Cebu Pacific could choose between the A330neo and B787 for up to 16 frames.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cebu ... SKCN1T015G

I don’t know if this would happen at the air show but I expect United to order the E 195 e2 as a replacement for the 737-700s and their really old a319 and a320s. Those planes are getting really old and will need to start the replacement cycle in the next few years. The E2 program or whatever it might become if Boeing decides to change the name needs a big order from a big airline to gain more relevance. I think if United ordered it then other airlines would follow suit and see it as a viable replacement for the smaller versions of those mainline airplanes. I think Boeing and Embraer know this, and given the relationship between United and Boeing and how big of a customer United is for them, they might give United a discount similar to that of Delta and the A220. The only possible hiccup I see to this is Scott Kirby who has shown a tendency to go for higher capacity in the mainline given the Max 10s and the 787-10. He has expressed doubts about the viability of having what is traditionally a regional jet operate in a mainline environment. There have been rumors about a bigger e2 than the 195 so that might have potencial, but I think this would be a great opportunity for both United and Boeing/Embraer.

Looking forward to the A220 and E2 sells also looking towards MRJ program for their road map

FlyHPN wrote:

ER757 wrote:

Arion640 wrote:

Is the 787-10ER actually a real concept or is this something airliners.net has made up?

It's an A.net plane - just like the A350-1100

I believe you’ve made a typo. It’s the A350-2000.

True, it is the 2000, with a fly somewhere on the graphic for it.

These mythical planes should be shunted out of civil aviation and into the hobby section.

chiad wrote:

Cebu Pacific could choose between the A330neo and B787 for up to 16 frames.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cebu ... SKCN1T015G

Definitely see this one going Airbus. They use 9 abreast in their a330ceo, and with that config and the lower capital cost, the neo is more economical. Same reason AirAsia went neo.

Didn’t AS say somewhere that they were all-in on the MAX? What would they lose if they cancelled their 321 order (which was originally a VX order, if I’m not mistaken)? Just my opinion (flame me if you feel you need to...seems to be a trend on a.net), but I can see them going back to an all-737 fleet and the 320 family of aircraft being gone (when? no clue...) and I can’t see them making any announcement at Paris...just my two cents.

MrBren wrote:

I have recently flown from Paris to Bangalore on an AF 777. This was so noisy. I hope AF will order more A350s to get rid of these 777.

They use the B777 for Banglore? for Bombay its mostly A340 and A330.

It would be better for them to order the A330neo for their older A330's as they are in pretty bad condition. B777 is a great aircraft, was the particular B777 which you were on extra noisy or you just hate the B777 in general?

rufusmi wrote:

chiad wrote:

Cebu Pacific could choose between the A330neo and B787 for up to 16 frames.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-cebu ... SKCN1T015G

Definitely see this one going Airbus. They use 9 abreast in their a330ceo, and with that config and the lower capital cost, the neo is more economical. Same reason AirAsia went neo.

Agreed, I don't see Boeing winning this one

superbizzy73 wrote:

Didn’t AS say somewhere that they were all-in on the MAX? What would they lose if they cancelled their 321 order (which was originally a VX order, if I’m not mistaken)? Just my opinion (flame me if you feel you need to...seems to be a trend on a.net), but I can see them going back to an all-737 fleet and the 320 family of aircraft being gone (when? no clue...) and I can’t see them making any announcement at Paris...just my two cents.

AS is definitely all in on the MAX. The full 10 airplane 321 order will be accepted(only 2 left for delivery I think) but the orders for the 320NEO will probably go by the wayside. I could see AS announcing an order where they step into some of the slots from JetAirways or Garuda or some other airline that is now looking to purge the MAX. My guess would be in the 100-200 range with a 1 for 1 replace on the bus and some for growth.



Just saw from the MAX production thread that the first AS MAX is rolling out next week.....Maybe an order to coincide with the rollout?

superbizzy73 wrote:

Didn’t AS say somewhere that they were all-in on the MAX? What would they lose if they cancelled their 321 order (which was originally a VX order, if I’m not mistaken)? Just my opinion (flame me if you feel you need to...seems to be a trend on a.net), but I can see them going back to an all-737 fleet and the 320 family of aircraft being gone (when? no clue...) and I can’t see them making any announcement at Paris...just my two cents.

I assume you referring to the extreme Boeing supportive Adam Levine. His conclusion is always Boeing looks good & we should buy.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fool.c ... 7-max.aspx

unitedewr737 wrote:

I don’t know if this would happen at the air show but I expect United to order the E 195 e2 as a replacement for the 737-700s and their really old a319 and a320s. Those planes are getting really old and will need to start the replacement cycle in the next few years. The E2 program or whatever it might become if Boeing decides to change the name needs a big order from a big airline to gain more relevance. I think if United ordered it then other airlines would follow suit and see it as a viable replacement for the smaller versions of those mainline airplanes. I think Boeing and Embraer know this, and given the relationship between United and Boeing and how big of a customer United is for them, they might give United a discount similar to that of Delta and the A220. The only possible hiccup I see to this is Scott Kirby who has shown a tendency to go for higher capacity in the mainline given the Max 10s and the 787-10. He has expressed doubts about the viability of having what is traditionally a regional jet operate in a mainline environment. There have been rumors about a bigger e2 than the 195 so that might have potencial, but I think this would be a great opportunity for both United and Boeing/Embraer.

United has some pretty long A32x routes. I'd imagine the A220 is a better fit with its greater range. But United is pretty cozy with Boeing so I imagine they are pitching the E2 pretty hard. Itd be interesting to see Boeing with launch the 797 with UA and have a side of E2s; or Airbus with the A321XLR for UA and a side of A220s.

rufusmi wrote:

Definitely see this one going Airbus. They use 9 abreast in their a330ceo, and with that config and the lower capital cost, the neo is more economical. Same reason AirAsia went neo.

Please note that no particular version of either candidate was mentioned. Apart from their current routes, 5J also wants to fly to HNL and LAX nonstop (postponed for the time being). Their business model calls for an airplane able to serve both destinations most of the year, in a dense configuration -- profitably. Unless they revise their network goal to less distant places or stop somewhere along the way.

ER757 wrote:

Agreed, I don't see Boeing winning this one

The choice could go either way. While initial capex will indeed be a big factor...CASM, operations & training costs, maintenance/supply agreements, engine reliability, performance guarantees, financing/amortization, earlier availability, etc. - could swing an otherwise straightforward decision. At the end of the day, the airframer offering the more flexible aircraft with the right combination of these attributes at the best price possible would walk away with the deal.

JerseyFlyer wrote:

Maybe Phillipines will convert options on another 5 A350s, possibly -1000s for what would be their second batch.

They have options for 6 not 5 A350's. But nonetheless I'm hoping PAL those firm its option for additional A350, either (A359 or A351.),.and maybe in the future consolidate there long-hul fleet to the A350 family rather then ordering a different aircraft type to replaced there B77W.

Devilfish wrote:

rufusmi wrote:

Definitely see this one going Airbus. They use 9 abreast in their a330ceo, and with that config and the lower capital cost, the neo is more economical. Same reason AirAsia went neo.

Please note that no particular version of either candidate was mentioned. Apart from their current routes, 5J also wants to fly to HNL and LAX nonstop (postponed for the time being). Their business model calls for an airplane able to serve both destinations most of the year, in a dense configuration -- profitably. Unless they revise their network goal to less distant places or stop somewhere along the way.

ER757 wrote:

Agreed, I don't see Boeing winning this one

The choice could go either way. While initial capex will indeed be a big factor...CASM, operations & training costs, maintenance/supply agreements, engine reliability, performance guarantees, financing/amortization, earlier availability, etc. - could swing an otherwise straightforward decision. At the end of the day, the airframer offering the more flexible aircraft with the right combination of these attributes at the best price possible would walk away with the deal.

FWIW, Reuters is late. A decision is already made. The big surprise is that they will be in an ultra-dense configuration, with more seats than the current emergency exit limitation (so a new sub-variant).

cpd wrote:

FlyHPN wrote:

ER757 wrote:

It's an A.net plane - just like the A350-1100

I believe you’ve made a typo. It’s the A350-2000.

True, it is the 2000, with a fly somewhere on the graphic for it.

These mythical planes should be shunted out of civil aviation and into the hobby section.

I know there's no shortage of these mythical planes, but the A350-2000 was actually a real study by Airbus, and given recent(ish) job adverts referring to future variants of the A350, probably remains on the table.
Bregier refers to the -2000 here: https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... br-444920/

unitedewr737 wrote:

I don’t know if this would happen at the air show but I expect United to order the E 195 e2 as a replacement for the 737-700s and their really old a319 and a320s. Those planes are getting really old and will need to start the replacement cycle in the next few years.

UA's 320s are older than its 319s, with ~30 or so to be replaced within the next five years. Even the oldest 319s are a few years behind that.

unitedewr737 wrote:

I don’t know if this would happen at the air show but I expect United to order the E 195 e2 as a replacement for the 737-700s and their really old a319 and a320s. Those planes are getting really old and will need to start the replacement cycle in the next few years. The E2 program or whatever it might become if Boeing decides to change the name needs a big order from a big airline to gain more relevance. I think if United ordered it then other airlines would follow suit and see it as a viable replacement for the smaller versions of those mainline airplanes. I think Boeing and Embraer know this, and given the relationship between United and Boeing and how big of a customer United is for them, they might give United a discount similar to that of Delta and the A220. The only possible hiccup I see to this is Scott Kirby who has shown a tendency to go for higher capacity in the mainline given the Max 10s and the 787-10. He has expressed doubts about the viability of having what is traditionally a regional jet operate in a mainline environment. There have been rumors about a bigger e2 than the 195 so that might have potencial, but I think this would be a great opportunity for both United and Boeing/Embraer.

I’m not sure if Boeing can really make pricing deals on the Ejets if the deal hasn’t closed yet.

PlanesNTrains wrote:

Arion640 wrote:

ODwyerPW wrote:

787-10ER authority to offer will be announced by Boeing.

Is the 787-10ER actually a real concept or is this something airliners.net has made up?

I think it's something we made up. ANZ buying the -10 has turned into the -10 can do SYD-LHR year round.

The ANZ press releases say that Boeing improved the 787s they are buying; of course a.netters are hotly disputing any improvement viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1422937&p=21388977&hilit=anz+787#p21388977.

I believe the 2.5t reduction in MTOW is real; but that only gets about 1/2 hour of flying time. More like a PIP than an ER type enhancement.

jagraham wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

Arion640 wrote:

Is the 787-10ER actually a real concept or is this something airliners.net has made up?

I think it's something we made up. ANZ buying the -10 has turned into the -10 can do SYD-LHR year round.

The ANZ press releases say that Boeing improved the 787s they are buying; of course a.netters are hotly disputing any improvement viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1422937&p=21388977&hilit=anz+787#p21388977.

I believe the 2.5t reduction in MTOW is real; but that only gets about 1/2 hour of flying time. More like a PIP than an ER type enhancement.

According to rumors (linked at end of that thread) Boeing is looking at increasing 787-9/10 MTOW 6t to 260t.

I assume you mean 2.5t reduction in empty weight, not MTOW.

Polot wrote:

jagraham wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

I think it's something we made up. ANZ buying the -10 has turned into the -10 can do SYD-LHR year round.

The ANZ press releases say that Boeing improved the 787s they are buying; of course a.netters are hotly disputing any improvement viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1422937&p=21388977&hilit=anz+787#p21388977.

I believe the 2.5t reduction in MTOW is real; but that only gets about 1/2 hour of flying time. More like a PIP than an ER type enhancement.

According to rumors (linked at end of that thread) Boeing is looking at increasing 787-9/10 MTOW 6t to 260t.

I assume you mean 2.5t reduction in empty weight, not MTOW.

Sorry, yes empty weight

Haven't seen anything remotely official regarding a MTOW increase, but it is logical. Perhaps enough to justify an ER designation (I'm sure Boeing would not want to sell a 6t MTOW improvement for free)

B777-8X update to win Project sunrise
https://theaircurrent.com/aircraft-deve ... tas-deals/

PR77W wrote:

They have options for 6 not 5 A350's. But nonetheless I'm hoping PAL those firm its option for additional A350, either (A359 or A351.)

Maybe 5 x A35K is all they could swing. However, this does get in the way.....

https://businessmirror.com.ph/2019/05/3 ... s-in-2018/

VSMUT wrote:

FWIW, Reuters is late. A decision is already made. The big surprise is that they will be in an ultra-dense configuration, with more seats than the current emergency exit limitation (so a new sub-variant).

Considering the difficulty of getting relief for exceeding established exit limits, that suggests to me a different OEM could supply 5J's next widebody. Unless Airbus found a more efficient way of providing those graded doors (while adding even more uncomfortable slimline seats) to quickly evacuate more passengers from an A330neo.

jagraham wrote:

Polot wrote:

jagraham wrote:

The ANZ press releases say that Boeing improved the 787s they are buying; of course a.netters are hotly disputing any improvement https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtop ... #p21388977.

I believe the 2.5t reduction in MTOW is real; but that only gets about 1/2 hour of flying time. More like a PIP than an ER type enhancement.

According to rumors (linked at end of that thread) Boeing is looking at increasing 787-9/10 MTOW 6t to 260t.

I assume you mean 2.5t reduction in empty weight, not MTOW.

Sorry, yes empty weight

Haven't seen anything remotely official regarding a MTOW increase, but it is logical. Perhaps enough to justify an ER designation (I'm sure Boeing would not want to sell a 6t MTOW improvement for free)

Well, it'll be great to see something official announced then. It certainly can't hurt 7810 sales.

PlanesNTrains wrote:

unitedewr737 wrote:

I don’t know if this would happen at the air show but I expect United to order the E 195 e2 as a replacement for the 737-700s and their really old a319 and a320s. Those planes are getting really old and will need to start the replacement cycle in the next few years. The E2 program or whatever it might become if Boeing decides to change the name needs a big order from a big airline to gain more relevance. I think if United ordered it then other airlines would follow suit and see it as a viable replacement for the smaller versions of those mainline airplanes. I think Boeing and Embraer know this, and given the relationship between United and Boeing and how big of a customer United is for them, they might give United a discount similar to that of Delta and the A220. The only possible hiccup I see to this is Scott Kirby who has shown a tendency to go for higher capacity in the mainline given the Max 10s and the 787-10. He has expressed doubts about the viability of having what is traditionally a regional jet operate in a mainline environment. There have been rumors about a bigger e2 than the 195 so that might have potencial, but I think this would be a great opportunity for both United and Boeing/Embraer.

I’m not sure if Boeing can really make pricing deals on the Ejets if the deal hasn’t closed yet.

Oficial doesn’t matter, All three parties know that it’s going down and Embraer can make the pricing deal if they want the customer. Boeing could nudge them in the right direction. Even if the deal falls through, United ordering E2s is a win for both Embraer and Boeing as United wouldn’t turn to the A220.

unitedewr737 wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

unitedewr737 wrote:

I don’t know if this would happen at the air show but I expect United to order the E 195 e2 as a replacement for the 737-700s and their really old a319 and a320s. Those planes are getting really old and will need to start the replacement cycle in the next few years. The E2 program or whatever it might become if Boeing decides to change the name needs a big order from a big airline to gain more relevance. I think if United ordered it then other airlines would follow suit and see it as a viable replacement for the smaller versions of those mainline airplanes. I think Boeing and Embraer know this, and given the relationship between United and Boeing and how big of a customer United is for them, they might give United a discount similar to that of Delta and the A220. The only possible hiccup I see to this is Scott Kirby who has shown a tendency to go for higher capacity in the mainline given the Max 10s and the 787-10. He has expressed doubts about the viability of having what is traditionally a regional jet operate in a mainline environment. There have been rumors about a bigger e2 than the 195 so that might have potencial, but I think this would be a great opportunity for both United and Boeing/Embraer.

I’m not sure if Boeing can really make pricing deals on the Ejets if the deal hasn’t closed yet.

Oficial doesn’t matter, All three parties know that it’s going down and Embraer can make the pricing deal if they want the customer. Boeing could nudge them in the right direction. Even if the deal falls through, United ordering E2s is a win for both Embraer and Boeing as United wouldn’t turn to the A220.

I read your comment as Boeing being involved in E2 pricing, and that was what I was responding to. Of course it's pretty much a done deal and of course United could choose to buy the E2 with more confidence, but I'm just not sure how much of a role Boeing would be playing in the pricing at this point.

Devilfish wrote:

VSMUT wrote:

FWIW, Reuters is late. A decision is already made. The big surprise is that they will be in an ultra-dense configuration, with more seats than the current emergency exit limitation (so a new sub-variant).

Considering the difficulty of getting relief for exceeding established exit limits, that suggests to me a different OEM could supply 5J's next widebody. Unless Airbus found a more efficient way of providing those graded doors (while adding even more uncomfortable slimline seats) to quickly evacuate more passengers from an A330neo.

His comment sounded to me like they are sticking with the A330. Higher than current exit limitations suggests to me a new set of exits added. Airbus would have more motivation to do such work for such a niche sub variant (very few airlines approach current limits) with their smaller A330neo backlog. Adding new exits might be more difficult/expensive with the 787’s barrel approach too, but not sure.

Polot wrote:

His comment sounded to me like they are sticking with the A330. Higher than current exit limitations suggests to me a new set of exits added. Airbus would have more motivation to do such work for such a niche sub variant (very few airlines approach current limits) with their smaller A330neo backlog.

Aaah...2 new standard doors or double overwing exits perhaps? Then 5J must have really given up on their US mainland ambitions for now. I wonder where else they intend to deploy this sardine can...HNL With limited galleys, lavs and restrictive free baggage allowance -- should PR be worried?

pabloeing wrote:

B777-8X update to win Project sunrise
https://theaircurrent.com/aircraft-deve ... tas-deals/

I don't have a subscription. Can somebody who does summarize the 77X and 78x changes?

Air Asia might be the launch customer for A321XLR.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-airb ... SKCN1T11SG

Well jonnyc is putting out rumour that aa is looking to order a321lr. That would be pretty big.

tphuang wrote:

Well jonnyc is putting out rumour that aa is looking to order a321lr. That would be pretty big.

Yeah, presumably based from JFK/PHL.

Ishrion wrote:

tphuang wrote:

Well jonnyc is putting out rumour that aa is looking to order a321lr. That would be pretty big.

Yeah, presumably based from JFK/PHL.

They're all in on the A321 so it seems like a natural extension for them.

jagraham wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

Arion640 wrote:

Is the 787-10ER actually a real concept or is this something airliners.net has made up?

I think it's something we made up. ANZ buying the -10 has turned into the -10 can do SYD-LHR year round.

The ANZ press releases say that Boeing improved the 787s they are buying; of course a.netters are hotly disputing any improvement viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1422937&p=21388977&hilit=anz+787#p21388977.

I believe the 2.5t reduction in MTOW is real; but that only gets about 1/2 hour of flying time. More like a PIP than an ER type enhancement.

By the time NZ’s 787-10s are ready to be delivered by 2024, it’s likely an ER/LR model would be something.

I would expect NZ to be one of the first to convert there 787-10 to ER’s as soon as it was publicly available.

Under New Zealand Law and being an publicly listed company it was required to announce the order once it was signed, doesn’t mean there isn’t an ER in the works more just NZ had to legally announce there intent to comment to billions of dollars.

zkncj wrote:

jagraham wrote:

PlanesNTrains wrote:

I think it's something we made up. ANZ buying the -10 has turned into the -10 can do SYD-LHR year round.

The ANZ press releases say that Boeing improved the 787s they are buying; of course a.netters are hotly disputing any improvement viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1422937&p=21388977&hilit=anz+787#p21388977.

I believe the 2.5t reduction in MTOW is real; but that only gets about 1/2 hour of flying time. More like a PIP than an ER type enhancement.

By the time NZ’s 787-10s are ready to be delivered by 2024....

Huh? First delivery is 2022 ( ref: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... -7-billion ).

I can see Boeing pushing for plenty of 777X/787 orders plus a NMA announcement. They need all the good press they can get, and that's a good way to get it.

Continental767 wrote:

I can see Boeing pushing for plenty of 777X/787 orders plus a NMA announcement. They need all the good press they can get, and that's a good way to get it.

They've been saying for a while now there won't be an announcement this year. If they do announce, it's next year.

chiad wrote:

Air Asia might be the launch customer for A321XLR.

With AK in line, can PR be far behind I can see PAL converting up to a glut of their existing A321N later delivery order to the XLR version.

Dash8Driver16 wrote:

superbizzy73 wrote:

Didn’t AS say somewhere that they were all-in on the MAX? What would they lose if they cancelled their 321 order (which was originally a VX order, if I’m not mistaken)? Just my opinion (flame me if you feel you need to...seems to be a trend on a.net), but I can see them going back to an all-737 fleet and the 320 family of aircraft being gone (when? no clue...) and I can’t see them making any announcement at Paris...just my two cents.

AS is definitely all in on the MAX. The full 10 airplane 321 order will be accepted(only 2 left for delivery I think) but the orders for the 320NEO will probably go by the wayside. I could see AS announcing an order where they step into some of the slots from JetAirways or Garuda or some other airline that is now looking to purge the MAX. My guess would be in the 100-200 range with a 1 for 1 replace on the bus and some for growth.

Given the current MAX issues, no airline with NEO positions is going to be relinquishing them anytime soon. Customers with both on the books will be waiting to see when the MAX is back in the air (and the costs), plus compensation offered by Boeing.

If a NEO payment milestone arrives in the meantime, will either have to pay, or formalise cancellation, which I doubt would concern Airbus, financiers, or NEO customers and prospects seeking earlier deliveries.

Given the situation with the Max, at the very least, being a wake up call for airlines operating all one fleet, Alaska or any other carrier retreating to be all Max, is absolute insanity. I am not saying it wont happen, but it is insanity, will lose them customers, and come back potentially to be a major mistake.

musman9853 wrote:

Continental767 wrote:

I can see Boeing pushing for plenty of 777X/787 orders plus a NMA announcement. They need all the good press they can get, and that's a good way to get it.

They've been saying for a while now there won't be an announcement this year. If they do announce, it's next year.

Eventually Boeing will figure out the market will only wait so long . . . if the Ultrafan is ported / scaled back to the A330, Airbus can squeeze the NMA market to a sliver. Sort of like what they did with the A320NEO.

Devilfish wrote:

PR77W wrote:

They have options for 6 not 5 A350's. But nonetheless I'm hoping PAL those firm its option for additional A350, either (A359 or A351.)

Maybe 5 x A35K is all they could swing. However, this does get in the way.....

https://businessmirror.com.ph/2019/05/3 ... s-in-2018/

Considering that PAL has been quite with regards to there options for 6 additional A350 I personally wouldn't be surprised that there will be no new orders coming from them for now. Although if they did place any new order a new or additional aircraft like A321neo, A321LR or XLR, and A350.That would be good.

Devilfish wrote:

Polot wrote:

His comment sounded to me like they are sticking with the A330. Higher than current exit limitations suggests to me a new set of exits added. Airbus would have more motivation to do such work for such a niche sub variant (very few airlines approach current limits) with their smaller A330neo backlog.

Aaah...2 new standard doors or double overwing exits perhaps? Then 5J must have really given up on their US mainland ambitions for now. I wonder where else they intend to deploy this sardine can...HNL With limited galleys, lavs and restrictive free baggage allowance -- should PR be worried?

AFAIK the A330-200 / -800 has a smaller exit pair 3, which limits the capacity to 406 passengers. Replacing that with a full sized exit should push that to 440. But that's a really tight configuration.

Devilfish wrote:

chiad wrote:

Air Asia might be the launch customer for A321XLR.

With AK in line, can PR be far behind I can see PAL converting up to a glut of their existing A321N later delivery order to the XLR version.

David Neeleman (JetBlue, WestJet, Azul, TAP, Moxy) seems to be eager to order as well.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... airbus-jet

mxaxai wrote:

Devilfish wrote:

Polot wrote:

His comment sounded to me like they are sticking with the A330. Higher than current exit limitations suggests to me a new set of exits added. Airbus would have more motivation to do such work for such a niche sub variant (very few airlines approach current limits) with their smaller A330neo backlog.

Aaah...2 new standard doors or double overwing exits perhaps? Then 5J must have really given up on their US mainland ambitions for now. I wonder where else they intend to deploy this sardine can...HNL With limited galleys, lavs and restrictive free baggage allowance -- should PR be worried?

AFAIK the A330-200 / -800 has a smaller exit pair 3, which limits the capacity to 406 passengers. Replacing that with a full sized exit should push that to 440. But that's a really tight configuration.

Changing that exit to larger full size type As is already an option for the entire A330 family. It is how the A333 gets to 440 pax ( Cebu’s seat 436) as by default that variant also has smaller type 1 exits behind the wings.

chiad wrote:

Devilfish wrote:

chiad wrote:

Air Asia might be the launch customer for A321XLR.

With AK in line, can PR be far behind I can see PAL converting up to a glut of their existing A321N later delivery order to the XLR version.

David Neeleman (JetBlue, WestJet, Azul, TAP, Moxy) seems to be eager to order as well.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... airbus-jet

Just want to point out David has nothing to do with JetBlue or WestJet anymore.

Polot wrote:

Changing that exit to larger full size type As is already an option for the entire A330 family. It is how the A333 gets to 440 pax ( Cebu’s seat 436) as by default that variant also has smaller type 1 exits behind the wings.

I thought this was optional on the -300 only, thanks for correcting me. Turns out there are -200s with the larger door too.

In any case, I doubt that it's worth the weight and cost to add another door on the A330. Going from 30" to 29" pitch could gain you another row, maybe two.

The only aircraft that could profit from an added exit are the 787-10 and A350-1000. And even those only in a pure economy configuration. Not sure if the investment is worth it.

Polot wrote:

Just want to point out David has nothing to do with JetBlue or WestJet anymore.

Ah .. I didn't know that. thanks for the update.

chiad wrote:

Air Asia might be the launch customer for A321XLR.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-airb ... SKCN1T11SG

This report is not quite accurate - Airasia has 100 A321Neos on order but has yet to receive its first frame. This is expected to take place in Q3 2019.

The order for A321 XLR is likely to be another revision of Airasia X's A330 Neo order from last year. The MoU for another 34 A339s was never firmed up - Airbus' O&D spreadsheet still shows 66 firm orders. There is speculation the order will be modified to 75 A339s and some A321 XLRs will now be also included. The A321 XLRs will give Airasia X more flexibility on seasonal routes as well as for opening up new thin routes.

PR77W wrote:

Considering that PAL has been quite with regards to there options for 6 additional A350 I personally wouldn't be surprised that there will be no new orders coming from them for now. Although if they did place any new order a new or additional aircraft like A321neo, A321LR or XLR, and A350.That would be good.

Perhaps with a bit of prompting from PR (do they lurk here?) the Inquirer hastened to add that proceeds from the new share offering would be used to expand its network and acquire new planes.....

https://business.inquirer.net/271726/pa ... -expansion

It could be a part of their capacity reduction strategy...replacing their older widebodies with smaller, more efficient aircraft.

mxaxai wrote:

AFAIK the A330-200 / -800 has a smaller exit pair 3, which limits the capacity to 406 passengers. Replacing that with a full sized exit should push that to 440. But that's a really tight configuration.

Neither carrier has stated anything about the A338. While PR in theory, could presumably use it for their expansion, they're an FSC with five-star aspirations, so no overly tight configs for them.

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=MNL-ADD/AK ... LAX,&DU=nm

The concern mainly was 5J could poach most of PR's customers at HNL, given the price sensitivity of their market.

jagraham wrote:

musman9853 wrote:

Continental767 wrote:

I can see Boeing pushing for plenty of 777X/787 orders plus a NMA announcement. They need all the good press they can get, and that's a good way to get it.

They've been saying for a while now there won't be an announcement this year. If they do announce, it's next year.

Eventually Boeing will figure out the market will only wait so long . . . if the Ultrafan is ported / scaled back to the A330, Airbus can squeeze the NMA market to a sliver. Sort of like what they did with the A320NEO.

ehh, ultrafan is still a while away. if boeing can leverage black diamond to get the 797 out by 2025, idk how economical it would be for an a330neoneo considering the 787 would be getting it too.

FlyingSlowly wrote:

The problem right now is that everyone wants the Delta price on the A220s... Short of the A220-500, what reason do other large airlines have to pay more than Delta? Just play the waiting game. Someone will be desperate to sell some A220s at a bargain again, eventually.

The very idea that other carriers want the original DL pricing is ludicrous. Of course the do, but they are not entitled to DL pricing, nor will they be getting it. Some will likely point out that in some insane way, other carriers "deserve" the DL pricing, as if it is their "right." What complete HOGWASH.

The A220 is no longer the aircraft that nobody wants. There is interest and demand now that did not exist prior to the initial DL order. And besides, the reality is that only DL stepped-up with their checkbook.

When DL finally said 'Yes' and placed their initial order for 75 frames, there were no other carriers present in the outer office jockeying for position to be at the head of the line; no one else awaiting their turn at the negotiating table. DL stepped up, sat down and said "Let's do this." They took a very informed, yet significant degree of risk by committing themselves to the CSeries. That play and that positioning is what opened the door for skilled DL negotiators to walk away with very generous volume discounts. If you show up late to the party, you should not act surprised when you discover that the door prizes have been awarded, most of the food is gone and the most attractive dates have been spoken for.

There are already sufficient firm orders in place to keep the A220 production line(s) humming right along for several years. Hopefully DL will continue to place additional top off their orders to extend the production backlog further into the future. The A220-500 cannot get launched soon enough.