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Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 2:40 pm
by HongMeng
Ryanair flights in and out of UK airports took off as normal this morning despite strikes by pilots, the airline has said.Thousands of passengers were braced for disruption ahead of a 48-hour walkout over pay and conditions.However, the airline said 97% of flights took off on time on Thursday morning, blaming the few delays on air traffic control.

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-49432317

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:04 pm
by FCOTSTW
What a smash for the pilots! Zero contractual leverage!

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:05 pm
by f4f3a
They have either paid people to come in on days off or other parts of the network have been affected during strike to avoid media attention . It must have cost them one way or another .

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:21 pm
by THS214
f4f3a wrote:
They have either paid people to come in on days off or other parts of the network have been affected during strike to avoid media attention . It must have cost them one way or another .


“Thanks to the great work and volunteerism of the vast majority of our UK-based pilots, Ryanair now expects to run its full schedule of flights to/from our UK airports.” https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 73626.html

"it has the support of less than 30% of Ryanair’s UK pilots" https://corporate.ryanair.com/news/stri ... ir-pilots/

So not 30% of Ryanair UK BALPA pilots but 30% of all Ryanair UK pilots. A longer strike would definitely have a huge disruption for Ryanair UK flights.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:22 pm
by THS214
f4f3a wrote:
They have either paid people to come in on days off or other parts of the network have been affected during strike to avoid media attention . It must have cost them one way or another .


“Thanks to the great work and volunteerism of the vast majority of our UK-based pilots, Ryanair now expects to run its full schedule of flights to/from our UK airports.” https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 73626.html

"it has the support of less than 30% of Ryanair’s UK pilots" https://corporate.ryanair.com/news/stri ... ir-pilots/

So not 30% of Ryanair UK BALPA pilots but 30% of all Ryanair UK pilots. A longer strike would definitely have a huge disruption for Ryanair UK flights.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:32 pm
by WayexTDI
f4f3a wrote:
They have either paid people to come in on days off or other parts of the network have been affected during strike to avoid media attention . It must have cost them one way or another .

Or, most pilots do not support the strike, despite what the pilot union said.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:36 pm
by barney captain
"The airline said it had drafted in pilots from elsewhere in Europe to fill in during strike action."

Yea, there's a term for those types of "individuals".

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:37 pm
by f4f3a
Well according to Ryanair pilots are demanding 400k a year which is total boll#%. So take what they say with a pinch of salt . Also you can volunteer to work days of and still get paid . Much cheaper to bribe people to work and is much cheaper than cancelling flights paying eu261 . I don’t think they did it for free .

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:37 pm
by WayexTDI
THS214 wrote:
f4f3a wrote:
They have either paid people to come in on days off or other parts of the network have been affected during strike to avoid media attention . It must have cost them one way or another .


“Thanks to the great work and volunteerism of the vast majority of our UK-based pilots, Ryanair now expects to run its full schedule of flights to/from our UK airports.” https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/ne ... 73626.html

"it has the support of less than 30% of Ryanair’s UK pilots" https://corporate.ryanair.com/news/stri ... ir-pilots/

So not 30% of Ryanair UK BALPA pilots but 30% of all Ryanair UK pilots. A longer strike would definitely have a huge disruption for Ryanair UK flights.

So, only 30% of Ryanair UK pilots?
From memory, 70% of BALPA-represented pilots voted, and 80% voted for the strike; 56% of BALPA-represented pilots voted for the strike.
And that represents only 30% of Ryanair UK pilots, meaning that BALPA represents only 53-54% of Ryanair UK pilots (53.6% * 70% * 80% = 30%). Barely a majority of Ryanair UK pilots. Good to know.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:38 pm
by WayexTDI
barney captain wrote:
"The airline said it had drafted in pilots from elsewhere in Europe to fill in during strike action."

Yea, there's a term for those types of "individuals".

Yep, it's called "people who want to work and not strike"; is that prohibited???

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:45 pm
by barney captain
WayexTDI wrote:
barney captain wrote:
"The airline said it had drafted in pilots from elsewhere in Europe to fill in during strike action."

Yea, there's a term for those types of "individuals".

Yep, it's called "people who want to work and not strike"; is that prohibited???


"People who won't support their Union Brothers and Sisters - but will happily benefit from their sacrifices"

There, fixed it for you.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:47 pm
by WayexTDI
barney captain wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
barney captain wrote:
"The airline said it had drafted in pilots from elsewhere in Europe to fill in during strike action."

Yea, there's a term for those types of "individuals".

Yep, it's called "people who want to work and not strike"; is that prohibited???


"People who won't support their Union Brothers and Sisters - but will happily benefit from their sacrifices"

There, fixed it for you.

"People who don't want to be racketed by the union goons and refuse to fatten the unions leaders".

There, fixed it for you.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:52 pm
by barney captain
WayexTDI wrote:
barney captain wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
Yep, it's called "people who want to work and not strike"; is that prohibited???


"People who won't support their Union Brothers and Sisters - but will happily benefit from their sacrifices"

There, fixed it for you.

"People who don't want to be racketed by the union goons and refuse to fatten the unions leaders".

There, fixed it for you.


Do you have any experience with airline contract negotiations? Because that hardly defines the process.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 5:58 pm
by DiamondFlyer
WayexTDI wrote:
barney captain wrote:
"The airline said it had drafted in pilots from elsewhere in Europe to fill in during strike action."

Yea, there's a term for those types of "individuals".

Yep, it's called "people who want to work and not strike"; is that prohibited???


No, but when they end up on a scab list for the rest of their life, they made the decision to do so.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 6:09 pm
by WayexTDI
barney captain wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
barney captain wrote:

"People who won't support their Union Brothers and Sisters - but will happily benefit from their sacrifices"

There, fixed it for you.

"People who don't want to be racketed by the union goons and refuse to fatten the unions leaders".

There, fixed it for you.


Do you have any experience with airline contract negotiations? Because that hardly defines the process.

No. But I see how the unions hold hostage the consumers and I believe they've outlived their usefulness.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 6:18 pm
by zuckie13
barney captain wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
barney captain wrote:
"The airline said it had drafted in pilots from elsewhere in Europe to fill in during strike action."

Yea, there's a term for those types of "individuals".

Yep, it's called "people who want to work and not strike"; is that prohibited???


"People who won't support their Union Brothers and Sisters - but will happily benefit from their sacrifices"

There, fixed it for you.


Hate to point out the obvious, but the pilots working are NOT in the Union to begin with. More like they're happy to benefit from the fraction of pilots who are and decided to strike.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 6:22 pm
by zuckie13
I should point out this was obviously what was going to happen. As strike of only a portion of the workers that is only 48 hours long. It was always going to be easy tor Ryanair to schedule pilots around this.

Since I have no understanding of UK law regarding with strikes, I have no idea if/how they could do more to make this more effective, but having only half the pilots in the Union to begin with will always make things hard.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 6:31 pm
by THS214
WayexTDI wrote:
barney captain wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
"People who don't want to be racketed by the union goons and refuse to fatten the unions leaders".

There, fixed it for you.


Do you have any experience with airline contract negotiations? Because that hardly defines the process.

No. But I see how the unions hold hostage the consumers and I believe they've outlived their usefulness.


Would you work for peanuts? Bad working conditions? etc. Because that's what ultimately will happen for most of the people if there is no unions. Company representatives and union working together is the best solution.

One can say that its the company that is holding consumers hostage. Both sides can give up.

And to make it clear, I don't know is this strike OK or not.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:34 pm
by n6238p
“I love airplanes and airlines but F the people that work for them, be happy you have a job.”

That’s what I’m seeing here.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:40 pm
by zuckie13
I love airplanes, but hate how the union bargaining process has become so adversarial that instead of working together to make a win for everybody it instead turns in to an "its all about me" mentality by both sides that leads to one side or the other saying it's my way or I strike/lockout.

I don't have a problem with the concept of a union, I have a problem that the unions usually want things to the detriment of the company, AND the company usually wants things to the detriment of the workers.

It would be more profitable to sit down, actually hash out something that keeps workers able to live a decent quality of life, while ensuring the company is not choked from being able to expand and compete (so it can grow and keep everyone employed for a long time).

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 8:59 pm
by WayexTDI
zuckie13 wrote:
I love airplanes, but hate how the union bargaining process has become so adversarial that instead of working together to make a win for everybody it instead turns in to an "its all about me" mentality by both sides that leads to one side or the other saying it's my way or I strike/lockout.

I don't have a problem with the concept of a union, I have a problem that the unions usually want things to the detriment of the company, AND the company usually wants things to the detriment of the workers.

It would be more profitable to sit down, actually hash out something that keeps workers able to live a decent quality of life, while ensuring the company is not choked from being able to expand and compete (so it can grow and keep everyone employed for a long time).

You mean, like a certain US major airline does and that a.net loves to hate?

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Thu Aug 22, 2019 11:12 pm
by barney captain
WayexTDI wrote:
zuckie13 wrote:
I love airplanes, but hate how the union bargaining process has become so adversarial that instead of working together to make a win for everybody it instead turns in to an "its all about me" mentality by both sides that leads to one side or the other saying it's my way or I strike/lockout.

I don't have a problem with the concept of a union, I have a problem that the unions usually want things to the detriment of the company, AND the company usually wants things to the detriment of the workers.

It would be more profitable to sit down, actually hash out something that keeps workers able to live a decent quality of life, while ensuring the company is not choked from being able to expand and compete (so it can grow and keep everyone employed for a long time).

You mean, like a certain US major airline does and that a.net loves to hate?


Which airline is that?

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:21 am
by Salukipilot
n6238p wrote:
“I love airplanes and airlines but F the people that work for them, be happy you have a job.”

That’s what I’m seeing here.


I mean what did you expect? This is A.net after all fellow Saluki bro.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:26 am
by AtomicGarden
barney captain wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
zuckie13 wrote:
I love airplanes, but hate how the union bargaining process has become so adversarial that instead of working together to make a win for everybody it instead turns in to an "its all about me" mentality by both sides that leads to one side or the other saying it's my way or I strike/lockout.

I don't have a problem with the concept of a union, I have a problem that the unions usually want things to the detriment of the company, AND the company usually wants things to the detriment of the workers.

It would be more profitable to sit down, actually hash out something that keeps workers able to live a decent quality of life, while ensuring the company is not choked from being able to expand and compete (so it can grow and keep everyone employed for a long time).

You mean, like a certain US major airline does and that a.net loves to hate?


Which airline is that?


DL I believe.

I agree 100% with zuckie13. Been there too many times (on the wrong side of the strike). But probably too idealistic.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:11 am
by WayexTDI
AtomicGarden wrote:
barney captain wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
You mean, like a certain US major airline does and that a.net loves to hate?


Which airline is that?


DL I believe.

I agree 100% with zuckie13. Been there too many times (on the wrong side of the strike). But probably too idealistic.

Yes, I meant DL.

The pro-unions guys on here keep ranting that DL is barely unionized; yet, their employees are happy to work there and DL knows how to entertain that fine balance between not giving too much to the employees (so the shareholders are happy) and giving enough to the employees (so they don't try to bring unions in).

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2019 6:24 am
by barney captain
WayexTDI wrote:
AtomicGarden wrote:
barney captain wrote:

Which airline is that?


DL I believe.

I agree 100% with zuckie13. Been there too many times (on the wrong side of the strike). But probably too idealistic.

Yes, I meant DL.

The pro-unions guys on here keep ranting that DL is barely unionized; yet, their employees are happy to work there and DL knows how to entertain that fine balance between not giving too much to the employees (so the shareholders are happy) and giving enough to the employees (so they don't try to bring unions in).


It didn't matter which airline you were referring to, the results would have been the same. You have just demonstrated your complete ignorance on the matter.

From 2006 -

https://money.cnn.com/2006/04/04/news/c ... /index.htm "Delta pilots authorize strike"

From 2001 -

https://money.cnn.com/2001/02/12/compan ... /index.htm "Delta pilots OK strike"

And this was just the pilots, other work groups were also equally affected. Ask the DL pilots of the era how they feel about losing their entire "guaranteed" retirement after a lifetime of service. Walking across a strike line in this (and many other) cases is tacit approval for corporate rape.

Your short-term myopic observations only serve to highlight your misconceptions.

Just two examples out of dozens and dozens. And you wonder why we feel strongly about this?

Go read "Hard Landings" and get back to us.

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2019 6:36 am
by HongMeng
barney captain wrote:
"People who won't support their Union Brothers and Sisters - but will happily benefit from their sacrifices" There, fixed it for you.


Bad days for aviation industry

Re: Ryanair pilots' strike. Flights take off

Posted: Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:00 pm
by WayexTDI
barney captain wrote:
WayexTDI wrote:
AtomicGarden wrote:

DL I believe.

I agree 100% with zuckie13. Been there too many times (on the wrong side of the strike). But probably too idealistic.

Yes, I meant DL.

The pro-unions guys on here keep ranting that DL is barely unionized; yet, their employees are happy to work there and DL knows how to entertain that fine balance between not giving too much to the employees (so the shareholders are happy) and giving enough to the employees (so they don't try to bring unions in).


It didn't matter which airline you were referring to, the results would have been the same. You have just demonstrated your complete ignorance on the matter.

From 2006 -

https://money.cnn.com/2006/04/04/news/c ... /index.htm "Delta pilots authorize strike"

From 2001 -

https://money.cnn.com/2001/02/12/compan ... /index.htm "Delta pilots OK strike"

And this was just the pilots, other work groups were also equally affected. Ask the DL pilots of the era how they feel about losing their entire "guaranteed" retirement after a lifetime of service. Walking across a strike line in this (and many other) cases is tacit approval for corporate rape.

Your short-term myopic observations only serve to highlight your misconceptions.

Just two examples out of dozens and dozens. And you wonder why we feel strongly about this?

Go read "Hard Landings" and get back to us.

2006 => 13 years ago, and DL (like other US airlines) was heavily suffering from the aftermath of 9/11.
2001 => 18 years ago.
Do you have any info from the 1940's???

We're talking 2019, not ancient history.
Since 2006, DL has merged with NW, has seen dramatic restructuring and changes in management.

TODAY, DL remains largely non-unionized and DL employees are largely happy.

By the way, no need for personal attacks.