• 1
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 6
  • 7
  • 18
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:41 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
...
And what happens if it doesnt shut down in the "NEAR FUTURE" or could you estimate the time frame of that near future as so far so many near futures have come and AI is still eating our money and flying So Id love to have your intellect on the time line as well when your so sure about its shutting down.


It is getting pretty difficult to predict what India is going to do in any matter.

If I have to take a wild guess, it will be around next budget, 55,000 Cr divestment looks good on new recruit's performance report.

There are no options other than the shutdown, no foreign investor will invest in India and the Indian private sector has no money to invest in an airline.


I will mark your words and will come back to you if its still flying beyond the time frame you've mentioned :) ..though I wont be surprised if it does keep flying for Ive been hearing about its shut down for a long time now So lets wait and watch :lol:
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:16 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
...
And what happens if it doesnt shut down in the "NEAR FUTURE" or could you estimate the time frame of that near future as so far so many near futures have come and AI is still eating our money and flying So Id love to have your intellect on the time line as well when your so sure about its shutting down.


It is getting pretty difficult to predict what India is going to do in any matter.

If I have to take a wild guess, it will be around next budget, 55,000 Cr divestment looks good on new recruit's performance report.

There are no options other than the shutdown, no foreign investor will invest in India and the Indian private sector has no money to invest in an airline.


There is another option, which should have been the logical first option, the GOI should sell AI debt free and with free rights to restructure AI's staff and fleet/operations after close. The GOI can pre negotiate the severance plan. I believe it was the debt load that stalled the last deal. That said, I think AI won't be privatized for a few years. Once Spice or Indigo or Vistara steps up on international connectivity, then privatization will make sense. Any buyer of AI will probably cut routes. I don't think India can afford the loss of connectivity with the current Jet loss. I really don't think AI should be expanding on any routes where they aren't already making money. If they are going to lose money at least launch routes that others can't (like DEL-DFW/LAX). Flying to DXB to only lose money is crazy. Let the private carriers take the regional routes. This is where I wish India had more of a US type approach to slot allocation. For example, if Vistara was willing to launch a BOM-DXB shuttle like Jet had (call it 5 flights a day speed out over the day) and the GOI knows form stats that business demand is there, then give it to them. Some routes need frequency more than more airline competition.
 
edealinfo
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:11 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:19 pm

unrave wrote:
IndiGo to launch daily flights on Delhi-Chengdu from 15SEP

Doesn’t Spicejet operate this route? If so, my hunch is that Spicejet will be driven out. Indigo may be ruthless in selecting routes that also penalizes Indian competitors.

By the way, what exactly does india’s Competition Authority do?
 
User avatar
unrave
Posts: 2640
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:37 pm

edealinfo wrote:
unrave wrote:
IndiGo to launch daily flights on Delhi-Chengdu from 15SEP

Doesn’t Spicejet operate this route? If so, my hunch is that Spicejet will be driven out. Indigo may be ruthless in selecting routes that also penalizes Indian competitors.

By the way, what exactly does india’s Competition Authority do?

1. You really really need to get your facts right. SpiceJet does not operate any flights to mainland China.
2. You really really need to understand what the CCI (it is a commission, not an authority) can and cannot do. (Hint: It never stops things that *increase* competition)
Denial of racism is as egregious as racism itself
 
User avatar
unrave
Posts: 2640
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:39 pm

FligtReporter wrote:

I will mark your words and will come back to you if its still flying beyond the time frame you've mentioned :) ..though I wont be surprised if it does keep flying for Ive been hearing about its shut down for a long time now So lets wait and watch :lol:

That account has a proven track record of predicting the most outlandish things with utmost confidence which never come to fruition, so don't hold your breath.
Denial of racism is as egregious as racism itself
 
User avatar
Viman
Posts: 59
Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:30 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:50 pm

FligtReporter wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
...
And what happens if it doesnt shut down in the "NEAR FUTURE" or could you estimate the time frame of that near future as so far so many near futures have come and AI is still eating our money and flying So Id love to have your intellect on the time line as well when your so sure about its shutting down.


It is getting pretty difficult to predict what India is going to do in any matter.

If I have to take a wild guess, it will be around next budget, 55,000 Cr divestment looks good on new recruit's performance report.

There are no options other than the shutdown, no foreign investor will invest in India and the Indian private sector has no money to invest in an airline.


I will mark your words and will come back to you if its still flying beyond the time frame you've mentioned :) ..though I wont be surprised if it does keep flying for Ive been hearing about its shut down for a long time now So lets wait and watch :lol:


Some of his older predictions are Jet Airways is fine and it is all a media hit job by Indigo, he was pleading mods to close the Jet shutdown threads, his post in Indian politics thread were predicting win for Sonia Maino and crushing defeat for Modi. He does not even live in India, it is good to have few Indians on this forum now otherwise it would have become a propaganda website.
 
User avatar
Viman
Posts: 59
Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2018 3:30 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:59 pm

Reached BOM few days back, Indigo was on-time as usual, i used to travel a lot on Jet airways so free food and Jet Wifi IFE were missing but i understand those were not sustainable and frankly for short trips Indigo with its frequency and on time performance is an excellent option.

There will be decent amount of turbulence near BOM due to weather conditions, also can spot those Jet 737 named as Spicejet, looks weird, so hopefully they repaint the planes after few months when the peak summer season is over.
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:12 pm

Viman wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:

It is getting pretty difficult to predict what India is going to do in any matter.

If I have to take a wild guess, it will be around next budget, 55,000 Cr divestment looks good on new recruit's performance report.

There are no options other than the shutdown, no foreign investor will invest in India and the Indian private sector has no money to invest in an airline.


I will mark your words and will come back to you if its still flying beyond the time frame you've mentioned :) ..though I wont be surprised if it does keep flying for Ive been hearing about its shut down for a long time now So lets wait and watch :lol:


Some of his older predictions are Jet Airways is fine and it is all a media hit job by Indigo, he was pleading mods to close the Jet shutdown threads, his post in Indian politics thread were predicting win for Sonia Maino and crushing defeat for Modi. He does not even live in India, it is good to have few Indians on this forum now otherwise it would have become a propaganda website.


Oh lol..Thanks for letting me know.Im new in the forums so Im not really aware of the track records of people..I thought he was an indian but since he doesnt even live in our country then I will give as much attention to his words as we give to Rahul Gandhi probably :bouncy:

Thanks for saving me brother and all you brothers in here..Plz do excuse me if I say somethin wrong as Im still immature in aviation and I will evolve when I learn and ask questions and Im sure bros like you will make me more aware about the present stats and conditons of our aviation industry

Jai Hind
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:16 pm

unrave wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:

I will mark your words and will come back to you if its still flying beyond the time frame you've mentioned :) ..though I wont be surprised if it does keep flying for Ive been hearing about its shut down for a long time now So lets wait and watch :lol:

That account has a proven track record of predicting the most outlandish things with utmost confidence which never come to fruition, so don't hold your breath.


Im really thankful of you for saving me bro..I wont be asking any questions from that person who isnt even aware of our aviation and as other poster said that his prediction about Jet was definitely the opposite so I assume AI will continue to fly for another 70+ years :rotfl:

Im new here and learning and Im thankful to bros like you who are here to save me from missleading folks who are pretty much like trolls and write about things and industry which they aint even a part of.
Thank you bro !
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:19 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
...
And what happens if it doesnt shut down in the "NEAR FUTURE" or could you estimate the time frame of that near future as so far so many near futures have come and AI is still eating our money and flying So Id love to have your intellect on the time line as well when your so sure about its shutting down.


It is getting pretty difficult to predict what India is going to do in any matter.

If I have to take a wild guess, it will be around next budget, 55,000 Cr divestment looks good on new recruit's performance report.

There are no options other than the shutdown, no foreign investor will invest in India and the Indian private sector has no money to invest in an airline.


There is another option, which should have been the logical first option, the GOI should sell AI debt free and with free rights to restructure AI's staff and fleet/operations after close. The GOI can pre negotiate the severance plan. I believe it was the debt load that stalled the last deal. That said, I think AI won't be privatized for a few years. Once Spice or Indigo or Vistara steps up on international connectivity, then privatization will make sense. Any buyer of AI will probably cut routes. I don't think India can afford the loss of connectivity with the current Jet loss. I really don't think AI should be expanding on any routes where they aren't already making money. If they are going to lose money at least launch routes that others can't (like DEL-DFW/LAX). Flying to DXB to only lose money is crazy. Let the private carriers take the regional routes. This is where I wish India had more of a US type approach to slot allocation. For example, if Vistara was willing to launch a BOM-DXB shuttle like Jet had (call it 5 flights a day speed out over the day) and the GOI knows form stats that business demand is there, then give it to them. Some routes need frequency more than more airline competition.


Thanks for your insight Mr.Caliguy and I assume your an indian ethnic person and someone who is aware of the indian civil aviation So I believe your statements and the hidden fact,which I find it pretty anticipatory and my own feeling,is you mentioning AI wont be privatised "FOR FEW YEARS" which leads me to believe AI will continue to operate as it is which means its highly likely for it to not get privatised against all the hype Modi gov has created over last few weeks.

So it means we probably have to just pray and hope that AI improves their services thats all I can say and expect and I think the gov should forget all this privatisation thing and instead tighten the knot of their management.

Thanks again Mr.California
Last edited by FligtReporter on Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:22 pm

Viman wrote:
Reached BOM few days back, Indigo was on-time as usual, i used to travel a lot on Jet airways so free food and Jet Wifi IFE were missing but i understand those were not sustainable and frankly for short trips Indigo with its frequency and on time performance is an excellent option.

There will be decent amount of turbulence near BOM due to weather conditions, also can spot those Jet 737 named as Spicejet, looks weird, so hopefully they repaint the planes after few months when the peak summer season is over.


Bro i think Spicejet is a brandless airline cause I have even seen their planes fully white and some with red winglets and some just clowny colours and ads..they are pretty much clown airline So even if they dont repaint them no one really cares..Im sure if you ask some folks out there about their logo some wont even be able to tell..dunno what Spice is upto but they definitely aint got no brand for sure..As For indiGo thats a class apart the best LCC in the world IMO
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:36 pm

FligtReporter wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:

It is getting pretty difficult to predict what India is going to do in any matter.

If I have to take a wild guess, it will be around next budget, 55,000 Cr divestment looks good on new recruit's performance report.

There are no options other than the shutdown, no foreign investor will invest in India and the Indian private sector has no money to invest in an airline.


There is another option, which should have been the logical first option, the GOI should sell AI debt free and with free rights to restructure AI's staff and fleet/operations after close. The GOI can pre negotiate the severance plan. I believe it was the debt load that stalled the last deal. That said, I think AI won't be privatized for a few years. Once Spice or Indigo or Vistara steps up on international connectivity, then privatization will make sense. Any buyer of AI will probably cut routes. I don't think India can afford the loss of connectivity with the current Jet loss. I really don't think AI should be expanding on any routes where they aren't already making money. If they are going to lose money at least launch routes that others can't (like DEL-DFW/LAX). Flying to DXB to only lose money is crazy. Let the private carriers take the regional routes. This is where I wish India had more of a US type approach to slot allocation. For example, if Vistara was willing to launch a BOM-DXB shuttle like Jet had (call it 5 flights a day speed out over the day) and the GOI knows form stats that business demand is there, then give it to them. Some routes need frequency more than more airline competition.


Thanks for your insight Mr.Caliguy


Thank you. Btw I don't live in India and have never been an Indian citizen. That said, I have been on this forum for years and years and have a love for Indian aviation. Would love to see India have strong airlines with a global footprint and true connecting hubs. You said you were new here, so I look forward to your opnions and comments. I hope you don't buy into the hate on this thread regarding national origin and residency (like the above post). That should never matter. Judge people's comments on their value and challenge them when they are wrong. Some posters seek to silence people by personally attacking them (sadly an ongoing issue on the Indian threads). We all benefit from a vibrant dialog from all. Peace.
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:41 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
the GOI should sell AI debt free ...


Between 11/18 and 3/19 there were multiple news articles and GoI's own PIB claiming 29,464 Cr debt have been moved to an SPV. Are these news real or fake? If it is true why are we talking about 55,000 Cr debt? 25,000 Cr is liabilities associated with av assets, whoever gets the planes assume liabilities.

Isn't AI technically debt free?

http://www.pib.nic.in/Pressreleaseshare ... ID=1566763
https://www.livemint.com/news/india/cab ... 80901.html
https://www.business-standard.com/artic ... 284_1.html
 
User avatar
unrave
Posts: 2640
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:44 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:

Isn't AI technically debt free?


FACTCHECK: It isn't. Even technically.
Denial of racism is as egregious as racism itself
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:45 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:

There is another option, which should have been the logical first option, the GOI should sell AI debt free and with free rights to restructure AI's staff and fleet/operations after close. The GOI can pre negotiate the severance plan. I believe it was the debt load that stalled the last deal. That said, I think AI won't be privatized for a few years. Once Spice or Indigo or Vistara steps up on international connectivity, then privatization will make sense. Any buyer of AI will probably cut routes. I don't think India can afford the loss of connectivity with the current Jet loss. I really don't think AI should be expanding on any routes where they aren't already making money. If they are going to lose money at least launch routes that others can't (like DEL-DFW/LAX). Flying to DXB to only lose money is crazy. Let the private carriers take the regional routes. This is where I wish India had more of a US type approach to slot allocation. For example, if Vistara was willing to launch a BOM-DXB shuttle like Jet had (call it 5 flights a day speed out over the day) and the GOI knows form stats that business demand is there, then give it to them. Some routes need frequency more than more airline competition.


Thanks for your insight Mr.Caliguy


Thank you. Btw I don't live in India and have never been an Indian citizen. That said, I have been on this forum for years and years and have a love for Indian aviation. Would love to see India have strong airlines with a global footprint and true connecting hubs. You said you were new here, so I look forward to your opnions and comments. I hope you don't buy into the hate on this thread regarding national origin and residency (like the above post). That should never matter. Judge people's comments on their value and challenge them when they are wrong. Some posters seek to silence people by personally attacking them (sadly an ongoing issue on the Indian threads). We all benefit from a vibrant dialog from all. Peace.


Verily,I second every word of yours.Irrespective of someones nationality or ethinicity we must respect to what peoples opinions are and limit our dialouges persistent to the content of the dialouge.I mean I would love to have an insight by someone like you who even not being an Indian still has ample knowledge and keen observance on my country's aviation rather than someone who is an Indian but knows nothing about Civil Aviation in India.

So Thanks again for your kind words..I'll be looking forward to asking more questions and sharing my own thoughts which might be a bit puerile,However,I hope more researched folks like you wouldn't mind that.

Regards Mr.California Guy
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:48 pm

FligtReporter wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
dtw2hyd wrote:

It is getting pretty difficult to predict what India is going to do in any matter.

If I have to take a wild guess, it will be around next budget, 55,000 Cr divestment looks good on new recruit's performance report.

There are no options other than the shutdown, no foreign investor will invest in India and the Indian private sector has no money to invest in an airline.


There is another option, which should have been the logical first option, the GOI should sell AI debt free and with free rights to restructure AI's staff and fleet/operations after close. The GOI can pre negotiate the severance plan. I believe it was the debt load that stalled the last deal. That said, I think AI won't be privatized for a few years. Once Spice or Indigo or Vistara steps up on international connectivity, then privatization will make sense. Any buyer of AI will probably cut routes. I don't think India can afford the loss of connectivity with the current Jet loss. I really don't think AI should be expanding on any routes where they aren't already making money. If they are going to lose money at least launch routes that others can't (like DEL-DFW/LAX). Flying to DXB to only lose money is crazy. Let the private carriers take the regional routes. This is where I wish India had more of a US type approach to slot allocation. For example, if Vistara was willing to launch a BOM-DXB shuttle like Jet had (call it 5 flights a day speed out over the day) and the GOI knows form stats that business demand is there, then give it to them. Some routes need frequency more than more airline competition.


Thanks for your insight Mr.Caliguy and I assume your an indian ethnic person and someone who is aware of the indian civil aviation So I believe your statements and the hidden fact,which I find it pretty anticipatory and my own feeling,is you mentioning AI wont be privatised "FOR FEW YEARS" which leads me to believe AI will continue to operate as it is which means its highly likely for it to not get privatised against all the hype Modi gov has created over last few weeks.

So it means we probably have to just pray and hope that AI improves their services thats all I can say and expect and I think the gov should forget all this privatisation thing and instead tighten the knot of their management.

Thanks again Mr.California


This is just my opinion. I do not have any secret knowledge and do not work in aviation. No one on this forum knows what will happen to AI. Not that anyone would do this, but you could go back a few years on the Indian aviation thread and read all the discussions about past AI privatization attempts. Been quite a roller coaster. The last time AI was put on the block many thought Modi was determined to privatize. But sadly the process broke down over debt forgiveness. That will be key again. Let's see...

I don't think my ethnicity is unknown on the forum (I haven't hidden it), but I won't answer now to just make a point. It doesn't matter. Would you like a poster on an American or EU forum disregarding you because you are Indian (and actually writing it and encouraging other people to disregard you)? There are going to be so many great topics to discuss and speculate on in the coming months. Let's focus on that rather than these silly (and very inappropriate) ways of interacting with each other. Sorry you got put in the middle of the mess of this forum. But I do look forward to your opinions and comments.
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 2:54 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:

There is another option, which should have been the logical first option, the GOI should sell AI debt free and with free rights to restructure AI's staff and fleet/operations after close. The GOI can pre negotiate the severance plan. I believe it was the debt load that stalled the last deal. That said, I think AI won't be privatized for a few years. Once Spice or Indigo or Vistara steps up on international connectivity, then privatization will make sense. Any buyer of AI will probably cut routes. I don't think India can afford the loss of connectivity with the current Jet loss. I really don't think AI should be expanding on any routes where they aren't already making money. If they are going to lose money at least launch routes that others can't (like DEL-DFW/LAX). Flying to DXB to only lose money is crazy. Let the private carriers take the regional routes. This is where I wish India had more of a US type approach to slot allocation. For example, if Vistara was willing to launch a BOM-DXB shuttle like Jet had (call it 5 flights a day speed out over the day) and the GOI knows form stats that business demand is there, then give it to them. Some routes need frequency more than more airline competition.


Thanks for your insight Mr.Caliguy and I assume your an indian ethnic person and someone who is aware of the indian civil aviation So I believe your statements and the hidden fact,which I find it pretty anticipatory and my own feeling,is you mentioning AI wont be privatised "FOR FEW YEARS" which leads me to believe AI will continue to operate as it is which means its highly likely for it to not get privatised against all the hype Modi gov has created over last few weeks.

So it means we probably have to just pray and hope that AI improves their services thats all I can say and expect and I think the gov should forget all this privatisation thing and instead tighten the knot of their management.

Thanks again Mr.California


This is just my opinion. I do not have any secret knowledge and do not work in aviation. No one on this forum knows what will happen to AI. Not that anyone would do this, but you could go back a few years on the Indian aviation thread and read all the discussions about past AI privatization attempts. Been quite a roller coaster. The last time AI was put on the block many thought Modi was determined to privatize. But sadly the process broke down over debt forgiveness. That will be key again. Let's see...

I don't think my ethnicity is unknown on the forum (I haven't hidden it), but I won't answer now to just make a point. It doesn't matter. Would you like a poster on an American or EU forum disregarding you because you are Indian (and actually writing it and encouraging other people to disregard you)? There are going to be so many great topics to discuss and speculate on in the coming months. Let's focus on that rather than these silly (and very inappropriate) ways of interacting with each other. Sorry you got put in the middle of the mess of this forum. But I do look forward to your opinions and comments.


i agree and have answered on my previous post...I tha nk you again for your kind words of advise for me and I surely will keep it in mind.
Thanks again Mr.California
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:13 pm

FligtReporter wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:

Thanks for your insight Mr.Caliguy


Thank you. Btw I don't live in India and have never been an Indian citizen. That said, I have been on this forum for years and years and have a love for Indian aviation. Would love to see India have strong airlines with a global footprint and true connecting hubs. You said you were new here, so I look forward to your opnions and comments. I hope you don't buy into the hate on this thread regarding national origin and residency (like the above post). That should never matter. Judge people's comments on their value and challenge them when they are wrong. Some posters seek to silence people by personally attacking them (sadly an ongoing issue on the Indian threads). We all benefit from a vibrant dialog from all. Peace.


Verily,I second every word of yours.Irrespective of someones nationality or ethinicity we must respect to what peoples opinions are and limit our dialouges persistent to the content of the dialouge.I mean I would love to have an insight by someone like you who even not being an Indian still has ample knowledge and keen observance on my country's aviation rather than someone who is an Indian but knows nothing about Civil Aviation in India.

So Thanks again for your kind words..I'll be looking forward to asking more questions and sharing my own thoughts which might be a bit puerile,However,I hope more researched folks like you wouldn't mind that.

Regards Mr.California Guy


Great thanks - we need a like button on net :)
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:19 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:

Thank you. Btw I don't live in India and have never been an Indian citizen. That said, I have been on this forum for years and years and have a love for Indian aviation. Would love to see India have strong airlines with a global footprint and true connecting hubs. You said you were new here, so I look forward to your opnions and comments. I hope you don't buy into the hate on this thread regarding national origin and residency (like the above post). That should never matter. Judge people's comments on their value and challenge them when they are wrong. Some posters seek to silence people by personally attacking them (sadly an ongoing issue on the Indian threads). We all benefit from a vibrant dialog from all. Peace.


Verily,I second every word of yours.Irrespective of someones nationality or ethinicity we must respect to what peoples opinions are and limit our dialouges persistent to the content of the dialouge.I mean I would love to have an insight by someone like you who even not being an Indian still has ample knowledge and keen observance on my country's aviation rather than someone who is an Indian but knows nothing about Civil Aviation in India.

So Thanks again for your kind words..I'll be looking forward to asking more questions and sharing my own thoughts which might be a bit puerile,However,I hope more researched folks like you wouldn't mind that.

Regards Mr.California Guy


Great thanks - we need a like button on net :)


Yes we do ..Hope someone invents a like button foe these forums soon !
 
edealinfo
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:11 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:21 pm

Vistara announces several new flights from Mumbai. Go Vistara, go!

https://livefromalounge.boardingarea.co ... ts-mumbai/
 
edealinfo
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:11 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:36 pm

edealinfo wrote:
Vistara announces several new flights from Mumbai. Go Vistara, go!

https://livefromalounge.boardingarea.co ... ts-mumbai/


Interesting points from the article:

1. The Government has already allotted 63 percent (close to two third) of Jet’s overall slots.

2. Of 48 slots (24 pairs) allowed to Vistara in Mumbai, it has already utilized 42 slots (21 pairs). This means it has permission to add 3 more slot pairs at Mumbai.

3. Vistara was allotted 110 slots of which 48 slots or 44 percent was directed towards Bombay. Why didn’t they go all-in for Bombay?
 
anshabhi
Posts: 2111
Joined: Thu Oct 20, 2016 10:40 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:42 pm

26 flights diverted due to sandstorm at DEL

https://mobile.twitter.com/agrawalharsh ... 2353988619

Delhi has such an extreme weather- 2 days ago it was 48°C and now a sand storm
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:53 pm

edealinfo wrote:
Vistara announces several new flights from Mumbai. Go Vistara, go!

https://livefromalounge.boardingarea.co ... ts-mumbai/


Great News for Vistara ! I really like their product however I feel they should do away with their Premium Economy as it doesnt make any sense..on one of my recent flights I saw only 4 people sitting in the whole PE also their PE is like what AI offers in its Economy like 25KG baggage,Great Legroom Minus the welcome drinks and menu but yes the food presentation is the same on a tray.

I dunno what the future holds for Vistara but I think their PE model will hurt them and probably they will scrap it from their cabins. lets see.
 
avier
Posts: 915
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:54 pm

Suspension of operations at airports in Gujarat due to Cyclone Vayu.
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:21 pm

edealinfo wrote:
Vistara announces several new flights from Mumbai. Go Vistara, go!

https://livefromalounge.boardingarea.co ... ts-mumbai/


I get that Vistara didn't get too many slots. I just wish their network out of BOM would be larger (meaning more city pairs). I fear that in the end, BOM will end up with a net plus frequency on trunk routes like BOM-BLR/DEL/CCU etc but lose connectivity to a lot of cities. Let's see the final analysis. That said, maybe some routes are better served by LCCs because of low business traffic. I wonder what the min connectivity Vistara would need at BOM to maintain a min long haul network out of BOM - say LHR 2X and 1X to 2 EU hubs (so 4 daily long haul flights).
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 4:52 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
edealinfo wrote:
Vistara announces several new flights from Mumbai. Go Vistara, go!

https://livefromalounge.boardingarea.co ... ts-mumbai/


I get that Vistara didn't get too many slots. I just wish their network out of BOM would be larger (meaning more city pairs). I fear that in the end, BOM will end up with a net plus frequency on trunk routes like BOM-BLR/DEL/CCU etc but lose connectivity to a lot of cities. Let's see the final analysis. That said, maybe some routes are better served by LCCs because of low business traffic. I wonder what the min connectivity Vistara would need at BOM to maintain a min long haul network out of BOM - say LHR 2X and 1X to 2 EU hubs (so 4 daily long haul flights).


I hope UK flies to Houston or Southern US for theres a lot of Indian diaspora there and its not served by neither AI nor the American 3 However with AI already forcing Etihad to scrap their SFO and flying to 5 US cities I dont think UK would be able to fill their 789s if they fly to the same cities as AI or any of the A3 do..So lets see where they choose to fly in long haul may be africa or South America lol
 
User avatar
lightsaber
Moderator
Posts: 18155
Joined: Wed Jan 19, 2005 10:55 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:03 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
edealinfo wrote:
Vistara announces several new flights from Mumbai. Go Vistara, go!

https://livefromalounge.boardingarea.co ... ts-mumbai/


I get that Vistara didn't get too many slots. I just wish their network out of BOM would be larger (meaning more city pairs). I fear that in the end, BOM will end up with a net plus frequency on trunk routes like BOM-BLR/DEL/CCU etc but lose connectivity to a lot of cities. Let's see the final analysis. That said, maybe some routes are better served by LCCs because of low business traffic. I wonder what the min connectivity Vistara would need at BOM to maintain a min long haul network out of BOM - say LHR 2X and 1X to 2 EU hubs (so 4 daily long haul flights).

When slots are precious, tertiary cities are dropped to add frequency for high yield passengers, so this is the logical outcome of slot limitations.

Mumbai is past due for more airport capacity. Until then, passengers will just have to connect.

Lightsaber
IM messages to mods on warnings and bans will be ignored and nasty ones will result in a ban.
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:13 pm

Talking about Vistara...With their PE in a price conscious market like India will they be able to even survive half as Kingfisher or Jet Airways ?

Though I have trust in them because they are a product of two finest and most professional brands in the world so they may survive however nothing can be said about brands in today's competitive world where kings are the likes of IndiGo and Air Asia apparently lolz
 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 7120
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:16 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
...I wonder what the min connectivity Vistara would need at BOM to maintain a min long haul network out of BOM - say LHR 2X and 1X to 2 EU hubs (so 4 daily long haul flights).


Where would Vistara get the money to buy these slots in the open market? Without money they have to wait for AI to die, so GoI will give away AI's slots to the airlines on the nice list. 9W was wishing for the same before it went down.

Indian aviation methods didn't change, just players are changing.
 
avier
Posts: 915
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:28 pm

lightsaber wrote:
When slots are precious, tertiary cities are dropped to add frequency for high yield passengers, so this is the logical outcome of slot limitations.


Not completely true. Tertiary cities can be money makers actually since they have very little to NIL competition and that's exactly what Spicejet is doing using the new Jet slots at BOM. List of such cities I can recollect SpiceJet added recently from BOM are :
Gorakhpur/Durgapur/Madurai/Vijayawada/Tirupati/Dehradun/Bagdogra/Kanpur.
Most of these routes have Spice as the sole carrier on the route. Half of them not even served by Jet earlier. Still the slots were used for opening up non-Jet routes.

Cities from Jets network lacking connectivity from BOM to such towns are Rajkot/Aurangabad/Bhuj/Jodhpur, and some more maybe. Air India is minting money on these routes as it has a monopoly on these routes currently offering just single daily flights. These routes charged a premium even during Jet days because of lack of LCC's on the route.
Some of these towns are small but serve as industrial towns hence their importance for frequent business travelers.
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
...I wonder what the min connectivity Vistara would need at BOM to maintain a min long haul network out of BOM - say LHR 2X and 1X to 2 EU hubs (so 4 daily long haul flights).


Where would Vistara get the money to buy these slots in the open market? Without money they have to wait for AI to die, so GoI will give away AI's slots to the airlines on the nice list. 9W was wishing for the same before it went down.

Indian aviation methods didn't change, just players are changing.


And it appears all those who "WISHED" for AI to die DIED themselves :rotfl:

Honestly I believe AI is probably gonna fly forEVER thats different case as to who owns it But Im certain that AI is the only Indian airline that Will continue to fly and Why ?

1.Its GOI's darling and they have kept it afloat for the last 74+ years and will continue to do so for theres not only an Emotional touch but also it has its own unique identity and as ironical as it may sound but thats true

2.AI being gov owned flies to many indian towns ans cities where no Private carier dares to fly like Agra,Khajuraho,Shimla,Ludhiana,Pasighat,Pantnagar etc and I think govt does sort of cashes in on its policy of making the common man of every small town fly.
So AI sort of acts as a tool for the GOI

3.I believe their diplomacy also plays AI as a tool to use in making relations better with other countries like recently AI being given SPECIAL Status of being the only Commercial Airline in the world to fly over Oman and KSA enroute Israel.


And Lastly to those who keep praying and wishing for AI to die have actually gone themselves like Kingfishers and Now 9W...I would suggest UK to stay away from this thought of wishing for AI to die etc but concentrate on their own business for AI is a mess that gov has created itself and given the mess AI its like an entity No gov under their regime would want to be responsible for the Demise of..so Be it Modi or Congress No one would wanna have the tittle of "Oh They Killed the Maharaja" etc or "First they Killed 9W and nw AI" and this is the truth.


Now AI haters or those who Wish AI to die should actually wish for Indian population to go down instead for as long as India will have a huge Middle class Huge number of people contributin to the economy the gov will get richer and the richer the gov will get the more it will pump in the money to AI :lol:

So AI isnt going anywhere anytime SOON i reckon !
Last edited by FligtReporter on Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:37 pm

dtw2hyd wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
...I wonder what the min connectivity Vistara would need at BOM to maintain a min long haul network out of BOM - say LHR 2X and 1X to 2 EU hubs (so 4 daily long haul flights).


Where would Vistara get the money to buy these slots in the open market? Without money they have to wait for AI to die, so GoI will give away AI's slots to the airlines on the nice list. 9W was wishing for the same before it went down.

Indian aviation methods didn't change, just players are changing.


They would lease the slot pairs I would imagine. In the open market or maybe EY will lease it to them!!! Looking at EY's flight schedule from LHR post Jet, those added slots aren't doing much for EY. Also Vistara should get one night departure from LHR as a new entrant (I know not guaranteed but these do come and go - look at the Chinese airlines).
 
binayak
Posts: 972
Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:00 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:38 pm

FligtReporter wrote:
Talking about Vistara...With their PE in a price conscious market like India will they be able to even survive half as Kingfisher or Jet Airways ?

Though I have trust in them because they are a product of two finest and most professional brands in the world so they may survive however nothing can be said about brands in today's competitive world where kings are the likes of IndiGo and Air Asia apparently lolz


I think in future only a limited number of their aircraft will have PE. Vistara has done an excellent job by inviting corp travel in PE. At least the ones getting booked on IndiGo prime / Spicemax can try Vistara's PE.
It's sad to hear you didn't have much of a good experience in that. I otoh found it worth the premium paid. There isn't much of a market for that in India but routes like DEL BOM etc might support it.
The best preparation for tomorrow is doing your best today
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:41 pm

avier wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
When slots are precious, tertiary cities are dropped to add frequency for high yield passengers, so this is the logical outcome of slot limitations.


Not completely true. Tertiary cities can be money makers actually since they have very little to NIL competition and that's exactly what Spicejet is doing using the new Jet slots at BOM. List of such cities I can recollect SpiceJet added recently from BOM are :
Gorakhpur/Durgapur/Madurai/Vijayawada/Tirupati/Dehradun/Bagdogra/Kanpur.
Most of these routes have Spice as the sole carrier on the route. Half of them not even served by Jet earlier. Still the slots were used for opening up non-Jet routes.

Cities from Jets network lacking connectivity from BOM to such towns are Rajkot/Aurangabad/Bhuj/Jodhpur, and some more maybe. Air India is minting money on these routes as it has a monopoly on these routes currently offering just single daily flights. These routes charged a premium even during Jet days because of lack of LCC's on the route.
Some of these towns are small but serve as industrial towns hence their importance for frequent business travelers.


Wow I didn't know these new city pairs from BOM. Will good for BOM. I really think increased city pairs will be good for BOM and the airlines. Plus if BOM-DEL/BLR/CCU/HYD airfares go up 10% because of a reduction in capacity, so be it. These city pairs can also afford the price hike and have good rail/bus connectivity as well. Plus price conscious pax can always take less desirable timed flights (like mid night).
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:47 pm

binayak wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
Talking about Vistara...With their PE in a price conscious market like India will they be able to even survive half as Kingfisher or Jet Airways ?

Though I have trust in them because they are a product of two finest and most professional brands in the world so they may survive however nothing can be said about brands in today's competitive world where kings are the likes of IndiGo and Air Asia apparently lolz


I think in future only a limited number of their aircraft will have PE. Vistara has done an excellent job by inviting corp travel in PE. At least the ones getting booked on IndiGo prime / Spicemax can try Vistara's PE.
It's sad to hear you didn't have much of a good experience in that. I otoh found it worth the premium paid. There isn't much of a market for that in India but routes like DEL BOM etc might support it.


No My experience with them has been good and im flying them next month from BOM-DEL-LKO however I just dont understand the concept of PE where when I can get the same service on AI Economy..and correct me if Im wrong brother.

UK PE - 30 Legroom,25 KGCheck in baggage,Food thats served on tray other than Economt which is served in a box,Welcome drinks and Options of meals,No Alliance

AI E - 30 Legroom, 25 Kg Check in baggage+ 10KG free if Infants with you ,Food served on the tray by same company TajSats only Minus are WELCOME Drinks and Choices of food,Star Alliance

So Dont you think its pretty weird that they are charging more money for just Welcome drinks ?
 
avier
Posts: 915
Joined: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:38 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 5:55 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:

Wow I didn't know these new city pairs from BOM. Will good for BOM. I really think increased city pairs will be good for BOM and the airlines. Plus if BOM-DEL/BLR/CCU/HYD airfares go up 10% because of a reduction in capacity, so be it.

I also don't see Vistara really filling up Jet's shoes. Vistara is mostly connecting the major metros from BOM with morning and evening departures. It's as if they only targeting business travellers. Whereas Jet, with their elaborate network, was the carrier of choice for businessmen/celebrities/sportsmen/other public figures/HNI's, etc. Such premium pax fly on all types of routes for work/shootings/matches/events and such. It's not like all premium pax have work only in the major metros. Many such public figures are also native to smaller towns, so a carrier with a diverse network with J cabin from BOM is needed just like Jet, of course with a much better cost structure.
 
edealinfo
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:11 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:18 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Also Vistara should get one night departure from LHR as a new entrant (I know not guaranteed but these do come and go - look at the Chinese airlines).


Do you mean a slot pair or a single slot? If the latter, then of what good is it, if they don’t also receive a landing slot to go with their departure slot.
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:30 pm

edealinfo wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Also Vistara should get one night departure from LHR as a new entrant (I know not guaranteed but these do come and go - look at the Chinese airlines).


Do you mean a slot pair or a single slot? If the latter, then of what good is it, if they don’t also receive a landing slot to go with their departure slot.


Yes take off and landing. LHR routinely gives out new entrant take off/landing slots (usually fits the 9-10pm departure LHR with a afternoon arrival into LHR).
 
edealinfo
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:11 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:33 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
edealinfo wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Also Vistara should get one night departure from LHR as a new entrant (I know not guaranteed but these do come and go - look at the Chinese airlines).


Do you mean a slot pair or a single slot? If the latter, then of what good is it, if they don’t also receive a landing slot to go with their departure slot.


Yes take off and landing. LHR routinely gives out new entrant take off/landing slots (usually fits the 9-10pm departure LHR with a afternoon arrival into LHR).


They should grab it, when available. However, their 787s don’t arrive until Jan or February 2020.
 
edealinfo
Posts: 1728
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2019 7:11 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 7:13 pm

FligtReporter wrote:
lets see.

More food to feed your obsession or fears with all things that are Air India
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.financ ... 5836/lite/

I wouldn’t be surprised if we get 5 pages of comments from you on the article in the above link, ha ha. I hope it doesn’t also keep you up at night.
 
aarbee
Posts: 415
Joined: Thu Aug 25, 2005 3:20 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 7:54 pm

CaliguyNYC wrote:
aarbee wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:

I just can't believe that Vistara isn't jumping in to a few key long haul flights like LON, HKG and on other EU hub where they partner with an EU airline for onward connections. I am all for being cautious but India's largest FSC just shut down. If now is not the opportunity when will? Just take 5 used SQ 787s and start. You take the above cities plus the 3 cities I suggested and UK would be a good option for business travelers out of BOM at least.

You make it sound so simple. Take some planes and start long haul international service is quite ludicrous.

I'm not in Airline business but still I can list a few things :
  • Is there a business plan
  • Is it feasible for them
  • Get the right pilots
  • Training the crew for long haul
  • Figuring out lodging arrangements in destination city
  • Negotiating fuel supply
  • Getting mechanical support
  • Getting ground staff on air side (baggage handles, etc.)
  • Getting land side staff (checkin, boarding staff, etc.)
  • Designing meals for long haul flights
  • Getting meals and on board stuff for the return flight
  • Designing the right business class product, its a FSC after all
  • Have the right marketing plan
  • Diversion and alternate airport contracts
and I can go on.

Hope you don't start business by just by taking "some" inventory and hope it works.

-R


Ugh, sorry I assumed since this was an aviation board, I wouldn't have to state the obvious.

Really, I thought otherwise. Since you were suggesting that "just take 5 planes and start", I wanted bring to your attention that airline business is NOT as easy as you make it sound - "just get planes and start".
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Vistara is a partnership with SQ. Right there you can tick off most of your list from ground staff in outside stations to expertise. Plus I never said start tomorrow. Start in October (winter schedule). They would use SQ's seats, IFE etc and can even wet lease the aircraft if needed. Also they have the backing of the Tatas and Tata consultancy. I mean how much resources do Indian companies need to launch long haul?

Just because UK is in partnership with SQ does not mean that everything is readily available. SQ does not have to drop everything, divert resources, provide materials, so that UK can start BOM-EU/US routes for your convince. "just take planes and start" does imply NOW. Nowhere in your statements have you provided a time frame.

Tomorrow you might think Vistara should exclusively give Jaguar chauffeur services to passengers, because they have the backing of Tatas and Tata Consultancy.
Tatas are not just sitting out there twiddling their thumbs waiting to jump in Vistara management because beloved Jet Airways failed.

CaliguyNYC wrote:

So now given the above, do you still think Vistara should be so overly cautious? How much lead time do you think is fair - 6 months, 1 year, 5 years? Love to hear your thoughts. Btw still don't think what I asked was "ludicrous" - that is a strong word.

Does not matter what I think or you think. Business create their own business plans, and it's up to them how much cautious they need to be. It's their investment.
Your statement was ludicrous because you made it sound like, just because of beloved Jet Airways' mis-management, Vistara should drop everything drive down to the next used planes salesman, buy 5 787s and volla - lets start BOM-LHR full service route.

It is not just this, earlier you had accused SG and Indigo for botching up international opportunities just because beloved Jet Airways failed and never bothered to response.

- R
Love the AIXes
 
CaliguyNYC
Posts: 1094
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 7:27 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Wed Jun 12, 2019 8:16 pm

aarbee wrote:
CaliguyNYC wrote:
aarbee wrote:
You make it sound so simple. Take some planes and start long haul international service is quite ludicrous.

I'm not in Airline business but still I can list a few things :
  • Is there a business plan
  • Is it feasible for them
  • Get the right pilots
  • Training the crew for long haul
  • Figuring out lodging arrangements in destination city
  • Negotiating fuel supply
  • Getting mechanical support
  • Getting ground staff on air side (baggage handles, etc.)
  • Getting land side staff (checkin, boarding staff, etc.)
  • Designing meals for long haul flights
  • Getting meals and on board stuff for the return flight
  • Designing the right business class product, its a FSC after all
  • Have the right marketing plan
  • Diversion and alternate airport contracts
and I can go on.

Hope you don't start business by just by taking "some" inventory and hope it works.

-R


Ugh, sorry I assumed since this was an aviation board, I wouldn't have to state the obvious.

Really, I thought otherwise. Since you were suggesting that "just take 5 planes and start", I wanted bring to your attention that airline business is NOT as easy as you make it sound - "just get planes and start".
CaliguyNYC wrote:
Vistara is a partnership with SQ. Right there you can tick off most of your list from ground staff in outside stations to expertise. Plus I never said start tomorrow. Start in October (winter schedule). They would use SQ's seats, IFE etc and can even wet lease the aircraft if needed. Also they have the backing of the Tatas and Tata consultancy. I mean how much resources do Indian companies need to launch long haul?

Just because UK is in partnership with SQ does not mean that everything is readily available. SQ does not have to drop everything, divert resources, provide materials, so that UK can start BOM-EU/US routes for your convince. "just take planes and start" does imply NOW. Nowhere in your statements have you provided a time frame.

Tomorrow you might think Vistara should exclusively give Jaguar chauffeur services to passengers, because they have the backing of Tatas and Tata Consultancy.
Tatas are not just sitting out there twiddling their thumbs waiting to jump in Vistara management because beloved Jet Airways failed.

CaliguyNYC wrote:

So now given the above, do you still think Vistara should be so overly cautious? How much lead time do you think is fair - 6 months, 1 year, 5 years? Love to hear your thoughts. Btw still don't think what I asked was "ludicrous" - that is a strong word.

Does not matter what I think or you think. Business create their own business plans, and it's up to them how much cautious they need to be. It's their investment.
Your statement was ludicrous because you made it sound like, just because of beloved Jet Airways' mis-management, Vistara should drop everything drive down to the next used planes salesman, buy 5 787s and volla - lets start BOM-LHR full service route.

It is not just this, earlier you had accused SG and Indigo for botching up international opportunities just because beloved Jet Airways failed and never bothered to response.

- R


Aarbee that is exactly my point no Indian airline is able to fill the gap for Jet's long haul. Not Vistara (with SQ and Tatas), not Indigo (with its profits) and not Spice (with its govt backing). The question is why can't they expand - they don't want to , they don't have the resources, they don't have the skill set, etc etc. You are not giving an opnion. You are just saying they don't have to. Ok you are right. They don't have to do anything. It is still a missed opportunity. And I am sorry you think having an opinion that some Indian airline should step up and try to fill in the gap of Jet's long haul is a hateful opinion to have. It is almost you are personally offended because I lament the sorry state of Indian aviation.

Btw to like 50% of all the net speculation and question around new airline routes, acquisitions, new cities one could respond with the same - the airline doesn't have to. What type of discussion would that be.
 
behramjee
Posts: 4968
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:56 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Thu Jun 13, 2019 12:16 am

Indigo officially announces that it will be launching new daily nonstop flights to Chengdu, China from Delhi using an A320Neo effective 15Sep.

In addition 6E also announced new daily Hong Kong -Calcutta nonstop flights effective 20Aug using an A320Neo.
 
vadodara
Posts: 971
Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2017 7:45 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:34 am

CaliguyNYC wrote:
Aarbee that is exactly my point no Indian airline is able to fill the gap for Jet's long haul. Not Vistara (with SQ and Tatas), not Indigo (with its profits) and not Spice (with its govt backing). The question is why can't they expand - they don't want to , they don't have the resources, they don't have the skill set, etc etc. You are not giving an opnion. You are just saying they don't have to. Ok you are right. They don't have to do anything. It is still a missed opportunity. And I am sorry you think having an opinion that some Indian airline should step up and try to fill in the gap of Jet's long haul is a hateful opinion to have. It is almost you are personally offended because I lament the sorry state of Indian aviation.

Btw to like 50% of all the net speculation and question around new airline routes, acquisitions, new cities one could respond with the same - the airline doesn't have to. What type of discussion would that be.



The first domino called Jet has fallen; waiting for the other, Air India, to fall.

We will see some rational growth happen.
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:57 am

behramjee wrote:
Indigo officially announces that it will be launching new daily nonstop flights to Chengdu, China from Delhi using an A320Neo effective 15Sep.

In addition 6E also announced new daily Hong Kong -Calcutta nonstop flights effective 20Aug using an A320Neo.

I wont be surprised if some day soon I see IndiGo Thailand ,IndiGo Singapore,IndiGo Malaysia etc :lol:

Their rate of expansion is steady but firm and I like that about them.They are the ones who surely will survive when all others have fallen for their strategy is clear and plans are set
 
binayak
Posts: 972
Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:00 pm

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:48 am

FligtReporter wrote:
binayak wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
Talking about Vistara...With their PE in a price conscious market like India will they be able to even survive half as Kingfisher or Jet Airways ?

Though I have trust in them because they are a product of two finest and most professional brands in the world so they may survive however nothing can be said about brands in today's competitive world where kings are the likes of IndiGo and Air Asia apparently lolz


I think in future only a limited number of their aircraft will have PE. Vistara has done an excellent job by inviting corp travel in PE. At least the ones getting booked on IndiGo prime / Spicemax can try Vistara's PE.
It's sad to hear you didn't have much of a good experience in that. I otoh found it worth the premium paid. There isn't much of a market for that in India but routes like DEL BOM etc might support it.


No My experience with them has been good and im flying them next month from BOM-DEL-LKO however I just dont understand the concept of PE where when I can get the same service on AI Economy..and correct me if Im wrong brother.

UK PE - 30 Legroom,25 KGCheck in baggage,Food thats served on tray other than Economt which is served in a box,Welcome drinks and Options of meals,No Alliance

AI E - 30 Legroom, 25 Kg Check in baggage+ 10KG free if Infants with you ,Food served on the tray by same company TajSats only Minus are WELCOME Drinks and Choices of food,Star Alliance

So Dont you think its pretty weird that they are charging more money for just Welcome drinks ?


1. Vistara's PE meals are much better than AI Y meals as per my experience.
2. More miles on Vistara PE than AI Y.
Also note that Club Vistara has tie up with BA, JL, SQ, and few other Star carriers for redeemptions .
AI's frequent flyer program is hardly of any use unless you are a long haul frequent flyer. It's very difficult to earn status on AI compared to UK. if you just fly domestic most of the time

3. Vistara PE has 33" legroom not 30"
The best preparation for tomorrow is doing your best today
 
FligtReporter
Posts: 200
Joined: Thu Sep 15, 2016 3:03 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:56 am

binayak wrote:
FligtReporter wrote:
binayak wrote:

I think in future only a limited number of their aircraft will have PE. Vistara has done an excellent job by inviting corp travel in PE. At least the ones getting booked on IndiGo prime / Spicemax can try Vistara's PE.
It's sad to hear you didn't have much of a good experience in that. I otoh found it worth the premium paid. There isn't much of a market for that in India but routes like DEL BOM etc might support it.


No My experience with them has been good and im flying them next month from BOM-DEL-LKO however I just dont understand the concept of PE where when I can get the same service on AI Economy..and correct me if Im wrong brother.

UK PE - 30 Legroom,25 KGCheck in baggage,Food thats served on tray other than Economt which is served in a box,Welcome drinks and Options of meals,No Alliance

AI E - 30 Legroom, 25 Kg Check in baggage+ 10KG free if Infants with you ,Food served on the tray by same company TajSats only Minus are WELCOME Drinks and Choices of food,Star Alliance

So Dont you think its pretty weird that they are charging more money for just Welcome drinks ?


1. Vistara's PE meals are much better than AI Y meals as per my experience.
2. More miles on Vistara PE than AI Y.
Also note that Club Vistara has tie up with BA, JL, SQ, and few other Star carriers for redeemptions .
AI's frequent flyer program is hardly of any use unless you are a long haul frequent flyer. It's very difficult to earn status on AI compared to UK. if you just fly domestic most of the time

3. Vistara PE has 33" legroom not 30"


Thanks for the elaboration.I like UK and thanks for making me understand it much better however their Club Vistara isnt really of a much benefit unless they start flying international or become a part of some alliance which I assume would be Skyteam or Oneworld.Though I have faith in their Parents however only time will tell if they will be able to succeed in the longer run or not which I believe they will be.With their changes of FSC to Partial FSC model where they offer ECONOMY LITE fares is good and Im sure they will keep changing things and modifying them as per the demand and their analysts advises.

Thanks
 
User avatar
unrave
Posts: 2640
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Thu Jun 13, 2019 5:43 am

Yet another article that highlights the gross mismanagement of Air India under the previous government

https://www.financialexpress.com/opinio ... s/1605836/
Denial of racism is as egregious as racism itself
 
blrsea
Posts: 1913
Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 2:22 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Thu Jun 13, 2019 5:45 am

CFM wins blockbuster jet engine order from IndiGo: Sources

Engine maker CFM International is poised to announce one of the world's largest jet engine orders with a deal for more than 600 engines from India's IndiGo, industry sources said.
...
The two sides are putting finishing touches to the deal in time for an announcement at next week's Paris Airshow, they added. CFM International and IndiGo declined to comment.
 
User avatar
unrave
Posts: 2640
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2015 6:37 am

Re: Indian Aviation Thread - June 2019

Thu Jun 13, 2019 5:47 am

blrsea wrote:
CFM wins blockbuster jet engine order from IndiGo: Sources

Engine maker CFM International is poised to announce one of the world's largest jet engine orders with a deal for more than 600 engines from India's IndiGo, industry sources said.
...
The two sides are putting finishing touches to the deal in time for an announcement at next week's Paris Airshow, they added. CFM International and IndiGo declined to comment.


IndiGo has finally run out of patience. Great win for CFM. Big loss for PW
Denial of racism is as egregious as racism itself
  • 1
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • 6
  • 7
  • 18

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos