SelseyBill wrote:; the WTO is sure gonna be interested.......
Doubt they'll give two hoots
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SelseyBill wrote:; the WTO is sure gonna be interested.......
by738 wrote:SelseyBill wrote:; the WTO is sure gonna be interested.......
Doubt they'll give two hoots
IPFreely wrote:bond787 wrote:par13del wrote:Still waiting to hear about the pressure that Trump placed on IAG to buy American....
Please provide evidence that IAG was pressured by Trump.
I’m curious about this also. Especially since neither the President or the press have publicized this or made any victorious claims. Will we see the evidence soon?
musman9853 wrote:really surprised at any max orders right now. honestly expected them to be announced after the grounding is over and it's out of the public eye
strfyr51 wrote:musman9853 wrote:really surprised at any max orders right now. honestly expected them to be announced after the grounding is over and it's out of the public eye
Did ANYBODY think Boeing wouldn't figure out what they screwed up, where and When they screwed it up, and NOT fix it? They Know they screwed up!
And knowing is half the battle! The fix is already In as we speak. It's now a matter of dotting the I's and crossing the T's Boeing will take a hit for this in the form of not making the profits per airplane they might have sought, and EVEN selling them at Cost for a while. But they'll be back and in FORCE. On THAT? you can make BOOK on. Especially now that Airbus is knee deep in the A321XLR? .All Boeing needs is to Lay back. Then formally announce the B797 on their Terms. When Airbus is up to their Hips in developing the XLR and can't readily change any designs to counter any Boeing, Moves as I think Boeing will have a damn surprise for them!
SelseyBill wrote:BrianDromey wrote:Have Boeing pulled another United-Style order here?
....mmmmmm, interesting thought.
Its gonna be sure interesting to find out what IAG paid per unit for these MAX's. If Boeing have priced this deal at rates under production cost; the WTO is sure gonna be interested....... Boeing might be able to pull a stunt like the United one for a domestic deal, but for an 'export' deal to a European carrier; well thats a whole different bag of onions..........
nikeherc wrote:[
Please save your nonsense for when somebody actually makes a dumping complaint.
strfyr51 wrote:musman9853 wrote:really surprised at any max orders right now. honestly expected them to be announced after the grounding is over and it's out of the public eye
Did ANYBODY think Boeing wouldn't figure out what they screwed up, where and When they screwed it up, and NOT fix it? They Know they screwed up!
And knowing is half the battle! The fix is already In as we speak. It's now a matter of dotting the I's and crossing the T's Boeing will take a hit for this in the form of not making the profits per airplane they might have sought, and EVEN selling them at Cost for a while. But they'll be back and in FORCE. On THAT? you can make BOOK on. Especially now that Airbus is knee deep in the A321XLR? .All Boeing needs is to Lay back. Then formally announce the B797 on their Terms. When Airbus is up to their Hips in developing the XLR and can't readily change any designs to counter any Boeing, Moves as I think Boeing will have a damn surprise for them!
musman9853 wrote:strfyr51 wrote:musman9853 wrote:really surprised at any max orders right now. honestly expected them to be announced after the grounding is over and it's out of the public eye
Did ANYBODY think Boeing wouldn't figure out what they screwed up, where and When they screwed it up, and NOT fix it? They Know they screwed up!
And knowing is half the battle! The fix is already In as we speak. It's now a matter of dotting the I's and crossing the T's Boeing will take a hit for this in the form of not making the profits per airplane they might have sought, and EVEN selling them at Cost for a while. But they'll be back and in FORCE. On THAT? you can make BOOK on. Especially now that Airbus is knee deep in the A321XLR? .All Boeing needs is to Lay back. Then formally announce the B797 on their Terms. When Airbus is up to their Hips in developing the XLR and can't readily change any designs to counter any Boeing, Moves as I think Boeing will have a damn surprise for them!
I was more surprised that any airlines were willing to take the PR hit by ordering a plane that many of the public considers unsafe. you and I know better, but the average joe only sees the crashes.
Antarius wrote:
The average passenger can classify planes into two buckets
1. Is an a380
2. Is not an a380
Seriously, most people have no frickin clue what aircraft they are on. In a year, this will be forgotten.
speedbird52 wrote:VV wrote:speedbird52 wrote:Someone clearly does not understand the Terminal 5 Baggage system. Good job getting angry about airplane suitcase boxes by the way.
If you can't go to terminal 5 then don't go there.
Do you know a single thing about the way Heathrow is set up?
nikeherc wrote:
It’s not dumping to sell below cost.
nikeherc wrote:It’s not dumping to sell below cost.
nikeherc wrote:If IAG buys the planes in Britain and then assigns them to EU subsidiaries, then Boeing didn’t sell them in the EU. By the time Boeing begins delivery Britain will be out of the EU therefore the EU can’t make a dumping complaint for Airbus.
nikeherc wrote:Please save your nonsense for when somebody actually makes a dumping complaint.
aviationaware wrote:Interesting sidenote: while the IAG press release mentions those aircraft at destined for Vueling, Level and British Airways' Gatwick ops, the Flightglobal order tracker has them split 50/50 between Vueling and Level.
Does Flightglobal know something we/I don't, or did they make a mistake here? I'm especially suspicious about Level, since their shorthaul ops seem to be going nowhere financially.nikeherc wrote:
It’s not dumping to sell below cost.
Well, Boeing certainly disagreed with that notion as recently as a couple of months back when they tried to bring down Bombardier and instead ended up driving them into Airbus' arms like idiots.
JannEejit wrote:Any chance BA's LGW operations could be rebranded as 'Level' or 'Level UK' in the near future ?
AirwayBill wrote:Don’t know if this has been discussed yet, but here we go:
Airbus: did not get chance to bid for the MAX order IAG gave to Boeing
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/news/business/airbus--did-not-get-chance-to-bid-for-the-max-order-iag-gave-to-boeing-11645858
Revelation wrote:This is why I love a.net:#227: This LOI is just posturing
#228: This LOI signals a move to a Boeing only fleet
Maybe it's just an opportunistic buy?
Nah, that'd deprive us of an opportunity to throw shade...
xwb565 wrote:Revelation wrote:This is why I love a.net:#227: This LOI is just posturing
#228: This LOI signals a move to a Boeing only fleet
Maybe it's just an opportunistic buy?
Nah, that'd deprive us of an opportunity to throw shade...
I am sorry for seemingly copying your modus operandi on this forum- taking a article and adding spin to it.
Revelation wrote:xwb565 wrote:Revelation wrote:This is why I love a.net:#227: This LOI is just posturing
#228: This LOI signals a move to a Boeing only fleet
Maybe it's just an opportunistic buy?
Nah, that'd deprive us of an opportunity to throw shade...
I am sorry for seemingly copying your modus operandi on this forum- taking a article and adding spin to it.
I appreciate the imitation, it's a great form of flattery, but you might want to work on coming up with some more believable spin -- BA going all Boeing falls short of the mark, IMO.
xwb565 wrote:I will do my best to learn from the master- your subtle way of throwing shade at Airbus is indeed worthy of imitation
Revelation wrote:xwb565 wrote:I will do my best to learn from the master- your subtle way of throwing shade at Airbus is indeed worthy of imitation
For the record, I truly admire the A321 (especially with PW GTF) and the A330 -- what's your favorite Boeing product?
Revelation wrote:This is why I love a.net:#227: This LOI is just posturing
#228: This LOI signals a move to a Boeing only fleet
Maybe it's just an opportunistic buy?
Nah, that'd deprive us of an opportunity to throw shade...
nikeherc wrote:SelseyBill wrote:BrianDromey wrote:Have Boeing pulled another United-Style order here?
....mmmmmm, interesting thought.
Its gonna be sure interesting to find out what IAG paid per unit for these MAX's. If Boeing have priced this deal at rates under production cost; the WTO is sure gonna be interested....... Boeing might be able to pull a stunt like the United one for a domestic deal, but for an 'export' deal to a European carrier; well thats a whole different bag of onions..........
It’s not dumping to sell below cost. Razor manufacturers sell razors below cost all the time to sell blades at ridiculous prices. Dumping is consistently selling in a foreign market for less than your home market price. This is to prevent abusing your domestic customers to subsidize your attempts to take over foreign markets. An example of dumping would be China selling steel for $500 per ton in China, and for $75 per ton in the U.S. in this way they would be illegally cornering the market in the U.S. There is no domestic large airliner manufacturing in Britain, therefore there is no British industry to damage. If IAG buys the planes in Britain and then assigns them to EU subsidiaries, then Boeing didn’t sell them in the EU. By the time Boeing begins delivery Britain will be out of the EU therefore the EU can’t make a dumping complaint for Airbus. If the question of aircraft pricing comes up, Airbus has as much to lose as Boeing.
Please save your nonsense for when somebody actually makes a dumping complaint.
xwb565 wrote:Revelation wrote:xwb565 wrote:I am sorry for seemingly copying your modus operandi on this forum- taking a article and adding spin to it.
I appreciate the imitation, it's a great form of flattery, but you might want to work on coming up with some more believable spin -- BA going all Boeing falls short of the mark, IMO.
I will do my best to learn from the master- your subtle way of throwing shade at Airbus is indeed worthy of imitation
crimsonchin wrote:Interesting that Reuters is saying the bid wasn't even open to both OEMs. If that's true, how does that tally with wanting to keep both sides on their toes and honest about pricing?![]()
crimsonchin wrote:Which is laughable as someone who's been reading this forum since around 2006 and can clearly remember what he and some of the other American posters (when flags were still shown next to posts) used to post re: Airbus. If you're going to be a fanboy, be an out and out one and at least spare everyone the insult of acting otherwise.
xwb565 wrote:Bloomberg reporting the same. No rfp was issued.
ShamrockBoi330 wrote:xwb565 wrote:Bloomberg reporting the same. No rfp was issued.
Bloomberg also reporting Airbus not giving up on this and intend to make a bid to win this back.
lightsaber wrote:VV wrote:dcajet wrote:
And one that knows how to get a very meaningful discount from Boeing...
You would be surprised by how expensive 737 MAX are.
In addition the guys in Seattle are quite disciplined managing the backlog thus protecting 737's value in the long run.
For this large an order at this time required a discount. IAG could easily wait until post the airshow and wouldn't have cared. Badic game theory says Boeing had to incentivise to stop the bad press.
I think the MAX is great and I'll fly on one in a heartbeat. I'll have my kids join. I'm also a test engineer who knows how to quantify risk and reduce it.
FWIW, I'm certain within 6 months of EIS Boeing will PIP the marketing to 737Ultimate or anything other than 737MAX. But we have another thread on that.
Lightsaber
nikeherc wrote:If the question of aircraft pricing comes up, Airbus has as much to lose as Boeing.
SelseyBill wrote:nikeherc wrote:If the question of aircraft pricing comes up, Airbus has as much to lose as Boeing.
.....and now the news that Airbus were not even given the opportunity to bid for this order. Wow.
If true; and it seems it is; an awful lot of questions arise, and no wonder shares dropped with the news. I would have thought there were requirements in IAG's management controls that would require multiple competitive bids to be secured before placing such a huge order.
No wonder it is just a letter of intention; I suspect this has a long way to go yet.
I don't honestly kn ow what Airbus can legally do; if anything; or even if they would be interested in bidding below $30M per unit to win the order.
SelseyBill wrote:nikeherc wrote:If the question of aircraft pricing comes up, Airbus has as much to lose as Boeing.
.....and now the news that Airbus were not even given the opportunity to bid for this order. Wow.
If true; and it seems it is; an awful lot of questions arise, and no wonder shares dropped with the news. I would have thought there were requirements in IAG's management controls that would require multiple competitive bids to be secured before placing such a huge order.
No wonder it is just a letter of intention; I suspect this has a long way to go yet.
I don't honestly kn ow what Airbus can legally do; if anything; or even if they would be interested in bidding below $30M per unit to win the order.
WayexTDI wrote:Not sure which shares you're talking about; but Airbus is slightly up right now, so I guess investors are not too worried about losing this potential order...
PixelPilot wrote:SelseyBill wrote:nikeherc wrote:If the question of aircraft pricing comes up, Airbus has as much to lose as Boeing.
.....and now the news that Airbus were not even given the opportunity to bid for this order. Wow.
If true; and it seems it is; an awful lot of questions arise, and no wonder shares dropped with the news. I would have thought there were requirements in IAG's management controls that would require multiple competitive bids to be secured before placing such a huge order.
No wonder it is just a letter of intention; I suspect this has a long way to go yet.
I don't honestly kn ow what Airbus can legally do; if anything; or even if they would be interested in bidding below $30M per unit to win the order.
Nobody placed any order yet.
The art of a good deal
And how do you know the price Boeing sold the planes at? Magic much?
PlymSpotter wrote:As it's turning out there wasn't a competitive process involved in the order, then it is unsurprising that a lot of investors and traders are bearish on IAG.
But that being said, because of this I'm hearing a lot of views that isn't a real order to be taken seriously at this point, and that the competitive process with Airbus hasn't yet begun. If so, interesting positioning by IAG - it puts them in a very strong negotiating position.
nickllhill wrote:Am I being silly in thinking.. These can’t go to BA at Heathrow as they can’t take containers?
PlymSpotter wrote:'Beat these terms or we'll convert the LOI'.