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LAXintl
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United drops GUM-HKG

Thu Jun 27, 2019 10:36 pm

As part of winter schedule update and news of additional SFO-HKG service, UA will drop its 4x weekly GUM-HKG 737 service. Last service Oct 26th.

Per internal news announcement, the Guam based aircraft will be reallocated to further expand on successful secondary Japanese markets.
Last edited by LAXintl on Thu Jun 27, 2019 11:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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CALMSP
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Re: Unied drops GUM-HKG

Thu Jun 27, 2019 10:57 pm

Big dissapointing. Loved this route. I thought recently it was just increased?
 
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UPlog
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Thu Jun 27, 2019 11:14 pm

One almost forgets UA operates almost a separate airline within an airline out in Guam. Reminds me of the old Pan Am Berlin operation.
 
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janders
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 12:26 am

Anyone with a handle on how many 737s are used for the Micronesia operation?
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CONTACREW
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 12:28 am

janders wrote:
Anyone with a handle on how many 737s are used for the Micronesia operation?



8
5 738 3 73G
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indcwby
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 12:30 am

CONTACREW wrote:
janders wrote:
Anyone with a handle on how many 737s are used for the Micronesia operation?



8
5 738 3 73G


I thought I read somewhere that they rotate often enough with mainland 737s. Does anyone know how frequent? I know it has to do with the saltwater environment.

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Max Q
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:18 am

Is this permanent or seasonal ?
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CONTACREW
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:25 am

Max Q wrote:
Is this permanent or seasonal ?


Permanent
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jetskipper
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:48 am

indcwby wrote:
CONTACREW wrote:
janders wrote:
Anyone with a handle on how many 737s are used for the Micronesia operation?



8
5 738 3 73G


I thought I read somewhere that they rotate often enough with mainland 737s. Does anyone know how frequent? I know it has to do with the saltwater environment.

-INDCWBY


No, the UA 737 Micronesia fleet is segregated to the Guam base. While the same aircraft as the US mainland fleet there are a few subtle difference. The GUM based 737s have SATCOM installed. Also the GUM fleet use Japanese as the secondary placard language for things such as emergency exit signs, lavatory signs, etc., the mainland fleet uses Spanish.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 4:00 am

HKG-GUM was the last UA HKG flight not operating to the continental US. A couple of years back they had HKG-SGN/SIN/NRT in addition to EWR/ORD/SFO.
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CALMSP
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 4:43 am

I don't think the GUM based planes have E+ either. Unless that's changed since my GUM-NGO flight.
 
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SQ789
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:28 am

Are they reducing more ops in GUM?
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BestWestern
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 5:33 am

I wonder if KA will take over the route once the acquire HK express.

That will give the route the feed it needs to be successful.
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myki
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 7:06 am

Also wondering if it might be a destination one of the AirAsia or Jetstar brands jump on to.

With HKG out of the picture, there's nothing further west than Manila. Could there be a market for SIN, KUL or SGN, even twice a week for weekend getaways, market both for GUM originating pax and GUM as a destination.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:44 am

myki wrote:
Also wondering if it might be a destination one of the AirAsia or Jetstar brands jump on to.

With HKG out of the picture, there's nothing further west than Manila. Could there be a market for SIN, KUL or SGN, even twice a week for weekend getaways, market both for GUM originating pax and GUM as a destination.

You need widebody for any of the three destinations, and when higher-yielding routes are not necessarily a success with LCC + widebody, this route is most likely doomed from the beginning.

Happy to be proved wrong though, but the market IMO is just not there.

Michael
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:50 am

SQ789 wrote:
Are they reducing more ops in GUM?


Nothing has been officially announced but according to what was posted on Flying Together UA will used that aircraft for other secondary markets in Japan. Ever since things have calmed down in the Pacific region and North Korea is no longer threatening Guam, Japanese tourist have come back in stronger numbers.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 1:22 pm

CALMSP wrote:
I don't think the GUM based planes have E+ either. Unless that's changed since my GUM-NGO flight.


They should all have E+. They have been rotating planes in and out of GUM from the mainland more regularly.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 1:38 pm

BestWestern wrote:
I wonder if KA will take over the route once the acquire HK express.

That will give the route the feed it needs to be successful.

According to my memory, UQ have already dropped the route long ago. After UA dropping the route, there will be no service between Guam and Hong Kong.
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LH658
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 1:45 pm

Sad, anyone knows why? Not enough demand?
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 1:55 pm

UA just increase the frequency to 6weekly in last winter
 
zakuivcustom
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 1:57 pm

c933103 wrote:
BestWestern wrote:
I wonder if KA will take over the route once the acquire HK express.

That will give the route the feed it needs to be successful.

According to my memory, UQ have already dropped the route long ago. After UA dropping the route, there will be no service between Guam and Hong Kong.


UO did indeed dropped GUM. They then planned to fly that route via NGO (i.e. HKG-NGO-GUM), but never started that, either.

LH658 wrote:
Sad, anyone knows why? Not enough demand?


Not enough demand and UA having higher yielding market (Secondary Japan as they specifically mention). Japan-Guam is growing again after years of decline anyway (Although South Korean had since took over being the #1 tourist group to Guam, and probably won't give up that title anytime soon).
 
usssla
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 2:18 pm

LH658 wrote:
Sad, anyone knows why? Not enough demand?


i guess is due to the shortage of slot of HKG.
UA used the slots to launch second daily SFO-HKG
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 2:52 pm

Maybe IAH - HKG or Guam - ICN?
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:05 pm

With the US military build-up in Guam I wonder if UA will give GUM-ICN another shot.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 3:46 pm

LH658 wrote:
Maybe IAH - HKG or Guam - ICN?

Lol - no. They wont be launching IAH-HKG.
 
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jetblastdubai
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:12 pm

usssla wrote:
i guess is due to the shortage of slot of HKG.
UA used the slots to launch second daily SFO-HKG


:checkmark: The 2nd daily SFO-HKG start-up date coincides with the GUM discontinue date so that make sense. At a slot controlled airport, much happier to see a 777 fly in instead of a 737.
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LAXintl
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:23 pm

Actually not related to HKG slots. Timings dont match.
For example GUM-HKG-GUM was planned with a 2300 arrival and 2355 departure for W19. The new SFO is times are 0610 arrival and 2230 departure.
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LAXintl
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 6:37 pm

x1234 wrote:
With the US military build-up in Guam I wonder if UA will give GUM-ICN another shot.


Korea is owned by the plethora of LCCs in the market. UA really does not stand a chance. Even with full planes, it was losing money in the market previously.
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ScottB
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 9:58 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Actually not related to HKG slots. Timings dont match.
For example GUM-HKG-GUM was planned with a 2300 arrival and 2355 departure for W19. The new SFO is times are 0610 arrival and 2230 departure.


Maybe yes, maybe no. It's conceivable they did a slot swap with another carrier.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:12 pm

eamondzhang wrote:
myki wrote:
Also wondering if it might be a destination one of the AirAsia or Jetstar brands jump on to.

With HKG out of the picture, there's nothing further west than Manila. Could there be a market for SIN, KUL or SGN, even twice a week for weekend getaways, market both for GUM originating pax and GUM as a destination.

You need widebody for any of the three destinations, and when higher-yielding routes are not necessarily a success with LCC + widebody, this route is most likely doomed from the beginning.

Happy to be proved wrong though, but the market IMO is just not there.

Michael

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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:17 pm

A 738 can actually make GUM-SIN as there's more traffic to SIN as its actually a US ally (GUM's main traffic is the US military remember). This also allows SIN-GUM-HNL traffic (FT says people were using it as a cheap way to fly HKG-GUM-HNL as that's low yielding.) Don't know if SIN yields are higher than HKG's though.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:33 pm

Also are they ever going to bring back the GUM-CNS route!? Its a hassle right now to get from Guam to Australia as you have to fly north or east to NRT or HNL. They should fly GUM-SYD (a route that's shorter than PTY-SFO which COPA flies with the 738 weight restricted).
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:45 pm

How does United rotate plans to GUM? Do they go US-HNL-GUM?
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 10:55 pm

x1234 wrote:
Also are they ever going to bring back the GUM-CNS route!? Its a hassle right now to get from Guam to Australia as you have to fly north or east to NRT or HNL. They should fly GUM-SYD (a route that's shorter than PTY-SFO which COPA flies with the 738 weight restricted).


Yes both of those are guaranteed money-makers...
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acavpics
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Fri Jun 28, 2019 11:04 pm

A bit off topic, but I find it very odd that UA does not fly from GUM to ANY of its hubs in on the mainland. Not even SFO or LAX.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:10 am

acavpics wrote:
A bit off topic, but I find it very odd that UA does not fly from GUM to ANY of its hubs in on the mainland. Not even SFO or LAX.


There is practically zero demand for it on the account that most Americans don't even know Guam is apart of The US.

I hope that they do not drawback the GUM hub because it is the most interesting flying the US3 have.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 12:40 am

x1234 wrote:
A 738 can actually make GUM-SIN as there's more traffic to SIN as its actually a US ally (GUM's main traffic is the US military remember). This also allows SIN-GUM-HNL traffic (FT says people were using it as a cheap way to fly HKG-GUM-HNL as that's low yielding.) Don't know if SIN yields are higher than HKG's though.


Guam’s main traffic is tourism first, tourism second, and tourism third. Plus any large movement of troops can be done by the military themselves anyway. Also, US military presence in Singapore is tiny.

ScottB wrote:
LAXintl wrote:
Actually not related to HKG slots. Timings dont match.
For example GUM-HKG-GUM was planned with a 2300 arrival and 2355 departure for W19. The new SFO is times are 0610 arrival and 2230 departure.


Maybe yes, maybe no. It's conceivable they did a slot swap with another carrier.


And the myth that you need slot swap at HKG continues. HKG is crowded but definitely not 100% full. Plus late night/early morning slots? Those are plentiful.
 
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jetblastdubai
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:14 am

zakuivcustom wrote:

And the myth that you need slot swap at HKG continues. HKG is crowded but definitely not 100% full. Plus late night/early morning slots? Those are plentiful.


You're probably right on with that comment. According to section 28 of this document, slots may not be traded between different airlines...only between parent companies and subsidiaries of the parent company. There's probably some mechanism to allow for an exception but the restriction is in print for some reason.

https://www.cad.gov.hk/reports/SC%20Gui ... 20HKIA.pdf
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 1:25 am

UA has an allegiant style niche there in Guam. I was there last year and the hotels are all full, as were various flights. HNL-GUM seems to have mixed load factors but I would bet the 777 brings in a lot of cargo. They also get steady military business.
 
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 3:36 am

SierraPacific wrote:
acavpics wrote:
A bit off topic, but I find it very odd that UA does not fly from GUM to ANY of its hubs in on the mainland. Not even SFO or LAX.


There is practically zero demand for it on the account that most Americans don't even know Guam is apart of The US.

I hope that they do not drawback the GUM hub because it is the most interesting flying the US3 have.


Most Americans know that Guam is part of the United States. Congress is even worried about it tipping over.
 
Max Q
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 3:41 am

Inevitably it will tip if you put too many people on one side


We were warned..
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kiowa
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 3:15 pm

Max Q wrote:
Inevitably it will tip if you put too many people on one side


We were warned..


Sadly, we elect these people.
 
ScottB
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 7:06 pm

x1234 wrote:
Also are they ever going to bring back the GUM-CNS route!? Its a hassle right now to get from Guam to Australia as you have to fly north or east to NRT or HNL.


Er, couldn't you go via MNL? PR offers service to GUM, SYD, BNE, and MEL. You could probably even do an interline between UA & QF at MNL.
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:42 pm

ScottB wrote:
x1234 wrote:
Also are they ever going to bring back the GUM-CNS route!? Its a hassle right now to get from Guam to Australia as you have to fly north or east to NRT or HNL.


Er, couldn't you go via MNL? PR offers service to GUM, SYD, BNE, and MEL. You could probably even do an interline between UA & QF at MNL.


PR flys to CNS as well, though I believe it’s only seasonal
 
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LAXintl
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sun Jun 30, 2019 1:39 am

The freed up capacity will be allocated to 3 additional flights to Nagoya giving it 14 weekly.
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N649DL
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sun Jun 30, 2019 7:59 am

I had no idea about the distance, but I was surprised to read that GUM-HKG is under 5 hours on a 738. Where are they putting this plane within Japan? UA seems to be chopping away at the NRT hub as well.

GUM is a niche hub from the CO days. The economics of Guam as a remote island has to come into play at some sort with a routing to Hong Kong for UAL. The "Island Hopper" in itself seems like a mail bag route to me.

It was sad to see CNS whacked during the merger times too. Talk about a unique routing for sure! I've always wondered if UA could sustain a nonstop SFO or LAX to GUM routing?
 
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UPlog
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Sun Jun 30, 2019 5:07 pm

N649DL wrote:
Where are they putting this plane within Japan?


Posted already :point:

LAXintl wrote:
The freed up capacity will be allocated to 3 additional flights to Nagoya giving it 14 weekly.
 
jteruel06
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:29 am

acavpics wrote:
A bit off topic, but I find it very odd that UA does not fly from GUM to ANY of its hubs in on the mainland. Not even SFO or LAX.


UA already serves GUM with the daily GUM-HNL non-stop flights plus the island hopper. There's also the connecting options at KIX or NRT.
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jteruel06
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:29 am

jteruel06 wrote:
acavpics wrote:
A bit off topic, but I find it very odd that UA does not fly from GUM to ANY of its hubs in on the mainland. Not even SFO or LAX.


There's isn't much need for a non-stop GUM to mainland flight. UA already serves GUM with the daily GUM-HNL non-stop flights plus the island hopper. There's also the connecting options at KIX or NRT. UA would be better using the 787 or 777 on the flight on a more lucrative market such as China.
Last edited by jteruel06 on Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
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jteruel06
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Re: United drops GUM-HKG

Mon Jul 01, 2019 2:37 am

N649DL wrote:
I had no idea about the distance, but I was surprised to read that GUM-HKG is under 5 hours on a 738. Where are they putting this plane within Japan? UA seems to be chopping away at the NRT hub as well.


From GUM, UA has flights to NRT, KIX, NGO, and FUK. At its height before the merger (then CO/CS) had flights to OKA, CTS, SDJ, KIJ, and other cities in Japan.

This could be a crazy theory, but it could be related to UA not getting the slot for the GUM-HND flights. The HND flights would have allowed UA to focus more on HND and shift at least one of the 3 daily flights from NRT to HND for easier domestic connections. Since they couldn't get it, this might be part of Plan B.
Jeffrey Teruel
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