sonicruiser
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Qantas confirms 3 weekly BNE-SFO and 4 weekly BNE-ORD to start by late April 2020

Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:32 am

QF is launching BNE-ORD/SFO after getting their JV with AA approved. I thought I'd make a separate thread for it, otherwise I'd miss it.

https://onemileatatime.com/qantas-brisbane-chicago/
Last edited by qf789 on Mon Jun 17, 2019 4:30 am, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: new information
 
N809FR
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:36 am

Wonder what AA might have in store for us... hope these actually get off the ground in the next year!
 
ZK-NBT
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:44 am

Personally while I think these will definitely happen I think we are jumping the gun a little, the deal has been approved by the US just today.

I’d say start a new thread once we have an actual start date given that this has been extensively discussed in more than 1 thread. It has been well known that QF were looking at ORD.
 
smi0006
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:52 am

This is tentative approval only... and an announcement of intent to announce once if all approval is given.

There is already a thread on the JV recommend we consolidate threads.
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:11 am

And QF is not announcing the route with schedule and such... Think the title is misleading.

Michael
 
sonicruiser
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:14 am

smi0006 wrote:
This is tentative approval only... and an announcement of intent to announce once if all approval is given.

There is already a thread on the JV recommend we consolidate threads.


Yes but it was tentative on being approved which it now has been unless I'm missing something. Their intent to do BNE-ORD has been known for a while, I'd have expected this was the announcement.
 
log0008
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:18 am

I now have had confirmation AA will launch MEL-LAX 3 weekly increasing to 5 weekly in peak seasons. This will replace QF95/96
 
dcajet
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:19 am

eamondzhang wrote:
And QF is not announcing the route with schedule and such... Think the title is misleading.

Michael


:checkmark: :checkmark:

Agree with you. These routes are a good 2 years away. Folks are jumping the gun here.
"Unattended children will be given espresso and a free kitten"
 
dcajet
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:21 am

sonicruiser wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
This is tentative approval only... and an announcement of intent to announce once if all approval is given.

There is already a thread on the JV recommend we consolidate threads.


Yes but it was tentative on being approved which it now has been unless I'm missing something. Their intent to do BNE-ORD has been known for a while, I'd have expected this was the announcement.


US DOT approval is still tentative. These routes are still a good 2 years away. We need to wait for official word from QF before stating the routes are officially launched. which they are not.
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eamondzhang
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:27 am

sonicruiser wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
This is tentative approval only... and an announcement of intent to announce once if all approval is given.

There is already a thread on the JV recommend we consolidate threads.


Yes but it was tentative on being approved which it now has been unless I'm missing something. Their intent to do BNE-ORD has been known for a while, I'd have expected this was the announcement.

In all honesty QF never made an official announcement with press release, and one mile at a time is never a credible source with full or rumours and such.

I won't count it as official until the point where official press release is made and/or GDS is loaded, and I do think majority of people agree here.

Michael
 
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hic787
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:31 am

log0008 wrote:
I now have had confirmation AA will launch MEL-LAX 3 weekly increasing to 5 weekly in peak seasons. This will replace QF95/96


Source?
 
Motorhussy
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:33 am

BNE-ORD/SFO would indicate that NZ is getting some, perhaps significant, Australian traffic on their AKL-SFO and AKL-ORD routes.
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:39 am

Motorhussy wrote:
BNE-ORD/SFO would indicate that NZ is getting some, perhaps significant, Australian traffic on their AKL-SFO and AKL-ORD routes.


Probably so, however QF have talked about ORD for years even being within days of a first seevic via LAX in 2003 before it was pulled, SFO makes sense as the west coast is a huge market ex Australia and offers something different instead of LAX, also allows QF to replace some of the capacity they lost at SYD with the 789 replacing the 744 in December.
 
log0008
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:40 am

hic787 wrote:
log0008 wrote:
I now have had confirmation AA will launch MEL-LAX 3 weekly increasing to 5 weekly in peak seasons. This will replace QF95/96


Source?


I'll just Melbourne airport source and no not just a rampy
 
LondonXtreme
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:44 am

If QF plans to launch BNE-SFO, what will be UA's move?UA was a step behind QF on launching MEL-SFO route. I wonder if AC can make YVR-BNE work, how come UA doesn't attempt SFO-BNE? The market of SFO is far superior than YVR.
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:12 am

LondonXtreme wrote:
If QF plans to launch BNE-SFO, what will be UA's move?UA was a step behind QF on launching MEL-SFO route. I wonder if AC can make YVR-BNE work, how come UA doesn't attempt SFO-BNE? The market of SFO is far superior than YVR.


UA would likely be even less interested in BNE-SFO now. With MEL-SFO coming on-line later this year, along with some decreases in SYD frequencies over the next few months, seems that they are trying to find more of a balance in their offering across the year.

UA has had a presence in MEL for a long time, with it comes a decent level of premium demand that they can tap into. Their rep did state at a conference last week that premium demand has dictated their decision making process, which indicates that that route was something that they saw as a network gap.

BNE will likely have enough on its plate with ORD and SFO services, which more than likely will be accommodated with some readjustment to the LAX frequencies. Not sure AA will jump onto that one as they appear to be looking to do for MEL, but we will see.
 
simairlinenet
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:14 am

aa.com is the credible source: https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com/ne ... department

As part of the case put to the DOT, Qantas and American flagged an intention to launch several new routes within the first two years of the proposed joint business. Qantas expects to announce details of two new routes — Brisbane, Australia (BNE)–Chicago (ORD) and BNE–San Francisco (SFO) — once final approval is received.
 
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:19 am

simairlinenet wrote:
aa.com is the credible source: https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com/ne ... department

As part of the case put to the DOT, Qantas and American flagged an intention to launch several new routes within the first two years of the proposed joint business. Qantas expects to announce details of two new routes — Brisbane, Australia (BNE)–Chicago (ORD) and BNE–San Francisco (SFO) — once final approval is received.


Sure it is, that’s the whole point though that it’s been known for some time that ORD was on QF’s radar, this is just further confirmation of that until they officially announce a start date, it’s been in their radar for more than 15 years DFW took more than 10 years defore they finally flew there.

The topic is well covered in atleast 2 other threads hence I don’t think we need another thread until we have an official start date.
 
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:24 am

dcajet wrote:
sonicruiser wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
This is tentative approval only... and an announcement of intent to announce once if all approval is given.

There is already a thread on the JV recommend we consolidate threads.


Yes but it was tentative on being approved which it now has been unless I'm missing something. Their intent to do BNE-ORD has been known for a while, I'd have expected this was the announcement.


US DOT approval is still tentative. These routes are still a good 2 years away. We need to wait for official word from QF before stating the routes are officially launched. which they are not.


If final approval is received in the next 2 months then BNE-SFO will launch in December IMHO, to offset the decline in capacity on SYD-SFO. They already have the aircraft on property to launch these routes, and the capacity will be freed up with changes (cancellation) of QF55/56 and QF95/96. ORD will probably launch for the Northern Summer, as they would probably want a longer lead time there to establish the route.
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j0erayb0b99
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:47 am

Honestly... I wouldn't be surprised with QF launching nonstop service between BNE and ORD. NZ is already operating AKL-ORD with a 787-9 with what I would think would be decent loads from United and other Star carriers operating out of ORD. EWR and IAD I'm sure give good flow traffic into ORD from Europe destinations as well. It would be good competition between both NZ and QF. Remember... AA has LGA, PHL, DCA, CLT, and maybe MIA all flowing into ORD so a nonstop from QF could work.
 
Chasensfo
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:49 am

Qantas really wants to have their departures off of the same concourse as American, perhaps with the new T1 it will finally happen, though probably not with the partial opening in July.
 
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 5:28 am

eamondzhang wrote:
And QF is not announcing the route with schedule and such... Think the title is misleading.

Michael


The title has been changed to reflect that it is being planned and not yet announced
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Tdan
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:46 am

log0008 wrote:
hic787 wrote:
log0008 wrote:
I now have had confirmation AA will launch MEL-LAX 3 weekly increasing to 5 weekly in peak seasons. This will replace QF95/96


Source?


I'll just Melbourne airport source and no not just a rampy


This is not true and your source is wrong. The scenario you outlined would require pre-conceived collaboration and schedule alignment between AA and QF which is illegal until the final order.

Plus, all QF B789s have their A checks in LAX and removing the 95/96 would remove the critical maintenance input.

Suggest removing this assertion or labeling it as future route speculation.
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planemanofnz
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 11:37 am

Interesting to see SEA not featuring in QF US expansion plans now - I wonder how the AA JV will impact on QF's codesharing with AS.

Cheers,

C.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:02 pm

planemanofnz wrote:
Interesting to see SEA not featuring in QF US expansion plans now - I wonder how the AA JV will impact on QF's codesharing with AS.

Cheers,

C.


The previous JV applications would have killed any AS codesharing (although perhaps not interlining or single-fare-component mixed-carrier journeys).

The revised application made significant changes, including removing a provision that would have barred either carrier from code-sharing with other carriers. Code-sharing is an arrangement between airlines in which two or more carriers publish and advertise a single flight under their own flight number.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... SKCN1T41W8

We'll have to see how non-exclusive codesharing is protected in the tentative and final approvals granted.
 
planemanofnz
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:08 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
planemanofnz wrote:
Interesting to see SEA not featuring in QF US expansion plans now - I wonder how the AA JV will impact on QF's codesharing with AS.

Cheers,

C.


The previous JV applications would have killed any AS codesharing (although perhaps not interlining or single-fare-component mixed-carrier journeys).

The revised application made significant changes, including removing a provision that would have barred either carrier from code-sharing with other carriers. Code-sharing is an arrangement between airlines in which two or more carriers publish and advertise a single flight under their own flight number.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... SKCN1T41W8

We'll have to see how non-exclusive codesharing is protected in the tentative and final approvals granted.

Interesting - do you know if NZ/UA and VA/DL have restrictions on code-sharing with others?

With SEA off the table for QF now, I wonder if DL would consider SEA - SYD? Or would VA?

Cheers,

C.
 
jasoncrh
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:17 pm

The Qantas CEO stated several time and was quoted in Australian media saying that they would launch ord-bne if they got approval for ATI, but that they'd start SEA as a “plan b” if they didn’t get ATI. Nevertheless, Qantas codeshares with AS at SFO to feed their flights there. AA doesn’t have much of a asFO presence, so Qantas uses AS there.


planemanofnz wrote:
Interesting to see SEA not featuring in QF US expansion plans now - I wonder how the AA JV will impact on QF's codesharing with AS.

Cheers,

C.
 
babastud
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:27 pm

Great news! Hopefully things go smooth ahead and these routes move forward. I'm not surprised by BNE-SFO it's actually long overdue. I was thinking UA would jump into it first, and that may still happen but will see? Of course BNE-ORD has nothing to due with BNE it's just ORD access to Australia. I have my doubts about this route sticking long term, as I think many premium passengers would rather one stop it through LAX or soon to be SFO. SEA does also not surprise me as it is simply cheaper and easier to just shuttle down the coast and have plenty of options out of LAX or SFO. Delta to SYD from SEA would not do well.
 
UALifer
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 12:31 pm

Is there any gate availability in SFO for QF to add a BNE-SFO flight? I know the G side of the international terminal is basically full, not sure about the A side though.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 1:05 pm

planemanofnz wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
planemanofnz wrote:
Interesting to see SEA not featuring in QF US expansion plans now - I wonder how the AA JV will impact on QF's codesharing with AS.

Cheers,

C.


The previous JV applications would have killed any AS codesharing (although perhaps not interlining or single-fare-component mixed-carrier journeys).

The revised application made significant changes, including removing a provision that would have barred either carrier from code-sharing with other carriers. Code-sharing is an arrangement between airlines in which two or more carriers publish and advertise a single flight under their own flight number.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... SKCN1T41W8

We'll have to see how non-exclusive codesharing is protected in the tentative and final approvals granted.

Interesting - do you know if NZ/UA and VA/DL have restrictions on code-sharing with others?

With SEA off the table for QF now, I wonder if DL would consider SEA - SYD? Or would VA?

Cheers,

C.


I don't see that SEA is off the table. This iteration of the JV proposal dropped the codeshare restriction. Whether QF thinks SEA is the best new market is a different question. (IMHO, DL would do better on BNE/SYD/MEL from LAX, not SEA. Further, DL doesn't have much new widebody capacity capable of SEA-SYD coming - just two more A350s until 2025).

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... 19-453724/
 
Gemuser
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 1:25 pm

babastud wrote:
Great news! Hopefully things go smooth ahead and these routes move forward. I'm not surprised by BNE-SFO it's actually long overdue. I was thinking UA would jump into it first, and that may still happen but will see? Of course BNE-ORD has nothing to due with BNE it's just ORD access to Australia. I have my doubts about this route sticking long term, as I think many premium passengers would rather one stop it through LAX or soon to be SFO. SEA does also not surprise me as it is simply cheaper and easier to just shuttle down the coast and have plenty of options out of LAX or SFO. Delta to SYD from SEA would not do well.

I would just like to point out that BNE - ORD is LIKELY to orginate in SYD or MEL with a connection [possibly on another international flight] from the other city. I agree that this route has little to do with BNE itself, it is access to ORD. Although not yet mentioned [and anybody who thinks AJ has reveled QF total thinking has not be paying attention] IMHO I really don't think BNE - ORD will survive the arrrival of the later deliveries of the Project Sunrise aircraft.

Gemuser
 
DCA350
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:12 pm

Extremely impressive by Qantas. Amazing they can sustain long haul flights out of 4 airports while in Germany, Lufthansa with a much larger economy and 3 times the population can only seem to muster flights from 2.
 
jbs2886
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Re: Qantas launches BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD

Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:32 pm

Tdan wrote:
log0008 wrote:
hic787 wrote:

Source?


I'll just Melbourne airport source and no not just a rampy


This is not true and your source is wrong. The scenario you outlined would require pre-conceived collaboration and schedule alignment between AA and QF which is illegal until the final order.

Plus, all QF B789s have their A checks in LAX and removing the 95/96 would remove the critical maintenance input.

Suggest removing this assertion or labeling it as future route speculation.


AA/QF is allowed to plan for a JV (including planned launches of routes), that isn't illegal.
 
Detroit313
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:35 pm

Congratulations to American Airlines and Qantas for their joint venture!
 
jasoncrh
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:23 pm

one has absolutely nothing to do with the other.

quote="DCA350"]Extremely impressive by Qantas. Amazing they can sustain long haul flights out of 4 airports while in Germany, Lufthansa with a much larger economy and 3 times the population can only seem to muster flights from 2.[/quote]
 
dcajet
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:31 pm

DCA350 wrote:
Extremely impressive by Qantas. Amazing they can sustain long haul flights out of 4 airports while in Germany, Lufthansa with a much larger economy and 3 times the population can only seem to muster flights from 2.


Errr... but have you looked at maps of both countries lately? Australia is a continent-country with few cities, and long distances between them. Germany is a country in Europe with many cities, quite close to each other. Where in Australia can you take an ICE train from city A and be at city B's airport within 1-2 hours travel time?
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babastud
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:58 pm

UALifer wrote:
Is there any gate availability in SFO for QF to add a BNE-SFO flight? I know the G side of the international terminal is basically full, not sure about the A side though.



QF uses A side of International terminal. Later this year or next year a section of Terminal 1 is due to be completed which will allow more gates for domestic use, thus we may see jet blue or others moving over their freeing up space in A side for international only. Of course 4-6 gates of international space is due to come online in the coming few years with the completion of Terminal 1 and that should help also.
 
Galvan316
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 4:01 pm

Does the A380 Have the range to make BNE-ORD?
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dfw88
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 5:07 pm

From AA email to employees, after mentioning QF's new BNE routes:

Since many U.S. based customers have already booked their winter Australia and New Zealand travel, and we’ve deployed our widebody aircraft to fly trans-Atlantic and to Hawaii for the winter, we plan to make a route announcement of our own later this year for service beginning in 2020. For now, American and Qantas will review the Order, with a final decision from the DOT expected in the next few weeks.
 
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chepos
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Tue Jun 04, 2019 5:34 pm

dfw88 wrote:
From AA email to employees, after mentioning QF's new BNE routes:

Since many U.S. based customers have already booked their winter Australia and New Zealand travel, and we’ve deployed our widebody aircraft to fly trans-Atlantic and to Hawaii for the winter, we plan to make a route announcement of our own later this year for service beginning in 2020. For now, American and Qantas will review the Order, with a final decision from the DOT expected in the next few weeks.


I expect the route announcement to be LAX MEL. I hope LAX AKl goes year round.


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questions
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sat Jun 08, 2019 7:23 pm

Why have DL/VA been so stagnate on US-AU routes while AA/QF and UA are growing?
 
Fargo
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sat Jun 08, 2019 7:32 pm

questions wrote:
Why have DL/VA been so stagnate on US-AU routes while AA/QF and UA are growing?


Maybe because the DL/VA jv isn’t as strong as AA/QF and UA/NZ?
 
questions
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sat Jun 08, 2019 9:13 pm

Fargo wrote:
questions wrote:
Why have DL/VA been so stagnate on US-AU routes while AA/QF and UA are growing?


Maybe because the DL/VA jv isn’t as strong as AA/QF and UA/NZ?


What specifically do you mean by “strong”?

AA/QF makes since. Does VA’s connecting traffic not add much value?
 
aryonoco
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sat Jun 08, 2019 11:29 pm

questions wrote:
Why have DL/VA been so stagnate on US-AU routes while AA/QF and UA are growing?


I don't know about DL, but VA International is a money losing operation. Their transpacific flights are a particular drag on their balance sheet. They have the wrong airplane (too big) and the wrong number (not enough). The ratings agencies all rate VA as junk grade, the parent companies either have their own financial issues or are uninterested in sinking more money into VA, hence VA is in no position to raise capital to fix its issues.

If DL cared, they could fix all these issues, they could become a VA shareholder and help VA the way they have done with VS, but Australasia doesn't seem to rate high in DL's priority list and they seem happy to be a niche player on this market.
 
DFWuser
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sun Jun 09, 2019 12:03 am

Galvan316 wrote:
Does the A380 Have the range to make BNE-ORD?


It works with DFW-SYD. Range-wise, no problem, but the demand would most likely not justify the plane. 788/789 is more suitable. 388 fleet is already stretched out.
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Fargo
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sun Jun 09, 2019 12:04 am

aryonoco wrote:
questions wrote:
Why have DL/VA been so stagnate on US-AU routes while AA/QF and UA are growing?


I don't know about DL, but VA International is a money losing operation. Their transpacific flights are a particular drag on their balance sheet. They have the wrong airplane (too big) and the wrong number (not enough). The ratings agencies all rate VA as junk grade, the parent companies either have their own financial issues or are uninterested in sinking more money into VA, hence VA is in no position to raise capital to fix its issues.

If DL cared, they could fix all these issues, they could become a VA shareholder and help VA the way they have done with VS, but Australasia doesn't seem to rate high in DL's priority list and they seem happy to be a niche player on this market.


This.

Additionally, DL doesn't even fly to New Zealand on their own metal and the DL/VA jv is only accessible via LAX, whereas the AA/QF and UA/NZ is accessible (i.e, they have flights) via LAX, SFO, DFW, IAH, ORD, etc.

So yes, AA/QF and UA/NZ are light years ahead of DL/VA. And honestly, even if DL cared enough to want to close the gap, I'm not sure there is much they could do.
 
questions
Posts: 1954
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Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sun Jun 09, 2019 4:59 am

Fargo wrote:
aryonoco wrote:
questions wrote:
Why have DL/VA been so stagnate on US-AU routes while AA/QF and UA are growing?


I don't know about DL, but VA International is a money losing operation. Their transpacific flights are a particular drag on their balance sheet. They have the wrong airplane (too big) and the wrong number (not enough). The ratings agencies all rate VA as junk grade, the parent companies either have their own financial issues or are uninterested in sinking more money into VA, hence VA is in no position to raise capital to fix its issues.

If DL cared, they could fix all these issues, they could become a VA shareholder and help VA the way they have done with VS, but Australasia doesn't seem to rate high in DL's priority list and they seem happy to be a niche player on this market.


This.

Additionally, DL doesn't even fly to New Zealand on their own metal and the DL/VA jv is only accessible via LAX, whereas the AA/QF and UA/NZ is accessible (i.e, they have flights) via LAX, SFO, DFW, IAH, ORD, etc.

So yes, AA/QF and UA/NZ are light years ahead of DL/VA. And honestly, even if DL cared enough to want to close the gap, I'm not sure there is much they could do.


Thanks.
 
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SCFlyer
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:14 pm

Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sun Jun 09, 2019 5:46 am

Fargo wrote:
aryonoco wrote:
questions wrote:
Why have DL/VA been so stagnate on US-AU routes while AA/QF and UA are growing?


I don't know about DL, but VA International is a money losing operation. Their transpacific flights are a particular drag on their balance sheet. They have the wrong airplane (too big) and the wrong number (not enough). The ratings agencies all rate VA as junk grade, the parent companies either have their own financial issues or are uninterested in sinking more money into VA, hence VA is in no position to raise capital to fix its issues.

If DL cared, they could fix all these issues, they could become a VA shareholder and help VA the way they have done with VS, but Australasia doesn't seem to rate high in DL's priority list and they seem happy to be a niche player on this market.


This.

Additionally, DL doesn't even fly to New Zealand on their own metal and the DL/VA jv is only accessible via LAX, whereas the AA/QF and UA/NZ is accessible (i.e, they have flights) via LAX, SFO, DFW, IAH, ORD, etc.

So yes, AA/QF and UA/NZ are light years ahead of DL/VA. And honestly, even if DL cared enough to want to close the gap, I'm not sure there is much they could do.


DL doesn't have enough widebodies on order atm even if they did want to expand in the Australasia/Pacific market.
Currently 2x A350-900s (last 10 deferred till 2025+) and a bunch of A330-900NEOs which doesn't have the range for SYD-LAX.

If DL still wants to keep a presence in the Australian market, basically VA has to do the bulk of the work for them.

However, VA is likely to remain stagnant with CAPEX to remain low as the new CEO is currently cost cutting (e.g currently in the offices) which may likely extend to the domestic market, in addition to the current cutting occurring in the international short-haul markets (IIRC the larger losses are from Short Haul Int'l).

The axe has already come out in the Short Haul Int'l network with the axing of some Trans-Tasman flighs and scaling some Trans-Tasman flights (e.g SYD-CHC) back to seasonal.
 
cedarjet
Posts: 8488
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 1:12 am

Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sun Jun 09, 2019 6:10 am

Is Brisbane the Aussie end of the route because of range? Otherwise I don’t get it. 75% of traffic will have to take a domestic flight from Sydney or Melbourne first, so it’s no improvement on going via LAX on QF/AA or via AKL on NZ.

Reminds me of the people who said after the success of PER LHR that Perth would get nonstops to Frankfurt and Paris. Frankfurt and Paris have been attempted from Sydney without success, but Perth, country town with a CBD consisting of two streets is getting nonstops?!

So how come Brisbane of all places, another small country town, is in the frame for a nonstop to Chicago ahead of Sydney or Melbourne?
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
Ishrion
Posts: 896
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: Qantas plans to launch BNE-SFO and BNE-ORD one QF/AA final approval is granted

Sun Jun 09, 2019 6:18 am

cedarjet wrote:
Is Brisbane the Aussie end of the route because of range? Otherwise I don’t get it. 75% of traffic will have to take a domestic flight from Sydney or Melbourne first, so it’s no improvement on going via LAX on QF/AA or via AKL on NZ.

Reminds me of the people who said after the success of PER LHR that Perth would get nonstops to Frankfurt and Paris. Frankfurt and Paris have been attempted from Sydney without success, but Perth, country town with a CBD consisting of two streets is getting nonstops?!

So how come Brisbane of all places, another small country town, is in the frame for a nonstop to Chicago ahead of Sydney or Melbourne?


I’d bet on range. BNE-ORD is 100 miles shorter than PER-LHR while SYD-ORD is 200 miles longer.

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