AF086
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UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:12 am

ANAC's (Brazilian regulator) system shows a request from United for a IAH-VCP service using the flight number of the current IAH-GRU flight. That implies a move of the Houston flight to Campinas. It is odd because the request is only valid from 30NOV to 25DEC and it does not feature the VCP-IAH leg. If true a few factors may explain the move if it really happens: the demise of Avianca Brasil which provided feed for UA, Azul's massive hub at VCP that would allow UA to reach cities no other US airline does and the fact that IAH is the smallest O&D from GRU of all of UA's flights and, as a consequence, the flight that carries most connections.

Requested schedule is:

UA62 - IAH 0230 1240 VCP - DAILY - 763

All times UTC.

Time will tell if it was a system error or if UA simply did not file the whole request to the Brazilian authorities. But we cannot forget that UA holds a significant stake at Azul and that they already codeshare.
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xdlx
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:35 am

United seems to have a new network planner that "thinks out of the box"; Second destination announcement that goes "away from norm" CPT is an excellent choice to avoid JNB hot and high restrictions. And VCP certainly can give them a source of revenue away from GRU a busy airport any day.
 
sonicruiser
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:19 pm

xdlx wrote:
United seems to have a new network planner that "thinks out of the box"; Second destination announcement that goes "away from norm" CPT is an excellent choice to avoid JNB hot and high restrictions. And VCP certainly can give them a source of revenue away from GRU a busy airport any day.


This ^
 
VC10er
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:32 pm

Hmmm...I am no route planner, but while one flight on UA metal seems logical given Azul, to end the 1 flight from United’ South American gateway HUB to South America’s largest city and business city seems very strange to me.
Indeed UA has many flights to GRU from the USA: EWR, IAD, ORD, they are not convenient connections for the entire western and mid west USA. So if you live in San Diego, LA l, SF or even Denver- you’d need to fly way north or north east to get to GRU?
A NEW flight from IAH to VCP would be interesting, but then I’d think Azul would like to fly their metal to IAH?

Given the great option to fly to GRU and then grab Azul to SDU...in Rio’s city center vs GIG, is extremely convenient vs the ride from GIG to the beaches or downtown - which has made me curious why Azul hasn’t officially joined Star Alliance?
Azul is a great airline (domestically) - I’ve never flown them internationally however.
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STT757
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:41 pm

I just cannot see UA dropping IAH-GRU in favor of VCP. If UA Does serve VCP, it will be in addition to GRU.


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DolphinAir747
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:51 pm

How are UA's ORD-GRU and IAD-GRU doing?
 
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flyer1225
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:08 pm

Is there enough connecting traffic to launch IAH-VCP in addition to IAH-GRU?
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Cointrin330
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:12 pm

DolphinAir747 wrote:
How are UA's ORD-GRU and IAD-GRU doing?


UA has been flying ORD-GRU for years. The Brazil market has been in flux due to the country's economic issues, but overall, UA has made little to no adjustments to its portfolio of Brazil routes (IAH-GIG, IAH-GRU, IAD-GRU, EWR-GRU, ORD-GRU) for some time.
 
AF086
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:43 pm

VC10er wrote:
Hmmm...I am no route planner, but while one flight on UA metal seems logical given Azul, to end the 1 flight from United’ South American gateway HUB to South America’s largest city and business city seems very strange to me.
Indeed UA has many flights to GRU from the USA: EWR, IAD, ORD, they are not convenient connections for the entire western and mid west USA. So if you live in San Diego, LA l, SF or even Denver- you’d need to fly way north or north east to get to GRU?
A NEW flight from IAH to VCP would be interesting, but then I’d think Azul would like to fly their metal to IAH?

Given the great option to fly to GRU and then grab Azul to SDU...in Rio’s city center vs GIG, is extremely convenient vs the ride from GIG to the beaches or downtown - which has made me curious why Azul hasn’t officially joined Star Alliance?
Azul is a great airline (domestically) - I’ve never flown them internationally however.


If you want to arrive at SDU from the US with UA, it will be much more convenient to connect at VCP given AD's large offer to the airport. And IAHGIG has its own public, it's IAH largest O&D in Brazil. Too bad UA does not explore other destinations from Rio.

IAH is not on Azul's plans with their own metal.
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evanb
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:53 pm

AF086 wrote:
If you want to arrive at SDU from the US with UA, it will be much more convenient to connect at VCP given AD's large offer to the airport. And IAHGIG has its own public, it's IAH largest O&D in Brazil. Too bad UA does not explore other destinations from Rio.


In all fairness, if you want to arrive at SDU from the US with UA, you may as well just take UA129 IAH-GIG and take a taxi across town. It'll be much quicker than the connection IAH-VCP-SDU.
 
AF086
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:55 pm

evanb wrote:
AF086 wrote:
If you want to arrive at SDU from the US with UA, it will be much more convenient to connect at VCP given AD's large offer to the airport. And IAHGIG has its own public, it's IAH largest O&D in Brazil. Too bad UA does not explore other destinations from Rio.


In all fairness, if you want to arrive at SDU from the US with UA, you may as well just take UA129 IAH-GIG and take a taxi across town. It'll be much quicker than the connection IAH-VCP-SDU.


Agreed and did that many times. But some people prefer landing at SDU just like others that may prefer arriving at CGH from abroad connecting at GIG to achieve that.
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LAXdude1023
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 2:58 pm

If this is indeed a replacement flights, its an awful idea. VCP is out in the boonies and a solid two hours from GRU. A real yield killer.

It would be better off as an additional flight given that IAH is UA's primary gateway to Latin America. Even then I dont think its a good idea.
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n2dru
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:05 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
If this is indeed a replacement flights, its an awful idea. VCP is out in the boonies and a solid two hours from GRU. A real yield killer.

It would be better off as an additional flight given that IAH is UA's primary gateway to Latin America. Even then I dont think its a good idea.


Would you happen to know the top O&D US destinations for GRU and GIG? Where does IAH, ORD and IAD fall on the list?
 
LAXdude1023
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:11 pm

n2dru wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:
If this is indeed a replacement flights, its an awful idea. VCP is out in the boonies and a solid two hours from GRU. A real yield killer.

It would be better off as an additional flight given that IAH is UA's primary gateway to Latin America. Even then I dont think its a good idea.


Would you happen to know the top O&D US destinations for GRU and GIG? Where does IAH, ORD and IAD fall on the list?


ORD and IAD are bigger to GRU than IAH.

IAH is far larger to GIG than ORD and IAD.

IAH has an inverse relationship to Brazil that the rest of the country does. IAH-GIG is not only very large but commands very high fare premiums. Its really the only market other than Florida and NYC that does in the US. IAH-GRU isnt small, but its not huge either.
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2travel2know2
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:17 pm

Really, why not AD VCP-IAH then?
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dcajet
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:26 pm

2travel2know2 wrote:
Really, why not AD VCP-IAH then?


Because Azul's international strategy seems to be to fly to destinations popular with the Brazilian source market (FLL, MCO, BRC, MVD, EZE, LIS, OPO) or to bring tourism into Brazil from source markets like Argentina (EZE, COR, ROS). Greater Sao Paulo - Houston is not either of them. Rio is another story altogether because of the oil industry and an exception in a market like GIG that has seen nothing but service reductions all over the past few years.
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9w748capt
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:28 pm

AF086 wrote:
evanb wrote:
AF086 wrote:
If you want to arrive at SDU from the US with UA, it will be much more convenient to connect at VCP given AD's large offer to the airport. And IAHGIG has its own public, it's IAH largest O&D in Brazil. Too bad UA does not explore other destinations from Rio.


In all fairness, if you want to arrive at SDU from the US with UA, you may as well just take UA129 IAH-GIG and take a taxi across town. It'll be much quicker than the connection IAH-VCP-SDU.


Agreed and did that many times. But some people prefer landing at SDU just like others that may prefer arriving at CGH from abroad connecting at GIG to achieve that.


Wow I'm surprised people do that in Rio. The airports there aren't quite as far apart as in Sao Paulo. I can understand connecting to arrive at CGH vs GRU given how far GRU is outside the city. But then again I've only been to Brazil once and probably not going back - if I was a regular visitor I may feel differently!
 
C010T3
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:32 pm

Can‘t you lot spot a misfile when you see one?
 
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ojjunior
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:35 pm

AF086 wrote:
It is odd because the request is only valid from 30NOV to 25DEC


Testing i presume and during high season.
But yes, nice move and good luck for UA
 
dcajet
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:43 pm

C010T3 wrote:
Can‘t you lot spot a misfile when you see one?


:lol: So much for United's whiz kid of a network planner :lol:
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n2dru
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:50 pm

LAXdude1023 wrote:
n2dru wrote:
LAXdude1023 wrote:
If this is indeed a replacement flights, its an awful idea. VCP is out in the boonies and a solid two hours from GRU. A real yield killer.

It would be better off as an additional flight given that IAH is UA's primary gateway to Latin America. Even then I dont think its a good idea.


Would you happen to know the top O&D US destinations for GRU and GIG? Where does IAH, ORD and IAD fall on the list?


ORD and IAD are bigger to GRU than IAH.

IAH is far larger to GIG than ORD and IAD.

IAH has an inverse relationship to Brazil that the rest of the country does. IAH-GIG is not only very large but commands very high fare premiums. Its really the only market other than Florida and NYC that does in the US. IAH-GRU isnt small, but its not huge either.


Thanks for your response. I figured IAH GIG has to do with the oil industry.
 
NYKiwi
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 4:32 pm

So living in NY, we only have seasonal non-stop to GIG now, so earlier this month I had to fly there and opted for EWR - GRU - SDU, and I have to say it was pretty smooth. I could have done LGA - IAH - GIG, but the convenience of SDU is great, and beats transferring in MIA any day....

So there are people that will use GRU as a transfer to Rio.

Also not that this is any indication of the flight profitability but the EWR to GRU was packed and not a bad ride on the older Continental 777-200.
 
AF086
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:56 pm

C010T3 wrote:
Can‘t you lot spot a misfile when you see one?


That is why the question mark is on the title.
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VC10er
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:58 pm

NYKiwi wrote:
So living in NY, we only have seasonal non-stop to GIG now, so earlier this month I had to fly there and opted for EWR - GRU - SDU, and I have to say it was pretty smooth. I could have done LGA - IAH - GIG, but the convenience of SDU is great, and beats transferring in MIA any day....

So there are people that will use GRU as a transfer to Rio.

Also not that this is any indication of the flight profitability but the EWR to GRU was packed and not a bad ride on the older Continental 777-200.


I am someone who is probably unique vs most when it comes to flying to Rio & São Paulo. I started flying UA to Rio about 1995 or ‘96. It is actually, true reason I am still a loyal UA flier today, I had racked up some serious miles and status. The reason I choose UA was its relationship with VARIG in Star Alliance. Between the 2 it gave me great options from the USA (pre 9/11) and unparalleled Brazilian domestic access. Also, RG was still great and an experience unto itself- a time warp back to the days of a banquet in the skies with Brazilian sizzle!
Aside from the UA flights numbers 987 & 988 from JFK to GRU, then a hop to GIG (It was just an hour sitting on the plane as pax left, and UA pax from other flights boarded and off we went)
Then the world changed on 9/12. I was actually on UA 988 on the first restored flight. I had become friends with the crew and my best friend FA said to me “keep your seatbelt very tight during the entire flight because the pilot has instructions to flip the plane (763) upside down “IF” the cockpit is attacked” I said “for how long? Just one turn, right?” She said “ Actually we can fly upside down for a long time...easy!”
GANG: Is that true? Can a 767 and others fly upside down? Wouldn’t the aircraft lose lift if the air foil wing was upside down?
Fast forward to today. As much as I like flying the 752 or 763 to IAH, then switching to the IAH to GIG, I HATE the return and going through security and passport control at IAH after a comfy flight from GIG.
I have found the EWR to SDU so much more pleasant, it’s an easy connection “today” with the new GRU, and (sorry) the ride and traffic from GIG to Zona Sul can suck vs landing at SDU, literally being 10 minutes in a taxi to my apartment in Copacabana. Both ways!
I miss VARIG like I miss PanAm.
MY ONE QUESTION: does either DL or AA offer SDU also?
IDEA: if the GIG flight could then put you on Azul (etc) to CGH, thus avoiding the usually HORRIBLE ride from GRU to downtown São Paulo - especially at night!
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
ScottB
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Re: UA moving IAH-GRU to VCP?

Tue Jun 11, 2019 4:34 pm

VC10er wrote:
MY ONE QUESTION: does either DL or AA offer SDU also?


Yes, both have Brazilian partners serving SDU: G3 in the case of DL and JJ in the case of AA.

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