Wouldn't you rather watch Netflix or Sam Chui than free CNN?

DL's system for the A220 is basically a tablet.

Plus, I don't want to have to use my phone as an IFE device because Doug Parker assumes everyone does.

DL's A220 IFE may be "basically a tablet," but it's as good, if not better than, AA's IFE offerings on the 788 in my personal opinion.

Can they also serve hot meals on flights to Hawaii instead of Wraps?

Planes4you wrote:

Can they also serve hot meals on flights to Hawaii instead of Wraps?

Would be nice, but it was only a few years ago that even on DFW-Hawaii flights, Y catering was strictly BOB or BYO, not even a complimentary wrap as they offer now. I can't imagine yields are good enough. And AA's Hawaii flights go out packed anyway.

WBM wrote:

For me IFE on a flight is a big deal. The funny thing is I rarely sit down to watch TV or a movie at home. But in the air I find it a great opportunity to sit back, relax and catch up on movies I've missed.

This is true for me as well.

DDR wrote:

9w748capt wrote:

This is so hilarious. So Dougie gets it all of a sudden? Yeah right. AA's identity crisis is beyond absurd. On one hand they introduce a sparkling new flagship lounge at DFW, and with the other foot their domestic product is worse than even Spirit's. Yet more proof that LCC management just doesn't get it.

KFLLCFII wrote:

Forget IFE...drop the bag fees and I'll care.

Just get one of the 22 AA branded credit cards that comes with a free bag.

You hate AA we get it.

No, travel in the back of an Oasis plane going for hours on end going to the west coast like many and you'll get it. He is simply pointing out reality.

I wouldn’t pay for this since I’m a kid but why is it so expensive to pre order meals on American?