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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 8:58 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
This isn’t AS, this is AA no mandatory OT if I don’t want to work extra hours I don’t have too.

That too hard to comprehend?


So, again, let's say I'm AA, and I want mandatory OT language in the contract. Let's negotiate - what do you want in exchange for that language?

Or are you saying that now and forever, you're too good to ever be required to help the operation in times of extreme, unprecedented need?

Can’t buy us since 1949 the IAM hasn’t had mandatory OT in our contract


In other words, you're unwilling to negotiate. At all.

THAT too hard to comprehend?
Last edited by EA CO AS on Tue May 21, 2019 9:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 8:58 pm

From a coworker

“A planner, with little or no real aircraft maintenance experience. Fills the on-ground time with as much work as possible...irregardless of station actual manpower, parts availability, tooling required...then the inept station manager arbitrarily assigns parts based on the ATA, not actual experience...And then all the blame falls to the lowest denominator...
US..”
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:01 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:

So, again, let's say I'm AA, and I want mandatory OT language in the contract. Let's negotiate - what do you want in exchange for that language?

Or are you saying that now and forever, you're too good to ever be required to help the operation in times of extreme, unprecedented need?

Can’t buy us since 1949 the IAM hasn’t had mandatory OT in our contract


In other words, you're unwilling to negotiate. At all.

THAT too hard to comprehend, hoss?

We are in negotiations and the company HASNT asked for mandatory OT from maintenance.

And yes I’m not willing to vote yes if the JCBA has mandatory OT in it.

The company already abuses the mandatory on the ramp and numerous grievances are always filed.

Once again since no one answers this, are you wanting mechanics not to follow the established IAW with the maintenance manuals, job cards and established policies?
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:10 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
We are in negotiations and the company HASNT asked for mandatory OT from maintenance.

And yes I’m not willing to vote yes if the JCBA has mandatory OT in it.

The company already abuses the mandatory on the ramp and numerous grievances are always filed.



I realize they haven't asked; I'm just pointing out how militant you are. You never came back with a counter-proposal, no specific language to ensure it wasn't abused or misused, etc. Wouldn't you even be interested in knowing WHY the company felt they needed that language, were they to propose it?

All of that is part of negotiation, but you're not interested in any of that. You just say "Gimme" and "No" - I have the same discussion every day with my 2 year old.
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:16 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
Did you not read the motion?

AA stated higher increases in aircraft utilization has led to less scheduled time to achieve maintenance. And this is the time of year AA increases seasonal widebody usage and flights.

And AA has increased their European flights since 2017.

And narrowbody usage has increased to make up for the grounding of the Max fleet and AA had 14 738s out of service for an extended period of time due to shoddy work by vendors who did the Oasis Mods and MD 80s being retired.


Increased, sure. They already lag the others. This also lags other majors such as KLM etc. by quite a bit.

This still does not explain how stuff suddenly has rapidly accelerated at this convenient time. Please provide some data. Otherwise, we can call this what it is - plain as day BS.
2019: SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX OAK SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHTYYZ DEN DOH BLR MAA TXL MEX
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:19 pm

I’m not militant. Im a realist. We lost so much in the two chapter 11s.
AA is making billions, Doug Parker “ We will never lose money again”. Yet they are asking us for concessions.

Doug made $19 million last year, they’ve spent $14 billion over the past several years on stock buybacks, yet the stock is in the tank and they haven’t paid down much debt.

You are on the outside looking on, you didn’t live what LUS and LAA have been through.

For example to put all the Association members on the better and lower cost insurance would cost AA $39 million a year. Yet they have spent $14 billion on buybacks.

Realist, not militant. We gave up plenty to save the company, time for returns.
Last edited by Boof02671 on Tue May 21, 2019 9:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:19 pm

What appears to be going on at AA is why airline unions have to be careful with what tools they use. Right now the people affected most are the one that pay the bills--the customers. As that harm trickles down the line, that quickly comes back to hurt the very workers it's intended to help.

If there's a legit slowdown, and I don't think AA would be this specific if there wasn't, it needs to end now. This could be a lesson on how airline union power is not good as an offensive weapon.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:24 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
I’m not militant. Im a realist.


My understanding, if I'm to believe your online profiles, is that you're also no longer an IAM member.

So why are you so invested in what's going on at AA?
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:25 pm

The Association’s response:

“WASHINGTON, May 21, 2019— The TWU-IAM Association today issued the following statement in response to American Airlines’ request for an injunction against the Association:

“It is unfortunate that American Airlines has chosen to abandon negotiating with its employees and instead go straight to federal court. The airline is frustrated with the Association for refusing to allow more of our maintenance and repair work to be outsourced to South America, China and Europe. We are also standing strong against cuts to our medical benefits and retirement security. Our members value American Airlines fliers and work hard every day to ensure they have the best experience possible.

“The Association is ready and willing to get back to the bargaining table at any time and negotiate a fair joint collective bargaining agreement, but to do so would take a willing partner. We would much prefer to be at the negotiating table than in a legal battle brought on by American.”

The TWU-IAM Association was formed in 2015 following the merger of US Airways and American Airlines. Both the Transport Workers Union (TWU) and the International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers (IAM) jointly represent Fleet Service, Mechanic and Related, and Stores employees at the merged carrier. More information about the TWU-IAM Associations and its negotiations with American Airlines is available at usaamerger.com.”

https://www.goiam.org/press-releases/tw ... s-lawsuit/
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:29 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
What appears to be going on at AA is why airline unions have to be careful with what tools they use. Right now the people affected most are the one that pay the bills--the customers. As that harm trickles down the line, that quickly comes back to hurt the very workers it's intended to help.

If there's a legit slowdown, and I don't think AA would be this specific if there wasn't, it needs to end now. This could be a lesson on how airline union power is not good as an offensive weapon.

Guess you forgot about WN last month. It achieved AMFA’s goal.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:33 pm

Association Letter to AA on Memorial Day Holiday – LOA

Dear Ms. Vaughn,

We are in receipt of your email regarding holidays on American Airlines. Your failure to personally contact any designated Association representative and your demand that we respond within two days is reflective of the disrespect you have shown your employees during this entire negotiations process. We take these matters seriously and you should too. Despite your disregard to the value of our relationship, we will respond.

As you know, the parties have reached a tentative agreement regarding holiday pay for all Association represented employees. Your email indicates a willingness to observe that tentative agreement; therefore, the Association is in full agreement to permanently implement the tentative agreement reached regarding holiday pay for all Association represented employees and for all future holidays.

The Association also agrees there are many significant disparities between the premerger employees that should be resolved. While holiday pay is important, the biggest disparity that exisits between employees is health insurance. The negative impact to employees by the company refusing to address reasonable healthcare solutions far outweighs any amount of holiday pay they may receive.

So in addition to implementing the tentative agreement on holidays, we agree to implement the other tentative agreements reached thus far in negotiations. If you are genuine in your appeal to end discrepancies, you will agree.

American Airlines has determined to stop negotiations that would bring resolution to those disparities and that would allow for completion of all open collective bargaining issues. We demand you end your negotiations boycott and agree to resume those negotiations immediately. Your refusal to engage in final negotiations is, in your own words, costing your employees millions of dollars in lost wages and other contract value.

If your proposal is to piece meal implementation of the agreed to items, then let’s get to it – we demand it.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:40 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
AA has stated in their motion high utilization leads to less ground time and the SA bases AMTS are less than stellar one posted on Facebook AMT group where does he look up a repair procedure.

You dont work here. I do.


I’ve dealt with plenty of clueless AA mechanics right here in the United States.

Super80Fan wrote:
I really do feel bad for the mechanics but I can't tell you the number of times we have landed on time only to wait at our gate for 10-20 minutes because the ground crew aren't out there yet, and this isn't even a bustling hub like DFW or ATL, this is at smaller outstations (who are not third party companies but are hired by Piedmont or DGS).

Can't say I'll feel bad when that job gets automated.


That job is already automated at the hubs, where they use automatic guidance systems instead of marshallers for arriving aircraft.

Then the ramp crew shows up whenever they feel like it and your bags get to the carousel an hour later.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:42 pm

Not true. They don’t self park in CLT or PHL.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:45 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
MSPNWA wrote:
What appears to be going on at AA is why airline unions have to be careful with what tools they use. Right now the people affected most are the one that pay the bills--the customers. As that harm trickles down the line, that quickly comes back to hurt the very workers it's intended to help.

If there's a legit slowdown, and I don't think AA would be this specific if there wasn't, it needs to end now. This could be a lesson on how airline union power is not good as an offensive weapon.

Guess you forgot about WN last month. It achieved AMFA’s goal.



Only because WN was disproportionately impacted by the MAX groundings than AA was, and AMFA chose that time to inflict maximum leverage when WN was already taking a PR beating. TWU-IAM wildly overplayed their hand with AA, thinking they’d get the same outcome.

To paraphrase a line from a movie, it may have seemed like the union had AA over a barrel, but they didn’t realize it only seemed that way, and that’s why they’re in court now instead of at the negotiating table.

The union is going to lose, badly.
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:47 pm

WN has 34 Max AA has 24.

And WN settling had nothing to with the Max groundings, read their lawsuit.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 9:57 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
WN has 34 Max AA has 24.

And WN settling had nothing to with the Max groundings, read their lawsuit.


Yes, and 34 MAX8s at WN are a much larger amount of ASMs than 24 MAX8s at AA. Combine that on top of the slowdown AMFA was already pulling at WN, and you have a recipe for an operational nightmare from a customer experience perspective. That's why WN was so quick to up the ante at the table.

But again, my understanding, if I'm to believe your online profiles where you use the same username, is that you're no longer an IAM member.

So why are you so invested in what's going on at AA?
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Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 10:04 pm

The topic is about AA suing, not me. Stay on topic. I have a vested interest
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 10:08 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
The topic is about AA suing, not me. Stay on topic. I have a vested interest


By implying that you're part of the union and/or an AA employee, you've made yourself part of the discussion.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 10:20 pm

Once again the Topic is AA suing the Association, not about me.

You don’t work for AA and numerous posters here don’t, yet you don’t ask them.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 10:38 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
Guess you forgot about WN last month. It achieved AMFA’s goal.


A) We don't yet know what, if anything, AMFA had to give to get.
B) WN and AMFA had been at it for almost 7 years. US was a still an airline at that point.
C) WN has very high margins, giving AMFA leverage--leverage the IAM-TWU doesn't have.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 10:38 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
Not true. They don’t self park in CLT or PHL.


.....And those are the two AA hubs I wait the longest in for ground crew to arrive. The automated marshaling is a God send and I hope every airport gets it.
RIP McDonnell Douglas
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 10:44 pm

MSPNWA wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
Guess you forgot about WN last month. It achieved AMFA’s goal.


A) We don't yet know what, if anything, AMFA had to give to get.
B) WN and AMFA had been at it for almost 7 years. US was a still an airline at that point.
C) WN has very high margins, giving AMFA leverage--leverage the IAM-TWU doesn't have.

Yes we do it’s all on their webpage.

They didn’t lose any scope language and made numerous financial gains, they ratified their contract overwhelmingly today

Eligible Voters
Votes Cast 2541
2379 (93.62% participation)
Accept 2251 (94.62%)
Reject 128 (5.38%)
Last edited by Boof02671 on Tue May 21, 2019 10:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 10:51 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
Once again the Topic is AA suing the Association, not about me.

You don’t work for AA and numerous posters here don’t, yet you don’t ask them.


You're the OP and posted about the lawsuit, sharing something internal from AA as if you're an employee. But again, if the other online profiles you have where you use the same username are to be believed, you're neither an AA employee nor a union member. So it's natural to wonder how you obtained the information you're sharing, why you feel you have a vested interest in the situation, etc.

You're free to defend what you feel is right, but I, as others here have done, am also free to state a case that counters yours. As I said before, my take on this is simple; the union miscalculated, badly. They thought they'd exert the same leverage at AA that AMFA did at WN, engaging in a deliberate slowdown to put pressure on the company. WN felt they had little choice but to make a deal because they generally have good relationships with their labor groups and wanted to salvage that relationship, coupled with the fact that the groundings of the MAX8s on the property made things many times worse.

While AA has their MAX8s grounded as well, it doesn't have anywhere near the same effect on the AA network as it does on the WN network, so a deliberate, orchestrated slowdown won't have the same "oh man we'd better get a deal done ASAP" results that it did at WN. And obviously, AA has what they believe to be sufficient proof to support that this was a union-orchestrated labor action or else they'd not have gone to court.

The union is going to end up losing this and paying AA quite a bit of money once this is all done.
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Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 10:58 pm

You couldn’t be more wrong The Association has the same leverage that AMFA had, if not more.

If the union is going to lose, why did AA cave and give the LAA Association Members double time and a half for Memorial Day when their CBA doesn’t require it? And it’s not even an LAA holiday in their CBA.

Why did AA bump up the LUS Association Members to double time and a half instead of double time?

AA caved, not the Association.

AA and UA both sued their respective maintenance unions in the past and lost over the same issue.

Only AA in the APA sickout dud they win, yet they agreed not to collect the fines.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:03 pm

“APFA Stands with our Sisters and Brothers at TWU and IAM. They need a respectable contract now!” —APFA President Lori Bassani
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:04 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
MSPNWA wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
Guess you forgot about WN last month. It achieved AMFA’s goal.


A) We don't yet know what, if anything, AMFA had to give to get.
B) WN and AMFA had been at it for almost 7 years. US was a still an airline at that point.
C) WN has very high margins, giving AMFA leverage--leverage the IAM-TWU doesn't have.

Yes we do it’s all on their webpage.

They didn’t lose any scope language and made numerous financial gains, they ratified their contract overwhelmingly today

Eligible Voters
Votes Cast 2541
2379 (93.62% participation)
Accept 2251 (94.62%)
Reject 128 (5.38%)

7 years Southwest mechanics went without higher salaries, saving Southwest hundreds of millions of dollars, in exchange for a signing bonus worth a fraction of those savings...
And that’s a win for AMFA in your book? Maybe for union leaders. Certainly not for any current Southwest Mechanic. Those mechanics could’ve had a full contract worth of extra salary and a new current contract in that time.
You may need to check out your dictionary definition of “winning”
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:18 pm

WN is paying them ALL their retro pay, it’s quite a large sum.
It’s around $160 million.

They lost no work and made numerous gains.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:24 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
If the union is going to lose, why did AA cave and give the LAA Association Members double time and a half for Memorial Day when their CBA doesn’t require it? And it’s not even an LAA holiday in their CBA.

Why did AA bump up the LUS Association Members to double time and a half instead of double time?


In times of extreme need, airlines have been known to allow OT and DT rates to trigger at times earlier than the contractual minimums to encourage volunteerism for extra hours when the state of the operation warrants it. AA clearly felt that in the short term, to ensure their customers were taken care of, it made sense to temporarily pay the premium rates for those hours or exceed the premium rates. They didn't do it because they were being altruistic, and they certainly didn't do it because they were caving on a long term deal - they did it in the short term to get people to work and take care of the customers during this problem.

And now that they've identified the source of the problem, they're taking legal action to correct it.
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Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:27 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
WN is paying them ALL their retro pay, it’s quite a large sum.
It’s around $160 million.

They lost no work and made numerous gains.

You urged folks to look at all the amfa wins on their website. I did. I can’t find where even amfa claims full retro.
160M/2,500 = $63k/person
That’s not full retro.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:31 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
If the union is going to lose, why did AA cave and give the LAA Association Members double time and a half for Memorial Day when their CBA doesn’t require it? And it’s not even an LAA holiday in their CBA.

Why did AA bump up the LUS Association Members to double time and a half instead of double time?


In times of extreme need, airlines have been known to allow OT and DT rates to trigger at times earlier than the contractual minimums to encourage volunteerism for extra hours when the state of the operation warrants it. AA clearly felt that in the short term, to ensure their customers were taken care of, it made sense to temporarily pay the premium rates for those hours or exceed the premium rates. They didn't do it because they were being altruistic, and they certainly didn't do it because they were caving on a long term deal - they did it in the short term to get people to work and take care of the customers during this problem.

And now that they've identified the source of the problem, they're taking legal action to correct it.

Totally wrong again it’s not going to stop them working by the book, and the Association had to sign off on it. The overwhelming opinion of employees is still against the company on Jetnet and Social Media.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:33 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
WN is paying them ALL their retro pay, it’s quite a large sum.
It’s around $160 million.

They lost no work and made numerous gains.


Again, all of this is because AMFA happened to walk into a "perfect storm" situation where they were able to get WN cornered. Their ongoing slowdown, which was already causing WN to get hammered in the press and especially in social media, was taking a huge toll. People were booking away due to the operational issues, res agents were working mandatory OT to reaccommodate customers since WN doesn't reprotect offline, and their brand was being damaged as a result.

Then, 5% of their already-stretched-thin fleet was grounded, without any real guidance on when they'd be able to get them back in the air. And due to the capacity of those planes vs. the rest of the fleet, that was a huge hit to their ASMs.

WN realized they'd be paying, one way or the other - so, do you pay in the form of continued book-aways, reduced net promoter and JD Power scores, and ongoing social media savaging each day, or once through the nose to resolve an outstanding labor dispute?

They took the latter, and AMFA has the MAX8 situation to thank for it. They'd never have gotten anywhere near the package they did without it.

The union badly miscalculated the situation when they appeared to think the MAX8 situation at AA, coupled with an illegal work action, would be their payday. Instead, they'll get a day in court.
Last edited by EA CO AS on Tue May 21, 2019 11:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:33 pm

The first TA failed as it wasn’t full retro. It’s not divided by the number of mechanics to the sum, it’s based on all hours worked. And they have 2,300 mechanics.

Go read the TA it’s there.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:35 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
Once again the Topic is AA suing the Association, not about me.

You don’t work for AA and numerous posters here don’t, yet you don’t ask them.


You're the OP and posted about the lawsuit, sharing something internal from AA as if you're an employee. But again, if the other online profiles you have where you use the same username are to be believed, you're neither an AA employee nor a union member. So it's natural to wonder how you obtained the information you're sharing, why you feel you have a vested interest in the situation, etc.



Boof please explain this. Now I have doubts that you are even an AA employee.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:40 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
The first TA failed as it wasn’t full retro. It’s not divided by the number of mechanics to the sum, it’s based on all hours worked. And they have 2,300 mechanics.

Go read the TA it’s there.

Your own numbers of the vote that you posted said 2,541 members voted.
I’ll let you figure out the rest of your math. Glad you don’t represent me in a union.
 
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Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:42 pm

JAMBOJET wrote:
Glad you don’t represent me in a union.


He doesn't appear to represent anyone in a union anymore. :duck:
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
Boof02671
Topic Author
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:44 pm

Once again the topic is the lawsuit, typical you deflect and try to attack the poster.
 
Boof02671
Topic Author
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:45 pm

And now the pilots are backing the Association

https://www.alliedpilots.org/News/ID/69 ... nd-Sisters
 
alasizon
Posts: 1810
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:52 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
And now the pilots are backing the Association

https://www.alliedpilots.org/News/ID/69 ... nd-Sisters


No, the APA is backing the Association. There is a difference between the actual pilots and the political games the unions themselves will play with one-another.
Manager on Duty & Tower Planner
 
Fixinthe757
Posts: 212
Joined: Thu Oct 17, 2013 10:48 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:53 pm

I personally am glad they outsource. Hell I work on their 777s!! Have been for over 3 years now. And as long as the union keeps on being greedy and wanting more (like they all do), they will continue to outsource as well everyone else. One of these days these union people are going to realize that THEY are the reason outsourcing happens....company cant afford to keep them in house! Take too long to get the job done and cost too much per hour. Keep outsourcing AA!
 
Boof02671
Topic Author
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Tue May 21, 2019 11:56 pm

Fixinthe757 wrote:
I personally am glad they outsource. Hell I work on their 777s!! Have been for over 3 years now. And as long as the union keeps on being greedy and wanting more (like they all do), they will continue to outsource as well everyone else. One of these days these union people are going to realize that THEY are the reason outsourcing happens....company cant afford to keep them in house! Take too long to get the job done and cost too much per hour. Keep outsourcing AA!

Please post the tail numbers so I don’t fly on the planes you work.

AA outsources the least amount of maintenance.
 
JAMBOJET
Posts: 71
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2018 6:23 pm

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 12:09 am

Boof02671 wrote:
Fixinthe757 wrote:
I personally am glad they outsource. Hell I work on their 777s!! Have been for over 3 years now. And as long as the union keeps on being greedy and wanting more (like they all do), they will continue to outsource as well everyone else. One of these days these union people are going to realize that THEY are the reason outsourcing happens....company cant afford to keep them in house! Take too long to get the job done and cost too much per hour. Keep outsourcing AA!

Please post the tail numbers so I don’t fly on the planes you work.

AA outsources the least amount of maintenance.

Out of curiosity, are you against international outsourcing or just outsourcing?
I.e. if a company in Wichita or Mobile worked on an AA plane with fully FAA certified mechanics, you’d be against that?
 
Boof02671
Topic Author
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 12:26 am

I’m against outsourcing. All that work was done in-house and it took bankruptcies to steal the work and eliminate jobs.

Certain work that couldn’t be done in-house I don’t have an issue with.

Most repair stations ie mobile have way more unlicensed mechanics working planes than licensed. Foreign repair stations are not held to the same standard as Airlines and US based MROs, the FAA hardly inspects foreign repair stations.
 
Boof02671
Topic Author
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 12:31 am

This is one of AA’s largest vendor for outsourcing, especially widebodies

http://av-info.faa.gov/repairstation.as ... o=MZAR013L
 
Boof02671
Topic Author
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 12:33 am

AA narrow body airbus overhaul vendor

http://av-info.faa.gov/repairstation.as ... o=RJEY598H

163 licensed mechanics

2231 unlicensed mechanics!
 
Boof02671
Topic Author
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 12:42 am

Gee look an AA 777 from LAX-NRT just turned around 1/3 of the way back to LAX for a maintenance issue.
 
Boof02671
Topic Author
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 12:49 am

Another AA vendor who does lots of work

http://av-info.faa.gov/repairstation.as ... o=HK0Y765N

48 licensed mechanics

714 unlicensed mechanics

How do you all feel now?
 
LMP737
Posts: 5902
Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 12:52 am

KFTG wrote:
LMP737 wrote:
So what do you do for a living?

Airlines are not jobs programs.


Do you work for one?
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
N983AN
Posts: 101
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 10:15 am

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 12:55 am

Boof02671 wrote:
AA has stated in their motion high utilization leads to less ground time and the SA bases AMTS are less than stellar one posted on Facebook AMT group where does he look up a repair procedure.

You dont work here. I do.


So are you currently an active AA employee?
 
LMP737
Posts: 5902
Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 1:02 am

UpNAWAy wrote:

Irrelevant. But it's also a job likely to be replaced by AI.


It is quite relevant. I always chuckle when I hear people repeat the mantra of how they should be happy to have jobs, technology changes, companies have to be more efficient, outsourcing is a fact of life in the business world etc, etc. I laugh because I want to tell them when they get a pink slip due in part to the before mentioned reasons I want them to come back to these forums and let us know so we can tell them the same thing.

And no, I do not work for American Airlines.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
Antarius
Posts: 1565
Joined: Thu Apr 13, 2017 1:27 pm

Re: AA sues IAM-TWU Association over alleged slowdown

Wed May 22, 2019 3:09 am

Borrowing from the FT delay thread and dkc192's post

5/21 AA169 LAX-NRT took a 6-hour trip to nowhere, returned to LAX due to MX; now delayed 17h to 0530 local tomorrow
5/22 AA170 NRT-LAX delayed 17h due to above shenanigans
5/21 AA127 DFW-PVG returned to gate and subsequently delayed 7.5h due to MX/crew availability
5/21 AA86 ORD-LHR delayed 2.5h due to MX
5/21 AA42 ORD-VCE delayed 1h and counting due to MX
5/21 AA754 PHL-CDG cancelled due to MX
5/22 AA755 CDG-PHL cancelled due to above MX (another costly one for AA...)
5/21 AA734 PHL-MAN delayed 1h and counting due to MX
5/21 AA758 PHL-ATH delayed 1.75h due to MX
5/21 AA718 PHL-FCO delayed 4h and counting due to MX
5/21 AA258 PHL-LIS delayed 1h and counting due to MX


Clear bad luck, right?
2019: SIN HKG NRT DFW IAH HOU CLT LGA JFK SFO SJC EWR SNA EYW MIA BOG LAX ORD DTW OAK PVG BOS DCA IAD ATL LAS BIS CUN PHX OAK SYD CVG PHL MAD ORY CDG SLC SJU BQN MHTYYZ DEN DOH BLR MAA TXL MEX

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