Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
BDKLEZ
Topic Author
Posts: 1796
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 11:57 am

Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Thu Aug 22, 2019 1:54 pm

With multiple agreements, franchise/ACMI across various carriers, is it possible that LM can keep this up? I know that after the demise of bmi Regional, assets were transferred to LM under their direct operation but my concern is that they are trying to do too much to quickly. Now that they are operating as their own airline, should they not be concentrating more on establishing their own presence?
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
User avatar
JannEejit
Posts: 1708
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2016 4:04 pm

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Thu Aug 22, 2019 2:05 pm

If by 'their own presence' you mean doing what they've always done, aka Highlands & Islands services, well that's still business as usual. Clearly being part of the same Airline Investments Ltd (AIL) group as BMI Regional, some of that business has been resurrected /transferred/re-established (delete as appropriate) under the Loganair brand. Time will tell if routes to Southend, Dusseldorf and everything else will be long term viable but at the moment seeing as the Embraer's are paid for and were not actually purchased by Loganair then it would appear to be an experiment worth doing. Personally I predict much tweaking of the network in the months and years to come, especially post Brexit. There's also the small matter of upcoming fleet renewal with the expected ATR-42 purchase to come and a further impact upon the dynamic.
 
StdTank80002
Posts: 40
Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2019 10:42 am

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:27 pm

Yeah the expansion seemed quite rapid from when I first started flying with them, obviously mainly to try and fill gaps since BMI Regional's demise. But it certainly feels from their announcements that there will be lots of chopping and changing to try find the most profitable routes. I do hope they dont overstretch themselves though I always enjoy flying with them!
 
Luftymatt
Posts: 550
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2009 7:27 pm

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Sat Aug 24, 2019 9:41 pm

It's a good point you raise, I've been wondering this myself for a while now. It's great to see them expand, I just hope it's not too much too soon.
chase the sun
 
BDKLEZ
Topic Author
Posts: 1796
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 11:57 am

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:32 am

And yet more new routes announced. They will be taking over from BE on EMA-GLA/EDI with 3x and 4x respective rotations Mon-Fri. Already started EMA-BRU/INV and EMA-ABZ to start early 2020. In addition, from early next year we have multiple additional routes supporting the oil & gas sector as well a new GLA-CWL connection. Further, we also have NQY-ABZ/NCL/GLA/NWI to start in the spring.

My original question seems to be justified. Are they dipping their toes in too many different ponds at the same time? I have a lot of time for Loganair given the historical connection with BD through Airlines of Britain (...I'm an ex BD employee) and I really wish them well with their bullish plans but my concern remains.

https://www.loganair.co.uk/loganair-new-routes-2020/

https://www.loganair.co.uk/new-east-midlands-routes/

https://www.loganair.co.uk/new-flights- ... t-newquay/
Trespassers will be shot; survivors will be shot again!
 
lhrsfosyd91
Posts: 135
Joined: Sun Apr 28, 2019 6:47 pm

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Sat Oct 12, 2019 11:12 am

BDKLEZ wrote:
And yet more new routes announced. They will be taking over from BE on EMA-GLA/EDI with 3x and 4x respective rotations Mon-Fri. Already started EMA-BRU/INV and EMA-ABZ to start early 2020. In addition, from early next year we have multiple additional routes supporting the oil & gas sector as well a new GLA-CWL connection. Further, we also have NQY-ABZ/NCL/GLA/NWI to start in the spring.

My original question seems to be justified. Are they dipping their toes in too many different ponds at the same time? I have a lot of time for Loganair given the historical connection with BD through Airlines of Britain (...I'm an ex BD employee) and I really wish them well with their bullish plans but my concern remains.

https://www.loganair.co.uk/loganair-new-routes-2020/

https://www.loganair.co.uk/new-east-midlands-routes/

https://www.loganair.co.uk/new-flights- ... t-newquay/


There is a market for a small full service airline connecting regions in the UK. There certainly wasn't enough room for Flybe, Loganair and flybmi at the same time hence we see one fewer player. Flybe is undergoing a heavy restructuring process and is chopping routes left right centre so it is a good time to establish presence in smaller UK cities.

The business is diversified which adds confidence in Loganair's management skills. They have guaranteed income on PSO routes and it is likely that oil and gas routes are also heavily subsidised. New routes are likely to be loss making however the aircraft are paid off and offer fewer seats than BE aircraft so are easier to fill at sustainable prices.
 
LX138
Posts: 319
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2009 5:45 pm

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Sat Oct 12, 2019 1:13 pm

At one point them seemed to operate almost every regional airliner going, which cannot be efficient for planning and crewing. That said, they do rely on a lot of subsidy flying - good for them, and this seems to see them through. I've taken the NOR-MAN service a few times, one of the more bizarre domestics one can take.
StarWorld Team - The ultimate airline alliance
 
eicvd
Posts: 1452
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2008 10:11 pm

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Sat Oct 12, 2019 3:17 pm

Management at WAT should be on to Loganair, perfect airline to fly a few WAT-UK routes with the Saab’s & ATRs coming.
COYBIB
 
User avatar
TheLion
Posts: 691
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 1:14 am

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Sat Oct 12, 2019 4:47 pm

Overall, an interesting thread, so far one free from ludicrous assumptions and wild a.nuttery :white:

I'll add my brief thoughts...

Loganair may seem to be dropping in a few odd routes, but their aim is to serve core markets (Scottish Highlands and Islands), while connecting parts of the UK that are underserved. They are also pursuing another nimble strategy of starting unserved secondary/tertiary to secondary/tertiary city business routes, which given their small aircraft size and paid-off finances, are low risk growth efforts, a strategy that could work well in the medium term.

As some of you mention, their PSO and subsidised routes (which are essential for connectivity of isolated communities and far-flung industry alike) are their bread and butter and are well backed by government and big business, their security lying in their very nature and vitality. I'm bullish and positive on Loganair.

LX138 wrote:
At one point them seemed to operate almost every regional airliner going, which cannot be efficient for planning and crewing. That said, they do rely on a lot of subsidy flying - good for them, and this seems to see them through. I've taken the NOR-MAN service a few times, one of the more bizarre domestics one can take.


Had to look up and check NOR, but then Norðfjörður in Iceland popped up! Of course I realised you meant Norwich, which is actually NWI!
 
tonystan
Posts: 1712
Joined: Sat Jan 07, 2006 7:39 am

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Sat Oct 12, 2019 9:43 pm

I’m really rooting for Loganair. A tartan dressed, Scottish underdog with some really unique flying and niche aircraft types, what’s not to love?

An awful lot of their operation involves public service routes deemed essential by many communities and they have done these services justice over the years.

Here’s to many more years of sustainable expansion!
My views are my own and do not reflect any other person or organisation.
 
sk736
Posts: 738
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2006 4:47 am

Re: Are Loganair over-stretching themselves?

Sat Oct 12, 2019 10:29 pm

I too have thought their expansion seems rapid, but they’ve been around for a long time and seem to know what they’re doing. Their fares are outrageously high on many routes, but people must be paying them! I hope they take over the MAN/GLA route that apparently is about to be axed by Flybe.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos