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Revelation
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Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:37 pm

Re: Boeing delays 777-8X entry into service

Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:23 pm

tealnz wrote:
CHRISBA35X wrote:
My reading of it is that they are wisely ceding the ULH sector to Airbus for the A359ULH/A350-1000ULH and putting the money saved into optimizing the 779X into its niche that Airbus has no answer to, and also into the 787-9/10 combo which is dominating the segment it plays in and has an opportunity to push the A330NEO out completely.

Okay...
The only little complication is that the A35K was configured as a direct replacement for the 77W (size, payload at range...). Chosing not to play in that segment, with the 77W replacement cycle getting under way in a few years, is an interesting strategic call. :scratchchin:

That strategic call was made when 77X was launched.

Boeing clearly had no appetite to do the original clean sheet Y3 they originally were mooting in the wake of the 787 debacle.

The technical reality meant than that new engines and new wings would also mean a stretch to amortize the heavier yet more efficient engines and to utilize the more efficient lift generation from the wings, thus doing 77X meant planes bigger than 77L/77W.

The market preference for 787/A359 sizes probably means it was a good call not to do a clean sheet.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
brindabella
Posts: 573
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2010 10:38 am

Re: Boeing delays 777-8X entry into service

Tue Aug 20, 2019 1:49 pm

Revelation wrote:
Sokes wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
787-8 444 of 1462, engineering in work to reduce cost/weight (30.3%)
Lightsaber


I don't understand what you mean. Can you please expand on it.

I can help, I speak Lightsaber.

444 of 1462 or 30.3% of all 787s on order or delivered are -8 models.

Cost and weight reduction are coming to the model because the improved -9 tail section is being retrofitted to the -8.


Yep, have been following the Lightsaber "Engine upgrade" class ( as best I can).

The principle that:
"better engines favour the biggest member of a family best".
Means that such better engines circa 2025 will make the 787-10 a model that every major airline will just have to have.

No ifs.
No buts.

Still learning!
cheers
Billy
 
WIederling
Posts: 8888
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 2:15 pm

Re: Boeing delays 777-8X entry into service

Tue Aug 20, 2019 4:27 pm

Sokes wrote:
I don't understand what you mean by "even 787-9 and A333, having cabin floor sizes equal to better than 0.1%".
Can you expand on that?

A330-300: 63,7 m length
B787-9: 62,8 m length


floor size is "length times width"
Murphy is an optimist
 
Sokes
Posts: 239
Joined: Sat Mar 09, 2019 4:48 pm

Re: Boeing delays 777-8X entry into service

Tue Aug 20, 2019 5:04 pm

WIederling wrote:
Sokes wrote:
I don't understand what you mean by "even 787-9 and A333, having cabin floor sizes equal to better than 0.1%".
Can you expand on that?

A330-300: 63,7 m length
B787-9: 62,8 m length


floor size is "length times width"


Thanks for the formula. I was always better in algebra than geometry. Next time I fly with with an A330 I will try to use the formula myself.
Why can't the world be a little bit more autistic?
 
tealnz
Posts: 575
Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2015 10:47 am

Re: Boeing delays 777-8X entry into service

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:10 am

Obviously the 787 is extremely strong in its market segment – and will be picking up some orders that in a previous generation would have gone to the 77W. The issue is the 778/779. At this point the 779 is not looking like a high volume seller. Meaning it's not going to be easy for Boeing/GE to compete with the 35K on price. And it is a heavy airframe. We can expect the 35K to undercut it on everything expect full-load CASM. Couple that with the delays and right now as a strategy the Boeing plan doesn't look too compelling.

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