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Boston757
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American Airlines Boston LHR, CDG and other Europe

Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:02 pm

I just learned that American still holds their BOS-LHR route authority. They have been talking about just waiting on the 321-neo st resume the route. If this is the case could they possibly see a restart of Paris,Dublin and Shannon. Who knows,maybe season service...they love that.
 
catiii
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:14 pm

BOS is a duopoly between B6 and DL. Could they use those LHR slots in the context of an immunized JV with BA though? Yes. Not sure anything beyond that makes sense.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:17 pm

Boston757 wrote:
I just learned that AAL still holds the BOS_LHR route authority. The talk is that they are waiting for the 321 neo to resume service at some point.. Not sure if they would be interested in possibly restarting , Paris, Dublin and Shannon as well. Who knows back to seasonal service.


The BOS-LHR slot AA has is being used by BA. Highly unlikely AA will restart any TATL service from BOS. AA is focused on growth from its hubs and where it has the least amount of competition, particularly from DFW and CLT, the two largest. AA's BOS footprint has shrunk substantially long before the AA/US merger and the legacy US footprint there has also diminished.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:19 pm

Cointrin330 wrote:
Boston757 wrote:
I just learned that AAL still holds the BOS_LHR route authority. The talk is that they are waiting for the 321 neo to resume service at some point.. Not sure if they would be interested in possibly restarting , Paris, Dublin and Shannon as well. Who knows back to seasonal service.


The BOS-LHR slot AA has is being used by BA. The two airlines have a JV on US-LHR flights and will use each other's slots at different times. AA has done this on JFK-LHR as well, ceding one of the 4 daily to BA for a time while the 772s were being reconfigured to remove First Class. Highly unlikely AA will restart any TATL service from BOS. AA is focused on growth from its hubs and where it has the least amount of competition, particularly from DFW and CLT, the two largest. AA's BOS footprint has shrunk substantially long before the AA/US merger and the legacy US footprint there has also diminished.
 
MAH4546
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:31 pm

There are no route authorities between the U.S. and the U.K. (or the EU for that matter). American is allowed to operate any route between the U.S. and U.K, just like any U.S. or U.K. airline can.
a.
 
iyerhari
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 9:36 pm

Cointrin330 wrote:
Boston757 wrote:
I just learned that AAL still holds the BOS_LHR route authority. The talk is that they are waiting for the 321 neo to resume service at some point.. Not sure if they would be interested in possibly restarting , Paris, Dublin and Shannon as well. Who knows back to seasonal service.


The BOS-LHR slot AA has is being used by BA. Highly unlikely AA will restart any TATL service from BOS. AA is focused on growth from its hubs and where it has the least amount of competition, particularly from DFW and CLT, the two largest. AA's BOS footprint has shrunk substantially long before the AA/US merger and the legacy US footprint there has also diminished.

PHL is AA's TATL service. There are sprinkled seasonal routes from ORD to Europe. BOS is no longer the focus for AA outside of hubs.
 
EK77WNH
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 10:28 pm

UA and AA are token players at Logan nowadays, and I never thought I’d see myself type that. DL and B6 have grown up around them. Across my many years of business flying, I never ‘invested’ in one carrier’s FF program until two years ago when I decided that JetBlue would achieve a critical mass at Logan that would make the whole thing worthwhile. And thus far I’ve accumulated about the equivalent of a dozen flights between Boston and Charleston...a place we will probably call our retirement home.
Next Trip:
JAL 7-8 BOS-NRT-BOS, 787-9
September
 
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FlyRow
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 10:34 pm

MAH4546 wrote:
There are no route authorities between the U.S. and the U.K. (or the EU for that matter). American is allowed to operate any route between the U.S. and U.K, just like any U.S. or U.K. airline can.


Very weird ramblings by the OP indeed. Everyone can open a route under the open-skies

The EU–US Open Skies Agreement is an open skies air transport agreement between the European Union (EU) and the United States. The agreement allows any airline of the European Union and any airline of the United States to fly between any point in the European Union and any point in the United States.
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BostonBeau
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 10:35 pm

American paid TWA $$$ for the BOS-LHR route, and almost immediately began downsizing (777->A300->757) even before the JV with British Airways came about. It seems strange that of the 8 flights between Boston and London (LHR and LGW) each day, only ONE of them is operated by a US Carrier (DL).
 
Brickell305
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 10:48 pm

BostonBeau wrote:
American paid TWA $$$ for the BOS-LHR route, and almost immediately began downsizing (777->A300->757) even before the JV with British Airways came about. It seems strange that of the 8 flights between Boston and London (LHR and LGW) each day, only ONE of them is operated by a US Carrier (DL).

Why is that strange? Many transatlantic routes are Euro carrier dominated?
 
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FlyRow
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:12 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
BostonBeau wrote:
American paid TWA $$$ for the BOS-LHR route, and almost immediately began downsizing (777->A300->757) even before the JV with British Airways came about. It seems strange that of the 8 flights between Boston and London (LHR and LGW) each day, only ONE of them is operated by a US Carrier (DL).

Why is that strange? Many transatlantic routes are Euro carrier dominated?


Depends, if a JV is in operation it doens't matter at all. No case of domination.
Look at a AMS with tons of Delta planes going to the US, many AMS fligths are Delta-operated, but metal neutral.
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OzarkD9S
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:13 pm

Paradigms change. When AA bought Business Express it looked as if AA was going to be the big cheese in BOS. And for a while they may have been though US was probably bigger, memory fades. Post 9/11 AA changed to their "Conerstone Strategy" of NYC, MIA, ORD, DFW and LAX with STL thrown in for a brief period. BOS along with NYC has had a significant priority change post US merger, and STL was long gone by then. AA "could" mount a challenge in BOS but the current strategy is almost a sole focus on their hubs and whatever they consider focus markets. Why battle for #3 in BOS or #4 in NYC when you almost own PHL and to an extent DCA. I consider it a fair enough trade.
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ABEguy
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:40 pm

iyerhari wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:
Boston757 wrote:
I just learned that AAL still holds the BOS_LHR route authority. The talk is that they are waiting for the 321 neo to resume service at some point.. Not sure if they would be interested in possibly restarting , Paris, Dublin and Shannon as well. Who knows back to seasonal service.


The BOS-LHR slot AA has is being used by BA. Highly unlikely AA will restart any TATL service from BOS. AA is focused on growth from its hubs and where it has the least amount of competition, particularly from DFW and CLT, the two largest. AA's BOS footprint has shrunk substantially long before the AA/US merger and the legacy US footprint there has also diminished.

PHL is AA's TATL service. There are sprinkled seasonal routes from ORD to Europe. BOS is no longer the focus for AA outside of hubs.


Of course there’s also JFK with 4x daily to LHR. MXP, CDG, MAD, BCN, and a seasonal FCO. Certainly not a gateway but does get some connections from the west coast and smaller rj served markets like CMH
 
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Tue Aug 20, 2019 11:51 pm

Cointrin330 wrote:
Boston757 wrote:
I just learned that AAL still holds the BOS_LHR route authority. The talk is that they are waiting for the 321 neo to resume service at some point.. Not sure if they would be interested in possibly restarting , Paris, Dublin and Shannon as well. Who knows back to seasonal service.


The BOS-LHR slot AA has is being used by BA. Highly unlikely AA will restart any TATL service from BOS. AA is focused on growth from its hubs and where it has the least amount of competition, particularly from DFW and CLT, the two largest.


CLT doesn't have a lot of O&D traffic so, if AA adds to CLT it's chasing connections. Lots of airport pairs require people to connect somewhere.
 
1ffb2002
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:07 am

TWA used to fly a wide body (747) every day BOS to LHR during the summer peak in late 1980s before the sale to American. I think we had an overlay some summers. Usually had great loads.
 
USAirALB
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:17 am

Was AA ever 3 daily on BOS-LHR?

I recall an AM daylight 777 and a PM 777 service but can’t recall if there was a third service in the evening, maybe on a 763.

BOS-CDG was at one point year round on a 763 or supposed to be year round, but eventually became seasonal (maybe after 9/11?).

They did a couple of other routes on 757s to Europe way back when (MAN I think was one of them) with the F class cabin sold as Y with seats going to Full fare Y pax and Elites.
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VS11
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:17 am

I can easily see AA deploying A321T from BOS,yes, the ones with lie-flat first class, to LHR, and to the west coast.
 
B752OS
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:33 am

There is no need for American to start Boston to Heathrow - their partner British Airways flies the route year round, 3-4 daily. They also have another partner in Iberia flying Boston to Madrid year round. So there's plenty of one-stop options, or you can easily connect through Philadelphia. Massport just finished up the terminal B expansion so they now have really nice facilities in Boston. Despite no international service by American in Boston, OneWorld is still very well represented as Cathay Pacific, Japan Airlines, Iberia, British Airways, Qatar and LATAM all serve Boston year round, non-stop.
 
Kno
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:42 am

BostonBeau wrote:
American paid TWA $$$ for the BOS-LHR route, and almost immediately began downsizing (777->A300->757) even before the JV with British Airways came about. It seems strange that of the 8 flights between Boston and London (LHR and LGW) each day, only ONE of them is operated by a US Carrier (DL).


I’m pretty certain the a300 became a 777 not the other way around.
 
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gatibosgru
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:42 am

VS11 wrote:
I can easily see AA deploying A321T from BOS,yes, the ones with lie-flat first class, to LHR, and to the west coast.


Does the A321T have the legs for BOS-LON? I'd imagine that'd be easy to do with either the A321NT or A321XLR
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VS11
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:59 am

gatibosgru wrote:
VS11 wrote:
I can easily see AA deploying A321T from BOS,yes, the ones with lie-flat first class, to LHR, and to the west coast.


Does the A321T have the legs for BOS-LON? I'd imagine that'd be easy to do with either the A321NT or A321XLR


I meant it as a configuration. I am sure they can find a version of the 321 to do the job. Beef up the front of the cabin, a couple of rows of PE and the rest economy. It is a six hour flight with low operational cost. I have always thought that the 239 BA rotation is too big anyway.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:18 am

1ffb2002 wrote:
TWA used to fly a wide body (747) every day BOS to LHR during the summer peak in late 1980s before the sale to American. I think we had an overlay some summers. Usually had great loads.


Remember, at the time, traffic was smaller systemwide, and there was no VS on the route and one or two BA flights only. Don't even think Pan Am flew BOS-LHR.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:20 am

VS11 wrote:
I can easily see AA deploying A321T from BOS,yes, the ones with lie-flat first class, to LHR, and to the west coast.


Don't think so. There are 17 A321T's in the fleet, and no more on order. They are all allocated from JFK to LAX (11 daily at peak) and JFK-SFO (5 daily at peak). The A321T was pulled from the one daily BOS-LAX flight that had it and as others have stated here already, BOS is not a major factor in AA's route network and in particular, across the Atlantic. They have PHL for that and to a MUCH lesser extent, JFK. B6 ate American's lunch at BOS a long time ago, and DL is about to have what's left of AA at BOS for dessert.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:22 am

USAirALB wrote:
Was AA ever 3 daily on BOS-LHR?

I recall an AM daylight 777 and a PM 777 service but can’t recall if there was a third service in the evening, maybe on a 763.

BOS-CDG was at one point year round on a 763 or supposed to be year round, but eventually became seasonal (maybe after 9/11?).

They did a couple of other routes on 757s to Europe way back when (MAN I think was one of them) with the F class cabin sold as Y with seats going to Full fare Y pax and Elites.


BOS-DUB was flown briefly on a domestic configured 757.
 
VS11
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:33 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
VS11 wrote:
I can easily see AA deploying A321T from BOS,yes, the ones with lie-flat first class, to LHR, and to the west coast.


Don't think so. There are 17 A321T's in the fleet, and no more on order. They are all allocated from JFK to LAX (11 daily at peak) and JFK-SFO (5 daily at peak). The A321T was pulled from the one daily BOS-LAX flight that had it and as others have stated here already, BOS is not a major factor in AA's route network and in particular, across the Atlantic. They have PHL for that and to a MUCH lesser extent, JFK. B6 ate American's lunch at BOS a long time ago, and DL is about to have what's left of AA at BOS for dessert.


I think they have enough new 321s coming in the next couple of years. While Boston-London is definitely NOT underserved by AA/BA, as part of a competitive response to B6 and DL/VS, AA can offer more frequency for their premium travelers without too much unnecessary economy capacity. AA has a lot of business frequent flyers and Boston hasn’t looked more affluent than now. Besides, in the case of a later departure, they can better utilize the aircraft instead of being parked overnight.
 
USAirALB
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:58 am

AA just this past year attempted putting the 321Ts on BOS-LAX and it didn’t work.
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NYCAAer
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 2:24 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
1ffb2002 wrote:
TWA used to fly a wide body (747) every day BOS to LHR during the summer peak in late 1980s before the sale to American. I think we had an overlay some summers. Usually had great loads.


Remember, at the time, traffic was smaller systemwide, and there was no VS on the route and one or two BA flights only. Don't even think Pan Am flew BOS-LHR.


Pan Am flew BOS-LHR in the 1960s and then there was some type of exchange where they dropped the route and started IAD-LHR instead. I’m not sure of the specifics, it was before my time.
 
VS11
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 2:30 am

USAirALB wrote:
AA just this past year attempted putting the 321Ts on BOS-LAX and it didn’t work.


This is interesting. Any insight why? I knew the 321T were showing up in Boston occasionally but didn't think it was part of a consistent offering.
 
styles9002
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 2:49 am

Cointrin330 wrote:

BOS-DUB was flown briefly on a domestic configured 757.


AA never operated BOS-DUB flights; they did fly BOS-SNN with the 752 in 2005 & 2006. AA also operated BOS-MAN for a period of time as well.
It is what it is.
 
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:06 am

VS11 wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
AA just this past year attempted putting the 321Ts on BOS-LAX and it didn’t work.


This is interesting. Any insight why? I knew the 321T were showing up in Boston occasionally but didn't think it was part of a consistent offering.


Was it sold as "Three-class" like the JFK-LAX/SFO flights are or was it sold as "Two-class" like what they recently did on the LAX-MIA flight by adding one A321T?
Because what I am thinking is there are a lot more business travelers in New York flying American to the West Coast than there are in Boston, the majority of Boston business people will choose to fly either Jet Blue or Delta, or United if they go specifically to SFO, so it is understandable why not many business people bought a C Class ticket on a BOS-LAX flight with American. Sure in the NYC area there is also Delta, Jet Blue and United, but my point is American still makes more money on Premium heavy routes out of JFK then they would do out of BOS.
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dank
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:29 am

I flew an aa 321t from bos to jfk a little over a year ago. I guess as part of the lax rotation? Not bad for such a short flight :). F seats on a J ticket (bos-jfk-eze). Not sure whether the business seats are sold as y (the 2x2 flat seats)
 
HPAEAA
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:39 am

dank wrote:
I flew an aa 321t from bos to jfk a little over a year ago. I guess as part of the lax rotation? Not bad for such a short flight :). F seats on a J ticket (bos-jfk-eze). Not sure whether the business seats are sold as y (the 2x2 flat seats)

The a321T was scheduled as a jfk-BOS rotation for some time, it was only 1x-2x daily iirc (I think it was sold as 3 class), recently aa tried adding BOS-LAX rotations 1-2x daily sold in the 3 class config but that was quickly ended.
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gatibosgru
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:47 am

dank wrote:
I flew an aa 321t from bos to jfk a little over a year ago. I guess as part of the lax rotation? Not bad for such a short flight :). F seats on a J ticket (bos-jfk-eze). Not sure whether the business seats are sold as y (the 2x2 flat seats)


I flew BOS-JFK-GRU a few years ago in Y and was able to select the J seats free of charge, but I imagine of they were in rotation nowadays it wouldn't be that way.
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CarbonFibre
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHR, CDG and other Europe

Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:17 am

AA did an LHR-BRU service a few years ago. Can anyone remember where in the US it originated from and returned to?
 
Cointrin330
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 11:14 am

styles9002 wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:

BOS-DUB was flown briefly on a domestic configured 757.


AA never operated BOS-DUB flights; they did fly BOS-SNN with the 752 in 2005 & 2006. AA also operated BOS-MAN for a period of time as well.


Correct, my mistake.
 
ilovepabst
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:06 pm

VS11 wrote:
I can easily see AA deploying A321T from BOS,yes, the ones with lie-flat first class, to LHR, and to the west coast.

321T is non ETOPS so not going to happen
 
tphuang
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:14 pm

VS11 wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
AA just this past year attempted putting the 321Ts on BOS-LAX and it didn’t work.


This is interesting. Any insight why? I knew the 321T were showing up in Boston occasionally but didn't think it was part of a consistent offering.

pretty simple. If you go to FT's thread on this, you will see how easy it was to get free upgrades and op-ups to F. Not exactly good for the bottom line of the airline. It was just bleeding so much money that they couldn't even last 6 months.
 
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:29 pm

FlyRow wrote:
MAH4546 wrote:
There are no route authorities between the U.S. and the U.K. (or the EU for that matter). American is allowed to operate any route between the U.S. and U.K, just like any U.S. or U.K. airline can.


Very weird ramblings by the OP indeed. Everyone can open a route under the open-skies

The EU–US Open Skies Agreement is an open skies air transport agreement between the European Union (EU) and the United States. The agreement allows any airline of the European Union and any airline of the United States to fly between any point in the European Union and any point in the United States.


When you cannot obtain slots to fly into any airport, having the ability to open routes is meaningless if you have nowhere to land.
 
Boston757
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHR, CDG and other Europe

Wed Aug 21, 2019 12:50 pm

321T is for 3 class real transcons. Currently using on BOS-LAX. This aircraft is not OW, but that can change. However, lie flat seats on a 2class configuration 321-neo definitely is workable.
 
incitatus
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:21 pm

EK77WNH wrote:
UA and AA are token players at Logan nowadays, and I never thought I’d see myself type that. DL and B6 have grown up around them. .....


Maybe you should not have typed that. AA has about 100 flights per day at BOS while DL has about 130. AA flies larger aircraft. DL has a much larger set of destinations, but a lot of them are 1 x daily.
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 1:33 pm

NYCAAer wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:
1ffb2002 wrote:
TWA used to fly a wide body (747) every day BOS to LHR during the summer peak in late 1980s before the sale to American. I think we had an overlay some summers. Usually had great loads.


Remember, at the time, traffic was smaller systemwide, and there was no VS on the route and one or two BA flights only. Don't even think Pan Am flew BOS-LHR.


Pan Am flew BOS-LHR in the 1960s and then there was some type of exchange where they dropped the route and started IAD-LHR instead. I’m not sure of the specifics, it was before my time.


Both PA and TWA had BOS-LHR authority prior to Bermuda II.

In the 1960s and 1970s, PA flew MSP-DTW-BOS-LHR as part of an interchange with NW. NW flew MSP-DTW, and PA flew DTW-BOS-LHR, with no change of aircraft. In 1976, PA was given local traffic rights on DTW-BOS; this was the first route PA was allowed to carry local passengers on in the 48 state US mainland.

The Bermuda II agreement in 1977 said all routes to the US could be served by either PA or TWA, but not both, with the exception of JFK and either BOS or LAX. The CAB gave Pan Am a choice between BOS-LHR or LAX-LHR, and PA chose to suspend BOS and serve LAX.

The US and Great Britain subsequently agreed to allow a second US carrier to fly from BOS to London, but that carrier had to serve LGW, not LHR. BOS-LGW was awarded to NW.
 
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Re: American Airlines Boston LHR, CDG and other Europe

Wed Aug 21, 2019 2:47 pm

CarbonFibre wrote:
AA did an LHR-BRU service a few years ago. Can anyone remember where in the US it originated from and returned to?


Yes, absolutely. It wasn't even a code share with BA, it was on AA's own metal believe it or not! This was ten years ago, when at that time AA had a BOS-LHR flight on its own metal and it continued to BRU. It was a 767. Back in 2009, I flew JFK-BRU on a 777 connecting on a 767 to BRU as AA 108. The flight was quite empty. The beverage service was water and orange juice only. "Enjoy this short flight to Brussels" the F/A said. But, of course, AA wouldn't sell you a ticket just to fly LHR-BRU, your ticket had to originate or arrive in the United States.
Ben Soriano
 
USAirALB
Posts: 2333
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: American Airlines Boston LHR, CDG and other Europe

Wed Aug 21, 2019 3:09 pm

Not Europe but way back when, AA had applied for BOS-NRT with an MD-11.
RJ85, F70, E135, E140, E145, E70, E75, E90, CR2, CR7, CR9, 717, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 744ER, 752, 753, 762, 772, 77E, 77W, 789, 319, 320, 321, 332, 333, 343, 359, 388
 
iyerhari
Posts: 1092
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:25 pm

Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 4:57 pm

incitatus wrote:
EK77WNH wrote:
UA and AA are token players at Logan nowadays, and I never thought I’d see myself type that. DL and B6 have grown up around them. .....


Maybe you should not have typed that. AA has about 100 flights per day at BOS while DL has about 130. AA flies larger aircraft. DL has a much larger set of destinations, but a lot of them are 1 x daily.

Ditto. AA and UA will focus on their core hubs and the hubs are very large cities where there is adequate demand. I remember seeing a thread - AA at BOS has more flights than AA at JFK at this time. The chances of AA to start a non-hub destination from BOS sounds remote at this time. It's way too cost competitive for AA to land and bleed - they are happy for B6 and DL to duck it out. AA has clearly indicated that PHL is their TATL hub. For the O&D rich destinations, they will rely on JFK. For DL, BOS is their secondary TATL market and that I believe is their strategy based on all the latest adds.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 26254
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

Re: American Airlines Boston LHR, CDG and other Europe

Wed Aug 21, 2019 5:17 pm

Boston757 wrote:
321T is for 3 class real transcons. Currently using on BOS-LAX. This aircraft is not OW, but that can change. However, lie flat seats on a 2class configuration 321-neo definitely is workable.


Key word is currently. The service ends September 4th.
a.
 
TWFlyGuy
Posts: 427
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:10 pm

Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 5:48 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:
Boston757 wrote:
I just learned that AAL still holds the BOS_LHR route authority. The talk is that they are waiting for the 321 neo to resume service at some point.. Not sure if they would be interested in possibly restarting , Paris, Dublin and Shannon as well. Who knows back to seasonal service.


The BOS-LHR slot AA has is being used by BA. Highly unlikely AA will restart any TATL service from BOS. AA is focused on growth from its hubs and where it has the least amount of competition, particularly from DFW and CLT, the two largest.


CLT doesn't have a lot of O&D traffic so, if AA adds to CLT it's chasing connections. Lots of airport pairs require people to connect somewhere.


Yes it is a smaller city that has less local traffic, and as a hub, CLT does have a higher percentage of connections in general, however it's an extremely low cost hub to operate making those connecting revenues stronger than they might be elsewhere. In addition, AA manages the capacity very effectively to maximize the local/connecting percentage of any given flight which helps as well. CLT also happens to be one of the highest fare cities in America, similar to what CVG was for DL which helps make that smaller base outpunch its weight class. Lastly, as a fast growing city with a strong corporate base, so that aspect is shrinking.
 
Cointrin330
Posts: 2077
Joined: Sat Jul 16, 2016 12:23 pm

Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 7:44 pm

TWFlyGuy wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:

The BOS-LHR slot AA has is being used by BA. Highly unlikely AA will restart any TATL service from BOS. AA is focused on growth from its hubs and where it has the least amount of competition, particularly from DFW and CLT, the two largest.


CLT doesn't have a lot of O&D traffic so, if AA adds to CLT it's chasing connections. Lots of airport pairs require people to connect somewhere.


Yes it is a smaller city that has less local traffic, and as a hub, CLT does have a higher percentage of connections in general, however it's an extremely low cost hub to operate making those connecting revenues stronger than they might be elsewhere. In addition, AA manages the capacity very effectively to maximize the local/connecting percentage of any given flight which helps as well. CLT also happens to be one of the highest fare cities in America, similar to what CVG was for DL which helps make that smaller base outpunch its weight class. Lastly, as a fast growing city with a strong corporate base, so that aspect is shrinking.


CLT: Land is cheap, it is a mid-sized city, and labor costs are lower than they are in other AA hub markets. AA has limited competition at CLT, controls better than 60% of the traffic, and therefore thrives there. Fares are higher there because AA has essentially a near monopoly.
 
jumbojet
Posts: 2957
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 3:01 am

Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 8:53 pm

incitatus wrote:
EK77WNH wrote:
UA and AA are token players at Logan nowadays, and I never thought I’d see myself type that. DL and B6 have grown up around them. .....


Maybe you should not have typed that. AA has about 100 flights per day at BOS while DL has about 130. AA flies larger aircraft. DL has a much larger set of destinations, but a lot of them are 1 x daily.



Delta is Boston's #1 global carrier. DL and its partners offer the most international seats ex BOS with flights covering 18 international destinations. No other airline at BOS can match that.
 
tphuang
Posts: 5354
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Wed Aug 21, 2019 9:09 pm

jumbojet wrote:
incitatus wrote:
EK77WNH wrote:
UA and AA are token players at Logan nowadays, and I never thought I’d see myself type that. DL and B6 have grown up around them. .....


Maybe you should not have typed that. AA has about 100 flights per day at BOS while DL has about 130. AA flies larger aircraft. DL has a much larger set of destinations, but a lot of them are 1 x daily.



Delta is Boston's #1 global carrier. DL and its partners offer the most international seats ex BOS with flights covering 18 international destinations. No other airline at BOS can match that.

That still doesn't take away the fact that AA is about the same size as DL domestically and have much stronger schedule to major business markets out of BOS while also dominate the largest international TATL and TPAC market out of BOS. But of course, those summer seasonal flights to MAN/EDI/LIS is where it's at.
 
Cunard
Posts: 2510
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2016 6:45 pm

Re: American Airlines Boston LHr, CDG and other Europe.

Thu Aug 22, 2019 12:25 am

WA707atMSP wrote:
NYCAAer wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:

Remember, at the time, traffic was smaller systemwide, and there was no VS on the route and one or two BA flights only. Don't even think Pan Am flew BOS-LHR.


Pan Am flew BOS-LHR in the 1960s and then there was some type of exchange where they dropped the route and started IAD-LHR instead. I’m not sure of the specifics, it was before my time.


Both PA and TWA had BOS-LHR authority prior to Bermuda II.

In the 1960s and 1970s, PA flew MSP-DTW-BOS-LHR as part of an interchange with NW. NW flew MSP-DTW, and PA flew DTW-BOS-LHR, with no change of aircraft. In 1976, PA was given local traffic rights on DTW-BOS; this was the first route PA was allowed to carry local passengers on in the 48 state US mainland.

The Bermuda II agreement in 1977 said all routes to the US could be served by either PA or TWA, but not both, with the exception of JFK and either BOS or LAX. The CAB gave Pan Am a choice between BOS-LHR or LAX-LHR, and PA chose to suspend BOS and serve LAX.

The US and Great Britain subsequently agreed to allow a second US carrier to fly from BOS to London, but that carrier had to serve LGW, not LHR. BOS-LGW was awarded to NW.


Well done for an excellent post and your correct with everything that you have wrote but if I could just add some detail to a slight error regarding LGW-BOS.

In 1978 World Airways were operating regular ABC flights between BOS and LGW almost on a daily basis with a mix of DC8-63 and DC10-30. World Airways applied to the DOT in 1979 for a scheduled license and to be awarded route authority for BOS to LGW

World Airways we're initially awarded a 12 month temporary route authority to fly from BOS to LGW which commenced in May 1980.

Routing was OAK-BOS-LGW-FRA six times weekly with DC10-30.

Northwest Orient we're subsequently awarded route authority for BOS to LGW which commenced on 01 June 1981.

Routing was DTW-BOS-LGW-FRA daily with B742.

World Airways we're subsequently awarded route authority for BWI to LGW which commenced in May 1982.

Routing was OAK-BWI-LGW-FRA six times weekly with DC10-30.

Northwest later changed BOS to LGW to DTW-LGW.

Routing was SEA-DTW-LGW-FRA daily with the B742, with the DC10-40 also appearing on the route.
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