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jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
KingOrGod wrote:jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
An that's your best advice LOL. PMSL.
So why is LH successful while operating A343/A346/B744/B748/A388...
Come on... we're waiting with baited breath...
LH658 wrote:KingOrGod wrote:jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
An that's your best advice LOL. PMSL.
So why is LH successful while operating A343/A346/B744/B748/A388...
Come on... we're waiting with baited breath...
I think it cause SAA is government ran airline, and LH isn't.
LH658 wrote:KingOrGod wrote:jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
An that's your best advice LOL. PMSL.
So why is LH successful while operating A343/A346/B744/B748/A388...
Come on... we're waiting with baited breath...
I think it cause SAA is government ran airline, and LH isn't.
jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
KingOrGod wrote:jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
An that's your best advice LOL. PMSL.
So why is LH successful while operating A343/A346/B744/B748/A388...
Come on... we're waiting with baited breath...
jfk777 wrote:KingOrGod wrote:jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
An that's your best advice LOL. PMSL.
So why is LH successful while operating A343/A346/B744/B748/A388...
Come on... we're waiting with baited breath...
Two airlines operating the same airplane don't have the same economics. LH is a leading airline with premium yields selling lots of Business and First Class that passengers actually pay thousands of Pounds, Euros, Dollars and hundred of thousands of Yen for. SAA in their wildest dreams of avarice could never charge what LH can. SAA also operates some ridiculous 16 hour flights to JFK, the longest LH is 14 hours to Argentina, shorter flights use less fuel. JNB to Peking is not a profitable endeavor. SAA has made lousy choices.
KingOrGod wrote:jfk777 wrote:KingOrGod wrote:
An that's your best advice LOL. PMSL.
So why is LH successful while operating A343/A346/B744/B748/A388...
Come on... we're waiting with baited breath...
Two airlines operating the same airplane don't have the same economics. LH is a leading airline with premium yields selling lots of Business and First Class that passengers actually pay thousands of Pounds, Euros, Dollars and hundred of thousands of Yen for. SAA in their wildest dreams of avarice could never charge what LH can. SAA also operates some ridiculous 16 hour flights to JFK, the longest LH is 14 hours to Argentina, shorter flights use less fuel. JNB to Peking is not a profitable endeavor. SAA has made lousy choices.
You brought it up... why does SAA not have F? Because they're rubbish and can barely compete with their J. If they could attract pax they'd be printing money. But more and more are rather going to go elsewhere with a solid premium product. Have you even been in the "premium lounge" of SAA at JNB? That's absolutely nothing to do with A346 economics.
SAA Operated 742/743/744 in their heyday, with at least 2 747 to LHR daily. The good old Blue DIamond class was worth it.
SAA would not have fared any better with a 777 when the A346 / B77E were up for tender. Fact is with SAA their problem doesn't lie with their fleet.
How come Comair did very well flying paid for rust buckets like B722 and B732 and SAA were making record losses with A320 in their fleet? Standing by to be impressed again.
KingOrGod wrote:You brought it up... why does SAA not have F? Because they're rubbish and can barely compete with their J. If they could attract pax they'd be printing money. But more and more are rather going to go elsewhere with a solid premium product. Have you even been in the "premium lounge" of SAA at JNB? That's absolutely nothing to do with A346 economics.
KingOrGod wrote:SAA would not have fared any better with a 777 when the A346 / B77E were up for tender. Fact is with SAA their problem doesn't lie with their fleet.
KingOrGod wrote:How come Comair did very well flying paid for rust buckets like B722 and B732 and SAA were making record losses with A320 in their fleet? Standing by to be impressed again.
Slug71 wrote:jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
They are rumored to get 2 A350s. But the A340 is the smallest of their problems.
The government is keeping all the money for themselves. They are insanely corrupt.Everything has been run into the ground. The military has been stripped of their budget and become a clown show of what it once was. The defense industry is pretty much gone. It was really good.
They can't keep the power on (Eskom has become a joke). They went into drought with massive water restrictions. Knew it was coming for 20 years.Farmers are being murdered left and right. The Police are a joke. People are being murdered in numbers. Ridiculously high rape crimes. Mostly the criminals have guns.
Millions of skilled South Africans have fled. NZ, Australia, Canada, UK, USA etc...have millions of South Africans. There should be many profitable routes.
Houses are Prisons/Forts, with barbed wire on 6ft high walls, electric fences, multiple locks on doors, security gates, burglar bars in front of the windows.......no thanks.
While many countries got rid of the death penalty and many others demanding/condemning it, South Africans are crying for its return.
I dont see why IAG would want SAA. But it might be SAA's only hope.
aviationaware wrote:Kudos to him for stating so clearly and openly what's wrong with SAA.
KingOrGod wrote:jfk777 wrote:KingOrGod wrote:
An that's your best advice LOL. PMSL.
So why is LH successful while operating A343/A346/B744/B748/A388...
Come on... we're waiting with baited breath...
Two airlines operating the same airplane don't have the same economics. LH is a leading airline with premium yields selling lots of Business and First Class that passengers actually pay thousands of Pounds, Euros, Dollars and hundred of thousands of Yen for. SAA in their wildest dreams of avarice could never charge what LH can. SAA also operates some ridiculous 16 hour flights to JFK, the longest LH is 14 hours to Argentina, shorter flights use less fuel. JNB to Peking is not a profitable endeavor. SAA has made lousy choices.
You brought it up... why does SAA not have F? Because they're rubbish and can barely compete with their J. If they could attract pax they'd be printing money. But more and more are rather going to go elsewhere with a solid premium product. Have you even been in the "premium lounge" of SAA at JNB? That's absolutely nothing to do with A346 economics.
SAA Operated 742/743/744 in their heyday, with at least 2 747 to LHR daily. The good old Blue DIamond class was worth it.
SAA would not have fared any better with a 777 when the A346 / B77E were up for tender. Fact is with SAA their problem doesn't lie with their fleet.
How come Comair did very well flying paid for rust buckets like B722 and B732 and SAA were making record losses with A320 in their fleet? Standing by to be impressed again.
evanb wrote:KingOrGod wrote:SAA would not have fared any better with a 777 when the A346 / B77E were up for tender. Fact is with SAA their problem doesn't lie with their fleet.
Agreed, SAA's problem has nothing to do with the fleet, and I'd add has nothing to do with the on-board product. It's purely years of very poor governance and looting which has put the balance sheet in a horrific state.
dmstorm22 wrote:I agree fleet is not the issue, especially given their main hub is JNB they have to account for hot-and-high conditions on their longer flights.
I will say the on-board product has suffered, but again that's probably tied to poor governance and looting as you say. Hard to pay to improve the seats or IFE on your A346, which flies your flagship routes, when the money is all being squirelled away.
I flew CPT-JNB-JFK last year, and got lucky that the A320 or whatever that was supposed to fly CPT-JNB got subbed out for an A332. The A332 was quite nice and modern. The A346 has seen far better days.
evanb wrote:dmstorm22 wrote:I agree fleet is not the issue, especially given their main hub is JNB they have to account for hot-and-high conditions on their longer flights.
I will say the on-board product has suffered, but again that's probably tied to poor governance and looting as you say. Hard to pay to improve the seats or IFE on your A346, which flies your flagship routes, when the money is all being squirelled away.
I flew CPT-JNB-JFK last year, and got lucky that the A320 or whatever that was supposed to fly CPT-JNB got subbed out for an A332. The A332 was quite nice and modern. The A346 has seen far better days.
It's a mixed bag. They have a tired product on the A340-300s and A340-600s mostly because they're been on the cusp of replacing these for several years. There is no point investing in updating the product if you're going to replace it. The governance issues have played havoc with their intent to replace them though. The A330-200s have a newer version of the old product and is acceptable. The A330-300s, the newest aircraft, have an excellent product. But honestly, when you compare to BA, even their old business class is comparable if not better than BA.
Same goes for short haul. A319s have an older product, while the A320s have a state of the art short haul product when compared to the competition.
Slug71 wrote:jfk777 wrote:SAA needs to ditch the A340.
They are rumored to get 2 A350s. But the A340 is the smallest of their problems.
The government is keeping all the money for themselves. They are insanely corrupt.Everything has been run into the ground. The military has been stripped of their budget and become a clown show of what it once was. The defense industry is pretty much gone. It was really good.
They can't keep the power on (Eskom has become a joke). They went into drought with massive water restrictions. Knew it was coming for 20 years.Farmers are being murdered left and right. The Police are a joke. People are being murdered in numbers. Ridiculously high rape crimes. Mostly the criminals have guns.
Millions of skilled South Africans have fled. NZ, Australia, Canada, UK, USA etc...have millions of South Africans. There should be many profitable routes.
Houses are Prisons/Forts, with barbed wire on 6ft high walls, electric fences, multiple locks on doors, security gates, burglar bars in front of the windows.......no thanks.
While many countries got rid of the death penalty and many others demanding/condemning it, South Africans are crying for its return.
I dont see why IAG would want SAA. But it might be SAA's only hope.
jfk777 wrote:King or GOD, what ever is said will never satisfy you. you know hy Comair makes $$ and SAA looses $$.
KingOrGod wrote:jfk777 wrote:2002 is a long time ago to be a leader in the flat-race, don't you think? I disagree, on-board product is well below par today. Springbok J (on the A346 anyway) doesn't even come close to most other carriers product, be it the seat, or the cabin crew resting their feet in ice-buckets, nor the lounge.
KingOrGod wrote:Sigh. Whatever folks. Give them more money. Let them buy A350.
It. Won't. Change. A. Thing.
B747-437B wrote:
Also, Adam Voss (ex-Jet Airways) has been appointed as the new CEO of SAA Technical.