Nicknuzzii
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United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 8:27 pm

Next year United plans to expand it's premium 767 service to Switzerland from Newark (EWR). It was not specified whether GVA or ZRH serivce would start first. But it does state the prior to year's end all LHR routes from ORD and EWR will be served by the premium 767s.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/united-ai ... ssion=true
 
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UPlog
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 8:59 pm

Yes posted couple months ago in the UA network thread.
 
jfk777
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 9:08 pm

Why is United investing in these old 767 and not in new 787-9 for these flights. United's 767 plans should include their exit not new Polaris seats for a high J version.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 10:05 pm

jfk777 wrote:
Why is United investing in these old 767 and not in new 787-9 for these flights.


It would seem that the 763s have the right seat count and premium mix for the market. Not every route gets a new plane.
 
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Pellegrine
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 10:08 pm

What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...
oh boy, here we go!!!
 
jfk777
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 10:17 pm

Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


Its a 767 with new Polaris seating plus premium economy and limited economy class seats. Seats about 160 passengers. UA wouldn't make this type of investment unless their plans are to keep these planes around quite a while, 5 years or more.
 
United1
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 10:21 pm

Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


Refers to UAs high J 763 configuration....46 Polaris seats vs the standard 30.

You wouldn’t know they were an old aircraft if you stepped on board on. Completely new interiors with Polaris J class seats, Premium Plus ect.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
jetwet1
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 10:37 pm

[twoid][/twoid]
Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


UA have done a nice job with the upgrades, the Polaris seat is a great upgrade from the previous seat and is almost on par with Delta one. For me the edge still goes to DL if only for the food, but I would have no issues flying long haul on the premium 763.
 
jayunited
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Fri Jul 19, 2019 11:18 pm

jfk777 wrote:
Its a 767 with new Polaris seating plus premium economy and limited economy class seats. Seats about 160 passengers. UA wouldn't make this type of investment unless their plans are to keep these planes around quite a while, 5 years or more.


The premium heavy Polaris 767 are the 1998 builds and later up to an including the the 3 ex-HA birds. The frames from the early 90's have Polaris only ( the exception is the seven birds built in 92 and 93 those birds have the diamond seats and were schedule to be retired. However with the MAX grounding UA might keep them around perhaps restrict them to domestic operations till the MAX situation is resolved.)
However, by the end of February all 763 that are remaining in the fleet till at least 2025 with have been reconfigured with 30 Polaris seatsa nd no P/E seats or 46 Polaris seats and 22P/E seats.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:11 am

UPlog wrote:
Yes posted couple months ago in the UA network thread.


That's not possible since this was just announced yesterday.
 
Weatherwatcher1
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:28 am

WhenUA started cross fleeting after the merger, EWR-GVA/ZRH were the first routes from a legacy Continental hub to get 3-class PMUA 767s with first class. Switzerland has good premium demand.
Last edited by Weatherwatcher1 on Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
jadedchameleon
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:28 am

[*]
Nicknuzzii wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Yes posted couple months ago in the UA network thread.


That's not possible since this was just announced yesterday.


Dude, this has been explained you before. Not everyone has to wait for official press releases.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1411803&p=21015237#p21015237
 
Cointrin330
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:38 am

Nicknuzzii wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Yes posted couple months ago in the UA network thread.


That's not possible since this was just announced yesterday.


It was announced back when the premium heavy 767 was being prepared, that beyond London Heathrow, other TATL markets could see the larger Polaris cabin 763s including Geneva and Zurich. There is a lot of premium demand for GVA and ZRH from NYC, and LX and UA essentially own the market. DL flies JFK-ZRH and likely does well given the corporate contracts it has in the NYC metro area, but LX and UA are in Star and so there is also connectivity through ZRH and to a lesser extent, GVA as a result to points beyond. It is a rich market with year round demand.
Last edited by Cointrin330 on Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
jayunited
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:40 am

Nicknuzzii wrote:
That's not possible since this was just announced yesterday.


The Points Guy may have just gotten a hold of this information yesterday but this is no secret and has been discussed at length in the UA Fleet/Network thread, however since those threads are now combined and there are now over 34 pages I completely understand if you did not know this change was coming.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:42 am

jfk777 wrote:
Why is United investing in these old 767 and not in new 787-9 for these flights. United's 767 plans should include their exit not new Polaris seats for a high J version.


UA has invested heavily in upgrading the 767-300ER fleet, similar to what DL did with theirs a few years back and both airlines have taken steps to extend the life of these birds, unlike AA which performed a patchwork of updates with cost considerations in mind. The 767-300ER is still an ideal aircraft for many routes from the East Coast and specifically the NYC area to Europe and the stage length also allow for decent cargo haul. The 767-300ERs are getting up in age, but many of UA's are mid-1990s builds and quite a few were built and delivered in 2002-2003. They're still getting up in age and cycles, but they've had a lot of work done to extend their lifecycle. The 787-9 isn't ideal for some of these routes, and the 787-10 is too large for some markets as well.
 
TTailedTiger
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:44 am

Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


What does the age of the plane matter? The interior will be completely new and very nice. Not the half ass job AA did to their 767's.
 
VC10er
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:50 am

A newly refurbished 767 is barely distinguishable from a 787 unless you’re an aviation enthusiast. She might be very old, but most aboard her would think she’s factory new.
I rarely fly to Zurich (sometimes) but very much to GVA. I don’t think GVA has seen anything other than a 763 for a couple decades, be it UA or CO. Perhaps Delta flies a different bird.
Once upon a time everything was rather big, a Swissair 747, MD11 then A330. Before that seeing a PanAm 747 was not unusual.
That is a very premium heavy route I would think. I was surprised not to see a Swiss 773 to EWR. Aside from UN and NGO’s etc, there are VERY large corporate HQ’s, in NJ (Kraft/Mondelez) and, Lausanne (about an hour by car, faster by rail) has Philip Morris International (by itself is the size of an airport), and BAT (2 global tobacco giants with very generous travel benefits), pharma and Nestle- Geneva is not a beautiful as Zurich, but it’s not far from some very spectacular places.
I could be very wrong, but isn’t NJ is Pharmaland, and so is Switzerland and Germany? I would assume a TON of business travel. EWR and UA must benefit greatly from that.
I actually love that GVA flight, waking up just as you turn right over the lake!
My only real surprise is how ordinary the Swiss Lounge is upstairs (has it been refurbished in 20 years? I was there only a couple months ago) still a shared lavatories with mauve tile with the other Lounges.
Last: whatever happened to GVA’s famous lit ads with the crushed crystal finishes???
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
RainerBoeing777
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:59 am

This year, the boeing 787-8 cabins will be updated and the IAD-ZRH route will have the new Polaris business class, it would be fantastic if IAD-GVA flies with the high quality Boeing 767-300ER.
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TWA902fly
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:04 am

VC10er wrote:
A newly refurbished 767 is barely distinguishable from a 787 unless you’re an aviation enthusiast. She might be very old, but most aboard her would think she’s factory new.
I rarely fly to Zurich (sometimes) but very much to GVA. I don’t think GVA has seen anything other than a 763 for a couple decades, be it UA or CO. Perhaps Delta flies a different bird.
Once upon a time everything was rather big, a Swissair 747, MD11 then A330. Before that seeing a PanAm 747 was not unusual.
That is a very premium heavy route I would think. I was surprised not to see a Swiss 773 to EWR. Aside from UN and NGO’s etc, there are VERY large corporate HQ’s, in NJ (Kraft/Mondelez) and, Lausanne (about an hour by car, faster by rail) has Philip Morris International (by itself is the size of an airport), and BAT (2 global tobacco giants with very generous travel benefits), pharma and Nestle- Geneva is not a beautiful as Zurich, but it’s not far from some very spectacular places.
I could be very wrong, but isn’t NJ is Pharmaland, and so is Switzerland and Germany? I would assume a TON of business travel. EWR and UA must benefit greatly from that.
I actually love that GVA flight, waking up just as you turn right over the lake!
My only real surprise is how ordinary the Swiss Lounge is upstairs (has it been refurbished in 20 years? I was there only a couple months ago) still a shared lavatories with mauve tile with the other Lounges.
Last: whatever happened to GVA’s famous lit ads with the crushed crystal finishes???


I flew EWR-GVA on a 767-400ER in February 2014. It was great, flight was about 50% full.

‘902
life wasn't worth the balance, or the crumpled paper it was written on
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:10 am

jadedchameleon wrote:
[*]
Nicknuzzii wrote:
UPlog wrote:
Yes posted couple months ago in the UA network thread.


That's not possible since this was just announced yesterday.


Dude, this has been explained you before. Not everyone has to wait for official press releases.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1411803&p=21015237#p21015237


Speculation and an announcement from the airline are two very different things.
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:37 am

Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


The new 167-seat configuration...J46-W22-Y+47-Y52. While older, these have the latest Polaris product and offer high J count for where you don't need as many Y seats. As for this, I suspect that GVA is likely the target, and that United will be targeting United Nations traffic. I could see LX dropping GVA from JFK (currently in a W pattern ZRH-JFK-GVA-JFK-ZRH)...which could allow LH to squeeze TXL into that slot at T4 or T7 at JFK on Eurowings (they had discontinued TXL because an appropriate slot could not be gotten).

The idea here is to operate roughly the same amount of J seats in TATL or TPAC wide-bodies, with variations in the Y count. These B763s actually have 2 more J seats than the brand-new B78X planes. After the B763s are done, I expect the B764s to be next. It is clear that United intends to keep these planes until they have no life left in them.
 
jadedchameleon
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:41 am

Nicknuzzii wrote:
jadedchameleon wrote:
[*]
Nicknuzzii wrote:

That's not possible since this was just announced yesterday.


Dude, this has been explained you before. Not everyone has to wait for official press releases.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1411803&p=21015237#p21015237


Speculation and an announcement from the airline are two very different things.


There are plenty of folks on this forum who work for the airlines and have far better information than speculation. Read the rest of the thread.
 
SteelChair
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:48 am

Love to see investments being made in 767s. Wish they had been re-engined and re-cockpitted by Boeing as a 767NG.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:50 am

jadedchameleon wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
jadedchameleon wrote:
[*]

Dude, this has been explained you before. Not everyone has to wait for official press releases.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1411803&p=21015237#p21015237


Speculation and an announcement from the airline are two very different things.


There are plenty of folks on this forum who work for the airlines and have far better information than speculation. Read the rest of the thread.


Sorry I do not have time through 35 pages. But if you do have time to nitpick my thread, I would also assume you have time to find me where in the UA network thread it confirmed the high-J 767 routes.
 
RJMAZ
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:11 am

jfk777 wrote:
Why is United investing in these old 767 and not in new 787-9 for these flights. United's 767 plans should include their exit not new Polaris seats for a high J version.

Because their huge order of 797's will not start to arrive until 2025. :bouncy:
 
dampfnudel
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 5:11 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
jfk777 wrote:
Why is United investing in these old 767 and not in new 787-9 for these flights. United's 767 plans should include their exit not new Polaris seats for a high J version.


UA has invested heavily in upgrading the 767-300ER fleet, similar to what DL did with theirs a few years back and both airlines have taken steps to extend the life of these birds, unlike AA which performed a patchwork of updates with cost considerations in mind. The 767-300ER is still an ideal aircraft for many routes from the East Coast and specifically the NYC area to Europe and the stage length also allow for decent cargo haul. The 767-300ERs are getting up in age, but many of UA's are mid-1990s builds and quite a few were built and delivered in 2002-2003. They're still getting up in age and cycles, but they've had a lot of work done to extend their lifecycle. The 787-9 isn't ideal for some of these routes, and the 787-10 is too large for some markets as well.

I guess the introduction of the 797 in the next decade would be deeply appreciated at UA and DL for a significant number of their routes.
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xorrygva
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 5:14 am

aemoreira1981 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


I could see LX dropping GVA from JFK (currently in a W pattern ZRH-JFK-GVA-JFK-ZRH)...which could allow LH to squeeze TXL into that slot at T4 or T7 at JFK on Eurowings (they had discontinued TXL because an appropriate slot could not be gotten).


Unlikely since the GVA-JFK is the most profitable flight in the entire LX network. Would not make sense to drop this for a flight from TXL.
 
VC10er
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:34 am

Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


“Premium” 767 refers to those 763s that have been configured to have many more premium seats than the other 763s. More Polaris, Premium Economy and very large E+ section- and the smallest of regular economy seats. The “premium 767” is not MORE premium in its actual product, Eg; Polaris First Plus seat with a sliding door and shower!

As I mentioned as well as others, the frame might be old, but the 763s have been gutted, and not even the old metal ashtray on the lavatory door is there. From the inside it’s as new looking as a 77W: walls, bins, carpets, bulkheads, seats, lavs- everything! The only tell tale sign are the shape and size of the windows. Kind of like being in a 170 year old house that’s been fixed up and entirely renovated and modern inside.The difference being that the house itself looks Victorian, but has a subzero refrigerator and modern furnishings.
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
VC10er
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:36 am

TWA902fly wrote:
VC10er wrote:
A newly refurbished 767 is barely distinguishable from a 787 unless you’re an aviation enthusiast. She might be very old, but most aboard her would think she’s factory new.
I rarely fly to Zurich (sometimes) but very much to GVA. I don’t think GVA has seen anything other than a 763 for a couple decades, be it UA or CO. Perhaps Delta flies a different bird.
Once upon a time everything was rather big, a Swissair 747, MD11 then A330. Before that seeing a PanAm 747 was not unusual.
That is a very premium heavy route I would think. I was surprised not to see a Swiss 773 to EWR. Aside from UN and NGO’s etc, there are VERY large corporate HQ’s, in NJ (Kraft/Mondelez) and, Lausanne (about an hour by car, faster by rail) has Philip Morris International (by itself is the size of an airport), and BAT (2 global tobacco giants with very generous travel benefits), pharma and Nestle- Geneva is not a beautiful as Zurich, but it’s not far from some very spectacular places.
I could be very wrong, but isn’t NJ is Pharmaland, and so is Switzerland and Germany? I would assume a TON of business travel. EWR and UA must benefit greatly from that.
I actually love that GVA flight, waking up just as you turn right over the lake!
My only real surprise is how ordinary the Swiss Lounge is upstairs (has it been refurbished in 20 years? I was there only a couple months ago) still a shared lavatories with mauve tile with the other Lounges.
Last: whatever happened to GVA’s famous lit ads with the crushed crystal finishes???


I flew EWR-GVA on a 767-400ER in February 2014. It was great, flight was about 50% full.

WOW! What an awesome surprise! Was it a last minute substitute or did you know in advance?

‘902
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
skipness1E
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 8:17 am

xorrygva wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


I could see LX dropping GVA from JFK (currently in a W pattern ZRH-JFK-GVA-JFK-ZRH)...which could allow LH to squeeze TXL into that slot at T4 or T7 at JFK on Eurowings (they had discontinued TXL because an appropriate slot could not be gotten).


Unlikely since the GVA-JFK is the most profitable flight in the entire LX network. Would not make sense to drop this for a flight from TXL.

Why would dropping premium heavy GVA for leisure heavy TXL be something you can see? Eye test time?
 
jghealey
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:08 am

VC10er wrote:
A newly refurbished 767 is barely distinguishable from a 787 unless you’re an aviation enthusiast. She might be very old, but most aboard her would think she’s factory new.
I rarely fly to Zurich (sometimes) but very much to GVA. I don’t think GVA has seen anything other than a 763 for a couple decades, be it UA or CO. Perhaps Delta flies a different bird.
Once upon a time everything was rather big, a Swissair 747, MD11 then A330. Before that seeing a PanAm 747 was not unusual.
That is a very premium heavy route I would think. I was surprised not to see a Swiss 773 to EWR. Aside from UN and NGO’s etc, there are VERY large corporate HQ’s, in NJ (Kraft/Mondelez) and, Lausanne (about an hour by car, faster by rail) has Philip Morris International (by itself is the size of an airport), and BAT (2 global tobacco giants with very generous travel benefits), pharma and Nestle- Geneva is not a beautiful as Zurich, but it’s not far from some very spectacular places.
I could be very wrong, but isn’t NJ is Pharmaland, and so is Switzerland and Germany? I would assume a TON of business travel. EWR and UA must benefit greatly from that.
I actually love that GVA flight, waking up just as you turn right over the lake!
My only real surprise is how ordinary the Swiss Lounge is upstairs (has it been refurbished in 20 years? I was there only a couple months ago) still a shared lavatories with mauve tile with the other Lounges.
Last: whatever happened to GVA’s famous lit ads with the crushed crystal finishes???

Yeah the Geneva area is absolutely loaded with headquarters and particularly charities related to the UN as you say. The Swiss business lounge at GVA was closed last December for renovation so I'm guessing that's been refurbished?
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:03 pm

jfk777 wrote:
Why is United investing in these old 767 and not in new 787-9 for these flights. United's 767 plans should include their exit not new Polaris seats for a high J version.


EWR-Switzerland is to too short a route for a 787. UA is putting them on longer routes that better exploit the 787's fuel economy. Switzerland is a high yield market. Having more premium seating can more than offset the higher CASM of the 767. It's similar to BA's strategy of having high J 747-400's.
 
LAXLHR
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:11 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
jadedchameleon wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:

Speculation and an announcement from the airline are two very different things.


There are plenty of folks on this forum who work for the airlines and have far better information than speculation. Read the rest of the thread.


Sorry I do not have time through 35 pages. But if you do have time to nitpick my thread, I would also assume you have time to find me where in the UA network thread it confirmed the high-J 767 routes.


I agree!! Many of us have lives which do not allow for wading through 35 pages JUST to satisfy an ego! It's great that dedicated threads exist, but like the poster said. Give the page number and leave it be.
BA JM EA GK PA VS AA SN HP CO W7 WN NW DL QQ UA AC US LH LX OS JL QF QR PG MH CX U2 EK 9W UK TP VY VN PC LO OK OZ UL SQ LA

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ewt340
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:19 pm

These B767 are really old though, especially the -300ER. Since they are putting the new seats here. Are they gonna really operate these aircraft for 10 more years?

Or the new polaris seats have the same dimension as the one in B787 and B777 so they could just ripped it out and refitted it to other aircraft?
Last edited by ewt340 on Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
runway23
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 12:21 pm

skipness1E wrote:
xorrygva wrote:
aemoreira1981 wrote:

I could see LX dropping GVA from JFK (currently in a W pattern ZRH-JFK-GVA-JFK-ZRH)...which could allow LH to squeeze TXL into that slot at T4 or T7 at JFK on Eurowings (they had discontinued TXL because an appropriate slot could not be gotten).


Unlikely since the GVA-JFK is the most profitable flight in the entire LX network. Would not make sense to drop this for a flight from TXL.

Why would dropping premium heavy GVA for leisure heavy TXL be something you can see? Eye test time?


There's absolutely no reason why LX/LH would ever do that. GVA-JFK is LX's highest yielding long haul route, has run for decades, just because it runs in a W pattern is not a reason to axe it (in fact EWR-GVA and GVA-IAD often swap in GVA too, should UA by the same logic get rid of IAD-GVA?). TXL on the other hand has consistently failed for LH.

Other than that from GVA in 2019, UA has load factors of 85% in J to IAD, 87% to EWR and about 70% in Y to both. The market clearly can't get enough J seats, so flying both routes with more premium seats and less Y makes sense.

It's hardly surprising to see UA follow the likes of EK who launched their new F product on DXB-GVA. GVA is pretty much as premium as it gets.
 
DDR
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 1:45 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Next year United plans to expand it's premium 767 service to Switzerland from Newark (EWR). It was not specified whether GVA or ZRH serivce would start first. But it does state the prior to year's end all LHR routes from ORD and EWR will be served by the premium 767s.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/united-ai ... ssion=true


It's great to see the 767 live on. Thanks for posting this, it's the first I've heard about it.
 
jadedchameleon
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Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:22 pm

LAXLHR wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
jadedchameleon wrote:

There are plenty of folks on this forum who work for the airlines and have far better information than speculation. Read the rest of the thread.


Sorry I do not have time through 35 pages. But if you do have time to nitpick my thread, I would also assume you have time to find me where in the UA network thread it confirmed the high-J 767 routes.


I agree!! Many of us have lives which do not allow for wading through 35 pages JUST to satisfy an ego! It's great that dedicated threads exist, but like the poster said. Give the page number and leave it be.


Look, the issue I was bringing up is just that Nick seems to think it's impossible that folks on here might actually know something before the company announces it. It's been proven time and time again that isn't true if you actually read the threads. If you want to just follow the official company press releases, then knock yourself out but you are missing much of the value of this forum--the people here who are more than just enthusiasts. I don't care if you read the dedicated threads or not. Just don't discredit the valuable contributors here.
Last edited by jadedchameleon on Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
vfw614
Posts: 3773
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 12:34 am

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 2:28 pm

52 Economy seats - that must be 8 rows. Is there a cabin divider? That is one cosy economy cabin.
 
EssentialBusDC
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:06 am

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:14 pm

vfw614 wrote:
52 Economy seats - that must be 8 rows. Is there a cabin divider? That is one cosy economy cabin.

No.

The cabin configuration of the 76L in coach is the pairs of seats along the windows are the Econ+ seats, and the middle three are regular Econ.


https://www.seatguru.com/airlines/Unite ... 00ER_E.php
 
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Pellegrine
Posts: 2268
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:19 am

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 3:24 pm

jfk777 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


Its a 767 with new Polaris seating plus premium economy and limited economy class seats. Seats about 160 passengers. UA wouldn't make this type of investment unless their plans are to keep these planes around quite a while, 5 years or more.


Point noted. I've been flying OW international since the AA/US merger so I wouldn't know. Those were some old 763s UA used to run IAD-ZRH though lol.
oh boy, here we go!!!
 
Cointrin330
Posts: 1113
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 12:23 pm

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sat Jul 20, 2019 7:07 pm

aemoreira1981 wrote:
Pellegrine wrote:
What is exactly a premium 767 of all things? That's one old plane...


The new 167-seat configuration...J46-W22-Y+47-Y52. While older, these have the latest Polaris product and offer high J count for where you don't need as many Y seats. As for this, I suspect that GVA is likely the target, and that United will be targeting United Nations traffic. I could see LX dropping GVA from JFK (currently in a W pattern ZRH-JFK-GVA-JFK-ZRH)...which could allow LH to squeeze TXL into that slot at T4 or T7 at JFK on Eurowings (they had discontinued TXL because an appropriate slot could not be gotten).

The idea here is to operate roughly the same amount of J seats in TATL or TPAC wide-bodies, with variations in the Y count. These B763s actually have 2 more J seats than the brand-new B78X planes. After the B763s are done, I expect the B764s to be next. It is clear that United intends to keep these planes until they have no life left in them.


Yeah no. JFK-GVA is one of LX's most profitable routes for the company, and its predecessor, SR. Absolutely no reason for LX to drop it as the airline carries the bulk of UN and other NGO traffic on this route, and while UA has the EWR-GVA route as well, the bulk of the contracts I suspect are with LX, not UA. UA carries a lot of premium traffic up front. The coach cabin varies wildly. On some days, it is packed. Other days, it is less than 50%. These load factors don't mean much but GVA sits in one of Europe's wealthiest corners and has a catchment area for western Switzerland and a good part of Southeastern France. The W pattern is really not a big deal since LX is all A330s from JFK anyway.
 
VC10er
Posts: 4031
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:25 am

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 5:45 am

vfw614 wrote:
52 Economy seats - that must be 8 rows. Is there a cabin divider? That is one cosy economy cabin.


I usually go by 1, 2 or 3 Xanax cabins. Regular or basic economy - especially on the high J, those regular economy seats in the middle are definitely 3 Xanax. The FA’s will wake you upon arrival! Joking aside, 1 Xanax and my friend slept from LHR to GIG on Norwegian and had to be woken to put his seat up for landing!
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
bgm
Posts: 2076
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 9:37 am

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 8:30 am

United1 wrote:
You wouldn’t know they were an old aircraft if you stepped on board on.


You certainly would once you take off. The cabin & engine noise are much louder than the 787. Not to mention the 1980s era lavs (unless UA replaced those with new ones?)
████ ███ █ ███████ ██ █ █████ ██ ████ [redacted]
 
VC10er
Posts: 4031
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2007 6:25 am

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 9:16 am

bgm wrote:
United1 wrote:
You wouldn’t know they were an old aircraft if you stepped on board on.


You certainly would once you take off. The cabin & engine noise are much louder than the 787. Not to mention the 1980s era lavs (unless UA replaced those with new ones?)


I’ve been on 2 refurbished 763s. I’m 99% sure the lavs are new. No, it’s not a 787 so yes the engines are louder at take off, buzz saw sound, smaller more square windows, but nothing else would lead an average flier (even in Polaris) that is was anything other than a brand spanking NEW aircraft.
It’s only downside is that the 1-1-1 in Polaris has no seats for couples. But if you’re spouse or friend are sitting in front of you or behind you, it’s not a huge deal. I flew it with a friend across the Atlantic on vacation, after landing he said “that was probably the best flight he could ever remember” He doesn’t fly tons, maybe international business class once or twice a year for vacation (he’s a trust fund baby so paying $6k or $7k for a flight is nothing to him) - when I told him how old the 767 was he was seriously shocked! He lives in Miami, but avoids AA and will always fly an international airline instead.
To Most the Sky is The Limit, For me, the Sky is Home.
 
SpaceshipDC10
Posts: 6352
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:44 am

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 10:23 am

VC10er wrote:
I don’t think GVA has seen anything other than a 763 for a couple decades, be it UA or CO.


I've seen, be it on site or with pictures, 767-200s/400s of CO as well as 757-200s and, UA has sent 767-300s along with some 777s.
 
rjmf22
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 10:37 pm

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 11:06 am

SpaceshipDC10 wrote:
VC10er wrote:
I don’t think GVA has seen anything other than a 763 for a couple decades, be it UA or CO.


I've seen, be it on site or with pictures, 767-200s/400s of CO as well as 757-200s and, UA has sent 767-300s along with some 777s.


I believe it's all 767-300's today, from both IAD and EWR. But these 767's are incredibly nice and as stated above, you really wouldn't be able to tell the planes age when you boarded.
United Airlines
 
ualcsr
Posts: 376
Joined: Sat May 27, 2006 12:53 pm

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 11:28 am

Here's an older post from the Points Guy with pictures of the premium 767. Polaris cabin looks huge and I'm impressed with the 2-2-2 layout in premium economy/Premium Plus.

https://thepointsguy.com/news/united-hi ... irst-look/
 
musman9853
Posts: 735
Joined: Mon May 14, 2018 12:30 pm

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 11:58 am

VC10er wrote:
bgm wrote:
United1 wrote:
You wouldn’t know they were an old aircraft if you stepped on board on.


You certainly would once you take off. The cabin & engine noise are much louder than the 787. Not to mention the 1980s era lavs (unless UA replaced those with new ones?)


I’ve been on 2 refurbished 763s. I’m 99% sure the lavs are new. No, it’s not a 787 so yes the engines are louder at take off, buzz saw sound, smaller more square windows, but nothing else would lead an average flier (even in Polaris) that is was anything other than a brand spanking NEW aircraft.
It’s only downside is that the 1-1-1 in Polaris has no seats for couples. But if you’re spouse or friend are sitting in front of you or behind you, it’s not a huge deal. I flew it with a friend across the Atlantic on vacation, after landing he said “that was probably the best flight he could ever remember” He doesn’t fly tons, maybe international business class once or twice a year for vacation (he’s a trust fund baby so paying $6k or $7k for a flight is nothing to him) - when I told him how old the 767 was he was seriously shocked! He lives in Miami, but avoids AA and will always fly an international airline instead.


Considering AA's product is better than most international carriers, he's missing out.
Welcome to the City Beautiful.
 
United1
Posts: 3829
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 9:21 am

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 3:45 pm

bgm wrote:
United1 wrote:
You wouldn’t know they were an old aircraft if you stepped on board on.


You certainly would once you take off. The cabin & engine noise are much louder than the 787. Not to mention the 1980s era lavs (unless UA replaced those with new ones?)


They are louder than the 78s not sure if that is really all that noticeable to the average passenger (average means not an a.net member.) :)

UA really gutted the interior of these aircraft:
Boeing Signature Interior bins
Refurbished the lavs (mechanical bits are the same but everything else is new)
nose to tail plug power and USB
same AVOD system and streaming video system as the 777/787
same WiFi system as the 777/787
upgraded avionics on the flight deck

These aircraft should be good to go through 2025.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
UA777FO
Posts: 20
Joined: Sat May 06, 2017 2:35 pm

Re: United to expand premium 767s to Switzerland

Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:09 pm

Sorry no upgraded avionics on the flight deck, still old out dated CRT’s. Something will have to done with that if they want to keep them as long as 2025

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