spannacomo
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Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:16 pm

Flight IG938 from SFO to MXP scheduled on june 1st was delayed beacuse the aircraft was damaged by a ramp vehicle, causing the flight to be postponed by 36 hours and affecting many passengers.
In this interview just published on corriere della sera (in italian only)
https://www.corriere.it/cronache/19_giugno_05/air-italy-quindici-mesi-altalena-ma-ora-compagnia-stabilizzata-46b3a0d4-878c-11e9-b851-9738da749704.shtml
rossen dimitrov, IG COO, claims that AA had a spare part IG needed to repair the aircraft but they refused to supply it, causing a delay increase. He also claims that they would have helped AA if it had happened in MXP.
Last edited by SQ22 on Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:46 am, edited 3 times in total.
Reason: Title updated
 
evanb
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Re: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:21 pm

Is AA IG's usual line maintenance supplier at SFO?
 
phxa340
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Re: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:30 pm

Maybe AA needed the part ? So much more to this story.
 
Worldair1
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Re: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:34 pm

If the airlines don't have an AOG assistance agreement in place ahead of time, good luck getting anything out of them. If one is in place it's considered a "loan" and the borrowing airline pays a percentage of what the part is worth every day until it's returned.
 
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9MMPQ
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Re: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:39 pm

I can guarantee that if it's the last part of that particular item in their inventory IG would not hand it over to AA or anyone else. That happens more often then people think. But without knowing the circumstances who knows what the issue was exacty. Seems a bit of a cheap shot to make in an interview and looks like they have more pressing issues to worry about.
I believe in coincidences. Coincidences happen every day. But I don't trust coincidences.
 
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UPlog
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 4:49 pm

Seems like a non-story.
 
spannacomo
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:08 pm

If AA had a good reason to refuse to supply the spare part, I would like to know it. Otherwise I think this decision was stupid at a level of business because AA had the opportunity to earn a fair price selling a spare part, and even more stupid at a more general level because people should not bear the grunt of air transport problems more than it is needed, and in this case it looks like it was not needed. Dimitrov said they would have helped AA in MXP if needed, this seems to me the correct approach. Make business and help people.
 
INFINITI329
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:08 pm

I'm confused why there are 330 parts for AA in SFO. Does SFO ever see AA A330 service?
 
Weatherwatcher1
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:13 pm

Sounds like Air Italy didn’t have the agreement in place or AA didn’t want to sell. Both issues happen. Airlines are usually pretty willing to help each other out with spare parts since it is mutually beneficial. At JFK for example, Delta is known to be the parts warehouse for everyone. They have quite a lucrative business selling parts. I would expect UA to be the main parts broker at SFO

INFINITI329 wrote:
I'm confused why there are 330 parts for AA in SFO. Does SFO ever see AA A330 service?


Without knowing what the part is, it is hard to tell. AA probably has lots of A321 parts. It very well could have been a part common to multiple planes.
 
yuomi
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:14 pm

INFINITI329 wrote:
I'm confused why there are 330 parts for AA in SFO. Does SFO ever see AA A330 service?



AA700 SFO-PHL is definitely run w/ an a330.

Can't think of any others off the top of my head.
 
alasizon
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:18 pm

Weatherwatcher1 wrote:
INFINITI329 wrote:
I'm confused why there are 330 parts for AA in SFO. Does SFO ever see AA A330 service?


Without knowing what the part is, it is hard to tell. AA probably has lots of A321 parts. It very well could have been a part common to multiple planes.


AA does send 330s to SFO almost daily from PHL so that makes sense as to why there would be a 330-specific part in SFO.
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Weatherwatcher1
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:23 pm

alasizon wrote:
Weatherwatcher1 wrote:
INFINITI329 wrote:
I'm confused why there are 330 parts for AA in SFO. Does SFO ever see AA A330 service?


Without knowing what the part is, it is hard to tell. AA probably has lots of A321 parts. It very well could have been a part common to multiple planes.


AA does send 330s to SFO almost daily from PHL so that makes sense as to why there would be a 330-specific part in SFO.


Other than tires, I don’t think AA would stock a whole lot of A330 specific parts for a single domestic turn. My guess is that we are talking about a part common to the A321. The majority of AA flights out of SFO are A321s
 
alasizon
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:29 pm

Weatherwatcher1 wrote:
Other than tires, I don’t think AA would stock a whole lot of A330 specific parts for a single domestic turn. My guess is that we are talking about a part common to the A321. The majority of AA flights out of SFO are A321s


The 330 sits on the ground for 13 hours in SFO every day for an MX touch.
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pilotkev1
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 5:58 pm

Probably something to do with LAA maintenance not being allowed to touch LUS, per union contracts, and vice versa.

Not sure about specifics, but I'd speculate SFO has contract maintenance for LUS equipment, and AA maintenance for LAA. Perhaps the part was stocked by contract maintenance instead of AA themselves.
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BTC
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:03 pm

spannacomo wrote:
If AA had a good reason to refuse to supply the spare part, I would like to know it.


Why? Were you affected by this?

spannacomo wrote:
Otherwise I think this decision was stupid at a level of business because AA had the opportunity to earn a fair price selling a spare part, and even more stupid at a more general level because people should not bear the grunt of air transport problems more than it is needed, and in this case it looks like it was not needed.


It's a stupid level of business not to have a parts agreement in place. Your ire should be directed at Air Italy firstly.

spannacomo wrote:
Dimitrov said they would have helped AA in MXP if needed, this seems to me the correct approach. Make business and help people.


Talk is cheap. Put it down in a contract.
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WayexTDI
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:27 pm

pilotkev1 wrote:
Probably something to do with LAA maintenance not being allowed to touch LUS, per union contracts, and vice versa.

Not sure about specifics, but I'd speculate SFO has contract maintenance for LUS equipment, and AA maintenance for LAA. Perhaps the part was stocked by contract maintenance instead of AA themselves.

This has nothing to do with LAA working on LUS aircraft or vice-versa; this is "just" about AA supplying a part to IG...
 
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litz
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:28 pm

If I were AA, I'd also be making darned sure I'd get paid for the part I was supplying ...
 
flyboy7974
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 6:39 pm

yuomi wrote:
INFINITI329 wrote:
I'm confused why there are 330 parts for AA in SFO. Does SFO ever see AA A330 service?



AA700 SFO-PHL is definitely run w/ an a330.

Can't think of any others off the top of my head.


AA has been running an A332 scheduled flight to SFO daily in the 4pm bank. Announced today is that aircraft will be pulled from the flight until further notice to allow a spare to remain in Philly to support the t/a operation.
 
Boof02671
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 7:47 pm

pilotkev1 wrote:
Probably something to do with LAA maintenance not being allowed to touch LUS, per union contracts, and vice versa.

Not sure about specifics, but I'd speculate SFO has contract maintenance for LUS equipment, and AA maintenance for LAA. Perhaps the part was stocked by contract maintenance instead of AA themselves.

Not true both sides can do line maintenance AA can work US and vice versa as long as they take the gen fam class.
 
Boof02671
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 7:49 pm

And Delta has done the same thing.

https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSL5N1FU50K

It’s probably because Air Italy is owned by one of the ME3.

https://airlinegeeks.com/2019/04/18/air ... riers-row/
 
smartplane
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:03 pm

litz wrote:
If I were AA, I'd also be making darned sure I'd get paid for the part I was supplying ...

Both use IATA payment settlement, so could have been paid for real time.
 
ozark1
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:18 pm

spannacomo wrote:
If AA had a good reason to refuse to supply the spare part, I would like to know it. Otherwise I think this decision was stupid at a level of business because AA had the opportunity to earn a fair price selling a spare part, and even more stupid at a more general level because people should not bear the grunt of air transport problems more than it is needed, and in this case it looks like it was not needed. Dimitrov said they would have helped AA in MXP if needed, this seems to me the correct approach. Make business and help people.

What a ridiculous statement. You have no idea what the circumstances were. Just another social media frenzy over an incident where the specifics are unknown. These are the kinds of Airliners posts that really irritate me. But you know it's 2019 when the source quoted is the media, and when the entire issue is about a part. Give me a break.
 
grbauc
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Re: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:41 pm

phxa340 wrote:
Maybe AA needed the part ? So much more to this story.



Have we not leaned that we are in the days of not investigating news but rather sensationalize news. Clicks and views matter more. Back in the day people held news organizations to some sort of standard and public opinion if negative towards a company could doom you. Example AA not wanting to go into Ch11 for fear of public retaliation. That generation is gone and they suffered due to waiting.
 
spannacomo
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:55 pm

BTC wrote:
spannacomo wrote:
If AA had a good reason to refuse to supply the spare part, I would like to know it.


Why? Were you affected by this?


No, why this question?
spannacomo wrote:
Otherwise I think this decision was stupid at a level of business because AA had the opportunity to earn a fair price selling a spare part, and even more stupid at a more general level because people should not bear the grunt of air transport problems more than it is needed, and in this case it looks like it was not needed.


It's a stupid level of business not to have a parts agreement in place. Your ire should be directed at Air Italy firstly.

AA refuse to sell a spare part this mean they won't sign any contract with IG, not viceversa. So my ire goes to the right side.
spannacomo wrote:
Dimitrov said they would have helped AA in MXP if needed, this seems to me the correct approach. Make business and help people.


Talk is cheap. Put it down in a contract.
probably AA would not accept a favor in MXP so that they are not forced to return it. The blame is still on AA.
 
INFINITI329
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 8:55 pm

flyboy7974 wrote:
yuomi wrote:
INFINITI329 wrote:
I'm confused why there are 330 parts for AA in SFO. Does SFO ever see AA A330 service?



AA700 SFO-PHL is definitely run w/ an a330.

Can't think of any others off the top of my head.


AA has been running an A332 scheduled flight to SFO daily in the 4pm bank. Announced today is that aircraft will be pulled from the flight until further notice to allow a spare to remain in Philly to support the t/a operation.


You learn something new every day... I had no idea AA ran 330s into SFO
 
usflyer msp
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 9:18 pm

spannacomo wrote:
BTC wrote:
spannacomo wrote:
If AA had a good reason to refuse to supply the spare part, I would like to know it.


Why? Were you affected by this?


No, why this question?
spannacomo wrote:
Otherwise I think this decision was stupid at a level of business because AA had the opportunity to earn a fair price selling a spare part, and even more stupid at a more general level because people should not bear the grunt of air transport problems more than it is needed, and in this case it looks like it was not needed.


It's a stupid level of business not to have a parts agreement in place. Your ire should be directed at Air Italy firstly.

AA refuse to sell a spare part this mean they won't sign any contract with IG, not viceversa. So my ire goes to the right side.
spannacomo wrote:
Dimitrov said they would have helped AA in MXP if needed, this seems to me the correct approach. Make business and help people.


Talk is cheap. Put it down in a contract.
probably AA would not accept a favor in MXP so that they are not forced to return it. The blame is still on AA.


You obviously have no idea how this works...
 
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 9:34 pm

usflyer msp wrote:
spannacomo wrote:
BTC wrote:

Why? Were you affected by this?


No, why this question?


It's a stupid level of business not to have a parts agreement in place. Your ire should be directed at Air Italy firstly.

AA refuse to sell a spare part this mean they won't sign any contract with IG, not viceversa. So my ire goes to the right side.


Talk is cheap. Put it down in a contract.
probably AA would not accept a favor in MXP so that they are not forced to return it. The blame is still on AA.


You obviously have no idea how this works...


Seriously, AA is under no obligation whatsoever to supply this part. It is done as a courtesy, if at all, when it happens. I understand it can be frustrating for IG when they know a part is there, but then maybe they should stock parts of their own with their respective contracted engineering teams at the outstations. Anyone who thinks AA was in anyway in the wrong has clearly never worked for an airline. Maybe it was petty, maybe it wasn't "nice", but it's business, and that is all there is to it.
 
Boof02671
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 9:45 pm

Maybe AA needed the part for scheduled maintenance that night. AA is under no obligation to lend/lease.
 
sargester
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 9:55 pm

INFINITI329 wrote:
I'm confused why there are 330 parts for AA in SFO. Does SFO ever see AA A330 service?


Yes PHL SFO daily
 
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:24 pm

BTC wrote:
Talk is cheap. Put it down in a contract.

Exactly. Sign a mutual support contract. Now if AA flies different equipment to Italy, then perhaps IG should sign a contract where AA guarantees a fly away kit is ready.

Perhaps AA was under such a lien where the contract penalties could have been high enough that staff couldn't release the part to anyone but a contract customer without executive approval.

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jaybird
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:44 pm

Isn't Air Italy currently being propped up by Qatar Airways? Certainly no love lost between AA and Qatar. Not surprised AA wouldn't help them out.
 
mcdu
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:47 pm

If Air Italy needed a part they should have a plan to get that part. Relying on a loan from AA is bad business. There is cost to doing business as an airline that the cheap carriers don't want to pay. They learn the hard way.
 
strfyr51
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:48 pm

Even IF American had 10 of them? What Obligation are they under to Give the part to IG? That kind of stuff is Arranged in advance with an Agreement!!
Did IG Have one???
If NOT? Then They needed to call the Airbus AOG desk and arrange the Part delivery because I'm Sure Airbus has one in Stock in the USA. You Can't just go around demanding other Airlines hand you their Parts!! Hell! By their Logic? American would be Bound to rob their OWN airplane to give the part to them!! FAT Chance!!
American isn't going to do that without Good damn reason.
 
strfyr51
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Wed Jun 05, 2019 10:53 pm

spannacomo wrote:
Flight IG938 from SFO to MXP scheduled on june 1st was delayed beacuse the aircraft was damaged by a ramp vehicle, causing the flight to be postponed by 36 hours and affecting many passengers.
In this interview just published on corriere della sera (in italian only)
https://www.corriere.it/cronache/19_giugno_05/air-italy-quindici-mesi-altalena-ma-ora-compagnia-stabilizzata-46b3a0d4-878c-11e9-b851-9738da749704.shtml
rossen dimitrov, IG COO, claims that AA had a spare part IG needed to repair the aircraft but they refused to supply it, causing a delay increase. He also claims that they would have helped AA if it had happened in MXP.

What Kind of BOOB demands Parts from another Carrier JUST because they have one? Is he flying Air Force 1? YGBSM!!
 
fdxtulmech
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:23 am

I would imagine that they did not have any kinda of vendor agreement in place. Without AA being an approved vendor the is no way for them to transfer the part legally, at least not quickly. Every part has to have a paper trail to satisfy the FAA requirements. Personally, I had an AA aircraft on a weather divert to a station where I worked for another company. The plane needed a couple of quarts of oil, I had the right oil and I was very familiar with the type of aircraft, but since we were not an approved vendor I couldn't touch the plane and I couldn't give the oil to the on-call guy that was approved for them. He was out of oil and it had to be flown in along with a mechanic just to put a couple of quarts of oil in an engine. A 30 min job became about an 8 hour ordeal just because of paperwork.
 
bourbon
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:29 am

Boof02671 wrote:
And Delta has done the same thing.

https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSL5N1FU50K

It’s probably because Air Italy is owned by one of the ME3.

https://airlinegeeks.com/2019/04/18/air ... riers-row/

Probably don’t have an loan/borrow agreement or finance approval with air Italy.
 
Boof02671
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:31 am

Not true, the AA part comes with a FAA and inspector 8130, tag.

Air Italy would go through Material Services, who would generate the request and a lend lease form gets filled out and whomever from IG would sign it and get a copy.
 
grbauc
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:38 am

Boof02671 wrote:
Maybe AA needed the part for scheduled maintenance that night. AA is under no obligation to lend/lease.



we have no clue to the circumstances.. Only guesses..
 
usflyer msp
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:56 am

Also by trying to embarass AA in the media, IG has just made sure that they will never ever get a part from AA.
 
WayexTDI
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:07 am

strfyr51 wrote:
Even IF American had 10 of them? What Obligation are they under to Give the part to IG? That kind of stuff is Arranged in advance with an Agreement!!
Did IG Have one???
If NOT? Then They needed to call the Airbus AOG desk and arrange the Part delivery because I'm Sure Airbus has one in Stock in the USA. You Can't just go around demanding other Airlines hand you their Parts!! Hell! By their Logic? American would be Bound to rob their OWN airplane to give the part to them!! FAT Chance!!
American isn't going to do that without Good damn reason.

Airbus AOG's are mostly handled by the OEM's themselves. If Airbus is the OEM, then yes Airbus AOG is to be called; but, if it's an independent OEM, then the OEM has stock.

The thing is, when an airline has an AOG, the OEM will usually sell a part, not loan it; whereas an other airline will do a loan usually (that might end up in a purchase, but that's another story). So, in the end, ordering from the OEM will most likely cost the airline more than borrowing from another airline; although that cost will surely be less than leaving the aircraft 30+ hours on the ground with the loss of revenue and such.
 
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:09 am

But for Air Italy to go public with this, they very well could have had an agreement with AA for AOG/parts. That's normal in the airline business.

And its normal for competitors to "help" eachother. Otherwise, you'd be forced to keep spare parts and AMT/A&P/Inspectors at ALL of your stations.
xx
 
WayexTDI
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:12 am

usxguy wrote:
But for Air Italy to go public with this, they very well could have had an agreement with AA for AOG/parts. That's normal in the airline business.

And its normal for competitors to "help" eachother. Otherwise, you'd be forced to keep spare parts and AMT/A&P/Inspectors at ALL of your stations.

Sure it's normal to help each other... unless it's to the detriment of their own operations. They aren't going to ground themselves to help a competitor...
 
Boof02671
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 1:51 am

Leasing a part isn’t cheap from an airline to airline.
 
BravoOne
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Re: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:01 am

Worldair1 wrote:
If the airlines don't have an AOG assistance agreement in place ahead of time, good luck getting anything out of them. If one is in place it's considered a "loan" and the borrowing airline pays a percentage of what the part is worth every day until it's returned.


Maybe they didn't pay for the last part that AA loaned them?
 
BTC
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 9:33 am

spannacomo wrote:
No, why this question?


Because if it's not affecting you, it's really none of your business how a commercial business deals with such requests.

spannacomo wrote:
AA refuse to sell a spare part this mean they won't sign any contract with IG, not viceversa. So my ire goes to the right side.


Yes, I hope to IG who haven't made proper arrangements.

spannacomo wrote:
probably AA would not accept a favor in MXP so that they are not forced to return it. The blame is still on AA.


Laughable answer.
Flown in :- A319, A320, A321, A332, A359, BAC ATP, BAC-1-11, BAE146, B722, B732, B733, B734, B738, B744, B752, B762, B763, B772, B788, CS3, CRJ7, CRJ9, Dash 8, DC10, Dornier 328, E170, E190, HS 121 Trident, Shorts 360
 
wjcandee
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Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:12 am

This smacks of a marginal airline trying to blame anyone but itself for its inability to recover quickly after its aircraft was damaged without a sufficient recovery plan.

And the OP's subsequent comments really reflect a lack of understanding of the details of how this aspect of this business works.

Lightsaber helpfully pointed out a potential wrinkle that everybody ignored: the part may have been one that is subject to a lien by a lender and couldn't be turned over by AA absent executive approval and most-likely approval of the lender, which usually means a bunch of paperwork. For the OP to say that "AA" should have done such-and-such ignores the reality that the person in the parts warehouse can't just put any old part on the back of another airline's pickup truck and tet them take it away. If there is a pre-existing contract in place, then there are agreed terms as to when and what can be sold/loaned and the terms on which all this is done. It likely runs to 50+ pages, plus schedules and addenda. If you don't have that in advance, you have to get a written agreement for that particular part, which might not be that simple. This airline is an Airbus customer. It accordingly has various agreements with them, and the agreements/paperwork side of things to have Airbus send in a part from somewhere else might result in a smaller total time from call to part delivery than trying to get it from another airline without a preexisting agreement. Fact is that Airbus ought to be able to get that part to the IG team within 5 or so hours if it's somewhere in the US, depending on how much IG is willing to pay for the transportation.

I understand that IG was trying to get its airplane back in the air, but the bigger picture is what happens if the part is destroyed or rendered worthless during the trip across the airport or during the installation process, what insurance covers it, does AA have the right to sell/lend it (i.e. if it's under a lien), what happens if it fails and an accident results, how creditworthy is the borrowing airline, etc., etc. Depending on the size, value, and uniqueness of the part, and the time of day the need arose, the decision to lend it isn't something that some guy in a warehouse likely has the authority to do, absent preexisting arrangements.

They're not asking to borrow a cup of sugar. For IG to blame AA for its own lack of planning seems pretty beyond-the-beyond.
Last edited by wjcandee on Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
SAAFNAV
Posts: 569
Joined: Wed Mar 17, 2010 5:41 pm

Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:24 am

spannacomo wrote:
If AA had a good reason to refuse to supply the spare part, I would like to know it.


Unless you work for AA, you have no reason for you being allowed to know it.

spannacomo wrote:
Otherwise I think this decision was stupid at a level of business because AA had the opportunity to earn a fair price selling a spare part, and even more stupid at a more general level because people should not bear the grunt of air transport problems more than it is needed, and in this case it looks like it was not needed. Dimitrov said they would have helped AA in MXP if needed, this seems to me the correct approach. Make business and help people.


Whether you think it was a stupid move or not, it remains the sole prerogative of AA to help another airline. Most likely, if they didn't, there was no contract binding them to do so. AA is not primarily in the business of selling parts. Whilst they might do that, it is not a spur-of-the-moment thing. And how do you know they might not have needed the part, or have minimum stock levels etc.

You should realize that airlines aren't there to make people's lives better. They only exist to make a profit for their shareholders. The vehicle they chose to make a profit just happened to be carting people around.

Before you are so quick to blame them for being so unfair, imagine if I were to knock on your door, saying I am a friend of a friend with a history of going bankrupt, but you'd better lend me your spare tire unless I go to the media and tell people how mean you are.
Last edited by SAAFNAV on Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
L-382 Loadmaster; ex C-130B Navigator
 
wjcandee
Posts: 7768
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 10:27 am

SAAFNAV wrote:
imagine if I were to knock on your door, saying I am a friend of a friend with a history of going bankrupt, but you'd better lend me your spare tire unless I go to the media and tell people how mean you are.


More like lend me your entire car. Right now.

And I'm not asking you; I'm asking your 15-year-old daughter because you're not home.
 
spannacomo
Topic Author
Posts: 91
Joined: Wed May 30, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:27 pm

I was not personally affected but I think those who were affected have the right to know that AA had the possibility to make money by selling a spare part AND help people, while they chose to lose money and hinder people. Shareholders also have the right to know it, so they can evaluate AA's management. That's all. I think that was a bad management decision but I have no problem with people thinking otherwise.
 
Boof02671
Posts: 1626
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: Media: AA refuses to supply IG with a spare part causing delays in SFO

Thu Jun 06, 2019 12:39 pm

spannacomo wrote:
I was not personally affected but I think those who were affected have the right to know that AA had the possibility to make money by selling a spare part AND help people, while they chose to lose money and hinder people. Shareholders also have the right to know it, so they can evaluate AA's management. That's all. I think that was a bad management decision but I have no problem with people thinking otherwise.

No one has the right to know your making a mountain out of a molehill.

You don’t know specifics, you are just gaslighting

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