ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:00 pm

Why is Israel the only country in the Middle East that any US airline currently flys to. I also heard that American Airlines is about to start flights to Morocco.
 
User avatar
FlyRow
Posts: 669
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2016 10:05 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:06 pm

Ever heard of politics? America is not very popular in large parts of the middle east

The distance is long, so market has to be worth it.

Morocco is not middle east.
F70-F100-RJ85-RJ70-E190-319-320-321-733-734-735-737-738-752-753-763-764-772-744-380
 
Ishrion
Posts: 888
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:21 pm

There's also the ongoing situation between the ME3 and the US3.

Delta used to fly ATL-DXB I believe... it ended in 2012 or 2014?

AA will start flights to Morocco next June which is in West Africa.
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:24 pm

FlyRow wrote:
Ever heard of politics? America is not very popular in large parts of the middle east

The distance is long, so market has to be worth it.

Morocco is not middle east.

So why do the US airlines fly to Israel and not other countries in the Middle East.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 5401
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:34 pm

Ishrion wrote:


Delta used to fly ATL-DXB I believe... it ended in 2012 or 2014?


And Cairo and Amman.
 
COSPN
Posts: 1722
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 6:33 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:36 pm

Continental was ready to start EWR-CAI. But the Arab spring happened and was canceled
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:38 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:


Delta used to fly ATL-DXB I believe... it ended in 2012 or 2014?


And Cairo and Amman.

Delta flew to Dubai until 2014, Cairo until 2011, Amman until about 2012 or 2013, and Istanbul until 2015 or 2016.
 
User avatar
FlyRow
Posts: 669
Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2016 10:05 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:41 pm

ArchGuy1 wrote:
FlyRow wrote:
Ever heard of politics? America is not very popular in large parts of the middle east

The distance is long, so market has to be worth it.

Morocco is not middle east.

So why do the US airlines fly to Israel and not other countries in the Middle East.


For real?
Cultural, economie, political, military, tourist ties. Propper market plus Of.

Unlike a lot of other me-countries.

This is not rocket science.
F70-F100-RJ85-RJ70-E190-319-320-321-733-734-735-737-738-752-753-763-764-772-744-380
 
MAH4546
Posts: 25675
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:00 pm

FlyRow wrote:
Ever heard of politics? America is not very popular in large parts of the middle east

The distance is long, so market has to be worth it.

Morocco is not middle east.


America is insanely popular throughout the Middle East, where they are obsessed with American culture and products.
a.
 
aaflyer777
Posts: 246
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:37 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:02 pm

Simple answer, there's a ton of competition from EK, QR, and EY and its just not worth it for a US airline to try and fight them for a share of the market
 
User avatar
stl07
Posts: 1512
Joined: Mon May 01, 2017 8:57 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:03 pm

FlyRow wrote:
Ever heard of politics? America is not very popular in large parts of the middle east

The distance is long, so market has to be worth it.

Morocco is not middle east.


point one-not entirely

united flew to Kuwait and Bahrain up until very recently and DL flew to DXB a few years ago

point two-YES, this is the reason why the above flights were dropped
Interesting how every thread is spammed with "bring back paid membership, there are too many spammers"
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:20 pm

So, why do Kuwait Airways, EgyptAir, Royal Jordanian, and Saudia still operate to the United States even with Etihad, Emirates, Qatar Airways, and Turkish Airlines dominating the market between the United States and the Middle East.
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
Posts: 764
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:24 pm

Okay, class, today's lesson is on the operating economics of airlines:

1) When the bean counters at a U.S. airline determine that there is enough premium traffic and/or profitability levels to begin a non-stop from one of their hubs to a new destination - be it domestic or foreign - the airline will begin service.
2) U.S. airlines will always cater first to those purchasing flights beginning and ending in the U.S. (i.e., primarily domestic passengers), whereas foreign airlines will cater to passengers in the country of their origin. For example, as much as I personally love Lufthansa, they are NOT in San Diego because a large number of us want to go backpacking in Germany. They are here because Germans and LH frequent fliers are flying to SAN, and we get the benefits.
3) Because the Middle East is now full of major carriers, they have home-field advantage. For example, at DXB, no US airline is ever going to have anything than O&D passengers there; meaning that anyone boarding a DL flight at ATL is going to be finishing their trip at DXB (unless they have a separate ticket). However, Emirates can rely on local traffic as well as connections. A person boarding an Emirates flight at ATL (hypothetical) could be terminating at DXB OR that person might connecting onward to a destination served by EK.
4) The "Middle East" is accessible to many American cities via a secondary hub airport. San Diego, for example, has both BA and LH to get us to most major airports in the region, via LHR or FRA.
5) Politics is politics, but business is business - Saudi Arabia, not Israel's friend, allows Air India to overfly the Kingdom en route to Israel. Granted, it's not El Al, but it shows that anything is possible. If any U.S. airline wanted to begin flying to destinations in the Middle East, they most certainly could, mostly without restrictions. TWA flew to Cairo and Riyadh, UA flew to Kuwait, and as mentioned, DL to DXB.
5) The majority of the USA-Israel traffic originates in the NYC area. That's the O&D bread and butter. There will ALWAYS be flights to/from JFK and EWR, and other places as the numbers allow. However, the airlines will always concentrate first and foremost on their O&D markets, and offer connections if it is possible. This is also evidenced by the great EWR/IAD swap of smaller regional flights, so as to free up room at EWR for EWR-only passengers.

Simply put, US airlines are not salivating at the thought of one day being allowed to serve the Middle East. They have partners that, when coupled with revenue sharing agreements, make such service unnecessary and unprofitable. When the numbers say otherwise, flights will commence.
Last edited by PSAatSAN4Ever on Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
rjmf22
Posts: 112
Joined: Wed May 25, 2011 10:37 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:24 pm

Back in the day, UA used to fly to Kuwait, Qatar, and Dubai. Times change.
United Airlines
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:35 pm

rjmf22 wrote:
Back in the day, UA used to fly to Kuwait, Qatar, and Dubai. Times change.

United flew from Washington Dulles to Kuwait City, Bahrain, and Dubai until about 2014. They also flew from Newark to Istanbul Ataturk for a few months in 2013.
 
leftcoast8
Posts: 114
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:59 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:49 pm

MAH4546 wrote:
America is insanely popular throughout the Middle East, where they are obsessed with American culture and products.


People in the Middle East love American culture and products, but as for the American government, it's a different story. And with only a handful of exceptions, the feeling is very much mutual.

Delta used to fly JFK-CAI-DXB with an MD-11 and ATL-DXB nonstop with a 77L, United as mentioned previously had a 772 IAD-DXB-DOH route. Pan Am even used to fly JFK-FRA-KHI with A300s (which isn't Middle East, but Pakistan is relatively close by and is easily accessible from most ME destinations). None of the U.S. carriers have any interest in returning to the Persian Gulf or the Levant, for many reasons: the ME4's dominant presence in the U.S. (the reason United and Delta ended their DXB flights in the first place), the falling out with Turkey, and the political chaos in Qatar.

I started a thread where there is a great discussion about this exact topic: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1426841

Tangent: The growth of the ME4 is even affecting flights from Europe, to some extent. Lufthansa used to fly to AUH and DOH, and KLM pulled out of DOH after 33 years of service to Qatar. They're just letting EY/QR to walk all over them. This can makes getting from North America to Qatar difficult, especially for airports that aren't close to Oneworld hubs and lack QR service (YVR, YYC, SEA, PDX, DTW). It requires connecting through LHR via BA (which, admittedly, has its daily LHR-DOH flight well-timed for connections from NA) as there are no *A connections to Doha except from Turkish and Ethiopian. Abu Dhabi isn't as bad due to the KL/EY interline agreement (in addition, KLM still has 5/week AMS-AUH flights) and the strong Skyteam connections in NA.
Last edited by leftcoast8 on Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:02 am, edited 2 times in total.
 
SurlyBonds
Posts: 331
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2015 10:24 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:54 pm

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Okay, class, today's lesson is on the operating economics of airlines:

2) U.S. airlines will always cater first to those purchasing flights beginning and ending in the U.S. (i.e., primarily domestic passengers), whereas foreign airlines will cater to passengers in the country of their origin. For example, as much as I personally love Lufthansa, they are NOT in San Diego because a large number of us want to go backpacking in Germany. They are here because Germans and LH frequent fliers are flying to SAN, and we get the benefits.


There's some home-country bias in the airline industry, sure. But I think this is pretty clearly untrue for mega-carriers like LH/AX, AF/KL, BA/IB, and TK, and that's just in Europe. On Indian routes, Lufthansa welcomes you with a "namaste" greeting and serves Indian food, including vegetarian, and of course they offer Indian movies. They wouldn't be doing this if their only target customer were Germans. (Where it may be more true is the US3 and CN3.)
 
xwb777
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2018 4:13 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:57 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Ishrion wrote:


Delta used to fly ATL-DXB I believe... it ended in 2012 or 2014?


And Cairo and Amman.



Amman was served by the B767.
 
triple3driver
Posts: 131
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:24 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:14 am

Indeed, America and the ME have some work to do before they can call each other buddies, but there's also a very large amount of travel demand between the 2 nations, and it makes sense as Tel Aviv is a massive tech hub. Furthermore, Tel Aviv is also a lot closer geographically to the United States then most, if not all Middle East nations, and the ME3 have a very extensive network to the US from their hubs that allows them to serve much more of their respective markets in a way that El AL could only dream of, so there isn't as much room for the US3.

This is refelcted in the fact that Delta operates daily A330 flights out of JFK, which switches to twice daily during peak season, United has a 787 and 777 flying out of EWR every day and a 77W flying daily out of SFO, and EL Al has multiple flights to both JFK and EWR using a mixture of 787 and 777 aircraft, except for Fridays.

Meanwhile, 2015 saw Delta and United cancel their flights to Dubai, the last of these types of flights operated by a US carrier.

So to summarize, much of the Middle East is dominated by the ME3, with very little room for the American carriers, and other markets which do not have flights or plans for flights are likely too small for the US3 to want to risk. Meanwhile, travel demand between the States and Israel is also high, and El AL does not have as much of a hold on the market, meaning that there's enough space for United and Delta to offer multiple flights in addition to the El Al flights.
If you can walk away from it intact, it was a good landing!
 
User avatar
adamblang
Posts: 1133
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:47 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:16 am

aaflyer777 wrote:
Simple answer, there's a ton of competition from EK, QR, and EY and its just not worth it for a US airline to try and fight them for a share of the market

Ding ding ding.

For some reading on the matter: https://onemileatatime.com/big-three-mi ... s-stopped/
146 319 320 321 332 333 343 717 734 735 73G 738 739 744 752 753 763 764 772 773 789 AR1 AT4 CNA CR2 CR7 DC9 ER3 ERD ER4 E70 E75 E90
 
zakuivcustom
Posts: 2658
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2017 3:32 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:33 am

triple3driver wrote:
So to summarize, much of the Middle East is dominated by the ME3, with very little room for the American carriers, and other markets which do not have flights or plans for flights are likely too small for the US3 to want to risk. Meanwhile, travel demand between the States and Israel is also high, and El AL does not have as much of a hold on the market, meaning that there's enough space for United and Delta to offer multiple flights in addition to the El Al flights.


Just a question - is El Al itself even all THAT popular among Israeli or Jewish population in US? Their hard/soft product is a joke (although improved recently), and I thought the only reason why some pick El Al is b/c of its security measures? (I don't know anything about the carrier of choice in that area...)

SurlyBonds wrote:
There's some home-country bias in the airline industry, sure. But I think this is pretty clearly untrue for mega-carriers like LH/AX, AF/KL, BA/IB, and TK, and that's just in Europe. On Indian routes, Lufthansa welcomes you with a "namaste" greeting and serves Indian food, including vegetarian, and of course they offer Indian movies. They wouldn't be doing this if their only target customer were Germans. (Where it may be more true is the US3 and CN3.)


Alongside my question about El Al, I thought one of the big reason why the like of LH can be successful in Indian market is b/c Indians doesn't exactly like their home carrier aka Air India. (Well, at least from my small sample size, my Indian colleagues at work actively avoid Air India).

Side note - once I read your statement, this LH ad pops right up in my head.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a4jsYjdoD50

As for the OP questions - I'll just repeat what other people have already said - ME3 is simply too dominant in the region for US3 to try and compete for that market, especially since US3 can only capture O&D market between US and the Middle East city (i.e. DXB/DOH/RUH). Meanwhile, ME3 can capture traffic like US-India along with local traffic.
Last edited by zakuivcustom on Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:39 am, edited 3 times in total.
 
FSDan
Posts: 2477
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:34 am

ArchGuy1 wrote:
So why do the US airlines fly to Israel and not other countries in the Middle East.


One reason Israel has remained as a destination while other Middle Eastern routes have faded away on U.S. carriers is that there are large Jewish-American populations in many major U.S. cities - particularly New York, which is why you see UA and DL each with 2x daily flights in the NYC-TLV market. It's simply a massive market. UA has also found success on SFO-TLV, which seems to be in large part due to economic ties in the high tech and pharmaceutical sectors. IAD-TLV is still quite new, but as others have mentioned, the U.S. and Israel have been quite close politically for decades. On top of all that, Israel is a popular destination for American tourists, whether it's for beaches and nightlife in Tel Aviv, or religious tourism to Jerusalem, Bethlehem, etc.

Regarding the ME routes flown in the 2010s by UA and DL, several of these (ATL-DXB, IAD-KWI-BAH, IAD-DXB-DOH) were supported by military traffic to the region while the U.S. was heavily involved in Iraq and Afghanistan. With a drawdown in the number of U.S. troops over there and an increase in service from the ME3, these flights went away.

When DL cut JFK-CAI and JFK-IST (which didn't happen at the same time), it was due to political unrest in Egypt and Turkey, respectively. I'm not sure if JFK-AMM was a similar case, or if that was just an example of a market that was too small and low-yielding.

Looking to the future, it seems unlikely that any of the US3 will drastically increase their presence in the region (outside of Israel) in the very near future. Dubai is a major financial hub and tourist draw, but the 800 lb gorilla that is EK is a strong deterrent. A route such as DTW-BEY could theoretically work for DL due to cultural ties and the fact that BEY is a hub for SkyTeam member Middle East Airlines, but the problem there is that Lebanon has been perpetually denied direct service to the U.S. due to security concerns around Hezbollah. Also, the market might be too low yielding to make the nonstop worth it over connections via CDG.
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:50 am

FSDan wrote:
When DL cut JFK-CAI and JFK-IST (which didn't happen at the same time), it was due to political unrest in Egypt and Turkey, respectively. I'm not sure if JFK-AMM was a similar case, or if that was just an example of a market that was too small and low-yielding.

Delta also ended it's New York JFK to Istanbul flights because of the explosive growth of Turkish Airlines, with them building a global hub in Istanbul and a massive number of flights from Istanbul to multiple US cities including New York JFK. Similar to Emirates, Etihad, and Qatar Airways creating major hubs in Dubai, Abu Dhabi, and Doha. EgyptAir also kept it's Cairo to New York JFK flights despite the unrest in Egypt and still does to the present day.
 
User avatar
ojjunior
Posts: 807
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:31 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:41 am

No US Airlines current flying to IST nowadays?
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:44 am

ojjunior wrote:
No US Airlines current flying to IST nowadays?

Correct
 
User avatar
aemoreira1981
Posts: 2775
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:17 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 2:10 am

DL and UA used to fly to DXB. However:

1. DXB is a fortress hub for EK.
2. UA had to use the B772(ER) there and often took a payload hit returning to IAD, and would often need to use the 12 direction to depart (DXB usually uses the 30 direction, although that involves a tailwind). UA could have relied on AI feed from many locations in India, but the payload hit caused problems. (This was before the CO merger.)
3. DL had no feed from DXB to ATL. (This was after EK used the A345 to launch JFK.) Also, it's hard to compete against JFK-DXB where one can fly B6 to JFK and then onward to DXB on EK (JFK-DXB, as well as FLL-DXB, have a B6 codeshare on them.). From the NYC area to DXB, EK operates 5x daily (3 nonstops, 2x A388 and 1x B77W) and 2 one-stops (via MXP on the A388 and ATH on the B77W).

DL also at one time used to fly to IST seasonally from JFK with a B763, but weaker demand and the terror attack at IST (now ISL) caused that to end. Also, there was no feed at IST at all, where DL was competing against a 3x daily service from JFK to IST, with TK basically plotting its path to be like EK, but with right-sized planes.

With IST and DXB culled, that left just TLV.

The other issue is: crews who fly to TLV can't also fly to other destinations in the Middle East on their own passports, other than transit via DXB to another flight departing from DXB. If UA were to fly to CAI seasonally, segregation of crews would be needed (i.e., an ORD or IAH-based crew would have to be used since there is no TLV from those destinations)...most likely IAH on a B789 or pmCO B772.
Last edited by aemoreira1981 on Thu Aug 15, 2019 2:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
User avatar
chepos
Posts: 6615
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 9:40 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 2:13 am

Not sure it has been mentioned, DL also flew ATL-KWI for a hot minute.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
Posts: 764
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 2:44 am

SurlyBonds wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Okay, class, today's lesson is on the operating economics of airlines:

2) U.S. airlines will always cater first to those purchasing flights beginning and ending in the U.S. (i.e., primarily domestic passengers), whereas foreign airlines will cater to passengers in the country of their origin. For example, as much as I personally love Lufthansa, they are NOT in San Diego because a large number of us want to go backpacking in Germany. They are here because Germans and LH frequent fliers are flying to SAN, and we get the benefits.


There's some home-country bias in the airline industry, sure. But I think this is pretty clearly untrue for mega-carriers like LH/AX, AF/KL, BA/IB, and TK, and that's just in Europe. On Indian routes, Lufthansa welcomes you with a "namaste" greeting and serves Indian food, including vegetarian, and of course they offer Indian movies. They wouldn't be doing this if their only target customer were Germans. (Where it may be more true is the US3 and CN3.)


True on all points.

But I would imagine the Germany-India business started before India-Germany. The India-Germany market, by way of this contact, grew tremendously, and now marketing now requires catering equally to Indian customs as to European. That's great for all sides!

It would have been better to say that non-stops originate in the home country, rather than leaving the confusion of implying that a market will remain static forever.
 
BWA900
Posts: 59
Joined: Wed May 14, 2014 11:20 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:03 am

Ishrion wrote:
There's also the ongoing situation between the ME3 and the US3.

Delta used to fly ATL-DXB I believe... it ended in 2012 or 2014?

AA will start flights to Morocco next June which is in West Africa.



Morocco is in North Africa which is also known as Greater Middle East.
Flown: A300 A319 A320 A321 A333 A343 A359 A388 B712 B735 B737 B738 B739 B38M B744 B752 B753 B763 B772ER B772LR B77W B788 B789 CRJ2 CRJ7 CRJ9 DH8A DH8B DH8D E145 E170 E190
 
blacksoviet
Posts: 1110
Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2016 10:50 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:03 am

The United States allows Israelis to obtain US citizenship without renouncing their Israeli citizenship. They are dual citizens. I believe Israelis are the only people allowed to do this.

Former Homeland Security director Michael Chertoff is an Israeli citizen.
 
blacksoviet
Posts: 1110
Joined: Thu Apr 21, 2016 10:50 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:08 am

FSDan wrote:
ArchGuy1 wrote:
So why do the US airlines fly to Israel and not other countries in the Middle East.


One reason Israel has remained as a destination while other Middle Eastern routes have faded away on U.S. carriers is that there are large Jewish-American populations in many major U.S. cities - particularly New York, which is why you see UA and DL each with 2x daily flights in the NYC-TLV market. It's simply a massive market. UA has also found success on SFO-TLV, which seems to be in large part due to economic ties in the high tech and pharmaceutical sectors. IAD-TLV is still quite new, but as others have mentioned, the U.S. and Israel have been quite close politically for decades. On top of all that, Israel is a popular destination for American tourists, whether it's for beaches and nightlife in Tel Aviv, or religious tourism to Jerusalem, Bethlehem, etc.

Regarding the ME routes flown in the 2010s by UA and DL, several of these (ATL-DXB, IAD-KWI-BAH, IAD-DXB-DOH) were supported by military traffic to the region while the U.S. was heavily involved in Iraq and Afghanistan. With a drawdown in the number of U.S. troops over there and an increase in service from the ME3, these flights went away.

When DL cut JFK-CAI and JFK-IST (which didn't happen at the same time), it was due to political unrest in Egypt and Turkey, respectively. I'm not sure if JFK-AMM was a similar case, or if that was just an example of a market that was too small and low-yielding.

Looking to the future, it seems unlikely that any of the US3 will drastically increase their presence in the region (outside of Israel) in the very near future. Dubai is a major financial hub and tourist draw, but the 800 lb gorilla that is EK is a strong deterrent. A route such as DTW-BEY could theoretically work for DL due to cultural ties and the fact that BEY is a hub for SkyTeam member Middle East Airlines, but the problem there is that Lebanon has been perpetually denied direct service to the U.S. due to security concerns around Hezbollah. Also, the market might be too low yielding to make the nonstop worth it over connections via CDG.

Does the A330-200 have enough range to do BEY-DTW?
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:25 am

aemoreira1981 wrote:
DL and UA used to fly to DXB. However:

1. DXB is a fortress hub for EK.
2. UA had to use the B772(ER) there and often took a payload hit returning to IAD, and would often need to use the 12 direction to depart (DXB usually uses the 30 direction, although that involves a tailwind). UA could have relied on AI feed from many locations in India, but the payload hit caused problems. (This was before the CO merger.)
3. DL had no feed from DXB to ATL. (This was after EK used the A345 to launch JFK.) Also, it's hard to compete against JFK-DXB where one can fly B6 to JFK and then onward to DXB on EK (JFK-DXB, as well as FLL-DXB, have a B6 codeshare on them.). From the NYC area to DXB, EK operates 5x daily (3 nonstops, 2x A388 and 1x B77W) and 2 one-stops (via MXP on the A388 and ATH on the B77W).

DL also at one time used to fly to IST seasonally from JFK with a B763, but weaker demand and the terror attack at IST (now ISL) caused that to end. Also, there was no feed at IST at all, where DL was competing against a 3x daily service from JFK to IST, with TK basically plotting its path to be like EK, but with right-sized planes.

With IST and DXB culled, that left just TLV.

The other issue is: crews who fly to TLV can't also fly to other destinations in the Middle East on their own passports, other than transit via DXB to another flight departing from DXB. If UA were to fly to CAI seasonally, segregation of crews would be needed (i.e., an ORD or IAH-based crew would have to be used since there is no TLV from those destinations)...most likely IAH on a B789 or pmCO B772.

Delta ended it's flights from New York JFK to Istanbul in May 2016, about a month before the Ataturk Airport attack. Istanbul also had a few terrorist attacks on the months leading up to May 2016.
 
classicjets
Posts: 249
Joined: Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:15 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:05 am

blacksoviet wrote:
The United States allows Israelis to obtain US citizenship without renouncing their Israeli citizenship. They are dual citizens. I believe Israelis are the only people allowed to do this.

Former Homeland Security director Michael Chertoff is an Israeli citizen.


The United States does not require citizens of any country to renounce their other citizenship upon naturalizing as a US citizen. Only people from countries which forbid holding multiple nationalities (like China and India) will lose their citizenship when becoming a US citizen.
 
User avatar
adambrau
Posts: 253
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:44 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:47 am

leftcoast8 wrote:
MAH4546 wrote:
America is insanely popular throughout the Middle East, where they are obsessed with American culture and products.


People in the Middle East love American culture and products, but as for the American government, it's a different story. And with only a handful of exceptions, the feeling is very much mutual.

Delta used to fly JFK-CAI-DXB with an MD-11 and ATL-DXB nonstop with a 77L, United as mentioned previously had a 772 IAD-DXB-DOH route. Pan Am even used to fly JFK-FRA-KHI with A300s (which isn't Middle East, but Pakistan is relatively close by and is easily accessible from most ME destinations). None of the U.S. carriers have any interest in returning to the Persian Gulf or the Levant, for many reasons: the ME4's dominant presence in the U.S. (the reason United and Delta ended their DXB flights in the first place), the falling out with Turkey, and the political chaos in Qatar.

I started a thread where there is a great discussion about this exact topic: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1426841

Tangent: The growth of the ME4 is even affecting flights from Europe, to some extent. Lufthansa used to fly to AUH and DOH, and KLM pulled out of DOH after 33 years of service to Qatar. They're just letting EY/QR to walk all over them. This can makes getting from North America to Qatar difficult, especially for airports that aren't close to Oneworld hubs and lack QR service (YVR, YYC, SEA, PDX, DTW). It requires connecting through LHR via BA (which, admittedly, has its daily LHR-DOH flight well-timed for connections from NA) as there are no *A connections to Doha except from Turkish and Ethiopian. Abu Dhabi isn't as bad due to the KL/EY interline agreement (in addition, KLM still has 5/week AMS-AUH flights) and the strong Skyteam connections in NA.


Pan Am mostly served KHI originating in BOM. BOM-KHI-FRA-JFK ie PA073 on a 747 one of which was hijacked in 1986. The A310's were used during PA's dying days.

United has found it's little part of the Middle East in Israel. Given the draw down of military traffic and the ME3 plus Turkish plus LH/BA/AF groups unlikely any imminent plans for more US-flag mideast ops.
Let's keep the skies friendly.
 
entdoc
Posts: 58
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:15 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 5:56 am

regarding crew segregation on TLV trips -
for quite a few years very few people have stamps in their passports upon entry or exit
nowadays using a biometric passport you get a small piece of paper with your picture on entry and exit nothing in the passport
i also believe that at the border control booths if requested they will not stamp the passport but give a similar little piece of paper
they are sensitive to the fact that many folk tourists and other (including crew) may have to travel to places that would
frown on an Israel visa in a passport so that has pretty much fallen by the wayside
(years ago some folk used to hold two passports for that reason)
 
User avatar
ojjunior
Posts: 807
Joined: Thu Jul 13, 2006 12:31 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:29 am

ArchGuy1 wrote:
ojjunior wrote:
No US Airlines current flying to IST nowadays?

Correct

Didn't realize that...
Considering Turkey is a kinda popular tourist destination and IST pretty well served in terms of airport size and stuff it's a surprise for me.
Okay, some political and security reasons may apply but i didn't know it was that much not to have any US airlines flying in.
Odd that all of them let TK fly alone between US and Turkey...
TK says a big thank you.
 
jasoncrh
Posts: 697
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:29 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:47 pm

United dropped Kuwait and Dubai in 2016. I think Qatar and Bahrain were dropped as tags from kuwait and bahrain prior to that.

United flew from newark to Istanbul in the summer of 2012, not 2013.

ArchGuy1 wrote:
rjmf22 wrote:
Back in the day, UA used to fly to Kuwait, Qatar, and Dubai. Times change.

United flew from Washington Dulles to Kuwait City, Bahrain, and Dubai until about 2014. They also flew from Newark to Istanbul Ataturk for a few months in 2013.
 
jasoncrh
Posts: 697
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:29 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 12:51 pm

Delta had lots of interline feed at DXB. Almost half the plane was traveling past Dubai to points in India, Bahrain, and other middle east points. While not a codeshare, which they did not have, Delta did flow a lot of traffic ot and from Emirates, Gulf Air, Saudia, and others at DXB. The thought that all traffic on Delta to Dubai (or anybody to Dubai) just stops in Dubai is a myth that underscores the misunderstanding of what can be done with interline relationships.

What really did UA and DL in in Dubai was Emirates's huge growth to the US. They fly to so many cities that the average fare to Dubai itself went down dramatically over the years. Plus, the size of the market never really great that much. Lower local fares, plus the low fares associated with interline traffic, meant doom for UA and DL in Dubai.

aemoreira1981 wrote:
DL and UA used to fly to DXB. However:

1. DXB is a fortress hub for EK.
2. UA had to use the B772(ER) there and often took a payload hit returning to IAD, and would often need to use the 12 direction to depart (DXB usually uses the 30 direction, although that involves a tailwind). UA could have relied on AI feed from many locations in India, but the payload hit caused problems. (This was before the CO merger.)
3. DL had no feed from DXB to ATL. (This was after EK used the A345 to launch JFK.) Also, it's hard to compete against JFK-DXB where one can fly B6 to JFK and then onward to DXB on EK (JFK-DXB, as well as FLL-DXB, have a B6 codeshare on them.). From the NYC area to DXB, EK operates 5x daily (3 nonstops, 2x A388 and 1x B77W) and 2 one-stops (via MXP on the A388 and ATH on the B77W).

DL also at one time used to fly to IST seasonally from JFK with a B763, but weaker demand and the terror attack at IST (now ISL) caused that to end. Also, there was no feed at IST at all, where DL was competing against a 3x daily service from JFK to IST, with TK basically plotting its path to be like EK, but with right-sized planes.

With IST and DXB culled, that left just TLV.

The other issue is: crews who fly to TLV can't also fly to other destinations in the Middle East on their own passports, other than transit via DXB to another flight departing from DXB. If UA were to fly to CAI seasonally, segregation of crews would be needed (i.e., an ORD or IAH-based crew would have to be used since there is no TLV from those destinations)...most likely IAH on a B789 or pmCO B772.
 
jasoncrh
Posts: 697
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:29 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:00 pm

Overall good, but #2 is a little off. Foreign airlines come to a US (or other city) to of course serve the needs of their home country travelers, but they also depend on the US point of sale for a large percent of their revenue. I have lots of family in San Diego, and they have repeatedly used both BA and LH services (they're very happy to have them!) to fly to LHR/FRA and connect to other cities in Europe and beyond. The same happens in other cities. I live in Washington, DC. We benefit from having a large and ever-increasing number of internatoinal carriers. Those carriers in DC primarily serve the large, wealthy, DC population that has the disposable income to travel abroad. Sure, they get people from Eurpoe or Asia too. But a large portion of the traffic originates in DC. For example, I use Lufthansa most times to go to Europe. I've used Korean Air to fly to Bangkok over Seoul, etc etc etc. Saying that foreign airlines cater to passengers primarily in their country of origin is definitely not accurate.

On Delta's flight to Dubai, about half the plane, on average, connected beyond Dubai using Delta's interline agreements with various partners in the region. It's a total myth that it all ended in Dubai. Traffic connected to Emirates, Saudia, Gulf Air to points in India, Saudi Arabia, and Bahrain. I know because I was an analyst at a competing airline at the time and monitored that type of data ;) Never underestimate the power of the interline for helping flow traffic.


PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Okay, class, today's lesson is on the operating economics of airlines:

1) When the bean counters at a U.S. airline determine that there is enough premium traffic and/or profitability levels to begin a non-stop from one of their hubs to a new destination - be it domestic or foreign - the airline will begin service.
2) U.S. airlines will always cater first to those purchasing flights beginning and ending in the U.S. (i.e., primarily domestic passengers), whereas foreign airlines will cater to passengers in the country of their origin. For example, as much as I personally love Lufthansa, they are NOT in San Diego because a large number of us want to go backpacking in Germany. They are here because Germans and LH frequent fliers are flying to SAN, and we get the benefits.
3) Because the Middle East is now full of major carriers, they have home-field advantage. For example, at DXB, no US airline is ever going to have anything than O&D passengers there; meaning that anyone boarding a DL flight at ATL is going to be finishing their trip at DXB (unless they have a separate ticket). However, Emirates can rely on local traffic as well as connections. A person boarding an Emirates flight at ATL (hypothetical) could be terminating at DXB OR that person might connecting onward to a destination served by EK.
4) The "Middle East" is accessible to many American cities via a secondary hub airport. San Diego, for example, has both BA and LH to get us to most major airports in the region, via LHR or FRA.
5) Politics is politics, but business is business - Saudi Arabia, not Israel's friend, allows Air India to overfly the Kingdom en route to Israel. Granted, it's not El Al, but it shows that anything is possible. If any U.S. airline wanted to begin flying to destinations in the Middle East, they most certainly could, mostly without restrictions. TWA flew to Cairo and Riyadh, UA flew to Kuwait, and as mentioned, DL to DXB.
5) The majority of the USA-Israel traffic originates in the NYC area. That's the O&D bread and butter. There will ALWAYS be flights to/from JFK and EWR, and other places as the numbers allow. However, the airlines will always concentrate first and foremost on their O&D markets, and offer connections if it is possible. This is also evidenced by the great EWR/IAD swap of smaller regional flights, so as to free up room at EWR for EWR-only passengers.

Simply put, US airlines are not salivating at the thought of one day being allowed to serve the Middle East. They have partners that, when coupled with revenue sharing agreements, make such service unnecessary and unprofitable. When the numbers say otherwise, flights will commence.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 5401
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:27 pm

jasoncrh wrote:
Saying that foreign airlines cater to passengers primarily in their country of origin is definitely not accurate.


I don't see the point in trying to make the generalization work in either direction. If you have data please point to it.

I don't know of data by international airport pair & country of origin but I can point to U.S. DOT data on share of passengers from major intl gateway airports non-stop to the U.S. by U.S. vs. foreign carriers. See Table 7: https://www.transportation.gov/sites/do ... r-2018.pdf

U.S. carriers get these shares XXX-USA from the top 10 gateways for the 12 months ended 12/2018:

LHR, 39%
YYZ, 26%
CUN, 98%
MEX, 45%
CDG, 41%
FRA, 29%
NRT, 50%
YVR, 40%
ICN, 16%
AMS, 60%

As for the 'Oh my god, how can DL not fly from HKG?!!!!!' crowd, I'll point out that HKG doesn't make the top 10. You'll notice the absence of PEK, PVG, too. The top Mideast origin, DXB, doesn't even crack the top 20.

TLV isn't even on the DOT's list of 40, although San Salvador, El Salvador is.
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 7:08 pm

FSDan wrote:
ArchGuy1 wrote:
So why do the US airlines fly to Israel and not other countries in the Middle East.


One reason Israel has remained as a destination while other Middle Eastern routes have faded away on U.S. carriers is that there are large Jewish-American populations in many major U.S. cities - particularly New York, which is why you see UA and DL each with 2x daily flights in the NYC-TLV market. It's simply a massive market. UA has also found success on SFO-TLV, which seems to be in large part due to economic ties in the high tech and pharmaceutical sectors. IAD-TLV is still quite new, but as others have mentioned, the U.S. and Israel have been quite close politically for decades. On top of all that, Israel is a popular destination for American tourists, whether it's for beaches and nightlife in Tel Aviv, or religious tourism to Jerusalem, Bethlehem, etc.

Regarding the ME routes flown in the 2010s by UA and DL, several of these (ATL-DXB, IAD-KWI-BAH, IAD-DXB-DOH) were supported by military traffic to the region while the U.S. was heavily involved in Iraq and Afghanistan. With a drawdown in the number of U.S. troops over there and an increase in service from the ME3, these flights went away.

When DL cut JFK-CAI and JFK-IST (which didn't happen at the same time), it was due to political unrest in Egypt and Turkey, respectively. I'm not sure if JFK-AMM was a similar case, or if that was just an example of a market that was too small and low-yielding.

Looking to the future, it seems unlikely that any of the US3 will drastically increase their presence in the region (outside of Israel) in the very near future. Dubai is a major financial hub and tourist draw, but the 800 lb gorilla that is EK is a strong deterrent. A route such as DTW-BEY could theoretically work for DL due to cultural ties and the fact that BEY is a hub for SkyTeam member Middle East Airlines, but the problem there is that Lebanon has been perpetually denied direct service to the U.S. due to security concerns around Hezbollah. Also, the market might be too low yielding to make the nonstop worth it over connections via CDG.

Delta ended it's flights from New York JFK to Amman in 2011, the same year they ended flights from New York JFK to Cairo. They ended the New York JFK to Istanbul flights in May 2016.
 
sonicruiser
Posts: 468
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:18 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 7:21 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
As for the 'Oh my god, how can DL not fly from HKG?!!!!!' crowd, I'll point out that HKG doesn't make the top 10. You'll notice the absence of PEK, PVG, too. The top Mideast origin, DXB, doesn't even crack the top 20.


Completely useless point. HKG doesn't make the top 10 because they don't even fly there in the first place. No shit dude. That's why this is an issue to begin with.
 
zakuivcustom
Posts: 2658
Joined: Sat Jun 10, 2017 3:32 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 7:42 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
As for the 'Oh my god, how can DL not fly from HKG?!!!!!' crowd, I'll point out that HKG doesn't make the top 10. You'll notice the absence of PEK, PVG, too. The top Mideast origin, DXB, doesn't even crack the top 20.


#12...for a city of 7.3M people, that's not shabby at all.

On the flip side, CX more or less alone get ~70% of that market (I'll give the remaining 4-5% to HX) vs. ~25% for US carriers. Not as "foreign-dominant" as ICN (16-84) or TPE (7-93); but the local carriers (mainly CX) at HKG is definitely a lot more dominant than CN3 at PVG (54-46 in favor of US carriers) or PEK (39-61).

ojjunior wrote:
ArchGuy1 wrote:
ojjunior wrote:
No US Airlines current flying to IST nowadays?

Correct

Didn't realize that...
Considering Turkey is a kinda popular tourist destination and IST pretty well served in terms of airport size and stuff it's a surprise for me.
Okay, some political and security reasons may apply but i didn't know it was that much not to have any US airlines flying in.
Odd that all of them let TK fly alone between US and Turkey...
TK says a big thank you.


You have to factor in the fact that TK itself has a VERY large presence in US. Traffic to/from IST also doesn't quite have the yield that US3 are looking for.
 
User avatar
tlecam
Posts: 1399
Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:38 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Thu Aug 15, 2019 9:54 pm

blacksoviet wrote:
The United States allows Israelis to obtain US citizenship without renouncing their Israeli citizenship. They are dual citizens. I believe Israelis are the only people allowed to do this.

Former Homeland Security director Michael Chertoff is an Israeli citizen.


What? My mum has dual citizenship with the US and Ireland.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
MAH4546
Posts: 25675
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Fri Aug 16, 2019 4:58 am

blacksoviet wrote:
The United States allows Israelis to obtain US citizenship without renouncing their Israeli citizenship. They are dual citizens. I believe Israelis are the only people allowed to do this.

Former Homeland Security director Michael Chertoff is an Israeli citizen.


What are you talking about?!? The U.S. allows anybody to have dual citizenship. The only restriction is that the the other country may not allow it (e.g. India does not allow dual citizenship).

This website needs to start charging fees to join again...
a.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 3966
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:53 am

Cus people from the Middle East want to go to America and people from America want to go to Hawaii.
 
oceanvikram
Posts: 50
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2017 12:00 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:56 am

ArchGuy1 wrote:
FlyRow wrote:
Ever heard of politics? America is not very popular in large parts of the middle east

The distance is long, so market has to be worth it.

Morocco is not middle east.

So why do the US airlines fly to Israel and not other countries in the Middle East.


ArchGuy1 by now there are enough posts that have provided compelling reasons as to why US airlines fly to Israel and not other Middle East Countries. If the posts don't satisfy you, then ask more detailed questions, if not, contact the airlines themselves. Another option is investment banking forums like wallstreetoasis.com.

At the end of the day it comes down to money. Yes ... it could be that simple. The US flagged airlines can not make money in any other Middle Eastern country other than Israel.
My comments are based as an aviation enthusiast first, then as a passenger who paid for his own ticket, after that a passenger on a business trip and finally an armchair CEO.
 
EK216
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 7:41 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:26 am

This is my first post on A.Net so don't jump on me too much, but the first thing I think about upon seeing the thread title, of course, relates heavily to the politics.

What comes to my mind is the geopolitics behind Arab world not recognizing Israel. Which is easily manifested into very little connections from TLV to ME3 connection hubs and/or other hubs (mainly by way of TK, RJ, PC, maybe even ET). It's noticeable the presence of the US3 flying to TLV (AA in 2020) and equally noticeable the ME3 among other regional major, minor, and LCC airlines (including: SV, G9, FZ, ABY, WY, KU, JZR, IR, PIA, IA, RB, W5 etc.) not.

I think the absence of those heavy (dare I say dominant?) regional airlines and their connections hubs is a major reason why many Euro carriers + LCCs/ULCCs, and ultimately the US3 can ALL transport decent traffic and churn any profits. This combined with less security threats plus solid positive socio+eco+pol ties with Israel on the USA side seems like a decent answer to me.
 
gokmengs
Posts: 1169
Joined: Wed Mar 09, 2005 2:48 am

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Fri Aug 16, 2019 10:39 am

blacksoviet wrote:
The United States allows Israelis to obtain US citizenship without renouncing their Israeli citizenship. They are dual citizens. I believe Israelis are the only people allowed to do this.

Former Homeland Security director Michael Chertoff is an Israeli citizen.

Incorrect, US does allow dual citizenship, there are some countries that doesn't allow this hence if you want to become a US citizen you need to renounce your original citizenship with your motherland. I'm a US/Turkish dual citizen.

ojjunior wrote:
ArchGuy1 wrote:
ojjunior wrote:
No US Airlines current flying to IST nowadays?

Correct

Didn't realize that...
Considering Turkey is a kinda popular tourist destination and IST pretty well served in terms of airport size and stuff it's a surprise for me.
Okay, some political and security reasons may apply but i didn't know it was that much not to have any US airlines flying in.
Odd that all of them let TK fly alone between US and Turkey...
TK says a big thank you.

Turkey is a very big market but TK dominates the market and its very tough to compete against them with their aggressive pricing coupled with high frequency and very good product. This is not limited to US carriers EU carriers such as LH, BA,AF all reduced service to IST, as TK was getting much of their business.
Yaşa Mustafa Kemal Paşa Yaşa, Adın Yazılacak Mücevher Taşa
 
ArchGuy1
Topic Author
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Jul 10, 2019 11:35 pm

Re: US Flagged Airlines to Israel

Sat Aug 17, 2019 10:04 pm

FSDan wrote:
ArchGuy1 wrote:
So why do the US airlines fly to Israel and not other countries in the Middle East.


One reason Israel has remained as a destination while other Middle Eastern routes have faded away on U.S. carriers is that there are large Jewish-American populations in many major U.S. cities - particularly New York, which is why you see UA and DL each with 2x daily flights in the NYC-TLV market. It's simply a massive market. UA has also found success on SFO-TLV, which seems to be in large part due to economic ties in the high tech and pharmaceutical sectors. IAD-TLV is still quite new, but as others have mentioned, the U.S. and Israel have been quite close politically for decades. On top of all that, Israel is a popular destination for American tourists, whether it's for beaches and nightlife in Tel Aviv, or religious tourism to Jerusalem, Bethlehem, etc.

Regarding the ME routes flown in the 2010s by UA and DL, several of these (ATL-DXB, IAD-KWI-BAH, IAD-DXB-DOH) were supported by military traffic to the region while the U.S. was heavily involved in Iraq and Afghanistan. With a drawdown in the number of U.S. troops over there and an increase in service from the ME3, these flights went away.

When DL cut JFK-CAI and JFK-IST (which didn't happen at the same time), it was due to political unrest in Egypt and Turkey, respectively. I'm not sure if JFK-AMM was a similar case, or if that was just an example of a market that was too small and low-yielding.

Looking to the future, it seems unlikely that any of the US3 will drastically increase their presence in the region (outside of Israel) in the very near future. Dubai is a major financial hub and tourist draw, but the 800 lb gorilla that is EK is a strong deterrent. A route such as DTW-BEY could theoretically work for DL due to cultural ties and the fact that BEY is a hub for SkyTeam member Middle East Airlines, but the problem there is that Lebanon has been perpetually denied direct service to the U.S. due to security concerns around Hezbollah. Also, the market might be too low yielding to make the nonstop worth it over connections via CDG.

Actually, American Airlines will be launching flights from Philadelphia to Casablanca in June 2020. So why is Morocco the only other country in the Greater Middle East besides Israel that will be seeing flights by a US airline in the very near future.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos