Italianflyer
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Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2007 3:06 pm

Re: Tower Air

Sat Aug 03, 2019 9:01 pm

Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


I think the distinction 25 years ago was that the legacies tried to put on a modicum of 'service'. PE & Tower were the vanguards of the 'you get what you pay for' mentality. And with Tower, this wasn't trivial stuff like bad food or rude ground/cabin staff; this was canceling downline flights overseas for DAYS with little/no information for pax AND crews.

I have flown with Tower alum and they loved it. The incompetence at the top built comradrey at the bottom. They say people truly "had your back".
 
BravoOne
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Re: Tower Air

Sat Aug 03, 2019 9:05 pm

Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


How may time sdid you ride on Tower?
 
OB1504
Posts: 3680
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Re: Tower Air

Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:22 pm

OP, here are some past threads with more information about Tower Air:

viewtopic.php?t=601949
viewtopic.php?t=218877
viewtopic.php?t=38645

And a video showing their “terminal” at JFK: https://youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu ... 6Jtiwdj97Y

Tower Air also had their aircraft prominently featured in the movies Liar Liar and Turbulence.



seabosdca wrote:
It's one of the world's small miracles that Tower Air never had a crash, given the state of their 747s. We don't have any passenger operators in the US today with such poor maintenance practices.


They did have a 747 go off the runway at JFK:



A fuel truck caught fire while fueling one of their 747s at MIA, taking out part of the wing with it, but that wasn’t really Tower’s fault. The aircraft was repaired and returned to service.



MR27122 wrote:
[to those actually responding to the TOPIC AUTHOR, did Tower ever operate scheduled flights between 2 points that didn't "touch" JFK?.


They flew MIA-SJU briefly, and possibly MIA-LAX.
 
CoThG
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Re: Tower Air

Sat Aug 03, 2019 10:35 pm

Morris Nachtomi....."I demand respect!"
 
FlyHossD
Posts: 1935
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Re: Tower Air

Sat Aug 03, 2019 11:32 pm

Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


While I didn't fly on Tower Air, I had a few relatives who did. The fares were cheap indeed, but the service wasn't necessarily even the same day (my mother has a great story about trying to get home from the Super Bowl - she arrived a day late, IIRC).

Is service today on the AA, DL, WN or UA any better. I'd say yes as the flights are normally flown the same day. The big 4 have what Tower didn't - the resources to recover relatively quickly when an airplane was down for maintenance service That is, when your fleet is small to start with and every plane is scheduled to fly, how do you recover when an aircraft is out-of-service especially when the fleet is spread around the globe?

I do remember flying with one pilot who had been a 747 captain at Tower. He enjoyed the company a bunch, but left for a more secure future once he and his wife started having children. He seemed to enjoy the unusual destinations that were common for the charters operations and the responsibility and trust that Tower placed in the crew.
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
ausworld
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Re: Tower Air

Sun Aug 04, 2019 12:42 am

Qantas leased Tower Air B747-131 N93117 for schedule service as follows

Leased to Qantas Airway in full Tower Air colours with decal “On lease to Qantas, December 12, 1987
Operated by Tower Air technical crews and Qantas cabin crews

First Qantas service QF18 Los Angeles-Honolulu-Nadi-Melbourne, December 12, 1987

Operated Melbourne-Fiji-USA services only.

Last Qantas service QF17 Melbourne-Nadi-Honolulu-Los Angeles, February 20, 1988

Returned to Tower Air at Los Angeles, February 20, 1988
Returned to GATX Leasing Corporation (USA), February, 1988
 
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spinkid
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Re: Tower Air

Sun Aug 04, 2019 1:15 am

Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


you're kidding right?

You must be young or something. Read the articles shared in the links earlier. I can remember seeing Tower in the news all the time with this type of stuff. For an airline that never served more than a few cities to have this much "history and legend" behind it, it truly was one of a kind, and that is why so many are bashing them.

every airline has an article like that about them, but Tower was just purely infamous in those years just before the dawn of twitter and hi speed internet.
 
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qfs
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Re: Tower Air

Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:02 am

spinkid wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


you're kidding right?

You must be young or something. Read the articles shared in the links earlier. I can remember seeing Tower in the news all the time with this type of stuff. For an airline that never served more than a few cities to have this much "history and legend" behind it, it truly was one of a kind, and that is why so many are bashing them.

every airline has an article like that about them, but Tower was just purely infamous in those years just before the dawn of twitter and hi speed internet.


I remember my mom flew Tower Air once from LA to New York. She had purchased a round-trip ticket but her flight out was so awful she ate the price of the ticket and flew United back. Apparently the flight attendant was bragging about his knife collection and wanted to show her when she left the airport.
 
Ziyulu
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Re: Tower Air

Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:16 am

qfs wrote:
spinkid wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


you're kidding right?

You must be young or something. Read the articles shared in the links earlier. I can remember seeing Tower in the news all the time with this type of stuff. For an airline that never served more than a few cities to have this much "history and legend" behind it, it truly was one of a kind, and that is why so many are bashing them.

every airline has an article like that about them, but Tower was just purely infamous in those years just before the dawn of twitter and hi speed internet.


I remember my mom flew Tower Air once from LA to New York. She had purchased a round-trip ticket but her flight out was so awful she ate the price of the ticket and flew United back. Apparently the flight attendant was bragging about his knife collection and wanted to show her when she left the airport.


Did Tower Air charge her the extra cost of the "hidden ticket"? Haha.
 
Kno
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Re: Tower Air

Sun Aug 04, 2019 3:48 am

Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


DL certainly does
 
Ufsatp
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Re: Tower Air

Sun Aug 04, 2019 8:16 pm

Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


For the most part, yes they do.
 
Lrockeagle
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Re: Tower Air

Sun Aug 04, 2019 11:59 pm

Stephen Keshner flew for FF. Wrote ‘Cockpit: Confessions of an airline pilot’, collection of short stories with a few about FF in there. Pretty cool book
Lrockeagle
14 years ago

I got $20 says AA takes their 787's with GE powerplants. Just a hunch. Any takers?
 
strfyr51
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:04 am

LVISA wrote:
They also had DC-8's, (-62's if memory serves). I flew with them a couple of times from NYC to Miami in the late 70's and they were great! Cheaper than Eastern and every passenger was offered a bubbly drink, (mimosa or champagne I believe), before departure. My son and daughter flew with them years later in the 747's and service at the airport and on board had badly deteriorated by then. Too bad, loved seeing the planes in JFK and MIA.

United bought the Ex- Tower Air 747-123's and turned them into pretty good airplanes after completely overhauling and refurbishing them. They flew the Pacific until they were replaced by 747-422's
 
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millionsofmiles
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 1:29 am

strfyr51 wrote:
LVISA wrote:
They also had DC-8's, (-62's if memory serves). I flew with them a couple of times from NYC to Miami in the late 70's and they were great! Cheaper than Eastern and every passenger was offered a bubbly drink, (mimosa or champagne I believe), before departure. My son and daughter flew with them years later in the 747's and service at the airport and on board had badly deteriorated by then. Too bad, loved seeing the planes in JFK and MIA.

United bought the Ex- Tower Air 747-123's and turned them into pretty good airplanes after completely overhauling and refurbishing them. They flew the Pacific until they were replaced by 747-422's


United operated five 747-123s...originally delivered to AA and retired in the early 80s. After AA, the five each flew for a succession of carriers, but none flew for Tower. I remember when the five were sitting out at the AA Superbay hangar in SFO in 1987 being prepped for delivery even though they had been out of AA’s fleet for a few years,
 
Ionosphere
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:17 am

I flew with a former Tower Air FA. He said they had to leave CAI once in the middle of the night. Tower was behind on their bills and the plane was going to repossessed. They pushed up pick up like 6hrs and left at like 2am.

A Tower Air 747 went off the runway taking off on JFK-MIA on December 20, 1995. There was a family connecting to an American flight to CLO in MIA. The family obviously missed their CLO connection. That plane was American 965 which hit a Mt descending into CLO killing all but 4 people onboard.

As of 2015 all the Tower Air signage was still on their terminal at JFK. DL used the parking lot for employee parking for awhile.
 
Ionosphere
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:21 am

CoThG wrote:
Morris Nachtomi....."I demand respect!"


Wasn't it "I demand Loyalty"? There was a website back in the day run by Tower Employees called that.
 
727LOVER
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:06 am

seabosdca wrote:
It's one of the world's small miracles that Tower Air never had a crash, given the state of their 747s. We don't have any passenger operators in the US today with such poor maintenance practices.

They did have a 747 go off the runway at JFK:






IIRC, this accident saved 2 women's lives. They were supposed to fly AA down to MIA and then connect onward This accident @ JFK sent the airport into mild chaos, causing delays. Their flight to MIA was several hours late and they missed their connecting flight. That connecting flight was AA965 to Cali.
"We must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope." - Martin Luther King, Jr.
 
agentskelly
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:00 am

One of my friends who is a USAF Vet took a few flights with them as a MAC charter during Desert Storm. He described those flights as great that when he had some vacation time, he flew JFK-LAX on them; he regretted it and on the return, flew TWA instead.
 
na
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 9:30 am

I remember one of thier Jumbos parked at a remote stand at FRA for some weeks (or even months?) after they shut down in 2000. I think it was N620FF.
Never flown them, but I flew once with a US charter operator which cant have been better -ATA. An adventurous route: Papeete-Honolulu-Las Vegas-Bangor-Frankfurt. A run-down former Delta Tristar with a loose, vibrating ceiling section, yellow and smelly from nicotine inside. There was a fight beteen a reckless chain-smoking mom which had forced her children to sit beside her and some nonsmokers sitting directly behind. I was one or two rows further back to witness it. The smoking section ended in the middle of a compartment, no devider prevented the nonsmokers from being "gassed". Before takeoff, the FAs couldnt close a door for more than one hour and had to call two servicemen to repair it.
 
Max Q
Topic Author
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 9:33 am

na wrote:
I remember one of thier Jumbos parked at a remote stand at FRA for some weeks (or even months?) after they shut down in 2000. I think it was N620FF.
Never flown them, but I flew once with a US charter operator which cant have been better -ATA. An adventurous route: Papeete-Honolulu-Las Vegas-Bangor-Frankfurt. A run-down former Delta Tristar with a loose, vibrating ceiling section, yellow and smelly from nicotine inside. There was a fight beteen a reckless chain-smoking mom which had forced her children to sit beside her and some nonsmokers sitting directly behind. I was one or two rows further back to witness it. The smoking section ended in the middle of a compartment, no devider prevented the nonsmokers from being "gassed". Before takeoff, the FAs couldnt close a door for more than one hour and had to call two servicemen to repair it.



Priceless, love this stuff..
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


Guns and the love of them by a loud minority are a malignant and deadly cancer inflicted on American society
 
cha747
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 11:51 am

They also served India for a period of time. Their prices always undercut the other carriers at the time. I never flew them but there were plenty of friends and family who did and (obviously) lived to tell about it. Old tattered planes. Delays. Vegetarian food mix-ups with frail uncles and aunties "starving" for hours because the only food they could eat was bread. One of the managers of Epinions.com Jonathan Kibera wrote a rather amusing and unfortunately true review of one of his flights to India on Tower Air but sadly, that almost 20 year old review got lost in the shuffle after Epinions shuttered. I always enjoyed spotting their 747's driving down the Belt Parkway past JFK.
You land a million planes safely, then you have one little mid-air and you never hear the end of it - Pushing Tin
 
Ionosphere
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:04 pm

Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


The 1997 Zagat Survey ranked Tower Air 59th out of 61 ranked carriers in terms of maintenance, ahead of only Valujet and Aeroflot
 
Fixinthe757
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:25 pm

We had one here at BFM for years in the later 90s, minus one engine. Was a freighter. We eventually installed the engine, made sure they all still started up, then they came and got it and flew it away. Kinda spooky after all those years of sitting here
 
richierich
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 2:21 pm

na wrote:
I remember one of thier Jumbos parked at a remote stand at FRA for some weeks (or even months?) after they shut down in 2000. I think it was N620FF.
Never flown them, but I flew once with a US charter operator which cant have been better -ATA. An adventurous route: Papeete-Honolulu-Las Vegas-Bangor-Frankfurt. A run-down former Delta Tristar with a loose, vibrating ceiling section, yellow and smelly from nicotine inside. There was a fight beteen a reckless chain-smoking mom which had forced her children to sit beside her and some nonsmokers sitting directly behind. I was one or two rows further back to witness it. The smoking section ended in the middle of a compartment, no devider prevented the nonsmokers from being "gassed". Before takeoff, the FAs couldnt close a door for more than one hour and had to call two servicemen to repair it.



Funny, in 1987 my parents booked a trip for the three of us that included flying into Rome and flying home from the UK, as we needed to be there for a wedding. All of our intra-European travel was done by road, rail and ferry, including a wonderful trip through the Italian and Swiss Alps by train that went through the Simplon Tunnel, and a fast trip from Geneva to Paris by the then-new TGV. Anyway, this trip down Memory Lane is only relevant because the outbound flight JFK-Rome was on Tower, and the return flight LGW-JFK was on ATA, so it provided a great comparison between these two bare bones, generically-named carriers.

Needless to say, although I was young, I was old enough to be annoyed and concerned that my father hadn't chosen to have us fly on 'real' carriers, which in the day would have included TW, PA, BA or AZ. We had done a couple of flights on PeopleExpress two years earlier, and I thought that was quite low-brou but I had never even heard of Tower and ATA before this trip! Thinking back, as these would prove to be my only flights on FF and ATA, I guess I was 'lucky' I had this opportunity and experience! And I'm sure the cost of flying on the legacy airlines mentioned would have been exorbitant for an itinerary like this, so it makes sense now. All tickets were booked through a travel agent.

Keeping in mind my age, here are my thoughts on FF: it was apparent even to my eyes that everything - I mean everything - about this airline screamed cheap! From the terminal at JFK (no hiding it had been hastily converted from a hangar,) to the old aircraft, Tower did not exude any class or feeling of safety or security. The plane looked old, felt old, and their original livery didn't even look like they had finished painting it. Upon takeoff, my only recollection of the flight itself, the overhead bins and ceiling panels shook and swayed far more than any aircraft I have seen before or since, and the overhead reading lights flashed on and off randomly throughout the cabin. I'm sure it wasn't a huge safety concern but it definitely did not instill a feeling of security about FF's maintenance. Keep in mind, flying in the 1980s was not as safe as flying today; it amazes me that FF never had a serious issue or crash in all their years of operations. As for on-board service, I don't remember the food (or even if we had any?) but the rest of the flight must have been largely uneventful. Upon landing in Rome, we didn't land in the main Fiumicino airport, of course, this was at CIA Ciampino Airport on the outskirts of the city. As with the NY experience, it felt very much like a 'fly by night' organization and that's about the best pun I can come up with to describe FF. I did later find out that the plane I flew on was once Braniff's Big Orange B747, obviously bought cheap after they went out of business, so that was kind of cool!

My thoughts on ATA: Of course LGW is not LHR but it has flights all over the world, so it doesn't have that second-best option feel to it unless you are used to LHR and only LHR. ATA had a much more significant operation at LGW than FF did at CIA (for starters, they used a jetbridge!) The L-1011 looked to be in good condition and the cabin was probably basic but it was a much more cheerful place than Tower's run-down B747. Indeed it seemed like ATA and their crew actually cared about their customers, and I do recall them being very friendly. Keeping in mind that personal IFE was about a decade away for almost all carriers, but there was a movie shown and the food was decent enough for the 7.5 hour flight to New York. I have always loved the Lockheed TriStar and it was one of only a handful of flights I ever managed on this type, but I always enjoyed this aircraft. I had no issues with ATA and would have happily flown them again, unlike Tower, although I did hear their service did go downhill in the later years before they went out of business.

So in summary, from my 1987 eyes, FF was pretty poor, if not scary, and ATA was a decent, low budget option. Expectations have certainly changed in the 32 years since these flights! Even a basic, budget airline across the pond is likely to have personal IFE options now, but food/drinks and any extras are likely to cost more, which is what PeoplExpress, Tower and ATA were all about. I guess they were ahead of the trend but is that an excuse to let FF off easy? I think TowerAir were like Ryanair but with old, decrepit planes and facilities, not a very inspiring or comforting place to spend time. From all that I hear, their crew did the best they could with the limited resources they were given, which wasn't very much.
None shall pass!!!!
 
LVISA
Posts: 31
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:22 pm

Viper911 wrote:
LVISA wrote:
They also had DC-8's, (-62's if memory serves). I flew with them a couple of times from NYC to Miami in the late 70's and they were great! Cheaper than Eastern and every passenger was offered a bubbly drink, (mimosa or champagne I believe), before departure. My son and daughter flew with them years later in the 747's and service at the airport and on board had badly deteriorated by then. Too bad, loved seeing the planes in JFK and MIA.


IIRC they never operated DC-8s, only 747's and they were established in 1983, maybe you're mixing it with some other airline.

Viper911


You are right, I was mistaken with the DC-8's, (sorry, senior moment...). My flights were in Arrow Air, not Tower Air.
 
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readytotaxi
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:42 pm

FCOTSTW wrote:
Tower Air had a strong relationship with the Department of Defense, as it shuttled military personnel to and from Europe first and to and from Middle East later, during the first Gulf war. As of passenger services, I remember having charter flights to CIA (Rome' s secondary airport), all economy.

Yes they did.

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you don't get a second chance to make a first impression!
Growing older, but not up.
 
wjcandee
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Re: Tower Air

Mon Aug 05, 2019 6:13 pm

Let's not diverge onto ATA, but I was a big fan. Flew them all the time to Chicago. I actually was sad when they tried to business-ify, and dumped the palm trees from their branding and their great slogan, "On ATA, you're on vacation." There was nothing like getting on them after a business trip and settling in with their signature cocktail -- I'm On Vacation!!! Even though I'm not. It was great. And the legroom was very-decent, way better than even Delta is today. On one of my favorite trips, a 727 captain recognized my name when I was checking in, from a now-defunct internet board, and invited me on early and to sit in the cockpit and chat before they had stuff to do. Nice, very-competent folks.
 
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millionsofmiles
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Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 06, 2019 3:30 am

I have several friends who are former Tower and the stories they tell could fill a book. Tower was one airline where the crews were just as interesting as the passengers.

I remember one online trip report on some early website where a passenger was sitting next to the galley. The curtains in the galley were closed and he suddenly heard, “You bitch!” and saw two flight attendants come through the galley curtain slapping the snot out of each other, until one fled down the aisle red-faced and crying.

Then they began the “service.”
 
santi319
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Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:18 am

millionsofmiles wrote:
I have several friends who are former Tower and the stories they tell could fill a book. Tower was one airline where the crews were just as interesting as the passengers.

I remember one online trip report on some early website where a passenger was sitting next to the galley. The curtains in the galley were closed and he suddenly heard, “You bitch!” and saw two flight attendants come through the galley curtain slapping the snot out of each other, until one fled down the aisle red-faced and crying.

Then they began the “service.”

And then they went to DL:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/01/31/delta-flight-grounded-after-crew-members-get-into-fight-with-flying-fists/
 
69bug
Posts: 131
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Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 06, 2019 7:36 am

Check out this site by an ex Tower pilot.. a lot of stories ..

https://terryliittschwager.com/index.php

bug
 
CoThG
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Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 06, 2019 5:10 pm

Ionosphere wrote:
CoThG wrote:
Morris Nachtomi....."I demand respect!"


Wasn't it "I demand Loyalty"? There was a website back in the day run by Tower Employees called that.


The forum was called "I demand respect". It was a Tower employee forum in which they laid out all the Tower dirty laundry. The name of the forum "I demand respect" was attributed to Nachtomi as he allegedly said the same to a group of employees. Nachtomi failed to realize the respect is earned and not something one demands.
 
Worldair1
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:57 pm

Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 06, 2019 5:54 pm

I was a charter sales rep back in the 90's and Tower had a bad reputation within the industry. It was well deserved. Call it bashing if you want, but I don't think anyone is questioning the crews or employee's work ethic, more like questioning how cheaply it was run by their owner. They constantly cut all manners of corners to save $$$.
 
TUGMASTER
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Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:17 pm

69bug wrote:
Check out this site by an ex Tower pilot.. a lot of stories ..

https://terryliittschwager.com/index.php

bug



Great site.... recommend to all.
 
Max Q
Topic Author
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Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 06, 2019 11:46 pm

TUGMASTER wrote:
69bug wrote:
Check out this site by an ex Tower pilot.. a lot of stories ..

https://terryliittschwager.com/index.php

bug



Great site.... recommend to all.



Absolutely fascinating I agree
The best contribution to safety is a competent Pilot.


Guns and the love of them by a loud minority are a malignant and deadly cancer inflicted on American society
 
GZM1
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Re: Tower Air

Wed Aug 07, 2019 4:20 pm

Bealine251 wrote:
I flew on a Tower Air 747 from Gatwick to Barbados in the late 1980s. It was a package holiday so charter flight. Seem to recall the aircraft was N601FF. My 3 memories of the flight out was firstly on take off looking out of the window and watching the two engines on the starboard wing swinging around as we climbed out of Gatwick...

What you saw is natural and according to design. The engines have to swing freely in the same way a wing bends, so as to relieve stress and loads. An engine is hung by three screws, or pylons. Each pylon is shaped like a cone that ends in a screw. The screw holds the cone in place inside a casing and they become one body. That is what is holding the engine in place. The system absorbs vibrations and also radial/axial loads and the full weight of the engine as well.
It’s all Greek to me! Aeroplane Basic Category Cycle Dynamic Economics Ecstasy Fantasy Galaxy Geometry Harmony History Horizon Idea Logic Magnetism Music Mystery Nautical Orchestra Organism Phenomenon Political Problem Symphony Technology Telephone Zone
 
panam92
Posts: 53
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Re: Tower Air

Thu Aug 08, 2019 6:47 pm

I flew Tower Air from JFK-LAS round trip. There terminal was cramped inside but was easy to get to.
The flight going to Las Vegas was great, The back of the plane was empty and the Flight attendants were friendly.
The flight going home was very full, I remember not sitting with all my friends, but we left and arrived on time.
The 747 was an old Pan Am.
 
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United_fan
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Re: Tower Air

Thu Aug 08, 2019 7:05 pm

Didn't they have issues with fuel on the Athens flights ? I remember reading the old 747's sometimes had trouble with range on those flights.
"Suspicion is a matter of opinion"
 
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millionsofmiles
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Re: Tower Air

Thu Aug 08, 2019 8:29 pm

United_fan wrote:
Didn't they have issues with fuel on the Athens flights ? I remember reading the old 747's sometimes had trouble with range on those flights.


So did TWA flying the westbound nonstop. The old -100s often made fuel stops on their way to JFK. They also used almost the entire runway taking off from the old Hellinikon Airport.
 
jmc757
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Re: Tower Air

Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:16 pm

CoThG wrote:
Ionosphere wrote:
CoThG wrote:
Morris Nachtomi....."I demand respect!"


Wasn't it "I demand Loyalty"? There was a website back in the day run by Tower Employees called that.


The forum was called "I demand respect". It was a Tower employee forum in which they laid out all the Tower dirty laundry. The name of the forum "I demand respect" was attributed to Nachtomi as he allegedly said the same to a group of employees. Nachtomi failed to realize the respect is earned and not something one demands.


“I demand loyalty” was the name of the website. You can still view it courtesy of The Internet Archive http://web.archive.org/web/199910120450 ... yalty.com/
 
N649DL
Posts: 582
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:21 pm

Re: Tower Air

Thu Aug 08, 2019 10:29 pm

Lrockeagle wrote:
Stephen Keshner flew for FF. Wrote ‘Cockpit: Confessions of an airline pilot’, collection of short stories with a few about FF in there. Pretty cool book


Holy Cow, I just got this on Amazon Kindle for free. Thanks for this, it looks like the action starts on page 113.
 
strfyr51
Posts: 3937
Joined: Tue Apr 10, 2012 5:04 pm

LY

Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:36 am

wjcandee wrote:
A pilot I know claims that when he flew for Tower it wasn't so much that he ever felt imperiled by the maintenance, but rather inconvenienced.

Like the time he had to hand-fly one of their 747s across the Pond.

To me, that's a symptom of a bigger problem.

the autopilot id \s on the minimum Equipment List and can be deferred. Though it was RARELY ever deferred in my 35 years at United.
 
N408BN
Posts: 6
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2016 1:30 pm

Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:11 pm

I only recall that Tower Air destroyed N601BN (Fat Albert) at JFK.
We liked flying Braniff Style
 
BravoOne
Posts: 3595
Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:27 pm

Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:47 pm

Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


Obviously either your reading comprehension is very poor or you're just tossing out flame bait.
 
canyonblue17
Posts: 631
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:22 am

Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 13, 2019 9:16 pm

Got my brother a last minute ticket over Christmas holiday on Tower Air (mostly because it was only flight left with seats) between JFK and MIA - and yes he flew a 747 on that route. He said it was mass hysteria both ways checking in and boarding.
negative ghostrider the pattern is full
 
Ziyulu
Posts: 635
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:35 am

Re: Tower Air

Tue Aug 13, 2019 10:52 pm

BravoOne wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


Obviously either your reading comprehension is very poor or you're just tossing out flame bait.


Let's see what Tower Air did:
- No charge for checked bags
- No seat selection charges
- Meals included in economy class
 
User avatar
drerx7
Posts: 4380
Joined: Fri Jun 30, 2000 12:19 am

Re: Tower Air

Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:24 am

Ziyulu wrote:
BravoOne wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:
I can't believe how so many are bashing Tower for poor service. Do AA, UA, and DL offer good service today?


Obviously either your reading comprehension is very poor or you're just tossing out flame bait.


Let's see what Tower Air did:
- No charge for checked bags
- No seat selection charges
- Meals included in economy class

Well...no one really did those things during Tower Air times. Had they survived...I'd bet plenty money they would be doing the same.
HOUSTON, TEXAS
 
volks92
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Apr 23, 2019 1:53 am

Re: Tower Air

Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:27 am

bsbisland wrote:
wmblanco wrote:
They served GRU for a time.


In the 90s there were lots of charter flights from Brazil to Florida and that was quite common to see their 747s at GRU and other Brazilian airports for those charters, but I don't remember them serving GRU regurlarly.

Tower Air had scheduled service to MIA from GRU between 1995-1997 and also nonstop to JFK from GRU in late 1995/early 1996. Flights to GRU continued on to GIG until 1996. There are some old schedules in the Panrotas archive (in Portuguese): https://issuu.com/panrotas/

Their charters were very popular with tour operators in Brazil, usually heading to MCO or MIA. It was by far the cheapest ticket to Florida.

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