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readytotaxi
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Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:03 pm

https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/ ... index.html

UK-based air travel intelligence company OAG has crunched the data to discover the routes and airlines that generate the highest revenue around the world, in both total annual revenue and revenue per hour.

1. British Airways: New York JFK -- London Heathrow (Total revenue: $1,159,126,794 / revenue per hour: $27,159)
2. Qantas Airways: Melbourne -- Sydney (Total revenue: $861,260,322 / revenue per hour: $23,773)
3. Emirates: London Heathrow -- Dubai International (Total revenue: $796,201,645 / revenue per hour: $24,926)

No.2 did make me blink.
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Byrdluvs747
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:30 pm

They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.
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American 767
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:44 pm

Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


That's a good question. I would say in includes all AA/BA JV revenue, because some travelers book a flight on AA metal through BA's website and enter their BA frequent flyer number. It isn't just BA metal, I don't think, it is the total revenue BA makes when their customers book flights through BA.
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Nicknuzzii
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Fri Aug 16, 2019 5:47 pm

Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


Yep and not a Skyteam carrier in sight.
 
UAEflyer
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:05 pm

If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!
 
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hOMSaR
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:20 pm

UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Because their newest airplanes aren't configured in a layout that maximizes the revenue for LHR-JFK?
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mutu
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Fri Aug 16, 2019 7:41 pm

hOMSaR wrote:
UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Because their newest airplanes aren't configured in a layout that maximizes the revenue for LHR-JFK?


Indeed so. The workhorse of the route is the 86J 747 with 4 classes. The 380 cant park at T7 and has to o much Y capacity. The new 350 has no F. The 77W is expected to become the next workhorse on the route with 72J new club suites and 8F in a 4 class configuration. But the switch h will take a few years.

We still have no clues on where the 787-10 is headed and in what configuration.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 3:00 am

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Yep and not a Skyteam carrier in sight.

...which (if these data are to be taken at face value) speaks well in DL's favor, seeing as it's often the highest grossing carrier on the planet.
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 3:03 am

UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Why bother. If you can make it rain without doing so, use the newer aircraft where they are needed.
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JOYA380B747
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 3:06 am

Why is LAX-JFK not the highest earning route within US?
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 5:03 am

JOYA380B747 wrote:
Why is LAX-JFK not the highest earning route within US?

Competition
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jumpjets
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 11:40 am

Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


It seems likely that it is the combined figure for both BA and AA as the article refers to 'more than 600 flights per month' So doing my own bit of crunching the data...

BA currently have 8 flights a day between LHR and JFK [and vice versa] which in a typical 31 day month is 496 trips across the Atlantic, which falls short of the 600+ referred to in the article.

AA have three flights a day between JFK and LHR which gives another 186 trips across the Atlantic

Add them together and you get 682 per month which is in line with the numbers referred to in the article.

Other possibilities are that OAG have inadvertently added together BAs flights from LHR to both JFK and EWR, which would give 620 flights in a 31 day month or taken all BA flights from JFK to London and included the flights to LGW and LCY, which again would give more than 600 flights a month in total.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 11:50 am

jumpjets wrote:
Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


It seems likely that it is the combined figure for both BA and AA as the article refers to 'more than 600 flights per month' So doing my own bit of crunching the data...

BA currently have 8 flights a day between LHR and JFK [and vice versa] which in a typical 31 day month is 496 trips across the Atlantic, which falls short of the 600+ referred to in the article.

AA have three flights a day between JFK and LHR which gives another 186 trips across the Atlantic

Add them together and you get 682 per month which is in line with the numbers referred to in the article.

Other possibilities are that OAG have inadvertently added together BAs flights from LHR to both JFK and EWR, which would give 620 flights in a 31 day month or taken all BA flights from JFK to London and included the flights to LGW and LCY, which again would give more than 600 flights a month in total.


AA has 4 daily flights betweeen JFK and LHR.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 11:51 am

mutu wrote:
hOMSaR wrote:
UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Because their newest airplanes aren't configured in a layout that maximizes the revenue for LHR-JFK?


Indeed so. The workhorse of the route is the 86J 747 with 4 classes. The 380 cant park at T7 and has to o much Y capacity. The new 350 has no F. The 77W is expected to become the next workhorse on the route with 72J new club suites and 8F in a 4 class configuration. But the switch h will take a few years.

We still have no clues on where the 787-10 is headed and in what configuration.


Which is why from the perspective of cabin and seat, AA is the better option than BA on JFK-LHR at the moment, in all cabin classes.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:05 pm

[

AA has 4 daily flights betweeen JFK and LHR.[/quote]

Oops you are of course correct.

That takes the total for a 31 day month up to in excess of 700 flights a day, which makes me wonder if they had aggregated BA and AA why they didn't refer to 'over 700 flights a month'....I guess I will never know, unless the author of the article reads this thread and replies :D
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:22 pm

UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Because their newest airplanes are allocated to routes that benefit the most from having the newest most fuel efficient planes. LHR-JFK is a rather short flight by transoceanic standards. The shorter the flight, the less cost penalty for using an older less efficient plane.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:29 pm

Is that non-stop only or does it include connecting flights?
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:30 pm

flyingclrs727 wrote:
UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Because their newest airplanes are allocated to routes that benefit the most from having the newest most fuel efficient planes. LHR-JFK is a rather short flight by transoceanic standards. The shorter the flight, the less cost penalty for using an older less efficient plane.


I'm glad they don't operate their newest airplanes. Who wants to be stuck in 3-3-3 on a 787?
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:31 pm

UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


The A388 can't fit at T7 or T8 (where BA will move soon). The A35K doesn't have F, and so that's out, while the B789, which does have F, has too few J seats. The B77W does occasionally come to JFK. I do expect the B78X to come to JFK as that's a frame that could fill the role of the B772 and won't have a crew rest area (the B772s being re-deployed where crew rest is needed).

As for AA, it likewise uses its 5-class B77Ws on JFK-LHR.

Outside of oneworld, UA, which relies on O&D, is moving LHR to high-J B763s mostly, while DL and VS (which do have LHR feed via BE) are (for VS) using the first four A35Ks on LHR-JFK as they come in.

Within the USA, the highest-ranking city pairs are NYC-LAX and NYC-SFO...and it shows, as B6 and AA use premium-configured narrow-bodies, UA uses p.s. or internationally-configured planes, and DL only uses internationally-configured planes.
Last edited by aemoreira1981 on Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
lhrsfosyd91
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:45 pm

I'm surprised they haven't decided to send the A350 to EZE or BKK yet, it would be an enormous fuel saver.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:48 pm

lhrsfosyd91 wrote:
I'm surprised they haven't decided to send the A350 to EZE or BKK yet, it would be an enormous fuel saver.


Over time! YYZ and DXB are destinations within a one-day rotation. JFK would have been likely but there is no F.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 12:59 pm

Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


Yes 4 of the routes are OW carriers.
4 of the routes are Star carriers.
5 of the 10 ten routes are starting or terminating at LHR.
Lastly 4 of the routes are domestic routes. The most surprising domestic route being QF's MEL-SYD. Impressive!!

OAG's article is much better than the CNN article in that they take it a few steps further and show top 10 North American routes and to 10 Asia routes.
BA has 3 routes in the top 10 North American routes LHR-JFK/BOS/LAX.
The US3 all cracked the top 10 on their respective LAX-JFK/EWR flights, but the clear winner in terms of revenue is AA by a more than a mile.
UA's SFO-EWR posted some great numbers.
Lastly AF's CDG-JFK is in the top 10 but its revenue is less than half of BA's but that is to be expected considering the differences between London and Paris.

Looking at the OAG report almost every airline in the top 10 North American sections saw their revenue drop on their respective routes in the 2018/2019 year verses 2017/2018 except for DL.
DL's LAX-JFK route saw revenue increase almost a million dollars. Just something I hop AA and especially UA (EWR) are taking note of on this highly competitive route.

revenue.https://www.oag.com/blog/billion-dollar ... i=75733337
 
flybaby
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 1:25 pm

It’s interesting to note that for other carriers besides BA, while there are a lot of departures, the load factors from New York and Newark to LHR are rather abysmal.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 1:34 pm

jayunited wrote:
Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


Yes 4 of the routes are OW carriers.
4 of the routes are Star carriers.
5 of the 10 ten routes are starting or terminating at LHR.
Lastly 4 of the routes are domestic routes. The most surprising domestic route being QF's MEL-SYD. Impressive!!

OAG's article is much better than the CNN article in that they take it a few steps further and show top 10 North American routes and to 10 Asia routes.
BA has 3 routes in the top 10 North American routes LHR-JFK/BOS/LAX.
The US3 all cracked the top 10 on their respective LAX-JFK/EWR flights, but the clear winner in terms of revenue is AA by a more than a mile.
UA's SFO-EWR posted some great numbers.
Lastly AF's CDG-JFK is in the top 10 but its revenue is less than half of BA's but that is to be expected considering the differences between London and Paris.

Looking at the OAG report almost every airline in the top 10 North American sections saw their revenue drop on their respective routes in the 2018/2019 year verses 2017/2018 except for DL.
DL's LAX-JFK route saw revenue increase almost a million dollars. Just something I hop AA and especially UA (EWR) are taking note of on this highly competitive route.

revenue.https://www.oag.com/blog/billion-dollar ... i=75733337


Thank you for sharing that link.

A few things that I find interesting are:
- For the US, 3 of the top 5 are foreign airlines.
- Delta doesn't appear until number 9
- Amsterdam and Frankfurt don't make any list at all - despite being major European hubs
- CDG only makes one list once, from JFK and has less than half the revenue of LHR from JFK
- LHR still dominates
- The vast mega hubs of the ME3 only rank when attached to LHR

It seems to me that perhaps Delta is somewhat underperforming, despite their network out of NYC (NYC dominates the US routes on the global top 10). Also Amsterdam, CDG and Frankfurt as European mega hubs at first glance are underperforming, alongside the Middle East where a lot of activity doesn't seem to be matched by a lot of income. No wonder the airlines still prize LHR.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 2:08 pm

Ryanair01 wrote:
jayunited wrote:
Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


Yes 4 of the routes are OW carriers.
4 of the routes are Star carriers.
5 of the 10 ten routes are starting or terminating at LHR.
Lastly 4 of the routes are domestic routes. The most surprising domestic route being QF's MEL-SYD. Impressive!!

OAG's article is much better than the CNN article in that they take it a few steps further and show top 10 North American routes and to 10 Asia routes.
BA has 3 routes in the top 10 North American routes LHR-JFK/BOS/LAX.
The US3 all cracked the top 10 on their respective LAX-JFK/EWR flights, but the clear winner in terms of revenue is AA by a more than a mile.
UA's SFO-EWR posted some great numbers.
Lastly AF's CDG-JFK is in the top 10 but its revenue is less than half of BA's but that is to be expected considering the differences between London and Paris.

Looking at the OAG report almost every airline in the top 10 North American sections saw their revenue drop on their respective routes in the 2018/2019 year verses 2017/2018 except for DL.
DL's LAX-JFK route saw revenue increase almost a million dollars. Just something I hop AA and especially UA (EWR) are taking note of on this highly competitive route.

revenue.https://www.oag.com/blog/billion-dollar ... i=75733337


Thank you for sharing that link.

A few things that I find interesting are:
- For the US, 3 of the top 5 are foreign airlines.
- Delta doesn't appear until number 9
- Amsterdam and Frankfurt don't make any list at all - despite being major European hubs
- CDG only makes one list once, from JFK and has less than half the revenue of LHR from JFK
- LHR still dominates
- The vast mega hubs of the ME3 only rank when attached to LHR

It seems to me that perhaps Delta is somewhat underperforming, despite their network out of NYC (NYC dominates the US routes on the global top 10). Also Amsterdam, CDG and Frankfurt as European mega hubs at first glance are underperforming, alongside the Middle East where a lot of activity doesn't seem to be matched by a lot of income. No wonder the airlines still prize LHR.

Ryanair, your summary is facinating.

JFK and LHR are critical and valuable hub feed. Neither can accommodate every city pair demand could feed, but they have such huge premium feed, they require specially configured aircraft for the premium trunk routes.

Delta, KLM, LH, EK, QR, and EY are more hubbing airlines. Now FRA is known as a high premium airport, so I am surprised there isn't a route from FRA in the top ten. It could be LH just doesn't offer the same connections LHR does.

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Byrdluvs747
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 2:20 pm

jayunited wrote:
Yes 4 of the routes are OW carriers.


I think your miscounted. The list includes BA, AA, QR, CX, and QF.
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jayunited
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 4:49 pm

Byrdluvs747 wrote:
jayunited wrote:
Yes 4 of the routes are OW carriers.


I think your miscounted. The list includes BA, AA, QR, CX, and QF.


QR is part of OW?? I didn't know QR had joined my apologies you are correct 5 of the top 10 routes are OW.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 4:58 pm

jumpjets wrote:
Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


It seems likely that it is the combined figure for both BA and AA as the article refers to 'more than 600 flights per month' So doing my own bit of crunching the data...

BA currently have 8 flights a day between LHR and JFK [and vice versa] which in a typical 31 day month is 496 trips across the Atlantic, which falls short of the 600+ referred to in the article.

AA have three flights a day between JFK and LHR which gives another 186 trips across the Atlantic

Add them together and you get 682 per month which is in line with the numbers referred to in the article.

Other possibilities are that OAG have inadvertently added together BAs flights from LHR to both JFK and EWR, which would give 620 flights in a 31 day month or taken all BA flights from JFK to London and included the flights to LGW and LCY, which again would give more than 600 flights a month in total.



Did you account for Virgin Atlantic?
 
inkjet7
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 5:21 pm

UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Maybe because they are relatively short so fuel consumption is less important than on longer routes?
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 5:26 pm

JFKIceman wrote:
jumpjets wrote:
Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


It seems likely that it is the combined figure for both BA and AA as the article refers to 'more than 600 flights per month' So doing my own bit of crunching the data...

BA currently have 8 flights a day between LHR and JFK [and vice versa] which in a typical 31 day month is 496 trips across the Atlantic, which falls short of the 600+ referred to in the article.

AA have three flights a day between JFK and LHR which gives another 186 trips across the Atlantic

Add them together and you get 682 per month which is in line with the numbers referred to in the article.

Other possibilities are that OAG have inadvertently added together BAs flights from LHR to both JFK and EWR, which would give 620 flights in a 31 day month or taken all BA flights from JFK to London and included the flights to LGW and LCY, which again would give more than 600 flights a month in total.



Did you account for Virgin Atlantic?


Maybe I am misunderstanding your comment but why would VS be included in BA’s JFK-LHR operating stats? I do believe BA/AA LHR-JFK is included in those operating stats together due to the JV, but VS operates independent of BA.


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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 5:30 pm

Ryanair01 wrote:
- CDG only makes one list once, from JFK and has less than half the revenue of LHR from JFK


AF has a little more than half the scheduled hours BA has yet manages to come as #3 in terms of revenue/hour. Not too bad I'd say.
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 5:41 pm

Not a surprise QF MEL-SYD made the list. The route is flown but 738 and 330 most week days every 15-30mins. I think it will be the perfect route for a 797. If it wasn’t for their reliability I’m sure QF would have kept their 763 - with 36J and 210Y running every 30mins. They great for short haul- but I think the amount of cycles caught up with them in the end. At one point SYD-MEL was the worlds busiest air route, by pax numbers now it’s somewhere in Korea?
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 6:02 pm

smi0006 wrote:
Not a surprise QF MEL-SYD made the list. The route is flown but 738 and 330 most week days every 15-30mins. I think it will be the perfect route for a 797. If it wasn’t for their reliability I’m sure QF would have kept their 763 - with 36J and 210Y running every 30mins. They great for short haul- but I think the amount of cycles caught up with them in the end. At one point SYD-MEL was the worlds busiest air route, by pax numbers now it’s somewhere in Korea?


Really surprised that the Australian government is not planning high speed rail on a route like this. With that much traffic, there’s gotta be an economic case for it. Especially if yields are that high.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 6:52 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
https://edition.cnn.com/travel/article/highest-revenue-airline-routes/index.html

UK-based air travel intelligence company OAG has crunched the data to discover the routes and airlines that generate the highest revenue around the world, in both total annual revenue and revenue per hour.

1. British Airways: New York JFK -- London Heathrow (Total revenue: $1,159,126,794 / revenue per hour: $27,159)
2. Qantas Airways: Melbourne -- Sydney (Total revenue: $861,260,322 / revenue per hour: $23,773)
3. Emirates: London Heathrow -- Dubai International (Total revenue: $796,201,645 / revenue per hour: $24,926)

No.2 did make me blink.


why would that make you blink? They're two big wealthy cities, economically and politically intertwined with no
high speed rail, largely due to new track needed that will cost billions and unlike in places like Spain it would
need to be completely fenced off and not a cheap fence either. We have a problem called Kangaroos and the tend to
move about the place in packs so they jump on the track and get hit at high speed you have a disaster.

There is however good airports and transport to and from the city. And with the longer distances it makes more sense.
 
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 7:39 pm

Ziyulu wrote:
flyingclrs727 wrote:
UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Because their newest airplanes are allocated to routes that benefit the most from having the newest most fuel efficient planes. LHR-JFK is a rather short flight by transoceanic standards. The shorter the flight, the less cost penalty for using an older less efficient plane.


I'm glad they don't operate their newest airplanes. Who wants to be stuck in 3-3-3 on a 787?


I just had that experience and I still cannot believe why they couldn't make that plane a few inches wider...
 
Eiszeit
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:50 pm

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 8:09 pm

lightsaber wrote:
Ryanair01 wrote:
jayunited wrote:

Yes 4 of the routes are OW carriers.
4 of the routes are Star carriers.
5 of the 10 ten routes are starting or terminating at LHR.
Lastly 4 of the routes are domestic routes. The most surprising domestic route being QF's MEL-SYD. Impressive!!

OAG's article is much better than the CNN article in that they take it a few steps further and show top 10 North American routes and to 10 Asia routes.
BA has 3 routes in the top 10 North American routes LHR-JFK/BOS/LAX.
The US3 all cracked the top 10 on their respective LAX-JFK/EWR flights, but the clear winner in terms of revenue is AA by a more than a mile.
UA's SFO-EWR posted some great numbers.
Lastly AF's CDG-JFK is in the top 10 but its revenue is less than half of BA's but that is to be expected considering the differences between London and Paris.

Looking at the OAG report almost every airline in the top 10 North American sections saw their revenue drop on their respective routes in the 2018/2019 year verses 2017/2018 except for DL.
DL's LAX-JFK route saw revenue increase almost a million dollars. Just something I hop AA and especially UA (EWR) are taking note of on this highly competitive route.

revenue.https://www.oag.com/blog/billion-dollar ... i=75733337


Thank you for sharing that link.

A few things that I find interesting are:
- For the US, 3 of the top 5 are foreign airlines.
- Delta doesn't appear until number 9
- Amsterdam and Frankfurt don't make any list at all - despite being major European hubs
- CDG only makes one list once, from JFK and has less than half the revenue of LHR from JFK
- LHR still dominates
- The vast mega hubs of the ME3 only rank when attached to LHR

It seems to me that perhaps Delta is somewhat underperforming, despite their network out of NYC (NYC dominates the US routes on the global top 10). Also Amsterdam, CDG and Frankfurt as European mega hubs at first glance are underperforming, alongside the Middle East where a lot of activity doesn't seem to be matched by a lot of income. No wonder the airlines still prize LHR.

Ryanair, your summary is facinating.

JFK and LHR are critical and valuable hub feed. Neither can accommodate every city pair demand could feed, but they have such huge premium feed, they require specially configured aircraft for the premium trunk routes.

Delta, KLM, LH, EK, QR, and EY are more hubbing airlines. Now FRA is known as a high premium airport, so I am surprised there isn't a route from FRA in the top ten. It could be LH just doesn't offer the same connections LHR does.

Lightsaber


Is there even a route at FRA that has a realy high frequency that is longhaul like LHR-JFK. Frankfurt itself has about 740K inhabitants you can't compare it to world class cities like London or New York. FRA has many routes but none even remotely colse to the prime city pairs.
 
Ryanair01
Posts: 432
Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2013 9:27 pm

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 9:30 pm

Eiszeit wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
Ryanair01 wrote:

Thank you for sharing that link.

A few things that I find interesting are:
- For the US, 3 of the top 5 are foreign airlines.
- Delta doesn't appear until number 9
- Amsterdam and Frankfurt don't make any list at all - despite being major European hubs
- CDG only makes one list once, from JFK and has less than half the revenue of LHR from JFK
- LHR still dominates
- The vast mega hubs of the ME3 only rank when attached to LHR

It seems to me that perhaps Delta is somewhat underperforming, despite their network out of NYC (NYC dominates the US routes on the global top 10). Also Amsterdam, CDG and Frankfurt as European mega hubs at first glance are underperforming, alongside the Middle East where a lot of activity doesn't seem to be matched by a lot of income. No wonder the airlines still prize LHR.

Ryanair, your summary is facinating.

JFK and LHR are critical and valuable hub feed. Neither can accommodate every city pair demand could feed, but they have such huge premium feed, they require specially configured aircraft for the premium trunk routes.

Delta, KLM, LH, EK, QR, and EY are more hubbing airlines. Now FRA is known as a high premium airport, so I am surprised there isn't a route from FRA in the top ten. It could be LH just doesn't offer the same connections LHR does.

Lightsaber


Is there even a route at FRA that has a realy high frequency that is longhaul like LHR-JFK. Frankfurt itself has about 740K inhabitants you can't compare it to world class cities like London or New York. FRA has many routes but none even remotely colse to the prime city pairs.


Come on, Frankfurt is the long-haul prime gateway for Germany, notwithstanding the secondary role of Munich. The German economy is one of the world's most powerful. If Frankfurt Airport were some regional airport then OK, but it's the main gateway to Germany, serves a global financial hub, is the largest base for one of the world's leading airlines and within an hour's drive has well over 10 million residents who are generally pretty wealthy. I know Frankfurt is a little village compared to London and New York, but Frankfurt Airport has a much wider role.
 
Eiszeit
Posts: 13
Joined: Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:50 pm

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 10:08 pm

All right but this thread compares single routes between 2 cities and FRA as much as I like it is not in the same league.
 
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ro1960
Posts: 1161
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:19 am

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 10:14 pm

Lufthansa wrote:
why would that make you blink? They're two big wealthy cities, economically and politically intertwined with no
high speed rail, largely due to new track needed that will cost billions and unlike in places like Spain it would
need to be completely fenced off and not a cheap fence either. We have a problem called Kangaroos and the tend to
move about the place in packs so they jump on the track and get hit at high speed you have a disaster.


Most HSR tracks are fenced off because they need to be in a sterile corridor where any incursion can cause major disruption or an accident. It's not what would make HSR in Australia expensive. HSR is just plain expensive to build (new tracks, new stations, new maintenance centers, etc.). From what I read every government since the 80s has conducted studies that ended up being shelved due to the high state investments needed. Countries that have HSR had major help from their governments. Without that no HSR.
You may like my airport photos:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/aeroports
 
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SeaEagle8
Posts: 159
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2018 8:59 pm

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 10:24 pm

smi0006 wrote:
Not a surprise QF MEL-SYD made the list. The route is flown but 738 and 330 most week days every 15-30mins. I think it will be the perfect route for a 797. If it wasn’t for their reliability I’m sure QF would have kept their 763 - with 36J and 210Y running every 30mins. They great for short haul- but I think the amount of cycles caught up with them in the end. At one point SYD-MEL was the worlds busiest air route, by pax numbers now it’s somewhere in Korea?


Exactly. People on here do not realise the volume of flights and seats on the SYD-MEL route everyday. Also the high revenue per hour is right near the top.

Seoul-Jeju is number one for passengers. SYD-MEL is number two.
NSW based avgeek
 
moa999
Posts: 541
Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2018 6:37 am

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 11:05 pm

On SYD-MEL, QF has 37 - 45 flights per day in each direction, mostly 738s but some 332s (all scheduled, no US style shuttle)

SYD-MEL is 450m/720km.. remember Australia is big.
A bit longer than LHR-FRA which also doesn't have any direct high speed rail, best is a change at Brussels but still 5+ hours.

More importantly there is almost no population in between which makes the economics of dedicated high speed rail far more difficult.
While SYD and MEL are 5+ million, the next biggest (and slightly off a direct route) is Canberra at under 500k.

Plus a realistic route has you going inland which means crossing mountain ranges twice.
 
Ziyulu
Posts: 631
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:35 am

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sat Aug 17, 2019 11:13 pm

MalevA346 wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:
flyingclrs727 wrote:

Because their newest airplanes are allocated to routes that benefit the most from having the newest most fuel efficient planes. LHR-JFK is a rather short flight by transoceanic standards. The shorter the flight, the less cost penalty for using an older less efficient plane.


I'm glad they don't operate their newest airplanes. Who wants to be stuck in 3-3-3 on a 787?


I just had that experience and I still cannot believe why they couldn't make that plane a few inches wider...


If it was 10 inches wider, they will probably try to squeeze in another seat.
 
User avatar
flyingclrs727
Posts: 2415
Joined: Thu Apr 19, 2007 7:44 am

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sun Aug 18, 2019 12:53 am

Ziyulu wrote:
MalevA346 wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:

I'm glad they don't operate their newest airplanes. Who wants to be stuck in 3-3-3 on a 787?


I just had that experience and I still cannot believe why they couldn't make that plane a few inches wider...


If it was 10 inches wider, they will probably try to squeeze in another seat.


I'm pretty sure the design criterion was to make it just enough wider than an A330 that 17.0" seats could be installed in a 3-3-3 configuration. Then the Boeing propaganda machine marketed it as an 8 abreast aircraft. I think they should have designed it so at least 17.5" seats could be installed 3-3-3. That would have been just 4.5".
 
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aemoreira1981
Posts: 2881
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Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sun Aug 18, 2019 1:11 am

jayunited wrote:
Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


Yes 4 of the routes are OW carriers.
4 of the routes are Star carriers.
5 of the 10 ten routes are starting or terminating at LHR.
Lastly 4 of the routes are domestic routes. The most surprising domestic route being QF's MEL-SYD. Impressive!!

OAG's article is much better than the CNN article in that they take it a few steps further and show top 10 North American routes and to 10 Asia routes.
BA has 3 routes in the top 10 North American routes LHR-JFK/BOS/LAX.
The US3 all cracked the top 10 on their respective LAX-JFK/EWR flights, but the clear winner in terms of revenue is AA by a more than a mile.
UA's SFO-EWR posted some great numbers.
Lastly AF's CDG-JFK is in the top 10 but its revenue is less than half of BA's but that is to be expected considering the differences between London and Paris.

Looking at the OAG report almost every airline in the top 10 North American sections saw their revenue drop on their respective routes in the 2018/2019 year verses 2017/2018 except for DL.
DL's LAX-JFK route saw revenue increase almost a million dollars. Just something I hop AA and especially UA (EWR) are taking note of on this highly competitive route.

revenue.https://www.oag.com/blog/billion-dollar ... i=75733337


Not surprised by LAX-JFK. I expect that when there are at least 10 frames in, to keep with the B78X product on UA, DL might deploy the A339 on LAX-JFK, unless there have been A333s reconfigured to the A339 product. If AA's B789s had first class, I would say that perhaps AA should deploy those on LAX-JFK, but AA can charge a premium on having so few seats, but so many premium seats, on its JFK-based A321 subfleet (these A321s have first class, and the only other AA model with first class is the B77W).
 
PhilMcCrackin
Posts: 135
Joined: Mon Jun 24, 2019 11:54 pm

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sun Aug 18, 2019 1:19 am

I wonder where LAX-LHR falls on there, it's gotta be up there. There's, what, six airlines that fly it?
 
APYu
Posts: 478
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 10:23 pm

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sun Aug 18, 2019 7:26 am

aemoreira1981 wrote:
UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


The A388 can't fit at T7 or T8 (where BA will move soon). The A35K doesn't have F, and so that's out, while the B789, which does have F, has too few J seats. The B77W does occasionally come to JFK. I do expect the B78X to come to JFK as that's a frame that could fill the role of the B772 and won't have a crew rest area (the B772s being re-deployed where crew rest is needed).
.

Most of the BA 772s which operate to JFK DONT have crew rest areas anyway. (Crew rest areas are only on the RR powered 777s, JFK sees largely the GE powered aircraft).
We'd like to welcome in particular our Executive Club members and those joining us from our Oneworld alliance partners.
 
WPvsMW
Posts: 2084
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:30 pm

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sun Aug 18, 2019 8:11 am

smi0006 wrote:
At one point SYD-MEL was the worlds busiest air route, by pax numbers now it’s somewhere in Korea?


GMP/CJU

(To thwart attacks for using "obscure" airport codes, Seoul Gimpo / Jeju. Query: obscure... if it's the busiest?)
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 197
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:57 pm

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sun Aug 18, 2019 1:13 pm

jayunited wrote:
Byrdluvs747 wrote:
They didn't clearly indicate whether the JFK-LHR revenue was purely from BA metal or does it include all AA/BA JV revenue on the route.

I also found it interesting that half of the top 10 list are OW carriers.


Yes 4 of the routes are OW carriers.
4 of the routes are Star carriers.
5 of the 10 ten routes are starting or terminating at LHR.
Lastly 4 of the routes are domestic routes. The most surprising domestic route being QF's MEL-SYD. Impressive!!

OAG's article is much better than the CNN article in that they take it a few steps further and show top 10 North American routes and to 10 Asia routes.
BA has 3 routes in the top 10 North American routes LHR-JFK/BOS/LAX.
The US3 all cracked the top 10 on their respective LAX-JFK/EWR flights, but the clear winner in terms of revenue is AA by a more than a mile.
UA's SFO-EWR posted some great numbers.
Lastly AF's CDG-JFK is in the top 10 but its revenue is less than half of BA's but that is to be expected considering the differences between London and Paris.

Looking at the OAG report almost every airline in the top 10 North American sections saw their revenue drop on their respective routes in the 2018/2019 year verses 2017/2018 except for DL.
DL's LAX-JFK route saw revenue increase almost a million dollars. Just something I hop AA and especially UA (EWR) are taking note of on this highly competitive route.

revenue.https://www.oag.com/blog/billion-dollar ... i=75733337


UA's SFO-EWR was almost $30 million more profitable than AA's LAX-JFK
 
jumbojet
Posts: 2881
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sun Aug 18, 2019 1:26 pm

well, LHR-JFK might get knocked off its high perch as the only billion dollar route once Blue starts JFK to presumably, Heathrow. Certain Blue fans will have you believe that Blue is going to go gangbusters on this route and turn the market on JFK-LHR upside down and knock everyone's profits down.
 
tvh
Posts: 155
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 7:41 am

Re: Heathrow-JFK is the world's only billion-dollar airline route.

Sun Aug 18, 2019 1:37 pm

Antarius wrote:
UAEflyer wrote:
If BA’s most lucrative route is JFK, why the don’t operate their newest airplanes on it !!


Why bother. If you can make it rain without doing so, use the newer aircraft where they are needed.


Bear in mind revenue is not profit.

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