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TWA772LR
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Re: What’s the emergency at EWR?

Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:37 am

DocLightning wrote:
Wacker1000 wrote:
I'm guessing United would want something well maintained with complete maintenance records.....


AA might not be doing so hot on the customer satisfaction side of things, but I have absolute confidence in their maintenance and safety.

I respect you big time Doc, but AA did have over 1/3 of their fleet grounded not too long ago...
When wasn't America great?


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DL757NYC
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Thu Jun 20, 2019 3:59 am

N649DL wrote:
DL757NYC wrote:
If they need a late build 757 with RR engines AA retired a bunch with relatively low time. And there are passenger models to be had out there. From foreign carriers. There are way more RR equipt frames than PW.


UA also has legacy PW 757s sitting in the desert as well. With only 15 ex-PS frames, there really isn't much slack in that sub fleet either.



The PMUA fleet was clapped out. Fed Ex picked through the fleet the ones left had corrosion issues. UA dumped them for a reason and Fed Ex passed on them. Fed Ex has both PW and RR 757’s.
 
N649DL
Posts: 586
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Thu Jun 20, 2019 4:46 am

DL757NYC wrote:
N649DL wrote:
DL757NYC wrote:
If they need a late build 757 with RR engines AA retired a bunch with relatively low time. And there are passenger models to be had out there. From foreign carriers. There are way more RR equipt frames than PW.


UA also has legacy PW 757s sitting in the desert as well. With only 15 ex-PS frames, there really isn't much slack in that sub fleet either.



The PMUA fleet was clapped out. Fed Ex picked through the fleet the ones left had corrosion issues. UA dumped them for a reason and Fed Ex passed on them. Fed Ex has both PW and RR 757’s.


Not necessarily. Some of the former PS fleet were 1989-1990 Legacy 752s (already mentioned) versus younger models in the 1997-1999 range. They sold 30 off to FedEx because it was essentially a quick sale in a gypsy sort of way under Smisek to get cold hard cash fast. I'm not sure if there was any rhyme or reason to the actual cycles of the planes sold, they just made do with 15 of the 757 to make into the new PS fleet. Then they ditched JFK and now they're oddballs in the overall fleet spectrum with no slack in case one goes MX.

The 757-200 is an amazing aircraft (one of my favorites) but even the ex-CO models are getting long in the tooth. That said, I fly DL a lot and they have domestic 757s dating back to 1990 with brand new interiors still flying and no firm plans to retire them in the short term.

It's funny how DL have installed brand new extended overhead bins and side panels, but if you check the registration number the aircraft could be from 1990-1992. The only way to tell other than that are the slow motors on the toilets (which is one of the few artifacts of how old they still are) or the cockpit itself. The downside is they cram in over 200 people to the old birds and it takes forever to board and de-plane.

No doubt UA could do the same but are probably waiting on it until the last possible second. If they did, it would have nothing to do with this broken aircraft it would be because of the MAX ban.
 
catiii
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Re: What’s the emergency at EWR?

Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:36 am

TWA772LR wrote:
DocLightning wrote:
Wacker1000 wrote:
I'm guessing United would want something well maintained with complete maintenance records.....


AA might not be doing so hot on the customer satisfaction side of things, but I have absolute confidence in their maintenance and safety.

I respect you big time Doc, but AA did have over 1/3 of their fleet grounded not too long ago...


As a result of a labor action though...
 
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DocLightning
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Re: What’s the emergency at EWR?

Thu Jun 20, 2019 4:09 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
I respect you big time Doc, but AA did have over 1/3 of their fleet grounded not too long ago...


Are you telling me and everyone else on this board that AA's fleet is not well-maintained and has incomplete maintenance records?
-Doc Lightning-

"The sky calls to us. If we do not destroy ourselves, we will one day venture to the stars."
-Carl Sagan
 
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SilverwingSpttr
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:11 pm

So UA are down one TATL-capable 752 now. I'm no expert, but I'm sure it couldn't hurt having a parts plane in the system.
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by738
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Fri Jun 21, 2019 6:11 pm

So whats the latest? where did it get lifted to and who's looking at it? FAA first, insurance then decision on repair or scrap?
 
11C
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:28 pm

Forgive me for not rereading this entire thread, it seems to have wandered from the original topic. Concerning that original topic, does anyone still believe that this “de-rotation” phenomenon could break an airliner the way that this one broke? I have no information that suggests how this did happen, but a nose wheel touching down “hard,” (after the mains, in a normal landing) and the entire nose gear structure failing, are clearly not comparable. Especially considering that this is a 757, which is considered to be very stout. A bounced landing seems possible. Any thoughts? Clearly, we will all find out soon enough.
 
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STT757
Posts: 13874
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Sun Jun 23, 2019 4:53 pm

CALTECH wrote:
UPS757Pilot wrote:
CALTECH wrote:
Reports are the acft bounced 3 times and came down on the nose landing gear at least once. Crane with slings and a trailer used for towing due to stability and structural concerns. NTSB quarantine in Hangar 55. Both nose wheel says and 4 main wheel says are in quarantine also.
We practice these scenarios in the simulator and unless you are stabilized after a bounce, a go-around is the best course of action. I wonder if the NTSB will take a look at this one.

Preliminary scuttlebutt is that the plane was bounced then the tires blew. Should've pulled up and performed a go around.

'HARD LANDING ON 22L EWR'

Boeing AOG Reps to provide repair feasibility report by Friday.


What’s the verdict, hopefully it will be repaired and returned to service.


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Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
77H
Posts: 1461
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Wed Jun 26, 2019 1:27 pm

OneSexyL1011 wrote:
UA444 wrote:
OneSexyL1011 wrote:
Ahh so pretty much the underpowered, under performing, lesser performance weighted, less capable, no raft or ETOPS, and lower avionic and communication optioned 757's then. Got it. Hate to burst his bubble but the RR birds are a much better version of the 757.

The PW 757 has better fuel burn, is quieter, more range, and is better looking. Funny how DL, NW, and TW all flew some of the longest 757 flights with PW powered ones. Meanwhile a slight breeze and it’s a fuel stop for RR. PW sounds like a refined V8, RR is buzzy General Motors 4 cylinder.

As for the UA 757s, some in fact do have ETOPS, life rafts, and they all meet the new avionics requirements from the FAA. Sorry to burst your bubble.

Compared to the RR 757's:
No SATCOM
No HF Data Link
Single HF
No 8.33 radios
No RSP/RCP ICAO communication minimums
Smaller fuel tanks
Less range (NW/Delta has higher weighted and fuel capacity versions)
Smaller less powerful engines
Lower AFM operating weights
No GPS Until about 2016 finally (post merger of course)
No Rafts or ETOPS except for 15 out of the original what? 100?

Yeah, they can just keep doing SFO-EWR-SFO. We'll put the real 757 on the real routes. There is a reason why they never leave the continental 48 anymore.


Many of the original “100” (I believe it was actually 97) pmUA 57s did have ETOPS. Flew numerous segments to and from Hawaii in the back of PW powered pmUA 752s. As a matter of fact, prior to the merger, The PW 752s were doing DEN-KOA/LIH/OGG, long before the RR 752s took over. While DEN-LIH is just under 3,000 nm, DEN sits a mile above sea level and aircraft departing west have to be able to clear the Front Range within minutes after take off. The pmCO RR 752s are remarkable but the pmUA PW 752s weren’t some spring chickens.

77H
 
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OneSexyL1011
Posts: 238
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Sat Jul 13, 2019 11:45 pm

Update on the 757's status.
Aircraft line number 3123 (N26123) has started being dismantled and prepared for aircraft salvage. Engines and APU are in the process of being removed. Any salvageable parts are being kept once approved by engineering. The rest will be dismantled on site.

As expected, a write off.
 
AA737-823
Posts: 5461
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2000 11:10 am

Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:00 am

OneSexyL1011 wrote:
Update on the 757's status.
Aircraft line number 3123 (N26123) has started being dismantled and prepared for aircraft salvage. Engines and APU are in the process of being removed. Any salvageable parts are being kept once approved by engineering. The rest will be dismantled on site.

As expected, a write off.


I figured as much, but it's still sad.
I had two very nice long-haul domestic flights on this aircraft.
What a shame.
 
ukoverlander
Posts: 383
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Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:02 am

That'll buff right out.........
 
ltbewr
Posts: 14329
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Sun Jul 14, 2019 1:06 am

Sad to see a plane lost to parts and scrap, but most important is that there were no injuries or deaths. This kinda reminds me of the WN 737 at LGA a few years also that did a similar nose heavy landing. It too got parted/scrapped out if I recall correctly. I also recall the pilots were quite heavily disciplined.

EWR has a major MX facility, I recall a UA 777 taking off for HKG doing a major tail drag, it was fixed at EWR with major involvement of Boeing staff. Apparently the damage with this 757 was too severe on critical structures to be fixed safely and at a reasonable costs considering the hours/cycle and depreciation, the part out/scrap value was likely the best financial choice.
 
n471wn
Posts: 1717
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:23 am

Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Sun Jul 14, 2019 1:25 am

ltbewr wrote:
Sad to see a plane lost to parts and scrap, but most important is that there were no injuries or deaths. This kinda reminds me of the WN 737 at LGA a few years also that did a similar nose heavy landing. It too got parted/scrapped out if I recall correctly. I also recall the pilots were quite heavily disciplined.

EWR has a major MX facility, I recall a UA 777 taking off for HKG doing a major tail drag, it was fixed at EWR with major involvement of Boeing staff. Apparently the damage with this 757 was too severe on critical structures to be fixed safely and at a reasonable costs considering the hours/cycle and depreciation, the part out/scrap value was likely the best financial choice.


The WN pilot was fired as she lost her composure and grabbed the controls from the FO at a critical time.
 
Max Q
Posts: 7712
Joined: Wed May 09, 2001 12:40 pm

Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:47 am

ltbewr wrote:
Sad to see a plane lost to parts and scrap, but most important is that there were no injuries or deaths. This kinda reminds me of the WN 737 at LGA a few years also that did a similar nose heavy landing. It too got parted/scrapped out if I recall correctly. I also recall the pilots were quite heavily disciplined.

EWR has a major MX facility, I recall a UA 777 taking off for HKG doing a major tail drag, it was fixed at EWR with major involvement of Boeing staff. Apparently the damage with this 757 was too severe on critical structures to be fixed safely and at a reasonable costs considering the hours/cycle and depreciation, the part out/scrap value was likely the best financial choice.



Mostly true except the 777 tail strike on take off was before the merger


It was a Continental aircraft
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


Guns and the love of them by a loud minority are a malignant and deadly cancer inflicted on American society
 
ltbewr
Posts: 14329
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

Re: United 757-200 hard landing at EWR

Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:58 am

Max Q wrote:
ltbewr wrote:
Sad to see a plane lost to parts and scrap, but most important is that there were no injuries or deaths. This kinda reminds me of the WN 737 at LGA a few years also that did a similar nose heavy landing. It too got parted/scrapped out if I recall correctly. I also recall the pilots were quite heavily disciplined.

EWR has a major MX facility, I recall a UA 777 taking off for HKG doing a major tail drag, it was fixed at EWR with major involvement of Boeing staff. Apparently the damage with this 757 was too severe on critical structures to be fixed safely and at a reasonable costs considering the hours/cycle and depreciation, the part out/scrap value was likely the best financial choice.



Mostly true except the 777 tail strike on take off was before the merger


It was a Continental aircraft


Thank you for the correction, CO had major mx facility at EWR that was taken over and expanded by UA

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